Guild Wars 2

Hey Anet, i think we are seeing a formula again within this game occurring like it did in your first game.

Warriors were amazing at the start of both of your games, Nerf, Nerf, Nerf and nerfity nerfity. sucks.

Might want to think about “balancing” your classes more than harming them. o no.. yeah, don’t worry. rune of scavenging only makes one build in PvP work properly now in GW2….. sure, give us that one build. let other classes have more than one.

Uh, what? Warriors in GW1 were awesome. I’ve never observed a GvG match that didn’t have at least 1 Warrior. They were awesome in PvE as well. I’d give anything to have the GW2 Warrior be like the one in the original game. Higher skill ceiling, stance dancing, more interesting adrenaline mechanic, etc.

I would not like to have the gw1 warrior back.
In the beginning they were good, but in the end not that really.
In GW1 assassins were used to tank / speedclear in high level PvE, not warriors.
Paragon (with warrior skills) was best suporter than warrior.
Warrior stances were better (efectiveness) when used by other professions (Monk for example).
In PvP the amount of melee hate / blinds was insane. Warrior didn´t have any caster hate.
The Healing signet plus frenzy was a joke.

In GW2 Warrior is not that bad. Let it be that way.

They really kittened the class badly this time.

Damage is so low that my ele with no armor pretty much beats my warrior’s DPS lol. Absolutely pathetic.

Anyways, I feel inclined to correct you on something – warriors were trashy at GW2’s release but they vastly improved them later on.

Ever since spring 2014, however, they have been absolutely nuking warriors to the point where there’s really no reason to play them anymore. Warriors are in a critically poor state atm.

Purple Miku.7032:

They really kittened the class badly this time.

Damage is so low that my ele with no armor pretty much beats my warrior’s DPS lol. Absolutely pathetic.

Anyways, I feel inclined to correct you on something – warriors were trashy at GW2’s release but they vastly improved them later on.

Ever since spring 2014, however, they have been absolutely nuking warriors to the point where there’s really no reason to play them anymore. Warriors are in a critically poor state atm.

I would partialy agree with you on this,

Warrior indeed got vastly improved when it comes to surviability with the buff of healing signet and the additional condition immunity and removal options.

But on the other hand some weapons like Sword/Mh and Rifle got drasticaly changed to the point we lost build synergies, skills versatility and builds diversity with some of those changes.

For every steps A-net makes forward, they also make 2 backwards…

Ambrecombe.4398:

Purple Miku.7032:

They really kittened the class badly this time.

Damage is so low that my ele with no armor pretty much beats my warrior’s DPS lol. Absolutely pathetic.

Anyways, I feel inclined to correct you on something – warriors were trashy at GW2’s release but they vastly improved them later on.

Ever since spring 2014, however, they have been absolutely nuking warriors to the point where there’s really no reason to play them anymore. Warriors are in a critically poor state atm.

I would partialy agree with you on this,

Warrior indeed got vastly improved when it comes to surviability with the buff of healing signet and the additional condition immunity and removal options.

But on the other hand some weapons like Sword/Mh and Rifle got drasticaly changed to the point we lost build synergies, skills versatility and builds diversity with some of those changes.

For every steps A-net makes forward, they also make 2 backwards…

Except with rifle skill changes they made the weapon be a better power based weapon which is what it always was to begin with. If anything they took 2 steps forward on that approach.

It never made sense for a power based weapon for the auto attack to make the target bleed.

silentnight warrior.2714:

I would not like to have the gw1 warrior back.
In the beginning they were good, but in the end not that really.
In GW1 assassins were used to tank / speedclear in high level PvE, not warriors.
Paragon (with warrior skills) was best suporter than warrior.
Warrior stances were better (efectiveness) when used by other professions (Monk for example).
In PvP the amount of melee hate / blinds was insane. Warrior didn´t have any caster hate.
The Healing signet plus frenzy was a joke.

In GW2 Warrior is not that bad. Let it be that way.

1) Bad warriors tanked, good warriors made mobs explode with HB and MoP. Tanking was pretty useless with the exception of a very few areas.

