Guild Wars 2

much worse..like i keep fighting 5 engis that r best engis game… and we all solo q

Mike.4830:

much worse..like i keep fighting 5 engis that r best engis game… and we all solo q

Was that team Five Gauge, Ostrich Eggs, Darth Vanquisher, Deku God, and Papa Dock?

Ya don’t kitten with that team, they unstoppable, it’s best to wait in base make use of your time by going to forums and write about how they need to get toned down due to being unstoppable.

… this game…. please add our old Team q mmr… im tired of playing with and vs bad players… im honestly just gonna have to super pug ever game?? i dont mind steamrolling everyone// but i would prefer if i could just solo q

Backpack.8517:

… this game…. please add our old Team q mmr… im tired of playing with and vs bad players… im honestly just gonna have to super pug ever game?? i dont mind steamrolling everyone// but i would prefer if i could just solo q

yeah… how much are we gonna have to farm these first time players before we can go against ppl who know what theyre doing?

Justin ODell.9517:

Snip

Since no one has said it yet, I guess I am. Thanks for all the effort you guys put in. While it may not be said as much as it should, we do appreciate all the hard work you guys put into the game.

Happy Holidays Justin. (And Evan too!)

idk I thought the idea was to lessen duplicates, maybe I am misunderstanding
the new info.

Honestly I have lost 5 matches in a row (first time playing since change, haven’t won a match). I used to “team queue” by myself before the change, and since my mmr was high I would usually end up with premades and the matches would be fun and competitive. Now I get matched up with other people queueing by themselves, and it is filled with toxic builds like mm necro. 2 power rangers, a few d/d cele strength rune eles, etc. It is absolutely awful and no fun to play. I refuse to resort to running a toxic build in order to compete. Can MMR be taken more into account than it is? I feel like I’m now forced into the old solo Q which I hated because of the amount of toxic builds.

i’m a very casual player, so i did not play many games, only played 3 games after justin made this post.

1st game i queued ranked arena alone as my warrior.
2nd and 3rd game i queued ranked arena as my warrior together with my engineer friend.

1st game:
3 skyham
5 kyhlo (winner)
2 temple
79 red (mes guard necro mes thief)
501 blue (ele thief war war-me guard)

uh, the scores. i think got carried by them.

79 red – blue 501
mesm 54 – 158 thi
necro 45 – 110 war
mesm 35 – 110 guard
guard 35 – 80 ele
thief 15 – 70 war-me

i guess this is what people call as blowout matches?

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

2nd game:
1 skyham
2 legacy
5 forest (winner)
298 red (ranger mes guard ele mes)
500 blue (engi guard ranger engi-friend war-me)

it became a 5v4 quickly though.
their ranger either d/c or rage quit shortly after me and the other engi in our team roughed them up thoroughly at their home point at the start of the game.

since dishonored is not implemented yet i think people are still rage quitting when they feel like it.

for a 4 player team they tried their very best.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

3rd game:
2 spirit watch
3 kylo (winner)
5 temple

426 red (engi necro mes guard ranger)
503 blue (war-me engi ranger engi-friend thief)

i think this is the most even match?

things might have been a bit different if their mesmer ’s wireless mouse did not start to run out of battery power.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

well to be honest, so far my few games in ranked arena have been enjoyable to me, perhaps because i have not been steam rolled yet by other stronger teams yet.

before justin made this post, i queued ranked arena by myself, alone, 4 games. the last 2 games was 5v4 and those people either d/c or quit right after the match began, even before the first skirmish.

could they have been disconnected by the server?
or they were just maliciously disconnecting the games, causing 5v4 to occur, since no dishonor in place yet?

My husband and I PvP’d in a party together last night and tonight.

Last night: it was either we were wiped or we wiped them. We tried both ranked and unranked: oddly, we had better luck with ranked. Skill level was horrifyingly varying with teams. A couple of matches I got 0 points personally because we were so outclassed – and that hasn’t happened to me in…. a loooong time. We teamed up with one other person for a couple of matches last night that were fair.

Tonight: No wipes. Matches were much better. We only did ranked, but felt much more even and I was either in the middle to upper part of my team in terms of score, win or lose. Though there was a 5v4. People felt much closer in skill level.

Thanks for the adjustments!

I played on EU on primetime. The ranked Q waiting time is awesome. Max 10sec and I got a game. But the teammates or opponents are just random. I played against a friend from my friend list. He and I are Top 200 soloQ player. On this team were 2 player that looked like never played PvP in GW2 before.

