Guild Wars 2

I’m wondering about the thought process behind “let’s nerf showbow #1 so that it can’t hit anything remotely mobile anymore.”

I personally think the nerf is really extreme. It’s WAY worse than the mug nerf.

If you haven’t tried it yet, shortbow #1 could EASILY be avoided now by simply strafing left and right. It WON’T hit you, and it doesn’t require trying hard neither – it is literally just pressing left and then right. You have more of a chance of landing a far ranged cluster bomb than a auto attack. No decent player would ever just stand in place for you to shoot at…

A ranger can brainlessly shoot fast homing, bleeding arrows, at 1200 range, but thieves shouldn’t be able to hit anything with auto-attack within 900r unless the enemy is brain dead? Well that’s not fair, let’s buff ranger pets as well! That would make things even!

As a thief player who has stayed loyal to playing a thief in tpvp, it’s frustrating when things like this happen…it’s hard enough to play a proper thief in tpvp. (no I don’t mean hotjoins) Now you can’t even sit at range anymore to shortbow, which was one of our only ways to play defensively. Now, our only choice is to either put a poison field down or pray for slow cluster bombs to hit a random target. The catch 22 is that we will still be forced to use a shortbow because of it’s amazing mobility and tricks with #5.

Question is: Why should a thieve’s long range weapon set get a nerf like this? I don’t see how it’s justified…no one ever complained about how OP thieves’ shortbow auto attacks were…people complained about how OP hgh engis are, and the devs decided to keep them untouched. People complained about ranger pets, but they decided to buff them, because why not? The pets can ONLY follow you across the map…why not give them more hp?

They don’t want to nerf anything drastically, then pull something like this?

Really?

Amaterasu.6280:

I’m wondering about the thought process behind “let’s nerf showbow #1 so that it can’t hit anything remotely mobile anymore.”

I personally think the nerf is really extreme. It’s WAY worse than the mug nerf.

If you haven’t tried it yet, shortbow #1 could EASILY be avoided now by simply strafing left and right. It WON’T hit you, and it doesn’t require trying hard neither – it is literally just pressing left and then right. You have more of a chance of landing a far ranged cluster bomb than a auto attack. No decent player would ever just stand in place for you to shoot at…

A ranger can brainlessly shoot fast homing, bleeding arrows, at 1200 range, but thieves shouldn’t be able to hit anything with auto-attack within 900r unless the enemy is brain dead? Well that’s not fair, let’s buff ranger pets as well! That would make things even!

As a thief player who has stayed loyal to playing a thief in tpvp, it’s frustrating when things like this happen…it’s hard enough to play a proper thief in tpvp. (no I don’t mean hotjoins) Now you can’t even sit at range anymore to shortbow, which was one of our only way to play defensively. Now, our only choice is to either put a poison field down or pray for slow cluster bombs to hit a random target. The catch 22 is that we will still be forced to use a shortbow because of it’s amazing mobility and tricks with #5.

Question is: Why should a thieve’s long range weapon set get a nerf like this? I don’t see how it’s justified…no one ever complained about how OP thieves’ shortbow auto attacks were…people complained about how OP hgh engis are, and the devs decided to keep them untouched. People complained about ranger pets, but they decided to buff them, because why not? The pets can ONLY follow you across the map…why not give them more hp?

They don’t want to nerf anything drastically, then pull something like this?

Really?

What got changed exactly? The projectile speed?

Working as intended… unless you want arrows to have a bent path…

Skyro.3108:

Amaterasu.6280:

I’m wondering about the thought process behind “let’s nerf showbow #1 so that it can’t hit anything remotely mobile anymore.”

I personally think the nerf is really extreme. It’s WAY worse than the mug nerf.

If you haven’t tried it yet, shortbow #1 could EASILY be avoided now by simply strafing left and right. It WON’T hit you, and it doesn’t require trying hard neither – it is literally just pressing left and then right. You have more of a chance of landing a far ranged cluster bomb than a auto attack. No decent player would ever just stand in place for you to shoot at…

A ranger can brainlessly shoot fast homing, bleeding arrows, at 1200 range, but thieves shouldn’t be able to hit anything with auto-attack within 900r unless the enemy is brain dead? Well that’s not fair, let’s buff ranger pets as well! That would make things even!

