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Posted by: SpecterMAT.7306

SpecterMAT.7306

Hey guys.
I’m a Warrior playing since beta.
I do both PvP and PvE equally and loved pvp all in my life.

But since these few past months, i got really sad about my profession.
In PVP all I see is copy paste warrior builds.
Typical hammer-bow, the traits which is described in the forum with the runes, with the exact rotation.

I join a pvp match then I check how many warriors does this match have.
Oh look, 4 warriors. I bet all of them are hambow with the same traits and tactic.
Then. I am right.
Everytime I meet a warrior i burst into laugh. “Look another hambow idiot try to CC me and try to kill me with the wooden bow”.
I mean,we became a joke. Is there no shame in us?

The current meta doesnt force us to use only 1 build, and only this build.
I always run with my own builds, changing it up sometimes just for fun and I still kill people, still having fun and I still can defend points.

Maybe because we have so many new players or players who think “Oh warriors are OP. I make one and kill people with it. Look Hambow build. I CTRL+V to myself lul”.
Or I don’t really know but it’s terrible that 95% of the PvP warriors are running a COPY PASTE build.

Before we got “buffed”,we were the lowest part of foodchain in PvP, everybody pwned us. I remember those days, when you really had to work for kills in those days, and everybody laughed at “oh look warrior,free kill.” sentences.
But the current state is kind of a joke now with hambow.

Maybe I’m the one who is kittening about it. But warrior profession was a really cool and awesome community. We put our axes and greatsword in everybody’s face ,rampaged through everybody with our mighty nord beard.
But we reduced now into mindless copy paste profession :\

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Posted by: Black Teagan.9215

Black Teagan.9215

The warrior was never a “free kill”.
Already after the release, was it no big problem to fight and defeat against up to 3 persons at the same time, especially if all are melees.
I know that, I do this more than once.

Ok, against condition builds was they a little weak, but the enhancement of the condition removes was to much and comes to fast at once.

BTT:

Why everybody use Hammer, is easy to answer.
They are really strong, against the other classes, especially the Burstskill.
The Hammer have more and fast recharge CC skills, than you can dogde or break.
Combine with the high condition remove from the 20 points in Defense and the high baseHP, the long running stability, incl. the armor of 3k as a fullberserker and hardcounters to reduce a lot of dmg, the warriors is a stronghold against Berserker and Conditionbuilds, while they deal high dmg and CCs.
And the massive heal from HS, and AH helps them alot.

The Bow isn’t important, but he help to pinned down the others.

That all warriors running the same build comes from this (^).
Why should they play a weaker build, or try to find another good/better build, if this game can be so easy?

Caleb Ferendir
-Charr Thief-
It’s good to be bad!

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Posted by: jihm.2315

jihm.2315

the problem is that Anet delays to fix classes lately, they left hambow warrior on the top for a long time now and elementalist to the bottom .

but its ok they cant know everything they are human too.

i made some epic battles vs warriors with my guardian in wvw.
its good to challenge the best sometimes .

a warrior last night that beaten me just by a little didnt finish me he emoted /salute and left.

id say that you have to be play really perfect to stand a chance against warrior but most times mistakes are unavoidable.

where warriors are mostly broken is at kitting while regenerating and winning fights like this.

lets hope the incoming healing signet nerf brings them in line with other classes.

action combat made mmos better lol

(edited by jihm.2315)

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Posted by: SpecterMAT.7306

SpecterMAT.7306

I think Jihm you see this topic differently than what it is.

I agree the game still needs a lots of balance. But seeing my profession running 1 build makes my heart in pain.

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Posted by: deathTouch.9706

deathTouch.9706

I think Jihm you see this topic differently than what it is.

I agree the game still needs a lots of balance. But seeing my profession running 1 build makes my heart in pain.

This is exactly my sentiment too. We have access to nearly every weapon in the game, yet the number of viable weapon sets, and furthermore builds with those weapon sets, are so limited that it calls into question why the other weapons even exist.

My solution: The skill ceiling AND floor of the weapon sets and utilities of the class need to be increased, separating skilled players from unskilled players within the class further, and the weapon sets need to be reworked and, in general, buffed, with attention and FOCUS on a niche role for each weapon. Right now we have a lot of weapons that are completely inferior to other weapons in terms of DPS, CC and utility. Also, to further diversify the class, each weapon should have power, hybrid or condi-focused options available to them, rather than having certain weapons that are “power only” or “condi only”.

