Guild Wars 2

If you like me, hate me, loath me, don’t know me or don’t care what I have to say atleast hear me out on this one subject.

For the longest time one of the main reasons I personally stuck to my Warrior was the community. They were so supportive, so determined to be heard and respected as a class. Because of that community I’ve come to meet and like/befriend a number of Warriors that talk frequently on the forums. Warriors who play completely different games (essentially), some WvW some PvE, some sPvP.

The one thing we all shared was a will to be better. Because of that we all did what we could, shared builds, talked strategies, supported each others streams and learned together how to play this class better.

However, I’ve noticed an increasing trend from Warriors on the Warrior forum. Bad mouthing, putting people down, criticism in an un-constructive manner and general depressing trolling. These actions made me reflect on the community that I’ve grown to love over the past 10 months.

I essentially came to the conclusion that for the few people who are intentionally trying to rain on everyone else’s parade; you need to re-evaluate your concept of contributing to the community.

Bringing each other down doesn’t help to raise the bottom line. As a class we have a stigma in the PvP community. Myself and others are trying our best to bring awareness of our class to the rest of the public. It’s an uphill battle, we fight closed minded perceptions and an unwillingness to learn and accept changes or new concepts.

Please don’t force us to fight within as well as fight others when it comes to the validity of our class.

United we stand.

Mel Gibson eat your heart out.

Keep it up man.

I know what you’re saying bro and I know what the problem is.

You see it is because we lack sustain, this is why we are a weak community.

xoxo

LoBo.1724:

Translation; “People that are providing constructive criticism to Anet about warriors are dumb, we should all be happy over the poo-poo that Anet gives us.”

No, that’s not winner talk.

If you have CONSTRUCTIVE criticism, then by all means aggregate it into a readable format / thread on the forum that specifically nails down the areas you want to discuss.

Coming into random topics and berating others under the guise that you’re providing helpful feedback is about as low and trolly as you can get for being a community member.

Be useful, be constructive, be intelligent. Don’t be a troll.

Nice copy paste from the previous thread.

Well, we provide more than 1 stun ever 8-10 seconds. Actually, we provide 4 stuns.

Ontop of that, I can 100-0 most thiefs in one stun combo. Solo most necros without having an issue.

Have you considered that the point of the CC Warrior isn’t about ‘turning a 3v3’ into a ‘2v2’? Throw down skull crack, swap targets, daze -> back to skull crack target -> swap to sword -> Final thrust for 5k -> knockdown. If they arent dead from the teamfight damage at this point, you’re skull crack is back up in 2 seconds, re-apply and just move on to the next target while your team finishes them off.

It’s not a 2v2 it’s being downgraded to, its a 2v3. Your DPS is still viable, and it hurts if played right. If you’re good at swapping targets, being apart of a fight you can do slick things like Skull Crack on a Ranger, as your team brings him into a downstate -> apply stuns and dazes to Spirit pet and stop the AoE rez.

There’s a lot of clutch plays, great peeling, decent DPS and thurough sustain a CC build can bring to the table.

Longbow is amazing as well, but in a team fight if you have to much AoE damage and not enough people in the thick of it, you get pushed back to your corner of the map and out capped 2-1.

LoBo.1724:

Defektive.7283:

Nice copy paste from the previous thread.

I had to copy paste it because you spent every ounce of your available energy to completely dismiss it as “moaning” without providing any logical reason.

dat delicious single minded passive-aggressiveness.

Ontopic; I can now see how you might provide a specific purpose with said build in a team-composition that builds arounds it to great effect. It’s like the GS/Mace build but with more focus on opening up pesky necros like a can-opener of sorts, nice. If you run with a lot of stability, you can also secure the Dunk on that 1 target.

Kudos for the reply, even though it was a hassle to get it out of you (or anyone else).

That wasn’t so hard was it? Cheers.

I think my problem is you kept saying you were providing constructive feedback, but all you were doing from my perspective is detailing how we are worse than another class. You weren’t explicitly saying how to fix something or what a player should do differently to fill that gap.

Defektive.7283:

LoBo.1724:

Defektive.7283:

Nice copy paste from the previous thread.

I had to copy paste it because you spent every ounce of your available energy to completely dismiss it as “moaning” without providing any logical reason.

dat delicious single minded passive-aggressiveness.

Ontopic; I can now see how you might provide a specific purpose with said build in a team-composition that builds arounds it to great effect. It’s like the GS/Mace build but with more focus on opening up pesky necros like a can-opener of sorts, nice. If you run with a lot of stability, you can also secure the Dunk on that 1 target.

Kudos for the reply, even though it was a hassle to get it out of you (or anyone else).

That wasn’t so hard was it? Cheers.

I think my problem is you kept saying you were providing constructive feedback, but all you were doing from my perspective is detailing how we are worse than another class. You weren’t explicitly saying how to fix something or what a player should do differently to fill that gap.

detailing the weakness is already a step closer to the fix.

Lighter.5631:

Defektive.7283:

LoBo.1724:

Defektive.7283:

Nice copy paste from the previous thread.

I had to copy paste it because you spent every ounce of your available energy to completely dismiss it as “moaning” without providing any logical reason.

dat delicious single minded passive-aggressiveness.

Ontopic; I can now see how you might provide a specific purpose with said build in a team-composition that builds arounds it to great effect. It’s like the GS/Mace build but with more focus on opening up pesky necros like a can-opener of sorts, nice. If you run with a lot of stability, you can also secure the Dunk on that 1 target.

Kudos for the reply, even though it was a hassle to get it out of you (or anyone else).

That wasn’t so hard was it? Cheers.

I think my problem is you kept saying you were providing constructive feedback, but all you were doing from my perspective is detailing how we are worse than another class. You weren’t explicitly saying how to fix something or what a player should do differently to fill that gap.

detailing the weakness is already a step closer to the fix.

While true, think of it from a real world perspective.

