Guild Wars 2

Gallrvaghn.4921:

Deimos Tel Arin.7391:

berserker stance only gives 8 seconds of condition immunity or 10 seconds if sure footed trait is taken.

the recharge time is 60 seconds so it would be another 50 seconds or 52 seconds before it can be used again.

that seems pretty balanced to me.
since the recharge time is quite long, at 60 seconds.

are people saying that the warrior can destroy them within 8 seconds?

Yes.

OR the warrior can just flail and run away with all leap skills and come back when 60 second CD is almost up.

are you playing pvp bro? wvw is that way>>>

Lordrosicky.5813:

Marcos.3690:

Lordrosicky.5813:

mini.6018:

@op.Anet should definetly go with this and preferrably make it an adept trait.Necros stop qq i have a tip for you.Your pets do 5k damage in one autoattack.Diamond skin would be funny on warriors though.A 30 k hp war is still just 3k damage you need to do.What you need to hit an ele with the insane ammount of ………
1000 DAMAGE to get them at 90% ? Hard to do i know with eles insane inate armor and necros highly telegraphed and obvious weapon skills.

Just 1 q.If you can, t do 10% damage on an ele how exactly are you dealing with engineers?

No, if you run a condition build you cant do 1k direct damage. It simply wont be possible. I cant kill an AR engi sitting there on 100 health an regen. Regen alone > my direct damage. And hybrid necro is horribly bad because scepter doesnt scale at all well with power stats outsies of scepter 3 which only does really when they have condis on them – which they wont.

So ye, you cant deal 10% damage. Rabid engis will be the same tbh.

And AR is not nearly as bad as this trait. At least with ar engis every build in the game has some chance of killing them but condi bombing them at 30% health. There will literally be no way a rabid build can even interract with such an ele. And tbh, same even for a carrion build on necro. They still wont be able to hurt the ele.

Like I said, the evidence is in this thread. A while back there was a thread about anet listening to the wrong players. It is time to see if that is truely still the case. You have experienced players lining up and saying this is a very very bad change to the game. And you have inexperienced players defending it for illogical reasons. This is such a simple thing for anet to see. I hope they dont kitten it up with this trait, which only effects pvp and not pve.

Sorry but a build that can’t deal 1k damage without condis is pure mindless spam and shouldn’t be playable in a serious game. Stop this nonsense thread.

Why is that the definition of mindless spam? That literally makes no sense whatsoever.

Im not saying that necro shouldnt be nerfed. It should be nerfed along with everything else. In fact atm it is probably 5th most powerful class in the game, as whilst it puts out big damage (in the right hands espicially) – it also actually dies and is really weak to the most powerful builds in the game.

5th most powerful class ahahaha

lollasaurus.1457:

Lordrosicky.5813:

Marcos.3690:

Lordrosicky.5813:

mini.6018:

@op.Anet should definetly go with this and preferrably make it an adept trait.Necros stop qq i have a tip for you.Your pets do 5k damage in one autoattack.Diamond skin would be funny on warriors though.A 30 k hp war is still just 3k damage you need to do.What you need to hit an ele with the insane ammount of ………
1000 DAMAGE to get them at 90% ? Hard to do i know with eles insane inate armor and necros highly telegraphed and obvious weapon skills.

Just 1 q.If you can, t do 10% damage on an ele how exactly are you dealing with engineers?

No, if you run a condition build you cant do 1k direct damage. It simply wont be possible. I cant kill an AR engi sitting there on 100 health an regen. Regen alone > my direct damage. And hybrid necro is horribly bad because scepter doesnt scale at all well with power stats outsies of scepter 3 which only does really when they have condis on them – which they wont.

So ye, you cant deal 10% damage. Rabid engis will be the same tbh.

And AR is not nearly as bad as this trait. At least with ar engis every build in the game has some chance of killing them but condi bombing them at 30% health. There will literally be no way a rabid build can even interract with such an ele. And tbh, same even for a carrion build on necro. They still wont be able to hurt the ele.

Like I said, the evidence is in this thread. A while back there was a thread about anet listening to the wrong players. It is time to see if that is truely still the case. You have experienced players lining up and saying this is a very very bad change to the game. And you have inexperienced players defending it for illogical reasons. This is such a simple thing for anet to see. I hope they dont kitten it up with this trait, which only effects pvp and not pve.

Sorry but a build that can’t deal 1k damage without condis is pure mindless spam and shouldn’t be playable in a serious game. Stop this nonsense thread.

Why is that the definition of mindless spam? That literally makes no sense whatsoever.

Im not saying that necro shouldnt be nerfed. It should be nerfed along with everything else. In fact atm it is probably 5th most powerful class in the game, as whilst it puts out big damage (in the right hands espicially) – it also actually dies and is really weak to the most powerful builds in the game.

5th most powerful class ahahaha

He plays necro and doesn’t know is most op kitten ever? Nah ’no one can be that bad.

I don’t even know if I’m going to take Diamond Skin. I simply don’t have the trait points. Do I drop 10 from Arcane and lose Evasive Arcana? Do I not get 15 in Water? I don’t think so.

the OP made even a Nerf Necro thread cause he lost in duel with his necro vs a necro

no joke^^

mini.6018:

Lordrosicky.5813:

mini.6018:

Wintel.4873:

Holy knee-jerk reaction…clueless about Ele traits/builds much?

Diamond Skin is a 30-point Earth trait. EARTH. The condition damage tree. If you see an Ele with Diamond skin, they have already put themselves at a huge disadvantage against almost every meta build.

