Guild Wars 2

Sword seems to have been designed as a hybrid power/condi weapon, but it doesn’t really work like that. MH Sword is used right now, but only because Flaming Flurry is busted. Let’s take a look at the other skills:

1. AA chain is fine, but pretty weak, especially on a power build. It could be left as is, but the rest of the skills need to do more raw damage.

2. Savage Leap is awesome, but only for it’s mobility. The damage component could easily be buffed, considering how telegraphed and slow the skill is.

3. Final Thrust is okay, but only for power builds. I think it should also add 3/6 stacks of bleeding or even torment.

4. Normal Flurry. Now, this one is just terrible. The bleeding it inflicts is weak, it takes too long to channel, it roots you in place, it does like zero power damage. Buff the bleeding duration slightly and increase the physical damage it inflicts by a ton so it’s actually something that’s worth casting for the whole duration.

5. Flaming Flurry. Extremely good, so much that it’s polarizing. The sword is nearly worthless without it.

As it stands now, only one skill is good for damage and only if you’re condi. At the same time, if you’re condi it has a dead skill and the normal F1 is nearly worthless regardless of your build. A good MH sword set might make GS/S hyper mobile builds a thing, it might make Arms something that people want to spec into.

Now we come to the OH Sword… I actually think it’s pretty simple. First, they need to decide whether it’s a pure condi weapon or a hybrid weapon.

1. Impale is alright, maybe a bit weak because it’s a projectile and we have a lot of projectile hate these days. The flip skill Rip is really bad though. It’s very slow and does nothing on a condi build and almost nothing on a power build. Rip needs to inflict bleeding/torment if it hits. Alternarively, if OH sword is supposed to be pure condi, you can cut the normal damage and make it inflict a ton of bleed/torment.

2. Riposte. This one needs to be a flip skill, not an automatic counter, just as the other skills of this type. The effect of the strike is weak, but it’s a defensive move first.

ALL weapons on war are joke now,they are way too outdated,lack utility and half of them are useless.

daw.4923:

ALL weapons on war are joke now,they are way too outdated,lack utility and half of them are useless.

since 2013, not going to happen, that’s the design philo for warrior in anet, old and clunky and not fancy and telegraphed and single functioned , berserker is already pushing the limit to sell HoT lol

I use sword in a power build and the damage fine .

Sword off hand might need a tuning and savage leap a slight lowering of activation time but the weapon works fine with power. ( I use sw/shield). .5 seconds active time reasonable for savage leap given this a low ICD skill.

The bleeds off old style savage flurry are not weak. They can be harder to land against enemies that break the Immob effect but you can generaly get at least SOME of these off before they do. I would point out in game terms you still damage ahead than if someone dodged your incapcitate as they avoid 100 percent of the latters damage.

If you want Sword to work with the bleeds and achieve a better outcome you should consider traiting arms. Power builds with 0 condition damage can easily generate bleeds well over 1.5k a tick. It might not seem a lot but it a substantial boost to overall damage output. The combo of Precise strikes ,Rending strikes and Bloodlust synergize very well with a sword here, even in a power build. With Blademaster and easy access to fury you get 40 percent crit chance with zero investment in precision.

Off hand sword there nothing wrong with this being Hybrid. It does not have to be either Or. Off hand 4 for riposte the cooldown should drop to 12 base and adren gain on no block go to 8 and it fine. Off hand 4 should have conditions added but it does not have to be a whole pile. 2 more torment is fine as a start on the rip.

My only issue with the warrior’s sword is the flow of the auto attack that I just can’t enjoy. The way skills flow just feel awkward for me and that’s the main reason that I don’t use this weapon.

Otherwise, It’s an ok weapon for both condi and power, while the gap closer stay an invaluable tool. Off hand sword have a block and a pretty nasty mid range skill, there is nothing to throw away in this weapon.

So yeah… instead of numbers buff, I’d gladly prefer new animations on sword AA.

Sword #3, final thrust, needs to have faster animation / cast time. Now it feels so clumsy and slow that it breaks the flow.

babazhook.6805:

I use sword in a power build and the damage fine .

Sword off hand might need a tuning and savage leap a slight lowering of activation time but the weapon works fine with power. ( I use sw/shield). .5 seconds active time reasonable for savage leap given this a low ICD skill.

