It may be subtle, but WvW will change from this. Zergs will be seen from a distance now charging to their destinations, scouts will be able to report more reliable intel as a result more quickly. Defenses can be mustered faster, I see great battles ensuing where before easy flips would happen.
Of course, I’m an optimist. But… things will change, in a good way.
The only thing I am worried about is having to turn down my setting too much. I remember back when the game first came out I had a lot of trouble with frame rate in this game, especially in WvW. I took a few months off from this game and during that time I ended up upgrading my processor to an i5. The game runs so much smoother in PvE and especially in WvW but I’m not sure how much of that is due to culling. I’m hoping my new specs will be good enough to keep my WvW settings relatively high. It just bothers me when I have to turn settings down for games that I know I should be able to run perfectly fine.
Have they gone over what the new graphic settings will be for WvW?
Yeah, I don’t think people realize how much this is going to change the face of the game.
It’s a GREAT thing, but I bet it’s gonna be jarring at first.
Yeah there really shouldn’t be any more instances where one zerg runs head on towards a “small” zerg only to find out it’s the entire opposing server running right at them. It’s going to help a lot with picking battles more carefully.
I am sure that some people will hate it at first. Mainly the people who have adapted their entire strategy to take advantage of the current culling shortcoming. I especially look forward to this.
I am sure that some people will hate it at first. Mainly the people who have adapted their entire strategy to take advantage of the current culling shortcoming. I especially look forward to this.
I am sure that some people will hate it at first. Mainly the people who have adapted their entire strategy to take advantage of the current culling shortcoming. I especially look forward to this.
I’d say the first people to complain are the thieves who have been abusing culling. They will probably claim that they are now underpowered and that their stealth needs to be buffed.
I am sure that some people will hate it at first. Mainly the people who have adapted their entire strategy to take advantage of the current culling shortcoming. I especially look forward to this.
I’d say the first people to complain are the thieves who have been abusing culling. They will probably claim that they are now underpowered and that their stealth needs to be buffed.
I am sure that some people will hate it at first. Mainly the people who have adapted their entire strategy to take advantage of the current culling shortcoming. I especially look forward to this.
I’d say the first people to complain are the thieves who have been abusing culling. They will probably claim that they are now underpowered and that their stealth needs to be buffed.
They’d be laughed off the server….
They will probably try to claim that getting the best out of culling was skillful. And it took skill to master how to use the culling to it’s highest potential. Pretty much like in other games where people claim that using some exploits took skill because not everyone could do it well.
The biggest abusers of culling were the zerg portals. A thief can’t help the fact that culling existed, although some no doubt benefited from it. What would you have them do… wait for 5 seconds after each attack so you can kill them?
Portals where used to actively exploit this however.
What will be funny is that the same people complaining about thieves, will be the same people who still get their kitten handed to them from the same thieves.
The biggest abusers of culling were the zerg portals. A thief can’t help the fact that culling existed, although some no doubt benefited from it. What would you have them do… wait for 5 seconds after each attack so you can kill them?
Portals where used to actively exploit this however.
What will be funny is that the same people complaining about thieves, will be the same people who still get their kitten handed to them from the same thieves.
That’s true, most thieves were just sitting in stealth waiting out the revealed debuff before hitting CnD again. To be completely honest culling was never needed for this.
Malzarius – Guardian
Malzerius – Thief
Dark Covenant (SBI)
I am sure that some people will hate it at first. Mainly the people who have adapted their entire strategy to take advantage of the current culling shortcoming. I especially look forward to this.
I’d say the first people to complain are the thieves who have been abusing culling. They will probably claim that they are now underpowered and that their stealth needs to be buffed.
They’d be laughed off the server….
They will probably try to claim that getting the best out of culling was skillful. And it took skill to master how to use the culling to it’s highest potential. Pretty much like in other games where people claim that using some exploits took skill because not everyone could do it well.
Now they can get the best out of “no culling.” :-P
Since I’ll need to scale down the setting a lot to Nametag-Only I just expect to see golems even less. Golems are the worst in terms of culling – they’re a kittening siege weapon and should be prioritized but somehow they are always the last thing you can see
The biggest abusers of culling were the zerg portals. A thief can’t help the fact that culling existed, although some no doubt benefited from it. What would you have them do… wait for 5 seconds after each attack so you can kill them?
