Guild Wars 2

Hello everyone,

I know this is a bit annoying to read but i just thought I would make this post for fun and get out some frustration. I have a few problems with warriors and it gets on my nerves when trying to make some builds with a warrior while other classes seem to have these kind of “Oh S^^T” traits.

Yes warriors have a “On Crap” button which is the one that removes conditions for every adren bar which is great but a warriors F1 skill is my ultimate problem when it comes to being “balanced”

Let me explain why,
All warriors understand that if you do not have any kind of trait to boost the speed of how fast you gain adren, it takes about 30 hits with any weapons on a warrior to get a full bar of adren. Yes a lot of you will say it’s easy to build adren and i feel like it’s nothing of importance when it comes to adren. Thats the problem.

Every class’s f1 skills have some kind of important value for their f1 or just f1-4 skills because they are changeable or they aren’t always the same.

Eles: Switching elements and gaining a mix of 20 different skills.
Mesmers: Causing mass damage, confusion, stun, and distortion.
Necros: New Hp Bar, new set of 1-5 skills(which are amazing, except for i think it was the 4ths skill underwater,LOL)
Engis: F1-4 skills change based on utilities but basicly getting somewhat same benefits from what the utilities are.
Thiefs: Stealing kinds of class based buff, depends on class it is better or worse.(but the amount of support traits for their f1 is amazing)
Guardian: burns, heals, and boons, which apply to everyone. and a lot of traits to benefit the their f1-3, even a elite which blocks everything and replenishes them)
Warriors: Graining bars of adren…… and using it skill for a kind of bash someone except for the longbow….

The reason i hate the warrior adren bar is because i feel like it does nothing, everything in the war trait system doesn’t help each other. everything works against each other to fit different builds but everything is setup in a weird way.

1bar = 5%, 2bars = 10%, 3bars = 15% damage or precision in a grand master lines. hey great, if i wanna keep that damage you are keeping me away from that damage bonus. o btw, i don’t wanna use my f1 skill cause i need that damage. wait what? Your taking away from us using like 8 skills which can do damage and our damage will increase if we keep those bars? Should i not use my bar? o yeah you got rid of the idea of us keeping our adren bar when we get out of combat? i enjoy the idea that a lot of people don’t gain adren back as fast and it sucks because we start losing it out of combat? thanks. and you let necros keep their DS bar when they are out of combat which gives them a whole freaken set of new HP, o don’t forget they have a oh crap trait which lets necros instantly go into DS when they hit 20% hp. Thanks Obama.

Now, i need Condition removal, maybe i should get the trait to use my adren to remove a condition everytime i use a bar of adren. great, now i have to go with a tank kind of build cause it is. Great….

“Adrenaline fuels their offensive power—the longer warriors stay in a fight, the more dangerous they become.” That doesn’t seem like the case here. This is the quote on the wiki and i feel like adren is so bland and boring….. nothing going on for it. everything works against the adren because everything for adren is so spread out and far apart from each other the builds are unpleasant.

Anet needs to change the adren bar for warriors

As someone with 2 level 80 rangers, I will trade you everything pet related, traits included, for just eviscerate.

SuzukiMethod.4732:

As someone with 2 level 80 rangers, I will trade you everything pet related, traits included, for just eviscerate.

Also those op down stats?! man i would love to.

SuzukiMethod.4732:

As someone with 2 level 80 rangers, I will trade you everything pet related, traits included, for just eviscerate.

Why? Rapid fire is better than eviscerate will ever be.

Kagamiku.9731:

SuzukiMethod.4732:

As someone with 2 level 80 rangers, I will trade you everything pet related, traits included, for just eviscerate.

Why? Rapid fire is better than eviscerate will ever be.

Against someone that know how to fight a pew pew ranger? Nope. Its easy to cancel the rapid fire of a ranger. If we could have a melee burst like eviscerate to punish those that approach too much of you and turn around you, ranger would be OP.

Between Cleansing Ire, Burst Mastery and Versatile Rage there should be plenty of adrenalin gain. Berserker’s Power is more of a PvE trait where stacking damage multipliers is important, whereas the bursts themselves are useful against players.

I would take the adrenalin system over most others. It’s all relative though, the classes are balanced around their mechanic in one way or another. Non-traited guardian virtues are pretty garbage, why should bursts be great without some investment? Elementalist have to invest into Elemental Attunement, etc.

More warrior entitlement.

Thaddeus.4891:

Kagamiku.9731:

SuzukiMethod.4732:

As someone with 2 level 80 rangers, I will trade you everything pet related, traits included, for just eviscerate.

Why? Rapid fire is better than eviscerate will ever be.

