Guild Wars 2

Maybe I’m doing it wrong, idk.

Can’t seem to do any legit damage going condi on it…or power. Whats the point of a weapon if it doesn’t do damage, or defense well?

Sword 3 pales in comparison to gs3. I mean when sword 3 hits something under 50% and crits…..its decent but its not by any means good. Why should sword 3 do at max the same damage as a regular gs3, but only when the target is below 50% and offer no invulnerability or movement or other bonuses like might/combofields proc? That really reflects the state of the weapon as a whole. The things it does okay….are really lackluster when you consider all the conditions and limitations put on them.

Especially when u consider the windup sword3 needs and the lack of defense you have while using it. Its really just a different way to land a burst hit….does that make it okay for it to fall in the state it is presently though? lol.
Sword 2 never did damage. And the cripple is short and outdated, it hardly matters against any opponent in the hot meta. And they definitely aren’t going to be scared of you being ontop of them if you are using a sword…..

Sword 1 never did damage….even with condi build (warrior bleeds suck). Offhand sword just sucks so badly, its limited to 1vs1 duels and even then its lackluster compared to other abilities that do the same but are aoe. Sword OH offers so much work for so little reward.

I’d say the weapon needs a redesign or major changes to how it does damage/defense. Maybe I’m wrong though, and I’m not using the right build.
Just tired of lackluster weapons. Everything should have a purpose for at least one of the modes in the game. What purpose is swords? I see OH sword called for in meta builds for dungeons as an alternative…but why would u bother if its more work and offers less payoff?

Agreed.
No wants to be hater, but warrior is a dumpster fire of problems. It is all just a combination of the community being ignored and now there is a near endless list of small to moderate things that either don’t work, make no sense or have no practical use on warrior.

Sword had its power scaling lowered, then it had it bleed application lowered. Longbow has been bounced all over the show, rifle has had more ups and downs that a roller coaster, axe and great sword have had their damage back-ended, tgraits in terrible locations..fire fields given inter cool downs that makes them sub par for any sort of condition build, mace berserker burst oddly condition damage when no other use of the weapon supports any sort of condition play. Hammer is nothing more than a paper weight you use on your desk.

The terrible thing is that all of this has been talked about for years in some cases. Yet nothing changes for ol’ warrior..first they get given, then they have something taken away and something else moved to a completely inappropriate trait tree.

I have AR150 viper necro and an AR150 viper warrior. It seems plausible that both should be able to perform much the same as each other in their own unique ways…but everybody legit knows I am gimping any team I am on taking the warrior over the necro. Warrior is just in a sad, sad place. Power builds are subpar..sustain builds are subpar..condi builds are subpar.

If you want power..take thief/rev
If you want support take druid/engi/ele
If you want condi take necro, mesmer.

Cerby.1069:

What purpose is swords? I see OH sword called for in meta builds for dungeons as an alternative…but why would u bother if its more work and offers less payoff?

That’s an easy question to answer: because not everyone cares about hitting the pinnacle of flavour of the month performance.

Here is a question back at you on the same vein: Why is it such a concern to you that sword ‘has no purpose’? Warrior has more weapon access than any other class. Do you think it’s a realistic that every weapon has some purpose to fill? how about the purpose of just “I like using sword and condition damage”. Seems reasonable to me.

Obtena.7952:

That’s an easy question to answer: because not everyone cares about hitting the pinnacle of flavour of the month performance.

Here is a question back at you on the same vein: Why is it such a concern to you that sword ‘has no purpose’? Warrior has more weapon access than any other class. Do you think it’s a realistic that every weapon has some purpose to fill? how about the purpose of just “I like using sword and condition damage”. Seems reasonable to me.

Ur argument is that as long as it does something different, than something else, it has earned its right to exist. Correct?

Okay, Scenario:
You are in a game that offers highly competitive 1vs1 duels (lets picture a Colosseum gladiator match). You enter a match against an enemy that plays the same class as you (a mirror match). Before you start the match you are given a choice of weapons. You both choose the same type of weapon, BUT you choose one that is exactly the same as ur opponent but has lower stats. You choose it on purpose cause it happens to have an unique skin. Both ur weapons do the exact same thing….but urs happens to look a little different.
Now the question is: Does this weapon have a right to exist? You would say yes. I would say no, because its a highly competitive 1vs1 duel mirror match. And that brings a host of problems as to why you don’t allow handicapped things in ur game. Its like going to an esports event and in the championships (or whatever) one of the people choosing this lower stat variant. I mean it gives them the ability to lose and save face since it wasn’t a fair fight. It gives them the ability to mock their opponent. It gives the ability to waste time basically. You are trying to determine who is better at something afterall.

What if you played a game and you found the giant amazing weapon of your dreams…..only to realize its the worst weapon in the game? Would that not leave you hurting? Is that fair? depends on the game right.

I mean in other games the level cap is so high that everyone is on different levels….so using something that some1 else doesn’t use, or maybe can’t use, can be fun and useful. In this game though were all at the same level, were all designed to be equals in a fight, were all designed so that we can swap our professions/characters for another with little work. Its like going into a 1vs1 against the same profession, and choosing ur own weapons and gear. But choosing level 78 gear instead of level 80 gear just so you do different amounts of damage than ur opponent…cause its different and that amuses you. Does lvl 78 gear have a right to exist in pvp? Its the same argument lol. Some of these analogies are boring i admit, the last one was legit tho.

Sword had its time, if you go back to WTS1 i think you will see rom playing a sword/sword 1 vs 1 warrior.

Simply put HOT gave everyone everything. Sword like longbow has a condi attack, a dps attack and some sourd of cc. Like cripple or slow or entangle.

Rev staff gives heals, blocks, huge cc and then switch to sword-shield which gives evades, huge bursts, and blocks. The same with staff druid which gives heals, mobility, negates range attacks and clears condi.

Everything about warrior is management, timing your skills and chaining them together which cant not be done anymore.

Weapons like sword, hammer, axe, and even the HOT weapon torch have no place in PvP other then simply making a goofy build for fun.

kdaddy.5431:

…snip…other then simply making a goofy build for fun.

Sometimes fun is what matters more in electronic entertainment than having the mathematically best build.

~EW

EphemeralWallaby.7643:

kdaddy.5431:

…snip…other then simply making a goofy build for fun.

Sometimes fun is what matters more in electronic entertainment than having the mathematically best build.

~EW

i can agree but before HOT you could run meta builds that were hammer/Greatsword or sword/shield- Longbow or you could run the best 1 vs 1 build which was mace/shield- greatsword.

Then if you wanted to run fun builds you could run sword-sword or in my case hammer-rifle with carrion amulet and you could still beat 90% of the players out there because the games balance was imply better.

If we are talking PvP, HOT took alot of the fun out because it took away competitive play away from different types of builds.

Even now the condi warrior that was really good in season 3 is below average for meta purposes, the game isnt about skill anymore which can take away alot of the fun.

I primarily run a power gs/s+sh while roaming, and have for just over a year or so. The gs is obviously the damage set… the sword’s primary purpose is additional mobility, followed by setup and the occasional big hit.

