Guild Wars 2

Its funny when people still keep claiming that warriors out dps other classes. If you count the big hit number, probably yes, but DPS – emphasis on per second – we’re probably one of the worst.

Solo play warrior is still pretty good, although i can get better mileage off some other classes. Group play, what else can we have aside from banners and mediocre dps?

WvW or PvP….we went from free kills at the start, to somewhat quite decent after 1.5yrs, then around 6mths after that, we’re back to free kills again.

I don’t get why people say that warriors are in an acceptable position right now and should not get any buffs, or that we should still get nerfed more (i’m looking at you people who say warriors should lose all mobility)

kayo.3817:

Solo play warrior is still pretty good, although i can get better mileage off some other classes. Group play, what else can we have aside from banners and mediocre dps?

Nothing else,that’s the correct answer. But how would it be fair compared to other classes if you give them also good dps, allthough they have much better support opportunities?

A fair solution would be to nerf the banner buffs and to buff their dps in return.

Anyway, buff the dps of warriors and maybe then guardians are behind warriors dps wise…. so should guardians now complain about offering nothing else than boons / reflection and medicore dps? Shall guardians now complain about beeing trashtear because only mesmers and necromancers have lower dps? I just don’t get the logic behind.

WvW or PvP….we went from free kills at the start, to somewhat quite decent after 1.5yrs, then around 6mths after that, we’re back to free kills again.

However, this thread is not about PvP so none is arguing against buffs in PvP but…
Why are nearly all EU PvP top tear teams like TCG and CM playing with warriors if they are “a freekill” ? lol.

dominik.9721:

However, this thread is not about PvP so none is arguing against buffs in PvP but…
Why are nearly all EU PvP top tear teams like TCG and CM playing with warriors if they are “a freekill” ? lol.

Lol, hes talking about early 2013 when no top team had a warrior, top warriors could not find a team, if you encounter a warrior in TQ in 10 matches you are lucky. not recent teams. if you really know “start” does not mean when you started playing this game which is “like last month or something” , not to mention TCG did not run warrior on ToG.

dominik.9721:

Nothing else,that’s the correct answer. But how would it be fair compared to other classes if you give them also good dps, allthough they have much better support opportunities?

A fair solution would be to nerf the banner buffs and to buff their dps in return.

Anyway, buff the dps of warriors and maybe then guardians are behind warriors dps wise…. so should guardians now complain about offering nothing else than boons / reflection and medicore dps? Shall guardians now complain about beeing trashtear because only mesmers and necromancers have lower dps? I just don’t get the logic behind.

Guardian brings so much more value to the team. You clearly don’t know how much value does reflect offers. simply one reflect will make a fight to so much faster so much easier. I don’t see the reason why guardian should out put higher DPS then a warrior with close to no team value except damage buff.

The worst about this all is that I’m only asking for reversal of the DPS loss of the last september patch. Warriors already had low-as-hell DPS. There was absolutely no reason to lower 100b + WWA damage at all. None.

Not only am I only asking for one of those two skills to be reverted, but I’m asking for it in a way that will not impact PvP to avoid QQ. Not even that worked.

Lol, hes talking about early 2013 when no top team had a warrior, top warriors could not find a team, if you encounter a warrior in TQ in 10 matches you are lucky. not recent teams. if you really know “start” does not mean when you started playing this game which is “like last month or something” , not to mention TCG did not run warrior on ToG.

kayo.3817:

WvW or PvP….we went from free kills at the start, to somewhat quite decent after 1.5yrs, then around 6mths after that, we’re back to free kills again.

I marked it for you.

Guardian brings so much more value to the team. You clearly don’t know how much value does reflect offers. simply one reflect will make a fight to so much faster so much easier. I don’t see the reason why guardian should out put higher DPS then a warrior with close to no team value except damage buff.

Why is a dmg buff close to no team value?
But that’s propably the reason in nearly every speedruns warriors are used but only in a few a guard is needed and used.
And that’s the reason why I’m against a buff even against a buff in which a warrior would get only 0,0001% more damage on 100b.
They are superior in solo play and superior in groups compared to other classes even if they have better dps than the warrior on his own.

