Guild Wars 2

I don’t see many warriors using condition specs in Spvp often. It is either glass cannons or in between.

The issue is that too many abilities can remove their condition, or turn them into boons. This makes condition warriors less appealing to play although players would not mind playing them if it actually can bring something into the table besides only 1 condition dot.

Since warriors only have 1 condition dot mechanic maybe it should be tougher to remove than the other classes. They can hot fix it into a trait in the arms tree like Deep cuts. Bleeds can last longer by 50% and bleeds cannot be remove until 5 seconds later since a few classes can remove condition passively every 3 seconds or 10. If possible maybe a little buff towards their bleed dot damage.

For the long bow weapon I think they need a reduce cool down ability trait like the other weapons. It can be hot fix into burning arrows and can be rename to Archery specialist.

These are just my thoughts to give condition warriors some flavor since they are the least played specs among them all.

How about instead…you decrease the duration of Warrior Bleeds?

Make it so they have 2 kinds of bleeds: small and big. The small persist like they do now and maybe do less damage while the big cause lots of damage but last for a very short time (perhaps only for 3 tics).

Ultimately, you’ll stack fewer bleeds (without some sort of condition duration/bleed duration +stat) but do more damage in a shorter time. Basically, by the time someone goes to remove the bleeds, the big ones have already done their harm and only the small ones are around to blow your cleanses on.

To clarify: Warriors have two damageconditions: Bleed and Burn

I play Conditionwarrior in PvE however I wouldnt mind if Cond gets a buff. You have to wait for the damage to come while critdamage delivers the same damage instantly… so shouldnt Conditions be slightly more powerfull to justify the duration?

In most dungeons stuff has to Die right now, damage that needs to tick seems contraproductive here so I think cond should be slightly stronger.

I use Longbow… in fact its my favorite weapon to use. I dont think that the bow needs a -CD trait because the skillsets fit perfectly together imo. lowering cds would also be too OP if you can apply 3 stacks of might via burst blast faster and more often. Ehat I do like to see is a damageincrease or maybe a chance to apply burning with the autoattack.

Can’t the autoattack already apply burning? Just lay down your burn field and shoot through it…

or how about scale the bleed stacks according to how many people are around you, people argue that so many bleeds will kill way to fast….. i think not because of the massive health on bosses……and even if it did kill alil to quick……scale the health accordingly so it still takes 5-10 minutes to down said boss, all i know is just because others are using bleeds, my damage shouldnt be penalized for it.

Leo G.4501:

How about instead…you decrease the duration of Warrior Bleeds?

Make it so they have 2 kinds of bleeds: small and big. The small persist like they do now and maybe do less damage while the big cause lots of damage but last for a very short time (perhaps only for 3 tics).

Ultimately, you’ll stack fewer bleeds (without some sort of condition duration/bleed duration +stat) but do more damage in a shorter time. Basically, by the time someone goes to remove the bleeds, the big ones have already done their harm and only the small ones are around to blow your cleanses on.

Sounds like a cool mechanic small bleeds dot does the normal bleeds damage and big does more dot damage, but the timer is extremely short.

As for the long bow stepping into the field of fire to do fire arrows. How about the trait burning arrows does exactly as it says doing fire damage while auto attacking and it does 10% more damage to flame targets. Only those who wants to use a long bow and have fire arrows coming from their auto attacks have to spec into the trait. This can make the long bow weapon even more worthwhile to use since dual shots damage doesn’t do as much damage as much as the rifle auto attack which can stack bleeds as well.

My thoughts:
The main issue isn’t the duration, or damage of our conditions so much as it is other mechanical failings. Look at the other classes that can condition damage well and you’ll notice one of the biggest things they have going for them: Number of condition types available. This basically allows them to act as a buffer for each other when it comes to the rampant condition removal being thrown around, much of it passive from the other classes (something warriors could use on our healing signet for instance).

Take an engi, ranger or necro for example: Quick access to bleeds, burns, AND poisons. The poison is a big one btw because of how it reduces healing AND deals damage. It’s one of the biggest things to aid condi builds going for them (confusion mesmers don’t need it because of the way confusion works, punishing the player for taking any action with a big damage hit compared to the other condis). Warriors have access to a few conditions, but they are spread out amongst multiple MH weapons and traits, they also completely lack poison in order to make their conditions matter.

Another thing is the speed of application. Unicorn and pistol dagger thieves for instance can bleed stack in large doses exceedingly fast. They can also reapply these large stacks almost at will which makes it very hard for the condi removal to keep up. Rangers, engis and necros all do this as well. Warriors though take a significant “ramp up” time to get those condi’s going and reapplied compared to the others.