I’d love to see a direct damage boost to the sword auto, and some work on the “freeze” that sometimes happens after a Flurry setup, but it’s honestly not a priority for the class or game.

I have no idea about the condi value of the sword and if that needs a buff… I mean, core warrior condi is anemic as hell, and Berserker condi is more powered by burning, so I guess that means it probably needs a buff.

Mobility is the main reason (by far) that I’m not just running an axe with the shield. It’s a big help in combat and to escape combat. It also let’s me make leaps that almost nobody else can when using elevation and weapon swap. As a fairly dedicated roamer, this just barely makes it worthwhile over taking another weapon.

The Flurry setup for a 100b (or any other spike) is ok, but not that great. Warriors and thieves largely ignore immob, but it’s sometimes enough to land a big hit on them (like a Final Thrust). Other classes can often pop an invuln, teleport, or condi clear that takes care of it. Still, it’s not nothing.

Powercreep..

Just compare warrior sword with HOT stuff.. it makes me cry seeing old warrior weapons doing kitten dmg/cc/sustain.. they all used to be viable but now they are kitten compared to HOT.

Hammer > trash CC nobody cares anymore about your slow CC chain.
Sword > power/condi both terrible dmg and stupid missing cripple and terrible slow#3
Axe > PvE .. meh dmg nothing more
Mace > single target, pretty decent but nothing more.
GS > yeah its because #3 and #5, both AA and 100b does kitten dmg (100b takes forever. go 100b a downed player lol! even ressing is more powerful then 100b)
Rifle > good burst, mostly single target, terrible AA.. gimmick can be decent but Rev does it better or thief.
Longbow > has its role on capture point > Aoe.. but Necro does it 10 times better.

this all because of HOT

With the right set up, sword AA can crit up to 2K per hit and the speed it rotates through its chain is pretty quick.

Sword is mainly used in front line wvw zergs now because of its leap skill mainly.

Sword/Torch+LB condi PS is meta for many fractals and raid encounters in PvE. Not every weapon is going to be meta in every game mode. You don’t see similar comparisons on ele forums saying that staff is “pretty dumb” because it isn’t used well in PvP?

ButterPeanut.9746:

Sword/Torch+LB condi PS is meta for many fractals and raid encounters in PvE. Not every weapon is going to be meta in every game mode. You don’t see similar comparisons on ele forums saying that staff is “pretty dumb” because it isn’t used well in PvP?

This is where you are incorrect, staff is huge in WvW, PvE, raids and such but staff ele was also the weapon of choice by EU in the Pro Leagues season 1 before it became 2 mesmer/ 2 rev and X class.

Before HOT staff was the bunker build of cantrip eles, secepter focus being fresh air build did the most dps of the ele builds and d/d being the meta. At no point was 1 actually stronger then the other simply used differently in team comps.

Each meta in PvP forces certain skills/traits to come out. Since HOT came out its simply been this build is best for everything.

See i agree that a weapon can have its place but warrior has greatsword then X weapon. That goes for every area of the game, i honestly prefer a dps greatsword warrior with rifle over a condi warrior in fractals. The Might stacks are constant 25 and your landing 15k damage on staff 5 rev and sword 3 rev by simply having a dps warrior who is doing the same amount of damage.

Then take that same build and apply to raids, PvE, WvW and make changes to stances from banners and you now have the PvP build.

It is really a sad thing to see 4-5 weapons not usable for competitive play anywhere in the game.

ButterPeanut.9746:

Sword/Torch+LB condi PS is meta for many fractals and raid encounters in PvE. Not every weapon is going to be meta in every game mode. You don’t see similar comparisons on ele forums saying that staff is “pretty dumb” because it isn’t used well in PvP?

Sword/sword-Longbow is meta. However, the weapon sets themselves don’t matter. It is the phalanx strength people are wanting. Pound for pound viper warrior does a subpar job in the role of condition stacking. If you take a viper warrior with agony sigils and they can only build about 10 stacks of bleed and maintain on average 4-6 stacks of burning. They can peak higher than this, but the duration just doesn’t last for any substantial time and requires them to be in melee range the entire time. When compared with Necromancer, these numbers are laughable at best and their ability to tank simply does not compare.

Too many adjustments have been made to warrior weapons which have rendered them subpar.
1) Offhand axe
2) Back-loading main hand axe damage.
3) Sword neither scaling with power or condition duration/application
4) Hammer across the board.
5) Longbow being a jack of no trade.
6) Off hand mace.

Cerby.1069:

Obtena.7952:

That’s an easy question to answer: because not everyone cares about hitting the pinnacle of flavour of the month performance.

Here is a question back at you on the same vein: Why is it such a concern to you that sword ‘has no purpose’? Warrior has more weapon access than any other class. Do you think it’s a realistic that every weapon has some purpose to fill? how about the purpose of just “I like using sword and condition damage”. Seems reasonable to me.

Ur argument is that as long as it does something different, than something else, it has earned its right to exist. Correct?

Not even that. I’m not talking about a ‘right to exist’ at all. It’s much simpler. Believe it or not, there are people that make choices based on theme, not performance. Sword fits a theme … the “I want to play sword” theme. It’s not hard to understand .. unless of course a person can’t imagine that people play this way.

Obtena.7952:

Cerby.1069:

Obtena.7952:

That’s an easy question to answer: because not everyone cares about hitting the pinnacle of flavour of the month performance.

Here is a question back at you on the same vein: Why is it such a concern to you that sword ‘has no purpose’? Warrior has more weapon access than any other class. Do you think it’s a realistic that every weapon has some purpose to fill? how about the purpose of just “I like using sword and condition damage”. Seems reasonable to me.

Ur argument is that as long as it does something different, than something else, it has earned its right to exist. Correct?

Not even that. I’m not talking about a ‘right to exist’ at all. It’s much simpler. Believe it or not, there are people that make choices based on theme, not performance. Sword fits a theme … the “I want to play sword” theme. It’s not hard to understand .. unless of course a person can’t imagine that people play this way.

Its perfectly fine to have a theme, its why this game has some of the cooler skins and character looks of any game.

But we are talking about the content of the game. You cant take a condi warrior, guardian, thief, into a raid/fractal and expect people to be happy if the group isnt doing well.

You cant go into WvW or PvP and expect to do well with 75% of the weapons in this game. You can say i made this number up but please take a scepter/focus ele into PvP and say you are useful. Or when is the last time you saw a sword thief in PvP?

I understand theme, its the only reason why ive had a mace on my charr guardian. But trying to say that mace is useful is a bit of a stretch.

Obtena.7952:

Cerby.1069:

Obtena.7952:

That’s an easy question to answer: because not everyone cares about hitting the pinnacle of flavour of the month performance.

Here is a question back at you on the same vein: Why is it such a concern to you that sword ‘has no purpose’? Warrior has more weapon access than any other class. Do you think it’s a realistic that every weapon has some purpose to fill? how about the purpose of just “I like using sword and condition damage”. Seems reasonable to me.