Currently there are NO decent builds involving 30 Earth because “condi ele” is something that barely exists. Necro and Engineer have superior condi application in every way. So you will still see most Ele’s going 30 Arcana + Air/Fire (burst) or Water (defensive).

What is wrong with people lol…

That is exactly what i was telling people when they introduced damage on boons trait on warriors but everybody has this ideea of 30/30/30/30/30 builds for all classes and they scream op op op op kitten(funny the screamers were mostly eles), even if in fact picking these traits actually means nerfing yourself.Just lol.I do hope however that they will qq as much about eles as they did about warriors.AGAIN and they will , the ammount of bad in players these days is “trough the roof”.

What are you on about dude. Yeh I am so bad. I couldnt find you on the leaderboards for team q but solo q you are 514th with a 59% win % over around 100 games. So you dont team q and have 100 games at a low level of solo q. Honestly, if you are so inexperienced/bad then why even post in balance threads? You cant have any understanding of the game. I dont go on fractals threads and tell them that a fractal boss is op cos I dont have a clue about it.

I loled .With an extra rofl.Not sure if serious whining about “can’t do 1k damage Anet omg” or “i’m a pro cuz i levderbvoards and stuff and you don’t”.

mini maybe because necro cant really bring an elementalist below that health line where he is actually affected by conditions…elementalists constantly heal themselves with their skill when using the signet…this might be okay in teamfights but in duels on sidenodes? hm maybe you should really think before you talk

Romek.4201:

the OP made even a Nerf Necro thread cause he lost in duel with his necro vs a necro

no joke^^

he made the thread because he saw that necro was too strong..
Oh man when have i ever seen an engineer complaining about the automated response trait..he as a necro saw that necro was too strong and suggested nerfs (on his own class!)

mini.6018:

lollasaurus.1457:

Lordrosicky.5813:

Marcos.3690:

Lordrosicky.5813:

mini.6018:

@op.Anet should definetly go with this and preferrably make it an adept trait.Necros stop qq i have a tip for you.Your pets do 5k damage in one autoattack.Diamond skin would be funny on warriors though.A 30 k hp war is still just 3k damage you need to do.What you need to hit an ele with the insane ammount of ………
1000 DAMAGE to get them at 90% ? Hard to do i know with eles insane inate armor and necros highly telegraphed and obvious weapon skills.

Just 1 q.If you can, t do 10% damage on an ele how exactly are you dealing with engineers?

No, if you run a condition build you cant do 1k direct damage. It simply wont be possible. I cant kill an AR engi sitting there on 100 health an regen. Regen alone > my direct damage. And hybrid necro is horribly bad because scepter doesnt scale at all well with power stats outsies of scepter 3 which only does really when they have condis on them – which they wont.

So ye, you cant deal 10% damage. Rabid engis will be the same tbh.

And AR is not nearly as bad as this trait. At least with ar engis every build in the game has some chance of killing them but condi bombing them at 30% health. There will literally be no way a rabid build can even interract with such an ele. And tbh, same even for a carrion build on necro. They still wont be able to hurt the ele.

Like I said, the evidence is in this thread. A while back there was a thread about anet listening to the wrong players. It is time to see if that is truely still the case. You have experienced players lining up and saying this is a very very bad change to the game. And you have inexperienced players defending it for illogical reasons. This is such a simple thing for anet to see. I hope they dont kitten it up with this trait, which only effects pvp and not pve.

Sorry but a build that can’t deal 1k damage without condis is pure mindless spam and shouldn’t be playable in a serious game. Stop this nonsense thread.

Why is that the definition of mindless spam? That literally makes no sense whatsoever.

Im not saying that necro shouldnt be nerfed. It should be nerfed along with everything else. In fact atm it is probably 5th most powerful class in the game, as whilst it puts out big damage (in the right hands espicially) – it also actually dies and is really weak to the most powerful builds in the game.

5th most powerful class ahahaha

He plays necro and doesn’t know is most op kitten ever? Nah ’no one can be that bad.

Seems like you havent played a single tournament in your entire life

and seems like you have not pressed 1 edit button in your entire life

Lordrosicky.5813:

mini.6018:

@op.Anet should definetly go with this and preferrably make it an adept trait.Necros stop qq i have a tip for you.Your pets do 5k damage in one autoattack.Diamond skin would be funny on warriors though.A 30 k hp war is still just 3k damage you need to do.What you need to hit an ele with the insane ammount of ………
1000 DAMAGE to get them at 90% ? Hard to do i know with eles insane inate armor and necros highly telegraphed and obvious weapon skills.

Just 1 q.If you can, t do 10% damage on an ele how exactly are you dealing with engineers?

No, if you run a condition build you cant do 1k direct damage. It simply wont be possible. I cant kill an AR engi sitting there on 100 health an regen. Regen alone > my direct damage. And hybrid necro is horribly bad because scepter doesnt scale at all well with power stats outsies of scepter 3 which only does really when they have condis on them – which they wont.

So ye, you cant deal 10% damage. Rabid engis will be the same tbh.

And AR is not nearly as bad as this trait. At least with ar engis every build in the game has some chance of killing them but condi bombing them at 30% health. There will literally be no way a rabid build can even interract with such an ele. And tbh, same even for a carrion build on necro. They still wont be able to hurt the ele.

