Guild Wars 2

We’ve all seen this topic before. “Make 100bs mobile!!1!!!one!!”

But there’s some new context today: Smarter AI!

Normally I make lengthy posts, but I wont mince words here. The bottom line is that either NPCs will soon move out of 100b because they’re smart (making 100b useless) or they wont because they’re stupid (making the AI upgrade pointless).

Either way, somethings being rendered useless.

My suggestion? Let Warriors walk (not run) and turn while channeling 100b, just like a Guardian channeling whirling wrath.

Disagree.

this will beg more nerfs to 100b damage.

As i always said, 100b should be (Hard to setup/High reward skill), the current issue is that “the reward” is not high enough compared to the large effort done to set it up, but i think the upcoming changes will address this issue.

All I see is an assumption that NPCs will move out of 100b. Do you have anything whatsoever to base that off other than assuming that improved AI means they will?

I agree with Juba that Hundred Blades is designed to be a hard-to-use but high-reward skill.

Amusingly, it has never been hard-to-use in PvE except in a few corner-cases. If it became hard-to-use in new PvE content, I don’t see why it’s design would need to change.

Juba.8406:

Disagree.

this will beg more nerfs to 100b damage.

As i always said, 100b should be (Hard to setup/High reward skill), the current issue is that “the reward” is not high enough compared to the large effort done to set it up, but i think the upcoming changes will address this issue.

What changes are those?!

Harper.4173:

Juba.8406:

Disagree.

this will beg more nerfs to 100b damage.

As i always said, 100b should be (Hard to setup/High reward skill), the current issue is that “the reward” is not high enough compared to the large effort done to set it up, but i think the upcoming changes will address this issue.

What changes are those?!

The new Forceful GS, Physical Skills improvement, the new Zerk power.

Mordrem Menders already get ‘knocked’ away from 100b, preventing you from killing them easily unless they’re pinned against a wall or something.

Maybe it’s a sign of things to come. I’ve noticed Silverwastes mobs are far more mobile than those you see in dungeons.

Some are more mobile, others are very happy to sit still. Neither is hard to hit with a full hundred blades.

I invite you to try landing a full 100b on Mordrem Menders when they’re out in the open. It doesn’t work.

CC maybe? Same as the setup for PvP/WvW…

Mobs generally have a few seconds between their attacks. After an attack they often sit still. That is the perfect time to Hundred Blades them without even needing to CC. It has the added bonus that they aren’t attacking so you’re not taking damage at that time either … at least not from that one mob.

Hey, so first a link and a disclaimer, so you guys know where first poster got this info. The link and disclaimer: Some things mentioned, like AI action when confronted with strong PBAoE, are subject to non-implementation. The guy says so himself. Could happen, could not. We pretty much have confirmed that THE highest rated behavior (action) of a ranged NPC in the expansion will be to go and always attempt to sit at max range or keep you there.

As for 100 blades, it was high risk, high reward. WAS. In fact it was already nerfed waaaaaay back in a feature patch. Now, most of us know that, 100 blades is still the skill that can hit up to an insane 10k hit. However, that damage nerf ensure it happens A) less and B )not unless the final strike of it hits. Anyone who PvPed in the days of yore as a warrior will know to let it go through you HAD to use frenzy followed by any stun or knockdown (usually Bullrush). Why? Without that 100% extra speed and some sort of good solid CC, they’d just cleanse and sidestep. It very much was high risk, high reward skill.

Now? Not so much. Now it’s used as cleave in zergs in WvW, or cleave in PvP in a team setting. One on one, unlike before, it is fairly easy to dodge or stop entirely. How easily? One 12 second cooldown I use, with no movement attached to it, completely negates it. So to set it up now, unlike before you need: A) stability, B )A stun or knockdown, and C)frenzy OR forgo all of that and use it in a group setting where allies are providing all those for you. Solo, this means that it’s an extreme risk, moderately high reward, considering protection’s prevalence and the damage nerf; In a group, it’s low risk, moderately high reward.

