Guild Wars 2

What do the fellow warriors think of the rifle after all the patches done to LB?

Honestly LB seems all around just a lot better than rifle especially with the 5 skill upgrade to have instant 5 stacks of bleed and the fact everything except 1 can do AOE.

The cooldowns are also kinda long on rifle considering what they do, especially 4 and 5 skill have way too long cooldowns for the small effect they do.

And let us not ignore cast times of f1 and 4. Theyre crazy long..

Oh and I still can’t believe anet has 1200 as range on the tooltip even though its 900

Both are pretty awful. Rifle has a nice burst damage but pays heavily for it. Longbow is more useful on its skills with its cc/dots, but its pretty weak.

Why roll LB or Rifle? Just go ranger.

Well theyre the only ranged weapon which is a neccesity for wvw and a lot of pve situations. spvp not so much.

Gasoline.2570:

Well theyre the only ranged weapon which is a neccesity for wvw and a lot of pve situations. spvp not so much.

They’re not a necessity to always have equipped.

They’re VERY situational.

-Rifle is good in WvW when you know you’re going up against someone who will kite you or you just want to have a lot of fun with the burst dmg.
-Longbow is good for farming badges when you’re in a zerg fighting another zerg or you’re defending.

I never run around with a ranged weapon unless the job calls for it. Which isn’t often.

As a warrior you can get the mobility(GS/S/W and Bulls Charge) you need to get to an enemy and your melee weapons will always be better put to use.

As for PVE yes a ranged weapon is always nice to have…but again you can swap them in and out as needed, you don’t always need to have it slotted.

The amount of all melee Warriors I’ve kited to death (as a warrior myself) is too kitten high. The damage difference between ranged and melee really isn’t that substantial considering you can keep ranged damage up 100% of the time. I know I’m in for a free kill if I see a Warrior come at me with a GS…

That said, the longbow 5 skill is the only good thing about the bow, the AoE is stupidly slow and easily dodged. Rifle #2 for immobilise, #3 for strong damage that lasts longer than a dodge roll, #5 sends people absolutely flying, great for capping points/protecting downed teammates. Not to mention the mother of all ranged DPS, Killshot.

Bow is good for aoe & stacking might, rifle is good for single target

Both are very situational, personally I used the rifle in a sword + horn / rifle build and it worked quite well with the only problem being the burst skill long cast making it dodge able with little effort. On WvW a long bow is a must for defending or fighting against large zergs, not to mention taking down enemy siege from the walls.

Bow damage for single target isn’t as great as melee but is quite good, the AoE can burst for some insane numbers and the burst skill can keep the enemy taking damage while people perform combos with it. Making it an over all great weapon, thus no need to go Ranger = ranged warrior = melee. Personally I roll both and play melee ranger as much as long bow/short bow ranger.

Rifle is good for fighting enemies 1v1 since it keeps your damage uptime and #5 makes for a good interrupt. But again it all depends on who you are facing. Most warrior’s mentality = berserk gear + bull rush + Frenzy + HB = win. Such warriors die too easily. Now a hammer warrior or a warrior who knows how to swap to ranged or to a support weapon is a whole different case.

Longbow is superior to a rifle in the hands of a decent player against decent players. Blind, immobolize, firefield, burst damage from 3…

I’ve had people try to kite me with a rifle in WvW and honestly it’s laughable. I cover the distance easily, dodge cripple/volley if they fire it off before I get there and then they have to swap to melee once I get there or prepare to get their face bashed in. So they switch to their GS but they don’t have any control abilities so there’s nothing to set up their HB with. Of course I keep them good and crippled so they’re not running away…

Neither weapon is that great to kite with really as warriors just aren’t designed to kite. The Longbow at least can bring some strong AoE to a group fight and has decent utility to boot.

This is all opinion of course, but it’s backed by the fact that I have never once lost to a rifle warrior and they make a healthy portion of my diet when camp capping.

