Guild Wars 2

Hey all,

I recently just started playing warrior. Up until now, I have next to zero experience on anything except engineer. I built The Predator on him, and wanted to be able to transfer that into a warrior build. However, after only a few hours of playing at 80, it quickly became apparent that rifle is FAR inferior to longbow. I remember a long time ago hearing about how they nerfed rifle on warrior, but I don’t recall what changes were made.
My question is this; what changes need to be made to warrior rifle for it to be viable again? And are there any viable rifle builds still around? Thanks all.

With rifle you want to focus on Kill shot and volley for your damage. I use this build: http://gw2skills.net/editor/?fJAQNAU3XjMdU7ZdH+dwJagggycBEA99pAX9asFhBA-TxBBwAY3fU+B4iAgT9nUaCyrTIwTA4sSwAAIA7cnBAkBIfMA-e

A lot people don’t like it, but I do at least as much damage as a LB power ranger, likely more, so I feel that it’s still quite viable.

i don’t mean offense but that build is pretty terrible, you aren’t going to go even close the amount of damage a LB ranger can pull off at range.

there are very few pve encounters in the game where ranged is actually the best option, when that happens just slap a rifle on one of your 2 slot and call it a day, no need to go out of your way with a specific build.

I put out 25-35k damage between my Volley and Kill Shot. Both of which have very low cooldowns. I don’t see how that is terrible.

You aren’t the first person to tell me that my build is terrible, but no one really gives me a good reason as to why it is.

Try rune of grove on any killshot build,yes you have less dmg..but that surprises effect of a bind root ( 12 sec if not destroyed ) can screw people over bigtime.It’s just to troll offc,but can provide for great fun and some free killshots.

Gern.2978:

I put out 25-35k damage between my Volley and Kill Shot. Both of which have very low cooldowns. I don’t see how that is terrible.

You aren’t the first person to tell me that my build is terrible, but no one really gives me a good reason as to why it is.

Longbow ranger is superior in every way.

IMO, Warrior rifle needs:
Auto Attack – Damage increase depending on foes distance, like ranger longbow.
Volley – This skill should give adrenaline per hit. Scrap this effect from auto attack.
Brutal Shot – This skill should apply revealed.

Still wouldn’t be that great but ehhh.

it’s bad because if you just use 6/5/0/0/3 and never use your burst to keep the berserker power boost you get higher damage and because axe offhand is just useless and a bunch other sub-optimal traits.

it’s bad because it focuses on rifle, which is bad.

honestly everything is wrong with that build i can’t even go about picking out details.

Hello,

Gern.2978:

I put out 25-35k damage between my Volley and Kill Shot. Both of which have very low cooldowns. I don’t see how that is terrible.

You aren’t the first person to tell me that my build is terrible, but no one really gives me a good reason as to why it is.

Actually, I find that the build is interesting and consistent. However, it has no condition removal, no stun-breakers, no mobility: if you get condi-bombed, hard-controlled or kited with someone able to avoid/block/reflect your volley or burst, then the game can become difficult.

As a personal preference, I’d pair the rifle with a GS rather than the double axe, mainly to gain mobility and GS#3 evade, in order to easily engage/disengage or achieve superior positioning during the fight (useful for the rifle). I’d thus remove the banner (since you’d be moving much more), probably in favor of “Fear Me” [EDIT: or “bolas”], and would keep the 6/2/0/0/6 template but reallocate axe traits into others (or maybe try 4/4/0/0/6).

Elegie.3620:

Hello,

Gern.2978:

I put out 25-35k damage between my Volley and Kill Shot. Both of which have very low cooldowns. I don’t see how that is terrible.

You aren’t the first person to tell me that my build is terrible, but no one really gives me a good reason as to why it is.

Actually, I find that the build is interesting and consistent. However, it has no condition removal, no stun-breakers, no mobility: if you get condi-bombed, hard-controlled or kited with someone able to avoid/block/reflect your volley or burst, then the game can become difficult.

As a personal preference, I’d pair the rifle with a GS rather than the double axe, mainly to gain mobility and GS#3 evade, in order to easily engage/disengage or achieve superior positioning during the fight (useful for the rifle). I’d thus remove the banner (since you’d be moving much more), probably in favor of “Fear Me” [EDIT: or “bolas”], and would keep the 6/2/0/0/6 template but reallocate axe traits into others (or maybe try 4/4/0/0/6).

It’s not a PvP build.

Gern.2978:

It’s not a PvP build.

Oh, sorry about that, still sleepy

Rifle higher damage than longbow ranger yeah..and pigs fly.. Lb1 at max range alone makes all rifle warriors cry.