I understand your points but imo I’m just against it.

They are one of the best solo classes but they’re not superior in groups wth. The only reasons people play them so often are:

a) misinformation
b) high health pool = more forgiving
c) misinformation
d) banners
e) misinformation
f) misinformation

Seriously. So many people are under the impression that warriors deal godmode DPS and that they actually matter in groups more so than for just banners. Aside from banners there’s really no reason to care about whether or not you bring a warrior. They do literally nothing better in a group of other players other than apply a passive damage increase with the press of a button.

Banners never have and never will be necessary. If they mattered that much, then rangers would be invited more often into groups because they not only deal better personal DPS but also offer offensive support. Does that happen? No. There’s a lot of variables that need to be considered to understand why this is the case and it’s silly to assume that just because you see a lot of people playing with a class that it means it needs no attention.

The fact that you’re using the fact that many people play with warrior still to try to prove your point astounds me. I’m sure the several necro players on this thread would dislike it if I stated that we shouldn’t bother buffing necro simply because I get pugs joining my fractal/dungeon groups on necros all the time.

Using that metric is about as useful as it is to gauge player skill from the little AP number that appears when you hover your mouse over them in the UI. Useless.

P.S. – even if warriors were actually nerfed to the point of being impractical to ever take in dungeon/fractal runs, I guarantee a ton of players would still use them just because it’s undesirable and difficult to give up something that a lot of time and effort was put into .

Does it matter whether they are superior in groups because of their dps or because of their group buffs?

How would you call it if you see in nearly every speedrun ( and I talk about real recordruns) warriors but only in a very very few speedruns Rangers / Engineers / Guards / Necromancers?

Neither you would exchange this warrior for a Ranger or an engineer ,nor you would change the warrior out if a guardian is needed.

So you wouldn’t call it superior?

It wouldn’t be surperior if an engineer outdps a warrior that much that it doesn’t matter if you have an engineer and his dps in your group or a warrior with his buffs.

It wouldn’t be superior if a ranger would bring the same amount of offensive buff as the warrior is able to offer.

It wouldn’t be superior if the warrior would deal the same dps as other classes deal but then he shouldn’t bring that much better group buffs in return.

I think its fair to say that after the group has Banner of Strength and Banner of Discipline any extra Warriors can be replaced.

Jeez, dis dominik guy.
Honestly? I couldn’t care less if I have a warrior in party or not. Aside from the banners, I mean. Everything they do, another class does better. All these nerfs to their personal damage didn’t help at all.
Yes, I do giggle under my breath because I play ranger and the idea of my little lady outdpsing the 100b spammers fills me with amusement, but I don’t see why they nerfed the warrs’ damage so harshly. They weren’t that great in the first place, really.
/poke
Soz, miku, couldn’t resist

I totally think the last nerf was unneeded and it would be nice if they reverted back to what it was (not for me, I don’t play that class for peasants!). Considering the huge mess pve is in, though, I doubt we gonna see any change in the near future.
Still, I don’t get why this small change is taking dem hate. Ok, they should change 200 things, but who cares…
I’ll still kick your kitten with dem op ranger.

[insert complaint about necro being broken since release]

[pvp balance whining]

[flirty comment about spoj]

Oh and btw, dominikucchi…. an engi stacks might better than a warr (+ crazy vuln). An elly stacks might better than a warr. A ranger can potentially stack might better than warr AND great offensive buffs + superior vulnerability. Oh, and also much better fury.
A warrior stacks might very well… for himself. Mostly.
And phalanx…. I love playing phalanx, but the damage loss is just crazy.
Now I’m outta here before he starts throwing a fit.
/runs away

i agree with miku warrior needs abit higher dps, cause when i started warrior i didnt consider it as a support class only. i considered warrior to be good overall in armor health and lastly yes damage. but it becomes wrong for me to only choose warrior because of there support (banner etc.)

and also some of the skills (gs (#5) etc.) is really broken and need to get fixed.

