Maybe our class is not that bad, after all?

Maybe our class is not that bad, after all?

in Warrior

Posted by: Dreamcoil.9617

Dreamcoil.9617

Privet there. I’m usually sit in read-only, preferring just occasionally watch interesting topics, bu-ut… Approximately, from skillsystem update release (June 23 ‘15, yea) and till nowadays i’m seeing more and more people who’s complaining about warriors being “kitten”, being “unplayable class”, being “too nerfed to actually do something”, after all. I don’t really want to turn the tide, raise the holy war against popular opinions and other prophety stuff, just wanna say a few things from the viewpoint of a warriors loyal fan. Mostly this talks will be about PvP, because i’m not a big WvW fan and PvE is kinda simple, when you know what exactly can your character do, and where it fails badly.
So, it’ll start from 3 sentences that i’ve seen most often, and then i’ll end this talkie-talkies with a little overall breakdown – thus this post mostly aims for people who keeps make threads like “anet plz change muh warrior onto something more killable”.

Warriors can’t endure a pressure/being helpless prey for condibuilds/cannot do this, that, and, oh, that simultaneously/can’t rek a team of 3 enemies on their point kittenty class deleting!!!!11one
Sadly, that last sentence is not been just imagined by me, it’s a quote from a mistchat. Spent about 20 mins talking with that guy, and realized that he didn’t even trolled. Sigh. Anyways, usually people complaining on something like that (especially new players, as i can see), so, here’s a first hint: warrior is one of the most versatile classes in general, but he pays for it – keep that in mind all the time. You want to bunk all the day long? Cleric stats, shouts, water rune, warbanner with regen, and you can even damage in this build – not insanely stronk, but enough from second-line rifle supporting. Want more CC for survivability? Twin maces on swap. Or shield for direct tanking. Whatevs, traits and weapon skills are flexible enough, if you’re know, what you want to achieve with your build. Not interested in bunking? Here, take a bow, be a condi dd. And so on, it’s trivial enough to not mention all the possibilities. And here is the point when we’re heading right to the…
WARRIOR CANT DAMEDGEEEE/WARRIOR CAN DAMAGE BUT DIES RIGHT AFTER ENDURE PAIN ENDS AND IT’S NOT ENOUGH ANYWAYS ANET BUFF MUH FUNKY GREATSWORD PLOX
…to the more mistchat quotes, seriously, i didn’t made any significant changes in them. Seen a bunch of similar-themed threads here, too. Well, that’s sort of true, usually you cannot just grab longest and heaviest greatsword available and slash everything that moves to death. I mean, you can, and many amateur wars behaves exactly like that, rushing/whirling into enemy’s pack and eventually die after a few seconds of hundred blade-ing ‘em. That’s mostly because of mindset “war must be yolo-damager or he doesn’t need at all”, plaguing war community since ~2013. That’s kittening ridiculous, like, really? Can’t you kitten realize that being jack of all trades, and therefore a master of none, implies using tactics different from “waaaaargh”? Kitty kitten, even specialization that contains one of the warrior’s biggest advantages over all else called “tactics”, eh. Back to our sheeps, it’s trivial as well, but somehow large part of wars just cannot take it, this way or that: GW2 has pretty decent role difference within teams, and if you’re picked one, be prepared to act accordingly. Warrior just doesn’t have a role called “all in”, you’re lacking some abilities anyway, and most of the burst/DPS-builds usually repaying for good damage output in overall brittleness, or vulnerability to a specific offense type. Yes, this is simple as a piece of a kitten, but oh, some people just cannot take it. Just. Can’t.
Okay, next.
War is too simple, pick GS and 111111/war is too meh-tier/cannot over-dps an ele or viper engi in dungeons, therefore useless/i want to kill anything in 2-3 buttons and live on doing that, bad class, cannot do that
Finally, most funny of all whinies. Someone heard too many stereotypes about class, nvming that many of them appeared few years ago, when things been different. Some just thinks that “war = simple and easy faceroll kills (hello, almost all of the hammer/GS users, who just jumps in and starts to mash keyboard)”. And all that people makes warrior, plays a dozen of arena matches/WvW rounds/makes a two-three dungeon runs, see that their zerker MASSIV DAMAGE build can’t rek as good as they wanted, or as good as their zerker LB ranger reks, for example… and they’re start to whine, here as well. Without, sometimes, even basic understanding of “who is who”. In PvE, mostly, it’s just a side effect of a “DPS race”, and old, rusty stereotypes that rooted in the mind of a player too deep. In PvP and WvW, tho, it’s a most common reason for someone to blame war for… anything? It’s just that. And mostly it happens because warrior can do something alone only in some specific builds, many of which was been culled by celestial and sentinel amulets removal – he’s a teamplayer, and a very decent one, in some of the areas maybe even the best. This class is suited for almost everything, every situation that game can throw at you, but it’s impossible to be prepared for anything and do everything, even with skillpool being so, like, “general”. Stop being a piece of kitten and for once ask yourself – “what i’m wanted to do on the battlefield?”. And make a build suited for something different than “Cooking Mama’s Happy Hammer” minigame, as well as suicidal greatsword charges, thinking that you can score a kill till Endure Pain is active, and then Balthazar personally will save you from revenge of angry enemy teammates. Maybe even start use /team chat, but that’s spicy midtier advanced playstyle.

