Guild Wars 2

I’ve recently been wondering about ways to break WvW into smaller groups. Or at least make the decision to zerg a bit more of a complex one.

One idea comes from the ancient notion that large armies are easier to spot. You see this in a lot of stories and films, “Seperate into smaller groups for more stealth and then meet up into a large army at your destination.”

So yeah:
- Basically every friendly objective you hold, is a detector. It can detect enemies in a radius around it.

- The range at which the enemy can be detected, depends on how many enemies there are in an area. 30+ players can be detected from all the way across the map. 15+ players can be detected if they are near a detector. 5 or less players can never be detected, etc.

- Friendly players are always detected.

- In each friendly objective there is an NPC scout. When you talk to him, you will zoom out to the map view. The view is overlaid with a grid divided into squares. Each square will be colour-coded according to how many enemies are detected there.
eg. If there are 30+ enemies in a grid square, it will be bright red. If there are 30+ friendlies, it will be bright blue. If there are 30+ of both sides, it will be checkered or some other pattern. If there are less players than 30, the colour will be darker/less bright/whatever.

- This implementation has low bandwidth requirements. The client doesnt need to know the locations of the enemy or their movements, the server only needs to send map squares that have colours, every X seconds or so. This also means it can’t be hacked or exploited since the client does not receive any info the player is not supposed to see.

I think overall this would create a disincentive to zerg as it becomes far easier to spot them, and thus stop or avoid them. It also aids in coordination with your own team, since you can see which areas have friendlies defending them, etc.

Zergs might still occur (and really, I don’t want to hard-code them out of the game), but at least they have to decide if they want to split up for greater stealth and stuff like that.

Sure, the best organised servers might have scouts everywhere and don’t need such a feature, but most servers struggle with organisation and can use any help they can get. I’m sure it will be a useful tool for even organised servers.

Actually we need trap (you dont want enemy player run freely and easily in your area) which no red circle and cheap to build (but cannot be stacked). These trap can be ice, snare, land mine or whatever which slow down enemy movement and deal damage to moving siege. Maybe its also can scouting trap (which give signal to friendly map where enemy move).

(not really fancy device like radar or anything)

What you are describing is indeed just player scouts. Every server should have them. If you don’t that is your reason that your server is struggling with organisation. How can you organize if you don’t know what is going on?

I personally think radars would mess up strategies and you will get zerged even more, because they know exactly where you are and with how many.

MartyPartys.9187:

What you are describing is indeed just player scouts. Every server should have them. If you don’t that is your reason that your server is struggling with organisation. How can you organize if you don’t know what is going on?

I personally think radars would mess up strategies and you will get zerged even more, because they know exactly where you are and with how many.

I don’t see how you would get zerged more. If you dont have a zerg, then they won’t really be able to see you until you’re close to or attacking a point. By then it’s equivalent to the crossed swords except it gives more info about the size of your group. (which scouts would do anyways.)

Given that not every player is inclined to type, nor might they even speak english, I’m in favour of adding nonverbal tools to aid coordination. This is an example of one.

(a more player-oriented version would be some command that would count the number of enemies you can see onscreen, and then place a map ping with that number at your location. So people can “scout and report” with a single keypress rather than using chat or voice comms.)

MartyPartys.9187:

What you are describing is indeed just player scouts. Every server should have them. If you don’t that is your reason that your server is struggling with organisation. How can you organize if you don’t know what is going on?

I personally think radars would mess up strategies and you will get zerged even more, because they know exactly where you are and with how many.

I concur. Its not a failing in the game mechanics but a failure to organise. That may sound harsh but I’m pretty sure we’ve all fallen short in this department at times, and I include myself in this.

Roo Stercogburn.9671:

MartyPartys.9187:

What you are describing is indeed just player scouts. Every server should have them. If you don’t that is your reason that your server is struggling with organisation. How can you organize if you don’t know what is going on?

I personally think radars would mess up strategies and you will get zerged even more, because they know exactly where you are and with how many.

I concur. Its not a failing in the game mechanics but a failure to organise. That may sound harsh but I’m pretty sure we’ve all fallen short in this department at times, and I include myself in this.

Stop trying to make sense with all that fancy logic

To those who are saying “just scout more” I don’t think currently the scouting mechanic (if that’s what you want to call it) has the same “stealth vs. size” tradeoff that my idea has.

5 guys running past your scout is just as visible as a 30+ zerg.

I think my idea gives a small incentive to running a smaller group and a penalty to having a massive zerg.

By being able to easily spot zergs, you have more time to deploy seiges and prepare other defences. This offers an incentive to split your attacking zerg into smaller groups – and if both sides do the same, it means a greater chance of small group combat.

It is an interesting system but I do not think it would matter much.

The nature of the zerg is to roll as quickly with as many as possible. The zerg does not care if you can see it on the map, you will know where the zerg is when they roll up on you.

Tactically I like it, but is a bit too fine of a tool for the brute force of the zerg.

love the idea would add to wv3 imo

Stabio.2815:

It is an interesting system but I do not think it would matter much.

The nature of the zerg is to roll as quickly with as many as possible. The zerg does not care if you can see it on the map, you will know where the zerg is when they roll up on you.

Tactically I like it, but is a bit too fine of a tool for the brute force of the zerg.

Well, if we have it and it doesnt help, then we need that other RTS staple, where a predictable enemy is a dead enemy. If you can see the zerg coming, then there needs to be mechanics to allow even a smaller force to destroy them.

Dunno, maybe some sort of heavy machine gun siege? :P

This seems like a well thought out and good idea.

As well give some sort of advantage to being short staffed on a map, which no matter how “good” you are, you cannot control people’s play time.

For the idea of scouts- I don’t know that many people that enjoy roaming a giant map looking for people just to tell others about it. I’m sure there are a select sadistic few. But all the running is personally one of my least favorite aspects of wvw. I’d rather just have a super long respawn timer and able to wp anywhere I wanted after.