The issue that has been pointed out before many times is that the warrior is the easiest class to just pick up as an unskilled player and perform at a level that isn’t complete rallybait, like what would happen if that same player was with a thief or ele. The skill ceiling, though, is also relatively low given the limited options Wars have available in terms of weapon sets, telegraphed abilities, and generally boring utilities that either “prevent X type of damage”, “Give X boon(s)”, or “remove (x) conditions”. The only interesting utilities like Frenzy aren’t even unique to the class and rarely chosen since they are relatively situational and/or a liability in certain situations.

TL:DR Buff useless warrior weapon sets while reworking the class to be more difficult to play effectively.

V deathTouch V – Warrior
STD [Scarlet Gave Me Harpies]
Maguuma

(edited by deathTouch.9706)

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Posted by: redslion.9675

redslion.9675

I think Jihm you see this topic differently than what it is.

I agree the game still needs a lots of balance. But seeing my profession running 1 build makes my heart in pain.

Well, I tried to play glass war some time ago. You don’t last on the point, under AoE spam. Problem is most interesting builds are just wiped out by this brainless meta.

I shifted to meditation guardian because it’s a balanced build (never liked full glass or full bunker), without being brainless (defensive mechanics are much more active, and killing people with guard weapons feels much more rewarding). I don’t have cc or other stuff, but I think I got better by changing class.

You will never be able to know what an engineer is going to do next…

because he doesn’t know it himself

(edited by redslion.9675)

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Posted by: hellsmachine.4085

hellsmachine.4085

I don’t use a meta build. I use axe/mace sword/shield. Made it up myself. It’s very effective in PVP, plenty of CC and decent damage, whilst being very tanky.

Most people just want something that wins without experimenting. There is actually a lot of things that are viable with warrior.

(edited by hellsmachine.4085)

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Posted by: hellsmachine.4085

hellsmachine.4085

Hambow warriors are harmless. Melandru + stability = useless warrior. Condition warriors though. Well we all know that condition damage in general needs a major nerf.

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Posted by: Ilias.8647

Ilias.8647

…Well we all know that condition damage in general needs a major nerf.

Just to correct you…

Actually conditions themselves doesn’t need a nerf (like bleeding dealing too much damage to handle). Its just that certain professions are very good with overloading targets with various conditions (many of them damage dealing) … which means that its hard for you to cleanse them all while others can simply apply the same few conditions over and over that even if you cleanse them you regain them huge stacks before your condition removal skill is out of CD.

Still, this is possible due to to profession specific skills and certain runes (perplexity for example), not the conditions themselves.

Currently residing on … Gandara[EU]

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Posted by: Buzzcrave.6197

Buzzcrave.6197

…Well we all know that condition damage in general needs a major nerf.

Just to correct you…

Actually conditions themselves doesn’t need a nerf (like bleeding dealing too much damage to handle). Its just that certain professions are very good with overloading targets with various conditions (many of them damage dealing) … which means that its hard for you to cleanse them all while others can simply apply the same few conditions over and over that even if you cleanse them you regain them huge stacks before your condition removal skill is out of CD.

Still, this is possible due to to profession specific skills and certain runes (perplexity for example), not the conditions themselves.

Wrong. Conditions do need a nerf. Either reducing the damage per tick, or making it not being able to reapply 5x faster than you cleanse, or reduce its duration. Stop defending this broken mechanic, it is even worst than defending a D/P blind spam teef. The fact that conditions can burst you down faster than power or on par with power is just total bs. Conditions are supposed to kill your enemy slowly, not bursting through that 20k hp in few seconds.

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Posted by: jayson.6512

jayson.6512

…Well we all know that condition damage in general needs a major nerf.

Just to correct you…

Actually conditions themselves doesn’t need a nerf (like bleeding dealing too much damage to handle). Its just that certain professions are very good with overloading targets with various conditions (many of them damage dealing) … which means that its hard for you to cleanse them all while others can simply apply the same few conditions over and over that even if you cleanse them you regain them huge stacks before your condition removal skill is out of CD.

Still, this is possible due to to profession specific skills and certain runes (perplexity for example), not the conditions themselves.

have you watch a video a condi warrior can melt you in seconds

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Posted by: Travis the Terrible.4739

Travis the Terrible.4739

The warrior was never a “free kill”.

