Guild Wars 2

Paid server transfers, although I knew were coming, I was always hoping that it’d take a long time to add these to the game. However, as we can see in this very forum, it’s going to ruin WvW.

Servers are trying to mass recruit people before everyone is placed in a server. Even Sea of Sorrows is trying to recruit guilds, and they’ve won just about every single time they’ve been in T1 and are currently winning by a big margin.

The main issue with WvW has NEVER been people switching servers or guilds leaving. This is a GOOD THING because it adds diversity in your matchups.

For the past 8 weeks before this week, Blackgate and SoR fought and both got extremely sick of each other… after about the third week. Finally TC joined but it still ended up getting boring fighting the same people over and over.

Now with paid server tranfers, where players are stuck on their server (I know, you can PAY to get out, but if you have a large guild, you’re going to lose a lot of members that simply can’t afford it), it’s going to be more of the same old, same old battles between three servers with nothing switching around. The only thing to really stop some servers is people leaving.

There are also a bunch of servers that are stuck between being too good for their current tier but not good enough for their next one. They don’t have much room to grow when it’s a numbers issue.

Either remove paid server transfers (or never add them) or add better rewards in WvW so obtaining the gems to switch servers isn’t equivalent in cost to completely gear a character.

I wish they’d charge $100 per transfer. Sick of the server hopping.

Columba.9730:

I wish they’d charge $100 per transfer. Sick of the server hopping.

This.
Band-wagoners that saturate the winning servers because they have to win -NO MATTER WHAT- finally will have to pay for it.

I’m with Columba on this. At the very least it’ll cost people to spy. Perhaps that will curtail it a tiny bit if they have to cough out real money each time to do so.

How someone can think paid transfers are bad, especially when Kaineng just got a whole bunch of transfers and will stomp servers for a month until they reach the right tier, is beyond me.

Raven Paradox.1860:

Servers are trying to mass recruit people before everyone is placed in a server.

From what I have heard, some servers are even sending out press gangs!

the entire point of the ELO rating system is so that eventually, with minimal population shifts, you’ll be fighting the same enemies every single week. and the only way to change your rating is to improve in strategy and skill, not population.

working as intended.

Raven Paradox.1860:

The main issue with WvW has NEVER been people switching servers or guilds leaving.

Unfortunately, I disagree. Although there are other factors that affect the unbalanced system that is the WvW, the constant band-wagon jumping to a higher tier (negating your claim that it’s never been about server transfers) added a lot of the unbalance. Had paid transfers started out during launch, we may have seen a different outcome—ie, there may be a more distinguished balance between tiers.

As has already been mentioned, the saturation in certain tiers, due to transfers, has drastically messed up the balance.

When free transfers expire, there will undoubtedly be servers with high densities of WvW goers, and those servers will most likely stick to their high/respective tiers. This will leave the servers with less density of WvW population fighting to remain in their mid-lower tiers.

What Anet would need to do is to find some sort of mechanism to alleviate the extreme unbalance between every server. This could (as a suggestion) be the amalgamation of servers. IE: pair up T1 Servers with T8 Servers:

Green server in T1 + Red Server in T8
Blue servers in T1 + blue of T8
Red server in T1 + red of T8

etc etc.

I agree with OP. Server transfers has never been a problem. Most hardcore WvW players agree on this. Most of the people who complain about it are casual players.

The server balance has been getting better and better… why fix something that’s not broken? and ruin it in the proccess?

Server transfers have been a huge problem. This is a welcomed change even though we will have to brace ourselves for one more fallout.

If paid transfers were implemented right off the bat than you would see HoD at the top still completely dominating T1 with no problem. TA (the alliance that made HoD who they were in it’s prime) was formed BEFORE Guild Wars 2 was even released publicly. TA planned to join HoD as soon as they could. There was no bandwagoning to HoD then.

Convenant.7092:

I agree with OP. Server transfers has never been a problem. Most hardcore WvW players agree on this. Most of the people who complain about it are casual players.