The bleeds off old style savage flurry are not weak. They can be harder to land against enemies that break the Immob effect but you can generaly get at least SOME of these off before they do. I would point out in game terms you still damage ahead than if someone dodged your incapcitate as they avoid 100 percent of the latters damage.

If you want Sword to work with the bleeds and achieve a better outcome you should consider traiting arms. Power builds with 0 condition damage can easily generate bleeds well over 1.5k a tick. It might not seem a lot but it a substantial boost to overall damage output. The combo of Precise strikes ,Rending strikes and Bloodlust synergize very well with a sword here, even in a power build. With Blademaster and easy access to fury you get 40 percent crit chance with zero investment in precision.

Off hand sword there nothing wrong with this being Hybrid. It does not have to be either Or. Off hand 4 for riposte the cooldown should drop to 12 base and adren gain on no block go to 8 and it fine. Off hand 4 should have conditions added but it does not have to be a whole pile. 2 more torment is fine as a start on the rip.

dunno about power sword,you shoud try axe,i dont remember criting with sword for 12k in half sec. and aa chain with 12k dps.

Offhand sword definitely needs a tune up.

Have you ever tried landing offhand sword 4? Most unreliable POS ever. Slow as hell, you can practically walk straffe it.

edit/ Offhand sword 5 is also trash, you need to be facing your target within range for the counter attack to hit and often fails

I’m in favour of sword buffs. Off the top of my head, I think the following would be good:

• +50 power scaling on the sword auto
• Double the bleed stacks on the auto chain, add two bleeds to the third auto, but cut the duration of all of them in half. The reason for this is we have limited condi diversity, which makes us relatively easy to clear, so the short term pressure needs to by increased. Overall condi damage from a full autochain (if left uncleared) would thus be increased by 33%
• Double or even triple the bleed duration on Flurry. It’s not worth channeling beyond the immob atm, it’s a self-root, and a single condi clear will wipe it (and any other bleeds you’ve applied) out even with the buff
• Double the cripple time on Savage Leap, but otherwise leave it as a great mobility skill
• Some sort of condi load to Final Thrust, probably involving Torment. Ideally, double the Torment when the target is below 50%
• Improve the mechanic on Impale/Rip so that both are more usable (increased distance on Rip and toned down cast animation on Impale, perhaps)

The above would put the sword in the middle of the road for power, decent (but not crazy) condi damage, and a very good overall hybrid weapon with good utility (mobility, block, and soft cc)

daw.4923:

babazhook.6805:

I use sword in a power build and the damage fine .

Sword off hand might need a tuning and savage leap a slight lowering of activation time but the weapon works fine with power. ( I use sw/shield). .5 seconds active time reasonable for savage leap given this a low ICD skill.

The bleeds off old style savage flurry are not weak. They can be harder to land against enemies that break the Immob effect but you can generaly get at least SOME of these off before they do. I would point out in game terms you still damage ahead than if someone dodged your incapcitate as they avoid 100 percent of the latters damage.

If you want Sword to work with the bleeds and achieve a better outcome you should consider traiting arms. Power builds with 0 condition damage can easily generate bleeds well over 1.5k a tick. It might not seem a lot but it a substantial boost to overall damage output. The combo of Precise strikes ,Rending strikes and Bloodlust synergize very well with a sword here, even in a power build. With Blademaster and easy access to fury you get 40 percent crit chance with zero investment in precision.

Off hand sword there nothing wrong with this being Hybrid. It does not have to be either Or. Off hand 4 for riposte the cooldown should drop to 12 base and adren gain on no block go to 8 and it fine. Off hand 4 should have conditions added but it does not have to be a whole pile. 2 more torment is fine as a start on the rip.

dunno about power sword,you shoud try axe,i dont remember criting with sword for 12k in half sec. and aa chain with 12k dps.

The reason I prefer sword over Axe is I prefer Arms line over strength in my build. With sword this affords me a 20 percent crit rate from the get go and in my own build psuhes my crit rate to close to 90 percent all the time. While Axe has greater raw power from the AA , FT hits very hard and with the bleeds a great deal of that AA difference is made up for. FT damage is the same as the Axe burst on targets under 50 percent health.

