Guild Wars 2

Power guards (medi)
Power ele (Celestial)
Condi ranger
Condi thiefs (pistol)
Condi necro
Condi and power engies
Condi mesmers

After 9/9 patch we are just a little bit more kittened against them..

Yeah its not about 1vs1 in this game.. but it kinda sucks EVERYONE keeps QQing about warriors where they are just plain easy free kills vs them

Well, its tough. I tweaked my build a bit and I am doing okay, not nearly as good as pre-patch but that probably has to do with the changes of other classes just as much.

I find it harder to fight guards now and I have yet to win a dual against a mesmer since patch. Actually those ~8 mesmer encouters I got #rekt fast man!
Thiefes are the same as before, if he knows how to play you loose. If he does not → free bag. Medicore thiefes are harder to fight as before though.

Add in the factor that I am not the best warrior and still need to get used to my adjustments.

I barely encouter any condi players though, cant say much regarding that. The new trait is doing wonders though and condis in larger groups are non-existant for me.

I’ve been saying this forever. Warriors will lose EVERY fight against the classes you just listed as long as the players are equally skilled.

The really OP as hell class are meditation DPS guardians. The amount of blocks, blinds, protection, regen, overall sustain, and damage they put out is insane. You can straight up scepter number 1 warriors to death. No lie.

Thieves can be butter for my GS Warrior now, but not blind spamming thieves. Can’t hit those kitteners for anything, and they don’t stand still long enough to burst them down even if I wasn’t blind.

EvilSardine.9635:

I’ve been saying this forever. Warriors will lose EVERY fight against the classes you just listed as long as the players are equally skilled.

The really OP as hell class are meditation DPS guardians. The amount of blocks, blinds, protection, regen, overall sustain, and damage they put out is insane. You can straight up scepter number 1 warriors to death. No lie.

Medi guards have good access to protection and Regen? Unless they swap a meditation with a shout, and put 1 point in virtues they don’t have much protection at all, just blinds, blocks and dodges. Here’s a trick to scepter since it’s qute lackluster and slow, if you’re at ranged move side to side over half the projectiles will miss because of bad tracking. if you’re having trouble with blocks 1v1 grab Signet of might, since guards do not have Hard CC or soft CC unless they have hammer or Binding Blade on GS. You can do away with Dolyak Signet, since you don’t need the stability against them. Not to mention unless they are running traveler’s runes, they are slow, very slow.

all depends on your build. my shout bunker can deal with the builds listed but has big problems against zerker warrior / thief.

1.Take away your Greatsword
2. take away the axe
3. play a PvP build
fixed

From my perspective which is only wvw I don’t think op is correct. With all that mobility Just disengage recoup and re engage.
I find I play warrior like I play shatter mesmer full zerk and just wait for your moment pick your fights burst and leave.
The extra armor and hp just makes it that better.
But like I said I have no idea about pvp so apologies if that’s what this is regarding.

Warriors shall be weak vs all other classes?

Hard to believe if I see so many warriors who can easily dominate 3 players at once.

Black Teagan.9215:

Hard to believe if I see so many warriors who can easily dominate 3 players at once.

Horrible attempt. 0/10

Darksteel.8412:

warriors need a hardcore buff, heal sig could be upped quite abit again for starters, and some better condi removal without having to go troopers rune,…cleansing ire unless on LB is totall garbage vs invuln/blind/stealth/block/perma evade (ranger/thief) warrior is hands the most clumsy and weak class of gw2 and Ik the bandwagon will never agree…but also srsly the hardest class to play succesfully

Please don’t buff healing signet. I hate having to use a passive heal just because it’s the only skill that’s even viable. I’d love to use Healing Surge, reduce the cd with some seconds and I’d take that probably.

About condi removal I don’t think we need more because there’s alot of things you can do. You can use zerk stance, lyssa runes, stamina signet, purity/generosity sigils, CI, dogged march, minus condi food, minus condi runes, warhorn or trooper runes with shouts. I don’t think warrior is supposed to have more than that. I mean if I want I can spec full condi removal and be awesome, but I’d lack against power builds. Dodging actually gets you a long way in evading conditions. Thiefs are just ridicoulus though.

Then there’s alot to warrior builds. People seem obsessed with getting their toughness up for example, forgetting that toughness only applies when you’re being hit. Same for any stat ofcourse but especially toughness. I’d say a reasonably good player doesn’t need toughness, because a good player doesn’t get hit. (Unless thief)

Black Teagan.9215:

Warriors shall be weak vs all other classes?

Hard to believe if I see so many warriors who can easily dominate 3 players at once.

Lmao. Warr is probably the worst class for outnumbered fights. I know one warrior that can for real kill good players outnumbered and that’s RÔM[TCG] he soloed 3 people in the PvP world cup in china. Then he’s probably the best warr in gw2 but it is possible. But there’s just a handful who can do it for real against real players. Scrubs in WvW doesn’t count.