So, honestly, change it so we can move. Ranged AI are highly likely to be attempting in HoT to move out of the way, thus we’re going to need everything we use in solo PvP to pull it off, or hope our group will cover us for every single mob, which would not be practical if fighting elites or large veteran groups.

Dand.8231:

We’ve all seen this topic before. “Make 100bs mobile!!1!!!one!!”

But there’s some new context today: Smarter AI!

Normally I make lengthy posts, but I wont mince words here. The bottom line is that either NPCs will soon move out of 100b because they’re smart (making 100b useless) or they wont because they’re stupid (making the AI upgrade pointless).

Either way, somethings being rendered useless.

My suggestion? Let Warriors walk (not run) and turn while channeling 100b, just like a Guardian channeling whirling wrath.

I also would love to have smarter AI’s but I would like to keep HB as is. Also, walking HB is broken and shouldn’t happen for PvP.

It’s good that open world PvE will become more challenging. Now maybe people will need to think about how they use their skills rather than spamming Hundred Blades off cooldown.

Warrior has never been a mechanically intensive profession. Its challenge has always lain in its telegraphed and difficult to land skills, requiring that competitive players learn how to bait dodges and cooldowns, read skill animations, and set up bursts.

Greatsword is already a very popular weapon due to its extremely forgiving nature (high mobility for kiting and recovery, decent damage from all skills other than auto attack). Buffing Hundred Blades is unnecessary and would only turn the weapon into another Guardian greatsword, with everyone and their mother running it everywhere. Additionally, unlike Guardians, Warriors have decent access to both soft and hard CC, and the skill doesn’t require actually being inside the target hitbox to deal full damage. Given these facts, there’s a clear reason why Whirling Wrath should be mobile, since it would be practically impossible to land if it were stationary, but as far as I can tell people only want walking Hundred Blades because they’re too lazy to actually set up the skill. So what if it’s not usable in every single setting? Maybe that will at least get some players to try running different weapon sets.

Any major buff to Hundred Blades would just draw more people from other forums to complain about Warrior and get it nerfed again, probably leaving us worse off than before. We’re already getting significant buffs to damage in the upcoming trait system rework. There are other parts of the profession that are more deserving of changes, such as the nigh-mandatory traits Cleansing Ire and Fast Hands.

Torqiseknite.1380:

Warrior has never been a mechanically intensive profession. Its challenge has always lain in its telegraphed and difficult to land skills, requiring that competitive players learn how to bait dodges and cooldowns, read skill animations, and set up bursts.

This is an excellent summary of why I love the Warrior class and greatly respect truly exceptional Warriors.

Torqiseknite.1380:

Any major buff to Hundred Blades would just draw more people from other forums to complain about Warrior and get it nerfed again, probably leaving us worse off than before. We’re already getting significant buffs to damage in the upcoming trait system rework. There are other parts of the profession that are more deserving of changes, such as the nigh-mandatory traits Cleansing Ire and Fast Hands.

We just had a several day discussion/argument/debate in another thread in the Warrior subforums on this (Fast Hands and Cleansing Ire).

Long story short … those people that come to other subforums just to complain can suck an egg :-p There are always those that will complain. Those who actually look for facts are smart enough to ignore those that just want to complain … so I wouldn’t worry too much about those complainers.

Juba.8406:

Harper.4173:

Juba.8406:

Disagree.

this will beg more nerfs to 100b damage.

As i always said, 100b should be (Hard to setup/High reward skill), the current issue is that “the reward” is not high enough compared to the large effort done to set it up, but i think the upcoming changes will address this issue.

What changes are those?!

The new Forceful GS, Physical Skills improvement, the new Zerk power.

Even with those I still don’t see it.

Torqiseknite.1380:

Any major buff to Hundred Blades would just draw more people from other forums to complain about Warrior and get it nerfed again, probably leaving us worse off than before.

Oh, the fear mongering.

“If Dobby asks for more, Dobby might get moar. The others will hate Dobby and master will punishes us!”

