Guild Wars 2

The axe as it is now, is a rather poor weapon choice for warriors considering using it as your main weapon.

The axe lacks mobility/cc, useful utility in skills to make them viable and has a bad (not speaking about dmg here!) AA. Let me explain this to you:

First of all, let’s take a short look at the axe skills:

1. Autoattack: Since the patch on 25th of June, the main damage from the autoattack lies in
   it’s last swing. To get to this attack takes around 3.6 seconds by the way.
2. Cyclone Axe: This skill can attack up to 5 enemies in a circle around you and stacks some
   vulnerability on them. Furthermore it’s a whirl finisher.
3. Throw Axe: Throws an axe on your opponent and cripples him. Can only hit 1 enemy.
   This is a projectile finisher.
4. Dual Strike: Hits up to 3 enemies with 2 strikes each. The warrior gains fury
   depending on how many strikes he landed.
5. Whirling Axe: Spin around for about 3 seconds and hit up to five enemies 15 times.
   This skill is a whirl finisher and you can dodge while attacking.
6. Eviscerate: Leap at your enemy and deal massive damage. This is a leap finisher
   and has a range of 300.

Mobility/CC
As it is now:
This is kind of obvious, as axe is not made for these purposes. There is the sword for mobility and the mace for CC is what most people are going to say. So, if these two options are given to other weapons, what does the axe have? Looking at the skills listed above we can see that the axe does not offer any kind of – what I call – “controlling” effects, except the 4 seconds cripple on #3 which only hits a single enemy and can be evaded easily.

What could be done:
There is a third option of such controlling effects and many classed already have it: evade. In my opinion, this could be a nice buff for whirling axe. This skill currently has some nice effects such as the whirl finisher, but the damage is rather unsatisfying.
So why not give this skill some utility and let the warrior evade for 0.75 seconds.
———————————————————————————————————————————————-
Utility in skills
As it is now:
I want to take a look at the skills #3 #4 #5 and F1 here.
#3 offers a single target, projectile finisher cripple. The velocity is slow and often misses against real players who dodge/strife.
#4’s main reason to use is the fury you get. This would be a nice thing, but warrios already have such easy access to fury via traits, utility and elite making the gained fury redundant in most cases.
#5 only shines if you can hit 5 enemies or have some nice combo field beneath you.
In PvE/WvW the damage is otherwise rather lackluster and the only other utility you may find is dodging while attacking.
F1 deals some nice amount of damage (if it hits critical) and is a leap finisher. Unfortunately its range is only 300 and furthermore reduced by cripple/chill and it is a highly telegraphed skill as well, meaning you have to prepare for it with stun/immobilize most of the time.

What could be done:
#3 could need some increased velocity. That alone should be enough for this skill.
Another nice buff would be a 1 second immobilize before crippling, however this can also be achieved by traiting 10 pts into the vitality tree.
#4 This skill…It looks good, it feels good, but there is not much coming around to be honest.
Maybe add a supportive aspect to it and grant half of the fury gained to your team members. Or, as this skill is probably meant to be offensive, just make it unblockable.
#5 This is a highly situational skill in my opinion. It should be used if you have a desired combo field beneath you or if you are surrounded by at least 5 enemies. So why don’t we add another situational use to it. Make it block (or even reflect) projectiles similar to the ranger’s skill where they also gain retaliation and inflict vulnerability, in cost of not being able to move.
F1 is an awesome burst skill, but doesn’t hit that much without preparation. My Suggestions: Increase the range to 600, to make it useful even if you are crippled or add evade frames to the attack, so it can’t be interrupted midair.