Ur argument is that as long as it does something different, than something else, it has earned its right to exist. Correct?

Not even that. I’m not talking about a ‘right to exist’ at all. It’s much simpler. Believe it or not, there are people that make choices based on theme, not performance. Sword fits a theme … the “I want to play sword” theme. It’s not hard to understand .. unless of course a person can’t imagine that people play this way.

You are absolutely correct, I have no idea what you are talking about.
The “I want to play sword” theme…..so what are you arguing for exactly in respect to this thread? Your right to play sword? I never called for the removal of sword. I just called for it to be redesigned or changed. That still enables your “I want to play sword” theme.

Are you saying You want to play that specific sword with those specific skills and those specific damage values? Well then we have a disagreement, and i’ll refer you back to my original response.

If I’m still off the mark (and im assuming I am) feel free to enlighten me further. I find this intriguing.

What Choppy said. Mobility. In WvW. I like running rifle. Sword/shield keeps me alive longer than greatsword.

kdaddy.5431:

Obtena.7952:

Cerby.1069:

Obtena.7952:

That’s an easy question to answer: because not everyone cares about hitting the pinnacle of flavour of the month performance.

Here is a question back at you on the same vein: Why is it such a concern to you that sword ‘has no purpose’? Warrior has more weapon access than any other class. Do you think it’s a realistic that every weapon has some purpose to fill? how about the purpose of just “I like using sword and condition damage”. Seems reasonable to me.

Ur argument is that as long as it does something different, than something else, it has earned its right to exist. Correct?

Not even that. I’m not talking about a ‘right to exist’ at all. It’s much simpler. Believe it or not, there are people that make choices based on theme, not performance. Sword fits a theme … the “I want to play sword” theme. It’s not hard to understand .. unless of course a person can’t imagine that people play this way.

Its perfectly fine to have a theme, its why this game has some of the cooler skins and character looks of any game.

But we are talking about the content of the game. You cant take a condi warrior, guardian, thief, into a raid/fractal and expect people to be happy if the group isnt doing well.

You cant go into WvW or PvP and expect to do well with 75% of the weapons in this game. You can say i made this number up but please take a scepter/focus ele into PvP and say you are useful. Or when is the last time you saw a sword thief in PvP?

I understand theme, its the only reason why ive had a mace on my charr guardian. But trying to say that mace is useful is a bit of a stretch.

Why is it assumed that you should be able to do that anyways? Do players really think that Anet sits at their desks and plans out how each weapon will perform in ever aspect of the game? I can assure you … they don’t.

Cerby.1069:

Obtena.7952:

Cerby.1069:

Obtena.7952:

That’s an easy question to answer: because not everyone cares about hitting the pinnacle of flavour of the month performance.

Here is a question back at you on the same vein: Why is it such a concern to you that sword ‘has no purpose’? Warrior has more weapon access than any other class. Do you think it’s a realistic that every weapon has some purpose to fill? how about the purpose of just “I like using sword and condition damage”. Seems reasonable to me.

Ur argument is that as long as it does something different, than something else, it has earned its right to exist. Correct?

Not even that. I’m not talking about a ‘right to exist’ at all. It’s much simpler. Believe it or not, there are people that make choices based on theme, not performance. Sword fits a theme … the “I want to play sword” theme. It’s not hard to understand .. unless of course a person can’t imagine that people play this way.

You are absolutely correct, I have no idea what you are talking about.
The “I want to play sword” theme…..so what are you arguing for exactly in respect to this thread?

Pretty simple: You asked what the purpose of sword was if it doesn’t do ‘legit’ damage … it’s a weapon people can use if they want to. It has nothing to do with performance. Obviously there are way more reasons to include weapons for classes other than “do legit damage”, because there wouldn’t be classes like warriors with a dozen weapons to choose from if that was true.

Frankly, I think what is ‘legit’ damage is debatable in the first place,a s well as the fact that damage isn’t the only factor in choosing a weapon, depending on what element of the game you play. There is no reason for Anet to jump on every weapon to improve it every time meta changes or when a player thinks they see a deficiency.

Their are reasons to use sword; I use it because it stacks significant amounts of bleeds very fast. You say Warrior bleeds suck? I beg to differ. I can apply 8 stacks of them every 7 seconds just from regular Burst, not including what I get from traits and Sword AA.

Wow impressive except 2 necros can stack around 90+ bleeds.

Also its obvious Anet doesnt care about weapon balance, utility skill balance, Elite Skill balance.

This is a thread pointing that out but you are simply arguing your point of view when that isnt the topic of the thread nor is it a real response to the person you are trying to suggest that your 10+ stacks of bleeding actually is efficient.

Edit- Lol i cant believe i didnt add this, in PvP, PvE, WvW i have a full trap ranger. I can get 30 stacks of bleeds, 5 burn, 5 psn with some other condi in 5 sec. So yeah that sword damage you mentioned, yeah i guess it works for you.

CntrlAltDefeat.1465:

ButterPeanut.9746:

Sword/Torch+LB condi PS is meta for many fractals and raid encounters in PvE. Not every weapon is going to be meta in every game mode. You don’t see similar comparisons on ele forums saying that staff is “pretty dumb” because it isn’t used well in PvP?

Sword/sword-Longbow is meta. However, the weapon sets themselves don’t matter. It is the phalanx strength people are wanting. Pound for pound viper warrior does a subpar job in the role of condition stacking. If you take a viper warrior with agony sigils and they can only build about 10 stacks of bleed and maintain on average 4-6 stacks of burning. They can peak higher than this, but the duration just doesn’t last for any substantial time and requires them to be in melee range the entire time. When compared with Necromancer, these numbers are laughable at best and their ability to tank simply does not compare.

Too many adjustments have been made to warrior weapons which have rendered them subpar.
1) Offhand axe
2) Back-loading main hand axe damage.
3) Sword neither scaling with power or condition duration/application
4) Hammer across the board.
5) Longbow being a jack of no trade.
6) Off hand mace.

There is a whole lot wrong with your first statement. Granted there are problems with other weapons, but that wasn’t the focus of the OP. The focus of the OP was that there is no point to sword, which simply is not true.

1. The fact that people take a warrior because of PS, EA, and banners is irrelevant in the discussion. You still only take a power GS warrior in PvE for the same reasons. Not because GS does significantly better damage. In fact, in many fights condi PS with LB/Sw+T does greater overall damage than GS warrior and it still checks all the boxes of 25 might, banners, EA.

2. Condi PS should not take agony sigil ever. The bleed and burning estimates are so far off its laughable.
Here’s a video of Fennec’s benchmark on condi PS
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bV9pbcKCggw

If you want a real fight video, look at qT’s 5 man Gorseval kill from 1up’s perspective.

qT’s 5 man kill is arguably the most challenging PvE content anyone has performed to date. The amount of failures, min maxing, and rotation requirements needed for this kill was something that very few players could ever accomplish. Not only that, but for their role of warrior in the group, they were MORE successful with condi PS LB/S+T than they were with the traditional GS power PS. But obviously you know way more about LB/Sw+T than arguably the best PvE players in the game.