Another issue is the mitigation factor. If you ignore the ranged condi classes for a moment, because ranged application is far superior to melee and look at the tools a thief has for example while being in someone’s face and applying their conditions:

Unicorn: Evasion DURING the attack. This is huge. This allows them a safety buffer during the time it takes to set up their bleeds before utilizing their other defensive maneuvers to survive the counter assault by the enemy.

Pistol/Dagger: I know it’s ranged, but still they have access to a teleport and pbaoe blind field. Warriors have a leap, but unlike the teleport it’s a telegraphed one-way trip before going on CD. Also, no blind.

Then there are the bugs on warrior condi weapons such as longbow, and burning either not applying properly or the duration being less than what it should be. There’s also the issue of poor design with something like fan of flames for instance (longbow 2)

Currently you have to use it like a shotgun, point blank, for it to matter. Also each of the three arrows is supposed to apply 2 seconds of burn duration for a total of 6 if they all hit, currently they only apply 1 second. That’s a 50% bug-based-nerf. That’s huge. However the arc itself is crap. If it’s not point blank you’re going to hit with the middle arrow while the other two go off in a ridiculous spread.

My fix/compromise:
Keep the 1 second burn duration per arrow, but add 2 more arrows in between the current left and right projectiles. This means if you hit 1 person with all 5 arrows it’s still not the 6 second duration that it should be currently, but the fan itself will be a much more practical spread allowing you to shoot it into the forward lines of battle and have a better chance of connecting with more than 1 target.

For the sword MH:
Place the cripple on the savage leap (sword 2 attack) when it hits. Make the sword 3 either:
Blind on hit (Go for the eyes/Blinding slash, w/e) for a mitigation/interrupt utility
Evade on attack and apply another bleed stack OR poison (Festering wound, w/e)

(look at the sword/dagger thieves or sword ranger attacks for example of this type of evading sword attack)

• I like some of the other suggestions as well with the dual bleed “sizes” and durations, possibly give them 2 seperate condi icons and rename the “big/short” bleed “hemmorage” or something. Would give a buffer for condi removal and also would help with that whole “bleed caps at 25 stack, lol on you!” crap. the longbow “burning arrows” suggestion above is nice as well.

TLDR- Warrior condi spec has some basic design flaws imo where it lacks both in condi types available, poison being a very important one, speed of application and damage mitigation besides “block with face”. Bugs and ability functional flaws hinder the longbow as well.

personal gripe – The longbow should friggin’ have 1200 range DEFAULT instead of having to waste a trait for it. Make that trait better on it’s own to be worth taking besides the punishment feel of taking it just to get basic “LONGbow” functionality out of the darn weapon in the first place

A thief can get their bleeds stack up to 20 with caltdrop trait quicker than my flurry and their duration last longer than ours. staying at 20 stacks . It is quite frustrating how they design warriors condition spec without seeing its flaws and counters in pvp.

The only problem with warrior bleeds is that we have no way to apply a large stack quickly, outside of a full adrenaline Flurry. But all of the condition weapons build adrenaline slow as kitten.

If longbow applied a bleed along with the burn (attack #2 and burst), I’d call warrior conditions complete. This could even be part of one of the longbow traits

Thief condition is a very durable build, but it’s not that hard to stay out of caltops. It’s the pistol stealth attack that’s nice (5 stacks ranged, 4s duration). That’s enough to force condition removal. It’s not OP though, you counter it the same way as any offhand dagger build (dodge/outrun/CC CnD) and any condition build (condition removal)

I’m with bettadenu. The last thing the warriors need is a buff. You should just be happy where you are.

Ethics.4519:

I’m with bettadenu. The last thing the warriors need is a buff. You should just be happy where you are.

I’m not sure where you can say warriors are balance or what spec is balance because overall the results goes between balance, unbalance and broken depending on what spec you are.

I know for sure condition warriors using swords have a difficulty applying their bleeds because it can be removed easily since it’s our only condition we can apply while others classes have 2 conditions or 3 to apply on one single target. Long bow has its own flaws as well because for you to apply a condition the players must stay in the combustive shot aoe area or get hit by fan of fire which it’s duration only last 2 seconds 1/2.

I think long bow auto attack should apply fire arrows when you spec into the trait burning arrows instead of benefiting off a elementalist using firewall or standing in combustive shot. This will make Longbow more worthwhile to play in pvp and in pve making an condition warrior smile.

Rifle weapon is fine where it’s at because it can treat as condition spec or glass cannon spec and they also get a bonus trait to reduce their cool downs.

The sword is actually a hybrid weapon. It gets about 50/50 direct damage and condition damage. Toughness/Prec/CD is not maximizing the sword’s potential. If they buff Con Damage, they need to lower the sword’s direct damage.

Shifu.4321:

The sword is actually a hybrid weapon. It gets about 50/50 direct damage and condition damage. Toughness/Prec/CD is not maximizing the sword’s potential. If they buff Con Damage, they need to lower the sword’s direct damage.