Autoattack
As it is now:
Since the patch on the 25th of june, the damage is no more rising steadily towards the end of the chain, but rather have it spike with the last attack. This change made it obviously less attractive for PvP where you often won’t land the last attack, but as I see it, it also has some drawbacks in other situations. Against enemies with low health, you often don’t even get to the end of the chain. Therefore you are contributing less damage despite using an autoattack which fully concentrates on damage and nothing else. It doesn’t have vulnerability, bleed, cripple, weakness or anything like this.
The main reason I think the autoattack is bad, is that you often feel obliged to make it to the last attack to make it an effective autoattack (even then, there seems to be some odd aftercast time after the last attack). Meanwhile, you have some other skills ready and you might want to use them, but it would reset the autoattack, so you don’t.
What I want tosay is, the axe’s #1 doesn’t complement with the rest of the skills.

What could be done:
Make it more responsive.
Balancing the autoattack is always hard, because it’s the most used skill of all 5.
One possibility would be to decrease the time it takes to get to the last attack.
This can be achieved either by increasing the attackspeed (on-hit effects need to be considered!) or by decreasing the amount of hits from 6 to 4 for example.
———————————————————————————————————————————————-
I only looked at these three aspects now, although I know there is more to it, such as synergizing with other weapons, traits and actual differencing between PvE/PvP/WvW.
This is only meant to show the main deficit of axes as I see them compared to our other weapons. I am not saying I want to see all of these changes and make axe an op weapon, these are just a few suggestions to bring it on par with the other weapons.

I wrote this, because lately I haven’t seen many warriors (including myself) running around with axes other than using the standard GS/axe+mace combo for dungeon speedruns.

no real tl;dr here (axe is lackluster and needs some utility)

I prefer to rework axe chain completely and make it 3 hits like every other weapon. A medium dmg fast hitting hits or at least unnerf it.

Cyclone axe should be turned into 1sec evade on 10cd

Throw axe should be a pull on 15cd

Dual strike i have no idea. Maybe add 3sec weakness per hit?

For whirling – buff it damage by 50% in pve/wvw too, and make it reflect projectiles. Add some special buff to actually move faster while channeling

Evi – range 450.

Well axe is the PvE weapon already. Wouldn’t mind it becoming more useful as PvP weapon, but consider that we have a few weapons already that are completely useless outside PvP.

Tom Gore.4035:

Well axe is the PvE weapon already. Wouldn’t mind it becoming more useful as PvP weapon, but consider that we have a few weapons already that are completely useless outside PvP.

Axe offhand inst even a pve weapon..If anything its “look at my cool animations”
Cyclone is used to stack vul but thats about it
Throw axe in pve? Im not sure if i have seen anyone doing that.

Scoobaniec.9561:

Tom Gore.4035:

Well axe is the PvE weapon already. Wouldn’t mind it becoming more useful as PvP weapon, but consider that we have a few weapons already that are completely useless outside PvP.

Axe offhand inst even a pve weapon..If anything its “look at my cool animations”
Cyclone is used to stack vul but thats about it
Throw axe in pve? Im not sure if i have seen anyone doing that.

You’re right about those, but your suggestions were completely over the top and aimed to change another weapon in the warrior’s arsenal useful only in PvP.

The OP’s suggestions were pretty nice, though.

Wasn’t the axe mainhand changed because people noticed that you got more DPS by not using Triple Chop at all? Because if you ask me, people repeating the first two attacks of an autoattack chain sounds like something that should be fixed.

I prefer to rework axe chain completely and make it 3 hits like every other weapon. A medium dmg fast hitting hits or at least unnerf it.

That’s gonna be a tough call. The axe chain takes a lot longer to complete than some other chains (such as sword) and the reason that skills like Triple Chop can have the high damage that they do is because it’s got a channel. Making Double Chop and Triple Chop 1 hit each would either have to come with longer animations reminiscent of Mace auto-attack or a significant nerf to the base damage at the cost of being much faster.

And personally, I like Axe MH because it’s got 6 hits. Throw in Sharpened Axes and Furious and it generates ridiculous amounts of adrenaline on its own.

I don’t mind it in PvE. Don’t really care about the great sword looks either so I don’t mind the axe and I do like the animations. Doesn’t matter what you use in PvE really because it is just PvE.