In all honesty the thing that put me off playing warrior is not the damage nerfs. Its the boon duration nerfs on signet of rage and the instant adren degen. The adren changes were needed. But i do think there should be a delay before it starts degenerating. I can accept damage nerfs because they dont make the class feel any different. But when you suddenly make a class feel clunkier and suddenly stop its 99% uptime on solo fury. That annoys me.

deSade.9437:

pls read at least once. The Banners are important so one warrior is important. So your sentence that you don’t care about warriors asides banners doesn’t make any sense.
I also don’t care about mesmers aside portals, don’t care about guards aside stability and wor and don’t care about rangers aside spirit+spotter… so what?

And you never would exchange the warrior for an engi because he can stack might and vulnerabilty.
All in all the warrior offers better dps for groups than the engi is able to – that’s the reason why the warrior is superior and that’s the reason you do nearly every recordrun with a warrior and nearly no recordrun with an engineer.
None cares about might stacks from a ranger or an engineer in a group, it’s the task of the elementalist and you will get the 25 stacks uptime, anyways.
Therefore you care about what class offers the best dps buffs for an optimal group dps. And this class is the warrior – not an engineer and not a ranger.

In the current 26 speedclear records 18 times a warrior is used, 4 times a ranger is used and 0 times an engineer is used.Guard was used in 5 cases.
But Warrior isn’t superior it seems. Their dmg is kitten, they are trashtear ,none cares about banners and none cares if a warrior is in the group.

k.

Who does speedruns?

Sadly, not many people care about speedruns anymore it seems but they nearly show perfect what classes are to prefer in groups.
And I guess, 4/26, 0/26, 5/26 compared to 18/26 is meaningful.

Warriors are optimal in speedclears because of how monotonous dungeon play is. Melee always does more damage than range, so a melee class is gonna always do more dps, and just by memorizing attack patterns make for a quick easy encounter.

But then again, other classes can do it better (takes somewhat more skill, but most people look for the lazy playstyle). Just a random PvE example, in orr, i can clear mobs after mobs faster on my guard than my warrior. I can take out individual mob faster on my thief/mesmer than i can with my warrior. Heck my ranger simply takes a slow stroll through and I hardly take a hit at all while walk looting dead bodies after dead bodies.

As for PvP, there are still warriors out there that do do very well, but its very very far and few inbetween. And let me guess, most are in Hambow. I don’t pvp so I can’t say for sure, but each team has a certain type of playstyle, thus some playstyles may involve having a warrior in there. For unorganized pvp, warriors are easily the worse, unless the person playing it has an extremely high skill level.

In the case for WvW, we have…lets see…..banners? F1 on hammer? F1 on bow? Stacking might? Well…I don’t even take my warrior to WvW anymore cause its just deadweight, and in a random pug zerg, I’ll just be lying on the ground most of the time. So I bring my guardian in and all of a sudden I’m showering in particle effects while wondering why there’s nothing more to kill.
.
.
.
But anyways, back to the main topic at hand, warriors do need fixing in PvE. Uncalled nerf to damage on gs (just because every warrior uses it in PvE?), nerf to signet of rage (because every warrior uses it in PvE? And they buffed the passive effect, all the while claiming they want to promote more active play), triple nerf to adrenaline (ok, deplete on usage is long overdue, but what was going on when they also made it instant decay @ 100% faster speed?), and nerfed healing signet (because every warrior uses it in PvE cause our other heals are worse?).

There’s no point putting out suggestions on how to fix the class anymore. Anet obviously doesn’t listen or read the suggestions; only listen to the vocal minority on the FORUMS on warrior QQ; replaced their entire balance team with monkeys; and obviously they do not play the warrior profession, but only “dabble” in it (which to them is playing). Plus, people want warriors to be free kills, so no matter what buffs we get, we’re just going to get nerfed harder.

I loled at reading “melee class” and monotonous dungeons.
That proofes namely that you haven’t understand why you pick up a warrior in speedruns.

Then I was astonished when I had to read that in low lvl PvP warrior is bad – everyone complains about hambow because it’s that easy to play and a faceroll class.

The coronation of this post is the WvW topic. Obv. the reason GvG zergs consist of 50% warriors is that you always lay on the ground as warrior.