On a different game I asked in Chat if someone is going to close…. no answer…. so I wrote I take it. Game starts and we are with 4 people at close. I moved to mid and 3 of them are waiting until it is capped. 1 is going to svanir and wipes. Respawn… wipes again.

Come on. I am not backpack but increase the matchmaking time until you find a good game for us.

I know you are in the BETA right now and it is ok. But you have to work on that or replace it with the old MMR

My team qs lately… 500-0, 500-6, 500-28… cmon reseting MMR?? What is your reasoning behind doing so.

Backpack.8517:

My team qs lately… 500-0, 500-6, 500-28… cmon reseting MMR?? What is your reasoning behind doing so.

you’re too good.

the other players simply cannot deal with you and your team.

are there no other players out there up to you and your team’s level? O_O

There are… my point is, we aren’t getting them…. Like we will q, and another decent team will Q, we won’t get each other..

Backpack.8517:

There are… my point is, we aren’t getting them…. Like we will q, and another decent team will Q, we won’t get each other..

hmmm have you 2 teams tried sync queuing?
since i think you all probably know one another.

i.e. all 10 players enter the ranked arena queue together?
the new system should put your 2 teams together!

if you have already tried that,
your team entered ranked arena queue,

and few seconds later,
the other team entered ranked arena queue,

then both teams should fight each other!

if not, then something is wrong!

Backpack.8517:

My team qs lately… 500-0, 500-6, 500-28… cmon reseting MMR?? What is your reasoning behind doing so.

Yes, the MMR takes quite a long time to have enough games to be accurate for a given player. It is derived not from the player’s performance, but must be deduced from random TEAM performances the player is 1/5th of. That’s a very tough challenge that I am sure takes a 100 games or more to become accurate. Why start over?

Justin ODell.9517:

We’re increasing the penalty for duplicate professions from ‘-200’ to ‘-500’, and increasing the bonus for playing a unique (read: only one on team) from ‘100’ to ‘500’. Hopefully this will reduce the number of duplicate professions seen.

Please correct me if I’m wrong, but I don’t think this will reduce the number of duplicate professions. If I understand it correctly, it reduces the MMR of the team with duplicate professions by 500, and increase the MMR for the unique profession by 500. That means a team with duplicate professions will have the benefit of fighting a lower skill team (since they got the reduced MMR). That’s even better for them. For example, a team of 5 engis stacking now will totally farm the newbies 500 MMR lower.

Is that the intended behavior?

If the above is correct, I think adjusting MMR is the wrong approach for this problem, since for some professions, stacking of them should be treated as a lower MMR (like thieves), but for some professions, stacking of them should be treated as a higher MMR (like guardians/engis).

I think it’s better to make it so we only look for the match with no duplicate profession. If the player’s queue time is more than 1 minute, then also enter the player into a queue that will accept a duplicate profession. If the queue time is more than 2 minutes, enter the player into a queue that will accept 2 duplicate. If the queue time is more than 3 minutes, enter the player into a queue that will accept 3 duplicate, and so on.

Since we already have the “expected match result” to calculate the ladder point, I think we should be more strict about match compositions (like 11111 vs 11112) and duplicate professions.

The matchmaking is a lot better now. I have played 6 games so far, all of them able to carry to victory. Right decision.

Dhunis.9072:

The matchmaking is a lot better now. I have played 6 games so far, all of them able to carry to victory. Right decision.

The fact that you win 6 matches in a row does not mean match making is balanced. If you win 6 balanced match the system is working , if you win 6 unbalanced (ex 500-100 or so ) match the system is not working … but u will be much happier than the other side

PierPiero.9142:

Dhunis.9072:

The matchmaking is a lot better now. I have played 6 games so far, all of them able to carry to victory. Right decision.

The fact that you win 6 matches in a row does not mean match making is balanced. If you win 6 balanced match the system is working , if you win 6 unbalanced (ex 500-100 or so ) match the system is not working … but u will be much happier than the other side

what do you think a balanced match results should be?

500 vs 400+ (5 vs 5 gg well played?)
500 vs 300+ (5 vs 5 gg they tried their best?)

500 vs 200+ (5 vs 5 kinda somewhat steam rolled the other team?)
500 vs 100+ (5 vs 5 brutally massacred them?)
500 vs <100 (5 vs 5 blowout match?)
500 vs 0 (5 vs 5 what is this i don’t even?)

500 vs 300+ (5 vs 4 not really gg but they really tried their best!)

My point is, no matter what i did yesterday some games were impossible to win due to (no) skill of my teammates. After the adjustment the quality of my teammates improved.