That’s like saying death blossom should receive a nerf or any classes that can apply direct damage and condition. However sword direct damage isn’t as strong as great swords or axes. If anything it’s on par with maces or about as close.

IIRC swords have the highest direct damage of any condition weapon of any class right? It should be weaker than GS and axe, since they don’t do anything but direct damage. IMO the damage isn’t really the problem, but the easy removal of conditions.

Spifnar.4712:

If longbow applied a bleed along with the burn (attack #2 and burst), I’d call warrior conditions complete.

Sigil of Earth + 50% Bleed Duration + 33% Chance to Bleed on Crit = ~6-7 steady stacks of bleeds. Auto attack gives two chances, fan of fire three, and while your combo field pulses direct damage. 3 Krait Runes & 3 Affliction Runes +20 Points into condition duration will give you 100% duration on your bleeds. Sigil has a 2 second internal cooldown, but the chance to bleed on crit does not.

Longbow also has a double 100% projectile finisher with Stronger Bowstrings. That means you can also apply Poison and Confusion in the right group setting.

Shifu.4321:

IIRC swords have the highest direct damage of any condition weapon of any class right? It should be weaker than GS and axe, since they don’t do anything but direct damage. IMO the damage isn’t really the problem, but the easy removal of conditions.

That’s pretty much what my topic is about is how easy it is to remove a condition warrior condition in pvp. That’s why I think a buff like either get a poison condition as Braxxus said or make it where those who spec into the trait deeper cuts. The bleeds can’t be removed until 5 seconds later and this trait can’t be activated again after 10 seconds has passed.

kandolo.2574:

Spifnar.4712:

If longbow applied a bleed along with the burn (attack #2 and burst), I’d call warrior conditions complete.

Sigil of Earth + 50% Bleed Duration + 33% Chance to Bleed on Crit = ~6-7 steady stacks of bleeds. Auto attack gives two chances, fan of fire three, and while your combo field pulses direct damage. 3 Krait Runes & 3 Affliction Runes +20 Points into condition duration will give you 100% duration on your bleeds. Sigil has a 2 second internal cooldown, but the chance to bleed on crit does not.

Longbow also has a double 100% projectile finisher with Stronger Bowstrings. That means you can also apply Poison and Confusion in the right group setting.

I’m confused about the long bow part. What do you mean in the right group setting we can apply poison and confusion?

Brutalistik.6473:

I’m confused about the long bow part. What do you mean in the right group setting we can apply poison and confusion?

There’s a hidden benefit to the Stronger Bowstrings trait. It turns all your Longbow attacks into 100% combo finishers. That means anytime you shoot through a combo field you will apply a brief effect twice (Poison, Confusion, Regeneration, Condition Removal, Burning, Blindness, Lifesteal, Chill).

Without the trait you only have a 20% chance of applying the effect.

Braxxus.2904:

My thoughts:
The main issue isn’t the duration, or damage of our conditions so much as it is other mechanical failings. Look at the other classes that can condition damage well and you’ll notice one of the biggest things they have going for them: Number of condition types available. This basically allows them to act as a buffer for each other when it comes to the rampant condition removal being thrown around, much of it passive from the other classes (something warriors could use on our healing signet for instance).

Take an engi, ranger or necro for example: Quick access to bleeds, burns, AND poisons. The poison is a big one btw because of how it reduces healing AND deals damage. It’s one of the biggest things to aid condi builds going for them (confusion mesmers don’t need it because of the way confusion works, punishing the player for taking any action with a big damage hit compared to the other condis). Warriors have access to a few conditions, but they are spread out amongst multiple MH weapons and traits, they also completely lack poison in order to make their conditions matter.

TLDR- Warrior condi spec has some basic design flaws imo where it lacks both in condi types available, poison being a very important one, speed of application and damage mitigation besides “block with face”. Bugs and ability functional flaws hinder the longbow as well.

This post pretty much says it all. Although I might add something to the conversation. If you are having an issue with having your conditions cleansed, you might want to consider adding more? Warriors CAN apply confusion, through the distracting strikes trait, and vunrability through a offhand mace #4 ability or through Rending strikes trait. Rending strikes or offhand mace is a reasonable way to get vunrability on a target, along wtih cripple from sword #3 and your opponent needs a full cleanse or 3 removals to get it all off.

Anyone who has played competitve WoW arena knows that you need to stack less meaningful conditions/bonuses to eat your opponents cleansing before they get to your more valueable ability.

Something to consider. And for the record I don’t think it’s a good idea to give warriors access to poision. Frankly our class is pretty well off. we are about 75-80% of where we should be now, only lacking in some bug fixes and build varity. We don’t have any CORE issues, like other classes.