I’ve played way too many mmo’s and I’ve seen that limited thinking time and again.
It goes something like, “Don’t complain or it might get buffed and then nerfed to insanity!”

But I’ve never seen it happen to that degree, ever.

I’ve witnessed first hand, classes getting buffed overnight to ridiculous and just stay ridiculous until everyone accepted it.

I’ve seen classes start underpowered/overpowered and remain. But, getting the huge buff and then subsequent nerf, no.

Last thing, someone earlier complained about a moving hundred blades.
Did you mean rapid fire?

@EnderzShadow
I agree about what you call “fear mongering”. If something is truly needed, people shouldn’t care about other classes asking for it to be nerfed. There are always people that think something is OP when it kills them … because it’s never that they messed up and played poorly … that never happens :-p

Nitpicky of me, but I disagree with your Rapid Fire example. Rapid Fire has a longer cooldown, does less damage (check the coefficients), and is on a class that has less base hp, less base armor, and less power coefficients across their weapon skills.

Everything has it’s pros and cons though. I don’t want Rapid Fire buffed and more than I think Hundred Blades needs a buf. They are both in a good places since good players aren’t really bothered by them, just bad ones. Good players know how to use them and how to counter them.

Unrelated:

• +1 for Enders-related name
• +1 for Shadowbane
• +1 for DAoC

All things from way back in my past that I loved … always nice to see someone else that loved them too.

@Sebrent I have a ranger and I am not super serious. I know it’s a different class and there are some huge very obvious downsides to the power ranger.

I’m not disagreeing as much as I was just being disagreeable…. devils advocate if you will.

But to keep with the theme of playing devils advocate :P

You can avoid the dmg of a 100b by just walking away from the warrior.

At least most of the warrior mechanics just ‘work’. We talk about buffs and nerfs but when I played a mesmer, that forum didn’t talk about damage coefficients as much as they just wanted the class to work right.

-Bean was the man.
-Nothing beat KoS RP’ing guilds that yelled the goofiest things (right before you got ganked)
-Aw yes, the game that WvW was built off of. The game 99 percent of GW2 playerbase has no idea about. I wish there were 2 more realms. I don’t want to kill asuras. I want to show my in game racism towards another realm….dirty tree hugging HIBS!

EnderzShadow.2506:

Torqiseknite.1380:

Any major buff to Hundred Blades would just draw more people from other forums to complain about Warrior and get it nerfed again, probably leaving us worse off than before.

Oh, the fear mongering.

“If Dobby asks for more, Dobby might get moar. The others will hate Dobby and master will punishes us!”

I’ve played way too many mmo’s and I’ve seen that limited thinking time and again.
It goes something like, “Don’t complain or it might get buffed and then nerfed to insanity!”

But I’ve never seen it happen to that degree, ever.

If you want a recent example, look at Engineer turrets. There were numerous threads complaining about them in the PvP subforum, and after their recent nerf, the majority of them are essentially unviable in just about every single game mode, since they die extremely fast even when fully traited for. The only ones people still use are Healing Turret, since everyone just explodes it for the blast finisher anyways, and the free turrets from Supply Crate. While turrets did need a nerf, the one they received didn’t just balance them, it rendered most of the turrets practically useless.

I’m not saying that we shouldn’t ask for buffs and changes if they’re actually justified. However, repeatedly requesting unwarranted buffs (such as the one suggested in this thread) will eventually result in overbuffing, and the inevitable nerfs that follow.

I don’t really why we are still discussing this matter. Juba said everything : 100b is what it should be, namely a hard to setup/high reward skill. The problem being that it is currently not quite “high reward” enough.
Aside from that, I don’t see the problem : in a group, you set this up ; solo, you switch to axe AA which is a little less powerful but far more reliable (so more DPS in most cases).

If HB becomes unusable, warriors will still have Axe/Mace.

If people feel Hundred Blades is not currently high reward enough, then I imagine we can all agree that a proper (and the simplest) solution is just a numbers tweak on its damage.

