Guild Wars 2

did we get rekt?

only if u are a pve.

Yes. The skill is 100% pointless now as even if someone hits both fields, they will only get hit once every .5 seconds. It effectively functions the exact same as the non-zerker f1 now (perhaps even worse).

Burnzerker has been butchered.

So we can basically salvage our viper armor now? i hate this update

Yay, Scorched Earth exploit got stomped. Now burnzerker won’t have brokenly high dps in PvE.

The damage from this exploit was so high it was legitimately game breaking in some areas (no updraft gore with a bunch of burnzerkers, anyone?).
Nerf though it may be, I can only see it as healthy for the game. Burnzerker should be more in-line with the dps capabilities of other condi damagers now. Hopefully it doesn’t end up too low though.

This with the KoF changes are straight-up nerfs to burnzerkers.

I had made my condi warrior my main and I can now barely break 4k burning damage. This is disgusting. The only thing im happy about is rifle is legit good now for pve, but holy lord condi warrior is dead

well,. im switching my viper set to my guard and atleast ill have one condi heavy…

Yeah.. anet pretty much killed Burnzerkers… can’t do jack in this game because they feel it’s not their vision.

Arewn.2368:

Yay, Scorched Earth exploit got stomped. Now burnzerker won’t have brokenly high dps in PvE.

The damage from this exploit was so high it was legitimately game breaking in some areas (no updraft gore with a bunch of burnzerkers, anyone?).
Nerf though it may be, I can only see it as healthy for the game. Burnzerker should be more in-line with the dps capabilities of other condi damagers now. Hopefully it doesn’t end up too low though.

Something isn’t an ‘exploit’ merely because you don’t like it. The functionality on Scorched Earth was working PRECISELY the same way it did in the preview for Berserker this summer. Now, they’ve removed functionality from something that didn’t need touching (because there’s about a billion modifiers you could change and get the same result) and warrior will be back to having one viable weapon set in PvE. I’ve only spent the last 2 years playing nothing but greatsword, so hooray for the return of that.

viper bers is dead now time to switch for my viper engi/reaper i try viper bers at VG and with this 0.5s and when he still move i do almost zero dps and for non move targets its 40% dmg loss

Noxicon.4956:

Something isn’t an ‘exploit’ merely because you don’t like it. The functionality on Scorched Earth was working PRECISELY the same way it did in the preview for Berserker this summer. Now, they’ve removed functionality from something that didn’t need touching (because there’s about a billion modifiers you could change and get the same result) and warrior will be back to having one viable weapon set in PvE. I’ve only spent the last 2 years playing nothing but greatsword, so hooray for the return of that.

It’s not an exploit because I don’t like it.
It’s an exploit because its functionality is in-line with what is established in GW2 as exploitative behavior. The same behavior we’ve seen identified as “exploits” in several other skills which have been changed. And pretty well confirmed by the fact that, surprise surprise, they changed this one too.

So I’ll throw that right back at you. It doesn’t stop being an exploit just because you like it.

Taking advantage of the side-by-side field to double, and in some cases triple or quadruple, the skill’s damage is quiet obviously unintended. It put burnzerker dps some 40% above the next best contenders. It was so above what arenanet intended that it could legitimately be used to break new encounters.

And it’s not necessarily bad now anyways. I’m not claiming to know how much damage burnzerkers do now. That will take testing. But they’re likely still viable and in-line with the capabilities of other top PvE condi-damage dealers.
(this was never a problem in PvP since it couldn’t be taken advantage of there, and the change they went with for scorched earth wont affect pvp).

Also, we’re talking about an exploit. An exploit can be a bug. A bug can be an exploit. But an exploit is not necessarily a bug. The fact that it’s “working” or “is still the same as it was in beta” is not indicative of whether it’s an exploit or not.

Instead of complaining that an exploit you liked was fixed, how about you put on your viper gear, grab your longbow, and go test burnzerker’s new dps capabilities. If they’re in-line with what the other top condi-damagers can do, then great. That’s called balance.
If it’s below what other top condi-damagers can do, then that’s something worth discussing, and we should get on Anet’s case for over-nerfing it.

You don’t understand. The functionality of Scorched Earth was PRECISELY what they wanted it to be. They mentioned it during the stream when they announced it, that it would place multiple fire fields and the point was that people could run through multiple of them (they talked about its use in WvW). The skills you are referring to (primarily Fiery Rush on FGS is my guess) were NOT intended to function that way and did so because of the engine, NOT the skill design. That is why this isn’t an exploit, and was instead just using the actual skill. It wasn’t buggy or glitchy in any capacity.

I am one who argued that it NEEDED to be nerfed, but its HOW they nerfed it I take issue with, especially given the multipliers in the berserker tree itself. Always angry is 7% physical AND condi damage as a minor trait; That could very easily be nerfed to adjust the damage output of a condi warrior without losing one of the few things on the warrior that, in my opinion, wasn’t rolling your face across the keyboard. It was different and unique, and in addition to that, required at least a small amount of skill to place your fields appropriately to get the most damage out of them.

Anet builds a ton of multipliers into the trait lines, then instead of using those to tune, they instead mess with functionality, and change things that would be perfectly fine if that didn’t have inherent modifiers all over the place. Thus, everything starts to feel like the same kitten class, cause they all do similar kitten with different modifiers. Where’s the fun in that?

Nerf it, fine, but rewriting the functionality on it while leaving obviously broken minor traits in makes no kitten sense. It is now the same functionally as f1 when you’re not in berserker. Weee Elite Spec’s giving new playstyles!