As a thief player who has stayed loyal to playing a thief in tpvp, it’s frustrating when things like this happen…it’s hard enough to play a proper thief in tpvp. (no I don’t mean hotjoins) Now you can’t even sit at range anymore to shortbow, which was one of our only way to play defensively. Now, our only choice is to either put a poison field down or pray for slow cluster bombs to hit a random target. The catch 22 is that we will still be forced to use a shortbow because of it’s amazing mobility and tricks with #5.

Question is: Why should a thieve’s long range weapon set get a nerf like this? I don’t see how it’s justified…no one ever complained about how OP thieves’ shortbow auto attacks were…people complained about how OP hgh engis are, and the devs decided to keep them untouched. People complained about ranger pets, but they decided to buff them, because why not? The pets can ONLY follow you across the map…why not give them more hp?

They don’t want to nerf anything drastically, then pull something like this?

Really?

What got changed exactly? The projectile speed?

Nope, they no longer try to track the target.

Just try it, have someone autoattack you and strafe left and right.

Amaterasu.6280:

Skyro.3108:

Amaterasu.6280:

I’m wondering about the thought process behind “let’s nerf showbow #1 so that it can’t hit anything remotely mobile anymore.”

I personally think the nerf is really extreme. It’s WAY worse than the mug nerf.

If you haven’t tried it yet, shortbow #1 could EASILY be avoided now by simply strafing left and right. It WON’T hit you, and it doesn’t require trying hard neither – it is literally just pressing left and then right. You have more of a chance of landing a far ranged cluster bomb than a auto attack. No decent player would ever just stand in place for you to shoot at…

A ranger can brainlessly shoot fast homing, bleeding arrows, at 1200 range, but thieves shouldn’t be able to hit anything with auto-attack within 900r unless the enemy is brain dead? Well that’s not fair, let’s buff ranger pets as well! That would make things even!

As a thief player who has stayed loyal to playing a thief in tpvp, it’s frustrating when things like this happen…it’s hard enough to play a proper thief in tpvp. (no I don’t mean hotjoins) Now you can’t even sit at range anymore to shortbow, which was one of our only way to play defensively. Now, our only choice is to either put a poison field down or pray for slow cluster bombs to hit a random target. The catch 22 is that we will still be forced to use a shortbow because of it’s amazing mobility and tricks with #5.

Question is: Why should a thieve’s long range weapon set get a nerf like this? I don’t see how it’s justified…no one ever complained about how OP thieves’ shortbow auto attacks were…people complained about how OP hgh engis are, and the devs decided to keep them untouched. People complained about ranger pets, but they decided to buff them, because why not? The pets can ONLY follow you across the map…why not give them more hp?

They don’t want to nerf anything drastically, then pull something like this?

Really?

What got changed exactly? The projectile speed?

Nope, they no longer try to track the target.

Just try it, have someone autoattack you and strafe left and right.

You mean they don’t home in like the Guardian Scepter does!??!

This is an outrage!

So it’s now on par with other ranged weapons right?

Yea, on par like mesmer’s GS auto attacks which are homing channeled attacks which can hit multiple targets, and on par with ranger auto attacks which are 1200r bleeding homing arrows.

On par, for sure.

Jax – comparing this nerf to a gaurdian scepter is stupid, a thief is a dps class, a guardian isn’t. Give thieves survivability like a guardian and we’ll talk.

On par with warrior long bow, ranger long bow, and ele staff abilities.

You don’t understand – a shortbow is our ONLY viable ranged option. We don’t have a choice…don’t even bring up p/p.

Sb hits 3 targets for 1k damage for no initiative. It needed some balance/.

i beeen using p/p though it kill my mobility that all

Welcome to the world of the scepter guardians.

Pyriall.5027:

On par with warrior long bow, ranger long bow, and ele staff abilities.

Thief SB is on par with long bow and staff now? Awesome! I missed the part where they adjusted Shortbow range to 1200-1500. Ohh wait they didnt? Guess its not on par then is it now?

I dont understand all the fuss.
the Devs specifically said they wanted to nerf viable sets down so that unviable sets would get used more. Seems like everything is working as intended.

Do you guys even read dev notes or watch sotg? This was all stated there.

mursie.3681:

I dont understand all the fuss.
the Devs specifically said they wanted to nerf viable sets down so that unviable sets would get used more. Seems like everything is working as intended.