Thanks for this hotjoin ranked with pve scrubs all day arenanet

Backpack.8517:

… this game…. please add our old Team q mmr… im tired of playing with and vs bad players… im honestly just gonna have to super pug ever game?? i dont mind steamrolling everyone// but i would prefer if i could just solo q

This.

I won over 50 games yesterday with a few others. It was no challenge at all and I don’t even know myself why I did this.

I was just about to make a thread for this. You claimed to have reworked what I came here to discuss. Cause I still get premades of 3-5 players while we’re all solo (judging by guild tags). It’s a drawback with this new system really cause teams can end up against what was formerly known as “solo queue” people.

Also. Remove courtyard, people TDM on the rest anyway, and it messed with camera SO bad its unplayable half the time if you play a mobile class like thief.

edit/ Also, I’ve yet to play a close game. We either steam roll or get steam rolled. You only made PvP worse, except eleminating the 4v5. But since skill is so unbalanced now anyway, it doesnt even matter. GG

Much better matchmaking. I had two of the closest matches I’d ever had last night! 490(+/- 1):500 and 500:475! Those were so much fun!

it shouldn’t be wrong to ragequit with a 200 or 300 score difference. please make dishonor not affect those.

or can we have a “surrender” option for the team to vote for? it will really save our time.

just think about it. how many are complaining about courtyard being boring kitten? due to when knowing that it’s impossible to win you still have to play till 500.

Ok these are my initial thoughts on the new pvp system in regards to team ranked matches. I dont know if it already being covered, but most of what ive seen relates to solos.

So we gathered our team for some pvp. Its the same people we generally play with, and we are decent. Not the greatest, but generally do alright. When we do lose, and we do, more often then id like to admit, we usually put up at least a decent fight. (At least having a score of around 275 if we get beaten badly.) But today, with our team, we seemed to be getting matches where we were completely out classed. Had a courtyard match where we lost 0-500. Just brutally stomped. In almost evey other match we struggled to even get 100 points.

What i am confused about is how team matches are determined. I’ll admit i dont know anything about mmr or if that even plays a role, or how it would, but some of these match ups were way out of our league.

Although i do like the new system, and being able to get into a match easier and quicker, i think it still needs alot of tweaking. Especially in how team match ups are determined.

Edit: I started a thread about this, but I think it fits in better here.

Not all that long after you implemented these changes last night I got these 2 games in a row, while queuing unranked on my thief. First game was 4 thieves 1 mesmer vs a decent comp, second was 4 thieves 1 elementalist vs a decent comp. Neither time was anyone on my side in a party, though the first game had 2 people on the opposite team in one. We lost the first game terrible, because what the kitten can an unorganized team of only squishies do on foefire, but won the second game thanks to whoever the 2 people who voted trollhammer were.

Screenshots

Ish.2846:

Also. Remove courtyard, people TDM on the rest anyway, and it messed with camera SO bad its unplayable half the time if you play a mobile class like thief.

your complaint about tdm is that youre bad at controlling the camera. hmm.

I think it’s AWESOME that you’re able to make changes on the fly like this! Thanks for still tinkering with it!

The only thing is, now that you’re increasing minimum filter setting to 20, queues will be longer. Isn’t it time to start thinking about an alternative to having us wait around in HOTM while we’re queued, for when queue times become annoyingly long?
My suggestion, as I’ve said in other threads, would be: increase ready button window from 20" to 60" (which should be enough for even the slowest load screens); decrease the pre-match countdown from 2 minutes to 60" to compensate.

Lexiceta.4156:

idk I thought the idea was to lessen duplicates, maybe I am misunderstanding
the new info.

I like how people think that the one match they play is indicative of EVERY RANKED QUEUE MATCH EVER. The changes decrease THE LIKELIHOOD of duplicate professions. If there’s nobody else queuing within a reasonable timeframe you’ll get whoever’s there. How the hell are people posting within 35’ of Justin’s post and saying “oh this is worse than before!” You really think the one game you’ve played in that time has any statistical significance whatsoever?

And for everyone reading and thinking that Justin’s changes didn’t work: bear in mind nobody is motivated to post complaining unless their match was a statistical outlier with 3 rangers or 5 engis. For every 1 person moaning about an unbalanced match there’s probably hundreds who just had an evenly matched one.

