Guild Wars 2

Hey guys,

I’m new to the warrior community. I have an 80 guardian which I play frequently and I switch between support/defense and offensive/support and a thief at 80 (shelved till Anet decides how to balance and make them fun).

Anyways, I was looking at the majority of the boons that the warrior gives and they seem pretty offensive in opposite aspect to guardians. I was wondering if anyone has tried to create a boon/shouts (vigorous shouts) build for spike healing and offensive support. Unfortunately, the class lacks multiple sources to buff others but anyone rocking 2.4k heals is pretty helpful in my opinion. Weapons are hammer for CC, sword+horn for aoe weakness, cripple (+1 second immobilize), vigor, swiftness, and mobility.

At 1500 healing at level 80: 40 + 1152 + 1200 = 2392 per shout.
Also heals nearby allies.

Or would a banner warrior be more supportive with all banners instead of burst healing from shouts?

Utilities(gems used to reach 1500 healing):
http://gw2skills.net/editor/?fIAQFASngOk8YzDSBxEhAApwKuOFUSVwu0DxQLNA;TwAgzyvEMJ9S1kiJquMeJ8yqkrLpSA

Build/Gear:
http://gw2buildcraft.com/calculator/warrior/?8|2.1k.h1f|c.1k.h1f.g.1k.h6|1k.71g.1k.71g.1k.71h.1k.71h.1k.711.1k.711|1k.68.1k.68.1k.68.1k.68.1k.68.1c.68|0.a4.k2a.u18c.a6|2m.1|e

ArtemisEntreri.4138:

Hey guys,

I’m new to the warrior community. I have an 80 guardian which I play frequently and I switch between support/defense and offensive/support and a thief at 80 (shelved till Anet decides how to balance and make them fun).

Anyways, I was looking at the majority of the boons that the warrior gives and they seem pretty offensive in opposite aspect to guardians. I was wondering if anyone has tried to create a boon/shouts (vigorous shouts) build for spike healing and offensive support. Unfortunately, the class lacks multiple sources to buff others but anyone rocking 2.4k heals is pretty helpful in my opinion. Weapons are hammer for CC, sword+horn for aoe weakness, cripple (+1 second immobilize), vigor, swiftness, and mobility.

At 1500 healing at level 80: 40 + 1152 + 1200 = 2392 per shout.
Also heals nearby allies.

Or would a banner warrior be more supportive with all banners instead of burst healing from shouts?

Utilities(gems used to reach 1500 healing):
http://gw2skills.net/editor/?fIAQFASngOk8YzDSBxEhAApwKuOFUSVwu0DxQLNA;TwAgzyvEMJ9S1kiJquMeJ8yqkrLpSA

Build/Gear:
http://gw2buildcraft.com/calculator/warrior/?8|2.1k.h1f|c.1k.h1f.g.1k.h6|1k.71g.1k.71g.1k.71h.1k.71h.1k.711.1k.711|1k.68.1k.68.1k.68.1k.68.1k.68.1c.68|0.a4.k2a.u18c.a6|2m.1|e

The problem is, it does less healing and damage then guardian hammer build, has no sustain besides burst healing and little to no damage.

The boons it gives are “ok.” but thats just it, they are “ok.” you could just run 2 warriors with no points in the vitality tree and both have “FGJ” and have perma fury for the group the entire time.

The healing is “ok.” but unless you stack healing power (which is warriors weakest stat.) the heals are only about 1.1k.

A guardian hammer build stacking Knights/Valkyrie gear can put out more healing then that and have all the damage with much better boons like protection and regeneration and vigor for the party.

As far as fun factor, its really not fun, your running in melee, doing little to no damage and providing “mediocre” support at best, if the group has a support ele or guardian you are easily replaced.