I’d say a reasonably good player doesn’t need toughness, because a good player doesn’t get hit. (Unless thief)

that bull…

Gamgee.8612:

Black Teagan.9215:

Warriors shall be weak vs all other classes?

Hard to believe if I see so many warriors who can easily dominate 3 players at once.

Lmao. Warr is probably the worst class for outnumbered fights. I know one warrior that can for real kill good players outnumbered and that’s RÔM[TCG] he soloed 3 people in the PvP world cup in china. Then he’s probably the best warr in gw2 but it is possible. But there’s just a handful who can do it for real against real players. Scrubs in WvW doesn’t count.

Enough said

Gamgee.8612:

Lmao. Warr is probably the worst class for outnumbered fights. I know one warrior that can for real kill good players outnumbered and that’s RÔM[TCG] he soloed 3 people in the PvP world cup in china.

LOL. The players must have been bad or he caught two of them with low health and cooldowns or the story is completely exaggerated or made up. There is no way anyone can 1v3 against EQUALLY skilled opponents. It doesn’t happen.

MARTIAL CLASSES FOR LIFE.

EvilSardine.9635:

LOL. The players must have been bad or he caught two of them with low health and cooldowns or the story is completely exaggerated or made up. There is no way anyone can 1v3 against EQUALLY skilled opponents. It doesn’t happen.

It is not exaggerated and you can witness it by yourself by watching the repeat broadcast of the said event. And obviously they weren’t EQUALLY skilled opponents since ROM is amongst the best warriors (if not the best)…
(and obviously, again, he didn’t kill all of his oponents by himself, but he did hold three of them off longer than anyone could have done, and didn’t even die in the end)

warriors are weak? try telling that to non guard/ele classes who wanna play a dungeon or god forbid a fractal

Vukorep.3081:

warriors are weak? try telling that to non guard/ele classes who wanna play a dungeon or god forbid a fractal

hmm what you doing, this is a PvP thread here.
not to mention thief has always been in dungeon speed clear and engi actually has 3rd highest dps
and ranger has been in speed clears as well…

FatRaKoon.1782:

It is not exaggerated and you can witness it by yourself by watching the repeat broadcast of the said event. And obviously they weren’t EQUALLY skilled opponents since ROM is amongst the best warriors (if not the best)…
(and obviously, again, he didn’t kill all of his oponents by himself, but he did hold three of them off longer than anyone could have done, and didn’t even die in the end)

You said “it’s not exaggerated” then you go on to change what was previously stated. The previous person said he “soloed 3 people”. Apparently now it’s just “held off” until help arrived. I was correct in saying the story was exaggerated.

Again, like I said. A warrior will never be able to take on 2 or more equally skilled opponents.

Well, put like this, you’re right. But the thing is, we’re talking GW2 PvP here and, aside from hotjoin, someone will never be forced in an outnumbered situation without getting some help at some point. That’s why I considered that ROM had soloed 3 people.

But then again, whereas you’re right when you say that a warrior could never 2V1 equally skilled opponents and kill them, your statement is yet kind of irrelevant since no class can 2V1 equally skilled opponents and be the victor…

So yeah, you’re technically right in what you say, but your point means nothing.

FatRaKoon.1782:

Well, put like this, you’re right. But the thing is, we’re talking GW2 PvP here and, aside from hotjoin, someone will never be forced in an outnumbered situation without getting some help at some point. That’s why I considered that ROM had soloed 3 people.

But then again, whereas you’re right when you say that a warrior could never 2V1 equally skilled opponents and kill them, your statement is yet kind of irrelevant since no class can 2V1 equally skilled opponents and be the victor…

So yeah, you’re technically right in what you say, but your point means nothing.

So you are saying that no class ( warrior included) can win 1v2 when the players are equally skilled.

So he is right about what he said and you were wrong on saying that warrior can solo 1v3.

Basically yes. But you know, my memory isn’t aging well so I can’t remember exactly how it went. The thing is, ROM is the best warrior around and I’ve seen him do incredible things with this class.

So why don’t you and EvilSardine go take a look at the actual footage of the match and see for yourselves if it bothers you so much ? Rather than making assumptions that he can’t take on 3 opponents. This would surely end this futile debate.

I very much do get wrecked in sPvP unless the person I’m fighting is incredibly terrible and even then, they have to not be playing one of the flavor of the month builds. Every time I fight another warrior, no matter how they build, it’s a long drawn out fight where neither of us really beat the other until someone’s team mate comes along. It feels like basically all the terribads in WvW complained about warriors and now the class is neutered in sPvP, not that they were ever in a good spot to begin with.