In WvW, if I’m in a small fight, I like it in main hand because sword is slower and easier for people to dodge. In a zerg, it doesn’t really matter much people are going to be constantly moving from the aoe and often use up their dodges. Small fights, not more than 5-10 people, are different and sword is at a bit more of a disadvantage.

I like how the axe auto attack chain works.

I would like to see skill 2 invulnerablity increased in duration. It is a bit too short to really use that skill.

I do like #3 when I’m trying to chase someone down that thought they could get a way after jumping me.

Axe off hand, I don’t use in PvP. I’d rather use something else in the off hand. The damage offered for #5 is jut not worth the use and other weapons offer better options like stuns or knock downs. For PvE, I would like to see the damage increased for this skill, it really is kind of lack luster.

I like Eviscerate but it is kind of buggish when using. Sometimes it shoots past the target and then kind of flips back and other times it just doesn’t go far, maybe a foot, in both cases I had my target stunned and I had no conditions so I know movement or dodge wasn’t a problem.

Lately I’ve been having quite similar thoughts in regard to some of warrior’s offhand choices and versatility. I am a warrior who highly favors power/crit builds as opposed to the widespread CC hammer/mace wars out there, or the sword and Lbow condition users. Thus, I have difficulty selecting weapons, as I have found Greatsword to be lacking in versatility and usefulness when not running a build focused upon assassination and landing successful 100b’s. I’m far more of a brawler who ups the dps as high as I can take it while remaining respectably survivable. While not really a pro by anyone’s standards, I have a good amount of experience playing warrior, and mained the class through every meta since I started playing the game. Warrior Offhand Axe is a weapon I believe to be in serious need of some rework. Mainhand Axe, in my humble opinion, is a masterful bursting weapon that is in good balanced state, including the Auto-Attack; it does not require tweaking at all. Without further ado:

Dual Strike: This skill is a higher-damage attack that grants fury based on the amount of strikes that connect. It does quite useful damage, gives you a boon, and cleaves. If I had to make a suggestion, it would be that a different boon be granted, perhaps a stack of Might for each foe/strike. Otherwise, it’s a good skill.

Whirling Axe: This brings us to the reason usually cited for why no one seriously brings axe along offhand. It is a long Whirl Finisher, does mediocre damage, and allows you to remain quite mobile while attacking 360 degrees around you. While this can definitely be situationally useful, it is neither versatile nor synergistic enough to warrant its use. The only skill the Warrior can use alone with this is obtained via the Lbow, a weapon that does not work well with what Axe has to offer.

The problems persist, in that the Auto-Attack usually does more damage per second than this skill does, especially in the high-crit builds typical of Axe users. While there is no issue with a skill doing less DPS than the Auto, it brings no advantage over using different skills other than the Whirl Finisher. Additionally, one is almost without exception forced to use an evade when the opponent does as well, since the vast majority of enemies will dodge away from the visually impressive skill, if not simply resorting to CC or setting up their counter-attack underneath your reduced DPS.

While it can be argued that the Offhand Axe is not meant to be used for those engaging in solo or small group play, I would ask, then, why it is equally useless for aoe damage. If one is to be engaging in a large fight, say a 5v5 or a zerg clash, one wishes to do the most amount of damage with the least amount of risk possible. I need not go into the Warrior’s superior alternatives. The weapon is a poor choice indeed to bring to the table. It possesses no inherent defensive measures and makes the caster a more visible target. While a better Whirl Finisher can scarce be found, a Warrior has far better and safer tools at his disposal. I would propose several alterations or buffs to Whirling Axe. Along with all of these suggestions, I submit that the base damage be increased. While other buffs may increase the attractiveness of the skill it will never be seen as quite viable until it meets or possibly exceeds the Auto’s DPS. It doesn’t need to be anything like a mobile Hundred Blades, but it needs to be doing more than the few thousand damage typically seen. A longer cooldown might be in order with some of the following suggestions.

