Guild Wars 2

Really? I know there’s Invul Finishing in the game with Mist Form or Elixir S, but Vengeance? Really? Is this an oversight or did somebody at ArenaNet HONESTLY think this was a good idea? A Warrior can down you with Rocks and Hammers and then Vengeance, go Invulnerable for 3 seconds or whatever the duration is (Long Enough to Ignore my Fear and then Finish me) and Finish you.

I’ve never felt so cheated in my entire time playing this game than being beaten in a 1v1 like that. As if Vengeance wasn’t OverPowered enough, they’re actually able to invul finish from a downed state, which is impossible for every other class.

Please reconsider this design choice in your December 14 Update. Thank you.

Unless the warrior is traited he has a fair chance of dieing right after he kills you… and it’s been like this since the first open beta… maybe you should work on getting a bit more defense so you won’t end up in a downed fight? That always helps me. Just a bit more defense can be the difference between a downed fight and a stomp for your team.

Rofl. Just kite the warrior around. Yes, rocks do damage, but if you pop your survivability skills when you down him, there’s no way he’ll get you down before he pops vengeance. Once he does that, run around and wait for vengeance to wear out.

From a downed state, warriors have a fairly useless 2. In a bigger fight, you’ll only stop one person and then you’re finished by the others. In a 1v1, you must time the hammer just right or your opponent will have ample time to get up and finish you before you can vengeance. You can pop stability or something to ignore the hammer as well.

Also, the invulnerability is only for ~1 seconds upon getting up. Time your fear right and he’ll get affected by it. Invulnerability is not the issue here.

When a warrior gets downed, don’t let him down you. Downed players should not be downing other players unless the fight was very even, and in that case, you shouldn’t feel that “cheated”. There’s a good chance a warrior would kill you in an even down fight anyway, because rocks do a lot of damage.

A few other classes also have fairly powerful downed skills. Take a mesmer, for example. If you give them time to pop their 3, the phantasm does a lot of damage, and you’ll easily get downed. Pop stability when stomping. It’s extremely powerful. In any case, a warrior will not have enough time to pop vengeance if you’re efficient about stomping them, and if you were down low enough to be downed immediately after you downed them, then he would have beaten you in a down fight anyway, just like a mesmer or a guardian would.

In any case, if you’re up, then you should never be afraid of a warrior on vengeance. It’s only the people that aren’t efficent about stomping and then just dawdle around their downed body that have an issue.

It’s just the fact that warriors are so obviously the favorite profession of ANET that its frustrating to other classes. The warrior class is hands down the most polished, not only do they have a self Rez, that can be traited for 100% rez on kill, they ALSO get invulnerability with this skill?? Not only can the free Rez but they can be invul as well, no other class in the game gets free invul like that. It’s just frustrating to other classes like necros and other who have a ridiculous amount of bugs, the patches come out the classes bring up their concerns, and this patch warriors received the longbow buff, and 5!! posts in to their (warriors) complaint thread they have John Peters replying to their concerns. Where every other class got nothing, no response from devs, nothing.

(Just venting) as it feels like warriors are the spoiled child that gets all the attention.

You realize in a 1v1 situation if you down the warrior you have a 100% chance to stomp him before he can pop vengeance if you don’t waste more than 2 seconds before starting the first stomp?

If you can’t stomp him once before 2 seconds (ie health too low), you back off and heal, then attack him from distance to stop him from healing. Once he pops vengeance, you run away and kite till he dies again. Its actually stupidly easy….

Now in a 1on1 situation where both players are downed, the warrior is indeed very strong here, but that’s the trade off the warrior gets for having by far the weakest #2 downed skill (single target knock down with a semi long cast time)

You’re invulnerable for ~1 seconds because of rally. You don’t “get invulnerability”. It’s only the rally mechanic that every character gets upon being downed or rallied.