What builds are you all playing ? Because personnally I’m rather good with warrior class in PvP but as I play mostly for fun (no real training and all), I’m not nearly as good as I should be with all my hours of playing the game. I’m quite far away from being among the best warriors…

Yet, I don’t understand all the struggle most of you seem to be going through. Although I agree with OP (except for power engis) in general, I don’t think warriors are that weak. I mostly play meta hambow and I struggle only against condi mesmers, engi and blinding thieves (which I can’t kill). The rest, I’m not saying it’s easy but it’s manageable (even if I can’t kill them, like celestial ele, I don’t often die to them. Manage to hold them off at least).

When I’m not a teamfighter, I play celestial axe/sword build and I can hold close without to much trouble (except for decap/condi engis).

All this to say, I’m clearly not among the best but when I do PvP, even if there are some hard/really hard matchups I never felt “overwhelmed” by any other classes though. Meaning there rarely is a fight in which I die without having been able to do anything to the opponent.

P.S : Oh yeah, I almost forgot my nemesis class : medi guard XD. As EvilSardine said, they are completely OP… I guess I never won a fight against one of those (not counting the really, really bad ones).

Steelo.4597:

I’d say a reasonably good player doesn’t need toughness, because a good player doesn’t get hit. (Unless thief)

that bull…

Please counter with an argument. I have a good deal of experience going full zerker in WvW and PvP and would love to hear what your take of this is. I take it you think it’s bullkitten that you don’t need any toughness?

EvilSardine.9635:

Gamgee.8612:

Lmao. Warr is probably the worst class for outnumbered fights. I know one warrior that can for real kill good players outnumbered and that’s RÔM[TCG] he soloed 3 people in the PvP world cup in china.

LOL. The players must have been bad or he caught two of them with low health and cooldowns or the story is completely exaggerated or made up. There is no way anyone can 1v3 against EQUALLY skilled opponents. It doesn’t happen.

He didn’t stomp them, that is true. I would still say he soloed 3 players. You completely missed the point however. The "equally skilled " argument is just bullkitten because there’s no limit of how good you can be.

If I was to be the best player in the game there would be no equally skilled opponent. Do you get the point? There’s really no limit to how good you can be, and thus the true potential of the warrior haven’t been discovered.

There are actually players that are so good that they can 1v3 very good players. I would be pretty kittened off if I dueled and beat someone 5 times in a row and he said that “Yeah but if we were equally skilled you know you might not have won.”

Gamgee.8612:

Darksteel.8412:

warriors need a hardcore buff, heal sig could be upped quite abit again for starters, and some better condi removal without having to go troopers rune,…cleansing ire unless on LB is totall garbage vs invuln/blind/stealth/block/perma evade (ranger/thief) warrior is hands the most clumsy and weak class of gw2 and Ik the bandwagon will never agree…but also srsly the hardest class to play succesfully

Please don’t buff healing signet. I hate having to use a passive heal just because it’s the only skill that’s even viable. I’d love to use Healing Surge, reduce the cd with some seconds and I’d take that probably.

About condi removal I don’t think we need more because there’s alot of things you can do. You can use zerk stance, lyssa runes, stamina signet, purity/generosity sigils, CI, dogged march, minus condi food, minus condi runes, warhorn or trooper runes with shouts. I don’t think warrior is supposed to have more than that. I mean if I want I can spec full condi removal and be awesome, but I’d lack against power builds. Dodging actually gets you a long way in evading conditions. Thiefs are just ridicoulus though.

Then there’s alot to warrior builds. People seem obsessed with getting their toughness up for example, forgetting that toughness only applies when you’re being hit. Same for any stat ofcourse but especially toughness. I’d say a reasonably good player doesn’t need toughness, because a good player doesn’t get hit. (Unless thief)

Black Teagan.9215:

Warriors shall be weak vs all other classes?

Hard to believe if I see so many warriors who can easily dominate 3 players at once.

Lmao. Warr is probably the worst class for outnumbered fights. I know one warrior that can for real kill good players outnumbered and that’s RÔM[TCG] he soloed 3 people in the PvP world cup in china. Then he’s probably the best warr in gw2 but it is possible. But there’s just a handful who can do it for real against real players. Scrubs in WvW doesn’t count.

What build was ROM running?

warriors are still extremely strong in some cases but now with requirement of better timings and attention.

vincecontix.1264:

Gamgee.8612:

Darksteel.8412:

warriors need a hardcore buff, heal sig could be upped quite abit again for starters, and some better condi removal without having to go troopers rune,…cleansing ire unless on LB is totall garbage vs invuln/blind/stealth/block/perma evade (ranger/thief) warrior is hands the most clumsy and weak class of gw2 and Ik the bandwagon will never agree…but also srsly the hardest class to play succesfully

Please don’t buff healing signet. I hate having to use a passive heal just because it’s the only skill that’s even viable. I’d love to use Healing Surge, reduce the cd with some seconds and I’d take that probably.