If someone is building a chair wrong, you don’t walk up to them and say ‘your chair sucks’. You point out where it’s wrong and how to fix it.

Likewise if you go to a mechanic and your tire pressure light is on, they don’t come out and say ‘your tire is broken’. They inform you it has a puncture and ways to remedy it.

The point of constructive feedback is to provide actual feedback. Throwing in your 2c’s just to get it in there AND not helping to fix the issue is the problem at hand in these forums.

Otherwise we would be flooded with spam X is OP Y sucks and ‘Z is such bullkitten’.

AKA the SPVP forum.

Didn’t want to start a new thread for something petty but I think GS 5 should be a full evade on dash.

ArcTheFallen.7682:

Didn’t want to start a new thread for something petty but I think GS 5 should be a full evade on dash.

If ArenaNet wants to keep evade frames like they are now, then I agree.

But I’d also prefer them to just tone down everyone elses evade frames. Bring us all back down to ground zero.

Defektive.7283:

Lighter.5631:

Defektive.7283:

LoBo.1724:

Defektive.7283:

Nice copy paste from the previous thread.

I had to copy paste it because you spent every ounce of your available energy to completely dismiss it as “moaning” without providing any logical reason.

dat delicious single minded passive-aggressiveness.

Ontopic; I can now see how you might provide a specific purpose with said build in a team-composition that builds arounds it to great effect. It’s like the GS/Mace build but with more focus on opening up pesky necros like a can-opener of sorts, nice. If you run with a lot of stability, you can also secure the Dunk on that 1 target.

Kudos for the reply, even though it was a hassle to get it out of you (or anyone else).

That wasn’t so hard was it? Cheers.

I think my problem is you kept saying you were providing constructive feedback, but all you were doing from my perspective is detailing how we are worse than another class. You weren’t explicitly saying how to fix something or what a player should do differently to fill that gap.

detailing the weakness is already a step closer to the fix.

While true, think of it from a real world perspective.

If someone is building a chair wrong, you don’t walk up to them and say ‘your chair sucks’. You point out where it’s wrong and how to fix it.

Likewise if you go to a mechanic and your tire pressure light is on, they don’t come out and say ‘your tire is broken’. They inform you it has a puncture and ways to remedy it.

The point of constructive feedback is to provide actual feedback. Throwing in your 2c’s just to get it in there AND not helping to fix the issue is the problem at hand in these forums.

Otherwise we would be flooded with spam X is OP Y sucks and ‘Z is such bullkitten’.

AKA the SPVP forum.

Thing is, “Your chair sucks" is not detailing the weaknesses. by detailing, it’s more like “Your chair’s legs are bad.”
“Your chair’s color combination is bad.”
“Your chair is not comfortable to sit on.” so designers can rethink of the specific areas.

Although balancing a game is more complicated then your look-simple example, that simply listing the flaws doesn’t help you entirely to come up with a fix, but it does lead you closer to it.

I’ll give you it puts you on the right path to a fix, but if everyone is yelling out flaws then it just becomes a jumbled mess of an assembly. People like myself who take these considerations and actually try to implement them or to fill gaps / niches see this as everyone yelling at the same time.

It’s more beneficial to the community to be clear and concise with information on hand to back up a claim and a potential solution for the situation.

But it’s easier to just say ‘Your chair’s legs are bad’ instead of figuring out how to make them sturdier.

I also would like longbow F1 to be less of a hassle to use (less cast time?). It may be just me but I have to spam F1 whenever I’m immobilized to get it to shoot. I think we should have an adrenaline trait for damage reduction on adrenaline level. I think we also need better access to combo fields (fire on longbow?). What’s the point of having finishers if we have to rely on teammates to create the combo fields.. :S GS 4 needs to be reworked, it’s the most useless skill on the GS since leg specialist nerf (riposte maybe?). GS F1 needs to be reworked (maybe a kd? increase down time based on adrenaline).

ArcTheFallen.7682:

I also would like longbow F1 to be less of a hassle to use (less cast time?). It may be just me but I have to spam F1 whenever I’m immobilized to get it to shoot. I think we should have an adrenaline trait for damage reduction on adrenaline level. I think we also need better access to combo fields (fire on longbow?). What’s the point of having finishers if we have to rely on teammates to create the combo fields.. :S GS 4 needs to be reworked, it’s the most useless skill on the GS since leg specialist nerf (riposte maybe?). GS F1 needs to be reworked (maybe a kd? increase down time based on adrenaline).

GS in general needs a rework, right now only Whirlwind is a great skill on it. Damage numbers have shown Sword to do as much damage (maybe slightly less) than GS, but still provide an escape, a useful F1 and an opportunity for a second weapon.

Movement skills shouldn’t be affected by chill / cripple or better yet, have mobile strikes be improved to remove chill / cripple as well as it’s current immobolize.

I would love to see 1.5-2sec block as GS4.

I think this thread deserves:

Yeah, there are only like 4 people willing to have detailed and thorough discussions on warr issues in the adrenaline rising feedback thread.

I’m just trying to figure out what would make up for our huge lack of sustain. Guardians have protection + boons all a plenty. Mesmers have invuln/stealth/blink. Rangers have protection + heals + PETs to soak up dmg + evade. Thieves have stealth/shadowstep/evade. Necros have DS and fear. Engis have heals, invuln, condi immunity. Eles have boons/heal. Warriors have nothing. We need some damage reduction access or more block if that’s where they want to go and maybe access to better healing. Given the class, having a blink wouldn’t fit so we won’t have that and having stealth wouldn’t fit either so we need better defense and/or heals.

It seems like Anet wants warrior players to be the most skilled in timings because they put our very little defensive options on super high cds so we have to know when to exactly use skills such as Balanced Stance, Endure Pain, Bzerk Stance and Block. Not much spamming here. Oh got hit by a surprise signet of spite? Too bad.