3. Comparing to a necromancer is irrelevant because they don’t fulfill the same role. Warrior, no matter what gear you use in PvE, is meant to be a support class. The might generation, banners, EA, are the #1 reason you bring a warrior in a PvE group, not the solo damage. Necromancer fulfills a DPS role, so it should be compared to Ele, Thief, Engi, Guardian…not warrior.

4. My argument are based mostly on high end PvE, but the original OP was never specific in saying that sword is only bad in PvP or WvW and that’s what they don’t like. They simply argued it was bad all over, which isn’t true.

Obtena.7952:

Pretty simple: You asked what the purpose of sword was if it doesn’t do ‘legit’ damage … it’s a weapon people can use if they want to. It has nothing to do with performance. Obviously there are way more reasons to include weapons for classes other than “do legit damage”, because there wouldn’t be classes like warriors with a dozen weapons to choose from if that was true.

Frankly, I think what is ‘legit’ damage is debatable in the first place,a s well as the fact that damage isn’t the only factor in choosing a weapon, depending on what element of the game you play. There is no reason for Anet to jump on every weapon to improve it every time meta changes or when a player thinks they see a deficiency.

Their are reasons to use sword; I use it because it stacks significant amounts of bleeds very fast. You say Warrior bleeds suck? I beg to differ. I can apply 8 stacks of them every 7 seconds just from regular Burst, not including what I get from traits and Sword AA.

Oh, okay I get it now. I gave you the benefit of the doubt, assuming you understood what I wrote. Then since there was still a misunderstanding, I assumed I was the one in error in my interpretation. But in reality the problem was very simple. The fact is you are not understanding what “I” am writing, and you are the one having a misunderstanding.

You get 8 stacks of bleeding with Sword f1? Ok great…..in the time you are sitting there channeling this move what do you think is happening? And you do realize that 8 stacks of bleeding could total up to mere hundreds of damage? How does 8 stacks of bleeding and a few hundred in power damage, from a 4 second channel, matchup against 4 seconds of hundred blades? The point of the thread was to ask questions like that…..I literally posted other comparisons just like this above.

And in terms of ur sword AA…..I’m really curious what bleed damage values you are getting! Maybe you can post ur build or a screenshot or makeup an imaginary number and post it here to educate me? That would be thrilling.

If i could point out that on meta battle PS DPS warrior has a rating of 100 and the condi build you spoke of has a rating of 82.

Fractal has same scores for DPS Greatsword 100 and condi being 82.

WvW same thing, DPS warrior rating 95, next build is shouts at 90.

Just because someone uses a build and makes it work doesnt make it viable. I use rifle in PvP and ive had people ask me mu build. Then 2 days later i see them back on mace/shield- long bow and simply put its easier.

Also the raid guild im in prefer DPS warrior over condi and they said that necro/engy and even ranger can do condi damage better then warrior. The warrior is there to give might in raids and give as much DPS as possible.

I could ask the other raid guild im in since they do all 3 wings twice a week but they have core players who run it and raids are kind of eyes closed rotations for them at this point and could do it on almost any build/team comp set up.

Final thrust should be buffed to finish downed foes.

ddoi.9264:

Final thrust should be buffed to finish downed foes.

Oh man, I’d never leave the sword if they did that! Then again, I really dislike the unequal distribution of death blows in this game. So maybe I’d give up the sword out of guilt… </ambivalence>

kdaddy.5431:

If i could point out that on meta battle PS DPS warrior has a rating of 100 and the condi build you spoke of has a rating of 82.

Fractal has same scores for DPS Greatsword 100 and condi being 82.

WvW same thing, DPS warrior rating 95, next build is shouts at 90.

Just because someone uses a build and makes it work doesnt make it viable. I use rifle in PvP and ive had people ask me mu build. Then 2 days later i see them back on mace/shield- long bow and simply put its easier.

Also the raid guild im in prefer DPS warrior over condi and they said that necro/engy and even ranger can do condi damage better then warrior. The warrior is there to give might in raids and give as much DPS as possible.

The meta battle scores are pretty irrelevant. Many of the lower votes were put in well before the build was complete or realized as being strong.

“DPS warrior over condi and they said that necro/engy and even ranger can do condi damage better then warrior.”
This again also does not matter because warrior isn’t compared to those classes. When making a raid team you never think…“hmm should i take another warrior or a necro/engi/ranger?”. Either you have 2 warriors or you don’t and you should. Not 1, not 3. Condi warrior does give might and in some fights gives more DPS than the power build.

Wing 1
- VG = Having at least 1 condi is better because they can provide range might and buff the red guardian team
- Gor = Both are pretty strong and have their own pros/cons. I like condi when doing no updraft but power when you go to an updraft because you need to rebuild might quickly when flying back into the fight.
- Sabetha = Condi is better because of her positioning and Karde is extra vulnerable to conditions.

Wing 2:
Sloth = Power is a bit better I think because it provides stronger CC and you don’t lose might from swapping out of GS. Also he does clear conditions.
Trio = Doesn’t really matter cuz its EZ but condi is probably better because of Narella needing burn damage to light the kegs on fire.
Matthias: Condi is way better and you should ideally run both warriors on condi for clearing icy patches and ranged damage is very valuable in this fight.

Wing 3:
Escort = Both are fine, however condi warrior is probably best class in the game as locking down and killing the wargs. I typically solo 3-4 of them when doing this encounter.
KC = Power damage is king on all classes
Xera = Both are strong but I typically run condi because we usually have a few necros so stronger Epidemics.

Totals:
Condi: 4
Power: 2
Both are strong: 3

Not so clear cut?

ButterPeanut.9746:

kdaddy.5431:

If i could point out that on meta battle PS DPS warrior has a rating of 100 and the condi build you spoke of has a rating of 82.

Fractal has same scores for DPS Greatsword 100 and condi being 82.

WvW same thing, DPS warrior rating 95, next build is shouts at 90.

Just because someone uses a build and makes it work doesnt make it viable. I use rifle in PvP and ive had people ask me mu build. Then 2 days later i see them back on mace/shield- long bow and simply put its easier.

Also the raid guild im in prefer DPS warrior over condi and they said that necro/engy and even ranger can do condi damage better then warrior. The warrior is there to give might in raids and give as much DPS as possible.

The meta battle scores are pretty irrelevant. Many of the lower votes were put in well before the build was complete or realized as being strong.

“DPS warrior over condi and they said that necro/engy and even ranger can do condi damage better then warrior.”
This again also does not matter because warrior isn’t compared to those classes. When making a raid team you never think…“hmm should i take another warrior or a necro/engi/ranger?”. Either you have 2 warriors or you don’t and you should. Not 1, not 3. Condi warrior does give might and in some fights gives more DPS than the power build.

Wing 1
- VG = Having at least 1 condi is better because they can provide range might and buff the red guardian team
- Gor = Both are pretty strong and have their own pros/cons. I like condi when doing no updraft but power when you go to an updraft because you need to rebuild might quickly when flying back into the fight.
- Sabetha = Condi is better because of her positioning and Karde is extra vulnerable to conditions.