With traits and boons and 1500 healing power, Guardians can heal for 620 (I did the math using 1500 hp, with all the boons and healing traits I could use for my build.) every second, plus they have perma vigor and perma protection. Not only that, with Empowering Might, Altruistic healing has a chance to grant even more healing to the guardian, and if anyone stands in that circle and gains protection as well, it could buff the guardians heals up to about 1050ish per second, depending on how coordinated the group is.

That’s unfortunate that they don’t give warriors any options other than to dps (various ways though). Makes me think Ele’s have it made…

Try it out. Warriors may not be as strong as some people think, but they sure are fun to play with.

The problem of full-out healing power builds on Warriors is they make you hit like a full support Guardian with just 1% of what he gives.
You cannot replace a Guardian where it’s really needed on that build, and if you have a Guardian then your healing is not really needed (but your DPS really really is).

Anet needs to find a way to make support Warriors useful.
For instance vigorous shouts could give 3s of protection and regen (4s due to boon duration from tactics tree).
That would give a lot of survivability to your team compared to meaningless heals shout give now.

HannaDeFreitas.4236:

The problem of full-out healing power builds on Warriors is they make you hit like a full support Guardian with just 1% of what he gives.
You cannot replace a Guardian where it’s really needed on that build, and if you have a Guardian then your healing is not really needed (but your DPS really really is).

Anet needs to find a way to make support Warriors useful.
For instance vigorous shouts could give 3s of protection and regen (4s due to boon duration from tactics tree).
That would give a lot of survivability to your team compared to meaningless heals shout give now.

Well, honestly, I don’t want to replace what the guardian can do. I would be happy to let them keep defensive boons if warriors could have more options to give offensive boons. Might, Fury, and swiftness is about all I can see them giving people that is considered offensive. Vigor from horn is nice but that’s about it. If anet gives us more defensive options than they have to give more offensive options to guardians which would be great lol (80 guardian main). The only problem I see with this is you’re now combining class characteristics and that defeats the purpose of the two separate classes.

I would go to a full banner build if the bonuses will a little more attractive.

If it was more like 200 precision and 15% crit damage, it would then be more worth it. 90 precision is like maybe 4.3% crit chance which is not significant enough to turn the tide. Instead of stats it should just give solid stats. 10% crit chance 20% crit damage within proximity of banner (would make banners a good target for the enemy but who targets banners because they feel threatened?). Examples:

Banners have a 600 radius (900 with traits) and have 5,000 health or 65 seconds (at 80).
Banner of Tactics: 250 Condition damage + 20% condition duration.
Banner of Discipline: 210 precision, 15% crit damage
Banner of Strength: 250 Power, 250 vitality
Banner of Defense: Removed.

Battle Standard is tricky. It’s hard to fathom how to make this better since it offers boons. It lasts 65 seconds on a 4 min cool down. My idea is to make it worth picking up.

Place a battle standard that revives downed allies and grants Fury and Might to allies as long as it is being held (600). Lasts 90 seconds. Cooldown 240 seconds. 10,000 health. Only usable by the warrior. Buffs last 3 seconds before next pulse(3 seconds). While holding takes advantage of Inspiring Battle Standard Trait giving Regen (130 + 0.125 * Healing Power per second) and Inspiring Banners.

Skill / Recharge(seconds) / Description

Stab / .5 / Stab at foes with your banner hitting three nearby targets (range 200) and inflicting wounds. (Bleeding 3 stacks at 10 seconds)
Call Taunt! / 15 / Taunt five nearby enemies causing weakness (7s) and chill (3s). (400 radius).
Call Charge! / 30 / Inspire nearby allies granting stability for 10 seconds as you charge forward (600 range).
Call Route! / 20 / Grant Swiftness for 15 seconds and cause cripple for 7 seconds to all enemies.
Bolster Morale / 30 / Plant your banner in the ground and give vigor to your allies for 10 seconds as you engage the fight.