@EnderzShadow:
Lol, I see. I’ll play too

You can just walk out of Hundred Blades, but you can’t reflect it or use projectile-block skills against it. You can’t just walk out of Rapid Fire but you can reflect it and use project-block skills against it. :-D

A pet/ally can’t stand in front of a Hundred Blades and take the damage for you. A pet/ally can stand in front of a Rapid Fire and take the damage for you (assuming no piercing arrows).

DAoC was much younger days for me. I was a Lurikeen Ranger named “Arbitrator Fate” and a member in <Clan Destiny> … was such fun times.

Shadowbane’s roots are coming back in the form of “Crowfall”. I’m keeping an eye on it as it will come down to GW2 or Crowfall for me in the next 1.5+ years. I’m quite wary though given how I left before for Wildstar which also had some very good ideas but was coded horribly. While GW2 has its issues, it is one of the better coded MMOs out there.

Torqiseknite.1380
That is a great example. Gutting a build is not the proper solution in my mind. I think that was a knee-jerk reaction from ArenaNet due to:

• How much time it would take to fix it
• The fact that they are already redoing traits, etc.
• How much of an impact it was seeming to have on sPvP and the matchmaking and ranking system they’ve been working on refining there.

Which somewhat warrants it, but it does leave a bad taste for everyone; ArenaNet included I’m sure.

@FatRaKoon:
I agree. Good points.

Sebrent.3625:

If people feel Hundred Blades is not currently high reward enough, then I imagine we can all agree that a proper (and the simplest) solution is just a numbers tweak on its damage.

There’s obviously a lot of split opinions on this. I feel the 100b reward-vs-risk equation is just off a bit. Making 100b mobile in the form of walking (like whirling wrath) would grant it additional usefulness and versatility, as well as a QoL buff, but not directly up its numbers. I REALLY dont see how it would end up as overpowered.

Lets look at a few channeled skills and compare them (this is NOT a comprehensive list):

Warrior Flurry: self roots, immobs target, frontal cone, tracks targets, melee
Warrior Volley: mobile, tracks targets, ranged
Ranger Rapid Fire: mobile, tracks targets, ranged
Mesmer Blurred Fury: self roots, tracks targets, melee, evade frames
Guard Whirling Wrath: 1/2 mobile, 360 radius
War(and thief) Whirling Axe: 1/2 mobile, 360 radius
Necro Ghastly Claws: mobile, melee

Warrior 100b: self roots, melee

See the disparity? All the other self root skills also track targets. It makes sense because expecting someone to stand in a channeled skill is absurd, especially one with a backloaded damage spike. The skills that do not track are mobile. And most of the channeled skills also provide some additional effect as well. Flurry immobs targets to ensure it hits, or forces a condi break, Blurred Fury evades, etc.

Furthermore, even if 100b does gain 1/2 mobility (walking speed) it wont put it above the rest of the self root and 1/2 melee skills, the defense against it remains the same: Dodge out of melee.

Dand.8231:

Sebrent.3625:

If people feel Hundred Blades is not currently high reward enough, then I imagine we can all agree that a proper (and the simplest) solution is just a numbers tweak on its damage.

There’s obviously a lot of split opinions on this. I feel the 100b reward-vs-risk equation is just off a bit. Making 100b mobile in the form of walking (like whirling wrath) would grant it additional usefulness and versatility, as well as a QoL buff, but not directly up its numbers. I REALLY dont see how it would end up as overpowered.

Lets look at a few channeled skills and compare them (this is NOT a comprehensive list):

Warrior Flurry: self roots, immobs target, frontal cone, tracks targets, melee
Warrior Volley: mobile, tracks targets, ranged
Ranger Rapid Fire: mobile, tracks targets, ranged
Mesmer Blurred Fury: self roots, tracks targets, melee, evade frames
Guard Whirling Wrath: 1/2 mobile, 360 radius
War(and thief) Whirling Axe: 1/2 mobile, 360 radius
Necro Ghastly Claws: mobile, melee

Warrior 100b: self roots, melee

See the disparity? All the other self root skills also track targets. It makes sense because expecting someone to stand in a channeled skill is absurd, especially one with a backloaded damage spike. The skills that do not track are mobile. And most of the channeled skills also provide some additional effect as well. Flurry immobs targets to ensure it hits, or forces a condi break, Blurred Fury evades, etc.