It’s just the fact that Thiefs, Guardians and Mesmers are so obviously the favorite professions of ANET that its frustrating to other classes. Thiefs, Guardians and Mesmers are hands down the most polished, not only do they get stealth and huge amounts of boons they have better access to invulnerabilities. Not only can they stealth and reset a fight if they make mistakes or have better synergy with high toughness and boons like protection, retaliation and regeneration they also have shorter cooldowns or none at all on better skillsets than most classes. It’s just frustrating to other classes like Necros, Engineers, Elemenatlists, Warriors and Rangers who have ridiculous amounts of bugs, the patches come out the classes bring up their concerns, and this patch Warrriors recieved the longbow buff. Which didn’t make any sense because no one uses the longbow as a direct damage weapon but still that doesn’t stop ignorant people from coming onto the forums and using the “longbow buff” as some kind of great smoking gun in their infantile at best posts. 5!! posts into their (warriors) complaint thread they have John Peters replying to their concern about the fast hands minor trait bug and telling them it’s hard to fix when he should be replying to the concerns of the Ranger forums.

(Just venting) as it seems like Ignorant D-bags are the spoiled children of the internet that get all the attention.

AlBundy.7851:

It’s just the fact that Thiefs, Guardians and Mesmers are so obviously the favorite professions of ANET that its frustrating to other classes. Thiefs, Guardians and Mesmers are hands down the most polished, not only do they get stealth and huge amounts of boons they have better access to invulnerabilities. Not only can they stealth and reset a fight if they make mistakes or have better synergy with high toughness and boons like protection, retaliation and regeneration they also have shorter cooldowns or none at all on better skillsets than most classes. It’s just frustrating to other classes like Necros, Engineers, Elemenatlists, Warriors and Rangers who have ridiculous amounts of bugs, the patches come out the classes bring up their concerns, and this patch Warrriors recieved the longbow buff. Which didn’t make any sense because no one uses the longbow as a direct damage weapon but still that doesn’t stop ignorant people from coming onto the forums and using the “longbow buff” as some kind of great smoking gun in their infantile at best posts. 5!! posts into their (warriors) complaint thread they have John Peters replying to their concern about the fast hands minor trait bug and telling them it’s hard to fix when he should be replying to the concerns of the Ranger forums.

(Just venting) as it seems like Ignorant D-bags are the spoiled children of the internet that get all the attention.

Marry me. Nao.

Lol….really…complaining about warriors downed state…I’ve heard it all now…go over to thief forum and really let em have it bro!

Recently.1043:

Now in a 1on1 situation where both players are downed, the warrior is indeed very strong here, but that’s the trade off the warrior gets for having by far the weakest #2 downed skill (single target knock down with a semi long cast time)

Warrior’s 2 is NOT the worst.
The worst is Engineer’s 2.

gimmethegepgun.1284:

Recently.1043:

Now in a 1on1 situation where both players are downed, the warrior is indeed very strong here, but that’s the trade off the warrior gets for having by far the weakest #2 downed skill (single target knock down with a semi long cast time)

Warrior’s 2 is NOT the worst.
The worst is Engineer’s 2.

How is it worse? They serve the same function (single target interrupt).

Warrior’s version has a ONE SECOND CAST TIME. Engie’s does not lol. Someone standing above you , you throw 1 rock too many by accident, they can stomp you before you finish your knockdown skill. Yes the engie version pulls them to you, but you are only gonna use your KNOCKDOWN skill to interrupt a STOMP anyways which means they are already RIGHT NEXT TO YOU, it doesn’t matter.

Warrior #2 skill is still the worst.

Recently.1043:

gimmethegepgun.1284:

Recently.1043:

Now in a 1on1 situation where both players are downed, the warrior is indeed very strong here, but that’s the trade off the warrior gets for having by far the weakest #2 downed skill (single target knock down with a semi long cast time)

Warrior’s 2 is NOT the worst.
The worst is Engineer’s 2.

How is it worse? They serve the same function (single target interrupt).

Warrior’s version has a ONE SECOND CAST TIME. Engie’s does not lol. Someone standing above you , you throw 1 rock too many by accident, they can stomp you before you finish your knockdown skill. Yes the engie version pulls them to you, but you are only gonna use your KNOCKDOWN skill to interrupt a STOMP anyways which means they are already RIGHT NEXT TO YOU, it doesn’t matter.

Warrior #2 skill is still the worst.