Like I said, the evidence is in this thread. A while back there was a thread about anet listening to the wrong players. It is time to see if that is truely still the case. You have experienced players lining up and saying this is a very very bad change to the game. And you have inexperienced players defending it for illogical reasons. This is such a simple thing for anet to see. I hope they dont kitten it up with this trait, which only effects pvp and not pve.

man i just read through most of this and there are guys like mini that seem to never ever have a played a single tourny and yet complain about your idea..ridiculous

why he have to play a tourney for this? This change is not spvp only or tournament only. They will have this in pve wvw hotjoins – whereever

so relax – you are not a somehow more important player than any others cause they dont play tournaments

We r talking in spvp forum and eg i don’t care for pve. And I don’t even care for impact in hotjoins. It will be mosty a tournament issue thats why he maetnioned tournament play.
Imo it should wokr like sum1 mentioned – maybe immunity when attuing to earth for 3-4seconds and it stays when u stay in earth attu.

OP should wait with all the ranting/complaints until end december, or whenever people will be adjusting to the meta.

Sensotix maybe you are just as bad if you think a necro can’t deal 1k normal damage.Even one of his pets hits for more than 1k on a condi build.Ele is not that tanky uf he goes 30into fire and might even miss heals.Just stop focusing on how awesome you think you are maybe for a minute you will understand build mechanics.Or maybe i should make a few random streams too so the average chicken could say omg ye is right cuz he stream and stuff hurrr.

Aaand even if this was somehow possible in a paralel baddie universe , no one is forcing a necro to go full condi kitten.It will still annoy the kitten out of everyone else with his condi spam and free burning for 1 button press.His team can also do1.5k damage to an ele? Condis do not get cleansed even if the ele heals back to 90% treeshold and will continue eating it down to no immunity.Also a necro can radapt?

And please don’t try that bs on me that necro is kitten in tourneys.Necro is the best class for any 2 man group to have arround and not all teams are the best.Even normal average players do them you know..It is just downright impossible to do anything 1v2 if a necros up and that is the only class that can pull it off.you can’t focus the necro because ds leechform and chill croppke while the other class kills you.Or you cant focus even the worst squishiest ele cuz the necro would wreck you in seconds if you take off pressure.Attacks are invisible and ranged.Nice try bro.Keep it up for mEhSports.

mini.6018:

Sensotix maybe you are just as bad if you think a necro can’t deal 1k normal damage.Even one of his pets hits for more than 1k on a condi build.Ele is not that tanky uf he goes 30into fire and might even miss heals.Just stop focusing on how awesome you think you are maybe for a minute you will understand build mechanics.Or maybe i should make a few random streams too so the average chicken could say omg ye is right cuz he stream and stuff hurrr.

Aaand even if this was somehow possible in a paralel baddie universe , no one is forcing a necro to go full condi kitten.It will still annoy the kitten out of everyone else with his condi spam and free burning for 1 button press.His team can also do1.5k damage to an ele? Condis do not get cleansed even if the ele heals back to 90% treeshold and will continue eating it down to no immunity.Also a necro can radapt?

And please don’t try that bs on me that necro is kitten in tourneys.Necro is the best class for any 2 man group to have arround and not all teams are the best.Even normal average players do them you know..It is just downright impossible to do anything 1v2 if a necros up and that is the only class that can pull it off.you can’t focus the necro because ds leechform and chill croppke while the other class kills you.Or you cant focus even the worst squishiest ele cuz the necro would wreck you in seconds if you take off pressure.Attacks are invisible and ranged.Nice try bro.Keep it up for mEhSports.

mini seems like you dont get the point
first of all..in which univers is a MM necro viable (cuz you talked about “pets”)
second of all..my main point is that this trait is passive and that’s something good players don’t want to have in the game too much (choose your side)

Edit:
You claim to know a lot about pvp balancing..the fact that I can’t find you on one of the leaderboards has determined that that is a lie

Zenith.7301:

cymerdown.4103:

Zenith.7301:

Um……

15000-16000 average health with water traitline.

10% is 1500-1600 damage. Your minions will do that much in less than 2 secs.

It’s a useless trait. No ele will take it. An ele still needs 20 in water and 20 in arcana at the very least, not leaving enough for diamond skin.

First of all, “Your minions”??? What game are you playing where MM Necro is viable?

But anyway, that’s exactly the problem with the trait. Either it won’t be good enough and nobody will take it, or it will be pretty OP and everyone will take it. With complete immunity traits like that, there is not much middle ground (outside of meta shifts, but meta shifts due to a single OP trait are not very natural types of shifts).

Lastly, with the words you just said, I don’t think you’ve really thought carefully about how to min-max the trait. I won’t post the exact builds here, but use that noggin.

Aren’t you special.

It’s pretty obvious what some people would build like, and it’s nothing different from the usual ele bunker builds that need to go DIAF, because it’d be nice to get something different like glass cannon daggers (with no investment on 20 water/arcana) or a viable condition build, be it staff or scepter.

Good luck killing anybody in any reasonable amount of time when you’ve specced into Diamond Skin btw.

There are problems with going away from the bunker build btw.
The ele has no real special damage mitigation mechanic. Thief has stealth, necro has death shroud, …
Warrior has the same problem however they have much higher base health, aren’t clothies and have nice regen. Of course we have have mist form and the like but there comes a point where you’r all out of dodges and nice little tricks like that and then you just get stomped.

Of course the point of going glass canon is to not make the fight last long but that only goes so far. Either we get the “QQ firegrab worse then backstab” posts or we don’t have enough to burst something down and we either have to run (which we don’t do better then many other classes anymore) or continue to fight a close combat fight in which we’r the squichies sodding thing you can be in pvp.