But it’s okey.
Buff warrior.
Warrior is trash tear in PvE, allthough they are used in 18/26 speedruns.
Warriors are freekills in PvP ,allthough they are used in serveral top tier teams.
Warriors are bad in Zergfights,allthough every GvG-Team is playing with them

srsly what I get to read here is very impressive.

Anet fix it pls, that Miku can enjoy high numbers in arah again and that the warrior FINALLY becomes viable in PvP after 2 years ( they are bad as kitten in PvP none uses them !!!11)

#fix it

The reason for warriors in speedruns is for the banners. Everything else is mediocre for speedruns. Essentially you are not taking a warrior you are taking the banner of disc and banner of strength class.

Can we stop throwing insults around just because you disagree.

spoj.9672:

The reason for warriors in speedruns is for the banners. Everything else is mediocre for speedruns. Essentially you are not taking a warrior you are taking the banner of disc and banner of strength class.

Can we stop throwing insults around just because you disagree.

At the same way you don’t take a Mesmer, you are taking a portal, you don’t take a guard you are taking boons and reflect, you don’t take a ranger you are taking a spirit + spotter, you don’t take necromance because you don’t take necromancer.

so what?

But I now agree with the complains.
Warriors are urgently in the need of buffs. They are trashtear in PvE, freekils in PvP and lootbags in WvW.
The various arguments I read here why they desperatly need them convinced me.
Oh wait, what arguments actually were brought untill yet?

I still search vainly the " buff warriors BECAUSE….."

…

honestly dominik, go troll elsewhere pls.

You are like those people who say “warriors are in a good spot right now. Heck, even with the recent nerfs, we’re still doing well, if not better than before.” <—- find the irony in that? *hint – nerfs = getting screwed over.

Now let me point out to you the flow we warriors have been experiencing.

We’re crap at the start of game.
We got buffed after 1.5yrs (wow it took 1.5yrs?)
We’re not free kills anymore, but not OP killers.
People start to panic and QQ and refuse to adapt.
We got nerfed.
People still QQ because they want to make sure we always remain free kills.
Ranger got buffed and took some flak off us.
We asked to be buffed to allow us a chance.
People get worried we won’t be free kills again.
People continue to QQ to all suggestions to allow us any buffs.
We start threads like these to suggest ideas to improve the class, but not make it OP.
Then trolls hijack threads like these which give suggestions to continue their QQ.

So please do us a favour and troll other professions instead, cause we used to get, have got, and still getting flak for everything.

Everyone knows mesmer has been in a bad state in PvE for a long time. That is for another topic.

Being forced into a support role in groups is garbage, and we’re forced to do that unless we want to have sub-average DPS in our best possible personal damage setups. The whole problem is that we don’t have the option of having good personal DPS anymore. We’re forced into having unimpressive results even the best possible settings and the tradeoff isn’t worth it.

Since you brought up mesmers I’ll use them as an example here. They have significantly low DPS in compensation for being capable of soloing things that no other classes can (imbued shaman) and being the only class capable of achieving 100% reflect uptime. Warriors can’t solo everything. They also can only reflect if they sacrifice a huge amount of their DPS.

Every class has their own strengths (aside from necromancer I suppose) and their own problems that need work on and this thread’s focus is solely on what I believe are the warrior’s. There are also some other changes I’ve thought of but right now these are what I believe are what should be done first before all other things are considered for the class.

So far, looks like a lot more people seem to agree with me. Looks like you’re getting rather uptight about it, what with mocking me and all.

Hes not actually wrong. Hes just being a kitten and being rude about it. Some of the changes are quite reasonable such as the delay before adren degens.

I’m sure most people, somewhere at the back of their heads, know that its reasonable but for some reason will not allow it, or even to hear it being suggested. Why this is so I have absolutely no idea.

At this stage, most warriors are just asking for the recent uncalled nerfs to be reverted back, and instead of instant decay @ 100% faster, to have a slight delay (5~10sec) before it decays at the rate it used to. Keep the adrenaline use upon F1 usage regardless on hit or miss.

Is that really such a bad thing for warriors to ask for?

Edit: ooh, and fix our broken skills and super telegraphed attacks too.

kayo.3817:

You are like those people who say “warriors are in a good spot right now. Heck, even with the recent nerfs, we’re still doing well, if not better than before.” hint – nerfs = getting screwed over.