About condi removal I don’t think we need more because there’s alot of things you can do. You can use zerk stance, lyssa runes, stamina signet, purity/generosity sigils, CI, dogged march, minus condi food, minus condi runes, warhorn or trooper runes with shouts. I don’t think warrior is supposed to have more than that. I mean if I want I can spec full condi removal and be awesome, but I’d lack against power builds. Dodging actually gets you a long way in evading conditions. Thiefs are just ridicoulus though.

Then there’s alot to warrior builds. People seem obsessed with getting their toughness up for example, forgetting that toughness only applies when you’re being hit. Same for any stat ofcourse but especially toughness. I’d say a reasonably good player doesn’t need toughness, because a good player doesn’t get hit. (Unless thief)

Black Teagan.9215:

Warriors shall be weak vs all other classes?

Hard to believe if I see so many warriors who can easily dominate 3 players at once.

Lmao. Warr is probably the worst class for outnumbered fights. I know one warrior that can for real kill good players outnumbered and that’s RÔM[TCG] he soloed 3 people in the PvP world cup in china. Then he’s probably the best warr in gw2 but it is possible. But there’s just a handful who can do it for real against real players. Scrubs in WvW doesn’t count.

What build was ROM running?

Hambow iirc. 2 0 6 0 6 most likely.

FatRaKoon.1782:

Basically yes. But you know, my memory isn’t aging well so I can’t remember exactly how it went. The thing is, ROM is the best warrior around and I’ve seen him do incredible things with this class.

So why don’t you and EvilSardine go take a look at the actual footage of the match and see for yourselves if it bothers you so much ? Rather than making assumptions that he can’t take on 3 opponents. This would surely end this futile debate.

That dont bother me at all. I was just saying that your sentence was giving him the reason.
Take care.

Yeah I must admit that my sentence was poorly made…

But what matters in the end is the fact that is all this complaining about how weak and underwhelming the warrior is. This is just sad and wrong.

It’s just a matter of being more careful than before, warrior isn’t about rushing recklessly in the thick of things. We still have good damage, good access to hard CC, strong condi dispell and insane passive defenses…

FatRaKoon.1782:

Yeah I must admit that my sentence was poorly made…

But what matters in the end is the fact that is all this complaining about how weak and underwhelming the warrior is. This is just sad and wrong.

It’s just a matter of being more careful than before, warrior isn’t about rushing recklessly in the thick of things. We still have good damage, good access to hard CC, strong condi dispell and insane passive defenses…

Even when not rushing recklessly into things, all traits that depend on adrenaline reset to 0 the moment we get out of combat. None of that can be mitigated by being more careful. We took a hard nerf as a class to our core mechanic.

EX:

Adrenal Health: Resets to 0 out of combat or on miss.
Cleansing Ire: Resets to 0 out of combat or on miss.
Berserkers power: Damage buff reset to 0 upon out of combat or miss.
Heightened Focus: Reset to 0 upon out of combat or miss.

I am fine with the burst skills depleting adrenaline on miss. That much is fine and acceptable skill floor raising.

The fact that, as warrior stands, my adrenaline benefits are nixed the moment I leave combat, is a hit to the core mechanics. If anything the decay rate should be halfed, if not put back to where it was initially. The fact that adrenaline depletes immediately upon leaving combat removes the strategy complexity that once existed there.

That, in conjunction with the nerf that heavily punishes Warrior missing a single skill in a world of dodges, blocks, blinds and evades that in many cases cannot be predicted, forces Warriors to often hoard their adrenaline, which is what the developers apparently wanted to avoid.

Azure The Heartless.3261:

That, in conjunction with the nerf that heavily punishes Warrior missing a single skill in a world of dodges, blocks, blinds and evades that in many cases cannot be predicted, forces Warriors to often hoard their adrenaline, which is what the developers apparently wanted to avoid.

The ooc decay rate could be slowed down a few steps i agree. But at the same time I have always hated the tactic of using a greatsword to get out of combat to heal and then come back in again. Like a cheap thief.

You can manage your adrenaline. Don’t get out of combat – stay within range. There are other weapons than GS. Some of them work better with the adrenaline nerf. You can use your hammer to jump 600 range without loosing your adrenaline, swap weapons before you land it and you can do it again in 10 seconds. Pair that with a sword in main hand and you have two 600 leaps on 8 and 10 second cd(Fast hands trait) as long as you’re in combat.

EDIT: Misread – part of the post still stands though.