- The first idea that comes to mind is, of course, to make the skill Reflect Projectiles or at least Block them. This is taken rather blatantly from the Ranger’s #5 Axe skill of similar nature, and makes sense, considering the nature of the animation. Coincidentally this is one of the better ideas, as it gives the skill some defensive purpose, blends well with the animation, and allows the primarily close-ranged Axe Warrior a way to combat kiting enemies.

- The second is to give the skill applied Stability for the duration, possibly switched or coupled with Protection, given the difficulty of striking a foe who is spinning sharpened metal so furiously between himself and assailants. This allows for the Axe Warrior to maintain momentum during battle and give himself a defensive bridge between bursts, providing the much-needed survivability he needs against both close and long-ranged foes.

- Lowering condition duration for the duration of the skill. Another defensive measure, this would allow Warriors, typically shut down through application of chills and cripples, to press the assault and bring the pain.

The main philosophy behind most of these is damage mitigation or some sort of defensive measure, that when taken with the increased damage, makes going into a highly visible and vulnerable target worthwhile, and allows the Warrior more versatility for its viable offhand weaponsets.

Same thoughts.
Axe has no CC nor Mobility nor Support and its damage doesn’t include evades like GS does, so why using Axe?
Eviscerate isn’t as great as it used to be, especially when it doesn’t crit.

If it was made to spread more Vuln on mobs and Fury on your team it would be at least PvE worthy.

In PvP Evis is not enough to make Axe worth it, it’s pretty much like Killshot logic, you get one shot, one opportunity, to seize everything you ever wanted, in one moment, would you capture it, or just let it slip? slim shady kinda playstyle, meh.

Don’t make axe easy mode. There are still warriors (predominantly on NA) that are fine with axes as they are. The new patch will make duel axes synergize better with ultra high dps builds not currently employed by the playerbase.

I’d have found it great if the off-hand axe 5 just became like the ranger’s whirling defense. Immobilises you but reflects projectiles, deals damage and I think stacks vuln.

Yea I really don’t want axe to be easy mode that’s the one build that takes skill on warrior.

Offhand Axe does not have to become easy mode, but neither should it remain noob fodder. The problem is that the weapon brings nothing to the table that makes it desirable over other options. I’d advise against a root/reflect, similar to Ranger’s, because unlike Ranger, Warrior’s Axes are melee, and a root would make the weapon dysfunctional with the forward offensive mentality the skills provide.

The skill should still give aoe damage, but needs an increase in the actual damage or a defensive boon such as reflect or damage mitigation to make it desirable.

Rakshael.4361:

Offhand Axe does not have to become easy mode, but neither should it remain noob fodder. The problem is that the weapon brings nothing to the table that makes it desirable over other options. I’d advise against a root/reflect, similar to Ranger’s, because unlike Ranger, Warrior’s Axes are melee, and a root would make the weapon dysfunctional with the forward offensive mentality the skills provide.

The skill should still give aoe damage, but needs an increase in the actual damage or a defensive boon such as reflect or damage mitigation to make it desirable.

Offhand axe is different story, they could add reflect to the 5 and it will become lot stronger but really they don’t need to buff every weapon that will cause them to over buff something and imbalance again.

There are PvE weapons and there are PvP weapons. You think sword, hammer, mace, etc. are any use in PvE? Or any gearset other than Berserker or Assassin?

Just be glad warriors HAVE a PvE option, unlike necromancers.

^ I used sword (power) and mace in pve. Can’t complain about them.

Mace for weakness stack, and block
Sword dmg inst that bad as ppl trying make it to be.

Scoobaniec.9561:

^ I used sword (power) and mace in pve. Can’t complain about them.

Mace for weakness stack, and block
Sword dmg inst that bad as ppl trying make it to be.

I would use Sword in PvE if it wasn’t so utterly boring. Without condi damage, you’re left with auto-attacking and Final Thrust once the mob/boss is down to <50% hp. In comparison, with an Axe I can actually use Cyclone and Eviscerate, which is a lot of fun.