The server balance has been getting better and better… why fix something that’s not broken? and ruin it in the proccess?

I’m not saying that the transfers were the sole problem; but (from your definition), as a “casual” WvW player, the mass transfers of guilds from my server to SoS left our server spiralling down. While it took us some time to get back up, balance seemed to find its way. Maybe it’s both a good thing and a bad thing? Constant transfers have, at times, ironically balanced other tiers. There are extremes, of course (like SoS and Kain [who seems to be doing extremely well, zipping up the tiers]). But I do see both you and the OP’s point of view in that the paid transfers may throw yet another wrench in an engine ..so to speak. Perhaps paid transfers came too late? —-

Paid Server transfer won’t fix the problem, It’ll just make already strong servers remain strong.

The only way to truly fix it would be to allow people to transfer to Red/Blue servers for free and require Green to be paid.

I’m very happy about finally getting paid transfers. Now spies and saboteurs from one server have to pay to get onto an ‘enemy’ server and then pay to transfer back to their own.

We’ll also see a lot less instability than we do now where ‘fair weather bandwagon’ WvW players hop around like bunnies every week, swarming to the winning side or leaving the losing ones en masse. No server pride or anything, just the egocentrical desire to be on the winning side and everything else be kittened.

Also remember that this feature was meant to be in shortly after launch of the game, but because ANet still had to work out the guesting mechanic, they kept free transfers a lot longer than intended.

Convenant.7092:

I agree with OP. Server transfers has never been a problem. Most hardcore WvW players agree on this.

Ah yes, the ol’ hardcore player in bandwagoner’s clothing ruse!

Boy am I glad there was no mass transfers or recruiting before they put the paid transfers into place …. oh wait ….

Its about kitten time imo.

Raven Paradox.1860:

Paid server transfers, although I knew were coming, I was always hoping that it’d take a long time to add these to the game. However, as we can see in this very forum, it’s going to ruin WvW.

Servers are trying to mass recruit people before everyone is placed in a server. Even Sea of Sorrows is trying to recruit guilds, and they’ve won just about every single time they’ve been in T1 and are currently winning by a big margin.

The main issue with WvW has NEVER been people switching servers or guilds leaving. This is a GOOD THING because it adds diversity in your matchups.

For the past 8 weeks before this week, Blackgate and SoR fought and both got extremely sick of each other… after about the third week. Finally TC joined but it still ended up getting boring fighting the same people over and over.

Now with paid server tranfers, where players are stuck on their server (I know, you can PAY to get out, but if you have a large guild, you’re going to lose a lot of members that simply can’t afford it), it’s going to be more of the same old, same old battles between three servers with nothing switching around. The only thing to really stop some servers is people leaving.

There are also a bunch of servers that are stuck between being too good for their current tier but not good enough for their next one. They don’t have much room to grow when it’s a numbers issue.

Either remove paid server transfers (or never add them) or add better rewards in WvW so obtaining the gems to switch servers isn’t equivalent in cost to completely gear a character.

NONONONONO it already ruined WvW! A long time ago, with mass transfers for babies to go cry in a corner, or guilds who don’t feel like actually working hard to build a community. Coat tail riders, will now have to pay to get their easy wave to the top.

Let the losers who switch enjoy their 10 hour que’s, I don’t care. And if you have good commanders who know their tactics you don’t need a big zerg. (it will always help though :-p)

style.6173:

Winning server moves up a tier, losing server moves down a tier. The means new match ups every week except possibly the top 2 and botton 2 servers.

That is a TERRIBLE idea. There are huge gaps between some server tiers, all you’d end up with is the team that drops one week crushing the next and vice versa. You’d be guaranteed an unbalanced match every single week.

Aveneo.2068:

INow spies and saboteurs from one server have to pay to get onto an ‘enemy’ server and then pay to transfer back to their own.

Spies and saboteurs don’t generally use their main account to spy, they get a 2nd account so they can spy with one and actually play with the other. This change may slow them down if a match-up changes but have little effect overall.