Gamgee.8612:

Azure The Heartless.3261:

That, in conjunction with the nerf that heavily punishes Warrior missing a single skill in a world of dodges, blocks, blinds and evades that in many cases cannot be predicted, forces Warriors to often hoard their adrenaline, which is what the developers apparently wanted to avoid.

The ooc decay rate could be slowed down a few steps i agree. But at the same time I have always hated the tactic of using a greatsword to get out of combat to heal and then come back in again. Like a cheap thief.

You can manage your adrenaline. Don’t get out of combat – stay within range. There are other weapons than GS. Some of them work better with the adrenaline nerf. You can use your hammer to jump 600 range without loosing your adrenaline, swap weapons before you land it and you can do it again in 10 seconds. Pair that with a sword in main hand and you have two 600 leaps on 8 and 10 second cd(Fast hands trait) as long as you’re in combat.

EDIT: Misread – part of the post still stands though.

That situation you posted goes both ways, even. Said cheap thief can disengage to reset Warr adrenaline now. The moment a class can directly influence another classes core mechanic, something is wrong.

I’m against the “run away” option myself. but this time such a strategy directly affects my power and healing. I used to tolerate it because it was merely a way of delaying the inevitable, but now its a viable combat tactic. Instead of allowing yourself time to heal, OOC now negatively impacts your opponents strength. It’s like Anet was saying “ooh, cant beat this warrior? Here, let me soften him up for you” instead of actively encouraging a higher thought process for the currently standing warriors.

The sad thing is a direct handicap is not a “skill balance” or added “complexity” as far as strategy is concerned.

The sadder thing is the people howling like jackals about “warrior is brainless press F1 spam, need them to use more braincells” were actually partially satisfied with warriors just generally being harder to play, whether or not the factors leading to that difficulty were in the warrior’s control or not.

Aeolus.3615:

warriors are still extremely strong in some cases but now with requirement of better timings and attention.

I’ve been using this celestial s/s lb build someone gave me on here and it just helped my warrior tremendously. I was having a hard time after the patch as my axebow build wasn’t performing nearly as well as it used to, so I reluctantly tried this one with s/s lb and never looked back.

He can deal with most threats, hold a point pretty well, and even some of the few classes I struggle with such as dps guardians I still give a really good fight and force them to use everything. Warriors may still need some reworking, but they still have their place.

“Please counter with an argument. I have a good deal of experience going full zerker in WvW and PvP and would love to hear what your take of this is”

zerker just gets melted in under 2 seconds if you dont see it coming. of course if you have a guardian buddy giving you protection (equals a kittenload of toughness) and other buddies to softrez thats something else…but try soloing as a zerker and see what you get – a bunch of thiefs instant-killing you, some mesmer melting through your health in no time while escaping your gapclosers and even the occasional random ranger just dpsing you down in 3 seconds when you are out of dodges or facing the other direction. Btw i have a big deal of experience too running zerker in wvw – first year or so i exclusively played zerker warrior, mostly longbow & GS… fun if you melt face in a 1v2 but running back from spawn every 10-15 minutes sucks and rallying the enemy because you cant keep your game up under pressure.. tactics in this gameplay is mostly disengageing with GS and then go in for a kill -better roll a thief if you like that. Oh and there is the issue of arrow carts.

Azure The Heartless.3261:

Adrenal Health: Resets to 0 out of combat or on miss.
Cleansing Ire: Resets to 0 out of combat or on miss.
Berserkers power: Damage buff reset to 0 upon out of combat or miss.
Heightened Focus: Reset to 0 upon out of combat or miss.

I am fine with the burst skills depleting adrenaline on miss. That much is fine and acceptable skill floor raising.

The fact that, as warrior stands, my adrenaline benefits are nixed the moment I leave combat, is a hit to the core mechanics. If anything the decay rate should be halfed, if not put back to where it was initially. The fact that adrenaline depletes immediately upon leaving combat removes the strategy complexity that once existed there.

Are people seriously complaining about not having access to cleansing ire when out of combat? Azure, you realize it’s not even possible to be OOC with conditions on you, right? And I’m sure that you’re really going to miss adrenal health when your HP is replenishing at 10x the rate. Do you even actually use heightened focus or berserker’s power in a pvp build?

The only two times I see a warrior inconvenienced about losing adrenalin out of combat is either when they disengaged using mobility or are bringing it to the next fight. Working as intended, as I see it.

The current Adrenaline mechanic just isn’t fun. The rate that it diminishes ooc is simply too high for one. Secondly, the losing of all adrenaline on a “miss” with so many blinds, blocks, dodges, knockbacks, fears is kind of BS unless you have a bow. Should there be some type of penalty? Yea probably so but a full adrenaline drop for it is too high and most likely the only reason more kittening isn’t heard is because bow F1 isn’t hindered by this mechanic. The problem being is you ended up punishing almost every warrior build in spvp outside of hambow.