My pewpew that inst even full zerk in wvw runs with 1058 damage on the tooltip, against squishies that about 4k crit/hit. I dont think they will ever make rifle viable. Been waiting far too long for that to happen.

Scoobaniec.9561:

Rifle higher damage than longbow ranger yeah..and pigs fly.. Lb1 at max range alone makes all rifle warriors cry.

My pewpew that inst even full zerk in wvw runs with 1058 damage on the tooltip, against squishies that about 4k crit/hit. I dont think they will ever make rifle viable. Been waiting far too long for that to happen.

Common misconception about Warrior Rifle.

You are comparing apples and oranges by comparing warrior rifle #1 and Ranger LB #1. Warrior rifle’s primary damage comes from Kill shot and volley, everything about the mechanics of warrior rifle is geared towards getting off kill shot as often as possible, that’s why the auto attack gives more adrenaline when hitting foes inflicted with vulnerability, which you put on the enemy with rifle #4. The auto attack is really only for building adrenaline.

I think a lack of understanding this is why so many people think warrior rifle is so bad. They put on Berserker’s Power and just sit on all their adrenaline because they think that’s what you have to do as a damage warrior. Basically they play Rifle Warrior like they play GS warrior and then get disappointed at their damage.

Rifle is literally the worst weapon for a warrior, period. I absolutely love the predator but sadly the only thing that stops me from making one is that it requires an engineer to make use of :/

Gern.2978:

>

While you talking about volley and killshot (which takes time to build up ofc) forgetting about rapid fire that is stronger than your volley.
You have burst one trick pony called killshot which is easy to dodge btw but nvm that one as i dont think were talking about pvp.

From pve perspective lb ranger will outdps you so badly that you literally have no idea;

-your damage on “1” is mediocre unlike long range shot at max range
https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Long_Range_Shot
https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Fierce_Shot

-you wont make up for that by volley either as rapid fire also deals 20% higher damage along with 10 stack of vul which you can apply more frequency and without wasting time for brutal shot that has lower damage than fierce (pathetic).

https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Volley
https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Rapid_Fire

-you also can train ranger lb to deal extra 5% damage and 10% casttime reduction along with extra range that can be reach up to 2100 meters thx to broken mechanics ingame.

Take a look at these numbers in links. Lower base damage, even lower power scaling. Apples to oranges right? Do you really think you can outdps lb ranger with killshot?

Sorry to break it for you, but youre not even close to archieve that, with higher power its olny getting worse and worse in favor of ranger lb. And thats actually without counting their class mechanic called “pet” which does about 30% of ranger dps also bringing extra utility so your killshot and rifle lies and screams about the nonsense you talking about. I dindt even mentioned aoe barrage which also hits like a truck while applying cripple. That joke knockback and stealth are just a cherry on the top.

If you want we can give it a try and see who will kill heavy golems in spvp faster – your warrior joke rifle or my pewpew ranger. But as it stands now rifle remain as trash weapon that might as well be deleted from warrior weapon list and i doubt anyone will be missing that. No damage, no utility, nothing.

Scoobaniec.9561:

Gern.2978:

>

While you talking about volley and killshot (which takes time to build up ofc) forgetting about rapid fire that is stronger than your volley.
You have burst one trick pony called killshot which is easy to dodge btw but nvm that one as i dont think were talking about pvp.

From pve perspective lb ranger will outdps you so badly that you literally have no idea;

-your damage on “1” is mediocre unlike long range shot at max range
https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Long_Range_Shot
https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Fierce_Shot

-you wont make up for that by volley either as rapid fire also deals 20% higher damage along with 10 stack of vul which you can apply more frequency and without wasting time for brutal shot that has lower damage than fierce (pathetic).

https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Volley
https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Rapid_Fire

-you also can train ranger lb to deal extra 5% damage and 10% casttime reduction along with extra range that can be reach up to 2100 meters thx to broken mechanics ingame.

Take a look at these numbers in links. Lower base damage, even lower power scaling. Apples to oranges right? Do you really think you can outdps lb ranger with killshot?

Sorry to break it for you, but youre not even close to archieve that, with higher power its olny getting worse and worse in favor of ranger lb. And thats actually without counting their class mechanic called “pet” which does about 30% of ranger dps also bringing extra utility so your killshot and rifle lies and screams about the nonsense you talking about. I dindt even mentioned aoe barrage which also hits like a truck while applying cripple. That joke knockback and stealth are just a cherry on the top.

If you want we can give it a try and see who will kill heavy golems in spvp faster – your warrior joke rifle or my pewpew ranger. But as it stands now rifle remain as trash weapon that might as well be deleted from warrior weapon list and i doubt anyone will be missing that. No damage, no utility, nothing.