2 Players here know actually what balance is and the rest just trash-talk. Diamond-Skin will create the following Scenario in a competitive Team q:

- Diamond-Skin won’t affect teamfights? Check
- Diamond-Skin will affect every 1v1 and hardcounters condition-specs? Check.
Play the ele with a Soldier-Amulet, which means 10% are nearly 2k life. Now try with a necro to actually deal that damage fast enough. Besides that ele have easy access to regeneration and many other sources of healing. (arguments like: Play power-necro or minion-master etc. will just proove my point that you have no idea about this Topic)

Whoever think, this won’t create a hard-counter or won’t create another cheesy-build, definitely has no clue about the whole balance and how it function between different classes/builds and modes.

Soldier amulet ele does virtually no damage whatsoever, so it’s not like the necro would be under pressure.

lol Zenith eles can do damage with soldiers amulet. Thats not the issue as you don’t seem to of read this entire thread.

Let me say it again b4 I start ignoring this thread just like you guys are:

NO ONE CARES IF ITS OP OR UP.
its a bad mechanic that brings more hard counters in the game. It shouldn’t exist. Simple as that.

JinDaVikk.7291:

lol Zenith eles can do damage with soldiers amulet. Thats not the issue as you don’t seem to of read this entire thread.

Let me say it again b4 I start ignoring this thread just like you guys are:

NO ONE CARES IF ITS OP OR UP.
its a bad mechanic that brings more hard counters in the game. It shouldn’t exist. Simple as that.

^ yes . Plus adding this they will have to be careful and they will nerf skillfull aspects of the ele to compensate and make sure no unkillable ele pops up

JinDaVikk.7291:

NO ONE CARES IF ITS OP OR UP.
its a bad mechanic that brings more hard counters in the game. It shouldn’t exist. Simple as that.

Quoted for emphasis. Hard countering is not a healthy way to balance things. It’s sad that Anet is even contemplating this change.

Oblivion.8307:

How about Diamond Skin would activate for 2 seconds whenever you switched to Earth, and gave 75-90% condition reduction? It provides active play and doesn’t act as a hard counter to condition builds.

This. A perfect way to give a similar kind of effect, but require timing and foresight to use with maximum efficiency. It’s funny, but I think this was the best comment to come out of this huge thread, and it’s only 2 sentences long.

A few points:

1. This isn’t actual “passive play” as you have to actively change your play-style to keep the trait in effect. This means using your heals earlier or popping CDs at less ideal times, and actively changing how you play your class. It also has team counter-play in that you just say “thief, come tap this ele so my tanky condi-spam necro can blow him up”

2. Perhaps these “condi immune” traits are a response to the complaints that the meta-ruling condi-builds are able to “do glass cannon damage with a tanky build.” In other words, if you take a carrion amulet, now you have absolutely NO issue with the trait, but you don’t have unreasonable survivability:damage ratios.

3. As Acandis said earlier, this trait isn’t going to be THAT strong except in certain situations. This is a very much 1v1 trait, and the class that has the MOST trouble with it is the necro, which should be teamfighting anyway. In teamfight scenarios, this trait only has limited use for maintaining mobility early in a fight, probably for S/D or S/F, which won’t want to give up the damage just to take the this trait anyway.

Romek.4201:

why he have to play a tourney for this? This change is not spvp only or tournament only. They will have this in pve wvw hotjoins – whereever

so relax – you are not a somehow more important player than any others cause they dont play tournaments

oh he is.. u hasnt seen his thread where claims to be one of the only ones who has the right to suggest something because some virtual e-pen number? he is the god amongst mortel in his opinion and has a lot of fanboys, so shame on u to talking about such prooooooooooooo

:) sarcasm is marvelous

There’s really no reason to divulge into leaderboard numbers when talking about balance, I agree. However I would like to point out that many necromancers would prefer Dhuumfire to be removed from the necromancer, I really hate the trait personally. The ideology behind us not wanting for this trait is to start getting traitlines fixed properly with perhaps a removal of traits such as dhuumfire, empathic bond, incendiary powder and such traits like them, moving the power of these traits into different areas of classes(except dhuumfire, they can just remove that). Adding more to the game isn’t the way to go as you’re just adding more stupidity into what traits already are instead of aiming to fix them even if it does take time to do so.

I climbed out of MMR Hell to top 300 and can pretty safely say that if you’re not playing against higher tier players you have no idea what ought to be considered for class balance. I haven’t been playing there that long, but I’ve reached the point that I know I will be there and potentially higher for as long as I play the game. Rotation, building, class matchups… etc.

Mini, I’ve seen you trolling around enough to see that you are like I used to be before I woke up and learned how to play better. If you 1v1’d Lord I’m pretty sure he would kite your Warrior and fear chain you into the fetal position b/c nobody gets to the top 100 on LB and stays there without knowing how to play their class

When you consider Rock Solid-Ether Renewal-Diamond Skin its pretty obvious that Ele is not going to lose a 1v1 against a Condi build. It’s an easy way out of dealing with Ele’s problems and will make Ele the next class that goes from challenging to easy mode. Add that to blind spam, instant burst with Fresh Air, and some of the best healing power scaling in the game.

I’ve said it before, but I’ll throw it out there again – Condi builds are gonna be teamfighters only nobody in their right mind is gonna put a condi build on sides with Warrior and Ele being able to easily deal with condis 1v1.

