Guild Wars 2

To be a bunker you need three important things…
1 Protection
Protection is the most powerful boon in the game, it is almost like having a second set of armor, without protection don’t even attempt to be a bunker.

2 Condition Removal
The second most important thing to a bunker, this is very important. Conditions are really bad. Often in PvP, many condition users will focus fire on you because they know Warrior cannot do anything to remove conditions quickly and are very “easy prey” to them, as a necromancer player I usually focus on warriors (I can tell if they have a signet) for epidemic, because spreading his conditions to the entire raid is always good times, I mean what is he going to do about it? Lol.

3 Self Healing
We don’t really have many unique options for healing, and our healing is pretty much subpar, Adrenal Health should be healing for twice as much as it does now. I suggested awile back that we should gain health for each strike of adrenaline, this would allow new builds and abuse our “gain extra strike.” traits we have all over, however this just makes the hammer/mace even more worthless then they already are, because of slow attacks and the fact blind wrecks our day.

This is why warrior will never be a bunker and will never have sustain.

Daecollo.9578:

2 Condition Removal
… Warrior cannot do anything to remove conditions quickly and are very “easy prey” to them

Pff Daecollo. Shoutsheals + sup soldier runes means up to 6 conditions can be removed in a very short time. ( 4 semi-instant, 2 in 1.4 seconds or whatever it takes for mending to complete) IF YOU’RE SPECCED FOR IT.

You seriously need to stop trolling the war forums. Everytime you post here you show you lack of game knowledge in an extremely blatant way.

Kaga.7629:

Daecollo.9578:

2 Condition Removal
… Warrior cannot do anything to remove conditions quickly and are very “easy prey” to them

Pff Daecollo. Shoutsheals + sup soldier runes means up to 6 conditions can be removed in a very short time. ( 4 semi-instant, 2 in 1.4 seconds or whatever it takes for mending to complete) IF YOU’RE SPECCED FOR IT.

You seriously need to stop trolling the war forums. Everytime you post here you show you lack of game knowledge in an extremely blatant way.

Specced means runes? Ok..

No, you need a grandmaster of tactics to be able to do that. Technically it’s possible to remove even more via soldier runes shouts + warhorn ( to remove cripples ) but that’s gimping your offhand a little.

Specced = runes, 3x utility, 1x healing, 2x traits. You can add in 3x traits if you want to self-heal.

Runes: Runes of Soldier obviously (6 piece bonus: shouts remove conditions)
Healing: Mending (removes 2 conditions)
Trait 1: Lung Capacity (shouts recharge 20% quicker)
Trait 2: Restorative Strength (healing skill removes Crippled, Chilled, Immobilized and Weakness)
Utility: Shake It Off (skill removes condition from allies, runes remove another. 20s CD)
Utility: For Great Justice (rune removes a condition from self and allies, 20s CD)
Utility: On My Mark (rune removes a condition from self and allies, 24s CD).

And to add it all in, throw in the Vigorous Shouts trait and the Cleric’s Amulet/Jem and your shouts will heal about 2k each.

Still missing protection and possibly better healing. Adrenal Health will regenerate 120hp/s on the Warrior at max adrenaline, which isn’t exactly that much. Of course, it does have 4 skills that heal it. Can’t get banner regeneration as it competes with shouts heal trait (and the only banner available will be the elite one).

Kaga.7629:

No, you need a grandmaster of tactics to be able to do that. Technically it’s possible to remove even more via soldier runes shouts + warhorn ( to remove cripples ) but that’s gimping your offhand a little.

So youre saying warriors are actually amazing at removing conditions cause we can put 30 points into a tree and use one specific set of runes with all three utilities taken up?

I guess we all should just be playing SHOUT warriors now! Screw all our other specs and builds, obviously they just don’t compare!

Rune is an item, show me other classes using an item to bandfix something..Ommo Pie anyone? Its has nothing to do with class seriously.

Also shouts healing for 2k with cleric amulet is a joke, maybe good for hotjoin but thats all.

IMO, Warriors are not meant to bunker, in order to do so, you need reliable Protection Boon and its lesser cousin, Regeneration Boon.

Other than the OP hinted it, I’m not sure why this is leading to condition removal and fairly weak Shout healing (counter to .5s to 1s of attack or basically one Aegis block at best).

As noted, Warriors should be bunker buster (multiples of damage based on boons on target and not straight Boon stripping). This would give tPvP the needed meta from where the tPvP gameplay is right now.

Every class should have a way to be anything, otherwise there is no point of having offensive/defensive trees.

Daecollo.9578:

Every class should have a way to be anything, otherwise there is no point of having offensive/defensive trees.

This^

And to the OP

1. Agree
2. Agree
3. Agree

Exactly Daecollo, every class should be able to fill every role, although some obviously do certain roles better. I’d actually enjoy playing a bunker warrior, and have been trying to since launch, but I would never expect to be on par with a guardian.

Put 1 guardian and 1 warrior together and you be kitten those parties. This combo is better than 2 guardians and better than 2 warriors.

It is true the only thing a warrior lacks is protection, but if my bunker warrior would get protection, I wouldn’t even have to dodge because I’ll be a walking mountain. I am already really hard to kill.

Full bunker guardian vs full bunker warrior? I am still not sure which is the best tank, many think guardian. But I wouldn’t be so sure about that. Warrior will deal more damage.