The AA of sword is more damage to be sure, but given I use shield off hand what gives sword the edge for my purposes in WvW is #2 and #3 compared to axe #2 and #3. Savage leap on a low cooldown via Blademaster is just so nice for gap closing and has been all I needed to finish a pile of people trying to break off from a fight to recover and is also great for cross map movement.

That said I do use Axe MH as well as Mace as I carry every weaponset with me outside longbow and will make these final observations.

The Burst from axe is single target and a single instance as compared to the sword burst being 8 attacks that can hit multiple targets. This means the chances of proccing an Adrenal and or cleansing Ire off a sword burst is usually easier . (flaming fury will hit multiple targets at range)

Added to that I trait my weapons for might on crit in a boon duration build. Discounting cleave using the burst of the sword against a single target I can stack 8 might and have 8 separate chances to proc any other on crit effects that I might have via a sigil whereas the Axe burst can only do this once. Given the burst can in fact cleave and hit multiple targets when compare to the Axe burst , this gives more an edge to sword.

1v1 you are probably better off with AXE but in group fights I tend to like what the burst of the sword can offer.

Choppy.4183:

I’m in favour of sword buffs. Off the top of my head, I think the following would be good:

• +50 power scaling on the sword auto
• Double the bleed stacks on the auto chain, add two bleeds to the third auto, but cut the duration of all of them in half. The reason for this is we have limited condi diversity, which makes us relatively easy to clear, so the short term pressure needs to by increased. Overall condi damage from a full autochain (if left uncleared) would thus be increased by 33%
• Double or even triple the bleed duration on Flurry. It’s not worth channeling beyond the immob atm, it’s a self-root, and a single condi clear will wipe it (and any other bleeds you’ve applied) out even with the buff
• Double the cripple time on Savage Leap, but otherwise leave it as a great mobility skill
• Some sort of condi load to Final Thrust, probably involving Torment. Ideally, double the Torment when the target is below 50%
• Improve the mechanic on Impale/Rip so that both are more usable (increased distance on Rip and toned down cast animation on Impale, perhaps)

The above would put the sword in the middle of the road for power, decent (but not crazy) condi damage, and a very good overall hybrid weapon with good utility (mobility, block, and soft cc)

I do not think bleeds needed to be added to the auto at all. While true they can be cleansed with there being limited sources of condition types available , the bleeds can be applied over and over again at will. Added to that if you do go into Arms you can get more bleeds added along with some nice Vuln stacking. Both of these have the chance to be applied on every single attack.

The fact is you WILL have a bleeds on your target no matter how many times the target cleanses unless you stop attacking which also means that when in arms you always get that 5 percent damage boost.

babazhook.6805:

I do not think bleeds needed to be added to the auto at all. While true they can be cleansed with there being limited sources of condition types available , the bleeds can be applied over and over again at will. Added to that if you do go into Arms you can get more bleeds added along with some nice Vuln stacking. Both of these have the chance to be applied on every single attack.

The fact is you WILL have a bleeds on your target no matter how many times the target cleanses unless you stop attacking which also means that when in arms you always get that 5 percent damage boost.

Yeah, I tossed the extra bleeds on the third attack just because I find the bleed application on only 2/3 of the chain annoying. If you take that away and leave the other change to auto, the boost to condi damage from the entire chain is just whatever additional bleed gets in before you’d normally get cleared. If not cleared in either case, there’d be zero net increase. That might be sufficient, I’m not sure… it’s not powerful relative to the rest of the game, mind you.

While, yes, you’ll always have bleeds for the purposes of the extra power damage and crit chance, it’s not awesome for dps when your target can more or less kill your condi damage with light condi clear. It would be a different story if we had better condi diversity, but we don’t.

Choppy.4183:

babazhook.6805:

I do not think bleeds needed to be added to the auto at all. While true they can be cleansed with there being limited sources of condition types available , the bleeds can be applied over and over again at will. Added to that if you do go into Arms you can get more bleeds added along with some nice Vuln stacking. Both of these have the chance to be applied on every single attack.

The fact is you WILL have a bleeds on your target no matter how many times the target cleanses unless you stop attacking which also means that when in arms you always get that 5 percent damage boost.