Portals where used to actively exploit this however.
What will be funny is that the same people complaining about thieves, will be the same people who still get their kitten handed to them from the same thieves.
huh? you should be able to see the portal, right? It is already a big indicator for a shakedown…
Just keep in mind guys before we get too excited that possibly the new change to address culling might increase the skill lag. Lets be prepared for the worst, but hope for the best.
Just keep in mind guys before we get too excited that possibly the new change to address culling might increase the skill lag. Lets be prepared for the worst, but hope for the best.
I agree. Let us hope at the very least that skill lag will be less frequent as people will be able to at last choose their battles. Maybe steer your 30 man away from the 60 to 90 man zergs
I wouldn’t make this assumption yet. It depends how much that offloading the ‘solution’ onto performance of the players pc’s is actually going to work. If the majority can’t handle rendering all those players, then fps lag might end up just as bad as the culling.
Just keep in mind guys before we get too excited that possibly the new change to address culling might increase the skill lag. Lets be prepared for the worst, but hope for the best.
“Culling isn’t related to skill lag, because the server has to know about all the things about all of the players, all of the time. That is pretty much a constant. The process of culling did use a bit of CPU, so we’ll get a little bit back when we stop doing it, but not so much that I think it’ll have a noticeable impact on skill lag.”
Taken directly from a dev interview. But I’m sure many people will just choose not to believe it.
I wouldn’t make this assumption yet. It depends how much that offloading the ‘solution’ onto performance of the players pc’s is actually going to work. If the majority can’t handle rendering all those players, then fps lag might end up just as bad as the culling.
I think it’s a safe assumption most rigs can handle rendering name tags but who knows.
I am sure that some people will hate it at first. Mainly the people who have adapted their entire strategy to take advantage of the current culling shortcoming. I especially look forward to this.
I’d say the first people to complain are the thieves who have been abusing culling. They will probably claim that they are now underpowered and that their stealth needs to be buffed.
I wouldn’t make this assumption yet. It depends how much that offloading the ‘solution’ onto performance of the players pc’s is actually going to work. If the majority can’t handle rendering all those players, then fps lag might end up just as bad as the culling.
I think it’s a safe assumption most rigs can handle rendering name tags but who knows.
I’m sure they can, but if you have 50 name tags jumping all around, mixed in with maybe 20 solid player models, I’m not sure that is gonna make for much clarity in a battle.
It may be subtle, but WvW will change from this. Zergs will be seen from a distance now charging to their destinations, scouts will be able to report more reliable intel as a result more quickly. Defenses can be mustered faster, I see great battles ensuing where before easy flips would happen.
Of course, I’m an optimist. But… things will change, in a good way.
… and to counter it, people will gather in even larger zergs to flip keeps easier and faster before being scouted, resulting in more ability and graphics lag than we have ever seen before.
It may be subtle, but WvW will change from this. Zergs will be seen from a distance now charging to their destinations, scouts will be able to report more reliable intel as a result more quickly. Defenses can be mustered faster, I see great battles ensuing where before easy flips would happen.
Of course, I’m an optimist. But… things will change, in a good way.
… and to counter it, people will gather in even larger zergs to flip keeps easier and faster before being scouted, resulting in more ability and graphics lag than we have ever seen before.
Of course, I’m a pessimist.
Or people in megazergs will get tired of people turning the other way forcing them to pvdoor and break up into smaller zergs… The optimistic point of view.
It may be subtle, but WvW will change from this. Zergs will be seen from a distance now charging to their destinations, scouts will be able to report more reliable intel as a result more quickly. Defenses can be mustered faster, I see great battles ensuing where before easy flips would happen.
Of course, I’m an optimist. But… things will change, in a good way.
… and to counter it, people will gather in even larger zergs to flip keeps easier and faster before being scouted, resulting in more ability and graphics lag than we have ever seen before.
Of course, I’m a pessimist.
Or people in megazergs will get tired of people turning the other way forcing them to pvdoor and break up into smaller zergs… The optimistic point of view.
Can we at least call megazergs megazords instead? Megazergs just seems too weird.
I do hope that they find a way to buff the thief because when you can see them they are usually an easy kill but frustrating as all hell when in permanent stealth.
There needs to be a balance that makes it a fair playing field for all involved.