In PvE a guardian wins ofcourse in tankyness but in WvW with 50+ damage sources I think a warrior is more tanky.

ps.: all good warriors I know are shout/heal warriors. Not all go soldier runes, just depends how much you want to contribute to the group.

Kaga.7629:

Daecollo.9578:

2 Condition Removal
… Warrior cannot do anything to remove conditions quickly and are very “easy prey” to them

Pff Daecollo. Shoutsheals + sup soldier runes means up to 6 conditions can be removed in a very short time. ( 4 semi-instant, 2 in 1.4 seconds or whatever it takes for mending to complete) IF YOU’RE SPECCED FOR IT.

You seriously need to stop trolling the war forums. Everytime you post here you show you lack of game knowledge in an extremely blatant way.

So we have to be specced AND geared to remove SIX conditions every 20 seconds or so and you think that is good condition management? Not to mention that shout warrior is one of the most dull warrior builds out there. Conditions literally shut down a warrior. Constant cripple, chill, or immobilizes can reduce our damage output to insignificant numbers. A shout warrior maybe could manage this, but then it really comes down to him being able to just auto attack his opponent down because his utilities don’t give him any dominance or control.

Zayle.7253:

Kaga.7629:

Daecollo.9578:

2 Condition Removal
… Warrior cannot do anything to remove conditions quickly and are very “easy prey” to them

Pff Daecollo. Shoutsheals + sup soldier runes means up to 6 conditions can be removed in a very short time. ( 4 semi-instant, 2 in 1.4 seconds or whatever it takes for mending to complete) IF YOU’RE SPECCED FOR IT.

You seriously need to stop trolling the war forums. Everytime you post here you show you lack of game knowledge in an extremely blatant way.

So we have to be specced AND geared to remove SIX conditions every 20 seconds or so and you think that is good condition management? Not to mention that shout warrior is one of the most dull warrior builds out there. Conditions literally shut down a warrior. Constant cripple, chill, or immobilizes can reduce our damage output to insignificant numbers. A shout warrior maybe could manage this, but then it really comes down to him being able to just auto attack his opponent down because his utilities don’t give him any dominance or control.

It’s better than kill 1 player every 90s or how long are those cooldowns?
And you got 2 weapons with 5 skills, if you let them chain cc you, yea you deserve to die. A warrior needs to chain cc his enemy. And why kill something within 2s and die right after because you got <2700 armor. I think it is better to kill something on a longer run and still be able to tank damage from an other player.

Fighting a necro for example, most of his conditions are ground target. They have 0 stability. So dodge the circles, get close chain cc and you will barely have any conditions on you.

MiLkZz.4789:

It’s better than kill 1 player every 90s or how long are those cooldowns?
And you got 2 weapons with 5 skills, if you let them chain cc you, yea you deserve to die. A warrior needs to chain cc his enemy. And why kill something within 2s and die right after because you got <2700 armor. I think it is better to kill something on a longer run and still be able to tank damage from an other player.

Fighting a necro for example, most of his conditions are ground target. They have 0 stability. So dodge the circles, get close chain cc and you will barely have any conditions on you.

Wait…… playing a shout warrior is better then playing a 100B warrior according to you… but then you go and describe how ANY warrior without shouts can supposedly handle any necro just by dodging?

You see where the lines of congruity have faded? One extreme to the other and we’re supposed to just go “yeah OK… necro = easy kill and shouts = AWESOME!”

The point we’re all trying to make is just for us to be on par with EVERY other class in the game with condition removal(maybe besides thieves, but they stealth 80% of the time and avoid tacking any stacks of anything) we have to not only spec for it but also gear for it, and then it is still slightly behind most classes.

Sure maybe you didn’t like 100B spec and most of us hate the far from viable shout build in tPvP, but that doesn’t change the facts in question here.

Warriors will never be the bunker that Guardians and D/D elementalists are unless there are changes in balance, for all the reasons the OP stated above.

Both have better on demand condition removal, that is easily traited into, both have insane boon generation, both have better heal sustainability. Eles have better CC, guardians probably around the same as a warrior, warrior might have slightly more possibly, if they aren’t a shout build.

Heck, even a bunker mesmer is better than a bunker warrior

I accept that warriors aren’t a bunker class, we do damage, or at least that is what we are supposed to do. What I can’t really accept though is how a class with the lowest base stats outsustains a class with the highest base stats. This is mostly sPvP I am talking about, in WvW we are more or less OK but still

killahmayne.9518:

Warriors will never be the bunker that Guardians and D/D elementalists are unless there are changes in balance, for all the reasons the OP stated above.

Both have better on demand condition removal, that is easily traited into, both have insane boon generation, both have better heal sustainability. Eles have better CC, guardians probably around the same as a warrior, warrior might have slightly more possibly, if they aren’t a shout build.

Heck, even a bunker mesmer is better than a bunker warrior

I accept that warriors aren’t a bunker class, we do damage, or at least that is what we are supposed to do. What I can’t really accept though is how a class with the lowest base stats outsustains a class with the highest base stats. This is mostly sPvP I am talking about, in WvW we are more or less OK but still

So true. I’m honestly thinking about hanging up my warrior after the frenzy nerf. Got my title … was my favorite class but meh this one really did us in for dmg. No way we can remove boons fast enough and we’re all white dmg spike wise. Fighting a bunker with burn and bleed is a joke if they have any sense… and like you said our bunker isn’t as good.