Furthermore, even if 100b does gain 1/2 mobility (walking speed) it wont put it above the rest of the self root and 1/2 melee skills, the defense against it remains the same: Dodge out of melee.

Flurry, Volley, and Ghastly Claws all deal significantly less damage than Hundred Blades. People do tend to complain about Rapid Fire, but it has a clear animation and is fairly easy to evade, dodge, or LoS, and it’s honestly the only thing making the Ranger longbow decent, whereas all of the skills on Warrior greatsword are useful. Blurred Frenzy also deals less damage, requires melee range on a profession that relies on positioning to survive, and is primarily used as a survival tool rather than a real burst. Whirling Wrath deals less damage than Hundred Blades, needs to be inside the target hitbox to land full damage, and exists on a profession that lacks the cc to prevent people from dodging out.

Don’t believe me? Let’s look at the skill damage coefficients:
Hundred Blades: 4.21 (first 8 strikes), 1.10 (final strike)
Rapid Fire: 3.75
Volley: 3.0
Ghastly Claws: 2.88
Whirling Wrath: 2.8 (7 melee strikes), 0.15 (7 projectiles)
Blurred Frenzy: 2.40
Flurry: 1.039

Even with the damage nerf, Hundred Blades still comes out on top, and also has a shorter cooldown than 4/5 of the other skills on the list. This isn’t to say that it’s necessarily better than the other skills, or even a good skill in and of itself, but it is clearly superior in terms of damage. If it became mobile, it would pretty much be strictly better than Whirling Wrath and Ghastly Claws. Also, I really don’t see your points about the melee skills tracking targets; as you said, any decent player will just dodge backwards out of melee range, so how does a skill tracking out-of-range targets change anything? Hundred Blades already has a large enough cleave area to hit anything in front of you.

The reason I don’t support walking Hundred Blades isn’t necessarily because I think it would be overpowered, but rather because it’s flatly unnecessary. You called it a QoL buff, but really what it would do is make the skill far easier to use, requiring much less setup, while still maintaining a higher damage coefficient than every other skill of its kind. Furthermore, let’s look at it in the context of professions: Warrior is one of the few professions that has enough cc to disable a target for long enough to plausibly land a full channeled melee skill. The argument “but they can stunbreak or cleanse it” applies to every kind of cc; Warrior isn’t an exception, and it shouldn’t be. People tend to compare Hundred Blades to Whirling Wrath, but they forget that Guardians have no way to prevent targets from dodging out of melee, and even with the skill’s mobility, it’s practically impossible to ever land the full damage.

Making Hundred Blades mobile would remove one of the strategic aspects of using it, and add an unneeded buff to an already-excellent weapon set. I found your original justification for this buff quite strange; if mobs do dodge out of Hundred Blades, try immobilizing them? Knocking them down? Maybe even using one of the other four skills available on greatsword? How forgiving does one weapon set have to be?

Cygnus.6903:

If HB becomes unusable, warriors will still have Axe/Mace.

Ahah that’s pretty much exactly what I just said XD. In shorter though

Honestly, I’d love to see MH Axe make a comeback in the PvP metas. I find few skills as satisfying as Eviscerate when they hit. The animation, the sound, the damage number, and the crumpled opponent at your feet … though it is less nice when you’re the one that eats the evis :-p

Torqiseknite.1380:

Flurry, Volley, and Ghastly Claws all deal significantly less damage than Hundred Blades.

Don’t believe me? Let’s look at the skill damage coefficients:
Hundred Blades: 4.21 (first 8 strikes), 1.10 (final strike)
Rapid Fire: 3.75
Volley: 3.0
Ghastly Claws: 2.88
Whirling Wrath: 2.8 (7 melee strikes), 0.15 (7 projectiles)
Blurred Frenzy: 2.40
Flurry: 1.039

I don’t believe you, because you forgot an extremely crucial factor here: the times spent channeling.