Edit: Symbolic I disagree on LB because being at the bottom shows you how TERRIBLE most players are. Especially on NA lol. You’ve never been there so you haven’t had the “privilege” of having to stare at your monitor and shake your head at the kind of things lower tier people do.

jmatb.6307:

I climbed out of MMR Hell to top 300 and can pretty safely say that if you’re not playing against higher tier players you have no idea what ought to be considered for class balance. I haven’t been playing there that long, but I’ve reached the point that I know I will be there and potentially higher for as long as I play the game. Rotation, building, class matchups… etc.

Mini, I’ve seen you trolling around enough to see that you are like I used to be before I woke up and learned how to play better. If you 1v1’d Lord I’m pretty sure he would kite your Warrior and fear chain you into the fetal position b/c nobody gets to the top 100 on LB and stays there without knowing how to play their class

When you consider Rock Solid-Ether Renewal-Diamond Skin its pretty obvious that Ele is not going to lose a 1v1 against a Condi build. It’s an easy way out of dealing with Ele’s problems and will make Ele the next class that goes from challenging to easy mode. Add that to blind spam, instant burst with Fresh Air, and some of the best healing power scaling in the game.

I’ve said it before, but I’ll throw it out there again – Condi builds are gonna be teamfighters only nobody in their right mind is gonna put a condi build on sides with Warrior and Ele being able to easily deal with condis 1v1.

Edit: Symbolic I disagree on LB because being at the bottom shows you how TERRIBLE most players are. Especially on NA lol. You’ve never been there so you haven’t had the “privilege” of having to stare at your monitor and shake your head at the kind of things lower tier people do.

You are describing a 0/30/30/30/30 elementalist lol

jmatb.6307:

Edit: Symbolic I disagree on LB because being at the bottom shows you how TERRIBLE most players are. Especially on NA lol. You’ve never been there so you haven’t had the “privilege” of having to stare at your monitor and shake your head at the kind of things lower tier people do.

I’m already there, i think i’m rank 6-700 or something because i only play zerker staff or d/d ele lol. alls I mean is there’s no reason to bring up leaderboard numbers into a discussion as it’s pointless and ends up in a ‘my kitten is bigger than your kitten’.

I personally think it will be a non issue on a burst ele .It will hard counter the necro(who cares about that sorry excuse of a class anyway) but that spec wont be able to have elem attunement so no access to protection on demand and no regen.
In the end it will be just like the current brust ele only ridiculously much weaker to physical attacks cause he wont be able to get protection or weakness through 25 arcana minor(it procs a lot more than people give credit for on zerkers fresh air)

Then it will be used in a bunker spec that will have the sustain to not die after 3-4 autos of a thief..Now that!!That id like to see.The crying will be SO amusing to watch in here
Btw every champion in Lol has a unique passive..No one complaines and everybody reacts (actively :P) to it.Passives can be good and bad.Just this game seems to have too many

Considering that an Ele with Diamond Skin trait will have to be some kind of random bunkerish condi damage build, I doubt it will affect the Spvp “meta” any time soon unless elementalists start putting out conditions other than bleeding and burning.

I do think condi immunity is as equally stupid as condition damage in its current state. Instead they should replace the many useless defensive minor/major traits with something that deals with condition removal/condi duration decrease. Zerkers will still be as vulnerable to condi, hybrid/bunker specs will have better ways to deal with it.

You need to play the elementalist class a bit to realize that players putting 30 in earth to gain a little condi resistance when you already possess a decent amount of it is most likely not going to happen unless they revamp pretty much everything.

BlackBeard.2873:

A few points:

1. This isn’t actual “passive play” as you have to actively change your play-style to keep the trait in effect. This means using your heals earlier or popping CDs at less ideal times, and actively changing how you play your class. It also has team counter-play in that you just say “thief, come tap this ele so my tanky condi-spam necro can blow him up”

2. Perhaps these “condi immune” traits are a response to the complaints that the meta-ruling condi-builds are able to “do glass cannon damage with a tanky build.” In other words, if you take a carrion amulet, now you have absolutely NO issue with the trait, but you don’t have unreasonable survivability:damage ratios.

3. As Acandis said earlier, this trait isn’t going to be THAT strong except in certain situations. This is a very much 1v1 trait, and the class that has the MOST trouble with it is the necro, which should be teamfighting anyway. In teamfight scenarios, this trait only has limited use for maintaining mobility early in a fight, probably for S/D or S/F, which won’t want to give up the damage just to take the this trait anyway.

I love how all the forums experts think there is a condition meta. It is 100% a bunker meta run by classes which are bad targets and yet have massive dps. Like warriors, thieves and rangers. Necro gimps a team because its too easily killable, not mobile and can be locked down at times. Necro should be nerfed with everything else. And condition teams are still strong. But over the last week almost all teams have moved to the 2xwarrior set up because it is by far the best thing you can play currently.

Oblivion.8307:

jmatb.6307:

Edit: Symbolic I disagree on LB because being at the bottom shows you how TERRIBLE most players are. Especially on NA lol. You’ve never been there so you haven’t had the “privilege” of having to stare at your monitor and shake your head at the kind of things lower tier people do.

I’m already there, i think i’m rank 6-700 or something because i only play zerker staff or d/d ele lol. alls I mean is there’s no reason to bring up leaderboard numbers into a discussion as it’s pointless and ends up in a ‘my kitten is bigger than your kitten’.