It may be subtle, but WvW will change from this. Zergs will be seen from a distance now charging to their destinations
I doubt you’ll be able to see players any farther than you currently can, but you will see the zerg when it’s up close. Culling and the distance of which sprites are drawn isn’t the same thing.
I do hope that they find a way to buff the thief because when you can see them they are usually an easy kill but frustrating as all hell when in permanent stealth.
There needs to be a balance that makes it a fair playing field for all involved.
Because getting spiked for a 10k backstab, in toughness/vitality gear, is not enough. A thief can go full beserker with little to no danger with all the stealth and culling, and get away with ease, unless they mess up, and even then, they have to mess up bad.
Thieves are basically given kills on a silver platter at the moment, while other classes have to put some effort into fights. It’s time for thieves to man up and play like the rest of us do.
I do hope that they find a way to buff the thief because when you can see them they are usually an easy kill but frustrating as all hell when in permanent stealth.
There needs to be a balance that makes it a fair playing field for all involved.
Because getting spiked for a 10k backstab, in toughness/vitality gear, is not enough. A thief can go full beserker with little to no danger with all the stealth and culling, and get away with ease, unless they mess up, and even then, they have to mess up bad.
Except the culling fix won’t change a thing with the zerker build; if you didn’t see him coming, he’s still going to hit you. Maybe, just maybe you’ll get in a swing or two, but that’s pretty much about it. If anything, it will encourage thieves to go to it now that the CnD spam will be negated with the “revealed debuff no matter what” being applied by the devs. So the P/D thief is most likely going to see less prominence.
DragonBrand – Terror Gaming [TG]
Fer Aline – Thf; Suralinta – Rgr; Alyra Va Tel – Ele; Mer Aline – War
Except the culling fix won’t change a thing with the zerker build; if you didn’t see him coming, he’s still going to hit you. Maybe, just maybe you’ll get in a swing or two, but that’s pretty much about it. If anything, it will encourage thieves to go to it now that the CnD spam will be negated with the “revealed debuff no matter what” being applied by the devs. So the P/D thief is most likely going to see less prominence.
Perhaps it won’t, but it will probably reduce their effectiveness in larger group fights. Right now with culling and stealth, thieves can slip around large groups like ghosts. But with the update, they will be seen more and have a 3s cooldown before stealth is an option again, which is plenty to drop a ’zerker Thief.
Now they’ll have to stick more to a spank ‘n’ gank role, roaming around. Or so I hope. And maybe, just maybe, as thieves realize this, they’ll put more in survivability to take damage in group fight, thus reducing their 2-3 hit kills.
I am just looking forward to the end of the “perma stealth” aspect of the thief that has been abused in wvwvw.
To better understand it I got my thief up to level 80 and took her into wvw and was amazed at how easy it was to hit and vanish on a consistent basis, and yes thieves do hit hard.
When it became apparent that with just a little bit of tweaking and even less experience that playing a thief this way enabled even someone without any real pvp skill, like myself, to effectively tie up and slowly pick off groups of 7-8 people or less without any real danger to myself I had to put her away. It wasn’t even amusing it was actually pitiful.
This being said I still really hope that the developers have come up with a way to even the playing field where the thief is buffed in a way to not have them go the way of the dinosaur.
I am just looking forward to the end of the “perma stealth” aspect of the thief that has been abused in wvwvw.
To better understand it I got my thief up to level 80 and took her into wvw and was amazed at how easy it was to hit and vanish on a consistent basis, and yes thieves do hit hard.
When it became apparent that with just a little bit of tweaking and even less experience that playing a thief this way enabled even someone without any real pvp skill, like myself, to effectively tie up and slowly pick off groups of 7-8 people or less without any real danger to myself I had to put her away. It wasn’t even amusing it was actually pitiful.
This being said I still really hope that the developers have come up with a way to even the playing field where the thief is buffed in a way to not have them go the way of the dinosaur.
I did the same thing, figuring if i knew how it was played, i could counter it. Oh the lawls i was having going behind people’s groups when my group went head on into them. They focused more on aoeing or trying to stop me than the group before them, and i still kept downing them or weakening their forces. It was so stupid.
And at least anet fixed the ‘never gonna cap this supply post’ abuse.
Yeah a thief can simply sneak behind the zerg and take them out one by one!!!
Are you playing Tier 8? Seriously!
