Guild Wars 2

Warrior Skill dmg (when no amulet is equipped)
1. Hammer Swing : 352 (1/2 CD)
2. Fierce Blow : 547 (12s CD)
3. Hammer Shock : 274 (12s CD)
4. Staggering Blow : 391 (20s CD)
5. BackBreaker : 586 (30s CD)

avg dmg of Warrior Hammer (all added / 5) : 430
avg cd time of warrior hammer skill (add added / 5) : 14.9s

Engi Hammer Skills dmgs (when no amulet is equipped)
1. Positive Strike : 313 + might for 8sec (1/2s CD)
2. Electro-whirl : 860 (6s CD)
3. Rocket Charge : 1173 (10s CD)
4. Shock Shield : 975 (20s CD)
5. Thunder Clap : 1410 (24s CD)

avg dmg of Warrior Hammer (all added / 5) : 946.2
avg cd time of engi hammer skills (add added / 5) : 12.1s

thus,
1. avg dmg : engi hammer = 946.2>>> Warrior hammer = 430 (2.2 times higher)
2. avg CD time : engi CD time = 12.1s > warrior CD time 14.9s (2.8s faster than avg CD time of Warrior)

WARRIOR IS DEAD!

This is a really interesting and depressing way at evaluating relative balance, and I find myself struggling to find a silver lining here. Things actually get worse when you add in the additional effects.

The engi #1 attack chain does alightly less damage, but it adds two stacks of might and two stacks of might and two stacks of vuln for 8s over the course of the 1.5s it takes to execute the chain.

The engi #2 skill doesn’t add the weakness that Fierce Blow gives us, but it’s a 360 degree aoe attack that’s more likely to hit foes, is a whirl finisher (see engi #5), and reflects projectiles. It also does 50% more damage with only 50% the cooldown that Fierce Blow has.

The engi #3 skill lacks the aoe cripple that hammer Shock gives us. In exchange, it gets: 4x the damage, includes a leap finisher that, with a range of 1000, outclasses any mobility skill in the warrior’s kitten nal, includes a 1s evade that’s longer than the warrior’s only evade (Whirlwind Attack), and has a cooldown that’s 2s shorter than Fierce Blow. Did I mention the damage? Did I mention that it hits 20% harder than a stage-3 Eviscerate to up to 5 targets?

The engi has the same 20s cooldown as the warrior’s Staggering Blow, and it doesn’t get the 360 degree aoe knockback SB gives the warrior. What does it get? Damage that’s just a little less than a stage-3 Eviscerate on up to five targets, provides a 2s block, and applies 10 stacks of vuln for 5s. To sum that up, it combines a block that’s 2/3 our best one (Shield Stance), all the vulnerability from our best weapon application (Crushing Blow) for half the time but on 2/3 more targets, and simultaneously hits just about as hard as one of our highest damaging skills (Eviscerate) to 5x the targets.

Engi skill #5 doesn’t get the long 2s knockdown that Backbreaker gives the warrior. What it does provide is a 6s fire-and-forget pulsing lightning field that has a 1200 range, stuns all targets for 1s, applies vulnerability, and does just shy of 50% more damage than a stage-3 Eviscerate…. Oh yeah, and it’s cooldown is 6s shorter than Backbreaker.

At this point, I’d like to be say, “at least the warrior can swap weapons”, but why would you want to? It has huge damage, buffs and debuffs, amazing mobility, two highly damaging defensive skills, and a high damage combo field that can be dropped at range. And then you remember the kits, which have a zero swap cooldown while we’re begging for a baseline 5s weapon swap….

Ok, I’m depressed. Can anyone think of anything that makes this not seem as bad as it looks?

yeah a cc weapon should totally measured by its damage output....not

Choppy.4183:

This is a really interesting and depressing way at evaluating relative balance, and I find myself struggling to find a silver lining here. Things actually get worse when you add in the additional effects.

The engi #1 attack chain does alightly less damage, but it adds two stacks of might and two stacks of might and two stacks of vuln for 8s over the course of the 1.5s it takes to execute the chain.