Nerfs doesn’t have to mean that you are screwed over. You can nerf sth. and it becomes balanced.

We’re crap at the start of game.
We got buffed after 1.5yrs (wow it took 1.5yrs?)
We’re not free kills anymore, but not OP killers.
People start to panic and QQ and refuse to adapt.
We got nerfed.
People still QQ because they want to make sure we always remain free kills.
Ranger got buffed and took some flak off us.

Where do people cry? This thread is about buffing the warrior not nerfing him.
Warrior is atm as balanced as never before. That’s why he is used in top PvE guilds for Speedruns and is used in top tier pvp teams and that’s why he doesn’t deserve buffs.
That has nothing to do with crying.

We asked to be buffed to allow us a chance.

That’s the point. Why do you need buffs. Read what I wrote two lines above and it should be clear that you don’t need buffs. So about what “chance” you need are you talking ?

People get worried we won’t be free kills again.
People continue to QQ to all suggestions to allow us any buffs.
We start threads like these to suggest ideas to improve the class, but not make it OP.
Then trolls hijack threads like these which give suggestions to continue their QQ.

Some people have noticed that warrior is fine as it is. He isn’t to strong but has his usage in every gamemode even in top tier.
So at the same way nerfs would be unjustified atm every buff would be unjustified,too.

So please do us a favour and troll other professions instead, cause we used to get, have got, and still getting flak for everything.

So you talk all the time about PvP,allthough this is a PvE-Thread.
You think that warrior in PvP is atm to weak that he deserve buffs – mention as much “QQ” as I didn’t see before and call other people “trolls” because they are against a buff of your class?

k.

@ Purple Miku:
I completly understand your point that the warrior has to be used as supporter and that you even don’t have the chance to act as a DD.

That’s why I suggested to buff the dps but to nerf his group buffs in return.
You have to find a compromise for that.
Simply to buff his dps ( doesn’t matter how much ) doesn’t solve the problem.

dominik.9721:

@ Purple Miku:
I completly understand your point that the warrior has to be used as supporter and that you even don’t have the chance to act as a DD.

That’s why I suggested to buff the dps but to nerf his group buffs in return.
You have to find a compromise for that.
Simply to buff his dps ( doesn’t matter how much ) doesn’t solve the problem.

I don’t agree with that. Party buff is the main thing for a Warrior. If you decrease that to increase its DPS, where will you put the Warrior? Will it be superior to an Elementalist in DPS? Probably not. So the situation won’t change. You will still keep only 1 warrior for buff that are now less good, but won’t get more of them because an Elementalist will do more dps.

Each profession need to have its own thing. If they can’t bring different things, then some profession won’t be used at all because there is always another profession better at it.

Yes that’s an other problem which shows that you can’t simply nerf/buff classes without references to other classes.

There’ll always be the class which is able to deal the most damage, so there’ll always be the classes who have to stand in the shade dps-wise and have to be satisfied with their support they offer.

Though, it would be fair to give warriors at least the chance to decide either to bring support and low dps or low support and “good” dps in return.

But that’s not a warrior problem. As I mention you can employ this example on every class which doesn’t deal the highest dps.
Ranger Spotter+Spirit, Guard boons +reflect,Mesmer portal,Engineer vulnerability etc.

Ya but Warrior DPS is not SO bad that you can’t do kitten with it. Yes compare to Elementalist the Warrior have less dps, but a group of warrior can still do a decent job in a speed run. Like a lot of ppl, I think the last nerf to their dps was stupid. If they could just get back to the way it was, I think that the Warrior would in a good place.

Profession like Necromancer, Engineer, Mesmer and Ranger need a lot more working on them for PvE than Warrior. Especially Necromancer.

dominik.9721:

@ Purple Miku:
I completly understand your point that the warrior has to be used as supporter and that you even don’t have the chance to act as a DD.

That’s why I suggested to buff the dps but to nerf his group buffs in return.
You have to find a compromise for that.
Simply to buff his dps ( doesn’t matter how much ) doesn’t solve the problem.