From testing it, they obliterated burnzerker. And I’m not talking about bringing it in line with other cond classes. It’s gutted.

It’s Anet. They’ll buff in next ‘quarterly balance patch’.

Yep, let the Oooh you guys are overreacting people say what ever they need to say.. but no matter how you look at it… anet just took an option completely from warrior to use for Raids.. so it’s PS warrior we have left.

Arewn.2368:

Noxicon.4956:

Something isn’t an ‘exploit’ merely because you don’t like it. The functionality on Scorched Earth was working PRECISELY the same way it did in the preview for Berserker this summer. Now, they’ve removed functionality from something that didn’t need touching (because there’s about a billion modifiers you could change and get the same result) and warrior will be back to having one viable weapon set in PvE. I’ve only spent the last 2 years playing nothing but greatsword, so hooray for the return of that.

Also, we’re talking about an exploit. An exploit can be a bug. A bug can be an exploit. But an exploit is not necessarily a bug. The fact that it’s “working” or “is still the same as it was in beta” is not indicative of whether it’s an exploit or not.

They have talked about how the skilled warrior would be able to place an enemy in between two fields for double damage. They fully intended the skill to work exactly the way it did.
The damage itself simply turned out to be way higher than they ever expected thus the need to reduce it to some degree.
It might almost have been a pride thing since people were able to easily break their “hard challenging” content like Gorseval.

And the condition damage is indeed below average now if you take engineers as your average. They will move from a must have to an only bring when no other option.

https://youtu.be/jd9QuYktMos?t=1262

Anet should ban themselves for blatantly putting ‘exploits’ into their game! Yea!

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/info/updates/Game-Update-Notes-November-4-2015/first#post5717429 This is what’s responsibile for Burnzerker DPS being stupidly high. But instead of reverting what they screwed up, they went after functionality. Why have damage modifiers if you don’t use those modifiers to tune? Stop trying to reinvent the wheel and adjust with the built in knobs you gave yourselves.

Raizen.7981:

did we get rekt?

Depends on what you mean. Did the build’s DPS get cut down by a very noticeable chunk? Yeah. Is the build no longer viable? Nah.

Azure.8670:

I had made my condi warrior my main and I can now barely break 4k burning damage. This is disgusting. The only thing im happy about is rifle is legit good now for pve, but holy lord condi warrior is dead

I would check your rotation/gear/something. I was able to get to 6-7k burning damage with just banners. Previously was around 9k under same scenario. 22-33% burn DPS nerf (not total DPS nerf, this would be less of a loss) does sound harsh, but it was also out DPSing classes by this much in some scenarios too. The build was not gutted by any means. Still one of the better condi builds. Condi engi may be better, but only under in the hands of a player who can get down the rotation well, which is uncommon. This build was extremely lazy and easy to use. It shouldn’t be top.

Screenshot attached to show burning damage.

@Noxicon & @ Henry
People keep saying “but Anet said it could be used that way!”
But I tuned-in to their podcasts, and I went back and re-listened to multiple sources to try to find where they claimed what you’re saying they claimed, and I’ve been unable to find it.
And when ever I ask people “well where did you hear that”, they don’t seem to have an answer.

I’m not saying Anet didn’t say that, but I haven’t been able to find where they did.
So, can you link me the source where arenanet specifically says they intended for Scorched Earth to be used in such a way that you simultaneously hit the enemy with several of the fields by lining up hitboxes?
And running through the fields so that they get hit repeatedly (not simultaneously) as they move through them, is not the same thing as lining up an unmoving enemy’kittenbox up so that they’re being hit by multiple fields at the same time.

And the exploit-type in question is taking advantage of hitboxes to have the same skill hit someone multiple times in a single interval. That was the case with the other skills, and is the case with Scorched Earth.
The fact that they changed it in this way should itself be a loud indication that this is precisely the case.
Because you’re absolutely right, they could have adjusted any of the other many modifiers in order to adjust damage. But they didn’t. Instead, they changed the thing that’s exhibiting exploit-like behavior.
Because it’s an exploit. They didn’t intend for the skill to be used that way, resulting in anywhere from double to quadruple damage. They didn’t intend for burnzerker damage to be that high, and it was that high as a direct result of that behavior. It wasn’t OP because of a patch where they buffed condi damage by 7%, it was OP because the you could unintentionally get double (or more) damage out of one of the build’s main condi sources. They buffed warrior condi damage (in the patch you linked) because their condi damage was weak when played the way they expected/intended (i.e without scorched earth exploit). And now that scorched earth has been fixed, surprise suprise, condi warrior is apparently on the weak side and could actually use more buffs.
Burnzerker in situations where you couldn’t take advantage of the scorched earth exploit (such as pvp)? Weak there too. After the change? no difference, because the exploit could only be done on un-moving NPCs in the first place.

Also, they haven’t changed the functionality of the skill. It still shoots. It still burns. It still places side by side fields. It still uses adrenaline. You can still get hit by those fields in succession. Exactly as intended.
Hit-interval is in fact a modifier.

It was definitely not a bug/exploit, it was just anet saying: “kitten, we screwed up”, and applying a bandage to fix it.

Take a look at what they did with frost bow. It was doing astronomical amounts of damage to large hitbox monsters like Bloomhunger, so what they did? they nerfed DAMAGE COEFFICIENT instead of FUNCTIONALITY, this translates to frost bow still being able to hit with all impacts but doing overall less damage.

Why the kitten didn’t you do the same with scorched earth anet? what’s next, meteor shower hitting only every .5 secs? Don’t be lazy and do balance the right kittening way.