Jzaku.9765:

Yeah, there are only like 4 people willing to have detailed and thorough discussions on warr issues in the adrenaline rising feedback thread.

less people the better. i dont want a class to be design by a committee. classes design by a committee are giant messes.

for me, i am only i interested in reducing after cast time with non rewarding skills. i want to make dynamic build but after cast time is just awful

basically, i want to have fun dying with bad builds

ArcTheFallen.7682:

I’m just trying to figure out what would make up for our huge lack of sustain. Guardians have protection + boons all a plenty. Mesmers have invuln/stealth/blink. Rangers have protection + heals + PETs to soak up dmg + evade. Thieves have stealth/shadowstep/evade. Necros have DS and fear. Engis have heals, invuln, condi immunity. Eles have boons/heal. Warriors have nothing. We need some damage reduction access or more block if that’s where they want to go and maybe access to better healing. Given the class, having a blink wouldn’t fit so we won’t have that and having stealth wouldn’t fit either so we need better defense and/or heals.

Perhaps give us better access to weakness?

It would fit within the aesthetic of our class, and along with the CC we have access to could potentially give us decent sustain through offensive abilities. Shoring up some of our other heals might help as well (I’ve always been a fan of sustained healing in the games I play, but our healing signet just doesn’t cut it).

In regards to the original intent of this thread: More solidarity within players of the same class is a great thing to see. It makes people feel better about the class they play, and makes newcomers to the class feel welcome and encouraged to pick it up and learn it.

Nothing scares people away like looking at a class forum and seeing it riddled with posts about how bad it is, or watching the most vocal members tear each other apart instead of trying to actually discuss anything. I’ve seen it in a few MMOs, and don’t want it to happen here as well, not with a class I quite enjoy playing, despite it’s struggles in PvP.

loseridoit.2756:

Jzaku.9765:

Yeah, there are only like 4 people willing to have detailed and thorough discussions on warr issues in the adrenaline rising feedback thread.

less people the better. i dont want a class to be design by a committee. classes design by a committee are giant messes.

for me, i am only i interested in reducing after cast time with non rewarding skills. i want to make dynamic build but after cast time is just awful

basically, i want to have fun dying with bad builds

Hey, if half of our non-rewarding skills had less terrible after cast time they would stop being so “non-rewarding”.

Jzaku.9765:

loseridoit.2756:

Jzaku.9765:

Yeah, there are only like 4 people willing to have detailed and thorough discussions on warr issues in the adrenaline rising feedback thread.

less people the better. i dont want a class to be design by a committee. classes design by a committee are giant messes.

for me, i am only i interested in reducing after cast time with non rewarding skills. i want to make dynamic build but after cast time is just awful

basically, i want to have fun dying with bad builds

Hey, if half of our non-rewarding skills had less terrible after cast time they would stop being so “non-rewarding”.

i just dont like the giant hit me sign. take a look at salvage leap. the skill is actually pretty bad under 300 range because the after cast stay the same. for a good quarter second, youre pretty much stuck in the air. i am not asking to reduce after cast time on high damage abilities but other special skills that barely do as much damage as an auto attack or other attack that just keep missing like rush. i just want the class to feel less clunky.

The only people complaining about Warriors at the moment are people who want to play bunkers. If you want to play a bunker, for the love of god, just play a guardian. Warriors are not optimal at bunkering just like glass cannon Guardians can never deal as much damage as glass cannon Warriors.

Lighter.5631:

Defektive.7283:

Lighter.5631:

Defektive.7283:

LoBo.1724:

Defektive.7283:

Nice copy paste from the previous thread.

I had to copy paste it because you spent every ounce of your available energy to completely dismiss it as “moaning” without providing any logical reason.

dat delicious single minded passive-aggressiveness.

Ontopic; I can now see how you might provide a specific purpose with said build in a team-composition that builds arounds it to great effect. It’s like the GS/Mace build but with more focus on opening up pesky necros like a can-opener of sorts, nice. If you run with a lot of stability, you can also secure the Dunk on that 1 target.

Kudos for the reply, even though it was a hassle to get it out of you (or anyone else).

That wasn’t so hard was it? Cheers.

I think my problem is you kept saying you were providing constructive feedback, but all you were doing from my perspective is detailing how we are worse than another class. You weren’t explicitly saying how to fix something or what a player should do differently to fill that gap.

detailing the weakness is already a step closer to the fix.

While true, think of it from a real world perspective.

If someone is building a chair wrong, you don’t walk up to them and say ‘your chair sucks’. You point out where it’s wrong and how to fix it.

Likewise if you go to a mechanic and your tire pressure light is on, they don’t come out and say ‘your tire is broken’. They inform you it has a puncture and ways to remedy it.

The point of constructive feedback is to provide actual feedback. Throwing in your 2c’s just to get it in there AND not helping to fix the issue is the problem at hand in these forums.

Otherwise we would be flooded with spam X is OP Y sucks and ‘Z is such bullkitten’.

AKA the SPVP forum.

Thing is, “Your chair sucks" is not detailing the weaknesses. by detailing, it’s more like “Your chair’s legs are bad.”
“Your chair’s color combination is bad.”
“Your chair is not comfortable to sit on.” so designers can rethink of the specific areas.

Although balancing a game is more complicated then your look-simple example, that simply listing the flaws doesn’t help you entirely to come up with a fix, but it does lead you closer to it.

The main problem with this is two-fold, in my opinion:

1. You lend no credibility to your subjective analysis when you give no actual detail. I want to believe you that the color combination on my chair is bad, but what makes it bad? What makes it uncomfortable? Do you like to slouch and it’s a straight-back chair? Perhaps the chair just isn’t for you, but perhaps it could actually be improved. Which leads to

2. No additional information is almost as useful as just saying “your chair sucks”, and if that’s the only feedback ANet receives, then they just have to try to guess how to fix it. If one person is building a chair, they can probably reorient legs/make a new chair in a relatively short period of time. ANet’s two-week release timeline is pretty kitten fast as far as timeframes for changes are concerned, but it’s a super delicate tightrope to walk. If you elaborate on what is wrong, then the odds of them fixing it faster are greater.

