Guild Wars 2

Hey there guys Titan here again.

I know I rarely due this but I’d like to get input from other sources to try and see if I’m missing anything.

What I’m looking for:
A WvW build meant to duo well with a D/D Thief(Utilities: Shadowstep, Shadow Refuge, Blinding Powder).

What I would like:
- Survivability non-reliant on disengaging fights.
- Preferably high AoE damage to effectively have a fighting chance against outnumbered fights.
- Be able to set up kills for the D/D Thief.
- Be able to survive being focused due to the Thief being invisible.

Not too much more too add, leaving the thread widely open for discussion. Weapon combinations and armor aren’t of consequence, simply trying to min-max the best possible WvW duo build when with a D/D thief.

I played with a friend for a while who was D/D as well.

You’re basically there to take the beating and interrupt them. Hammer for the interrupts and some aoe damage and i’d pick a sword/shield to be able to quickly jump to your thief buddy if hes in trouble and shield to interrupt anything that is going on near him at that moment.

FGJ is great for thieves and OMM as well, you pretty much want to do anything to increase his damage. So use your OMM on the target he is trying to kill instead of your own target.

While running and no targets in sight: Change hammer to gs (mobility) and shield to warhorn (speedboost for both of you). GS is also great for catching people offguard because you can cross so much land in a little time (GS 3- 5 – Sword 2 and eventually shield bash to stun them and set him up for your thief buddy)

As a third skill you might want Stomp, to ensure you can protect your buddy.

Elite, Signet of rage (for the stats of course and to be able to keep up with those fast thieves) of course.

Healing/Sustain: Healing signet for the sustained heal and if you get those shouts in your build, you might as well get the shout masteries which will heal your thief buddy as well.

Those are my 2 cents.

DontJudgeMe.3958:

I played with a friend for a while who was D/D as well.

You’re basically there to take the beating and interrupt them. Hammer for the interrupts and some aoe damage and i’d pick a sword/shield to be able to quickly jump to your thief buddy if hes in trouble and shield to interrupt anything that is going on near him at that moment.

FGJ is great for thieves and OMM as well, you pretty much want to do anything to increase his damage. So use your OMM on the target he is trying to kill instead of your own target.

While running and no targets in sight: Change hammer to gs (mobility) and shield to warhorn (speedboost for both of you). GS is also great for catching people offguard because you can cross so much land in a little time (GS 3- 5 – Sword 2 and eventually shield bash to stun them and set him up for your thief buddy)

As a third skill you might want Stomp, to ensure you can protect your buddy.

Elite, Signet of rage (for the stats of course and to be able to keep up with those fast thieves) of course.

Healing/Sustain: Healing signet for the sustained heal and if you get those shouts in your build, you might as well get the shout masteries which will heal your thief buddy as well.

Those are my 2 cents.

Love the in-depth explanation. Regardless of whether “I” needed to see that is awesome to see the thought process laid out. Would love if you could iterate more and include stat thresholds, cross profession combinations, ect.

Now Sword/Shield-Hammer is one of 4 current weapon combinations I’m currently thinking of. Of those 4 weapon combinations there are 6 possible trait/utility combinations I would consider using.

Current thoughts:
1: Sword/Shield-Hammer
- Balanced DPS/CC with close to the following stat spread
> Attack: 3,200-3,500(With Hammer Equipped)
> Critical Chance: 30%-40%
> Armor: 2,900-3,200
> Base Health
> Critical Damage: 90%-100%+
- Utilities: Bull’s Charge(Optional), Balanced Stance, Berserker’s Stance.

2: Sword/Shield-Hammer
- CC/Support with close to the following stat spread
> Attack: 3,000
> Critical Chance: 30%
> Armor: 3,200+
> Health: 27,500+
> Critical Damage: 40%-60%
- Utilities: “For Great Justice”, “Shake It Off”, Berserker’s Stance or Endure Pain.

3: Greatsword-Hammer
- Balanced DPS/CC with close to the following stat spread
> Attack: 3,200-3,500(With Hammer Equipped)
> Critical Chance: 30%-40%
> Armor: 2,900-3,200
> Base Health
> Critical Damage: 90%-100%+
- Utilities: Bull’s Charge(Optional), Balanced Stance, Berserker’s Stance.