Yes, under ideal circumstances a LB ranger can easily do more damage than a rifle warrior, but all that damage is dependent on being at max range at all times, which is next to impossible in dungeons and Fractals, and you have to be able to hit with your full RF every time. A rifle warrior doesn’t have to worry about being at range at all; a rifle warrior does as much damage in melee range as it does at 1200, in fact they can do more at melee range because you can switch to axe or greatsword in between using Volley and Kill-shot.

I really don’t see why you are getting so defensive about this. The OP asked how he can make rifle warrior viable, I gave constructive advice to that end. I don’t see how that insults you at all. The argument here is not whether a LB ranger does more damage than a warrior, but weather you can make a rifle warrior viable, which you can. The reason I compared it to a LB ranger is because LB rangers are considered not the best for Dungeons and fractals, but still viable. And I was sort of saying: “Look at a ranger, they are fine in dungeons, and I can do just as good as them on my rifle warrior.”

Well from what I gather, warrior rifle is average at best, but still inferior to long bow on warrior for a ranged choice. It’s too bad that the only class in the game to make use of this weapon is engineer. I hope thief gets it as a specialization, and maybe revenant too.

We have 1 problem here. You cant make rifle viable by any means. Rifle is outclasses by warrior longbow in every aspect this game has to offer and in general everyoone and their mom runs melee in dungs anyway (and ranger outdps warriors in melee as well).

Lets put it simply, rifle needs a complete overhaul. Current skills sux, all of them. Scrap them and start over. As it stands now theres no reason to pick up a rifle other than fashion reasons as youre nerfing yourself by doing so – that also applies to axe offhand.

Btw if i recall correctly volley is a dps loss over axe aa so why anyone would want to switch to rifle in melee range lol? That makes no sense whatsoever.

chaosdurza.3291:

Well from what I gather, warrior rifle is average at best, but still inferior to long bow on warrior for a ranged choice. It’s too bad that the only class in the game to make use of this weapon is engineer. I hope thief gets it as a specialization, and maybe revenant too.

I doubt revenant will get access to rifle as they are a brawler type class. And they already have a ranged option with hammer that might end up as second (or even first at max range) best dps range weapon. I personally dont believe that thief will get rifle in HoT xpac but in future i can see it happen.

I LOVE playing with rifle but it’s autoattack is just terrible. The removal of bleeding was completely unecessary and reduced the overall damage by quite a lot. 256 bleeding without conditon damage might not seem much but with deep cuts and condition food you could easily deal 11-12 seconds of bleeding damage per autoattack. That DID add up in a longer 1v1.

Now with the fierce shot I feel like I am throwing pillows at people. It’s rage-inducing how terrible it is.

Engineer rifle autoattack is faster and hits harder. Long range shot has a potential range of 1’900 and hits harder, even targets <500 range, slightly longer casting time. Even mesmer’s spatial surge is better…

Fierce shot did pretty good damage after the march 16 patch but it was a bug…

Mind you the fierce shot is not the only problem of rifle (obviously)… Those have been mentioned in other good threads.

All of you are are answering the question by saying “don’t use rifle cause you can get better damage with other weapons.” That fact is not in question. The question was not: “What weapons are more viable than rifle?” It was: “How can warrior rifle be made viable?” If you have no constructive advice to that end, I don’t see the point in replying.

IMO, warrior rifle is not completely worthless. You are going to put out enough DPS in a dungeon that the rest of the group won’t be carrying you. However, “fierce shot” and “volley” really do need a damage buff. I don’t think the other skills need any kind of a buff; Kill shot is the hardest hitting power-damage burst skill that a warrior has available to them, Brutal shot is really only meant to apply vulnerability, not damage, Aimed shot and Rifle Butt are CC abilities not damage abilities.

NO. Please don’t advise people to use rifle in dungeons.

There’s always a specific setup for a class that people hate the most in dungeons + fractals, for example:

-GS mesmers
-bearbow rangers
-staff guards
-rifle warriors

etc etc.

Read in the dungeons/fractals forum or even post there if you aren’t sure what people should or should not be taking to them.

There is a reason why people cringe when they see certain classes using these weapons all of the time… they are horrible. Hardly ever will you find a situation in which these are appropriate to use. They do exist but they are so rare that it would do you more of a favor than vice versa to just not bring a rifle with your warrior, period. Playing to have fun and being completely direspectful of your teammates’ time are two different things.

Purple Miku.7032:

NO. Please don’t advise people to use rifle in dungeons….