I’m generally of the opinion that if someone claims something is broken, but doesn’t know how to really explain why, then said person needs to re-evaluate their opinion. Emotions aren’t a good source of balance information, and, as an example, as much as I hate fighting condi necros that are everywhere in hotjoin these days, I’ve had to stop and say “well, what could I have done better in that fight?”. Sure, I’ve played a condi necro that I threw together and racked up kills easily, so frustration is high when I fight against one. However, if you don’t have a complete understanding of the situation, you shouldn’t be making claims about balance.

I really like this thread though. It’s super easy for MMO sub-communities, especially on forums, to be poisoned and devolve into mindless flaming/trolling. Some self-awareness would do everyone some good.

Defektive.7283:

If you like me, hate me, loath me, don’t know me or don’t care what I have to say atleast hear me out on this one subject.

---

For the longest time one of the main reasons I personally stuck to my Warrior was the community. They were so supportive, so determined to be heard and respected as a class. Because of that community I’ve come to meet and like/befriend a number of Warriors that talk frequently on the forums. Warriors who play completely different games (essentially), some WvW some PvE, some sPvP.

The one thing we all shared was a will to be better. Because of that we all did what we could, shared builds, talked strategies, supported each others streams and learned together how to play this class better.

However, I’ve noticed an increasing trend from Warriors on the Warrior forum. Bad mouthing, putting people down, criticism in an un-constructive manner and general depressing trolling. These actions made me reflect on the community that I’ve grown to love over the past 10 months.

I essentially came to the conclusion that for the few people who are intentionally trying to rain on everyone else’s parade; you need to re-evaluate your concept of contributing to the community.

Bringing each other down doesn’t help to raise the bottom line. As a class we have a stigma in the PvP community. Myself and others are trying our best to bring awareness of our class to the rest of the public. It’s an uphill battle, we fight closed minded perceptions and an unwillingness to learn and accept changes or new concepts.

Please don’t force us to fight within as well as fight others when it comes to the validity of our class.

United we stand.

The reason why I think people are trolling you and a few others is you guys are making the warrior sound like its ok. and its not ok its better its not quite there yet. In fact its not even close.

So yea I will agree warrior is better now its got to the point warrior is actually barely playable now. Barely playable, we dont want warrior to be barely playable we want it to be good.

Everytime I see one of these posts where I dont know if its opposite trolling or just people that have low standards or what not saying “there is nothing wrong with warrior” Its guuuuud now. It makes a lot of us mad. Cuz that kinda attitude is not whats got anet to make changes to warriors, and with that kinda attitude they will do nothing more to warrior to make it good.

Warrior still have a lot of poblems, traits that dont work right, skills that dont work right, list goes on, how about we stop making these post war is guuuud, and ignoring big problems and telling everyone that they dont know what they are talking about when they complain about warriors maybe the troll posts will stop.

There has been alot of positive feedback I dont want that positive feedback to stop because all of a sudden a few people think that warriors is great now. And thats how a few people are making it seem that is not the case.

We as a community have pushed anet to make warriors better, you want that to stop? I certainly don’t.

Warlord.9074:

Defektive.7283:

If you like me, hate me, loath me, don’t know me or don’t care what I have to say atleast hear me out on this one subject.

---

For the longest time one of the main reasons I personally stuck to my Warrior was the community. They were so supportive, so determined to be heard and respected as a class. Because of that community I’ve come to meet and like/befriend a number of Warriors that talk frequently on the forums. Warriors who play completely different games (essentially), some WvW some PvE, some sPvP.

The one thing we all shared was a will to be better. Because of that we all did what we could, shared builds, talked strategies, supported each others streams and learned together how to play this class better.

However, I’ve noticed an increasing trend from Warriors on the Warrior forum. Bad mouthing, putting people down, criticism in an un-constructive manner and general depressing trolling. These actions made me reflect on the community that I’ve grown to love over the past 10 months.

I essentially came to the conclusion that for the few people who are intentionally trying to rain on everyone else’s parade; you need to re-evaluate your concept of contributing to the community.

Bringing each other down doesn’t help to raise the bottom line. As a class we have a stigma in the PvP community. Myself and others are trying our best to bring awareness of our class to the rest of the public. It’s an uphill battle, we fight closed minded perceptions and an unwillingness to learn and accept changes or new concepts.

Please don’t force us to fight within as well as fight others when it comes to the validity of our class.

United we stand.

The reason why I think people are trolling you and a few others is you guys are making the warrior sound like its ok. and its not ok its better. So its got to the point warrior is actually playable now. Barely playable, we dont want warrior to be barely playable we want it to be good. Everytime I see one of these posts where I dont know if its opposite trolling or just people that have low standards or what not saying “there is nothing wrong with warrior” Its guuuuud now. It makes a lot of us mad. Cuz that kinda attitude is not whats got anet to make changes to warriors, and with that kinda attitude they will do nothing more to warrior to make it good.

Warriors as a whole aren’t in a great spot that’s for sure. You can’t use rifle, or hammer in high end PvP. We’re limited to only a handful of builds that really make us work to have it be successful.

But that last word is why we’re viable, not OP or rediculous, but viable. We have successful builds that do work.

They may pigeon hole us, put us in a spot we’re not used to, or a playstyle we’re not accustomed to, but they work.

Plenty of other classes play the same way, many mesmers would love to run Mantra, but they can’t, they are stuck with Shatter.

The key is their community has come to the conclusion that for now, they have a viable build that’s working for them. It’s not perfect, it doesn’t do exactly what everyone would want. But it works.

We’re in a similar position. We have a handful of builds that work, they aren’t the most amazing or will rock someones socks off, but they work.