Do you guys even read dev notes or watch sotg? This was all stated there.

You just said it yourself.

They ONLY nerfed the thief’s viable long range set. I guess they forgot to implement the nerf for all the other classes’ set =/

They seem to be out to kitten off as many non rangers as possible with this patch don’t they?

Nerfing mindless aoe is a always a good thing. Hoping for a grenade nerf sometime in the not too distant future.

Swim.6830:

Working as intended… unless you want arrows to have a bent path…

So it’s time to apply this on rangers too..

Swim.6830:

Working as intended… unless you want arrows to have a bent path…

Lol. Why not have a bent path? the bloody arrow bounces between targets.

The autoattack was hardly an issue…

So i play a ranger and a thief primarily in pvp. While i admit the arrows no longer homing targets is going to suck to get used to, I have no idea what ur talking about with ranger attacks homing as I have never seen my arrows track ANYTHING like thief shortbow arrows. they just have a faster and flatter trajectory.

You’re kidding me right?

Even at 1200r, a ranger’s SB autoattack is impossible to straft dodge…I have to actually hit dodge to dodge them…

The new thief SB autoattack, you can straft dodge at even roughly 400r.

That OP Shortbow right?! Yeah…

Shortbow is fine, and working well. Don’t like it? Use P/P.

Shemsu.8721:

Pyriall.5027:

On par with warrior long bow, ranger long bow, and ele staff abilities.

Thief SB is on par with long bow and staff now? Awesome! I missed the part where they adjusted Shortbow range to 1200-1500. Ohh wait they didnt? Guess its not on par then is it now?

Yes, being that you have to invest points to make those two weapons function. So, sure give thieves 1200 range and make it cost 10-20 points in a trait line…done and done.

I’ve been manually aiming when I see them do that. Srs.
Only because I know they won’t do it properly.

Pyriall.5027:

Shemsu.8721:

Pyriall.5027:

On par with warrior long bow, ranger long bow, and ele staff abilities.

Thief SB is on par with long bow and staff now? Awesome! I missed the part where they adjusted Shortbow range to 1200-1500. Ohh wait they didnt? Guess its not on par then is it now?

Yes, being that you have to invest points to make those two weapons function. So, sure give thieves 1200 range and make it cost 10-20 points in a trait line…done and done.

There’s a 20 shadow art trait that “increase the damage of shortbow and harpoon gun by 5%”, i think adding more range to all sb skills (and yes, this includes infiltrator’s arrow) wouldn’t be a luxury now and it would fix one of our trait (out of many).

Btw anet, the thief stealth skill with sb is still heat-seeking, just so you know.

ahhh now thieves can feel the pain of the warrior longbow gj arenanet.

Please don’t compare the thief shortbow to a ranger shortbow lol

Thief shortbow does WAY more damage and bounces between targets .. I’d give 300 range for that.. Also the bleed for rangers shortbow is if your behind or on your side of your target.. Who fights with their back turned besides nade engys lol

Do complain more and shortbow is not your only diffence you got stealth and blind deal

Amaterasu.6280:

You’re kidding me right?

Even at 1200r, a ranger’s SB autoattack is impossible to straft dodge…I have to actually hit dodge to dodge them…

The new thief SB autoattack, you can straft dodge at even roughly 400r.

While I feel your pain, thief shortbow projectiles are now the same as other classes’ arrows, albeit slower. I always felt it was unfair that only the thief got a homing bow weapon.

Ranger shortbow is now harder to dodge because they specifically buffed ranger arrow speed by 30% a while back. This is how rangers used to be:

Perhaps you’ll now learn to appreciate how polished the thief class actually is compared to other classes.

Pope.1469:

Amaterasu.6280:

You’re kidding me right?

Even at 1200r, a ranger’s SB autoattack is impossible to straft dodge…I have to actually hit dodge to dodge them…

The new thief SB autoattack, you can straft dodge at even roughly 400r.

While I feel your pain, thief shortbow projectiles are now the same as other classes’ arrows, albeit slower. I always felt it was unfair that only the thief got a homing bow weapon.

Ranger shortbow is now harder to dodge because they specifically buffed ranger arrow speed by 30% a while back. This is how rangers used to be:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=poltQGmLu5M

Perhaps you’ll now learn to appreciate how polished the thief class actually is compared to other classes.