Backpack.8517:

… this game…. please add our old Team q mmr… im tired of playing with and vs bad players… im honestly just gonna have to super pug ever game?? i dont mind steamrolling everyone// but i would prefer if i could just solo q

It’s ok dude, we’ve all seen you play, if you want to brag about how much better than everyone else you are you don’t need to disguise it as a diss against the matchmaking… :p If there’s a specific team you want to play against, maybe your time is better spent in scrims with them instead of queueing in ranked arena?

Justin said that in ranked queue the MMR has NOT been reset, btw.

Justin,

If the MMRs are not truly a measure of a player’s actual skill, then you would see blowouts, and the expected win prediction will usually be wrong.

I take it you guys are primarily turning the dials trying to FIRST make the Expected Win prediction truly accurate? Am I right?

Isn’t an accurate prediction the best proof that the MMRs are accurate?

Hello.

Please stop matching me against teams in unranked.

Thanks.

hello. i won 4~5 games continuously becuz ironically i get more engis and eles, which are op class currently, than enemy team. thx anet. hope you always gives me more engi and ele teammate whenever i play soloq.

My team hasn’t made it past 100 pts the last 4 consecutive games. Its not that the other team is amazing either its just the my team hasn’t the foggiest notion of what to do and how to rotate or even how to keep themselves off the floor. I Also don’t claim to be the best pvp player but i have played a considerable amount enough to know when my team is abominable. Before the patch i had some close games but after they are all blowouts.

Backpack.8517:

… this game…. please add our old Team q mmr… im tired of playing with and vs bad players… im honestly just gonna have to super pug ever game?? i dont mind steamrolling everyone// but i would prefer if i could just solo q

this is my biggest issue right now. there is too much trash happening with new/bad players trolling, and ragequitting without giving a hoot about the penalty.

I want to be separate from people who’ve never played a certain map, who have no clue how to use their build, who don’t understand conquest, etc. this population needs to troll itself, not others.

anyhow, those seems like good and necessary changes.

Thanks for working to improve the PvP experience. Ive actually been having some of the most interesting games and im not a HARDCORE pvper (no team sadly although if anyones looking for a ranger or necro in the U.S. Eastern let me know). Its been a good bit of time since I last fought people that I new for certain were more skilled than I was. Ive been changing things up and actually improving for hte first time in awhile.

Sure its frustrating to get partnered against 5 man teams when your solo queing. But thats becoming less and less common. Also these experiences tend to teach you ALOT more about pvp than fighting another random solo quer. After my last team disbanded due to real life issues I never bothered to find another. Now im actually looking because I want to get INTO these matches against these people more often.

I hope I can stay near the top of the solo quers so I get partnered against them again.

Thanks.

You said: “I have dual priorities, that do not conflict. 1) Improve match quality, 2) Ensure prediction is accurate.”

Isn’t #2 actually #1 as well?

Can you even have good match quality without an accurate prediction?

I assume you won’t be turning on the ladders until the prediction is very accurate, so you can award ladder points accurately.

Played four games so far. Good diversity in the team comp, never ran into a team with three rangers, for example.

Three of the matches were close, so it was fun :-)

5 matches in a row where i had 2+ players that were completely clueless as how to play tpvp. All matches resulted in losses that were not close. I don’t understand how i keep getting paired with players that have no experience whatsoever. I’ve been rank 80 since the 1st major patch so getting paired with these players doesn’t make any sense to me at all

For some strange reason, i just had a 1v1 in ranked match, how’s that even possible? I don’t know, but it was just me and a asura warrior and no one else was in there.. In fact, when the ready popup appeared there was only 2 slots for check..

Ryuu.5608:

For some strange reason, i just had a 1v1 in ranked match, how’s that even possible? I don’t know, but it was just me and a asura warrior and no one else was in there.. In fact, when the ready popup appeared there was only 2 slots for check..

Same I just had a duel as well…….2 in a row now.

edit my opponet says they are in thier second duel in a row too.

can confirm the above bug

http://i.imgur.com/OWDZXbZ.jpg

kinda fun tbh

finally ranked 1v1s! ;D

So after the poor matchmaking a couple of days ago, I didn’t play yesterday. I decided to give it a try again today, and I also just ended up in a 1v1.

Can you guys just do a blog post or something once you fix PvP? I feel like a beta tester.

style.6173:

Can you guys just do a blog post or something once you fix PvP? I feel like a beta tester.

Your feeling is shared and an accurate portrayal of reality. We are beta testers. This is how the process works in games with no public test server.

I played a bit on Wednesday and saw enough to give it a rest for a few weeks. I think I’ll pop back once the season starts to see if match quality has improved. If it’s still me solo versus premades, well, there’s always other games.