Could be toned down if any seems outrageous but I tried to try keep in mind what other utilities offer similar bonuses. The trick is the warrior has to take himself out of the fight to might and fury bonuses to his allies. He can stab at enemies but the point is to keep calling orders out to benefit your team. He can stab enemies with a 200 range (slightly longer than melee), he can debuff nearby enemies while granting bonuses for his allies while sacrificing his damage. He can jump in and fight but his allies will lose the might and fury buffs when they fall off.

You have to make it worth while to cause a warrior to want to drop his weapon to support his allies but you can’t make it too outrageous so that is my dilemma.

Sorry for wall of text.

ArtemisEntreri.4138:

HannaDeFreitas.4236:

The problem of full-out healing power builds on Warriors is they make you hit like a full support Guardian with just 1% of what he gives.
You cannot replace a Guardian where it’s really needed on that build, and if you have a Guardian then your healing is not really needed (but your DPS really really is).

Anet needs to find a way to make support Warriors useful.
For instance vigorous shouts could give 3s of protection and regen (4s due to boon duration from tactics tree).
That would give a lot of survivability to your team compared to meaningless heals shout give now.

Well, honestly, I don’t want to replace what the guardian can do. I would be happy to let them keep defensive boons if warriors could have more options to give offensive boons. Might, Fury, and swiftness is about all I can see them giving people that is considered offensive. Vigor from horn is nice but that’s about it. If anet gives us more defensive options than they have to give more offensive options to guardians which would be great lol (80 guardian main). The only problem I see with this is you’re now combining class characteristics and that defeats the purpose of the two separate classes.

I would go to a full banner build if the bonuses will a little more attractive.

If it was more like 200 precision and 15% crit damage, it would then be more worth it. 90 precision is like maybe 4.3% crit chance which is not significant enough to turn the tide. Instead of stats it should just give solid stats. 10% crit chance 20% crit damage within proximity of banner (would make banners a good target for the enemy but who targets banners because they feel threatened?). Examples:

Banners have a 600 radius (900 with traits) and have 5,000 health or 65 seconds (at 80).
Banner of Tactics: 250 Condition damage + 20% condition duration.
Banner of Discipline: 210 precision, 15% crit damage
Banner of Strength: 250 Power, 250 vitality
Banner of Defense: Removed.

Battle Standard is tricky. It’s hard to fathom how to make this better since it offers boons. It lasts 65 seconds on a 4 min cool down. My idea is to make it worth picking up.

Place a battle standard that revives downed allies and grants Fury and Might to allies as long as it is being held (600). Lasts 90 seconds. Cooldown 240 seconds. 10,000 health. Only usable by the warrior. Buffs last 3 seconds before next pulse(3 seconds). While holding takes advantage of Inspiring Battle Standard Trait giving Regen (130 + 0.125 * Healing Power per second) and Inspiring Banners.

Skill / Recharge(seconds) / Description

Stab / .5 / Stab at foes with your banner hitting three nearby targets (range 200) and inflicting wounds. (Bleeding 3 stacks at 10 seconds)
Call Taunt! / 15 / Taunt five nearby enemies causing weakness (7s) and chill (3s). (400 radius).
Call Charge! / 30 / Inspire nearby allies granting stability for 10 seconds as you charge forward (600 range).
Call Route! / 20 / Grant Swiftness for 15 seconds and cause cripple for 7 seconds to all enemies.
Bolster Morale / 30 / Plant your banner in the ground and give vigor to your allies for 10 seconds as you engage the fight.

Could be toned down if any seems outrageous but I tried to try keep in mind what other utilities offer similar bonuses. The trick is the warrior has to take himself out of the fight to might and fury bonuses to his allies. He can stab at enemies but the point is to keep calling orders out to benefit your team. He can stab enemies with a 200 range (slightly longer than melee), he can debuff nearby enemies while granting bonuses for his allies while sacrificing his damage. He can jump in and fight but his allies will lose the might and fury buffs when they fall off.

You have to make it worth while to cause a warrior to want to drop his weapon to support his allies but you can’t make it too outrageous so that is my dilemma.