As to the chicken kitten transfer kitten guilds … it will stop them, but only if the transfer fee is hefty enough.

Server hoppers whining… Go find a home and root for it and learn to be loyal.

Get ready for the mass influx to SOS and JQ between now and the 28th.

Isn’t it true the cost of transferring will be based on how populated the server is? So a heavily populated server costs more to transfer to than a lightly populated one.

If so that could help stabilize overall server balance over time.

Guys…its not like Gems cost that much in game coin.

Everyone is just going to end up transferring to SoS

Bunzy.8674:

Everyone is just going to end up transferring to SoS

Please no.

Convenant.7092:

I agree with OP. Server transfers has never been a problem. Most hardcore WvW players agree on this. Most of the people who complain about it are casual players.

The server balance has been getting better and better… why fix something that’s not broken? and ruin it in the proccess?

No, they have been a problem. You just want a free ride to keep hopping servers every other week with your gank group which I can understand, but to act like transfers aren’t screwing up matchups is pretty naive. I’m pretty tired of the fairweather idiots that have been transferring to my server after we went on a blowout streak. Beat the other servers bad enough and half of them transfer to you for the next matchup against them. How stupid.

If you think the matchups have been getting more balanced you obviously haven’t been paying attention to Kaineng or Maguuma the past two weeks.

I like this in a sort of cruel wicked way. People who need to win like someone who needs a smoke will pile onto winning servers and win through attrition. And they will have to que to get into WvW. While my home server has almost no que times so I can WvW whenever I want and it will naturally gravitate towards an equal match-up. I just hope it doesn’t end up in the unlucky tier against a predominantly oceanic server where I don’t get to see who I’m fighting because I’m asleep. Stomping and upgrading at bipolar periods of the day is expensive and no fun. As a matter of fact there should be a set of oceanic servers and an artifically high latency for oceanic players on American servers so this doesn’t happen.

It’s about time this happened. But I fear it might be too little too late. Servers that were once great have toppled under the weight of bandwagoners, the population balance has been made a mockery of.

I fear now that the face of WvW has been scarred forever by this, and the intention of the game mode will no longer be fulfilled. Servers were supposed to be of relatively equal population, and skill and co-ordination were supposed to be the determining factors. But now population is the determining factor, and since transfers are likely to slow down dramatically, it’s unlikely anyone in the currently T1 servers will transfer off, leaving a permanent population imbalance, and a ladder format not worth participating in.

Of course, this is not a reason to stop the implimentation of this much needed mechanic. If there’s any hope for WvW to recover, it will be a very, very slow process, probably taking years before the population balance evens out.

Paid Transfers are going to do more harm then good but you can wait and find out for yourself.

Bunzy.8674:

Paid Transfers are going to do more harm then good but you can wait and find out for yourself.

care to back that up with some well thought our reasoning?

Raven Paradox.1860:

The main issue with WvW has NEVER been people switching servers or guilds leaving. This is a GOOD THING because it adds diversity in your matchups.

o_o you are joking right?
Look at Kaineig, ET, HoD and Maguma.

I like that you have to pay for transfers soon, but the guesting news sucks.

WvW is a numbers game, good luck to servers with coverage gaps of ever filling them when paid transfers hit.

Convenant.7092:

I agree with OP. Server transfers has never been a problem. Most hardcore WvW players agree on this. Most of the people who complain about it are casual players.

The server balance has been getting better and better… why fix something that’s not broken? and ruin it in the proccess?

Just check : http://mos.millenium.org/matchups/evolution/eu and tick Gunnar’s Hold or Far Shiverpeaks to see how server transfers affected their performance!

Obviously the Tiers adjust themselves for the new realities, but the issue maintains. Hopping needs to be stopped (or severely limited) for the tiers to greatly adjust themselves!

Raven Paradox.1860:

The main issue with WvW has NEVER been people switching servers or guilds leaving. This is a GOOD THING because it adds diversity in your matchups.