So…..you’re response is basically, “lol thieves are now broken in the same way rangers used to be before they got fixed”

How very useful and constructive.

They need to increase the arrow’s velocity, losing the homing part of the projectile wouldn’t be such an issue if it wasn’t so freaking slow.

Basically now you can’t hit someone running at normal speed from 600 to 900 range.
(edit – which means if that person has any kind of speed buff it’s even worst)

Errant Venture.9371:

Pope.1469:

Amaterasu.6280:

You’re kidding me right?

Even at 1200r, a ranger’s SB autoattack is impossible to straft dodge…I have to actually hit dodge to dodge them…

The new thief SB autoattack, you can straft dodge at even roughly 400r.

While I feel your pain, thief shortbow projectiles are now the same as other classes’ arrows, albeit slower. I always felt it was unfair that only the thief got a homing bow weapon.

Ranger shortbow is now harder to dodge because they specifically buffed ranger arrow speed by 30% a while back. This is how rangers used to be:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=poltQGmLu5M

Perhaps you’ll now learn to appreciate how polished the thief class actually is compared to other classes.

So…..you’re response is basically, “lol thieves are now broken in the same way rangers used to be before they got fixed”

How very useful and constructive.

He has my sympathy. I don’t understand why ANet didn’t learn from identical problems in the past and buff thief arrow speed after they removed its homing capability.

But all this crying about how thieves are utterly broken because you can no longer fire homing, unavoidable arrows is unnecessary. I’m trying to expand his horizons a little.

Amaterasu.6280:

Yea, on par like mesmer’s GS auto attacks which are homing channeled attacks which can hit multiple targets, and on par with ranger auto attacks which are 1200r bleeding homing arrows.

On par, for sure.

Jax – comparing this nerf to a gaurdian scepter is stupid, a thief is a dps class, a guardian isn’t. Give thieves survivability like a guardian and we’ll talk.

Comparing how survivable a thief is to a guardian isn’t the point… The point is you guys aren’t the only ones suffering from this… This is why guardians rarely take scepter to pvp. AA is lucky to land and has been forever.

the fact is that this kittening mechanic should not even exist in an MMORPG. For god’s sake, this is not an FPS game, I can’t decide where to shoot, I just target a player and use my skill

fakeblood.2576:

Please don’t compare the thief shortbow to a ranger shortbow lol

Thief shortbow does WAY more damage and bounces between targets .. I’d give 300 range for that.. Also the bleed for rangers shortbow is if your behind or on your side of your target.. Who fights with their back turned besides nade engys lol

Do complain more and shortbow is not your only diffence you got stealth and blind deal

Tell me a ranger who doesn’t use sigil of earth on SB. Auto-attacks BLEED, and it stacks FAST. The ranger’s SB shoots easily 2x as fast as a thief’s.

Yea you shouldn’t compare the thief SB to Ranger’s SB, because the Ranger’s SB is mindless auto-attacking = win.

Pope.1469:

Kultas Sunstrider.9218:

the fact is that this kittening mechanic should not even exist in an MMORPG. For god’s sake, this is not an FPS game, I can’t decide where to shoot, I just target a player and use my skill

I’d be fine if ANet made all ranged autos homing, so they could only be obstructed by terrain, blinded, or evaded. Not this poorly understood middle ground where if your target changes direction suddenly, your attack misses and says “out of range,” or “obstructed.”

What middle ground.
At certain ranges they are basically guaranteed hits, as the range deepens it becomes possible to strafe.

Trick shot travels so slow that the range between basically guaranteed and strafeable is short hell. It’s basically a 600 range weapon atm that occasionally hits at 900 range.
Which I wouldn’t mind if other professions followed suit.

still better than necro staff 1 ;>

Amaterasu.6280:

fakeblood.2576:

Please don’t compare the thief shortbow to a ranger shortbow lol

Thief shortbow does WAY more damage and bounces between targets .. I’d give 300 range for that.. Also the bleed for rangers shortbow is if your behind or on your side of your target.. Who fights with their back turned besides nade engys lol

Do complain more and shortbow is not your only diffence you got stealth and blind deal

Tell me a ranger who doesn’t use sigil of earth on SB. Auto-attacks BLEED, and it stacks FAST. The ranger’s SB shoots easily 2x as fast as a thief’s.