No idea what game you were playing but playing a warrior at release was like taking a knife to a war zone known for using nuclear weapons.

Why would you play a warrior when you could be a d/d thief at release press 4 twice and down 3 WARRIORS AT ONCE? Why play a warrior when you could never die on a guardian bunker against 50 people at release? Why play a warrior when a ranger would just kill you by pressing the 1 key and never using any of his other skills at release? Was having to go through all of this worth it to just press f1 with an axe and crit an ele/thief for 15k? Not really.

The warrior was never a free kill at release. They were an easy kill 90% of the time just like how eles are right now. How often do you find yourself dying to an ele these days? If anything warriors now are more likely to not run away till they find a friend in pvp but run in head first and take some abuse till an ally comes in to help or you kill them.

Follow the darkness into the depths, it’s more fun than the light can provide.

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Posted by: redslion.9675

redslion.9675

Hambow warriors are harmless. Melandru + stability = useless warrior. Condition warriors though. Well we all know that condition damage in general needs a major nerf.

Those warriors are powered by their own tryhardness in lives completely devoid of fun. No way to stop them.XD

You will never be able to know what an engineer is going to do next…

because he doesn’t know it himself

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Posted by: BurrTheKing.8571

BurrTheKing.8571

In PvP there will almost always be one or two builds that stand above the rest. Hambow brings a lot to both 1v1 (although more and more builds can beat it recently) and team fights (which is more important). The ability to deny a stomp on a friend on enemies that aren’t using stability/invulnerability is invaluable. Bow keeps you from being kited (in fact I find it hard to run any build w/o bow now), has good AoE, and almost guaranteed condition cleanse.

It’s not that PvP Warriors are lazy and only want to copy-paste, it’s that running pretty much anything else screws your team over. You’re not “better” for running a non-meta build, and doing so may cost your team the win. Even the so-called OP condi Warrior is not as effective in TPvP as Hambow because in a team fight that build brings a lot less to the table. Right now a Decap Engi would be better at home bunker as well because it can hold out longer in 1vX situations.

Serious players will run what it currently the strongest build because they find winning fun. This is true in any game be it FPS, RTS, MMO, Moba, whatever. Unless someone comes up with a better build/strategy they’re going to stick to what’s best. I have tried MANY different builds while playing with friends that are fine with me doing it and I always find it inferior to Hambow. I’m playing around with a support build but even then I could just be smashing people’s face in with a Hammer. That being said t is possible to run what you want but ONLY if you build your team around it. Most people just solo-join so Hambow is a much safer option and you won’t be screwing people over.

What will fix this is ANet bringing other options up to Hambow’s level. Nerfing right now would just make things worse for most classes outside of a few situations. Warrior actually had a few more viable builds/roles but they have been nerfed to the point were there’s no point in bringing them. Mace/GS used to bring good single target lockdown/DPS but now its damage has been nerfed and Skull Crack, while still useable, just doesn’t stand up to Hammer now.

Some people are going to take this personally but I don’t intend it as such: if you think your custom build is serving you just fine chances are it isn’t as good as Hambow. Yes, it may excel at different things, but chances are those roles are better filled by another class. I don’t like that this is how it is, but I also don’t intend to screw people over by running something that isn’t optimal. It’s not “tryhard,” just respect for my teammates.

Just an angry old man…

Old Man Burr (War), Bad Hat Ben (Engi), Manly Manny Manson (Guard)

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Posted by: ens.9854

ens.9854

Cleansing ire sort of forces a lot of warriors to use bow since it is a guaranteed cleanse. GS, rifle, sword are all pretty bad burst skills and mace can be hard to land. Hammer is the 2nd easiest to land for cleanse but can still be blinded/blocked for a massive blowout.

I’ve been messing around with axe/shield again with spiked armor and air runes—it’s pretty effective, spiked armor is 50% uptime on retal and the runes can crit for 4k on zerkers

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Posted by: redslion.9675

redslion.9675

Problem is hambow doesn’t make you a better player.

You will never be able to know what an engineer is going to do next…

because he doesn’t know it himself

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Posted by: BurrTheKing.8571

BurrTheKing.8571

Problem is hambow doesn’t make you a better player.

Neither does running something else.