2) Paragons were essentially SY! spam bots. D Slash warriors can spam SY! very well while providing great dps and knock lock with BH.

3) I’ve only seen Monks use defensive stances in PvP, but I don’t see how that makes them more effective using them. I’ve also never seen any serious Warrior build use defensive skill in any format unless it was for farming or tanking.

4) Melee hate was bad for all melee except blind for Melandru Dervs. Warriors certainly had caster hate; knock lock.

5) If you use Healing Signet and Frenzy at the same time while under fire then you deserve to die. Any serious PvPer will tell you that Frenzy is one of the best skills in the game in terms of balance. High risk, high reward.

6) GW2 Warrior is excellent… as a banner bot.

Travis the Terrible.4739:

Ambrecombe.4398:

Purple Miku.7032:

They really kittened the class badly this time.

Damage is so low that my ele with no armor pretty much beats my warrior’s DPS lol. Absolutely pathetic.

Anyways, I feel inclined to correct you on something – warriors were trashy at GW2’s release but they vastly improved them later on.

Ever since spring 2014, however, they have been absolutely nuking warriors to the point where there’s really no reason to play them anymore. Warriors are in a critically poor state atm.

I would partialy agree with you on this,

Warrior indeed got vastly improved when it comes to surviability with the buff of healing signet and the additional condition immunity and removal options.

But on the other hand some weapons like Sword/Mh and Rifle got drasticaly changed to the point we lost build synergies, skills versatility and builds diversity with some of those changes.

For every steps A-net makes forward, they also make 2 backwards…

Except with rifle skill changes they made the weapon be a better power based weapon which is what it always was to begin with. If anything they took 2 steps forward on that approach.

It never made sense for a power based weapon for the auto attack to make the target bleed.

The Bleeds were there to improve your damage with Attack of Opportunity since Crack Shot wasn’t an adept talent yet, and since the Arms tree was about precision and condition damage you were at least getting some benefits out of those stats no matter what you did. Fierce Shot does indeed extra 20% damage over Bleeding Shot, but the bleed alone exceed that amount of power damage. So it was a nerf.

The Rifle had a condition build variant, I personnaly used the 4/6/0/0/4, which requiered Power/Precision/Condition Damage. And it could sustain over 4K Dps Unbuffed and still burst down your target with the mix of power attacks, bleeds and confusion from Distracting Strike. And it used to be a perfect switch option with Sword/Mh + Shield. The versatility of Savage Leap allowed you to get in or out of combats and with Quick Hands you could just switch between weapons whenever you needed to reapply a Cripple.

All those options are not viable anymore, and the change to Fierce Shot actualy reduces your DPS unless you are fighting a boss with max bleeding stacks.

So yes, A-net improved the Rifle in the latest patch for power users, but previously they also nerfed the rifle and completely destroyed a viable alternate build. Which sucks…

Ambrecombe.4398:

Travis the Terrible.4739:

Ambrecombe.4398:

Purple Miku.7032:

They really kittened the class badly this time.

Damage is so low that my ele with no armor pretty much beats my warrior’s DPS lol. Absolutely pathetic.

Anyways, I feel inclined to correct you on something – warriors were trashy at GW2’s release but they vastly improved them later on.

Ever since spring 2014, however, they have been absolutely nuking warriors to the point where there’s really no reason to play them anymore. Warriors are in a critically poor state atm.

I would partialy agree with you on this,

Warrior indeed got vastly improved when it comes to surviability with the buff of healing signet and the additional condition immunity and removal options.

But on the other hand some weapons like Sword/Mh and Rifle got drasticaly changed to the point we lost build synergies, skills versatility and builds diversity with some of those changes.

For every steps A-net makes forward, they also make 2 backwards…

Except with rifle skill changes they made the weapon be a better power based weapon which is what it always was to begin with. If anything they took 2 steps forward on that approach.

It never made sense for a power based weapon for the auto attack to make the target bleed.

The Bleeds were there to improve your damage with Attack of Opportunity since Crack Shot wasn’t an adept talent yet, and since the Arms tree was about precision and condition damage you were at least getting some benefits out of those stats no matter what you did. Fierce Shot does indeed extra 20% damage over Bleeding Shot, but the bleed alone exceed that amount of power damage. So it was a nerf.