Longbow.
Doesn’t sacrifice much damage compared to the Rifle, yet offers a hell of a lot more utility

Jonwar.9205:

Longbow is superior to a rifle in the hands of a decent player against decent players. Blind, immobolize, firefield, burst damage from 3…

I’ve had people try to kite me with a rifle in WvW and honestly it’s laughable. I cover the distance easily, dodge cripple/volley if they fire it off before I get there and then they have to swap to melee once I get there or prepare to get their face bashed in. So they switch to their GS but they don’t have any control abilities so there’s nothing to set up their HB with. Of course I keep them good and crippled so they’re not running away…

Neither weapon is that great to kite with really as warriors just aren’t designed to kite. The Longbow at least can bring some strong AoE to a group fight and has decent utility to boot.

This is all opinion of course, but it’s backed by the fact that I have never once lost to a rifle warrior and they make a healthy portion of my diet when camp capping.

Debating challenging you… But you’re probably really good and I’ll get roflstomped by the best…

Dolan.3071:

Jonwar.9205:

Longbow is superior to a rifle in the hands of a decent player against decent players. Blind, immobolize, firefield, burst damage from 3…

I’ve had people try to kite me with a rifle in WvW and honestly it’s laughable. I cover the distance easily, dodge cripple/volley if they fire it off before I get there and then they have to swap to melee once I get there or prepare to get their face bashed in. So they switch to their GS but they don’t have any control abilities so there’s nothing to set up their HB with. Of course I keep them good and crippled so they’re not running away…

Neither weapon is that great to kite with really as warriors just aren’t designed to kite. The Longbow at least can bring some strong AoE to a group fight and has decent utility to boot.

This is all opinion of course, but it’s backed by the fact that I have never once lost to a rifle warrior and they make a healthy portion of my diet when camp capping.

Debating challenging you… But you’re probably really good and I’ll get roflstomped by the best…

Challenge him

I don’t agree that longbow is better. When traited, rifle shots can pierce through a group and crit everything. With the shorter cooldown I never have a problem. Switching from Axe/axe or GS when in range. I just find that the bow seems slow and with all the condition removal out there in wvw it doesn’t matter that you burn. Typically you start against a zerg and find yourself up against a 1v1 fairly quickly. I prefer the direct shot over the slower bow shot.

zerotwo.4731:

I don’t agree that longbow is better. When traited, rifle shots can pierce through a group and crit everything. With the shorter cooldown I never have a problem. Switching from Axe/axe or GS when in range. I just find that the bow seems slow and with all the condition removal out there in wvw it doesn’t matter that you burn. Typically you start against a zerg and find yourself up against a 1v1 fairly quickly. I prefer the direct shot over the slower bow shot.

“when traited, rifle shots can pierece through a group and crit everything”
Long bow has three AoE attacks to make up for that. (I call the AoE blind the third).

“Bow seems slow” both auto-attacks are pretty slow and ideally should not be used.

“condition removal out there in WvWvW”
You don’t use a bow for condition damage normally. You don’t use a rifle for condition damage either. (Some do though, which I don’t find effective). It’s primarily for ranged DPS and utility.
Bow’s #3 and F1 are far more useful than anything the Rifle can bring for defense/offense of structures.
The F1 is primarily used to keep people away from certain areas rather than for the burning damage as well.

“find yourself up against a 1v1 fairly quickly”
You’re doing it wrong. Honestly.
If you are in a Zerg, you should never leave it (pubs do all the time for a single kill and get owned by a hyena mob lol)

If you are talking about near a building or within a structure defending/attacking… then why would you ever end up in a 1v1?
I rarely see 1v1 in Zergs unless they are the noobs that stray away or try some rambo crap and take a side route alone. It’s not effective.

Now, if you are talking about roaming… you shouldn’t really be using either ranged weapon (unless it’s a condition build w/ Swords or Mobility Rifle build).

Dolan

Debating challenging you… But you’re probably really good and I’ll get roflstomped by the best…

I make no claims to being particularly good. I win and I lose, but the typical rifle/gs combo is hilariously ineffective 1v1. I don’t actually run a longbow by the way (I run a hammer+sword/shield setup, my own build) but I do have a bit of time fighting with one as I like to pick off the scouts with my longbow before switching to my usual weapon set. If sPvP is what you’re talking about I generally run defektive’s hammer build as well.

All this being said, I have no qualms with taking a challenge. No hard feelings afterwards is my only requirement, and to give me a couple weeks (I work in third world countries, and my internet service is poor at best when I’m on the job as I am now).