Wing 2:
Sloth = Power is a bit better I think because it provides stronger CC and you don’t lose might from swapping out of GS. Also he does clear conditions.
Trio = Doesn’t really matter cuz its EZ but condi is probably better because of Narella needing burn damage to light the kegs on fire.
Matthias: Condi is way better and you should ideally run both warriors on condi for clearing icy patches and ranged damage is very valuable in this fight.

Wing 3:
Escort = Both are fine, however condi warrior is probably best class in the game as locking down and killing the wargs. I typically solo 3-4 of them when doing this encounter.
KC = Power damage is king on all classes
Xera = Both are strong but I typically run condi because we usually have a few necros so stronger Epidemics.

Totals:
Condi: 4
Power: 2
Both are strong: 3

Not so clear cut?

Just did wing 1,

On VG 1 power warrior, 2 necros, 2 druids, 1 mesmer, 1 rev, 2 tempest. 1 thief

On gors 4 eles, 2 revs, 1 mesmer, 1 thief, 2 druids

On sab 3 necros, 3 tempest, 1 thief, 1 druid, 1 mesmer, 1 rev

Im sorry but i disagree completely, i can take screen prints next time. This was a pug group and the person running it saw no reason for a warrior period and they allowed it for VG for banners.

The raid guild im in has a A raid team and a B raid team who clear all 3 wings twice a week and they only run 1 power PS warrior. And they too will take it out/trade it for a thief,Dh,or tempest.

Once again im sorry but im seeing more and more people take warriors out of team comps and when people say i got a condi warrior. The team always ask “do you have anything else”?

sword pairs pretty well with rifle as a main weapon. sure it does less reliable damage than greatsword but, i wanted a block in wvw with some mobility.

kdaddy.5431:

ButterPeanut.9746:

kdaddy.5431:

If i could point out that on meta battle PS DPS warrior has a rating of 100 and the condi build you spoke of has a rating of 82.

Fractal has same scores for DPS Greatsword 100 and condi being 82.

WvW same thing, DPS warrior rating 95, next build is shouts at 90.

Just because someone uses a build and makes it work doesnt make it viable. I use rifle in PvP and ive had people ask me mu build. Then 2 days later i see them back on mace/shield- long bow and simply put its easier.

Also the raid guild im in prefer DPS warrior over condi and they said that necro/engy and even ranger can do condi damage better then warrior. The warrior is there to give might in raids and give as much DPS as possible.

The meta battle scores are pretty irrelevant. Many of the lower votes were put in well before the build was complete or realized as being strong.

“DPS warrior over condi and they said that necro/engy and even ranger can do condi damage better then warrior.”
This again also does not matter because warrior isn’t compared to those classes. When making a raid team you never think…“hmm should i take another warrior or a necro/engi/ranger?”. Either you have 2 warriors or you don’t and you should. Not 1, not 3. Condi warrior does give might and in some fights gives more DPS than the power build.

Wing 1
- VG = Having at least 1 condi is better because they can provide range might and buff the red guardian team
- Gor = Both are pretty strong and have their own pros/cons. I like condi when doing no updraft but power when you go to an updraft because you need to rebuild might quickly when flying back into the fight.
- Sabetha = Condi is better because of her positioning and Karde is extra vulnerable to conditions.

Wing 2:
Sloth = Power is a bit better I think because it provides stronger CC and you don’t lose might from swapping out of GS. Also he does clear conditions.
Trio = Doesn’t really matter cuz its EZ but condi is probably better because of Narella needing burn damage to light the kegs on fire.
Matthias: Condi is way better and you should ideally run both warriors on condi for clearing icy patches and ranged damage is very valuable in this fight.

Wing 3:
Escort = Both are fine, however condi warrior is probably best class in the game as locking down and killing the wargs. I typically solo 3-4 of them when doing this encounter.
KC = Power damage is king on all classes
Xera = Both are strong but I typically run condi because we usually have a few necros so stronger Epidemics.

Totals:
Condi: 4
Power: 2
Both are strong: 3

Not so clear cut?

Just did wing 1,

On VG 1 power warrior, 2 necros, 2 druids, 1 mesmer, 1 rev, 2 tempest. 1 thief

On gors 4 eles, 2 revs, 1 mesmer, 1 thief, 2 druids

On sab 3 necros, 3 tempest, 1 thief, 1 druid, 1 mesmer, 1 rev

Im sorry but i disagree completely, i can take screen prints next time. This was a pug group and the person running it saw no reason for a warrior period and they allowed it for VG for banners.

The raid guild im in has a A raid team and a B raid team who clear all 3 wings twice a week and they only run 1 power PS warrior. And they too will take it out/trade it for a thief,Dh,or tempest.

Once again im sorry but im seeing more and more people take warriors out of team comps and when people say i got a condi warrior. The team always ask “do you have anything else”?

The “no warrior PUG meta”. Thank god I don’t pug because that is just terrible. Doesn’t seem like there is any convincing you, but literally watch any successful guild or group run raids. Warriors are likely the 2nd most important class to have in raid, only behind chrono.

Simply put, if you aren’t using sword on a condi warrior because a pug raid leader says its bad…then leave the group

I was thinking the same thing without the warrior but it was fine.

We killed Vg and Gors in 4 runs. Failed each boss once.

Also i would say im not gonna see it your way simply because im seeing more and more people basically have no need for a warrior.

In PvP its kind of behind rev and ranger in 1 vs 1 and doesnt bring as much DPS as a necro in team fights.

In PvE its works fine doing anything but you can just wish for more since other classes have it.

Then in raids, simply put im seeing less and less need for them. Thieves are being looked at more for heavy damage, eles seem to be a must for DPS and some heals, obviously the bunker mesmer and druids. Every raid is simply mesmer,,rev, 2 tempest, 1-2 druids and fill in the gaps.

The guild group im in carried me through some bosses since im not great at the sab fight. Basically they won that 8 man and a friend of mine is in a guild that sells raid. They use 2 thieves in there 8 man team to sell them and they only run 1 ps greatsword warrior.

Im more then willing to bet you have more experience in raids then I but im pretty sure i have more WvW and PvP experience and am only going off what the people in raids are telling me and my personal opinion on warrior. I honestly feel that the people who use condi warrior have a role but simply are not needed.

kdaddy.5431:

I was thinking the same thing without the warrior but it was fine.

We killed Vg and Gors in 4 runs. Failed each boss once.

Also i would say im not gonna see it your way simply because im seeing more and more people basically have no need for a warrior.

In PvP its kind of behind rev and ranger in 1 vs 1 and doesnt bring as much DPS as a necro in team fights.

In PvE its works fine doing anything but you can just wish for more since other classes have it.

Then in raids, simply put im seeing less and less need for them. Thieves are being looked at more for heavy damage, eles seem to be a must for DPS and some heals, obviously the bunker mesmer and druids. Every raid is simply mesmer,,rev, 2 tempest, 1-2 druids and fill in the gaps.