Still in the top 1k though. Some ppl on the forum are like 50-70% and think they know what balance is though. Those are the ppl I mean, not the lower half of the top 1k.

It is and isn’t a measuring contest. I agree that people who say they’re kittenes for being in the top 50 vs. top 150 is just first world drama, but people completely out of the loop dont’ really know what the game needs balance wise.

Edit: Marcos, Scepter/Focus 30 Air 30 Earth, 10 Water with Valks ammy is going to be pretty impressive sustain for not having Evasive Arcana post patch. Getting most, if not all, your Ether Renewal even with a little bit of HP is big, since it scales really well with it.

Blackbeard, I think it’ll have Eles capable of running home node defender again, like it used to be on some teams. They’re actually really good against Warriors 1v1 if they know what they’re doing

jmatb.6307:

Oblivion.8307:

jmatb.6307:

Edit: Symbolic I disagree on LB because being at the bottom shows you how TERRIBLE most players are. Especially on NA lol. You’ve never been there so you haven’t had the “privilege” of having to stare at your monitor and shake your head at the kind of things lower tier people do.

I’m already there, i think i’m rank 6-700 or something because i only play zerker staff or d/d ele lol. alls I mean is there’s no reason to bring up leaderboard numbers into a discussion as it’s pointless and ends up in a ‘my kitten is bigger than your kitten’.

Still in the top 1k though. Some ppl on the forum are like 50-70% and think they know what balance is though. Those are the ppl I mean, not the lower half of the top 1k.

It is and isn’t a measuring contest. I agree that people who say they’re kittenes for being in the top 50 vs. top 150 is just first world drama, but people completely out of the loop dont’ really know what the game needs balance wise.

Yeh, it is pretty much people who dont even play pvp. They just come over from the class forums to be the knights in shining armour for their favourite class. You get the same “Anet hates necro!” idiots on the necro forums. Just like the guys linking pve necro builds in the AR thread I made. You can’t engage with these people because they just have no idea about the game

These people twist and turn to try and make those of us who are posting to try and improve the game (and not just make our class easymode cheese) look bad. So they cling onto everything which gains any traction.

jmatb.6307:

Oblivion.8307:

jmatb.6307:

Edit: Symbolic I disagree on LB because being at the bottom shows you how TERRIBLE most players are. Especially on NA lol. You’ve never been there so you haven’t had the “privilege” of having to stare at your monitor and shake your head at the kind of things lower tier people do.

I’m already there, i think i’m rank 6-700 or something because i only play zerker staff or d/d ele lol. alls I mean is there’s no reason to bring up leaderboard numbers into a discussion as it’s pointless and ends up in a ‘my kitten is bigger than your kitten’.

Still in the top 1k though. Some ppl on the forum are like 50-70% and think they know what balance is though. Those are the ppl I mean, not the lower half of the top 1k.

It is and isn’t a measuring contest. I agree that people who say they’re kittenes for being in the top 50 vs. top 150 is just first world drama, but people completely out of the loop dont’ really know what the game needs balance wise.

Edit: Marcos, Scepter/Focus 30 Air 30 Earth, 10 Water with Valks ammy is going to be pretty impressive sustain for not having Evasive Arcana post patch. Getting most, if not all, your Ether Renewal even with a little bit of HP is big, since it scales really well with it.

Wake up from your delusional trance m8.Leadetboards stil mean nothing the win/lose ratio is purely based of the rng players you get teamed with.Pure chance.I used to have 10 wins in a row after the change and second day i could lose 15 in a row.Please explain to me how exactly is a players real skill shown if it’s only tied to rng team generator.

You can lose a lot and be the top player in a match, make low points but playing flawlesly(pushibg right nodes in the right times, causing handicap to enemie team forcing them to fight a 2, 3 v1) and still lose.Also is a lot harder to get into high ranks if you play a skill required build.Everyone in the top plays only easymode broken builds that should be the laughing stock of gaming in general (pvp gaming wise).
.
How many zerker warriors are at top? How many power rangers? How many non perma dodge thieves? How many non bunker guards, and so on.Copy paste counts too much in getting high rank also farming, quiting at the right time or luck.Just don’t preach us these top player knowledge and wisdom kitten .No one with half his brain will take it seriously.

Mini, the only delusional trance I’ve had is when I was saying exactly what you are saying now word for word 3 months ago. I was raging pretty hard at the Dhuumfire and Spirit Ranger meta, made all kinds of active/passive posts and QQ’d like there was no tomorrow… and sucked at playing the game.

To be honest if you’re having issues with the new matchmaking and losing that many in a row in the top 1k, then it looks like you were getting carried.

I learned how to rotate, when to 1v1, when to help the team and say “nope” to a better 1v1 build, how to pick the right class for your solo Q team, and when and how to play certain maps. You can’t play this game with tunnel vision and expect to win.

jmatb.6307:

Mini, the only delusional trance I’ve had is when I was saying exactly what you are saying now word for word 3 months ago. I was raging pretty hard at the Dhuumfire and Spirit Ranger meta, made all kinds of active/passive posts and QQ’d like there was no tomorrow… and sucked at playing the game.

To be honest if you’re having issues with the new matchmaking and losing that many in a row in the top 1k, then it looks like you were getting carried.

I learned how to rotate, when to 1v1, when to help the team and say “nope” to a better 1v1 build, how to pick the right class for your solo Q team, and when and how to play certain maps. You can’t play this game with tunnel vision and expect to win.