Only time and constructive feedback will fix the other issues, but for now we can’t go around saying we’re kitten poor when at a bare minimum, we’re viable.

—

Also in regards to low standards. I don’t think it’s a matter of low standards, but a matter of I’ll take what I can get. We havn’t been viable in a long time, to have something worth playing as right now is better than having nothing before hand.

I’m not sure if people are aware but a number of the changes ArenaNet made were requests that this community gave. Cleansing Ire was a specific request that was made by Daecollo! Although they implemented it slightly different, it still works exactly the same way.

ya i agree to a point in only that while they may only have a viable build the difference is there viable builds are more viable than ours. It’s not anywhere close to a even playing field. 1v1 there viable build vs our so called vaible build im going to say they are going to win. I know this is off topic and besides the point that your trying to make, but just cuz we may have a build that maybe might work with the right team composure and you say its not OP well other professions builds are OP and that puts warriors at a disadvantage. So maybe they need to be nerfed and warrior need to be buffed. But judging by anet last time they gave warriors a little somthing and nerfed them at the same time, then buffed the hell out of other professions that didnt need buffed so I dont think thakittens going to work out like that. ANET is not going to nerf there love children to put them on a level playing field with what warrior is at now.

Sry if my eng hurts ur eyes but ill give my 2 coppers.

I think thats theres no point bringing feedback to AN. Everyone and their mom knows that warrior is weaker of all professions when its comes to pvp, we simply lack any kind of sustain, and no..i won’t even touch cleansing ire trait that is getting countered by conditions, bringing up lb for removing conditions does not apply to me.

Why i should be forced to use a single weapon to get rid of conditions, what the point in that? Traits like that also limits build diversity, fixing a class by traits inst a way to go. Also lets take a look…burst skill..wasnt burst skill supposed to use carefully instead of “spam it off cd”? What if i want to hold my adrenaline to use evi in the right moment to kill someone, but im forced to use it earlier to get rid of some conditions to not die?

Also the fact that we lacking any ways to block/evade damage and in fact we taking everything on chest, a cd reduction on healing skills won’t help much, increasing current hp won’t change anything either, and anyone that believe its will is simply kitten.

Weapons skills are played in slow motion, a cc is needed in order to hit with them.. That was well knows for so long, what AN did? Take a look on final thrust..from a smooth animation in sword chain they turned that in killshot.v2 or even worse bc of lower damage, also the damage under 50% does not apply to me either. Also axe chain nerf without compesate in other areas.. <clap clap>

Whirling axe – buffed damage by 50% in spvp olny.. I have to say i lolled at that..Does it mean its fine in pve/wvw? No.. And what about thieves that reflect projectiles using our skill? A moment of silence..

Now take a look on necros, they been asking many times for options to escape from fight, and better survival options, what they did? Increased their damage in fact turning into moving bombs.

Their excuse is: “we don’t want to turn warriors into op killing machine. Warriors was op in beta.”

I fail to see how that can happen when war is a buttom tier list in tpvp, without complete rework of class. As for the beta (mind u i havent played in that time but ive seen vid) – warriors are strong, and i even say they are probably the stronger class in pvp against anyone that playing like a pve skritt – no dodge, no stunbreak, standing in one place, but the fun ending here. I will also post something i made a while ago

What we need is simple actually – as simple as ur skills that does damage olny.

Doesnt matter what weapons set we will put up – there always should be 2 blocks on weapons, some of them can carry evade (axe 2 seems to be good candidate) instead of block. All of them should have decent damage with some extra effects. Thats first step to improve sustain.

Step 2 – doesnt matter what class u pick, all of them have something else than just damage of some laughable vul stack. We need to have spread some short stuff like vigor, regeneration, switness, stability, weakness on them. As for stability i would think about skills like shield stance and..burst skills.

Step 3 – Looking at the other classes we sees to be underpowered, Thats false. Warrior is actually balanced, other classes are simply op comparing them to warrior. Key is: do u will nerf 7 classes into ground to warrior level, or u will improve warrior to match rest? Selfrooting, obvious, slow cast skills – we need to get rid of them all. Theres no trick, not a single boom more when u can say “wow, i dindt seen that killshot coming” not to mention that we actually need to set them up as without any help they are too hard to land

Step 4 – Mobility. Something we lack. We olny have 1 real gap closer/opener – savage leap. The olny one that inst affected by cripple/chill.
Bullrush would be decent but unlike savage bull is affected.
Whirdwind inst barery a gap closer, its just an evade move with little range that is also affected by cripple/chill.
Rush is definitely too slow, watching myself doing that i feel im on marathon for oldmans. Affected by cripple/chill, takes years to “rush” through 1200meters, and also has fairy high cd (20 untrained). Personally i vote for rush to share animation of guardian leap of faith , and cd lowered to 15sec and lets have it done. We need in combat mobility, not outisde combat. Current rush is better for outside as its has too high cd and barery hits anyone at all.

Step 5 – Adrenaline mechanic. Best example is cleansing ire. Its seems to be good..problem is..we have to rely on burst skills to land in order to remove conditions, its even funnier with blind that got fixed. I would like to see a F2, F3, F4 to be build into our mechanic rathen than picking a special trait to limit urself. Example how its could work:

F2 – Cleansing ire – spend our adrenaline on curing conditions, and gain health (400/800/1200) Adrenal health improves this to grant 1/2/3k and grant extra condi remove (2/3/4 compared to 1/2/3 without adrenal health)

Step 6 – Healing abilities. If all the steps above will be done, all we need is little tweaking like some cd reduction, buffing signet to around 300hp/sec.

Scoobaniec.9561:

I think thats theres no point bringing feedback to AN

Sadly, I’m starting to think this is the case too. All the feedback I’ve seen on the forums here seems to go unnoticed. I dont expect a dev to reply to every, or even any threads, but the actions taken come balance-patch time speak volumes.