The guild group im in carried me through some bosses since im not great at the sab fight. Basically they won that 8 man and a friend of mine is in a guild that sells raid. They use 2 thieves in there 8 man team to sell them and they only run 1 ps greatsword warrior.

Im more then willing to bet you have more experience in raids then I but im pretty sure i have more WvW and PvP experience and am only going off what the people in raids are telling me and my personal opinion on warrior. I honestly feel that the people who use condi warrior have a role but simply are not needed.

“It was fine” isn’t the argument I’m making. You can say that about every class. People have cleared with 10 guardians, 10 necros, 10 rangers, etc. No one class is 100% required. Just yesterday there was a 3 man Vale guardian kill by SC…yes 3 man. Mesmer, Druid, Condi warrior.

That doesn’t mean that you shouldn’t strive to create the best possible group. The fact of the matter is that raids aren’t challenging enough to require such a strict group composition. That can be a pro/con depending on your perspective.

The point I was making is that warrior is a critical part of a successful raid group. How you define “success” depends on that group. If you want smooth, fast, easy runs, you should have a minimum of 1 warrior. Can you do it without it? Of course. But that doesn’t mean you should aim for that.

You have no idea about how often I pvp or wvw.

PVP – I’ll give you druid and necro. A good warrior should beat rev 1v1, but rev’s current role isn’t to 1v1.

WvW- An equivalent statement would be like saying “You don’t need any frontline guardians in a zerg v zerg”. Sure you can probably win without them if you are more skilled than they are, but that doesn’t mean you should avoid guardians in your group.

You are simply making the argument now that anything can be useful depending on what the group wants which is what i basically said except you are now saying that you want 1 warrior in a group.

Also no rev beats warrior 1 vs 1. Especially a power warrior if they are both of good skill quality.

A revs enchanting daggers goes threw warriors endure the pain. Also a well timed staff 5 takes out over 12k and combo into 2 different blocks and stun breakers. Its why you saw tarcis using a rev at the start of S1 Pro League go to rev. As well as Rom now playing ranger. Tarcis brought it back for the last ESL but only really because of the 1 class stack rule.

If you go back and watch the ESL, tarcis lost a 1 vs 1 to phanta on druid. A good rev can take on any 1 vs 1 and stalemate for a long time. Rev has been the hard counter to DH in 1 vs 1 and warriors as well. Rev is the jack of all trades class right now capable of anything so saying its role isnt 1 vs 1 is a bit off.

Also i never said how much you PvP or WvW but simply that you havent done it was much as i have.

kdaddy.5431:

You are simply making the argument now that anything can be useful depending on what the group wants which is what i basically said except you are now saying that you want 1 warrior in a group.

Also no rev beats warrior 1 vs 1. Especially a power warrior if they are both of good skill quality.

A revs enchanting daggers goes threw warriors endure the pain. Also a well timed staff 5 takes out over 12k and combo into 2 different blocks and stun breakers. Its why you saw tarcis using a rev at the start of S1 Pro League go to rev. As well as Rom now playing ranger. Tarcis brought it back for the last ESL but only really because of the 1 class stack rule.

If you go back and watch the ESL, tarcis lost a 1 vs 1 to phanta on druid. A good rev can take on any 1 vs 1 and stalemate for a long time. Rev has been the hard counter to DH in 1 vs 1 and warriors as well. Rev is the jack of all trades class right now capable of anything so saying its role isnt 1 vs 1 is a bit off.

Also i never said how much you PvP or WvW but simply that you havent done it was much as i have.

This is becoming very derailed as the original thread was about how sword is useless…which I have already given plenty of examples of that not being true.

That being said, not one of your arguments for pvp was warrior versus rev, because that shouldn’t happen all that often. A pure power warrior in pvp right now is pretty poor. I’m partial to the condi GS/M+SH hybrid build that Drazeh ran in S3 pro finals. That build was designed to be able to 1v1 anything, including hundreds of 1v1s against Helseth on Mesmer. They had both commented that this build was one of the major reasons they won the S3 season finals. It has since been nerfed a bit with nerfs to adrenal health and it is niche to begin with.

If you rewatch any of the pro league finals, almost never does anyone explicitly send a revenant to a node to 1v1 a class. Maybe in the early seasons but that was due to class stacking and how crazy overtuned launch rev was. But since season 2/3, revs role has been pretty well defined.

That doesn’t mean it cant, it is just better suited in the team fight with large CC, downstate cleave and burst potential. The vast majority of the time you see mesmer, druid (if the team has an ele in team fight), or engi being sent to the 1v1 to contest/win a non team fight node. I personally wouldn’t send engi or druid if you’re team doesn’t have an ele to keep the necro alive, but thats a different discussion.

In the current meta revenant is without a doubt NOT the 1v1 class on a team because everyone takes 2 of mesmer, druid, engi. I haven’t included guard or thief because I don’t feel they are that viable at a high level, but both can be effective in lower levels.

First, you have pointed nothing out other then some people use it in raids.

Nothing else, you say you use the drazah build from S3 but you are comparing yourself to the team who dominated S3 and S4 finals. They dominated with only 2 games really being close against 55 dragons.

At no point does that make it a legit build, especially since they dropped it very quickly for S4. Simply being they have the best 1 vs 1 player in EU in Rom and he was taking on the 1 vs 1 with the condi mesmer taking the 1 vs 1 people would rotate to.

Also no engy did any 1 vs 1 except maybe Olrun who lost to tarcis which is probably why he picked up thief.

Using words of ESL players dont make them true especially when they were winning 500-200 in every game with or without a warrior. Sword is near useless in PvP and WvW and you yourself saying you dont use it just adds to it.

You are literally arguing for a weapon that you have now stated you dont use in PvP. It isnt any good for WvW and im pretty sure everyone on the warrior forum cana gree with that. Then you try using raids on VG to justify it when literally people are healing threw greens and not even worrying about the mechanics.

You can say you use it, thats fine. You tried arguing its necessary for teams in raids and then you back pedal and say well any team can run anything. You then say you dont use sword in PvP. Im recapping it all for you since in your own words you back tracked and acknowledged you dont use sword.

Ive clearly made my points and not changed my stance on any of them. Sword is a near useless weapon in the game for warrior, warrior is not a dominant force in PvP and will lose to multiple classes in 1 vs 1 at the highest level especially if they use sword and even pointed out that the DPS greatsword PS warrior is used threw out the game far more since it is the clear alpha.

You also have said “You have no idea about how often I pvp or wvw” when i simply said i bet ive done more then you. I stand by everything ive said and you are simply back tracking and started talking about other things which you are also incorrect about.

In speech and debate your suppose to make your points and support them, you have a post about how you need X amount of warriors in a post then you simply said the next post well you can obviously beat a raid boss with any class. You are waddling and struggling to make sure your point originally that sword is useful. Im yet to see it and i end it with you dont even use it yourself which you have already stated.

Okay last post here because you have turned this into a finger pointing game when the goal was to point out that there are cases where sword is useful.