…Read in the dungeons/fractals forum or even post there if you aren’t sure what people should or should not be taking to them.

…Playing to have fun and being completely direspectful of your teammates’ time are two different things.

Class/build discrimination is what is really disrespectful. Helping people with ideas to make their preferred play-style more viable, or suggestions to A-net on how to fix broken class mechanics is far more constructive than trying to tell people to play the way other people want them to.

I do notice that if all the stars align and I have applied 20 stacks of vulnerability to them, either through mace 4+rifle 4 or the utility, Kill Shot hits like a freakin truck. Like, over 13k crits. And if I take burst precision, it’s always a crit. This is pretty enjoyable in pvp to just do mace 5, mace 4, fear me, rifle 4 and kill shot. I have yet to not kill someone with this combo, does an immense amount of damage.

However, for pve, I just don’t see the damage as ‘viable’. To me, pve is not a place for burst damage, which is how the rifle is coming off to me. So maybe this weapon has its place in pvp, but not quite as applicable in pve?

Gern.2978:

Purple Miku.7032:

NO. Please don’t advise people to use rifle in dungeons….

…Read in the dungeons/fractals forum or even post there if you aren’t sure what people should or should not be taking to them.

…Playing to have fun and being completely direspectful of your teammates’ time are two different things.

Class/build discrimination is what is really disrespectful. Helping people with ideas to make their preferred play-style more viable, or suggestions to A-net on how to fix broken class mechanics is far more constructive than trying to tell people to play the way other people want them to.

That’s not true, everyone has the right to play how they want but if you have any concern for others you won’t burden them by bringing something that is obviously a terrible option. There’s no way to make rifle worth taking in PvE. Even if you demand to be able to range something, longbow is always better.

Rifle has no use other than roleplaying as a soldier or something like that.

In Silverwastes you are more likely to get shouted at for doing AoE damage in some fights (any longbow ability that’s not the autoattack) than using a Rifle. And most PvE is so easy that it almost doesn’t matter what kind of weapon you bring, as long as it does some damage ; the most importand thing to do is staying alive and keep on doing damage (personall I have yet to see build discrimination anywhere outside PvP)

Purple Miku.7032:

Gern.2978:

Purple Miku.7032:

NO. Please don’t advise people to use rifle in dungeons….

…Read in the dungeons/fractals forum or even post there if you aren’t sure what people should or should not be taking to them.

…Playing to have fun and being completely direspectful of your teammates’ time are two different things.

Class/build discrimination is what is really disrespectful. Helping people with ideas to make their preferred play-style more viable, or suggestions to A-net on how to fix broken class mechanics is far more constructive than trying to tell people to play the way other people want them to.

That’s not true, everyone has the right to play how they want but if you have any concern for others you won’t burden them by bringing something that is obviously a terrible option. There’s no way to make rifle worth taking in PvE. Even if you demand to be able to range something, longbow is always better.

Rifle has no use other than roleplaying as a soldier or something like that.

How does LB in a dungeon give more dps? It is condi based… People use it as condi cleanse… What am I missing? Rifle would be much better for power damage…

Just compare autoattack speeds and damage coefficients… longbow hits twice per shot, has an arced shot so actually longer range than rifle, so the longbow deals better DPS when straight up autoattacking. If you take volley into account then you also take arcing arrow into account as well so longbow’s still better DPS, so basically the only thing rifle has going for it is the fact that it pierces with crack shot… and that’s it. Longbow has a combo field with F1 that deals actually decent damage and you can use arcing arrow as a blast finisher in it for might, you have a blind with #4 and an immobilize with #5. Rifle just has a cripple and a skill that has a long windup that applies 4 vuln… The 4 vuln doesn’t rly justify casting it.

Point is rifle needs either complete rework or serious buffing otherwise the people using it on warrior will always be perceived as trolls in PvP or noobs in PvE. Not trying to hurt any of your feelings just trying to spread correct information.

Unless you 100% absolutely have to use a ranged weapon which is very few cases in dungeons/fractals, Greatsword builds will always come out on top in terms of dps. (and if you’re the only warrior you should be using PS/EA or at least EA if you have a might stacking ele). Like Miku already said above me, Longbow has the potential to offer dps, might stacking, and decent CC for those small times you ever need a ranged weapon.

Currently we warriors are glorified power support might stackers. If you want to use a high dps ranged weapon build, play a LB ranger. They hit harder than your rifle in any scenario, even with a melee weapon.

Purple Miku.7032:

…Rifle just has a cripple and a skill that has a long windup that applies 4 vuln… The 4 vuln doesn’t rly justify casting it.