Olba.5376:

Scoobaniec.9561:

^ I used sword (power) and mace in pve. Can’t complain about them.

Mace for weakness stack, and block
Sword dmg inst that bad as ppl trying make it to be.

I would use Sword in PvE if it wasn’t so utterly boring. Without condi damage, you’re left with auto-attacking and Final Thrust once the mob/boss is down to <50% hp. In comparison, with an Axe I can actually use Cyclone and Eviscerate, which is a lot of fun.

True that.. All i was doing is autoattack and afk.

Scoobaniec.9561:

^ I used sword (power) and mace in pve. Can’t complain about them.

Mace for weakness stack, and block
Sword dmg inst that bad as ppl trying make it to be.

Except it is.

Yeah, I would too would either like the entire axe chain reworked into a 3 hit chain, or reverted back to its old consistent damage.

After that I, along with many other people, professions, weapon users want a variety of 2-5 skills. Right now 2, 4, and 5, are all AoEish. 4 is a frontal cleave maybe rework into a better AoE skill, and adding a new 3 skill to hit multiple targets. But making new 2, 4, and 5 skills that focus on single target would be sweet imo, that way off hand axe may become viable in all realms of play.

I do think, Dempsey, that other weapons were intended to be more focused on single-target dps, such as GS and dual swords. It’s quite obvious axes were intended to be the more high-sustain cleave damage weapons. Until CC warriors stop getting all the attention, however, we’re stuck with offhand Mace or Shield instead of Axe. When 3/5 skills are cleave or aoe-based, you can’t redesign the weapon without destroying its purpose.

Sword, I find, is useful as a secondary for Savage Leap’s mobility and whatever utility you throw in offhand. Otherwise, it’s not a weapon I have equipped for fights very often.

For Mainhand Axe, I do agree that Anet is in a bit of a bind when it comes to the Auto. They want it to remain high-damage and quick, but they also don’t want the last hit to be completely ignored because it’s useless. Perhaps a conversion to yet another 3-hit cycle is in order. 3+ seconds is too long to do all your DPS on such a fast crit/power based weapon.

Axe has poor mobility this is true, but its still has good damage its popular for its auto and eviscerate. The weapon is never a poor choice if you want damage o/p over other abilites.

Axe5 combowhirl still broken for now months.

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/support/bugs/VIDEO-Anet-stole-the-pewpews/first#post2608412

One option would be to replace #5 entirely with a new skill. I have an idea:

Reckless Charge: While spinning weapons in a circle around him, the Warrior bursts forward toward a target, ignoring the effects of stuns, cripples, chills, immobilizes, and knockback for the duration (does not remove previously applied conditions). Projectiles are reflected, and the skill is a Whirl Finisher. Will not break previously applied Immobilize or CC. If the Warrior collides with the target, gain Fury for 5 seconds (OR Gain 5 strikes of Adrenaline). If the skill misses, gain Weakness for 5 seconds (OR Lose 5 strikes of Adrenaline).

Duration: 2 1/2 seconds
Cast time: 1/4 seconds
Range: 1000
Damage: 1,200 (x10 over duration) (I’m not a mathematician, these damage numbers are probably terrible, but they’re placeholders to give an idea of how the skill should work)
Cooldown: 30 seconds

Animation: Whirling Axe, slanted forward a bit, rushing forward in a line similar in speed to Rush.

Obviously, the risk-reward portion could be changed, or other ideas implemented. But we do not have to remain cemented into a slight alteration to #5 (or #4, for that matter) for a fix.

I really want to use Axe/Axe. It’s simply not viable in any way compared to Greatsword.