And its a vicious cycle, the lack of response from feedback, in turn discourages warriors from making future feedback posts (“why should I even bother?”), leaving nothing but the most persistent of players, and raging trolls.

And yet we wonder why our community has gone the tubes…

It’s funny we have one post showing an example of Anet taking a suggestion directly from a post on these forums and implementing it in the form of Cleansing Ire….followed by posts basically saying “no point giving Anet any feedback they don’t even read it”.

The only problem with Cleansing Ire now is it doesn’t cleanse if you miss bc you don’t spend the adrenaline if you miss. Rework adrenaline/burst skills so that you immediately use the adrenaline on skill activation – problem solved and removes a silly mechanic from the game.

Velron.3729:

..Cleansing Ire…

Is a rare exception.
I recall a period leading up to last months patch where all you could see on page 1 of the War forum, were posts about sustain. Which never happened.

Dand.8231:

Velron.3729:

..Cleansing Ire…

Is a rare exception.
I recall a period leading up to last months patch where all you could see on page 1 of the War forum, were posts about sustain. Which never happened.

From what I understand, there were disagreements with the PvE vs. PvP teams as to what should go into the game, and the PvP team weasled in as much as they could this time round

Solid post Defektive, keep on keepin-on

Dand.8231:

Velron.3729:

..Cleansing Ire…

Is a rare exception.
I recall a period leading up to last months patch where all you could see on page 1 of the War forum, were posts about sustain. Which never happened.

Don’t you see though that things like Cleansing Ire ARE sustain?

I can’t help but be curious how much of a sustain boost it would be if cleansing ire worked properly with melee weapons.

I agree we need some buffs to it overall – but I think, unlike with the Necro, they are keeping the slow balance approach with Warrior for whatever reason.

You know wat makes me like warriors even better.
The warriors that are actualy good in pvp are skilled players. Most other classes you can just start playing and figure them out easyly. With wars its diffrent. Our class all around has more weaknesses then strengths. So you you have to know exactly wat you r doing or your ganna fail.
Ive noticed this in just about everything to do with wars in pvp. You click on wrong button or click it a secnd late. Your dead. This is nice. I dont have to deal with ppl who cant pvp. Thats why i go after other warriors i wanna see if they know wat theyr doing.

I want Building Momentum work with sword burst.
I want 1s root after Staggering Blow fixed.
I want Savage Leap, Earthshaker, Rush, Bull Charge be 1/2 or 3/4 evade- I cant control my character once I press the button and here I am stoped by some random imobilize, chill and cripple (not in Savage Leap) Its bad enough that need to be aware of soroundings to use those becasue I can be stopped by small brick coming out of road or bush/tree etc.
I want Balanced Stance to be unique buff like Endure Pain, Frenzy, Berserker Stance -not a boon that can be stolen or turned into condition -we have enough of those.
I want Leg Specialist to immobilze more than 1 foe. Keep the cd but please make it aoe
I want Block in some utilty or trait or in other weapons not only in shield. Warrior master of weapon can only block attacks with shield? Ranger can do it with greatsword… Quagon and kids can block attacks with shield srsly.

Keep up the good fight warriors.

Defektive.7283:

I’ll give you it puts you on the right path to a fix, but if everyone is yelling out flaws then it just becomes a jumbled mess of an assembly. People like myself who take these considerations and actually try to implement them or to fill gaps / niches see this as everyone yelling at the same time.

It’s more beneficial to the community to be clear and concise with information on hand to back up a claim and a potential solution for the situation.

But it’s easier to just say ‘Your chair’s legs are bad’ instead of figuring out how to make them sturdier.

Well, Why would you buy a chair that have one leg shorter then the others and fix it yourself by placing a small pill of paper under it. 1st sure it works, but its not a good fix.
2nd, its designer’s job to build a good chair that is working, and we have the right to complaint.

what a good thing to do, is put a pill of paper under it for now(what most us doing right now or else we’d quit warrior and play something else),
and keep complaining over and over again(what most of us are doing right now as well , which is a good thing) till they actually send you a new chair that is working.

yet i do agree some of the people do exaggerate too much, but its understandable due to the disappointment over and over again

I’m the kind of person that would bring the chair back into my shop and fix it myself instead of waiting for corporate to come to my rescue.

Considering a number of my clients are huge corporate accounts with insane red tape and time tables to get things done, I don’t put much faith in an expedited response.

Defektive.7283:

I’m the kind of person that would bring the chair back into my shop and fix it myself instead of waiting for corporate to come to my rescue.

Considering a number of my clients are huge corporate accounts with insane red tape and time tables to get things done, I don’t put much faith in an expedited response.

Good luck fixing something that you dont even have acces to fix.

But in the reality is all other classes can be, just look at the core game mechanics here and see why the problem of the warrior moslty is not in the core of the warrior mechanics but instead in the other classes mechanics, making the warrior a class that does not belong to this game entirely.

Lets see :

-Most of the classes can generate boons through weapon skills , warrior cant…

-Most of the classes have evades or teleports on weapons skills, even stealths…. warrior dosent.

-Most of the classes have burst skills that can be used while moving and do pretty good damage…. warrior dosent

-Talking about this burst skills again, other classes can make burst from a really long distance, they are instants, they can do it from stealth or the burst comes from an npc that is not controled to the player, warrior dosent have any of this.

-No other class have telegraphed skills… warrior has (yay!! at least warriors have something they dont!!!)

-Other classes have acces to be bunkers, they can regenerate through everything,have acces to protection, aegis or vigor, warrior cant have any of those, even when its very justified to warriors have protection because of their heavy armor status they cant.

-Other classes have great acces to conditions, warrior has acces to bleeds and burning, but even if you build around conditions the damage it isnt great and you are better being an archer from a far relying on the other people to do the work for you, and really 2 conditions?… while necros can spam the hell out of everything and even engis.

-Other classes have heals that are balanced around their healthpools and have great utlities on them they cure condis or block or even evade… warrior again dosent have anythin, as a matter of fact, every healing skill of warrior are terrible and in very unjustified long cd.