“First, you have pointed nothing out other then some people use it in raids.”
- Not only that, but I pointed out that it essentially equivalent or advantageous to a power warrior on 7/9 encounters in the raid.

“Nothing else, you say you use the drazah build from S3 but you are comparing yourself to the team who dominated S3 and S4 finals”
- Where did I say anything about my skill? I simply stated that I am a fan of the build and that it was strong in that particular matchup.

“Also no engy did any 1 vs 1 except maybe Olrun who lost to tarcis which is probably why he picked up thief.”
- Rewatch the Astral Authority games in the World championships. Chaith spends the vast majority of the time in a 1v1 on far. If you read my post you would know that I am NOT advocating for this matchup, but it did happen which invalidates your post.

“You are literally arguing for a weapon that you have now stated you dont use in PvP. It isnt any good for WvW and im pretty sure everyone on the warrior forum cana gree with that. Then you try using raids on VG to justify it when literally people are healing threw greens and not even worrying about the mechanics.”
- I never said in any post that I use sword in anything other than PvE. Here is the first sentence of my first post per batum: Sword/Torch+LB condi PS is meta for many fractals and raid encounters in PvE. Not every weapon is going to be meta in every game mode.

“Ive clearly made my points and not changed my stance on any of them. Sword is a near useless weapon in the game for warrior, warrior is not a dominant force in PvP and will lose to multiple classes in 1 vs 1 at the highest level especially if they use sword and even pointed out that the DPS greatsword PS warrior is used threw out the game far more since it is the clear alpha.”
- Exactly, you derailed the conversation. The conversation was NEVER about how useful warrior was in PvP 1v1. The conversation was never about how good GS is. The conversation was about how sword is “useless” and I simply provided examples of that not being the case.

“You also have said “You have no idea about how often I pvp or wvw” when i simply said i bet ive done more then you. I stand by everything ive said and you are simply back tracking and started talking about other things which you are also incorrect about.”
- You literally told me you wvw and pvp more than me, not that it matters. In order for you to have done it “more” you have to know how much I have…please read

“you have a post about how you need X amount of warriors in a post then you simply said the next post well you can obviously beat a raid boss with any class”
- I never said the word “need”. I said “Either you have 2 warriors or you don’t and you should”. This is true. Just because you can beat the content without wariors does not make this any less true. You could have had an easier/smoother/faster time with 2 warriors and that has been proven by many in the PvE community. There is a reason why the best groups take 2 warriors. It isn’t because it is required to complete it at all…it is because it is the most efficient way.

“You are waddling and struggling to make sure your point originally that sword is useful.”
- Of course I am because this was the original question! The original question wasn’t about whether rev or druid or warrior or engi or mesmer can beat eachother 1v1 with any weapon set. Or whether or not people use it in wvw specifically. The question was a generic question about how sword isn’t useful…and I provided examples of that not being true. Case Closed.

Rifle / Sword + Shield should be a meta build at this point. Sword leap to shield stun to sword 3 ftw. You can crit for 14k plus using that combo. Its nice to finish runners off when you want to use the adrenaline signet elite to keep your stacks of signet mastery up.

Fwiw I’ve found the sword both fun and very effective in PvE with celestial gear. I think it shines best as a hybrid weapon… not a condi or (of course) power, but hybrid. One of my most effective weapon swaps in this vein was sw/sw + sw/torch…. stacking 3 different conditions, plus having a block, leap, and condi-clear is a very versatile skill-set…. again, in PvE (especially HoT).

I can see why it wouldn’t be very effective in PvP/WvW. I don’t see why a weapon needs or should be ideal in every game mode. Yeah, it’d be nice, but I don’t think it’s necessary or important that it be so.

~EW

edit: PS: necro scepter is superior to sword for single-target and ranged. Warrior 1-h sword is superior to scepter for multi-target in melee. The moment there are 2 enemies that can be closed in on, the sword has superior condi over the Necro scepter.

Go to the quantify website or check out thier youtube channel. The ps burnzerker is a meta build now used in raids. Guess what it uses sword/torch and longbow with 20k burns.

To be fair, I created a warrior build with sword in mind.

It has to be vanilla warrior to work, but in wvw I was getting 8k final thrust-100% crit chance-4k flurry-6k impale/rend and typically 1.5-2k auto attacks. I felt pretty sweet about it, but it is horrendously expensive to make. In Spvp it did exactly the same, but 20% less on the damage numbers. However, despite outplaying opponents, it still falls victim to cheese builds.

People can’t say I didn’t try hard and spend lots to make sword viable. I did some sweet things with it..but found I was always reverting to rifle to finish them off. It did better than I expected, but it still struggles to finish what it started.

sad stuff in this forum and this thread

Been playing since beta, i always play warrior.

If you think sword sucks compared to enemy cheese builds, its a no. You have sword 2, a leap to kite, to engage and to escape with. Yes it will take a little bit longer to kill the enemy with a faceroll build.

Flurry is great for setting up 100b’s or even final thrust especially against necro/reapers

With the new trait(minor adrenal health) makeover, sword is more valuable than ever. Easy to set up those 3 stacks/2 stacks of adrenal health with flurry(dont need intial hit of flurry to grant you adrenal health..any hit from the “flurry” will grant you stacks).

Anyway i dont expect anything from you guys, i dont stick to 1 armor set or build(traits) nor no weapon sets.

In GVG’s I switch it up every round if i need to, in roaming I switch it up every 30 minutes or 1 hour(according to food timer). During WvW raids, i switch it up every 30 minutes as well.

By switch it up, i mean : i try to utilize all weapons, yes even Warhorn(roaming, dueling and etc)

One thing I must add, if your playing sword with Berserker HoT spec with non condi build, you need to utilize the burst for the adrenal health aspect(if you have defense traited) or for its ease of activation for Berserker power trait(% damage)

look at these people

Twistedfighter ^^ normal warrior(vanilla)

Hollts ^^ Berserker spec

make warriors look like they need skill to use sword because of the information provided from this thread

KhainPride.3987:

sad stuff in this forum and this thread

Been playing since beta, i always play warrior.

If you think sword sucks compared to enemy cheese builds, its a no.

So what do you use OH sword for? And what Build you use for it?

I mean if you pick and choose you can make every thread obsolete.

Cerby.1069:

KhainPride.3987:

sad stuff in this forum and this thread

Been playing since beta, i always play warrior.

If you think sword sucks compared to enemy cheese builds, its a no.

So what do you use OH sword for? And what Build you use for it?

I mean if you pick and choose you can make every thread obsolete.

off hand sword i use, axe sword with shield mastery (very good for targeted duels like versus gunflame/killshot warrior)

sword 4 does good dmg when landed

Great videos of what warrior does the best. Crush inexperienced players.

I see a lot of hotjoin and PvE titles in the videos. When I am shown a swordmaster video of a warrior in 2 x legendary division I will change my view. However, I will not see that video, because it doesn’t exist…because no one got too, or even tried to make sword viable against other players who were experienced.

Savage leap is jerky and over shoots as much as bulls rush and flurry has a terrible pre and aftercast.