The engi #2 skill doesn’t add the weakness that Fierce Blow gives us, but it’s a 360 degree aoe attack that’s more likely to hit foes, is a whirl finisher (see engi #5), and reflects projectiles. It also does 50% more damage with only 50% the cooldown that Fierce Blow has.

The engi #3 skill lacks the aoe cripple that hammer Shock gives us. In exchange, it gets: 4x the damage, includes a leap finisher that, with a range of 1000, outclasses any mobility skill in the warrior’s kitten nal, includes a 1s evade that’s longer than the warrior’s only evade (Whirlwind Attack), and has a cooldown that’s 2s shorter than Fierce Blow. Did I mention the damage? Did I mention that it hits 20% harder than a stage-3 Eviscerate to up to 5 targets?

The engi has the same 20s cooldown as the warrior’s Staggering Blow, and it doesn’t get the 360 degree aoe knockback SB gives the warrior. What does it get? Damage that’s just a little less than a stage-3 Eviscerate on up to five targets, provides a 2s block, and applies 10 stacks of vuln for 5s. To sum that up, it combines a block that’s 2/3 our best one (Shield Stance), all the vulnerability from our best weapon application (Crushing Blow) for half the time but on 2/3 more targets, and simultaneously hits just about as hard as one of our highest damaging skills (Eviscerate) to 5x the targets.

Engi skill #5 doesn’t get the long 2s knockdown that Backbreaker gives the warrior. What it does provide is a 6s fire-and-forget pulsing lightning field that has a 1200 range, stuns all targets for 1s, applies vulnerability, and does just shy of 50% more damage than a stage-3 Eviscerate…. Oh yeah, and it’s cooldown is 6s shorter than Backbreaker.

At this point, I’d like to be say, “at least the warrior can swap weapons”, but why would you want to? It has huge damage, buffs and debuffs, amazing mobility, two highly damaging defensive skills, and a high damage combo field that can be dropped at range. And then you remember the kits, which have a zero swap cooldown while we’re begging for a baseline 5s weapon swap….

Ok, I’m depressed. Can anyone think of anything that makes this not seem as bad as it looks?

Engies only get medium armor.

Goldenrevolver.4371:

yeah a cc weapon should totally measured by its damage output….not

Do you find it better or worse now that you see the benefits beyond damage of the engi hammer vs the warrior hammer? Or, hell, any of our weapons… do you think any of them compete?

Ross Biddle.2367:

Engies only get medium armor.

Lol, think we could go tradesies with them?

Baseline 5s weapon swap would be reaaaallly great ! And I can’t get why they still didn’t do it… I mean come on, did you ever see a warrior without fast hand? … It kind of defines warrior for me and differentiate it from the other classes! It creates a more dynamic and unpredictable class.

@OP & Choppy, your posts are really depressing :’(

Imo, eviscerate has became a total joke…

I can’t play anymore with Leg Specialist(that I LOVED) , Berserker’s Fury + (old) Valkyrie Amulet, cuz I can’t go 30/25/10/0/15 (was it something like that?) I’m sad… :/
(this is where they killed the class for me, my gameplay, Leg Specialist was good and I can’t take it anymore cuz the traitline is kittenty, not my style’s weapons)

Goldenrevolver.4371:

yeah a cc weapon should totally measured by its damage output….not

The problem is that we have a CC weapon that offers little real CC without MASSIVE cooldowns that has virtually no damage attached to it. Hammer is literally balanced around using your skills and then swapping to another weapon. It’s balanced around another weapon’s damage. That’s a kittening problem.

Intersting, howevr you forgot that the warrior hammer actually has 6 skills. 7 if you count berserker.

gonna give a try to scrapper, it maybe the hammer I’m looking for.

Ross Biddle.2367:

Engies only get medium armor.

And no weapon swap.

Kits don’t really confuse the issue, either.

dace.8019:

Ross Biddle.2367:

Engies only get medium armor.

And no weapon swap.

Kits don’t really confuse the issue, either.

Who needs weapon swap when you have one weapon that does it all? You’re right, Engies getting kits on top of that is more perplexing than confusing.

See what I did there? ;D