Warrior 100b— 4.21+1.1 = 5.31 / 3.5 (cast time) = 1.51 DPS averaged across that. That’s assuming you land all 8 hits, including the backloaded final hit. If you break it down to “per hit” you can roughly assume 1 hit per 0.4375 seconds (8 hits in 3.5 seconds), with a damage coefficient of roughly 0.6 per hit (4.21/7 hits) works out to 1.37 DPS for the first 7 hits, with a 2.51 spike at the end (0.4375 with a 1.1 coeff), bringing the average up to 1.51

Ranger RapidFire— 3.75 / 2.5 (cast time) = 1.5 average

Whirling Wrath— (2.8 + (7×0.15)) / 0.75 = 5.133 average. Of course, thats unrealistic, because that assumes perfect hitbox positioning. A more realistic calculation might be that you land only a THIRD of these hits, which is still 1.71

Mes Blurred Fury— 2.4 / 2.5 = 0.96

Nec Ghastly Claws— 2.88 / 2.25 = 1.28

Summary
War 100b: 1.37 partial, 1.51 full combo
Ranger RF: 1.5
Guard Spin: 1.71* (see above)
Mes BF: 0.96
Nec GC: 1.28

For the record, Guardian GS Autoattack is: 1.12 ((0.8+0.8+1.2/2.5)

…but it is clearly superior in terms of damage…

The math clearly says you’re wrong. Ranger rapid fire is nearly identical (but RF is also ranged and fully mobile, and not backloaded on damage), and Whirling Wrath finishes ahead, EVEN if you assume only 33% of your hits/projectiles land. Necro is only 1.28, true, and Mes is lower, but Necro is also fully mobile and generates life force, while Mes evades during their entire animation. Both of these seem to be more than fair tradeoffs.

The reason I don’t support walking Hundred Blades isn’t necessarily because I think it would be overpowered, but rather because it’s flatly unnecessary. You called it a QoL buff, but really what it would do is make the skill far easier to use, requiring much less setup, while still maintaining a higher damage coefficient than every other skill of its kind. Furthermore, let’s look at it in the context of professions: Warrior is one of the few professions that has enough cc to disable a target for long enough to plausibly land a full channeled melee skill. The argument “but they can stunbreak or cleanse it” applies to every kind of cc; Warrior isn’t an exception, and it shouldn’t be. People tend to compare Hundred Blades to Whirling Wrath, but they forget that Guardians have no way to prevent targets from dodging out of melee, and even with the skill’s mobility, it’s practically impossible to ever land the full damage.

If you look at the DPS outcome as I posted above, making it 1/2 mobile actually brings it right in line with whirling wrath.

Also, as a side note, the claim that guards have no CC isnt true, Binding Blade pulls allow for a partial Whirl with no difficulty, mean they dont even need to swap to set up their hits. I’m not calling guard OP or cheap, just refuting your claims.

Anyway, why is it okay to assume that a Warrior MUST bring other skills JUST to set up 100b, but it’s fine that Ranger can just unload with RF, or Guard can Bind/Whirl without switching weapons? It’s great that they have ways to set up, but it should not be a 100% requirement that you set up, it should be a bonus. Backloading the DPS to the final hit already provides this bonus to land the entire chain. That does not mean that it should ONLY be usable following a setup.

I found your original justification for this buff quite strange; if mobs do dodge out of Hundred Blades

To clarify, what I was saying is that the response to most channeled skills is to dodge OUT of melee, because the hits track, are mobile, or hit 360. Warriors does NONE of these, so you can actually just walk around or dodge through the Warrior while he’s rooted, and attack them in the side/back. You cannot do this against any of the other channeled skills.

You didn’t use Weapon Strength in your math, so it is incomplete and incorrect.

Please see the wiki for Damage calculation.