The Rifle had a condition build variant, I personnaly used the 4/6/0/0/4, which requiered Power/Precision/Condition Damage. And it could sustain over 4K Dps Unbuffed and still burst down your target with the mix of power attacks, bleeds and confusion from Distracting Strike. And it used to be a perfect switch option with Sword/Mh + Shield. The versatility of Savage Leap allowed you to get in or out of combats and with Quick Hands you could just switch between weapons whenever you needed to reapply a Cripple.

All those options are not viable anymore, and the change to Fierce Shot actualy reduces your DPS unless you are fighting a boss with max bleeding stacks.

So yes, A-net improved the Rifle in the latest patch for power users, but previously they also nerfed the rifle and completely destroyed a viable alternate build. Which sucks…

Except longbow was always the better weapon of the 2 ranged except in range. The versatility of it far outweighed the better burst and pitiful bleeds that rifle gave. If anything I’d still say longbow is the superior ranged weapon for warrior. PvP or PvE the versatility of it just makes it so much better.

Honestly the only saving grace to rifle would be its burst damage then swapping back to your melee weapon. I havent looked at the sustained dps numbers for either weapon as of late, but im fairly certain longbow is better. Granted this isnt about longbow but still.

Tru Reptile.6058:

silentnight warrior.2714:

I would not like to have the gw1 warrior back.
In the beginning they were good, but in the end not that really.
In GW1 assassins were used to tank / speedclear in high level PvE, not warriors.
Paragon (with warrior skills) was best suporter than warrior.
Warrior stances were better (efectiveness) when used by other professions (Monk for example).
In PvP the amount of melee hate / blinds was insane. Warrior didn´t have any caster hate.
The Healing signet plus frenzy was a joke.

In GW2 Warrior is not that bad. Let it be that way.

1) Bad warriors tanked, good warriors made mobs explode with HB and MoP. Tanking was pretty useless with the exception of a very few areas.

2) Paragons were essentially SY! spam bots. D Slash warriors can spam SY! very well while providing great dps and knock lock with BH.

3) I’ve only seen Monks use defensive stances in PvP, but I don’t see how that makes them more effective using them. I’ve also never seen any serious Warrior build use defensive skill in any format unless it was for farming or tanking.

4) Melee hate was bad for all melee except blind for Melandru Dervs. Warriors certainly had caster hate; knock lock.

5) If you use Healing Signet and Frenzy at the same time while under fire then you deserve to die. Any serious PvPer will tell you that Frenzy is one of the best skills in the game in terms of balance. High risk, high reward.

6) GW2 Warrior is excellent… as a banner bot.

Ty for the imput.

1) In the areas you needed a tank you would not pick a heavy class for that (warrior), and that was my point. There were better tanks builds in other classes. If a player is good or bad that is irrelevant because you could be the best warrior in the world, when your party needed a tank you would switch classes.

2) Paragons were better at team suport than warriors. The team damage mitigation was way better than a warrior could provide. That was my point.

3) A monk is a good example. The moment a warrior use a stance to attack faster he could be blinded, hexed, the other player could activate a defensive stance for example, so the efectiveness of the stance could be very low.
A Monk using a stance “against” a warrior could provide not only damage mitigation (with blocks or if the warrior just stop attaking), but it could also replinesh their energy for spells. The efectiveness of the stance was way better.
Warrior defensive stances were more usefull in other classes.

4) Knock lock is not caster hate. The professions with caster hate were also… casters. Caster hate is when you punnish someone for using spells, just like melee hate.
Other thing, in GW1 you could not block spells and blind worked diferently for melee and spells.

5) I was just refering that Healing Signet and frenzy was considered a joke back then. Also warrior was the only class that had a skill like frenzy with that penality and a Healing skill that could be used to punnish the warrior even more when he needed the healing.

6) Agree, I just don´t want the GW1 warrior version back because it is worst that we have now.