But see, warrior isn’t even the best at offensive support. I will admit, both banners + EA and phalanx strength is good… but is there anything as good as literally permanent fury, 20-25 might, sometimes 25 vuln (glyph of storms), conjures, projectile blocks, blinds, and the undisputed best DPS in the entire game?

And no, I’m not wanting eles to be nerfed… what I want has been mentioned plenty of times throughout the thread.

Warrior doesn’t need to sacrifice anything else than it already does.

That’s the reason why thief, elementalist and warrior are superior in PvE atm.

Ya but Warrior are only there because of banners. They shouldn’t have done the last nerf.

It is a curcular argument.

So for what reason you bring a Ranger, a Mesmer, a guardian and an engineer?

At the same way you bring a warrior only because of banners, you’ll bring a Mesmer only because of his portal and a ranger only because of his spirit and his spotter trait.

The only classes you won’t bring just because of their group support are elementalists and thiefs.

dominik.9721:

It is a curcular argument.

So for what reason you bring a Ranger, a Mesmer, a guardian and an engineer?

At the same way you bring a warrior only because of banners, you’ll bring a Mesmer only because of his portal and a ranger only because of his spirit and his spotter trait.

The only classes you won’t bring just because of their group support are elementalists and thiefs.

Mesmer also bring projectil reflection and Mass stealth, pull and boon strip.
engineer also has team stealth, pull and higher damage with team healing abilities and water field.

Yes but you don’t bring them for that. If you don’t need a portal you won’t bring a mesmer at the same way you won’t bring an engineer because everthing he offers an Elementalist / thief already bring with an moreover much better.
You could also enumerate that the Warrior offers CC, shoutheal and warbanner but you don’t bring him for that.

Thaddeus.4891:

Ya but Warrior are only there because of banners. They shouldn’t have done the last nerf.

there wasn’t much reason for it yet they did it.

warrior is still viable and used extensively in all three game modes.

so besides fixing blatant stupid things like rush not even being able to hit a barn door, bull’s rush being equally as awful and things like this

why does warrior need buffing again?

saying this as someone who misses the old damage we were capable of, I can’t think of an actual practical reason warrior in PvE needs to be buffed in any way besides

—

—

QQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQ

In my opinion there’s no point to stick with war, warrior was my main since start of the game, but update by update war is changed to kitten, so i lvled ele, i think about thief too, engi is cool too so i dont know what class i will take :P

Another thing for the warrior that certainly needs changing:

Utility “On My Mark”

It’s simply too lackluster. Even prior to mace offhand’s Crushing Blow buff, it was very infrequently used due to the fact that it’s single target and lasts only 10 seconds. Now that mace offhand offers the same vulnerability but on shorter cooldown and cleaves, I think it’s suffice to say this utility needs to be changed.

Here’s a few options:
a) Perhaps increase the duration of the vuln itself to 20 seconds, though that does seem rather long to me. Even still, I don’t feel like I’d use it that often anyways.
b) Add weakness along with the 10 seconds of vulnerability, duration of the weakness isn’t something I’m sure of.
c) Rename the shout entirely to be more fitting of causing everything within a 600 radius to be applied the vulnerability, maximum of 5 targets nearest to the person casting the utility sounds good to me.

On my mark should be aoe and increase the duration for PvE. Seriously need anet to split things more. PvP balance doesnt work on PvE.

I don’t know about you guys but I believe that when you take X profession and start nerfing this and that, it will sooner or later end up being boring cause too many restrictions will result in fewer ways to be effective.

This is happening more or less with warrior lately where most warriors run similar builds. In a way it reminds me of the first few months of the game where a warrior had to choose between GS+Frenzy or nothing.

Bartosz.2013:

In my opinion there’s no point to stick with war, warrior was my main since start of the game, but update by update war is changed to kitten,…

Sometimes I think this forum is full with people that only play for efficiency in PvE.
Don’t get me wrong – I am pro buffing Warrior in PvE big time. The Damage at least.
But just because your main class is not up to the standards anymore you think of dropping it.
Is it an ancient thought that you may play a class because you like the class itself and its mechanics?