Except of course that it DOES have a cast time, probably about 3/4s or so, which you would know if you had used it instead of just looking it up on the wiki.
And the amount of time it disables them is far shorter than the 2s Hammer Toss gives you.

Warriors have the strongest downed state in the game. Sadly, they are under preforming pretty hard in PvP, so it doesn’t change much.

But if warriors get buffed, they should/will probably get nerfed in the downed state.

Teabaker.9524:

Warriors have the strongest downed state in the game. Sadly, they are under preforming pretty hard in PvP, so it doesn’t change much.

But if warriors get buffed, they should/will probably get nerfed in the downed state.

I wouldn’t say that. I think they have a 4-5 second timer on one of the strongest downed skills in the game (traited of course, or else it’s essentially a suicide run, which can’t be considered “strong”). A mesmer also has one of the strongest down 1 skills (confusion spam) and one of the highest damaging 3 skills as well.

Shadows, you should do some testing. Vengeance definitely gives invulnerability (idk how long exactly), and definitely grants some sort of stability for (much) longer than 1 sec. It’s pretty gay xD

Wait, why do I have to do some testing? I’m aware that you have invulnerability when you Vengeance. What I said is invulnerability is not a Vengeance mechanic, rather a rally mechanic, where Vengeance causes you to rally.

I suppose what I’m saying is…

Shadowscamp.8065:

Also, the invulnerability is only for ~1 seconds upon getting up. Time your fear right and he’ll get affected by it. Invulnerability is not the issue here.

…This is incorrect. if you 1v1 warrior ditto and he downs you and some seconds (not too few) later you down him, you win: you get a guaranteed stomp after using vengeance asap. I would assume the same goes for warrior vs necro / engineer / ranger / guardian.

yea try using number 3 in pve it has like maybe a 20%chance to bring you back chances are you die in pvp it might be strong but in pve pop it right before the mob finishes you and you have no other options cause chances are your dead anyways.

Doctor Orderly MD PhD DDS.7625:

I suppose what I’m saying is…

Shadowscamp.8065:

Also, the invulnerability is only for ~1 seconds upon getting up. Time your fear right and he’ll get affected by it. Invulnerability is not the issue here.

…This is incorrect. if you 1v1 warrior ditto and he downs you and some seconds (not too few) later you down him, you win: you get a guaranteed stomp after using vengeance asap. I would assume the same goes for warrior vs necro / engineer / ranger / guardian.

Well yes, I wasn’t disputing the fact that you can stomp after vengeancing. I was saying that invulnerability isn’t exactly the Vengeance mechanic. No other class can rally and fight normally for 15 seconds. This is true. However, all I said in that quote is that that it’s still possible to affect a warrior with control effects once the rally invulnerability wears off. I don’t have a timer on it, no, but if you’re any distance away from the warrior once he pops vengeance, the invulnerability will wear off by the time he gets to you. And yes, I’ve both been the one to vengeance as well been on the receiving end.

If you do not kite a vengeanced Warrior you do it wrong. He will die anyway.

Imo Vengeance is one of the most useless downed abilities in the game. In my Warriorlife I only witnessed a few times that Vengeancesbuff goes away in time.

In most cases wou fail to kill stuff in time or get rofletomped quickly because you rally with 30% HP only. Even if you happen to kill something in time it is ofen not enough and the buff stays and even if you traited for it and you kill something in time it buggs sometimes and you die anyway. (Note that there are alot of “If”)

If you get killed by a Warrior while Vengeance you just suck.

As was mentioned, there are a lot of ifs to make vengeance come out positive. Most of the time, even if everything goes your way, the best you can hope for is a tie (double kill). You also have to pray that no other enemy goes down while you are in vengeance as it’s a free rally for them to the dismay of your team.

On my warrior, I’d much rather have the thief or mesmer or even elementalist downed states. Thieves you pretty much have to hack to death, and mesmer and eles are just a pain in the neck to kill when you’re in the middle of a fight. I don’t envy ranger/engi/necro downed states, though. I would rank warriors downed state a distant fourth best with other three classes following close behind.

You were downed by an immobile guy throwing rocks? I don’t think vengeance is the problem you’re having here.