Against someone that know how to fight a pew pew ranger? Nope. Its easy to cancel the rapid fire of a ranger. If we could have a melee burst like eviscerate to punish those that approach too much of you and turn around you, ranger would be OP.

How do you cancel a pewpew ranger that’kittenting you from a safe spot? Reflect is the only way, which not every class has, and those who do only have a very limited supply of it. And they’ll be sure to knock you down prior to using it so most of it hits anyways. You can pop your stability, but they made you blow your stab for a skill with a 10 second cooldown.

Eviscerate is easily dodged and it’s predictable to when it will be used. Shield bash is also pretty easy to dodge. There is nothing more annoying than a power ranger hitting you with rapid shot when you’re already dealing with another player. Since a warrior needs to be in melee range to land the eviscerate, a good player can deal with a 2v1 situation against average players. Rangers make it impossible to 2v1.

Kagamiku.9731:

How do you cancel a pewpew ranger that’kittenting you from a safe spot? Reflect is the only way, which not every class has, and those who do only have a very limited supply of it. And they’ll be sure to knock you down prior to using it so most of it hits anyways. You can pop your stability, but they made you blow your stab for a skill with a 10 second cooldown.

Eviscerate is easily dodged and it’s predictable to when it will be used. Shield bash is also pretty easy to dodge. There is nothing more annoying than a power ranger hitting you with rapid shot when you’re already dealing with another player. Since a warrior needs to be in melee range to land the eviscerate, a good player can deal with a 2v1 situation against average players. Rangers make it impossible to 2v1.

There is not such thing as save spot in pvp. Pew Pew Ranger are the best at long range fight, don’t play their game or you’ll lose. Get in their face and turn around them. Rapid Fire cancel out if the target get behind you in the middle of the attack, leaving them with only their Greatsword which have the same problem, its a long skill that will cancel if you turn around him and go behind him while he’s casting it. Without its two main burst the only option the ranger will have is to block counter attack you in one side, then leaping to the other side so he can put some distance between you and him. In that situation you would want to close the gap fast and evade the obviously incoming knockback from LB to get in their face and turn around him again. Engineer, Elementalist and Medi guardian are the best at that because they have good teleport/leap to close the gap and are doing their best dmg in close/melee range.

Its just a l2p issue. Pew Pew ranger have obviously flaw that can be exploited, but of course if you stay at a distance you are doing exactly what they need. Otherwise if you can’t close the gap fast enough, you can use the environment to block the line of sight, forcing the Ranger to go closer to you.

You don’t even need quick reactions to mitigate RF’s damage, since its channeled. Also things like Retal. The only class with a legitimate complaint vs lb rangers are necros. For every one else it’s pretty much l2p. Although this is all aside from the topic which is profession mechanics and I will still trade you. You can have 30% of your dps tied to a pet who can’t hit anything that isn’t immob’d and ill take eviscerate. Cuz eviscerate + Moment of Clarity… I get all tingly just thinking about it.

Thaddeus.4891:

Kagamiku.9731:

How do you cancel a pewpew ranger that’kittenting you from a safe spot? Reflect is the only way, which not every class has, and those who do only have a very limited supply of it. And they’ll be sure to knock you down prior to using it so most of it hits anyways. You can pop your stability, but they made you blow your stab for a skill with a 10 second cooldown.

Eviscerate is easily dodged and it’s predictable to when it will be used. Shield bash is also pretty easy to dodge. There is nothing more annoying than a power ranger hitting you with rapid fire when you’re already dealing with another player. Since a warrior needs to be in melee range to land the eviscerate, a good player can deal with a 2v1 situation against average players. Rangers make it impossible to 2v1.

There is not such thing as save spot in pvp. Pew Pew Ranger are the best at long range fight, don’t play their game or you’ll lose. Get in their face and turn around them. Rapid Fire cancel out if the target get behind you in the middle of the attack, leaving them with only their Greatsword which have the same problem, its a long skill that will cancel if you turn around him and go behind him while he’s casting it. Without its two main burst the only option the ranger will have is to block counter attack you in one side, then leaping to the other side so he can put some distance between you and him. In that situation you would want to close the gap fast and evade the obviously incoming knockback from LB to get in their face and turn around him again. Engineer, Elementalist and Medi guardian are the best at that because they have good teleport/leap to close the gap and are doing their best dmg in close/melee range.

Its just a l2p issue. Pew Pew ranger have obviously flaw that can be exploited, but of course if you stay at a distance you are doing exactly what they need. Otherwise if you can’t close the gap fast enough, you can use the environment to block the line of sight, forcing the Ranger to go closer to you.