CookMETEnder

“find yourself up against a 1v1 fairly quickly”
You’re doing it wrong. Honestly.
If you are in a Zerg, you should never leave it (pubs do all the time for a single kill and get owned by a hyena mob lol)

This was pretty untrue until recently, and even now I still find a fair amount of 1v1-3 in WvW. I honestly hate zergs, and will only be part of one when my guild is involved or if a major objective is contested and help is needed. Now generally I don’t get better than 1v2, but I’ll still take that most of the time depending on what class combination it is (I’m not claiming that I win most of these, just that I’m capable of winning and willing to roll the dice).

Jonwar.9205:

Dolan

Debating challenging you… But you’re probably really good and I’ll get roflstomped by the best…

I make no claims to being particularly good. I win and I lose, but the typical rifle/gs combo is hilariously ineffective 1v1. I don’t actually run a longbow by the way (I run a hammer+sword/shield setup, my own build) but I do have a bit of time fighting with one as I like to pick off the scouts with my longbow before switching to my usual weapon set. If sPvP is what you’re talking about I generally run defektive’s hammer build as well.

All this being said, I have no qualms with taking a challenge. No hard feelings afterwards is my only requirement, and to give me a couple weeks (I work in third world countries, and my internet service is poor at best when I’m on the job as I am now).

You’re on! I’m only level 10 in PvP to give you an idea of what you’re dealing with. Though if it isn’t in the next few days it’ll have to wait a month for me to get back from overseas (seems to suit you as well) I’ll add you

I like the LB a lot as a opening weapon. It complements sword builds perfectly. That is the build I run. My partner runs a mobility rifle build. When we go roaming lots and lots of people die. They’re both great weapons if you build for it.

Lorelei

I like the LB a lot as a opening weapon. It complements sword builds perfectly. That is the build I run. My partner runs a mobility rifle build. When we go roaming lots and lots of people die. They’re both great weapons if you build for it.

Now this is where I can see rifle actually working, in coordinated pairs. I actually run my control build as a lot of people capping camps that I run into are glassy warrs/thieves/rangers (I don’t get why people play glassy rangers when you can make them kitten near indestructible but meh) and while they’d have a rough time 1v1 if I add them to party and explain that the target I put up will be locked down (or at the very least out of dodges and stun breaks) and easy to burst we can quickly take down larger groups (My burst damage is quite high as well if I get a well timed combo in).

Pin down while killshot was being charged seems like something that would work pretty well anyways… and then add in sword flurry… but coordinated teams can always do a lot more damage regardless of class/build.

Dolan

You’re on! I’m only level 10 in PvP to give you an idea of what you’re dealing with. Though if it isn’t in the next few days it’ll have to wait a month for me to get back from overseas (seems to suit you as well) I’ll add you

Just noticed your sig, I’m on EU servers not NA… I might switch when I move back to the states, but probably won’t happen unless my guild dies or something.

Jonwar.9205:

Just noticed your sig, I’m on EU servers not NA… I might switch when I move back to the states, but probably won’t happen unless my guild dies or something.

Oh kitten I didn’t even think about that. Oh well thanks anyway. Though from what I’ve read you seem like a immobilise spammer so your team can get the kill, probably wouldn’t translate too well to 1v1 anyways.

CookMETEnder.7582:

Longbow.
Doesn’t sacrifice much damage compared to the Rifle, yet offers a hell of a lot more utility

Jonwar.9205:

Longbow is superior to a rifle in the hands of a decent player against decent players. Blind, immobolize, firefield, burst damage from 3…

I’ve had people try to kite me with a rifle in WvW and honestly it’s laughable. I cover the distance easily, dodge cripple/volley if they fire it off before I get there and then they have to swap to melee once I get there or prepare to get their face bashed in. So they switch to their GS but they don’t have any control abilities so there’s nothing to set up their HB with. Of course I keep them good and crippled so they’re not running away…

Neither weapon is that great to kite with really as warriors just aren’t designed to kite. The Longbow at least can bring some strong AoE to a group fight and has decent utility to boot.

This is all opinion of course, but it’s backed by the fact that I have never once lost to a rifle warrior and they make a healthy portion of my diet when camp capping.

Exactly. The longbow brings in much healthier variation to any situation..