Damage = Weapon strength * Power * Skill coefficient / Armor

We can assume the target has the same armor and each class is running the same stats so same power as well … so we can reduce the comparisons to:

Weapon Strength * Skill Coefficient

Weapon Strengths (exotic/sPvP values)

• Warrior Greatsword = 995 – 1,100
• Guardian Greatsword = 995 – 1,100
• Ranger Longbow = 920 – 1,080
• Mesmer Sword = 905 – 1,000
• Necromancer Axe = 857 – 1,048

Work from there.

If you’re going to talk down to each other … you should probably make sure you’re doing the math right first.

Sebrent.3625:

You didn’t use Weapon Strength in your math

Interesting. I admit I never bothered to check the weapon power. I know the damage calculation, Damage = Weapon strength * Power * Skill coefficient / Armor (in fact I brought it up a few weeks ago in a different thread) but it never occurred to me that ANet would assign different weapons different attack values.

In fact the debate we had was purely related to skill coefficients, and is technically still correct in that limited sense. I’ll update to account for weapon power shortly.

I assumed Weapon Strength was just a function of the Weapons Quality (blue, green, rare, exo, ascd). In fact, it seems to me that by making them the same, damage would be easy and simple to compare as you could look at raw coefficients (as I was doing), but by making them all different, it could become maddening! I simply assumed they went the sane route. Big mistake apparently!

If you’re going to talk down to each other … you should probably make sure you’re doing the math right first.

I don’t talk down to anyone, nor do I assume myself or anyone else is perfect. Both myself and Torqiseknite have evidently failed to consider factors (him channel times, and myself weapon power). Such is life. I’ll revise my math shortly.

Sebrent, after looking into it and doing the math, the Exo GS is 1047, LB 1000, and Sword 952. Here are my revised numbers with Weapon Strength and Coefficient (before power/armor calcs):

War 100b: 1.37 partial(7/8), 1.51 full combo, x 1047 Exo GS Power = 1434 partial(7/8), 1581 full
Ranger RF: 1.5 coefficient, x 1000 Exo Longbow Power = 1500
Guard Spin: 1.71, x 1047 Exo GS Power = 1790
Mes BF: 0.96, x 952 Exo Sword Power = 914
Nec GC: 1.28 × 952 Exo Axe Power = 1219

Turns out not a whole lot changed. I guess thats no surprise, as the weapon powers don’t vary TOO much.

Guard Spin still does more over damage with only 33% of the hits/projectiles landing than 100b does if 100% of the hits land, and Ranger Rapid Fire still does nearly identical damage. Both of them allow mobility, and either a greater range or 360 attack cone. Necros still allows full mobility and lifeforce, and Mes still evades like a boss (though the damage is a good bit lower, clearly).

Dand.8231:

War 100b: 1.37 partial(7/8), 1.51 full combo, x 1047 Exo GS Power = 1434 partial(7/8), 1581 full
Ranger RF: 1.5 coefficient, x 1000 Exo Longbow Power = 1500
Guard Spin: 1.71, x 1047 Exo GS Power = 1790
Mes BF: 0.96, x 952 Exo Sword Power = 914
Nec GC: 1.28 × 952 Exo Axe Power = 1219

This isn’t how damage coefficients or DPS calculations work. Also, Hundred Blades actually has 9 hits – the first 8 have an overall damage coefficient of 4.21, whereas the last has a damage coefficient of 1.1. Since we’re talking DPS, though, let’s calculate the actual damage numbers. I’ll be assuming that the player has a total of 2000 power, fighting against an opponent in heavy armor, with standard weapon strengths.

Hundred Blades: (1047.5 * 2000 * 4.21) / 1211 + (1047.5 * 2000 * 1.1) / 1211 = 9185 / 3.5 s = 2624 DPS

Rapid Fire: (1000 * 2000 * 3.75) / 1211 = 6193 /2.5s = 2477 DPS

Whirling Wrath: (1047.5 * 2000 * 2.8) / 1211 + (1047.5 * 2000 * 0.15) / 1211 = 5102 / 0.75s = 6802 DPS; as we’re assuming a third of these land, 6802 / 3 = 2267 DPS