Now that this is out of the way…
I was never a fan of comparing professions when it comes to speedruns or dps. There is no such thing as perfect balance in an MMO.
I have no idea what everyones MMO history is, but I am a long time lineage II veteran.
(It is the MMO that has influenced me the most in those 5-6 years of playing it)

This game had something that was called “Class-based Olympiad” Its essentially your average 1v1 arena. The winner goes to the next round.
The only difference All fights were of the same classes to determine the strongest of each profession by the end of the olympiad. No cross-professions battles at all.

What I want to say is, yes your warrior might do 10% less personal Dps than the new ranger generation but you will never live the day where the dps is equal among all classes. I totally agree the warrior needs a damage buff in PvE but I am not getting totally butt-mad about it and drop my class.
If you guys care that much about speedruns or dps meters in PVE you want to achieve well, or best in comparison to other players (not classes). When Dominik does his next Lupi speedkill he is going to be super happy he broke his record and then it is for Miku to challenge him to do it faster…. and not some ranger or ele.
I think I made my point clear.

Stop comparing professions and rather challenger yourself who the best of each profession is! For the love towards your profession, nothing more.

And if its all about group-speed clears, hell then pick the same team set ups.
If this game would have a holy trinity you’d certainly not compare a group of tanks with a perfect setup that utilizes all 3 of the trinity.

PS:
Funfact: I suck with Hambow. I’ve been playing some sPvP lately.
On my Hammer I am practically a sitting duck because every smart player dodges the obvious tells or has long duration of stability when facing a warrior.

On Axebow I perform better but I still die because I am slow as kitten.

With Axe+Sh/GS I can stay alive for an entire match sometimes. I have a counter for everything and ususally score best in my team by a mile infact.

Maybe I just suck after all

Dominik and Narkodx are right. I strongly support them.

I run warrior since beta and I feel them to be quiet fair just run 6 0 0 4 4 gs/bow or Ham or Axe/Shield. Use Ascended Zerker gear with Str runes or Hoebrak or Rune of Pack. Fusion with Knight/Cav accessories. It’s very fun! And yes if I can get a champion shadow to eat my full one hundred blades that’s the reason for nerf. In wvw it strikes with 8k-12k and 13-17k with full stacks. A beautiful 4k with f1 gs so yes that’s why nerfed. You can GS and Bow 14-18 stacks of might easily.

I also champion a D/D or D/F ele and is quite fear in 1v1 tspvp, hotjoin or wvw roaming universe. I can get 25 stack of might in the same time But team play is the best.

Waisenpai.6028:

Dominik and Narkodx are right. I strongly support them.

I run warrior since beta and I feel them to be quiet fair just run 6 0 0 4 4 gs/bow or Ham or Axe/Shield. Use Ascended Zerker gear with Str runes or Hoebrak or Rune of Pack. Fusion with Knight/Cav accessories. It’s very fun! And yes if I can get a champion shadow to eat my full one hundred blades that’s the reason for nerf. In wvw it strikes with 8k-12k and 13-17k with full stacks. A beautiful 4k with f1 gs so yes that’s why nerfed. You can GS and Bow 14-18 stacks of might easily.

I also champion a D/D or D/F ele and is quite fear in 1v1 tspvp, hotjoin or wvw roaming universe. I can get 25 stack of might in the same time But team play is the best.

Thank goodness you’ve posted on a thread exclusively about PvE to give us relevant insight on your experiences in WvW and PvP.

Waisenpai.6028:

Dominik and Narkodx are right. I strongly support them.

I run warrior since beta and I feel them to be quiet fair just run 6 0 0 4 4 gs/bow or Ham or Axe/Shield. Use Ascended Zerker gear with Str runes or Hoebrak or Rune of Pack. Fusion with Knight/Cav accessories. It’s very fun! …

You see? You ended up suggesting a single build with an additional 2 variations (based on weapons and runes)… There is no variety in warrior builds!

So, whats the point of having all these traits/weapons/gear if, from the hundreds possible combinations, you end up having to pick one of the total two effective ones? It didn’t used to be like this.

And on top of that, I am really starting to believe that profession design and balance is being taken care by separate teams! I can’t explain how they manage to create professions with some great trait synergy, variety and overall potential, while narrowing down others to the same stuff over and over.