Dolan.3071:

The amount of all melee Warriors I’ve kited to death (as a warrior myself) is too kitten high. The damage difference between ranged and melee really isn’t that substantial considering you can keep ranged damage up 100% of the time. I know I’m in for a free kill if I see a Warrior come at me with a GS…

That said, the longbow 5 skill is the only good thing about the bow, the AoE is stupidly slow and easily dodged. Rifle #2 for immobilise, #3 for strong damage that lasts longer than a dodge roll, #5 sends people absolutely flying, great for capping points/protecting downed teammates. Not to mention the mother of all ranged DPS, Killshot.

Few things to consider

The bow aoe is also very large, the immoblize is much longer.

And honestly, to say aoes easy to dodge, the easiest to dodge move in the whole game is probably killshot. The time it takes to launch is an eternity without frenzy and it might not even crit so it’ll do far less damage than intended. I find it awful to try to use.

The biggest reason for this thread is the fact that I switched to rifle from lb due my love toward the predator. I’ve been running LB+GS pve and S/SH+LB in WvW mostly and it’s been really easy to keep the traiting quite same no matter what I do and no matter what weapons I take out for the occasional spin but I find the options of the rifle becoming very restrictive.

Bleed is long, but if you stack cond damage you sacrifice way too much for the other skills on it since only 1 does condi damage.

Rifle butt has a long reload time to become an effective source of keeping anything away for a little longer.

Just about every shot takes a while to fire. As with longbow is a tad slower on one, disregarding its 2 hits per 1 shot, the 4 and 5 skill are extremely quick to fire and the conditions they apply will affect the target immidiately. Also they have their respective aoes, yes even the 5.

Also for the rifle to be effective, you have to get arms to 20. For longbow it’s only 10 traitpoints and with that even comes a possibility to have banner traits. You can choose if you want to go more condi or zerk, with rifle you already lose 20 points to condi.

The skills are just so weirdly built for the rifle, the single target power is better but the lack of aoe is a major thing. And even if you trait it for piercing bullets, they have to be lined completely. Makes it so very situational.

maybe the biggest thing is the dip to 900 range as opposed to 1200 from LB.

I’d be interested to seeing whatever rifle traited builds there are that don’t suffer from volatility and lack of defense.

And yes bear my opinions are only centered toward wvw and pve. Spvp I wouldn’t even try to bother using the rifle.

Rifle is definitely a viable weapon as far as WvW is concerned, it is just a stark contrast of playstyle compared to the prototype melee warrior.

Most rifle warriors go mostly zerker as the F1 and the #3 can hit like a truck. Personally i’d rather go melee but that is just me.

I rarely ever use it but personally it is highly situational. Against certain classes (well not classes but I guess certain people/builds) this is mostly directed against Mesmers it might be wise to use a rifle because it can be next to impossible to lock them down in melee range (even if you do their illusions and phantasms will completely obliterate you + they are invulnerable with the sword) and they can kite circles around you. Maybe against certain guardians as well as they lack mobility.

I see the rifle more as a sniping weapon, instantly bursting down 1 or 2 people within a zerg and a niche 1v1 weapon.

Longbow is OK for 1v1 as it does have the immobilize/bleed, decent damage, blind and some burns, but mostly it is used to fire your #3, #4 and F1 into zergs for a decent combination of burst and burn damage. Good for catching lone targets as well. Overall the Longbow will probably net you more DPS but the #3 can be hard to land on lone moving targets and it has a lesser range.

Dolan.3071:

Jonwar.9205:

Just noticed your sig, I’m on EU servers not NA… I might switch when I move back to the states, but probably won’t happen unless my guild dies or something.

Oh kitten I didn’t even think about that. Oh well thanks anyway. Though from what I’ve read you seem like a immobilise spammer so your team can get the kill, probably wouldn’t translate too well to 1v1 anyways.

It actually translates very well 1v1, in WvW if I bate out an early stunbeak I can burst for some ridiculous damage against a helpless opponent when my crits line up decently (I’d guess on average 12k-15k). In sPvP I generally run a soldiers ammy so my damage is lower but I am still looking at 4k crits with 2 and 5.

EDIT: Also, regarding mesmers the Longbow still comes out ahead if you ask me, the firefield is a great way to handle their npc’s. That being said s/x mesmers are going to be a nightmare on a warrior regardless of how you skin that cat imo.