4: Greatsword-Hammer
- CC/Support with close to the following stat spread
> Attack: 3,000
> Critical Chance: 30%
> Armor: 3,200+
> Health: 27,500+
> Critical Damage: 40%-60%
- Utilities: “For Great Justice”, “Shake It Off”, Berserker’s Stance or Endure Pain.

5: Greatsword-Axe/Shield
-High DPS Burst with close to the following stat spread
> Attack: 3,500+
> Critical Chance: 40%+
> Armor: 2,900+
> Base Health
> Critical Damage: 90%-100%+
-Utilities: Bull’s Charge, Signet of Might(Optional), Endure Pain.

6: Longbow-Mace/Sword
- High Condi DPS/CC with close to the following stat spread
> Attack: 2,750
> Critical Chance: 35%-40%
> Armor: 3,000-3,200+
> Base Health
> Critical Damage: 50%+
-Utilities: Bull’s Charge, Stomp, Endure Pain.

Please discuss. Remember I am searching for the best build to duo with a D/D thief.

What about Hammer- Sword/Mace? I don’t know the DD thief that well but this weapons set has some good CC, a gap closer, and decent DPS potential.

Julie Yann.5379:

What about Hammer- Sword/Mace? I don’t know the DD thief that well but this weapons set has some good CC, a gap closer, and decent DPS potential.

I’ve considered it, but in situations where I’m likely to get focused I prefer Shield over Off-hand Mace.

How come you dont have GS-Mace/Shiled on there? You don’t want to be gimmicky? Works pretty well. I think that would suit your idea of what you wanted to do. A 3.5 sec mace stun sets up a kill for a thief very easy.

Ive been playing around with throw bolas a lot lately in WvW it seems to be better than it used to be. Its good for setting up kills sometimes.

Try somthing like this

http://gw2skills.net/editor/?fIAQNAR5ejkOxuFPqQMxBEkCNMLOKUCmQ9wO2w4A-jkCBoLCy0yA0HwECQJPKrJQCiVQFRjVXDT5KyqYCpyAwMGA-w

Why would you need to protect the thief..?

The thief has stealth, you don’t.

He stealths, stupid zerlings in wvw switch to warrior who is a sure target and is one of the ‘easiest’ classes to kill as opposed to guardians/mesmers.

Stealth will drop him as the target every few seconds. If anyone needs protecting it will be the warrior. If a thief needs your help in surviving then he isn’t very good at his class/wrong build.

Knockbacks -including stomping- are a bad idea as they move the target away from your thief’s focus fire. You need them still in one spot and thus immobilize is your best bet.

Based on the needs of the OP, LB is a must:
1. The AOE pressure is too high and will force targets to move away from your group’s general vicinity.
2.You won’t have to run around to catch the main target. That way you and the thief are on the target all the time.
3.AOE pressure can be used to pressure rezzers into moving away from the rezzed target or if they succeed in rezzing, them dropping thus putting you in a better situation since: A.They just dropped and B. Their target rezzed at low health and will have to run or drop him/herself if they try and rez.
4.AOE pressure is essential against 2+ thieves as you can fire and forget around your self thus forcing them to back off and expose them to your thief buddy.
5.LB can negate blinds since it has multiple shots on an attack or two. Blinding roaming thief groups won’t affect you that much.
6.LB 5 is essential as it has a 4s immobilize which will be heaven for your thief buddy. Even if they teleport away, they are still immobilized and you can still focus them if he can’t get to them in time.
If you are more glass cannony, LB burst followed by LB3 and then 2 will hit the rezzers hard helping you pressure larger groups. That sequence will give you the maximum burst without alerting the rezzers till it’s too late.

Keep in mind you will be focused instead of the thief in 90% of the time.

2nd Weapon set:
1.Your 2nd weapon set might have to be a hammer since you will need the AOE. Mostly use hamme burst with sigil of paralyzation to set up an unsuspecting foe attack with LB 3 with sigil of impact on the LB. That way you gurantee a crit after every stun. You can ask your buddy to run a weapon with sigil of impact to take advantage of your stuns.
Call out the stuns and immobilize.