Sorry for wall of text.

The problem with that is, the Guardian can offer all there support without giving up utility slots or being “taken out of the fight.” with full toughness tree they still have +30% Critical Damage and you can just get the precision lost with gear like maint oil and other things to bring your critical up as well as sigils.

http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Master_Maintenance_Oil

Guardians can still bring the hurt specced fully defensive with all toughness gear mixed with valkyries and still heal well, with no healing power.

That is just class difference though.

True. Though I haven’t been able to make a layout of guardian that included 3k armor, 3k attk, 50% crit, 100% crit dmg, and 15k+ health. If I could reach those numbers I wouldn’t want to roll a warrior unless I wanted crazy burst. Sadly, I can’t think of any ideas how to make warriors more interesting and have their own niche.

ArtemisEntreri.4138:

True. Though I haven’t been able to make a layout of guardian that included 3k armor, 3k attk, 50% crit, 100% crit dmg, and 15k+ health. If I could reach those numbers I wouldn’t want to roll a warrior unless I wanted crazy burst. Sadly, I can’t think of any ideas how to make warriors more interesting and have their own niche.

You wanna go for 2.6-2.8k max armor, getting armor after that isn’t really worth it.

ArtemisEntreri.4138:

True. Though I haven’t been able to make a layout of guardian that included 3k armor, 3k attk, 50% crit, 100% crit dmg, and 15k+ health. If I could reach those numbers I wouldn’t want to roll a warrior unless I wanted crazy burst.

There you go.

ArtemisEntreri.4138:

Sadly, I can’t think of any ideas how to make warriors more interesting and have their own niche.

Warrior’s niche is highest DPS/damage and best offensive support, and it’s pretty interesting if played out right (assuming you like that role of course).

HannaDeFreitas.4236:

Warrior’s niche is highest DPS/damage and best offensive support, and it’s pretty interesting if played out right (assuming you like that role of course).

This is what I am trying to discover and build. Sure I can go full GC hammer/GS or some other mixture but I wanted to serve a higher purpose than HULK SMASH!

How would you build a offensive support warrior?

ArtemisEntreri.4138:

This is what I am trying to discover and build. Sure I can go full GC hammer/GS or some other mixture but I wanted to serve a higher purpose than HULK SMASH!

How would you build a offensive support warrior?

A good offensive support set would be a 20/25/0/10/15 including FGJ+Banner of Discipline, Empower allies and switch SoR to Battle Standard for tough fights.
It gives your team 530 precision 175 power 10% crit dmg permanently, along with an AoE rez and Stability when it’s really needed.

I like your approach, I’m trying something similar with mine after the AC finally made me realise how squishy my initial build was.

I think the good thing about shouts/banners is that you can adjust on the fly and change your traits and utility skills how you need them (although i do favor banners in a party)
My suggestions:

- go for full Monk runes, you get a 5% chance to heal when hit on the 4th, and you get Aegis every time you use singnet of rage (or another elite skill if you really want to) 165 healing power

- instead of getting 15% boon duration from that water rune, use Chocolate Omnomberrie Cream (20% boon duration + a whopping 40% magic find when you have boons active)

- boon duration: 30% (trait) + 15% (monk) + 20% (food) = 65% which combined with Signet Mastery means you can have Swiftness, Fury (crit chance plus 20%) and Might 5+ (at least +175 on Power and CD) on constantly (cooldown 48s vs. duration 49 1/2 sec)

- if you’re going for warhorn, I would definetely invest in quick breathing (the faster cooldown again means you can have perma endurance (16s coold down vs. 16 1/2s duration) and you can use both skills to turn a condition into a boon for you and your allies every 16 1/2 sec.