I’d say warriors are currently viable more due to a few amulets, sigils, runes, oh and bow of course, than almost anything else. Sigil of Intelligence allowing rather tanky hambow warriors to get their crits off even they might be running with almost no crit chance. Rune of Str to help self stack hambow warriors with 20-25 might. Lastly Celestial amulet that is allowing for some decent hybrid builds. Obviously all classes have access to this stuff but I’d say most warriors running spvp would be in a much tougher spot without these. Point being is it is leading to very few build options and making it harder to balance the class since it’s almost assuming this is the only option you can run.

I’d be very curious to see what the game balance would be like if nobody had sigils, runes, and just a few amulet choices. Not saying to do this but I’d like to see how the classes balanced out without the interaction of those. Anet has 8 classes with power builds, condition builds, various weapon loadouts…..then all of the various runes, sigils, amulets and I think they struggle trying to balance all of it.

Steelo.4597:

“Please counter with an argument. I have a good deal of experience going full zerker in WvW and PvP and would love to hear what your take of this is”

zerker just gets melted in under 2 seconds if you dont see it coming. of course if you have a guardian buddy giving you protection (equals a kittenload of toughness) and other buddies to softrez thats something else…but try soloing as a zerker and see what you get – a bunch of thiefs instant-killing you, some mesmer melting through your health in no time while escaping your gapclosers and even the occasional random ranger just dpsing you down in 3 seconds when you are out of dodges or facing the other direction. Btw i have a big deal of experience too running zerker in wvw – first year or so i exclusively played zerker warrior, mostly longbow & GS… fun if you melt face in a 1v2 but running back from spawn every 10-15 minutes sucks and rallying the enemy because you cant keep your game up under pressure.. tactics in this gameplay is mostly disengageing with GS and then go in for a kill -better roll a thief if you like that. Oh and there is the issue of arrow carts.

I do not agree with you at all. Hammer/Sword+Shield here and always zerk except if I’m supposed to go shouts for support. Endure pain, shield stance and signet of stamina is awesome for you. You will rarely be out of dodges and if you are you’ve got shield stance and endure pain. GS with zerker does work but your source of damage forces you to stand still for 3 whole seconds which is quite bad for a zerk. You have to be constantly on the move with zerk which GS and LB are quite bad weapons for I’d say. Once you’ve used rush and whirl you’re as stationary as a statue. Both hammer and sword has a 600 leap on 8 sec cd while in combat. Well anyway, you play your game I play mine. Stop calling bull on stuff you don’t know though. Ask instead how if you’re interested. If you’re not then you’ve allready stopped evolving as a player.

Shanks.2907:

Azure The Heartless.3261:

Adrenal Health: Resets to 0 out of combat or on miss.
Cleansing Ire: Resets to 0 out of combat or on miss.
Berserkers power: Damage buff reset to 0 upon out of combat or miss.
Heightened Focus: Reset to 0 upon out of combat or miss.

I am fine with the burst skills depleting adrenaline on miss. That much is fine and acceptable skill floor raising.

The fact that, as warrior stands, my adrenaline benefits are nixed the moment I leave combat, is a hit to the core mechanics. If anything the decay rate should be halfed, if not put back to where it was initially. The fact that adrenaline depletes immediately upon leaving combat removes the strategy complexity that once existed there.

Are people seriously complaining about not having access to cleansing ire when out of combat? Azure, you realize it’s not even possible to be OOC with conditions on you, right? And I’m sure that you’re really going to miss adrenal health when your HP is replenishing at 10x the rate. Do you even actually use heightened focus or berserker’s power in a pvp build?

The only two times I see a warrior inconvenienced about losing adrenalin out of combat is either when they disengaged using mobility or are bringing it to the next fight. Working as intended, as I see it.

Perhaps I need to specify what I mean in these situations.

Regarding both Adrenal Health and Cleansing ire in the situation above:

>Encounter thief, swoop ranger, mesmer
>Battle commences.
>utility condi mitigation burned, on CD
>Adrenaline full

>opponent disengages

>OOC

>opponent returns and loads you with condis.

At this point your Adrenal Health and Ire are both at 0 and utility skill is on CD. Assuming you have SoR burned, at this situation the warrior is inconvenienced through class mechanic drawback instead of lack of skill. At this Condis are almost guaranteed if the warrior is not carrying LB or has a large wind-up burst, assuming the opponent can dodge, makes good use of interrupts, or has reasonable stealth.

There should not be -any- situation in which one opponent can dictate whether or not the other can use their core mechanic, much less benefit from the traits attached to it.

Warriors, as they stand now are spoonfeeding their opponents. their F1 skill more often than not requires them to land a single skill that is easily dodgeable, they howl out how full their adrenaline is, and they have no evasion tactics apart from moving really fast in a specific direction, so they’re easy to track.