2.Sword and shield/warhorn are tempting but remember that the sword is single target -except for the burst which though it affects mutliple targets, it has a tiny radius-. Shield might help you negate that burst. Also, sword is a gap closer+the immob from the burst is invaluable for setting up the target for dps and you don’t have to channel the sword burst to land the full immob.

3.Mace/shield is poor against multiple targets but can be used to play a bit defensively and take the aggro as well as set up a target for your thief buddy. The poor mobility is a poor seller.

4.GS: Good mobility and very nice dps against multiple targets. The problem is you don’t have any way of setting multiple targets without a hammer and every time you 100b you are exposed to damage for 3.5 seconds. Not practical in 2+ fights. The 2nd thief for example would just jump on the chance to burst u when you’re 100bing.

5.Rifle: Single target but it’s good for lolz if you are high in dps. Use group SR to stealth, killshot then LB 5 then LB3 while your thief buddy drops him as well then stealth/shadowstep or stab stomp so one target out of the way. Thieves or up arrows are your best bet for this as you know they will be glass cannony or got crap gear on.
Also with rifle, you never have problems with mobility as the damage is always applied on mesmers,kiters etc. The weapon is single target and is weak in general, unfortunately.

Primary combo: I suggest you definitely go for LB and the 2nd weapon set is up to you but a hammer is your best best for AOE after LB.

The 2nd combo would be hammer+GS. hammer burst with sigil of paralyz+unsuspecting foe and then 100b burst. You can repeat this every 7-9 seconds.

XII.9401:

Why would you need to protect the thief..?

The thief has stealth, you don’t.

He stealths, stupid zerlings in wvw switch to warrior who is a sure target and is one of the ‘easiest’ classes to kill as opposed to guardians/mesmers.

Stealth will drop him as the target every few seconds. If anyone needs protecting it will be the warrior. If a thief needs your help in surviving then he isn’t very good at his class/wrong build.

Knockbacks -including stomping- are a bad idea as they move the target away from your thief’s focus fire. You need them still in one spot and thus immobilize is your best bet.

Based on the needs of the OP, LB is a must:
1. The AOE pressure is too high and will force targets to move away from your group’s general vicinity.
2.You won’t have to run around to catch the main target. That way you and the thief are on the target all the time.
3.AOE pressure can be used to pressure rezzers into moving away from the rezzed target or if they succeed in rezzing, them dropping thus putting you in a better situation since: A.They just dropped and B. Their target rezzed at low health and will have to run or drop him/herself if they try and rez.
4.AOE pressure is essential against 2+ thieves as you can fire and forget around your self thus forcing them to back off and expose them to your thief buddy.
5.LB can negate blinds since it has multiple shots on an attack or two. Blinding roaming thief groups won’t affect you that much.
6.LB 5 is essential as it has a 4s immobilize which will be heaven for your thief buddy. Even if they teleport away, they are still immobilized and you can still focus them if he can’t get to them in time.
If you are more glass cannony, LB burst followed by LB3 and then 2 will hit the rezzers hard helping you pressure larger groups. That sequence will give you the maximum burst without alerting the rezzers till it’s too late.

Keep in mind you will be focused instead of the thief in 90% of the time.

2nd Weapon set:
1.Your 2nd weapon set might have to be a hammer since you will need the AOE. Mostly use hamme burst with sigil of paralyzation to set up an unsuspecting foe attack with LB 3 with sigil of impact on the LB. That way you gurantee a crit after every stun. You can ask your buddy to run a weapon with sigil of impact to take advantage of your stuns.
Call out the stuns and immobilize.

2.Sword and shield/warhorn are tempting but remember that the sword is single target -except for the burst which though it affects mutliple targets, it has a tiny radius-. Shield might help you negate that burst. Also, sword is a gap closer+the immob from the burst is invaluable for setting up the target for dps and you don’t have to channel the sword burst to land the full immob.

3.Mace/shield is poor against multiple targets but can be used to play a bit defensively and take the aggro as well as set up a target for your thief buddy. The poor mobility is a poor seller.