Blurred Frenzy: (952.5 * 2000 * 2.4) / 1211 = 3775 / 2 s = 1887 DPS; note that the tooltip for this is currently bugged, as the skill only contains four strikes, not eight, and the casting time is 2 seconds, not half a second

Ghastly Claws: (952.5 * 2000 * 2.88) / 1211 = 4530 / 2.25s = 2013 DPS

Guardian greatsword auto attack: (1047.5 * 2000 * 0.8) / 1211 + (1047.5 * 2000 * 0.8) / 1211 + (1047.5 * 2000 * 1.2) / 1211 = 4841 / 2.5 = 1936 DPS

Dand.8231:

Also, as a side note, the claim that guards have no CC isnt true, Binding Blade pulls allow for a partial Whirl with no difficulty, mean they dont even need to swap to set up their hits. I’m not calling guard OP or cheap, just refuting your claims.

Anyway, why is it okay to assume that a Warrior MUST bring other skills JUST to set up 100b, but it’s fine that Ranger can just unload with RF, or Guard can Bind/Whirl without switching weapons? It’s great that they have ways to set up, but it should not be a 100% requirement that you set up, it should be a bonus. Backloading the DPS to the final hit already provides this bonus to land the entire chain. That does not mean that it should ONLY be usable following a setup.

Binding Blade is easily negated by dodging when the Guardian activated the pull, causing it to only move you a short distance. Also, it doesn’t actually immobilize the enemy, meaning that they don’t even have to use a cleanse or stunbreak to dodge away.

I think it’s fine to assume that a Warrior should bring other skills to land full Hundred Blades channels, because skills aren’t balanced in a vacuum. If Guardians suddenly gained access to Throw Bolas, they would suddenly find it much easier to land Whirling Wrath, and the skill would probably need to be rebalanced. Rapid Fire was already subjected to an update to make its animation more obvious after people complained about how strong it was. Note also that Warrior greatsword is not the same as Guardian greatsword or Ranger longbow. Weapon skills should be balanced in accordance to their full weapon sets, rather than by individual skills.

Juba.8406:

Disagree.

this will beg more nerfs to 100b damage.

As i always said, 100b should be (Hard to setup/High reward skill), the current issue is that “the reward” is not high enough compared to the large effort done to set it up, but i think the upcoming changes will address this issue.

It’s not really about skill or effort. You just don’t use it until the target is either downed or CC’d. It’s almost useless otherwise.

This will be the death of warrior in pve i know axe do more damage but u need gs in the rotation to buff up. I really hope they have some plans for warrior so we wont stay
“sturdy body” and nothing else.

they should only change one thing with war now, and that is make axe 5 also reflect projecs or evade attacks??

Gamble.4580:

they should only change one thing with war now, and that is make axe 5 also reflect projecs or evade attacks??

How do people come up with this stuff…

Then again, almost everything they said they are changing made me think the same thing.

@Torqiseknite You can do all the math you want. The fact is you will never land a full Hundred Blades channel against a competent player of any profession. That doesn’t happen with any other channeled skill besides Ranger’s Whirling Defense, but this one has other uses. Also, all other static channeled skills have perks of their own:
Pistol Whip has a stun set up and evades.
Blurred Frenzy tracks, evades and has an excellent set up on 3.
Zealot’s Defense tracks, blocks projectiles and has range.
Whirling Defense provides retaliation, couses vulnerability, reflects projectiles and can be set up with 4.

^These are the skills you should compare Hundred blades with, they all have their uses besides damage. All are either much easier to set up and/or do something else besides damage.

Also, Hundred Blades being static makes it incredibly counterable, and the risks never offset the rewards becouse you can’t realistically hit this full channel on a competitive level or against competent opponents. In order to do so you need to fully commit your build to this single skill (mace/shield+gs build) and even then it ends up being a subpar build that’s really easy to counter.

Making Hundred Blades just like Whirling Wrath (with 1/2 mobility), wouldn’t break the weapon at all, as Dand said. It would also make the weapon 10 times more fun, as it wouldn’t be countered by simple strafing anymore.