Now we just have “you can reduce their healing/power/crit chance/burst damage by running away for a couple seconds” piled on top of the already low-skill ceiling.

I’m not interested though. And i dont think its any better just because you list some warrior skills. i know them already and i run sword / hammer on my raid warrior. i ran gs / lb back when frenzy & 100b wasnt nerfed and my longbow critted for 8k aoe (from the safety of a wall) and i could melt 3 people in 2 seconds with frenzy gs when they werent alert – it wasnt made for roaming, it was to dominate low-tier wvw in every aspect – clearing siege, defending, taking camps and killing players and it worked as an allrounder. Nowadays damage on zerker is low and in 1vx zerker can go home. Grats on using signet of stamina though, thats a nice choice. But still you are no evasion thief with it and if you get a good crit from a power thief or a phantom you are almost dead. mesmer, thief -those are the classes where i’d recommend building zerker. Power warrior is kinda bad overall these days and going 2k armor melee is just asking to get backstabbed or melted in AC fire. I think the argument “good players dont need toughness” is more aimed at your own esteemed skill level then at the objective viability of your build.

Darksteel.8412:

warriors need a hardcore buff, heal sig could be upped quite abit again for starters,

Sorry had to ROFL on that one. Healing Signet is the most OP item a warrior has. My guard would sell his soul for such passive healing. I have to spec AH or wear cleric gear and dodge like a mofo to beat that in which case i hit like a wet noodle.

Spartacus.3192:

Sorry had to ROFL on that one. Healing Signet is the most OP item a warrior has. My guard would sell his soul for such passive healing. I have to spec AH or wear cleric gear and dodge like a mofo to beat that in which case i hit like a wet noodle.

lol wut

I’d love for my warrior to have the blocks, blinds, invuln, protection, regen, teleports, and crazy sustain that even zerker guardians have.

Guardians will always dominate warriors in a 1v1. A group of 5 guardians would wipe the floor with 5 warriors as well. So what does this make warriors? Pretty useless I’d say.

Here’s the best advice coming from someone who’s main has been a warrior since the betas:

If you want to win every duel and every group fight then just stop using your warrior and run a guardian. If you want a challenge, though, and don’t want to fall asleep while destroying every class then stick with warrior. I still main my warrior because it’s fun as hell but I accept I’ll never beat most classes/builds out there.

Its a theme at this point, the only proff’s that can melee are thieves, thanks to the invis or evade spam and guardians when they have all cd’s up.
Unless you’re running as cc/fire field bot in team q, it’s pretty sad tbh.

EvilSardine.9635:

FatRaKoon.1782:

It is not exaggerated and you can witness it by yourself by watching the repeat broadcast of the said event. And obviously they weren’t EQUALLY skilled opponents since ROM is amongst the best warriors (if not the best)…
(and obviously, again, he didn’t kill all of his oponents by himself, but he did hold three of them off longer than anyone could have done, and didn’t even die in the end)

You said “it’s not exaggerated” then you go on to change what was previously stated. The previous person said he “soloed 3 people”. Apparently now it’s just “held off” until help arrived. I was correct in saying the story was exaggerated.

Again, like I said. A warrior will never be able to take on 2 or more equally skilled opponents.

Evil Sardine is the king of exaggeration and thinks he is the entire team in eotm. He gets all salty when he dies and claims one player killed the entire team.

landhere.8576:

Evil Sardine is the king of exaggeration and thinks he is the entire team in eotm. He gets all salty when he dies and claims one player killed the entire team.

You might be mistaking me for another player. The only time I go on EOTM is when my friends and I all run guardians and essentially do 8v30 when our borderlands are completely dead. Easy mode guardian steamrolling.

I’m a mesmer, but allow me to give you my take on a warrior.

But firstly, do NOT go asking to buff that healing signet. It may have just been a single post in this entire thread, but that signet is really, really annoying to deal with. Sometimes it feels like I’m getting 0 net damage[probably am] just because I let off the pressure for a second.

Now, back on topic, I think of warriors as one of two things: easy-to-hard learning curve, and well-rounded. The first part is simply saying that the skill cap to become viably good with a warrior is less than that of other classes, allowing players to quickly pick up warriors and beat other classes of around the same skill level on the lower tier of PvP. The problem warriors have, though, is that while it’s easy to pick up and learn, it’s much harder to progress and master. It’s like being stuck at 70-80% efficiency from the start. For an elementalist, let’s say, the learning curve is higher and the ele will start at around 10% efficiency, but gradually rise up to 80-90% given time to learn the profession. Within the same amount of time, a warrior will have improved to 82% efficiency.