There are safe spots in pvp. Take forest for example, at mid. Unless you went around the long way there is no way to get to the ranger. There are other spots where it’s very hard to reach when you’re being constantly pelted by RF and knockbacks.

Rangers are not hard to deal with in a solo scenario, but when accompanied by a teammate they’re a nightmare. And yes, there is a huge difference between tryhard premade on teamspeak, and the usual unranked/ranked que games. Organized teams can probably deal with rangers np, but the amount of games that are lost because unorganized teams have no idea what to do when two power rangers are obliterating the whole team from a distance…is something eviscerate could never do.

Either way, eviscerate is not special. Most warriors don’t even use axe.

Lastly, people really need to get original and come up with something more than “l2p”. It’s starting to sound like a broken record.

I know evis isn’t special and that’s a large part of why I chose that in my initial post, as even a mediocre burst skill would be largely more useful in many scenarios than a ranger pet and the accompanying dps loss. The other reason would be to have a solid skill to use with moment of clarity like evis or final thrust. You think evis is telegraphed? Maul puts a giant roaring bear over your head, you could dodge it blindfolded.

As far as the 2v1 on point argument goes, it wouldn’t be any better to have a lich form necro or Gs mesmer on the ledge freecasting. Any dps class left alone will wreck you. Also, this whole line of discussion about LB doesn’t have anything to do with class mechanics.

SuzukiMethod.4732:

You think evis is telegraphed? Maul puts a giant roaring bear over your head, you could dodge it blindfolded.

Maul is telegraphed but rangers have a way to almost guarantee it hits. Bow 3 —> GS 5 —> GS 2 (maul) Of course you can skip GS 5 when it’s on cooldown.
Warrior has no access to invis and has to rely on a disable to guarantee that eviscerate hits. But warrior doesn’t really have any non-telegraphed disables.

As far as the 2v1 on point argument goes, it wouldn’t be any better to have a lich form necro or Gs mesmer on the ledge freecasting. Any dps class left alone will wreck you. Also, this whole line of discussion about LB doesn’t have anything to do with class mechanics.

Lich form is ridiculous, but it has a long cd. GS mesmer relies heavily on the berserker which is so easy to dodge. Rangers seem to deal the highest amount of burst damage if left alone from my own experience. Unlike mesmers, ranger auto attacks hit like a truck, so even when RF is off cooldown, they’re still dealing enough damage to force you off a point.

If you start you Eviscerate right after you opponent dodged, it’ll (if timed right) land right when he comes out of the dodge and is unable to evade instantly again. At least that seems to work in my experience, not sure if it’s just that I’m matched up against ppl just as bad at sPvP as me :P

The Berserkers Might trait always seemed to be a trap to me (except maybe when you almost excusively use GS, of which the burst is hardly worth using anyhow) as it means not using a damage skill in the hope of doing more damage … I rather get Adrenaline quicker and get another Eviscerate in.

Kagamiku.9731:

Rangers are not hard to deal with in a solo scenario, but when accompanied by a teammate they’re a nightmare. And yes, there is a huge difference between tryhard premade on teamspeak, and the usual unranked/ranked que games. Organized teams can probably deal with rangers np, but the amount of games that are lost because unorganized teams have no idea what to do when two power rangers are obliterating the whole team from a distance…is something eviscerate could never do..

I don’t base my argument on bad pvpers pugs. I couldn’t give less a crap about ppl that can’t think by their own to go after that Ranger that free cast your team down or that Warrior that only go into Longbow at the beginning of the fight (especially in celestial gear lol).

If you are alone in ranked/unranked and nobody is going for the ranger, then take the responsibility and get in his face. It suck if you are a bunker and you can’t do kitten about it, but its life.

It’s not about being bad, it’s about being unorganized. Only a few classes can deal with power rangers that use terrain to their advantage. (mostly just thieves and D/D eles) And if you have none of those on your team or the ones you do have on your team don’t know their roll, then the rest of the team suffers.

A warrior can’t do kitten to a power ranger backed by teammates in most circumstances. If you somehow make it to him wherever he may be shooting you from, he’ll just run and find another location to wreck havoc upon. They’re mobile, and between LB3 and GS3 they’re going to juke you. Unless you think it’s the warriors job to do nothing but chase the ranger all game…And in that case, you have to pray your pugs are better than their pugs.

Kagamiku.9731:

It’s not about being bad, it’s about being unorganized. Only a few classes can deal with power rangers. (mostly just thieves and D/D eles) And if you have none of those on your team or the ones you do have on your team don’t know their roll, then the rest of the team suffers.