4.GS: Good mobility and very nice dps against multiple targets. The problem is you don’t have any way of setting multiple targets without a hammer and every time you 100b you are exposed to damage for 3.5 seconds. Not practical in 2+ fights. The 2nd thief for example would just jump on the chance to burst u when you’re 100bing.

5.Rifle: Single target but it’s good for lolz if you are high in dps. Use group SR to stealth, killshot then LB 5 then LB3 while your thief buddy drops him as well then stealth/shadowstep or stab stomp so one target out of the way. Thieves or up arrows are your best bet for this as you know they will be glass cannony or got crap gear on.
Also with rifle, you never have problems with mobility as the damage is always applied on mesmers,kiters etc. The weapon is single target and is weak in general, unfortunately.

Primary combo: I suggest you definitely go for LB and the 2nd weapon set is up to you but a hammer is your best best for AOE after LB.

The 2nd combo would be hammer+GS. hammer burst with sigil of paralyz+unsuspecting foe and then 100b burst. You can repeat this every 7-9 seconds.

I played a Hammer-LB for quite a while and absolutely loved it. Great for small group and zerg fights alike. Not very mobile though and that might be a down side. Sword/Shield-hammer might be a better choice or trait a gap closer like bulls charge

XII.9401:

Why would you need to protect the thief..?

2nd Weapon set:
1.Your 2nd weapon set might have to be a hammer since you will need the AOE. Mostly use hamme burst with sigil of paralyzation to set up an unsuspecting foe attack with LB 3 with sigil of impact on the LB. That way you gurantee a crit after every stun. You can ask your buddy to run a weapon with sigil of impact to take advantage of your stuns.
Call out the stuns and immobilize.

2.Sword and shield/warhorn are tempting but remember that the sword is single target -except for the burst which though it affects mutliple targets, it has a tiny radius-. Shield might help you negate that burst. Also, sword is a gap closer+the immob from the burst is invaluable for setting up the target for dps and you don’t have to channel the sword burst to land the full immob.

3.Mace/shield is poor against multiple targets but can be used to play a bit defensively and take the aggro as well as set up a target for your thief buddy. The poor mobility is a poor seller.

4.GS: Good mobility and very nice dps against multiple targets. The problem is you don’t have any way of setting multiple targets without a hammer and every time you 100b you are exposed to damage for 3.5 seconds. Not practical in 2+ fights. The 2nd thief for example would just jump on the chance to burst u when you’re 100bing.

5.Rifle: Single target but it’s good for lolz if you are high in dps. Use group SR to stealth, killshot then LB 5 then LB3 while your thief buddy drops him as well then stealth/shadowstep or stab stomp so one target out of the way. Thieves or up arrows are your best bet for this as you know they will be glass cannony or got crap gear on.
Also with rifle, you never have problems with mobility as the damage is always applied on mesmers,kiters etc. The weapon is single target and is weak in general, unfortunately.

Hey there XII,

Awesome post and thank you for replying.

I completely agree that the thieves survivability isn’t the issue. The problem I’ve been dealing with is my own, in almost every engagement I’m getting trained.

Now here issue with any Longbow – X build.

1: Longbow-Hammer
- Lacks mobility.
- If be trained by targets with stability Hammer won’t help and neither will a Fire Field.

2: Longbow-Mace/Shield
- Lacks mobility.
- Same problem as Hammer except you can delay it with Shield Stance for 3 seconds.

3: Longbow-Greatsword
- Lacks a way of locking down a target with moderate condition cleanse(Physical utilities on a 45 second cool-down are not a valid argument).
- Where as Stuns, Knockdowns, Knockbacks can force utility uses immobilize can be easily cleansed by passives, teammates, ect.

4: Longbow-Sword/Shield
- Similar problem to Longbow-Greatsword, better but still not a solution.

5: Longbow-Rifle
- Simply a lacking set.
- Great ranged damage but once the thief goes invisible and you get focused its over.

I didn’t focus on mobility because I got the impression you were going to abuse SR. Even then, it’s kinda iffy.