GS auto does vulnerable
2 100b for epic DPS
3 Whirl for damage/evade/mobility
4 Throw for ranged cripple
5 Charge for mobility
F1 The black sheep of the greatsword, a fairly useless skill

Axe auto is just damage, and back-loaded at that
2 Vulnerable and low DPS… waste of a button and time on a non-auto swing
3 Throw is a ranged cripple, slightly worse than GS 4
4 Fury…. useless
5 Whirl for moderate DPS
F1 Great damage but slow and short ranged, it’s difficult to land at times

Axe has a decent button (3), one meh button (5), and two lousy buttons (2/4).

Actually Dand if you use #2 before you start your Axe Auto, you’ll do a few %‘s more DPS, which pays off over time and even more so if you have an ally hitting the enemy as well. Obviously, this skill becomes more and more useful as the amount of enemies grows, since Axes are the aoe melee damage weapons. It’s certainly not lousy if used properly.

Dand.8231:

2 Vulnerable and low DPS… waste of a button and time on a non-auto swing

If your in a party of 5, giving vuln to your allies and boosting their damage for a slight personal DPS loss is completely worth it and never a waste…

I think they need to change 2 things with axes

Main-Hand Axe – Increase Eviscerate range to 450 and shorten the aftercast delay

Off-Hand Axe – Fix the whirl finisher on Whirling Axe

I really miss the CHOP CHOP CHOP CHOP of the old #1 before they changed it, because I felt like a mad butcher on a rampage in the slaughterhouse. It’s just not as fun anymore. It could possibly be reverted as quickness is not as effective as it was before(Axe#1 was like a mobile 100b before)

Make axe #5 the exact same animation as the minion from despicable me 2? Im game.

I use axe/shield in WvW as I’m against mace build. The auto damage this thing pumps out on critical hits is disgusting. I also run with the 33% chance to cause bleed on crit. This thing hurts.
Axe #2 damage needs a tweak and maybe a condition rework as vulnerability isn’t where it needs to be at all.
Axe #3 should immbolise as standard to be honest. However I would love to see the same skill as sword 4/5 (which ever gives torment stacks) until you pull it out. Torment would be interesting however maybe a reapplying cripple and stacking bleed for 5 seconds? Would give us engage time however maybe extend the CD on the ability.

Rakshael.4361:

Actually Dand if you use #2 before you start your Axe Auto, you’ll do a few %‘s more DPS, which pays off over time and even more so if you have an ally hitting the enemy as well. Obviously, this skill becomes more and more useful as the amount of enemies grows, since Axes are the aoe melee damage weapons. It’s certainly not lousy if used properly.

Doing #2 Axe for vul, followed by 1 for DPS, is lower than GS doing the same, #1 for vul, and #2 for DPS.

Only Axe #5 hits more than 3 targets to my knowledge, up to 5. And the times you’ll hit 5 enemies consistently are few are far between.

Delay.6908:

Dand.8231:

2 Vulnerable and low DPS… waste of a button and time on a non-auto swing

If your in a party of 5, giving vuln to your allies and boosting their damage for a slight personal DPS loss is completely worth it and never a waste…

I agree. Giving vulnerable is never a waste of time. And thats why GS is better. It brings vulnerable on its auto instead of a button, and has more personal DPS.

Dand.8231:

Delay.6908:

Dand.8231:

2 Vulnerable and low DPS… waste of a button and time on a non-auto swing

If your in a party of 5, giving vuln to your allies and boosting their damage for a slight personal DPS loss is completely worth it and never a waste…

I agree. Giving vulnerable is never a waste of time. And thats why GS is better. It brings vulnerable on its auto instead of a button, and has more personal DPS.

Except that GS auto is trash dps, so you should be switching in and out of GS and Axe, while you ar eon your axe you apply the vuln and then do your auto, then you go back to GS for the 100b+WW combo and try to do as little auto attacking as possible since it is terribad on GS.

Dand.8231:

Doing #2 Axe for vul, followed by 1 for DPS, is lower than GS doing the same, #1 for vul, and #2 for DPS.