tl;dr for ppl who don’t want to read my discourse above: there is playstyles other than “i wanna be top killer so badly, even bought a twilight for gud skin – gud skill xoxo” and also weapons other than GS, hammer and bow, as well as utils contains not only stances and signets. Turn your head on and finally start work with the team, it’s very delightful when team are decent too. Yes, warrior is outdated a little, comparing to realities of HoT, but still rocks, when used right – like an old shotgun among futuristic blasters"

Aaand, a more tight-packed breakdown for those, who still can only think about GS 2 all the way when he hears “warrior”. Just because noticeable part of warriors in mistchat and other mapchats refer to this forum in their ridiculous trashtalks, maybe some of them really lurks somewhere around, idk.

- Best revive speed in the game. Sometimes it’s really, i mean, REALLY better to res your downed ally than trying to “kill that thin mesmer grill, she’s on low hp, one whirl and… ow… dazed… ow… dun hit plz… ayy(”, especially when build contains tactics traitline. It’s a simple, even dumb advice, but kitteningly kitten, almost no one never resses even in situations when it can turn the checkerboard.
- As i’ve said before, potential to fill almost any combat role, except few very specific and class-tied ones. Here’s a tip: even warhorn, that’s considered to be useless, isn’t really useless when used right. No, not only swiftspam.
- Great skillpool and passive survivability. With the cele’s removal, a good all-round build that, if played well, was been able to kill, or at least withstand opressing of anyone 1×1, sometimes even 1×3, till the friends come, is gone – but even now passive tank with ton of CC and painfully punishing interrupts, is possible to built, and it’s even viable, woo. Yes, due to being oldest and, kinda, most conservative class, war’s abilities are looking slightly faint, a bit of “nice, almost good, but not good, duh” maybe, but that’s can be overcome by more team-relying play and careful position taking in massfights. Of course, some of the traits and abilities has their flaws (recent change in the berserker’s stance mechanic, considering necros boonstrip megabuff, looks like a bad joke, and tactics minor traits look way too WvW-oriented and outdated, as well as removal of almost all banner-related traits from traitlines), but existing balance and wepskills usability is pretty solid overall.
- Stop using kitten rampage as an ultimate killing tool in every build and every situation. This is gone out of hand slightly, “when in doubt – use rampage”. And die, because, yes, you’ve became a big and scary boffo, but that enemy pack or champ has a different opinion about your nearest future. Rampage form offers a great mobility, tho – sometimes it’s really better to run, restore your HP and CDs, and take another dive into battle. Or cap that empty far point.
– Like engi, but not engi. Sometimes a defensive/supportive war can save party in the dungeon/fractals from the wipe just by doing things that, well, not really tied to a big 5-digit numbers that splat out of the enemy. Stun here, so ally can eat through breakbar faster. Banner here, that will ease the party’s task noticeable. Warhorn dood here (remember that now vigor stacks?). Kick there. Repeat. And then you can turn from your PC/laptop and shout like a real warrior: “MOM LOOK I’M USEABLE!”. Awesome.