Now, warriors as a class are very well-rounded, putting it lightly. But they’re well rounded very strongly, meaning that they can do most of what they put their minds too, but aren’t particularly good at becoming specialists[correct me if I’m wrong]. In this way, they have nothing they’re weak to, but they don’t hard counter anything[some argue they hard counter everything].

Anyway, that’s how I view it, and might explain why you feel less powerful in certain PvP situations, though warriors are by no means weak. In fact, by my definition, warriors can never be “weak” just because of how they’re balanced to handle a good amount of everything[Direct damage, condition damage, cleansing, support, defense, etc.]. It’s this sort of superman-likeness that gains Warrior a lot of its hate.

Dondagora.9645:

I’m a mesmer, but allow me to give you my take on a warrior.

But firstly, do NOT go asking to buff that healing signet. It may have just been a single post in this entire thread, but that signet is really, really annoying to deal with. Sometimes it feels like I’m getting 0 net damage[probably am] just because I let off the pressure for a second.

Now, back on topic, I think of warriors as one of two things: easy-to-hard learning curve, and well-rounded. The first part is simply saying that the skill cap to become viably good with a warrior is less than that of other classes, allowing players to quickly pick up warriors and beat other classes of around the same skill level on the lower tier of PvP. The problem warriors have, though, is that while it’s easy to pick up and learn, it’s much harder to progress and master. It’s like being stuck at 70-80% efficiency from the start. For an elementalist, let’s say, the learning curve is higher and the ele will start at around 10% efficiency, but gradually rise up to 80-90% given time to learn the profession. Within the same amount of time, a warrior will have improved to 82% efficiency.

Now, warriors as a class are very well-rounded, putting it lightly. But they’re well rounded very strongly, meaning that they can do most of what they put their minds too, but aren’t particularly good at becoming specialists[correct me if I’m wrong]. In this way, they have nothing they’re weak to, but they don’t hard counter anything[some argue they hard counter everything].

Anyway, that’s how I view it, and might explain why you feel less powerful in certain PvP situations, though warriors are by no means weak. In fact, by my definition, warriors can never be “weak” just because of how they’re balanced to handle a good amount of everything[Direct damage, condition damage, cleansing, support, defense, etc.]. It’s this sort of superman-likeness that gains Warrior a lot of its hate.

I’m proud that an objective look at the warrior from a Mesmer could hit the nail on the head like that.

However, the fact alone that warriors get to a point where they give diminishing returns with a player’s comparative skill level -is- a weakness. There may be people that say Warriors -hard counter- everything, but its reasonable to say that anyone on par with or better than the warrior skill-wise with a different class will hard counter them, in high to top-tier play where mistakes are close to unforgivable.

Eh. Im new(ish) to Warrior and loving it. Play mostly WvW roaming and zerging. For me its about watching enemy boons since we have no reliable boon strip. Then interrupt and evisc for the win. Thieves can still be slippery though but for me it’s more of a l2p issue rather than a sense of being hobbled vs certain classes.

In case of emergency just run run run away.

Dondagora.9645:

I’m a mesmer, but allow me to give you my take on a warrior.

But firstly, do NOT go asking to buff that healing signet. It may have just been a single post in this entire thread, but that signet is really, really annoying to deal with. Sometimes it feels like I’m getting 0 net damage[probably am] just because I let off the pressure for a second.

Now, back on topic, I think of warriors as one of two things: easy-to-hard learning curve, and well-rounded. The first part is simply saying that the skill cap to become viably good with a warrior is less than that of other classes, allowing players to quickly pick up warriors and beat other classes of around the same skill level on the lower tier of PvP. The problem warriors have, though, is that while it’s easy to pick up and learn, it’s much harder to progress and master. It’s like being stuck at 70-80% efficiency from the start. For an elementalist, let’s say, the learning curve is higher and the ele will start at around 10% efficiency, but gradually rise up to 80-90% given time to learn the profession. Within the same amount of time, a warrior will have improved to 82% efficiency.

Now, warriors as a class are very well-rounded, putting it lightly. But they’re well rounded very strongly, meaning that they can do most of what they put their minds too, but aren’t particularly good at becoming specialists[correct me if I’m wrong]. In this way, they have nothing they’re weak to, but they don’t hard counter anything[some argue they hard counter everything].

Anyway, that’s how I view it, and might explain why you feel less powerful in certain PvP situations, though warriors are by no means weak. In fact, by my definition, warriors can never be “weak” just because of how they’re balanced to handle a good amount of everything[Direct damage, condition damage, cleansing, support, defense, etc.]. It’s this sort of superman-likeness that gains Warrior a lot of its hate.

Well put. This is how I view my warrior.

With the nerf to adrenaline, Warriors are definetly the weakest dueling profession now, but that doesn’t make them weak vs all classes considering this is a team oriented game. They provide stability stomps, strong CCs, banner resses and decent mobility.