I think to fit your needs you will have to bite the bullet and go LB and S/Warhorn:

You get two immobilizes, few classes break out of it regularly in time. An ele? Just wait for the water splash then immob right away= 4 sec of free dps -unless they teleport-. Guardians are OP and a different story. What can ya do.

The Sword burst +LB5 will be more than enough for pinning down targets. You can burst mastery to ensure an immob every 7 seconds but gotta be aggressive about it. Also, both immobilize effects are the Fire and forget kind. So you can keep kiting and dodging etc. I’m not sure if you tried LB. I used to despise the idea of using it in wvw but after trying it I really think it is THE most polished weapon for a warrior.

You are giving too much credit to opponents in WvW..to be honest, if you are serious about fighting against GOOD groups -not sure if you are seeing them in CD- then one of you has to be a boon abusing guardian,at least. Otherwise you gotta compromise. Wait till you run into guardian/ele abusing boon duration and in a month or 2, the celestial eles.

You just have to figure out how hard you’ll hit because you’ll need to hit hard to overcome ele/guard or g/g if your duo is war/thief. They just face roll ftw.

Simple answer from me would be Hammer with Mace/Shield. Armor would be Soldiers or Knights to stack some defense. Build at least enough in the crit line to get +50% crit chance against stunned targets. Impact sigil on Hammer, Paralyzation/Hydromancy for Mace and Shield. Whatever you want for either survivability or CC utility skills. Heal is up to you. Don’t really have a good build setup made for this as I haven’t run it before, but should be great for setting up easy kills. Hammer has knockdown, knockback, aoe stun + burst. Mace/Shield has 2 stuns, 1 of them is really long on the Burst skill with mace, a daze, 2 blocks. Should prove a pretty good support build to compliment a good thief.

I use a similar setup but with GS instead of Hammer. Usually solo, to small group of maybe 3-4 people, so I prefer the GS for the mobility, but all my guildies love having me around since I seem to always be the focus of the enemy groups, while I can soak a lot, and put out lots of stuns.

EDIT Threw a build together. Utilities can change at your discretion, and just change the Signet recharge trait if you change them, but you’ll find it makes you pretty tanky.

http://intothemists.com/calc/?build=-s;4NKVP0d4NL-60;9;59T-T;13;0019;125An-F2W;16TsW6TsWKBlc0-HXO0;1vV0X5Y8ZG4La5F-3k-BV8aNX8a;9;9;9;9;9;4V3-6H

Skull Crack with Mace burst will last a good 3.5-4s. I’d lead off with the shield stun first, see if you can make them freak and use a stun break. Watch for Stability icon, then smack em with Skull Crack. Swap to Hammer, hit em hard, then choose to either use Hammer burst ability for aoe stun/burst dmg, or back to mace/shield to tank up and wait for another skull crack. Should work really well as a solo roamer build as well I would think, but especially with bursty rogues around to take advantage of your CC.

EDIT 2 For the Sharpening Stone, just use the Hardened one instead. By far cheaper, and if you need that extra 1-2% bonus, then that’s really on you, and not the food.

After 2 days of testing(18 hours of actual gameplay) I’ve come to the conclusion that the following is going to preform best when in a duo with a thief.

http://gw2skills.net/editor/?fIAQNAS8ejcOJvNPuQMxBE0DNkLyiTBlI9gMGw0A-jkxAYLB5sXR0YrsFRjVXjpcTqKWQWIAZLAA-w

Kirito.8796:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9JU3WyYSWGU

- Survivability non-reliant on disengaging fights. (check)
- Preferably high AoE damage to effectively have a fighting chance against outnumbered fights. (check)
- Be able to set up kills for the D/D Thief. (check)
- Be able to survive being focused due to the Thief being invisible. (check)

Yea I love that build/vid. Need to try it out!

Lord Titan.3791:

After 2 days of testing(18 hours of actual gameplay) I’ve come to the conclusion that the following is going to preform best when in a duo with a thief.

http://gw2skills.net/editor/?fIAQNAS8ejcOJvNPuQMxBE0DNkLyiTBlI9gMGw0A-jkxAYLB5sXR0YrsFRjVXjpcTqKWQWIAZLAA-w

Really, no condition reduction food?