-Other classes can heal from other weapon skills utlities… warrior cant heal from weapon skills, and through utilities you need to expend 30 points in tactics to health a pity amount with shouts, its just terrible.

Im sure im forgeting some OP mechanics that other classes have and warrior dosent but i cant remember right now.

Lets see what a warrior can do to these classes:

Stun them? not a chance baby, teleports for the win, even on weapon skills.

Go melee?, not a chance again, chills,criple,inmovilize,stuns are looking at you…

Gap closers?, sure savage leap is good but is on a lame weapon that when you are close to the target you cant do any damage to them and guess…. teleports for the win…

Stealth!, one of the most anoying things, use your shield to prevent the burst from stealth sure!, block, block, block, block…. damm block is off…. BACKSTAB!!! 80% of your health bar is gone now!

Again stealth… where is this guy?… hea ppears in front of you, oh kitten, is a clone!, LETS TARGET THE REAL ONE!, I KNOW WHERE HE IS NOW!…. Tab….Tab….Tab….. TAB….. TAB…. OMG im going to click, this kitten is not working…..im dead…

You are going to kill someone this time, and then attune to water and starts healing like a mad, he is now full health again ready to kick your kitten ….

You are going to kill this time again, then the thief decides its time to escape… stealth…. a couple of seconds later he is back with full health.

You try to kill a ranger now, sure they can be beaten they are allways QQ in the forums that they are bad etc, lets see… you start landing your best attacks and he is yous enduring everything, regenerating every damage you are doing,, wait you can poison him… sure why not… oh wait.

There are so many OP mechanics on this game that is going to get really long to list them all, but i know people have an idea of what im talking about even if they play stupid pretending they dont.

Warrior is not allowed to be OP, devs are afraid of doing a lot of changes to the class so they can counter all of this OP mechanics other classes have, they are not allowed, and i dont know why, is not like the game is going to be more messed up than it is now with all of this stuff i said and more i dont said… it seems warrior is the only class that is some sort of balanced but i doubt they are going to bring the other classes to the level of the warrior, they cant in fact because core mechanics in those classes are OP by design, they cant be changed, warrior was created with another mentality, a view that dosent belong to this game.

Now the warrior isn’t the strongest in PvP, but I think too many people here make him out to be like complete trash which is not true. I rather think that the majority of warriors are just bad. They pick up the class and expect to steam roll through the enemy. This is why I was really happy that 100b frenzy got nerfed because it was increasingly detrimental to good warrior gameplay.

In the current state there are two main groups that I see. There are those that still whine that warrior has no sustain, how they can’t keep fighting and keep loosing to other classes. Then there are those who have figured something different out. That might be CC (hammer mace) , condi or some other strat, but it seems to work. Not as great as other builds but still decent, to a point where a little bit of skill advantage will make you win against most classes.

Now these days I’m not sure of I should support those calling for buffs in hopes of getting something better (hehe) or trying to prove them wrong..

Yeah, its not that warriors are in a bad place it is just 90% of them are apparently bad.

peter.9024:

Now the warrior isn’t the strongest in PvP, but I think too many people here make him out to be like complete trash which is not true. I rather think that the majority of warriors are just bad. They pick up the class and expect to steam roll through the enemy. This is why I was really happy that 100b frenzy got nerfed because it was increasingly detrimental to good warrior gameplay.

In the current state there are two main groups that I see. There are those that still whine that warrior has no sustain, how they can’t keep fighting and keep loosing to other classes. Then there are those who have figured something different out. That might be CC (hammer mace) , condi or some other strat, but it seems to work. Not as great as other builds but still decent, to a point where a little bit of skill advantage will make you win against most classes.

Now these days I’m not sure of I should support those calling for buffs in hopes of getting something better (hehe) or trying to prove them wrong..

people can’t prove them wrong because they are right,

more like “hopes of getting something better” or “try to deal with it themselves with some build that is close to viable yet not.”

and there’s a thing called both, try it out, its awesome

Gmtsai.6349:

Stop, just stop it people. While you guys are crying about warriors suck, there is someone already made a very strong build and been running in tournaments. The build is really viable and counters current Meta. Stop crying before you really understand warrior. Don’t just make lots of posts, lots of comments, lots of videos to make people think warrior sucks.

A warrior in high tier level pvp is there and been running a strong warrior comp, and people cannot handle it including me (I have faced the warrior today).

I don’t know if this will bothers the guy that I’m talking about, but I’m going to give out his name so people will go watch/ask him before you cry to warriors.

His name is Anas Tarcis, please, go ask him something before you cry so kitten warriors.

It is really annoy to see a community to cry on a thing because they all suck, and it is really annoy to see a community to cry on a thing that actually good.

yet anastarcis thinks that warrior need buff. ok

I guess the dilemma is between the warrior community trying to get dev attention vs. creating a helpful community for other warriors. I understand that some people think the squeeky wheel philosophy is what the warrior forums need, but it just makes for such a terrible experience for players that come here to learn about their class.

I feel like what we need is a more constructive and organized way to give feedback to the devs. Right now these forums seem like an absolute mess of complaints; while there’s a few good points and ideas overall it’s tough to get through, and it’s really hard to get any kind of good discussions on how to make the most of what we have. Thanks to Defektive, Anas Tarcis and others for at least trying though.

Personally my warrior is in a good spot because I have a build that works very well with how I wanted to play him. That aside though there are a few things I think that would greatly help other warrior builds / warriors in general.

- As a few mentioned previously having better access to weakness will give us a huge edge in fights. I’d take a consistent weakness application over protection any day of the week. Having 4-8 seconds of consistent 25% chance of taking 50% reduced damage > 4 sec of 33% reduced damage on a 20+ sec cooldown imo.