……Not trying to hurt any of your feelings just trying to spread correct information.

Except that you aren’t spreading correct information, because that skill “with a long windup that applies 4 vuln” (brutal shot) is actually a 1/2 second cast and applies 8 vuln.

yeah they buffed skill 4, it’s almost instant now which makes it a lot more viable in those few instances where you might want to range and pierce targets like, i dunno, legendary ice elemental.

can’t really think of anything other than that however.

Used to be 4 vuln, forgive me.

i frequently 1hit people in wvw with killshot. one second they are enjoying their 14-15k base health zerker ele or whatever.. a fraction of a second later they are downed on the ground. most times they dont even see what hit them, me being a 2 inch asura female. that is fun. also nothing puts out dps like using a piercing volley into a guild group restacking, zomg the numbers or just killshotting the driver and following up with a volley.. see how their coordination collapses when the driver is trying to save his butt from 2k crits every second.. I can say without getting red – rifle is the hardest weapon to play by standards of watching your surroundings, positioning, when to fire and when to keep it quieet – basically tactical thinking in wvw – and it has the most impact potential when you can get your thumb on the sweet spot and keep pressing. Just try not to stand out (asura!) because a sniper seen is a sniper soon to be dead.

Asking how to improve rifle is not an easy question. Here’s all the problems:

Skill 1: The bleeding on the old version wasn’t good, but with 5 points in arms you could at least get 10% more damage out of it. Now, it hits a pathetically small amount. Rather than making this a super long range weapon like Ranger LB, I would rather the rifle be more mid range focus. Maybe give this attack a damage bonus between 400-700 units. Make it deal roughly the same bonus damage that Ranger LB gets at long range.

Skill 2: I suppose there’s some synergy to be had with Leg Specialist, but having it ONLY deal cripple and a pathetic amount of damage is silly. Why not have this skill also give bonus damage if the target has Vulnerability? That would make it synergize with Brutal Shot and if you have Leg Spec it also sets up the first few hits of Volley.

Skill 3: As the main damage skill, its damage isn’t awful but not particularly great either. I would give this the same bonus damage between 400-700 units as the AA. How much extra I don’t know but I would say it needs to be competitive with a skill like Volley (I know I’m normally against comparing skills across classes but it seems appropriate here).

Skill 4: If the changes to Aimed shot happened then this skill may be fine as is. Maybe up the amount of vuln to 10.

Skill 5: I actually really like this skill. However, it would need to have the knockback upped to 500 with my suggested changes so that landing it means they get placed right in the sweet spot for the bonus damage. Maybe up the range to 200 as a QoL change. Maybe change the animation to make the user swing their rifle like a baseball bat (be careful not to burn your hands).

Killshot: The last change to the cast time was good, but it needs one little QoL change to be viable I think. Make the user immune to blind while using the skill. There’s still the obvious animation and the ability to block/reflect unless they bring Signet of Might (which means sacrificing sustain).

With these changes that would make the rifle a weapon about maintaining that mid range distance. There would be the powerful combo of Brutal Shot -> Aimed Shot -> Volley and Rifle Butt will allow you to set that combo up. Will this make rifle viable? Don’t know, but it would hopefully be a lot more useable than it is now.

Sorry to burst your bubble, but Rifle (and ranging in general) provides poor DPS. If your playing PvE, everything is easily melee-able and is expected by the majority of the community. Rifle warrior is one of the worst builds you could be playing up there with bow bear ranger and condi necro.

In PvP rifle is also outclassed by Bow in everyway.

This one again? Ngh, just gonna paste an idea for Rifle that would really help the Warrior overall in the long run:

“One idea would be Powerful Banners and Leg Specialist Swap, Tactics will get a 3rd trait for banner build, and Rifle gets a much needed trait in Strength tree.”

On a different note, I am still thinking that the rifle has the potential to be the best ranged weapon a Warrior has for PvP Power builds if they tweaked the numbers more. I don’t think we will see it outclass the LB in PvE, but as long as it is used SOMEWHERE, I would be happy.

If rifle on war would be the same dps as power ranger every ranger would reroll to it because it has stances and other defensive stuff while being naturally tanky.

Slightly off topic, but I just wanted mention the hilarity of the Longbow Ranger Vs. Rifle Warrior debate:
In the warrior forms, the majority of warrior and ranger players laugh at anyone who compares a rifle warrior to a longbow ranger. However, in the ranger forums, the majority of players (especially when talking about Rapid Fire) complain that rifle warrior can “do the same thing” as a Longbow Ranger. Some of those ranger players are the same people who laughed at you in the warrior forums for making that very comparison.