Thanks for chiming in, but those 2 videos don’t add anything credible to swords defense.

Playing since beta doesn’t add cred either. A lot of players have also played since beta, as in….guild wars 1 beta.

Magnus Godrik.5841:

Go to the quantify website or check out thier youtube channel. The ps burnzerker is a meta build now used in raids. Guess what it uses sword/torch and longbow with 20k burns.

Burn fields do not overlap now and have an internal cooldown of 0.5 seconds. Maybe once upon it did 20k..but those days are gone.

F.Y.I it was longbow doing the burns..this discussion is about sword. Get back to us about the bleed ticks and durations this meta build does currently. I will show a necro build that can do double.

I uses axe/wh in my secondary weapon set for WvW roaming. Basicaly it seemed to fit best, but i am not shure anymore. Axe was for a swap and burst or as an opener with a throw + evade the first impact… But i tried sword again and SW2 is indeed very valuable. SW3 and the autoattack are ok and its not such a great diffrence to axe. The burst now is diffrent and thus gives an option. So now i run S/WH and i don´t miss eviscerate much and enjoy my aditional leap.
Now make final trust a 2s cast time finisher ^^.

Cerby.1069:

Obtena.7952:

Pretty simple: You asked what the purpose of sword was if it doesn’t do ‘legit’ damage … it’s a weapon people can use if they want to. It has nothing to do with performance. Obviously there are way more reasons to include weapons for classes other than “do legit damage”, because there wouldn’t be classes like warriors with a dozen weapons to choose from if that was true.

Frankly, I think what is ‘legit’ damage is debatable in the first place,a s well as the fact that damage isn’t the only factor in choosing a weapon, depending on what element of the game you play. There is no reason for Anet to jump on every weapon to improve it every time meta changes or when a player thinks they see a deficiency.

Their are reasons to use sword; I use it because it stacks significant amounts of bleeds very fast. You say Warrior bleeds suck? I beg to differ. I can apply 8 stacks of them every 7 seconds just from regular Burst, not including what I get from traits and Sword AA.

Oh, okay I get it now. I gave you the benefit of the doubt, assuming you understood what I wrote. Then since there was still a misunderstanding, I assumed I was the one in error in my interpretation. But in reality the problem was very simple. The fact is you are not understanding what “I” am writing, and you are the one having a misunderstanding.

You get 8 stacks of bleeding with Sword f1? Ok great…..in the time you are sitting there channeling this move what do you think is happening? And you do realize that 8 stacks of bleeding could total up to mere hundreds of damage? How does 8 stacks of bleeding and a few hundred in power damage, from a 4 second channel, matchup against 4 seconds of hundred blades? The point of the thread was to ask questions like that…..I literally posted other comparisons just like this above.

And in terms of ur sword AA…..I’m really curious what bleed damage values you are getting! Maybe you can post ur build or a screenshot or makeup an imaginary number and post it here to educate me? That would be thrilling.

Oh you want an imaginary number … I have one: i

But seriously, I don’t get your complaint. Sword has a purpose and even if you don’t think it’s a good one, it fills it well. There isn’t a point to argue if 8 stacks is ‘good’ or not; the point is that if you are going to play condi warrior, your using sword and that’s a good enough reason for it to exist, even in the state its in. You might question the motivation to play that build, but that’s dependent on the player, not the game. You’re angle in this thread is performance and if performance was the only factor in making a choice on a build, you would be completely right, but it’s not so …

kdaddy.5431:

Wow impressive except 2 necros can stack around 90+ bleeds.

Wow … you compared the bleed stack from ONE warrior skill to the combined abilities of TWO necros to apply bleeds … what a completely valid comparison ><

CntrlAltDefeat.1465:

Magnus Godrik.5841:

Go to the quantify website or check out thier youtube channel. The ps burnzerker is a meta build now used in raids. Guess what it uses sword/torch and longbow with 20k burns.

Burn fields do not overlap now and have an internal cooldown of 0.5 seconds. Maybe once upon it did 20k..but those days are gone.

F.Y.I it was longbow doing the burns..this discussion is about sword. Get back to us about the bleed ticks and durations this meta build does currently. I will show a necro build that can do double.

No previously you could get 30k+. 20k burns is very achievable in current state and it DOES require swapping to sword. With alacrity you open with sword berserker burst, swap to LB for burst rotation, and swap back to sword for a final burst that you wouldn’t get by camping LB.

Watch a high end warrior go through the DPS rotation and you will realize sw/torch is essential to the rotation. Especially with the change to king of fires and the easy fire aura with the sword leap.

I’m not sure what the purpose of the comparison to necromancer is. Myself and others have repeatedly mentioned that the comparison is 100% irrelevant because necromancer and warrior do NOT fulfill the same role, even though they can both play condi.

You don’t see Mesmer compared to staff else in terms of power DPS. Those two classes don’t fill the same role, and neither do necro/warrior. That comparison is equally irrelevant.

I just wanted to share some screen shots of my raids today before the patch.

I couldnt get the sab kill but got the first 2 in 4 runs. So took about 40 min to get to Sab.

The other one is the Tier 4 -90- fractal.

I just want to point out that its simply easier/better for many of the areas of the game to not run warrior.

This next one is because people are actually trying to defend sword. im all for you saying im having fun with it but do not say its legit.

I would like for you to take a look at this screen shot, this was during S4 and when i was making my usual complaint about MM.

Look at my boons- let me add that that there is 2 screen shots because i sustained a 1 vs 3 and when a thief came to help me we won a 2 vs 3.

Guess what anyone can post anything on youtube/twitch/ or use pictures like i am and say ohhhhh this works. But guess what, sword does not work on warrior.

You only need 1 in raids, you dont need them in fractals, if your in WvW you are playing shouts or power. NOT SWORD and sword has not been useful in PvP since the Major Tournament when ROM was playing a 1 vs 1 sword build with cele amulet. That was almost 3 YEARS AGO.

This thread will keep going because people will argue they like it and therefore try to create a reason to use it.

kdaddy.5431:

If you go back and watch the ESL, tarcis lost a 1 vs 1 to phanta on druid. A good rev can take on any 1 vs 1 and stalemate for a long time. Rev has been the hard counter to DH in 1 vs 1 and warriors as well. Rev is the jack of all trades class right now capable of anything so saying its role isnt 1 vs 1 is a bit off.

Any team would use more than 1 rev given no class stacking. A rev doing 1v1’s is a waste of your rev, hence not it’s role.

Also; rev does not counter dragon hunter.

kdaddy.5431:

I just wanted to share some screen shots of my raids today before the patch.

I couldnt get the sab kill but got the first 2 in 4 runs. So took about 40 min to get to Sab.

The other one is the Tier 4 -90- fractal.

I just want to point out that its simply easier/better for many of the areas of the game to not run warrior.

Looking at the VG screenshot, you being a rev with 15 might, running shiro not dwarf, having staff out while VG is above 66%, and only being ~80-85% with 7:20 left is enough for me to consider all of your argument completely invalid.