17k hundred blades? Are you trying your best to not deal damage?

The several times I recall recently going into WvW, I remember hitting a 17k Final Thrust on a mesmer that probably didn’t know you can dodge on this game and and 11.8k Rush on a ranger with a longbow and a drake pet.

I’d be ashamed of myself to hit a 13-17k 100b.

I can agree with everything the OP said except the point on adrenaline decay. I understood that change. We have entirely too many skills/traits linked to adrenaline to allow it not to decay. Although some compensation could be applied to some skills that it effected.

coglin.1867:

I can agree with everything the OP said except the point on adrenaline decay. I understood that change. We have entirely too many skills/traits linked to adrenaline to allow it not to decay. Although some compensation could be applied to some skills that it effected.

You sure you carefully read it? I didn’t say that it shouldn’t decay, I said it shouldn’t decay at the speed that it currently does— which is basically vanishing before my eyes without a chance to make use of it in any situation other than a boss fight. You kill non-champs too fast for it to build up.

dominik.9721:

Yes but you don’t bring them for that. If you don’t need a portal you won’t bring a mesmer at the same way you won’t bring an engineer because everthing he offers an Elementalist / thief already bring with an moreover much better.
You could also enumerate that the Warrior offers CC, shoutheal and warbanner but you don’t bring him for that.

elemtanlist can’t open portal, so cant thief
elemtanlist cant open time wrap, so cant thief.
and mesmer has nice target covered projectil reflect while ele only has self reflect and thief is on lucky steal also self only.

shout heal is 30 point in to a useless trait line and covers your utility skills as well, water field is free.
warrior already have not so great damage, you put 30 in vita you will do so little damage for mediocre healing. that trait line does not even have healing power.
and why would you need a class to CC when every body can CC.

that being said, engineer is nice alter for ele, and mesmer has its own use.

your basically saying that Warrior is ok to be class C, because there are class B who are also inferior to class A.

Waisenpai.6028:

Dominik and Narkodx are right. I strongly support them.

I run warrior since beta and I feel them to be quiet fair just run 6 0 0 4 4

Clearly, you have 0 experience as a warrior in PvP other then being a hotjoin hero.
i stopped reading.

I don’t feel that the damage nerfs are unwarranted. To be honest over the last year with the addition of a second sigil slot on GS and the ascended armor stat increases the damage as climbed quite a bit. I mean + 5% from force +10% at night +5% ish? from ascended armor. I don’t think the original numbers were balanced with those increases in mind back in 2012. So I think the changes to HB and Whirlwind were an attempt to pull those back in line when those modifiers are present. Perhaps other classes need to be reviewed and brought in line as well.

As for the adren change I can’t really speak much to how it feels on 6/5/0/03 in PvE since I haven’t ran that since the patch hit, although it did take some time to get used to not being able to use Combustive shot before the beginning of every fight. It feels pretty decent in PvP after adjusting. I’d get behind some changes to the decay rate though, I think there is definitely room for fine tuning it.

Actually dominik makes absolute sense, i guess we should further nerf hundred blades by another 50%,then maybe buff banners 10%.

I think this change would still be balance because warrior can still solo, taken into speed run and needed only for support.

25 % increase on last hit is too much anyways. Hundred blades is divided into 2 parts. First part is where gs hit for 5 times, and 2nd part is last hit. kittens reduction by 5% isnt equivalent to 25 , it is still 5.

Consider this equation:
100 x (5 × 5%) = 500 × 5%

Total hundred blades dmg nerf is actually less than 5%, considering the nerf is only towards one part of the skill.

That is why the nerf was almost redundant, if aNet did not published it, i believe it was not noticeable.

But seriously tho, why the nerf ? Dont really like warrior to being a support class. I rather nerf the banners and have a dmg based warrior. A warrior being like a warrior, instead of a support class lol.

Constantly talking about other classes gets you nowhere. Warrior was perfectly fine, even a little underpowered DPS wise, before the nerf. There simply isn’t a reason not to revert it.

Try to fix other classes in topics that focus on, well, other classes.

Those 5% damage nerfs did further damage warriors that like to do content solo, where banners often don’t even matter enough to slot one.