Yea you shouldn’t compare the thief SB to Ranger’s SB, because the Ranger’s SB is mindless auto-attacking = win.

Just as a challenge, name a stronger source of damage or a skill rotation that does better damage than using just the auto attack.

You can’t blame people for optimizing damage on a weapon (even if it is just autoattacking) when the weapon was designed that way. You CAN blame the devs though.

Just fire at the target next to the one strafing left and right. It will bounce and hit both.

jcbroe.4329:

You CAN blame the devs though.

I think that’s the whole point of this thread

Errant Venture.9371:

jcbroe.4329:

You CAN blame the devs though.

I think that’s the whole point of this thread

I thought the whole point of this thread was to cry about having balanced pathing on the thief shortbow, then making inaccurate claims about how homing and “godly” the ranger shortbow is and how high bleed stacks can get (there is a flanking requirement, if you let somebody shoot you in the back to stack bleeds, you deserved it. Otherwise, the stack only sustains at about 2).

But anyhow, yes, now that the thief shortbow autoattack has been changed, the flight time does need increasing.

Thief’s trick shot hits 3 targets for incredibly good damage.

Just fire at the target next to the one strafing left and right. It will bounce and hit both.

End of discussion.

zone.1073:

Thief’s trick shot hits 3 targets for incredibly good damage.

Just fire at the target next to the one strafing left and right. It will bounce and hit both.

End of discussion.

I’m curious, what if there is only one target? I’m guessing the implied suggestion is that if there is only one target, than the shortbow isn’t the most optimal weapon to be using, right?

You’re right, I’m just curious about the versus 1 target instance.

Amaterasu.6280:

fakeblood.2576:

Please don’t compare the thief shortbow to a ranger shortbow lol

Thief shortbow does WAY more damage and bounces between targets .. I’d give 300 range for that.. Also the bleed for rangers shortbow is if your behind or on your side of your target.. Who fights with their back turned besides nade engys lol

Do complain more and shortbow is not your only diffence you got stealth and blind deal

Tell me a ranger who doesn’t use sigil of earth on SB. Auto-attacks BLEED, and it stacks FAST. The ranger’s SB shoots easily 2x as fast as a thief’s.

Yea you shouldn’t compare the thief SB to Ranger’s SB, because the Ranger’s SB is mindless auto-attacking = win.

I would say that most rangers dont use sigil of earth, because they run the shaman amulet, so their crit chance is 9%…… and the dmg from shortbow is pretty abyssmal in a bunker build, its more of a utility for poison, and evade and an interrupt. NOT mindless autoattacking. And looking at ur signature it’s somewhat obvious to me that ur an fotm rider, and ur a little behind sore about both ur op classes taking a hit this patch.

That being said, I believe that they should at least increase the projectile speed to put it on a level playing field with other bow attacks.

Try playing a Guardian with a Scepter.

No accuracy, and incredibly slow travel speed that can’t catch up with someone that has a passive speed boost / Swiftness.

Hahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahaha……..hahahahahahahahahaha!

What rangers wouldn’t give to trade with thief shortbow. Let’s make a trade — you get a shortbow with half the damage your shortbow does, single target, and a crappy ai that can’t stay on target unless they’re camping a point, and we get your shortbow that does double the damage, to 3 targets, a teleport, a shot with built in evade that you can spam 3-4 times, and the best aoe/combo blaster in the game. Anf btw, your aoe poison field is a thousand times better than the garbage poison spread rangers get.

You thieves have got to be some of the most disingenuous people.

Because it’s so hard to spam 3 on a shortbow and evade all attacks against you, soften a target to about 70-60% hp, and then mug_backstab them for a 2-shot.

What you need next is your dumb heartseeker spam to be nerfed by making it directional and aimed instead of homing and cost more initiative. You know, like eles actually have to prep and aim their burning speed.

Kwll.1468:

Nerfing mindless aoe is a always a good thing. Hoping for a grenade nerf sometime in the not too distant future.

Gernades are easy to evade unless you immobilize, slow, daze etc. They move slow through the air so you actually have to factor in distance

This reminds me of : http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=poltQGmLu5M
All i have to say on this subject, being a ranger and all is:

UMAD???!!