Note that i’ve didn’t say a word about berserkers. The reasons – two – is simple: i don’t want to buy a HoT, at least now, though i’m aware of war’s changing and performance in the realms of an expansion. That’s the first one. And the second being… meh. Like, wow, berserker, like-a, angry guy that sets everything ablaze, even himself, like, aggressive playstyle, yawn… That’s just boring. I’ve seen ‘em in action. Watched gameplay videos. Read some impressions and rewievs. Still boo-ring. That’s only my opinion, though, but it is what it is.

And don’t forget to shake it off occasionally.

Maybe our class is not that bad, after all?

in Warrior

Posted by: OmniumExtinction.3479

OmniumExtinction.3479

awesome write-up!

Maybe our class is not that bad, after all?

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Posted by: Cygnus.6903

Cygnus.6903

tl:dr or didn’t happen.

I only state my opinion unless stated otherwise.
Hulk Roaming Montages/Build Vids
I always rage but never quit.

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Posted by: cryorion.9532

cryorion.9532

The problem is not warrior, the problem is other classes being brokenly and horribly OP.
Q_Q

On serious note, warrior is ok, but still needs some adjustments.
Sad thing is that anet completely forgot about physical skills. I wish physical and rage skills could all break stuns (maybe if traited)… that would make them much more versatile.

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Posted by: CadeRG.4508

CadeRG.4508

Balthazar bless you, OP

Vaulting daredevil leap frog teef of AoE destruction

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Posted by: Jzaku.9765

Jzaku.9765

10/10 strawman condescension OP would read again

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Posted by: kdaddy.5431

kdaddy.5431

hmmmmm is this a serious thread of warriors being ok?

Maybe our class is not that bad, after all?

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Posted by: Ross Biddle.2367

Ross Biddle.2367

Wall of text hits you for 9 million damage.

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Posted by: Choppy.4183

Choppy.4183

Wall of text hits you for 9 million damage.

I dodged it.

I’m Biff Rangoon, and I approved this message.
Ehmry Bay | Omg Brb Icecream Truck (ICEE)

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Posted by: Dreamcoil.9617

Dreamcoil.9617

hmmmmm is this a serious thread of warriors being ok?

Quite so. ATM, wars maybe not the brightest and shiniest among all classes, but they are solid “ok”. The reason why they are “ok” and not “good” is a part of community, who thinks that warrior must be hot’n’cold in the same time, “because it’s a warrior and he’s tough guy, why must i learn and think”.

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Posted by: Serophous.9085

Serophous.9085

The thing is, its fine if you consider warriors “ok” or “good”. But why bother with that when i can play one of the others and be “amazing”?

What some have been saying is, warriors have basically been on par this whole time, its the other classes getting big changes and balances and specializations that they jumped way up, while warriors remained the same.

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Posted by: ryandeniszorro.6735

ryandeniszorro.6735

Could you please make vid of following :
1v1 necro
1v1 crono
1v1 DH
1v1 engi
1v1 druid
Do those in OS or guild arena with same skill level player .
We can discuss viable after that.

Ps. Also try gs/ham or gs/sw.sh war builds for that.

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Posted by: Warlord.9074

Warlord.9074

TLDR Keep dreaming.

“Just press 2 to win all the dps was us cuz we’re a
warrior and we’re the best class” Eugene

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Posted by: Caedmon.6798

Caedmon.6798

Whats the point of this thread other than trying to convince yourself warr is in a good spot and that you dont like people saying warr isnt viable… ?

Also,Best revive speed ingame,i lolled.

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Posted by: lighter.2708

lighter.2708

I can duel OP on any class that’s not a warrior by facing rolling on the keyboard and still beat you

Maybe our class is not that bad, after all?