A warrior can’t do kitten to a power ranger backed by teammates in most circumstances. If you somehow make it to him wherever he may be shooting you from, he’ll just run and find another location to wreck havoc upon. They’re mobile, and between LB3 and GS3 they’re going to juke you. Unless you think it’s the warriors job to do nothing but chase the ranger all game…And in that case, you have to pray your pugs are better than their pugs.

You can’t talk about unorganized vs organized. If you are unorganized then you probably gonna fight the ranger alone, if not then don’t go after him. And if you chase him and he run, he’s not dpsing your team to death, which is a good thing.

Usually ranger are between home and mid. Go decap or even cap their home so he go on the node fight you where you gonna have the advantage as a warrior. If he just pew pew you, get out, he’s losing pts to his team while he’s doing that. If he’s only staying at mid, just keep you effort between far and home. Play the points. It doesn’t mean that you will win, but what do you expect if you team CAN’T handle a single ranger.

Thaddeus.4891:

Kagamiku.9731:

SuzukiMethod.4732:

As someone with 2 level 80 rangers, I will trade you everything pet related, traits included, for just eviscerate.

Why? Rapid fire is better than eviscerate will ever be.

Against someone that know how to fight a pew pew ranger? Nope. Its easy to cancel the rapid fire of a ranger. If we could have a melee burst like eviscerate to punish those that approach too much of you and turn around you, ranger would be OP.

I thought rangers were already OP in WvW and PvP.

Fuji.6284:

Thaddeus.4891:

Kagamiku.9731:

SuzukiMethod.4732:

As someone with 2 level 80 rangers, I will trade you everything pet related, traits included, for just eviscerate.

Why? Rapid fire is better than eviscerate will ever be.

Against someone that know how to fight a pew pew ranger? Nope. Its easy to cancel the rapid fire of a ranger. If we could have a melee burst like eviscerate to punish those that approach too much of you and turn around you, ranger would be OP.

I thought rangers were already OP in WvW and PvP.

They are not OP. They are really strong, but unilateral. If you fight them on their ground they will be OP, if you know their weakness they are not.

My issue with Warriors is how the Adrenaline system was implemented. In GW1 adren was the secondary resource used for MULTIPLE skills and attacks. You had to decide whether to save up that adrenaline for a big chain or set up a build that uses many cheaper skills.

Rather than all utilities being CD based, why not give some skills a short CD but be powered by adrenaline that is separate from your F1 burst? Having ONLY CD based skills and nothing interesting like Engi kits makes the class feel bare bones.

Is this serious? I can’t take anyone complaining about this serious.

not been on in a really long time due to real life issues however it seems you hit every nail on the head. the only thing that kinda bothers me as well is that many classes have their f1 – f-4 skills related to doing condition power control defense. in some way or in another.

warriors in my humble opinion suffer from the idea that they need to be extremely simple which means your better off on a higher skill cap profession when you reach a certain skill lvl. personally I hate that about this class and truthfully I personally find the risk / reward to be off (in my personal opinion) esp if you don’t take one of the so called op traits / skills into combat.

i’ll bring up two builds of warriors and i’ll probably make a fool out of myself but hell it’s my opinion so i’ll express my thoughts.

warriors have to be in melee distance for their only condtion build in order to inflict bleeds (minus pindown since well it’s got a huge cd) but the rate we apply bleeds is only similar to that of other professions that can do that from range (necro engi theif ele) we get deep cuts which gives us a 50% duration but honestly while it is BETTER then the related trait of those 3 other classes those same classes have at least one major trick the warrior lacks that def makes them far better.

thieves can stealth easily necro has life force which is easy to generate and engi has 2x the number of skills as a warrior does giving it access to better conditions as well. does a slightly longer bleed really balance that truthfully I just don’t think so since a melee class is at much greater risk of being killed esp since many melee skills cleave and power our dps’s condition. now ik warrior is the highest tier for armor and health but the mitigation of other professions is just so much better then a big health bar and armor esp the light armor classes necro has life force which is better then a life bar still gets great skills along with it. Mesmer is the master of confusion (real world) when played right. ele can easily maintain 50% protection uptime just by swapping to earth which is where the condition damage is and heals through water.) protection will give a ele more armor then a warrior.

I am not saying that conditions need to out dps power but shouldn’t this be thought about a bit? that’s not the only area that warriors have obscured risk / reward but the one that just kinda bothers me the most. since truthfully as a condition warrior and experienced in 6 other professions they really just seem to do the job so much better in both departments mitigate damage due to active use of skill and better condition out put.

DPS wise I can barely bring myself to touch my warrior if i’m serious it’s just kinda bad if you want to be honest either your using the axe auto which is not really fun or your using 100 blades (dps loss to axe auto) which is a 3 second rootl and a large cast time to boot.