Yeah, I tossed the extra bleeds on the third attack just because I find the bleed application on only 2/3 of the chain annoying. If you take that away and leave the other change to auto, the boost to condi damage from the entire chain is just whatever additional bleed gets in before you’d normally get cleared. If not cleared in either case, there’d be zero net increase. That might be sufficient, I’m not sure… it’s not powerful relative to the rest of the game, mind you.

While, yes, you’ll always have bleeds for the purposes of the extra power damage and crit chance, it’s not awesome for dps when your target can more or less kill your condi damage with light condi clear. It would be a different story if we had better condi diversity, but we don’t.

Let us put it this way. I play all manner of builds cross all professions including condition builds. I do not think it wise to add more STACKS of a condition to a single attack via the AA. Thief dagger has one stack in the enitre chaint. Thief pistol has one stack per attack unless one stealths up first for a sneak attack which acts as a limiter. I know full well that increasing the NUMBER of stacks on thief would be too much and I think the same applies to warrior.

Now back to that clear and the warrior using bleed via a sword. About 6 months back I rejigged my build to go power warrior using sword/shield and taking the ARMS line. It was not my intent to use it for bleeds or condition damage when I did so but rather to leverage signet mastery into allowing close to 100 percent crit rate at all times without having to use precision in my gear.

I was quite suprised at the damage ticks I got off the bleeds and burns in sword when I went that route. I have 0 condition damage in the build but comboing with might stacks and the GM trait adder you can get significant bleed ticks and keep applying them over and over without having to rely on cover conditions. Added to that the line allows Vuln stacking via rending strikes which adds to both power and condition damage.

You then go down to your Zerker line and get Always angry which also adds to the Power and condition ticks.

In real game terms , even with cleansing and using a power build there is a significant increase in damage output from those ticks even as you do your power damage. Cover conditions are really not needed.

babazhook.6805:

Let us put it this way. I play all manner of builds cross all professions including condition builds. I do not think it wise to add more STACKS of a condition to a single attack via the AA. Thief dagger has one stack in the enitre chaint. Thief pistol has one stack per attack unless one stealths up first for a sneak attack which acts as a limiter. I know full well that increasing the NUMBER of stacks on thief would be too much and I think the same applies to warrior.

Now back to that clear and the warrior using bleed via a sword. About 6 months back I rejigged my build to go power warrior using sword/shield and taking the ARMS line. It was not my intent to use it for bleeds or condition damage when I did so but rather to leverage signet mastery into allowing close to 100 percent crit rate at all times without having to use precision in my gear.

I was quite suprised at the damage ticks I got off the bleeds and burns in sword when I went that route. I have 0 condition damage in the build but comboing with might stacks and the GM trait adder you can get significant bleed ticks and keep applying them over and over without having to rely on cover conditions. Added to that the line allows Vuln stacking via rending strikes which adds to both power and condition damage.

You then go down to your Zerker line and get Always angry which also adds to the Power and condition ticks.

In real game terms , even with cleansing and using a power build there is a significant increase in damage output from those ticks even as you do your power damage. Cover conditions are really not needed.

Like I said, it was only the equivalent of adding one extra stack (of the current duration) to the chain where there wasn’t one currently. I then doubled the stacks but cut the durations in half.

By comparison, thief (and only because you brought it up) applies a bleed with every pistol auto that’s 1/2 the duration of the bleed currently on the first two warrior sword autos. When factoring the gap on the warrior sword auto chain, the total applied bleeds by the pistol auto is 2/3 what the warrior sword does, but the warrior bleeds are cleared more easily (longer duration at less frequent application) and you have to be in melee to apply it.

Keeping all of my proposed bleed buffs to the auto chain, the warrior sword would put out twice the bleed pressure as the thief pistol auto (not counting the stealth burst), but only from melee (vs 900 range). It’s about in inline with what Anet’s done with damage balancing range vs melee elsewhere.

That’s before we get into the much higher condi diversity and application frequency that thief has generally, even if all of my proposed buffs to warrior got implemented. But, again, I’m only comparing to thief because you brought it up.