It ruined servers and the sense of community in the progress.
It’s for example why my server went from t1 to t7 (after having been in the 2nd place in t1 consistently for many matchups).
Also if you even were around for some time you would’ve seen that one of the major complaints about WvW has always been the free server transfers, only second to the culling issue and the whining about thieves.

Convenant.7092:

I agree with OP. Server transfers has never been a problem. Most hardcore WvW players agree on this. Most of the people who complain about it are casual players.

The server balance has been getting better and better… why fix something that’s not broken? and ruin it in the proccess?

Don’t try to speak for a group of players, it’s your opinion not of the majority of hardcore WvW players. It’s also laughable if you consider easymode fairweather players that are serverhopping hardcore. Hardcore crybabies yes that don’t want to put in any effort to build a community, reputation and actually work for getting high ranking instead of just transferring to a server that already did that for you.

Xsorus.2507:

Paid Server transfer won’t fix the problem, It’ll just make already strong servers remain strong.

The only way to truly fix it would be to allow people to transfer to Red/Blue servers for free and require Green to be paid.

That makes no sense.

So if Server A is red now and drops 1 place to be green in a lower tier, it doesn’t mean that server A will still be winning that match…. They might as well still end up 3rd in that match up and then you’re still forcing people to PAY to transfer to that server, while the servers that are doing better are free…

Imo they should’ve implemented free transfers within the first 2 months of release already. This is way too late. There would be 68% less drama on the wvw forums if they actually did so.

ajm.2931:

Isn’t it true the cost of transferring will be based on how populated the server is? So a heavily populated server costs more to transfer to than a lightly populated one.

If so that could help stabilize overall server balance over time.

That would’ve worked a lot better asap after release, rather than waiting 6 months to let the servers get kittened up and then trying to fix it.

wads.5730:

the entire point of the ELO rating system is so that eventually, with minimal population shifts, you’ll be fighting the same enemies every single week. and the only way to change your rating is to improve in strategy and skill, not population.

working as intended.

Glicko-2 rating system. Also, such system doesn’t really work for WvW the reason already discussed to death a while back. World Bank Indices like indicators should’ve been borrowed for WvW instead.

Catisa.6507:

Bunzy.8674:

Paid Transfers are going to do more harm then good but you can wait and find out for yourself.

care to back that up with some well thought our reasoning?

The majority of people are going to leave low tier servers for high tier, I expect a big influx of people going to SoS.

Why would they make people pay money in a free game (Just make the lockout time longer like 1 month or something) THERE IS NO REASON TO MAKE IT PAID, it just seems like another money making scheme to me.

Bunzy.8674:

Catisa.6507:

Bunzy.8674:

Paid Transfers are going to do more harm then good but you can wait and find out for yourself.

care to back that up with some well thought our reasoning?

The majority of people are going to leave low tier servers for high tier, I expect a big influx of people going to SoS.

Why would they make people pay money in a free game (Just make the lockout time longer like 1 month or something) THERE IS NO REASON TO MAKE IT PAID, it just seems like another money making scheme to me.

Have you even been playing this game? Its pretty obvious tiers unbalance everytime totally breaking WvW matchups because of free transfers.
Maybe you or your server hasn’t noticed it but there are more people playing this game then just you.
Elminating free transfers will finally give the tiers a proper chance to balance without being screwed over whenever some big guild decides they don’t like competition and move to the lowest tier.

Bunzy.8674:

Catisa.6507:

Bunzy.8674:

Paid Transfers are going to do more harm then good but you can wait and find out for yourself.

care to back that up with some well thought our reasoning?

The majority of people are going to leave low tier servers for high tier, I expect a big influx of people going to SoS.

Why would they make people pay money in a free game (Just make the lockout time longer like 1 month or something) THERE IS NO REASON TO MAKE IT PAID, it just seems like another money making scheme to me.

This i disagree…

Server transfer is a service not a commodity! I’m glad it is going to be paid, as now people will choose wisely if they want indeed to make that transfer. However, that transfer currency is in Gems that can be bought using in-game gold!