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Posted by: ryandeniszorro.6735

ryandeniszorro.6735

I can duel OP on any class that’s not a warrior by facing rolling on the keyboard and still beat you

I must say I respect what op wrote , it’s appetent that he is trying, sadly what’s u say is true, if both of u are skilled similar level I would not bet on war . I personally spent over 6k hours on war in wvw , I think I used to be good on it , but lately so many lost duels make me really sad. I may be wrong but I feel that I just can’t deal with any class other than war anymore. I feel slow, I feel lack of stability, condo removal and on times when I manage to set those few up, I feel I killed my dmg.
In any case I really wish this is true but may be that I became really bad war or just we are not even close class we used to be.

Maybe our class is not that bad, after all?

in Warrior

Posted by: Ross Biddle.2367

Ross Biddle.2367

Could you please make vid of following :
1v1 necro
1v1 crono
1v1 DH
1v1 engi
1v1 druid
Do those in OS or guild arena with same skill level player .
We can discuss viable after that.

Ps. Also try gs/ham or gs/sw.sh war builds for that.

What sort of a discussion on viability are you after? Is it the viability of 1v1’ing? Because that’s what you’ll be able to conclude from your request. Which game mode are you looking for viability in exactly? I’ve not heard of it.

Maybe our class is not that bad, after all?

in Warrior

Posted by: kdaddy.5431

kdaddy.5431

hmmmmm is this a serious thread of warriors being ok?

Quite so. ATM, wars maybe not the brightest and shiniest among all classes, but they are solid “ok”. The reason why they are “ok” and not “good” is a part of community, who thinks that warrior must be hot’n’cold in the same time, “because it’s a warrior and he’s tough guy, why must i learn and think”.

In all honesty your comments dont make alot of sense but in your post you wanted to talk PvP mostly so lets talk.

Lets not talk last patch because warrior was by far the most useless character ever in a season and lets move forward. You say warrior is solid and though not the best its not the worst. What does this mean?

Lets talk condi build, so far the best ive come up with is a mace/shield with longbow build and when ive played my friends on tester builds since the patch im still losing a majority of them to condi revs. So right off the bat its gonna be a 3-4-5 option with necro-rev and X class for condi builds.

Lets move to dps and ive done great sword with either rifle/ or mace shield once again we tested some 1 vs 1 and thief i would beat in 1 vs 1 but in 2 vs 2, 3 vs 3 would get caught. In scrimmages the thief would focus me down if i was fighting off point. Same thing with mesmers, this doesnt mean its not as good as these classes in the off point dps but it brings up another thing.

Mobilty, thieves and mesmers have better ability to get out of fights, +1 fights, jump into fights then warriors. Lets talk boon shares and team support since ele/guardians/ are still better. Lets talk best 1 vs 1 build its not warrior.

When you say in a good spot i sit here laughing and when you decide to comment back and actually make a point i sit back and wonder what you are talking about. Yeah i can go into unranked atm win a 1 vs 2 on my warrior against 2 bad players but had we had to have another season start right now, it will still greatly under perform vs equally skilled players vs stronger builds which there are plenty to name.

Taking others players post who dont have a great deal of insight or ability of the class and using them as your offensive point making is laughable and the simple idea because you can have moments of good play against poor players/ bad teams / unskilled know it alls does not make the class in a good place.

Maybe our class is not that bad, after all?

in Warrior

Posted by: lighter.2708

lighter.2708

Could you please make vid of following :
1v1 necro
1v1 crono
1v1 DH
1v1 engi
1v1 druid
Do those in OS or guild arena with same skill level player .
We can discuss viable after that.

Ps. Also try gs/ham or gs/sw.sh war builds for that.

What sort of a discussion on viability are you after? Is it the viability of 1v1’ing? Because that’s what you’ll be able to conclude from your request. Which game mode are you looking for viability in exactly? I’ve not heard of it.

PvP obviously, and giving you the option to 1v1 instead of 5v5 is already being extremely generous since warrior has no sustain against any competent team

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Posted by: Jae.5138

Jae.5138

i like how your tl dr is longer than the original post