Only Axe #5 hits more than 3 targets to my knowledge, up to 5. And the times you’ll hit 5 enemies consistently are few are far between.

I agree. Giving vulnerable is never a waste of time. And thats why GS is better. It brings vulnerable on its auto instead of a button, and has more personal DPS.

So you’re comparing Axe Auto, which is fantastic, with GS Auto, which is horrible, and Axe #2, which is meant to be used to hit multiple opponents and increase the damage of your auto and allies, with GS #2, which is high burst dps. Anyone else see the lack of logic here? They’re utterly different, and made for diametrically separate purposes. GS is a burst weapon intended for single targets even though it CAN hypothetically hit more; no one ever really hits more than one person in PvP. Axe is aoe dmg in EVERY gametype, even though it’s likewise useful 1v1, and one constantly hits more than one person with its very quick cast time. GS has higher damage output, yeah, but it has absolutely nothing to do with Axe, and certainly not with Offhand Axe, the topic being discussed here.

That’s my point. It doesn’t do enough damage to even warrant taking it as an offhand for PvE, where everything is technically viable.

According to the wiki, where I looked because I double-checked this to make sure I was right, GS has zero vulnerability stacking skills. The only way you’re getting vulnerability on it is through a specific trait, which would work on any other weapon, especially Axe’s fantastic, and faster, mainhand Auto. I know because I use it. In fact, using that trait with Axe stacks MORE vulnerability for even MORE great damage that isn’t reliant on a rooted skill to kill anything.

I don’t mean to condescend or be offensive, Dand, but I don’t think you understand the concept of Warrior Axe. It’s not about straight numbers. Greatsword is a fine weapon to use, and if 100b is what you live, swear, and die by, that’s fine, burst all of those guys down in WvW. Just don’t come in and derail the thread because you don’t prefer it to your zerker build, please.

Rakshael.4361:

GS is a burst weapon intended for single targets even though it CAN hypothetically hit more; no one ever really hits more than one person in PvP.

A) Given how the Forceful Greatsword trait works, more targets = faster might stacking so no … Greatsword is primarily an AoE focused weapon.
B) Hundred Blades is second only to a grenade engineer when “Downed-cleaving” an enemy team so again, AoE focused weapon.

Rakshael.4361:

*According to the wiki, where I looked because I double-checked this to make sure I was right, GS has zero vulnerability stacking skills. *The only way you’re getting vulnerability on it is through a specific trait, which would work on any other weapon, especially Axe’s fantastic, and faster, mainhand Auto.

http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Greatsword_Swing
http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Greatsword_Slice
… would like a word. That’s the auto attack chain btw.

Also, comparing two weapons that are utilized in different manners and then saying “X is better cuz moar damage” is kind of hilariously narrow-minded. Axe is damage and nothing but damage so yes it’s sustained damage will be higher because that is all it brings.

Chaosbroker.3860:

Rakshael.4361:

GS is a burst weapon intended for single targets even though it CAN hypothetically hit more; no one ever really hits more than one person in PvP.

A) Given how the Forceful Greatsword trait works, more targets = faster might stacking so no … Greatsword is primarily an AoE focused weapon.
B) Hundred Blades is second only to a grenade engineer when “Downed-cleaving” an enemy team so again, AoE focused weapon.

Rakshael.4361:

*According to the wiki, where I looked because I double-checked this to make sure I was right, GS has zero vulnerability stacking skills. *The only way you’re getting vulnerability on it is through a specific trait, which would work on any other weapon, especially Axe’s fantastic, and faster, mainhand Auto.

http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Greatsword_Swing
http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Greatsword_Slice
… would like a word. That’s the auto attack chain btw.

Also, comparing two weapons that are utilized in different manners and then saying “X is better cuz moar damage” is kind of hilariously narrow-minded. Axe is damage and nothing but damage so yes it’s sustained damage will be higher because that is all it brings.