- This is more for axes in specific, but having a ranged evade or traited reflect ability tied into whirling axe / cyclone axe / moves that have a weapon spin would provide a greater battle presence in all aspects of the game (whirlwind attack is a perfect example of this). Thieves dagger storm for example reflects all projectiles but they’re still subject to melee attacks.

- Healing shouts and regen banners are good, but I’m surprised there’s no regen proc or something akin to thieves stealth regen when using stances.

ArcTheFallen.7682:

I’m just trying to figure out what would make up for our huge lack of sustain.

Well, there was some talk of how the heal skills were to have their cooldowns reduced, and it was actually part of the unofficial patch notes that were leaked. They also mentioned they were looking at skills like healing surge in that people find it odd how you need adrenaline to get better healing but have to heal to get the adrenaline.

If they simply reduced the cooldowns, that would make some ground on better sustain, but I guess they are just not prepared to do that yet. The devs will always have more data than any of us do, but there’s been so many instances where having 5 seconds less on my healing skill cooldown would have changed the course of the fight drastically.

Yamsandjams.3267:

ArcTheFallen.7682:

I’m just trying to figure out what would make up for our huge lack of sustain.

Well, there was some talk of how the heal skills were to have their cooldowns reduced, and it was actually part of the unofficial patch notes that were leaked. They also mentioned they were looking at skills like healing surge in that people find it odd how you need adrenaline to get better healing but have to heal to get the adrenaline.

If they simply reduced the cooldowns, that would make some ground on better sustain, but I guess they are just not prepared to do that yet. The devs will always have more data than any of us do, but there’s been so many instances where having 5 seconds less on my healing skill cooldown would have changed the course of the fight drastically.

the buff was held back because they care about pve and wvwvw balance -_-

they mention it in the sotg.

Gmtsai.6349:

Stop, just stop it people. While you guys are crying about warriors suck, there is someone already made a very strong build and been running in tournaments. The build is really viable and counters current Meta. Stop crying before you really understand warrior. Don’t just make lots of posts, lots of comments, lots of videos to make people think warrior sucks.

A warrior in high tier level pvp is there and been running a strong warrior comp, and people cannot handle it including me (I have faced the warrior today).

I don’t know if this will bothers the guy that I’m talking about, but I’m going to give out his name so people will go watch/ask him before you cry to warriors.

His name is Anas Tarcis, please, go ask him something before you cry so kitten warriors.

It is really annoy to see a community to cry on a thing because they all suck, and it is really annoy to see a community to cry on a thing that actually good.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=TrAn2a2bvko

Defektive.7283:

United we stand.

And divided we fall.

Defektive.7283:

Warlord.9074:

Defektive.7283:

If you like me, hate me, loath me, don’t know me or don’t care what I have to say atleast hear me out on this one subject.

---

For the longest time one of the main reasons I personally stuck to my Warrior was the community. They were so supportive, so determined to be heard and respected as a class. Because of that community I’ve come to meet and like/befriend a number of Warriors that talk frequently on the forums. Warriors who play completely different games (essentially), some WvW some PvE, some sPvP.

The one thing we all shared was a will to be better. Because of that we all did what we could, shared builds, talked strategies, supported each others streams and learned together how to play this class better.

However, I’ve noticed an increasing trend from Warriors on the Warrior forum. Bad mouthing, putting people down, criticism in an un-constructive manner and general depressing trolling. These actions made me reflect on the community that I’ve grown to love over the past 10 months.

I essentially came to the conclusion that for the few people who are intentionally trying to rain on everyone else’s parade; you need to re-evaluate your concept of contributing to the community.

Bringing each other down doesn’t help to raise the bottom line. As a class we have a stigma in the PvP community. Myself and others are trying our best to bring awareness of our class to the rest of the public. It’s an uphill battle, we fight closed minded perceptions and an unwillingness to learn and accept changes or new concepts.

Please don’t force us to fight within as well as fight others when it comes to the validity of our class.

United we stand.

The reason why I think people are trolling you and a few others is you guys are making the warrior sound like its ok. and its not ok its better. So its got to the point warrior is actually playable now. Barely playable, we dont want warrior to be barely playable we want it to be good. Everytime I see one of these posts where I dont know if its opposite trolling or just people that have low standards or what not saying “there is nothing wrong with warrior” Its guuuuud now. It makes a lot of us mad. Cuz that kinda attitude is not whats got anet to make changes to warriors, and with that kinda attitude they will do nothing more to warrior to make it good.

Warriors as a whole aren’t in a great spot that’s for sure. You can’t use rifle, or hammer in high end PvP. We’re limited to only a handful of builds that really make us work to have it be successful.

But that last word is why we’re viable, not OP or rediculous, but viable. We have successful builds that do work.

They may pigeon hole us, put us in a spot we’re not used to, or a playstyle we’re not accustomed to, but they work.

Plenty of other classes play the same way, many mesmers would love to run Mantra, but they can’t, they are stuck with Shatter.

The key is their community has come to the conclusion that for now, they have a viable build that’s working for them. It’s not perfect, it doesn’t do exactly what everyone would want. But it works.

We’re in a similar position. We have a handful of builds that work, they aren’t the most amazing or will rock someones socks off, but they work.

Only time and constructive feedback will fix the other issues, but for now we can’t go around saying we’re kitten poor when at a bare minimum, we’re viable.

—

Also in regards to low standards. I don’t think it’s a matter of low standards, but a matter of I’ll take what I can get. We havn’t been viable in a long time, to have something worth playing as right now is better than having nothing before hand.

I’m not sure if people are aware but a number of the changes ArenaNet made were requests that this community gave. Cleansing Ire was a specific request that was made by Daecollo! Although they implemented it slightly different, it still works exactly the same way.

“Plenty of other classes play the same way, many mesmers would love to run Mantra, but they can’t, they are stuck with Shatter. "

Stopped reading the thread right here. You really want to compare us to mesmers and say we are in the same boat?

You, sir, are either a fool or a troll.