And I agree that you can get some decent ticks out of the sword auto, but if you look at your combat log on a normal fight, averaging out the bleeds and compare it to forgone damage from using something like axe or greatsword, it comes out considerably lower. It’s easy to underestimate the bleeds, but it’s actually not that high when you consider the periodic cleanses that wipe them out pretty easily. Also, getting a few 1k ticks in a row isn’t going to offset that a power warrior can do an extra 2k+ per auto (when factoring in crits and over the course of the chains).

I experimented with a gs/s+s build a while back that used mostly zerk gear, but (iirc) sinister swords and maybe a couple of sinister trinkets. The main concept was to generate tonnes of might (and some vuln) to get respectable power and condi damage. It worked ok, and gave me options when facing opponents who were more vulnerable to one damage type or another, but it was ultimately sub-optimal except in niche circumstances. Great mobility though, and reasonably fun,but I shelved it after about two weeks of play time.

Point being, I see plenty of room to buff both the power and the condi of warrior sword. I’m not married to the idea of adding the bleed to the third auto, but I don’t think it would be overpowered either given it’s just the equivalent of adding one of the current bleeds from the other two autos.

Part of the problem in boosting the damage on the AA from sword is as it gets closer to the other sets , there becomes less reason for the other sets. I really do not think there a problem with sword 1 2 and 3 outside maybe a slight tweak in activation time on savage leap.

Damage wise the set works fine main hand.

If you just want raw power damage stick to axe. If you want decent + that a mix of condition and power while offering utility then sword works very well. (the fluidity and feel of sword main may be an issue but that seems to exist across a number of classes with that as Main hand)

babazhook.6805:

Part of the problem in boosting the damage on the AA from sword is as it gets closer to the other sets , there becomes less reason for the other sets. I really do not think there a problem with sword 1 2 and 3 outside maybe a slight tweak in activation time on savage leap.

Damage wise the set works fine main hand.

If you just want raw power damage stick to axe. If you want decent + that a mix of condition and power while offering utility then sword works very well. (the fluidity and feel of sword main may be an issue but that seems to exist across a number of classes with that as Main hand)

With what I proposed, sword would still have its niche. Axe would remain the highest melee power dps/spike, gs would come in second but with the best mobility and best aoe spike. Sword would still be third or fourth (of four) for melee power damage, but would be a great hybrid weapon with very good mobility.

I used mainland sword (with gs) as my primary roaming set from about July 2015 until a few months ago, and I still use it when it suits me. I know it can work well, but that doesn’t mean it couldn’t do with some buffs to keep up with the rest of the game.

daw.4923:

ALL weapons on war are joke now,they are way too outdated,lack utility and half of them are useless.

Pretty much sums it all up lol.
We can’t just fiddle with the damage values, we have to have redesigns at this point.

Greatsword and rifle are really the only weapons I feel can function in the current meta. Adding diffferent/more conditions or evades or little stuff to these weapons is enough to maintain their relevance.
The same cannot be said for the other weapons…..hammer is probably the poster child for just how outdated some weapons have become since release.

flaming flurry sucks lol, its so hard to hit ppl that are not even 360 range away and moving slightly to the left

Choppy.4183:

babazhook.6805:

Part of the problem in boosting the damage on the AA from sword is as it gets closer to the other sets , there becomes less reason for the other sets. I really do not think there a problem with sword 1 2 and 3 outside maybe a slight tweak in activation time on savage leap.

Damage wise the set works fine main hand.

If you just want raw power damage stick to axe. If you want decent + that a mix of condition and power while offering utility then sword works very well. (the fluidity and feel of sword main may be an issue but that seems to exist across a number of classes with that as Main hand)

With what I proposed, sword would still have its niche. Axe would remain the highest melee power dps/spike, gs would come in second but with the best mobility and best aoe spike. Sword would still be third or fourth (of four) for melee power damage, but would be a great hybrid weapon with very good mobility.

I used mainland sword (with gs) as my primary roaming set from about July 2015 until a few months ago, and I still use it when it suits me. I know it can work well, but that doesn’t mean it couldn’t do with some buffs to keep up with the rest of the game.

I am not saying sword does not need buffs,. I am saying they have to focus those on off hand for 5 and 6, with the others being very close to where they should be.