Jonwar.9205:

Neither weapon is that great to kite with really as warriors just aren’t designed to kite. The Longbow at least can bring some strong AoE to a group fight and has decent utility to boot.
.

I don’t worry about kiting too much as a warrior with a range weapon. With heavy armor and the highest hps of all classes, I always go on the front lines throwing AOE’s.

If on the other hand you absolutely must run away when a huge zerg is approaching which happens quite often in Tier 1, haha, activate signet of rage, 33pct movement speed for a whopping 39 seconds. You can also blow this signet for kiting if you so prefer, 33pct movement speed for 39 seconds is a long kitten time.

scootshoot.6583:

Jonwar.9205:

Neither weapon is that great to kite with really as warriors just aren’t designed to kite. The Longbow at least can bring some strong AoE to a group fight and has decent utility to boot.
.

I don’t worry about kiting too much as a warrior with a range weapon. With heavy armor and the highest hps of all classes, I always go on the front lines throwing AOE’s.

If on the other hand you absolutely must run away when a huge zerg is approaching which happens quite often in Tier 1, haha, activate signet of rage, 33pct movement speed for a whopping 39 seconds. You can also blow this signet for kiting if you so prefer, 33pct movement speed for 39 seconds is a long kitten time.

You don’t have SoR going as soon as you can? O.o that baby’s going as soon as soon as the enemy draws their weapon…

1. trait Crack Shot for piercing shots + 20% less CD
2. trait Quick Bursts for 20% less CD for Killshot
3. trait Furious to gain adrenaline when crit
4. equip Superior Sigil of Fire on your rifle
5. look for stacked groups
6. ???
7. profit

now your rifle pierce enemies + AoE damage chance on crit + 8s CD on both Volley and Kill Shot

the way i see it , you are now like a B-52 bomber delivering huge damage but needs jets escorting to keep enemy away from you.

you make the difference in 2-5 player groups , you save a lot of time for them to kill that annoying Guardian , mesmer or even thief or snipe that annoying ele on the wall defending.

in 1vs1 90% of the times i win if i started the fight , Volley and if he decided to waste dodges then prepare for the killshot if he rushes give him a rifle butt -Aimed Shot then shower with Volley , Aimed Shot to prevent him from running also killshot is a good runners killer due to the 1500 range

if i get ambushed i die fast but with sword/horn you can run away easily.

I prefere to play my rifle Warrior (20/30/0/0/20) with a Rampager Set and Sword/Shield as secondary weapons. People usualy don’t expect a rifle Warrior to get out a sword and a shield and they also don’t expect to get confused whenever they get interupted by a kick, a rifle but or a shield bash.

You get a great constant dps from condition and 100% crit rate under fury, you can stack both bleeding and confusion in intensity for massive amounts of damage, you can still burst ennemies down with volley and you get better defensive options while keeping a very good mobility and of course Flurry for the runners!

I use the rifle when players try to run or kite. Using GS or duel axes for melee. I don’t even use the trait list for bow and not interested in shout healing vs DPS. I just found the bow to be slow and unreliable. However I was using it when not traited for it. So 900 range isn’t all that great.

Baseline Rifle when no traits chosen
Longbow (with trait) >>> baseline Rifle
Rifle (with trait) >>> baseline Longbow
Longbow (with trait) = Rifle (with trait); Longbow better for AoE (and slightly more effective Adrenaline gains), Rifle better for Single target or bleed builds

Artaz.3819:

Baseline Rifle when no traits chosen
Longbow (with trait) >>> baseline Rifle
Rifle (with trait) >>> baseline Longbow
Longbow (with trait) = Rifle (with trait); Longbow better for AoE (and slightly more effective Adrenaline gains), Rifle better for Single target or bleed builds

Note that taking a Longbow with Stronger Bowstrings is buged, you get a double 100% combo projectile when shooting with Dual Shot making it much more powerfull than it should be.

Ambrecombe.4398:

Note that taking a Longbow with Stronger Bowstrings is buged, you get a double 100% combo projectile when shooting with Dual Shot making it much more powerfull than it should be.

I was not aware this was considered a bug for the ability but more of a ‘bug’ in the description since this functionality has been present since August 2012 (3rd Open) in Beta. I do believe it is working as intended since 2 other improvements to Longbow have been made since then.