You get teamed with double thief , ele and engie while playing non fotm warrior.Enemy team is 2 bunker guards 1 warrior wich is ofc hambow pvt, and 2 necros or 1 spirit ranger.I can take diwn the warrior while handling 1 guardian.I can decap the point against a guardian, necro or warrior.I can hold the point for fairly long if im not getting zerged or 1v2 with a necro involved becquse can kill ppl rather fast with my build.Can i win the match? Never because my team overall kust lacks in composition wixh was rng based not choice or skipp.Enemy team only needs to zerg 1 point, plant the guardiang and gg move to second.Plant guard and then just roam in between.

Rng is rng there can’t be a discussion about it.

Team lb is different because it’s your fault if you bring a bad composition but most of the times that is the only factor that counts, yeam comp and build.Most high ranks builds are gimmick OP builds wich require minimum skill as anyone already knows.

I just have another meter for skill lvl.Kill op builds while using a up one has my respect.Every warrior that was doing decent before fixes has my respect.Every ele that does good now has my respect and so on.You can’t just copy paste the newest op build and climb broken lb to getsome sugar in my book sorry.

Mini is right about the randomness of matchups and how solo q really doesnt mean anything right now. After this reset we will see how things turn out, but if your claim to fame right now is how high you are on solo q, please take a seat.

soloq really shouldn’t be taken as a skill measurement, lol. if anything it’s something you do to improve your own gameplay. You can’t win every game but if you’re doing the correct things you’re more likely to win than lose games. If you really want to improve your gameplay you can review all of your games to think what you could have done better in regards and how you could have done better in order to carry your team and apply the things you’ve learned to future games. That’s really what soloq is for in my honest opinion. But nevertheless the topic has derailed into stupid leaderboard rank kitten contest.

Completely off topic:

Stop complaining about people running stronger builds. It’s called competition. You want to run a weaker build and complain about your team losing? Stop being a hypocrite.

or run d/d zerker ele and have fun while not caring about your rank!

Mind to explain why you are under the opinion that
a: diamond skin is an hard counter to all condition builds
and
b: hard counters are a bad thing for the game
?

Lachanche.6859:

Mind to explain why you are under the opinion that
a: diamond skin is an hard counter to all condition builds
and
b: hard counters are a bad thing for the game
?

Read the thread

Sensotix.4106:

mini.6018:

Lordrosicky.5813:

mini.6018:

Wintel.4873:

Holy knee-jerk reaction…clueless about Ele traits/builds much?

Diamond Skin is a 30-point Earth trait. EARTH. The condition damage tree. If you see an Ele with Diamond skin, they have already put themselves at a huge disadvantage against almost every meta build.

Currently there are NO decent builds involving 30 Earth because “condi ele” is something that barely exists. Necro and Engineer have superior condi application in every way. So you will still see most Ele’s going 30 Arcana + Air/Fire (burst) or Water (defensive).

What is wrong with people lol…

That is exactly what i was telling people when they introduced damage on boons trait on warriors but everybody has this ideea of 30/30/30/30/30 builds for all classes and they scream op op op op kitten(funny the screamers were mostly eles), even if in fact picking these traits actually means nerfing yourself.Just lol.I do hope however that they will qq as much about eles as they did about warriors.AGAIN and they will , the ammount of bad in players these days is “trough the roof”.

What are you on about dude. Yeh I am so bad. I couldnt find you on the leaderboards for team q but solo q you are 514th with a 59% win % over around 100 games. So you dont team q and have 100 games at a low level of solo q. Honestly, if you are so inexperienced/bad then why even post in balance threads? You cant have any understanding of the game. I dont go on fractals threads and tell them that a fractal boss is op cos I dont have a clue about it.

I loled .With an extra rofl.Not sure if serious whining about “can’t do 1k damage Anet omg” or “i’m a pro cuz i levderbvoards and stuff and you don’t”.

mini maybe because necro cant really bring an elementalist below that health line where he is actually affected by conditions…elementalists constantly heal themselves with their skill when using the signet…this might be okay in teamfights but in duels on sidenodes? hm maybe you should really think before you talk

then don’t send a rabid necro to duel a diamond skin elementalist on side node?

Shar.3402:

Sensotix.4106:

mini.6018:

Lordrosicky.5813:

mini.6018:

Wintel.4873:

Holy knee-jerk reaction…clueless about Ele traits/builds much?

Diamond Skin is a 30-point Earth trait. EARTH. The condition damage tree. If you see an Ele with Diamond skin, they have already put themselves at a huge disadvantage against almost every meta build.

Currently there are NO decent builds involving 30 Earth because “condi ele” is something that barely exists. Necro and Engineer have superior condi application in every way. So you will still see most Ele’s going 30 Arcana + Air/Fire (burst) or Water (defensive).

What is wrong with people lol…

That is exactly what i was telling people when they introduced damage on boons trait on warriors but everybody has this ideea of 30/30/30/30/30 builds for all classes and they scream op op op op kitten(funny the screamers were mostly eles), even if in fact picking these traits actually means nerfing yourself.Just lol.I do hope however that they will qq as much about eles as they did about warriors.AGAIN and they will , the ammount of bad in players these days is “trough the roof”.

What are you on about dude. Yeh I am so bad. I couldnt find you on the leaderboards for team q but solo q you are 514th with a 59% win % over around 100 games. So you dont team q and have 100 games at a low level of solo q. Honestly, if you are so inexperienced/bad then why even post in balance threads? You cant have any understanding of the game. I dont go on fractals threads and tell them that a fractal boss is op cos I dont have a clue about it.