One thing different that i would like to see is different prices for different Tiers. Lowest Tiers even could be free to make players fill in those before anything else, and with a price increasing to the highest being on T1 tiers!

Bunzy.8674:

Catisa.6507:

Bunzy.8674:

Paid Transfers are going to do more harm then good but you can wait and find out for yourself.

care to back that up with some well thought our reasoning?

The majority of people are going to leave low tier servers for high tier, I expect a big influx of people going to SoS.

Why would they make people pay money in a free game (Just make the lockout time longer like 1 month or something) THERE IS NO REASON TO MAKE IT PAID, it just seems like another money making scheme to me.

It was supposed to be paid, always meant to be paid, designed to be paid, from day 1.

A lot of problem came from it being free.

Ashes.6418:

It’s about time this happened. But I fear it might be too little too late. Servers that were once great have toppled under the weight of bandwagoners, the population balance has been made a mockery of.

I fear now that the face of WvW has been scarred forever by this, and the intention of the game mode will no longer be fulfilled. Servers were supposed to be of relatively equal population, and skill and co-ordination were supposed to be the determining factors. But now population is the determining factor, and since transfers are likely to slow down dramatically, it’s unlikely anyone in the currently T1 servers will transfer off, leaving a permanent population imbalance, and a ladder format not worth participating in.

Of course, this is not a reason to stop the implimentation of this much needed mechanic. If there’s any hope for WvW to recover, it will be a very, very slow process, probably taking years before the population balance evens out.

Well put, and I completely agree.

I’d even go further to say that the problem may never correct itself, as new players with an interest in WvW will start off on high ranked WvW servers, and thus the current high ranked servers will always have a larger active WvW population.

ArenaNet needs to actively do something to help solve the problem of WvW population imbalance, and stop crossing their fingers and hoping it sorts itself out.

Mif.3471:

Ashes.6418:

It’s about time this happened. But I fear it might be too little too late. Servers that were once great have toppled under the weight of bandwagoners, the population balance has been made a mockery of.

I fear now that the face of WvW has been scarred forever by this, and the intention of the game mode will no longer be fulfilled. Servers were supposed to be of relatively equal population, and skill and co-ordination were supposed to be the determining factors. But now population is the determining factor, and since transfers are likely to slow down dramatically, it’s unlikely anyone in the currently T1 servers will transfer off, leaving a permanent population imbalance, and a ladder format not worth participating in.

Of course, this is not a reason to stop the implimentation of this much needed mechanic. If there’s any hope for WvW to recover, it will be a very, very slow process, probably taking years before the population balance evens out.

Well put, and I completely agree.

I’d even go further to say that the problem may never correct itself, as new players with an interest in WvW will start off on high ranked WvW servers, and thus the current high ranked servers will always have a larger active WvW population.

ArenaNet needs to actively do something to help solve the problem of WvW population imbalance, and stop crossing their fingers and hoping it sorts itself out.

They should’ve implemented paid transfer unannounced just like nobody announces layoffs in near futures unless their books are ablaze and CEOs on the gallows.

Currently the side effects of free migrations are important and unbalance much McM.
ANet announced paid transferts a while ago, there is no surprise in there.

LHound.8964:

Bunzy.8674:

Catisa.6507:

Bunzy.8674:

Paid Transfers are going to do more harm then good but you can wait and find out for yourself.

care to back that up with some well thought our reasoning?

The majority of people are going to leave low tier servers for high tier, I expect a big influx of people going to SoS.

Why would they make people pay money in a free game (Just make the lockout time longer like 1 month or something) THERE IS NO REASON TO MAKE IT PAID, it just seems like another money making scheme to me.

This i disagree…

Server transfer is a service not a commodity! I’m glad it is going to be paid, as now people will choose wisely if they want indeed to make that transfer. However, that transfer currency is in Gems that can be bought using in-game gold!

One thing different that i would like to see is different prices for different Tiers. Lowest Tiers even could be free to make players fill in those before anything else, and with a price increasing to the highest being on T1 tiers!

What is the logic behind making it paid apart from making more money?
They could just increase the lock out system and have the exact same affect.