I am honestly a little confused with this warrior are kitten sentiment. In this thread https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/professions/warrior/Is-warrior-REALLY-sucking-that-hard-o-o/first#post4742894 @Purple Miku.7032 shows all the dps nerfs warriors have received and a lot of them are just nerfs for all classes in general.

While things like the longbow arcing arrow 15%, and 100b+whirlwind 5% nerf is bad I wouldn’t say that puts the warrior in the sh_ _ter. According to DnT warrior is still at 5th place in dps and the difference between 3rd and 5th is trivial at best considering the amount of keys an engineer has to present to stay in 3rd and the sword aa management a ranger has to do with bosses like alpha in CoE.

Additionally, warriors have not lost their place in the meta regardless of the nerfs so I think it’s safe to say warriors at the moment are generally balanced.

However there are some things that should be changed like the time at which adrenaline starts to deplete after a fight, effectiveness of healing skills besides signet needs to be reworked, and as in the thread @Purple Miku.7032 pointed out the bug with berserker power not applying to burst skills because the adrenaline drains before the actual damage calculation.

These are my thoughts on warrior anyway, I’m curious to know why specifically you think warrior is in the sh _ _ter right now.

I remember when Warriors were weak at release.

I don’t really know if they’re weak now, but it certainly doesnt seem like it when facing them.

However, remember not so long ago when warriors were godmode as represented in the pic below?

Yeah…

Vert.5041:

While things like the longbow arcing arrow 15%, and 100b+whirlwind 5% nerf is bad I wouldn’t say that puts the warrior in the sh_ _ter. According to DnT warrior is still at 5th place in dps and the difference between 3rd and 5th is trivial at best considering the amount of keys an engineer has to present to stay in 3rd and the sword aa management a ranger has to do with bosses like alpha in CoE.

Additionally, warriors have not lost their place in the meta regardless of the nerfs so I think it’s safe to say warriors at the moment are generally balanced.

However there are some things that should be changed like the time at which adrenaline starts to deplete after a fight, effectiveness of healing skills besides signet needs to be reworked, and as in the thread @Purple Miku.7032 pointed out the bug with berserker power not applying to burst skills because the adrenaline drains before the actual damage calculation.

After reading the list and catching up on things, I share the same sentiments.

Some of them do apply to all classes like ferocity + might, but some of them didn’t because a lot of classes weren’t able to really utilize strength runes/bloodlust stacks.

Fact of the matter is warrior has lost over 30% of its DPS on average in the past year, often times even more. Prior to any of these nerfs they weren’t even at the top. That’s absurd.

Imo the perfect way to resolve the issue would be to do something like…

Increase the damage from Slashing Power by 5% and/or increase the last hit of hundred blades by X% (I suggested this a while ago and while I did have a lot of people agree with me there were a few people who adamantly refused to accept it). Some people have posted saying they’d like a might duration increase for Forceful GS but I’m not really sure if I agree it’s needed, as that trait already seems overwhelmingly good to begin with.

I think axe offhand deserves a buff in more than one way because it just sucks. I don’t get why the damage increase only is applies to PvP… it’s really bad in PvE and I think it should be applied to it as well. Also #4 on it should either get a fury duration increase by maybe 2 seconds or have a reduced cooldown imo.

Furious Reaction trait I think needs adjustments; I posted this on another thread but I think it either needs a slight cooldown reduction or a fury duration increase. Leave the vigour alone.

Sword/mace offhands are both fine… warhorn doesn’t need adjustments either…

But something I thought about that I’d really like for axe mainhand would be a projectile block of ~3/4 seconds on cyclone axe (#2), same as the burning speed evade frame on dagger mainhand for ele. It’d be tough to time properly but it would actually make the skill worth using, because as it stands it’s currently a DPS loss in both PvE and PvP and WvW.

Have many more things I’d like to see but those are some things I think that would put warrior in a much, much better position.

silentnight warrior.2714:

Words

You have a right to your opinion but the Warrior in Guild Wars 1 was far more skill based and vastly superior to group play. The Warrior in Guild Wars 2 can do nothing better or as good in comparison to the other professions. The only thing they have better than other professions are their banners (that is literally it).