I loled .With an extra rofl.Not sure if serious whining about “can’t do 1k damage Anet omg” or “i’m a pro cuz i levderbvoards and stuff and you don’t”.

mini maybe because necro cant really bring an elementalist below that health line where he is actually affected by conditions…elementalists constantly heal themselves with their skill when using the signet…this might be okay in teamfights but in duels on sidenodes? hm maybe you should really think before you talk

then don’t send a rabid necro to duel a diamond skin elementalist on side node?

Those tactics are too advanced for some people, its better to complain on the forums before the change even comes out.

mini.6018:

You can’t just copy paste the newest op build and climb broken lb to getsome sugar in my book sorry.

You have no idea whether or not I used an OP build, an UP build, or what classes I used. You’re too mad to be good at the game you might want to take a break.

In your example, what in the world are you doing running that build with those teammates? That’s the kind of thing that separates people who want to win from people who win – you knew going in that the build was bad for your team and didn’t make any choice to improve your team’s chances…

Also, symbolic it wasn’t a coincidence that the people on top of team Q are the same people that were on top of solo Q. It’s not as legitimate a measure of skill as team Q, but you can’t be terrible and get on top if it, especially now with the changes to MMR pairing that doesn’t rig it for the people on top at everyone else’s expense.

I agree about what solo Q is for, it’s throwing yourself into a trap and getting out alive haha

jmatb.6307:

Also, symbolic it wasn’t a coincidence that the people on top of team Q are the same people that were on top of solo Q.

Ye we already know.It was called syncronizing

For all the rest.Your build pls? Back up your words.

In that scenario? Maybe you don’t understand how capture and hold works.

Enjoy lb reset.Have fun.

I hope they listened to this thread or rework how immunities work (maybe make all these things only immune to confusion, burn and bleed?).

Shar.3402:

Sensotix.4106:

mini.6018:

Lordrosicky.5813:

mini.6018:

Wintel.4873:

snip

snip

snip.

I loled .With an extra rofl.Not sure if serious whining about “can’t do 1k damage Anet omg” or “i’m a pro cuz i levderbvoards and stuff and you don’t”.

mini maybe because necro cant really bring an elementalist below that health line where he is actually affected by conditions…elementalists constantly heal themselves with their skill when using the signet…this might be okay in teamfights but in duels on sidenodes? hm maybe you should really think before you talk

then don’t send a rabid necro to duel a diamond skin elementalist on side node?

Not really. Sometimes things like this happen and you have to take a sucky 1 on 1. Also in team fights it wil be just as bad. Currently necro is borderline not viable because of warriors and thieves. The warriors and thieves can train you even if you are well behind ur own lines because:

1, S/d is the most OP spec ever made – it doesnt punish anyone for bad positioning and for taking fights they might not win. The s/d thief can just evade and escape literally anything. Nobody can peel a s/d thief off a necro because nobody can actually touch him.

2, Warrior do massive damage and cc with hammer and longbow. With zerker stance nobody can peel for you. They cant chill, cripple, immobalise or fear the warrior. And they cant stun the warrior because the warrior ALWAYS has stability. So again no team work can really save the necro.

And the sustain of these 2 classes is so absurd that even if the necro plays like a complete GOD and kites these people for a minute whilst not dying – it is unlikely anything on the other team will die because of healing signet and s/d evasion. It is a complete joke.

Rabid necro is the only viable necro build because necro is light armour and has no vigor, no evades, little boon protection. So a necro with rabids has the same armour as a guardian with zerker. Death shroud can be nice but it gets eaten up so fast and you have to have death shroud off cooldown and actually have some death shroud available. This is why power necro will always just be bad. Sure you might get it to work to some degree but it will never be good.

Carrions is also just bad because the scepter and marks scale horribly with power. So there is almost no benefit from going carrions. Your direct damage will barely increase.

So take the current situation and throw in an ele who can almost 1 shot you AND who you cant chill, fear, cripple or anything. He cant be peeled off you by a guardian immobalise. And he will be chasing you along with all the warriors. What hope does a necro have? I dont even care about being underpowered, I want to be underpowered. But I hate the fact that a necro will literally be unable to interact with 75% of what people play after the patch. Necro will be hopeless.

And on the underpowered and overpowered discussion. You would have to be insane to think diamond skin is anything but the best trait in the game. It will give you a 100% win % vs alot of builds and will make disengages a simple process. Even vs some builds which you wont win 100%, it will give such an initial advantage to make it likely you will win the fight. Such as any ranger. They will have massive difficulty with diamond skin eles too, as they suffer the same problem as necro – in that power specs are not runnable. They might be able to run carrions though and actually have a pet to help them

Diamond skin rewards an overly demanding health management system, and raises the skill cap significantly (which most buffs don’t do). Having a matchup that a min maxed glass necro can’t debunk easily will not break the game.

Phaeton.9582:

Diamond skin rewards an overly demanding health management system, and raises the skill cap significantly (which most buffs don’t do). Having a matchup that a min maxed glass necro can’t debunk easily will not break the game.

Yeh dat skill from healing PASSIVELY whilst they cast their skills will be epic. And it isnt a case of “debunk easily” – it is a case of 100% kill rate 1 on 1 an in team fights. Literally the hardest possible counter. They might as well give eles a skill called “Kill a necro within 1200 range”. You cant even stop them stomping by fearing from downed state. lol absurd