Just an angry old man…

Old Man Burr (War), Bad Hat Ben (Engi), Manly Manny Manson (Guard)

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Posted by: Ayrilana.1396

Ayrilana.1396

Players using a specific build and such isn’t just a warrior thing. You will see it across all classes. Only about 1% of players actually know how to analyze the traits and create a build while the rest rush to the forums to get theirs. Creating and testing out a new build was half the fun in all aspects of the game. With guides now giving out skill rotations, the last step now is just to let someone else play for you.

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Posted by: JVJD.4912

JVJD.4912

nah i have seen many other types of warriors in pvp, hammer/bow is bleh weak no mobility,no one shot dead player skills, just a prolonged fight, so boring and lust lacking except for the smash stuff

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Posted by: Ilias.8647

Ilias.8647

Wrong. Conditions do need a nerf. Either reducing the damage per tick, or making it not being able to reapply 5x faster than you cleanse, or reduce its duration. Stop defending this broken mechanic, it is even worst than defending a D/P blind spam teef. The fact that conditions can burst you down faster than power or on par with power is just total bs. Conditions are supposed to kill your enemy slowly, not bursting through that 20k hp in few seconds.

You said it yourself… The problem is that certain professions can apply too many stacks of a large enough variety of conditions for fair enough time AND that they can reapply them quite fast.

Even at 2000 condition dmg the bleed will deal 137dmg/stack… the issue starts when someone can apply 15xbleed,poison, 3xtorment, 3xconfusion, 5xvulnerability,cripple… faster than you can cleanse.

have you watch a video a condi warrior can melt you in seconds

Yeah, if you go WvW and bring no condition removal its more than possible. But that is like going into WvW with full zerker gear…

Currently residing on … Gandara[EU]

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Posted by: Evalia.7103

Evalia.7103

I don’t know, I really like the bow. But hammer is just not my thing, I use GS together with it. It seems easy to avoid, but I always manage to find that target that cannot, mostly due to cooldowns, sometimes due to lack of condition removal(bola’s, OP Pin Down, Fear me into HBWWRush can be pretty scary). Basically, I’ve found that I love playing all or nothing – and I’m even thinking of changing the OP signet to Defiant Stance – I really like the potential of it. Especially combined with frenzy and timed right.

(edited by Evalia.7103)

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Posted by: LoneWolfie.1852

LoneWolfie.1852

Hambow warriors are harmless. Melandru + stability = useless warrior. Condition warriors though. Well we all know that condition damage in general needs a major nerf.

http://youtu.be/ZboUAtJSIt8?t=4m45s

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Posted by: Blackjack.2083

Blackjack.2083

In sPvP I’d say if they eliminated LB from Warrior…..or dramatically redesigned it….50% of the cries for “NERF WARRIOR NOW OP!!!” would be eliminated. Being able to completely set yourself up to be tanky then do great condition damage while standing in your fire field that often times takes up the whole control point is dumb.

I’d say a good 80% of the warriors I run across in solo Q all seem to be condition builds….hell, I play warrior and I think its lame as well.

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Posted by: KeyboardCowboy.8465

KeyboardCowboy.8465

I actually don’t the Hambow build for my Warrior in sPvP and have been doing very well with a Sword/Shield Crit build. I run Bull Rush, Kick and Signet of Fury as my skills with the Signet Ultimate which keeps me at about a 50-70 Crit chance which may be a little over kill but a 2.5K crit on a kick to the face and the lovely 5-6k crit on Final Thrust is amazing. The build allows me to CC my target pretty well between Shield Bash, Kick and Bullrush to get their health at about 40-50% to finish them off with a Final Thrust. I do carry a long bow, but typically only use it to take down runners when they are at a sliver of HP for the kill. I can also utilize Bull Rush, Kick and SB to stop those pesky enemies from finishing off my teammates. The only classes I have difficulties fighting are Zoo classes such as Mesmers, Spirit Rangers and Necros just because of the targeting issues that I will eventually get better at. I honestly do not care for Hammer/GS, because when I made a warrior I wanted to be the gallant Knight style character and through some brewing have managed to develop a very competitive Sword/Shield build that I enjoy playing.

My Build: http://gw2skills.net/editor/?vIAQNAseTj8cU2ZVH+dwJaAwo4HiOKoaK1D6mrNA-TsAg0CnI0SplTLjWStsaNGZxxMAA

(edited by KeyboardCowboy.8465)