Bunzy.8674:

LHound.8964:

Bunzy.8674:

Catisa.6507:

Bunzy.8674:

Paid Transfers are going to do more harm then good but you can wait and find out for yourself.

care to back that up with some well thought our reasoning?

The majority of people are going to leave low tier servers for high tier, I expect a big influx of people going to SoS.

Why would they make people pay money in a free game (Just make the lockout time longer like 1 month or something) THERE IS NO REASON TO MAKE IT PAID, it just seems like another money making scheme to me.

This i disagree…

Server transfer is a service not a commodity! I’m glad it is going to be paid, as now people will choose wisely if they want indeed to make that transfer. However, that transfer currency is in Gems that can be bought using in-game gold!

One thing different that i would like to see is different prices for different Tiers. Lowest Tiers even could be free to make players fill in those before anything else, and with a price increasing to the highest being on T1 tiers!

What is the logic behind making it paid apart from making more money?
They could just increase the lock out system and have the exact same affect.

Leveling the servers! If a guild of n members wants to move to another server they will first fill the lowest servers due to nonexistent/small server transfer fee. However, if it was monthly locked we would see a constant inflow of guilds every month to the highest tiers!

Bunzy.8674:

LHound.8964:

Bunzy.8674:

Catisa.6507:

Bunzy.8674:

Paid Transfers are going to do more harm then good but you can wait and find out for yourself.

care to back that up with some well thought our reasoning?

The majority of people are going to leave low tier servers for high tier, I expect a big influx of people going to SoS.

Why would they make people pay money in a free game (Just make the lockout time longer like 1 month or something) THERE IS NO REASON TO MAKE IT PAID, it just seems like another money making scheme to me.

This i disagree…

Server transfer is a service not a commodity! I’m glad it is going to be paid, as now people will choose wisely if they want indeed to make that transfer. However, that transfer currency is in Gems that can be bought using in-game gold!

One thing different that i would like to see is different prices for different Tiers. Lowest Tiers even could be free to make players fill in those before anything else, and with a price increasing to the highest being on T1 tiers!

What is the logic behind making it paid apart from making more money?
They could just increase the lock out system and have the exact same affect.

It was meant to be paid, the game doesn’t pay for itself.

It was also announced before launch that higher population server will be more costly to transfer to.ANet only kept it free because guesting wasn’t ready. This in turn caused a lot of population problems for WvW and kept more people than they’d liked from WvWing. With this announcement, there will be a bandwagon effect that will cause more problem.

Also, effect vs. affect. http://www.merriam-webster.com/

LHound.8964:

Bunzy.8674:

LHound.8964:

Bunzy.8674:

Catisa.6507:

Bunzy.8674:

Paid Transfers are going to do more harm then good but you can wait and find out for yourself.

care to back that up with some well thought our reasoning?

The majority of people are going to leave low tier servers for high tier, I expect a big influx of people going to SoS.

Why would they make people pay money in a free game (Just make the lockout time longer like 1 month or something) THERE IS NO REASON TO MAKE IT PAID, it just seems like another money making scheme to me.

This i disagree…

Server transfer is a service not a commodity! I’m glad it is going to be paid, as now people will choose wisely if they want indeed to make that transfer. However, that transfer currency is in Gems that can be bought using in-game gold!

One thing different that i would like to see is different prices for different Tiers. Lowest Tiers even could be free to make players fill in those before anything else, and with a price increasing to the highest being on T1 tiers!

What is the logic behind making it paid apart from making more money?
They could just increase the lock out system and have the exact same affect.

Leveling the servers! If a guild of n members wants to move to another server they will first fill the lowest servers due to nonexistent/small server transfer fee. However, if it was monthly locked we would see a constant inflow of guilds every month to the highest tiers!

You honestly think they are going to go to low level servers because a low transfer fee.. if you are paying anyways you might as well make it count. So having an inflow/outflow is a bad thing now? Instead everyone is just going to be locked in the same server where the matchups will become boring and stagnant.