- I would also go for banners instead of shouts, banner of discipline for example then regenerates, grants a healing power buff and gives you 10% more boon duration, giving you a bit more leeway for boon reactivation

- finally I would definitely get rid of the second Sigil of Water as it’s a waste of space (they don’t stack and they both share the same cooldown anyway, which is why you shouldn’t equip two crit hit sigils at the same time) I would go for restoration (heal on kill), water (heal on crit) and Life (stack heal power on kills).

Hey Artemis,

Welcome to being a warrior.

Before i give you my analysis, I wanna say that you pretty much got the idea between the warrior and the guardian. Warrior being more offensive and Guardian defensive. In that breath you also have to understand that a warrior’s playstyle will not be the same as a guardian’s.

Being a support warrior isn’t about healing. That niche is more reserved for guardian’s, elementalist’s, and to a lesser extent engineer’s. A support warrior (as this is the more offensive oriented profession), is meant to increase the dps of the group or decrease the incoming dmg from the opponent. The healing aspect is just a little icing on the cake and that’s why the healing portion isn’t very much.

The tactics traitline is our support traitline. Hammer, Maces, Warhorn and Longbow are our more supportive weapons. Banners and Shouts are our support utilities and this is how they work…

Hammer – Meant for more group oriented fights as there is a lot of splash damage.. Provides permanent weakness when traited. Weakness makes it so the enemy (when not critting) does half dmg and dodges less.

Maces – Same as hammer except meant for smaller scale fights. Faster cooldowns makes it more ideal than the hammer in 1v1 engagements and also has a block and daze so u can avoid the “big” hits from the enemy or interrupt them.

Warhorn – This is our boon generator. When traited can turn our ailments into benefits and because it gets rid of snares, it also ensures that we can get back to the fight quicker…meaning more dps. Also has weakness.

Longbow – This weapon can ensure permanent 6 stacks of might to you and the whole group. 9 stacks if you trait 30 points into tactics and discipline. Also it makes sure that your entire group does more dmg through use of the large burning field. Projectiles cause burning…whirl finishers cause burning bolts..etc.

Banners – Our more pve oriented support utilities. Most warriors do not appreciate how good banners are (for pve). Banners grant 90 stats worth of points to all individual stats. But what people do not realize is that it is 90×5 for the group. So basically 450 stat points to 2 stats, per banner. That’s 900 points worth of stats per banner, assuming 10% crit dmg and 10% boon duration is equivalent to 90 stat points. When you see it like this, you start to appreciate the worth of banners a lot more. However, since those stats are spread out between the team, most warriors cannot see the benefit this has on the dps of the group (because they only see their numbers). Trait them, and they also add permanent regeneration. Because of the way banners work, this basically means you can blanket the battlegroup with a huge “Healing Rain” for the duration of the fight. And this is all before considering what the Warbanner brings to the table.

Shouts – Our more pvp oriented support utilities. Provide minor heals when traited. But also provide boons and debuffs to the enemy. Might and Fury boons. 10% more dmg via vulnerability (On my Mark). Shake it off breaks stuns…ensuring you get back to the fight quicker, and fear me is more defensive for those times when you need a breather.

So you can see from this that the warrior is more dps or anti dps oriented. Although we don’t heal as much as the guardian, it’s because we do not have to. Cuz our very reliable weakness debuff means the enemy’s dps is basically halved and our offensive boons means our dps is increased. So it’s not that guardian or warrior supports better…just different.

Most people, however, will think the guardian supports better simply because they can see the effects more clearly (You can actively see the amount of hp you get healed from a guardian but you cannot really sum up how much dmg you are NOT taking or how much more dmg your group is doing thx to what the warrior is doing).

Sorry for the long post.

TL;DR – Warrior supports more offensively while guardian supports more defensively. Doesn’t mean one or the other is better.

Basicly in groups it means you need to bring a Guardian for melee, otherwise without protection you are kittened in instances.

“Fury” is an awesome Stat, but its basicly giving the group 420 Precision.

Would you rather have 420 Precision, or 1500+ Toughness from a single buff?