I just feel that the risk v reward for warrior is honestly off and that it hold it’s player back where a say ele can do all that but much better same for engi and pretty sure for guardian as well.

I guess the argument is that warrior is too simple but that not really a rebuttal as much as stating what would be the problem.

honestly if they didn’t improve adrenaline at all but instead opted to give us more variety in our burst skills (assuming the skills aren’t trash) i’d probably be happy about it.

Look, give me all your problems and i’ll reply back. i might not know everything about all the classes but i understand enough of them to know what i am saying. You can not really be serious about trading me your pets skills on a ranger. the fact that you go down and if you have a wolf, Woot guess what? press F2 and he will fear anyone away. Rangers have the best revival skills ever. nothing except for the troll level of thief can beat it. only difference is rangers have it easy to get up. thief don’t.

Warriors are amazing when using the stupid freaken weapons everyone else uses in the meta. who uses maces on warriors in pvp?, and don’t tell me people who make moot use maces. those people only use it cause they wasted their time making their disco ball to smash heads in…

how many people used sword offhand on warriors? i would love to see someone make a mace/shield build for spvp and not make hammer or greatsword the main weapon set in it =p.

The thing is that Warriors suffer in their f1 skill because if we use it and it misses it’s over, until you get 30 hits in again to get adren up.

Mesmers miss with f1, no problem, they got f2-4 and they can make a lot of illusions.
Eles not happy with the element they switched to, no problem, they got 2 other element sets to witch to.
Engis used the wrong f skill? it’s ok, they got a lot of time to swithch around with their utility and f2-4 skills to make up for it( i’m looking at you tool belt)
Ranger miss their pet to attack something or use their skill? no problem, just shove your target back and switch pets to ue their f2.
Guardians miss with their f1 skill? o sorry, yo ucna’t miss with those, they just apply to you.
Necros accidently get out of death shroud because thy accidently double clicked? o it’s ok, they might have lich form or even just fear the target away until they can f1 again to get their f1 back.
Thiefs miss with their f1 skill? i don’t even think thats possible….

Get the pattern? Warriors F1 is stupid, put a pro war without a greatsword on a 1v1 fight and he will win. Put a pro (insert class) player against a pro 1v1 warrior, and he will lose cause they will know the large list of problems warriors have.

Please… and really? don’t get me started on the warriors down skills. getting up after 8 seconds when you go down? o i have 20 seconds to kill something? ok let me kill something, i killed 3 people and downed them but i still have vengeance on me, what did i do wrong? O i downed 3 people but i didn’t finish them, but they still get up cause i forced myself to die from a stupid vengeance skill? o hammer throw to knockdown a player…. he had stability….. o he had another player with him, i only have 1 hammer to throw…. sorry.

Warriors are down right messed up to play. Heres the problem Anet, Warriors need something to make them Interesting to play, just something to have a little fun with….. not have our premature f1 skill go off and either hit someone or not hit someone and still wastes….

Heres a interesting concept, i don’t care which one you give us but hell, either one would be amazing.

concept one:
Give us a 3rd weapon to switch to, it might sound stupid but having a 1-2-3 weapon swap would change the idea of how warriors work and having 3 different f1 skills with the current Adren setup would make things very very interesting.

Concept two:
Give warriors boons or extra affects like maybe (once you fill bar 2: gain 3 attacks which apply confusion or stun"this would make a lot of sense, more adren some kind of rage ability") give us a reward for completing a bar of adren.

Concept three:
Give warriors the ability to have a smaller penalty when they miss their f1 skill, and increase the rewards of the current traits in which adren stays or goes away so that they are or will be worth using… Increasing the idea of adren clearing 2 conditions for every bar use would be amazing, increasing the dps for each level of adren bar held by 5-7% on each level would be better cause it’s do hard to gain adren.

EvegodenRaven.5107:

concept one:
Give us a 3rd weapon to switch to, it might sound stupid but having a 1-2-3 weapon swap would change the idea of how warriors work and having 3 different f1 skills with the current Adren setup would make things very very interesting.

It does sound stupid at first, but after my initial reaction I don’t hate it. It would increase the complexity and diversity of warriors (thereby raising the profession’s ceiling), and it works thematically in that the class is supposed to be a master of weapons. The mechanic would also be similar to elementalists as masters of elements.

It would require some thought about balance though. On swap sigils being the obvious danger when combined with Fast Hands, but it may not be that big of a risk overall.

EvegodenRaven.5107:

Concept three:
Give warriors the ability to have a smaller penalty when they miss their f1 skill

Try using Burst Mastery.