A. I’m taking Warrior’s weapons as-is without traits. If you want to get into traits, then sure, we can, though this is incredibly off-topic. The point about GS’s Auto being HORRID still stands. No GS warrior with half a brain is EVER going to sit and just hack with #1. The goal of that might trait is specifically for 100b to gain extra damage. If you run with a coordinated team who is skilled enough to bunch people up for you, that’s fantastic. in 99% of the population’s experience, however, getting more than one person underneath your 100b is as rare as a precursor drop. Sure, it benefits from more targets, but then again, so do a lot of Axe skills. And Sword Skills. And Mace skills. And longbow skills. And… etc. Your point holds zero weight.

B. Second to another profession’s skill, based on what? Damage? Cleave when a group of enemies is downed? This is unclear to me, however, I will answer it as best I understand it: If you’re taking a weapon because it gets a group of already-downed enemies to die faster, you’re not taking a weapon for the right reason. The goal is to get them to that downed state, where just about any weapon (or heaven forbid stomping >.>) will work.

tl;dr, a few rare and relatively irrelevant scenarios, even if they supported you, do not an aoe weapon make. If I was one of you, I’d base my argument for GS aoe capabilities based on the #3 skill, not #2. Since you’re trying to justify it based on the highest damage output, though, it is somewhat indicative you live by 100b (kinda cheesy, and far more narrow-minded than anything you’ve accused me of).

GS does have the ability to do decent cleave damage, I will fully agree on that semantic. But it’s burst, not sustain, and aoe is not the focus of the weapon.

As for the Auto, you are correct, I was misled by a confusing article on the wiki. However, despite this incorrect statement on my part, there is absolutely no way the Greatsword stacks more vulnerability than Axe. Axe crits just as much, if not more since you’re using the Auto, and #2 provides a stack. As far as vulnerability stacking goes, Axe will never lose to the greatsword.

When I’m talking about Downed-cleave I’m not talking about stopping someone’s pitiful attempts to bandage themself, I’m actually talking about punishing their team members for running in to revive their downed member.

Yes you could poke them with a pointed stick to stop the downed player bandaging themselves. When it comes to discouraging other team members from reviving them you’re going to need something a little heavier. Though this kind of behavior is rare in hot-joins, once you move up from there you might see this more often.

Also to quote myself …

Chaosbroker.3860:

B) Hundred Blades is second only to a grenade engineer when “Downed-cleaving” an enemy team so again, AoE focused weapon.

What I’m talking about here isn’t based on damage it’s about the ability to fill that team role when required vs risk taken to do it. Melee vs 1500 range, not hard to see who’s taking the bigger risk.

One last thing …

Rakshael.4361:

A. I’m taking Warrior’s weapons as-is without traits.

At no point did you actually say this at all, so you’ll have to forgive me for thinking we were talking about the weapons with trait backup. So yes that does skew things heavily in favour of the Axe since the Greatsword is laughable without trait support.

So yes we’re both guilty of making assumptions about what the other was saying. I’ve tried to clarify and I’ll apologize for seeming to jump down your throat since guests finishing off my coffee and not saying a kitten thing does make me a little … annoyed first thing in the morning.

O.o How were you able to stay awake without coffee… No offense taken.

Ah, that is a good point about the res deterrence, now that I understand it. Eviscerate does a good job as well, since they can’t really dodge it, but 100b is more readily available and does the good cleave. I’ll give you this one.

Also, I do have experience running tournaments with an organized team as well, we’ve not done it in a while but I have done it with a good margin of success as a warrior. I just didn’t know what you were talking about ^^

Warrior needs a pull has anyone ever brought this up? It’s doesn’t make sense that warriors have tons of knockbacks (wh… why!?) and no pulls when htey’re melee oriented.
Axe Chain 1000 range, throw axe connected a chain to foes in front of you cone shaped, piercing damage, anyone with in the cone is pulled in and immobilized (cause you know… it’s a chain and it looks cool),
cast time instant, recharge 0 sec. deals 1 million damage.

muahaha