You mention Monks being able to use Warrior defensive stances better… but completely fail to mention the Warrior spear build that completely rolled a Paragon at his own game. Or the Warrior dagger build with shadow steps that plagued AB and Fort Aspen wood for months.

The Warrior in Guild Wars 2 is a complete joke. The only reason they became a problem is due to all the decently skilled people leaving the game. Now you have the terror of the most general form, auto attacks! oh no!

I’m pretty sure the coming months are going to bring some buffs for us

Yes ,hopefully they increase Greatsword dmg by 35% and remove the banners in return that the warrior drops out of meta finally.

But Hey, the main thing is we can see big dps numbers and have better things to offer than kittenty banners.

Seriously I really get tired of comments like " We’ve got only banners which make us special and compared to ele or thief dps our dmg sucks"

Well compared to thief and ele dps every other classes suck as well.
And yes it’s true the banner-kitten and a PS-warrior is the only reason to take a warrior in a group.
But again… this isn’t a warrior problem. You bring every class for one special reason.
A Mesmer for his portal, a ranger for his spirit and an engineer for vulnerability.

You guys should really stop to compare your class only with thiefs and elementalists. There are also 5 more classes.

Yes, I changed my opinion and I also think that the warrior deserves a dps buff but the arguments and complains you give are ridiculus, though.

I don’t understand these posts. A class in heavy armor and the highest amount of health SHOULD be doing less damage with a class in light armor low health.

Why do you feel you shouldn’t get a nerf? You really want the best armor, health, and dps? I quit warrior because it’s boring, it’s easy, it’s hard to die, there was no challenge at all. I hope they nerf the class even harder and I might actually enjoy the class getting balanced and being reasonable.

Sylent.3165:

I don’t understand these posts. A class in heavy armor and the highest amount of health SHOULD be doing less damage with a class in light armor low health.

Why do you feel you shouldn’t get a nerf? You really want the best armor, health, and dps? I quit warrior because it’s boring, it’s easy, it’s hard to die, there was no challenge at all. I hope they nerf the class even harder and I might actually enjoy the class getting balanced and being reasonable.

It is easy to understand.
If all classes had the same damage mitigation/defenses and the only diference between classes was the health/armour, then the ones with higher health/armour should do less damage. That is not the case in this game.

Here you got protection, evades, ports, stealth, when used properly can avoid a lot more damage than toughness/health could.

Sylent.3165:

I don’t understand these posts. A class in heavy armor and the highest amount of health SHOULD be doing less damage with a class in light armor low health.

I don’t really think anyone’s saying Warrior should be doing more DPS than an Elementalist. But, as the meta goes, we’re ranked higher than Mesmer and (far above) Necro in terms of damage dealing, and that’s why I think it’s in a good spot. A caution, though: You could argue Necro deserves to be low because it actually has the highest amount of health (with light armor) when the reason why it’s #8 is because of how ineffective conditions can be most of the time (in PvE). If its Specialization trades condi damage for more direct damage, who knows where it’ll place.

I know it’s easy to support the “live longer = deal less damage” philosophy, but how much “longer” is also has to be taken into account. Because of GW2’s combat, Warriors might survive… what, one extra hit from the boss? Maybe 2? We still have to dodge and we still have to pay attention to our surroundings, just like any other class. We’re not tanks who can sit there for 10 minutes (with a healer), laughing off all the damage the boss deals. However, that’s why I think the differences in the meta DPS ranking aren’t THAT substantial, at least for #3-7. We know Ele is clearly #1, Thief is clearly #2, and Necro is clearly #8. Everything inbetween can fluctuate.

Then the difficulty in dealing optimal DPS is considered. Engi has to swap kits and use a complex rotation, while remembering to survive, and Ranger has to deal with his sword’s “Time to die!” #1 autoattack. Warrior has an absurdly simple DPS rotation while also having the survivability you mentioned, PLUS group support. So we’re really not in that bad a position. Yes, we aren’t what we were pre-2014, and I think ANet can buff our damage a little bit and still keep us in this balanced spot, but we’ll see.