I tried that tactic tonight and got nowhere but dead very quickly. Perhaps I’m bad, or perhaps I’m playing against people who know what they’re doing? I dunno.
Either way, thief isn’t a ticket to glory, except against a player who isn’t built to handle one.
Tell me, how unbalanced are they in sPvP?
I am just looking forward to the end of the “perma stealth” aspect of the thief that has been abused in wvwvw.
To better understand it I got my thief up to level 80 and took her into wvw and was amazed at how easy it was to hit and vanish on a consistent basis, and yes thieves do hit hard.
When it became apparent that with just a little bit of tweaking and even less experience that playing a thief this way enabled even someone without any real pvp skill, like myself, to effectively tie up and slowly pick off groups of 7-8 people or less without any real danger to myself I had to put her away. It wasn’t even amusing it was actually pitiful.
This being said I still really hope that the developers have come up with a way to even the playing field where the thief is buffed in a way to not have them go the way of the dinosaur.
I did the same thing, figuring if i knew how it was played, i could counter it. Oh the lawls i was having going behind people’s groups when my group went head on into them. They focused more on aoeing or trying to stop me than the group before them, and i still kept downing them or weakening their forces. It was so stupid.
And at least anet fixed the ‘never gonna cap this supply post’ abuse.
Haha too funny that’s exactly the same reason I did that for..
As far as Jacklo (post above) goes that’s even funnier because I know more than a few people who did the same and had identical if not exactly the same results…
I am just looking forward to the end of the “perma stealth” aspect of the thief that has been abused in wvwvw.
To better understand it I got my thief up to level 80 and took her into wvw and was amazed at how easy it was to hit and vanish on a consistent basis, and yes thieves do hit hard.
When it became apparent that with just a little bit of tweaking and even less experience that playing a thief this way enabled even someone without any real pvp skill, like myself, to effectively tie up and slowly pick off groups of 7-8 people or less without any real danger to myself I had to put her away. It wasn’t even amusing it was actually pitiful.
This being said I still really hope that the developers have come up with a way to even the playing field where the thief is buffed in a way to not have them go the way of the dinosaur.
I did the same thing, figuring if i knew how it was played, i could counter it. Oh the lawls i was having going behind people’s groups when my group went head on into them. They focused more on aoeing or trying to stop me than the group before them, and i still kept downing them or weakening their forces. It was so stupid.
And at least anet fixed the ‘never gonna cap this supply post’ abuse.
Haha too funny that’s exactly the same reason I did that for..
As far as Jacklo (post above) goes that’s even funnier because I know more than a few people who did the same and had identical if not exactly the same results…
So in perspective, how many thieves do you actually see pull this stunt off, against decent players I might add?
Yeah, you’ll see a few videos here and there but they’re mostly laughable where the targets have no clue.
Show me a single video of a well known party/guild/squad who go down to a single thief. You won’t find one because it’s a myth brought about by baddies. You’ll find plenty of pugs getting decimated however. Go figure.
I bow to your greatness you win… I just made of that up and so did Serophous…. And I refuse to get into a flame war with you, so you win. Go out and celebrate!!! You’ve earned it.
Edit I almost forgot: I guess that the groups that I was with that got picked off like we described must all be noobs.. I know I am but not so sure about the others. Again I bow to your greatness and am done with this topic as I refuse to feed you any more.
I bow to your greatness you win… I just made of that up and so did Serophous…. And I refuse to get into a flame war with you, so you win. Go out and celebrate!!! You’ve earned it.
Well ok, take the easy way out. Someone said it and it must be true.
Where do you see the sPvP players moaning about thieves? It doesn’t happen and you don’t see sPvP teams with nothing but thieves. It doesn’t work.
If you play a class with a build that leaves you vulnerable, or are not at the top of your game, some thieves are going to make you look inferior.
Lord knows I’ve learned this the hard way in every game I’ve played. And guess what… as in Rift and other games, if they can’t beat you 1 vs 1, they’ll team up and beat you 2 vs 1. It’s their mentality.
For clarity, I do play thief, but not the builds you’re discussing.
Yeah a thief can simply sneak behind the zerg and take them out one by one!!!
Are you playing Tier 8? Seriously!
I tried that tactic tonight and got nowhere but dead very quickly. Perhaps I’m bad, or perhaps I’m playing against people who know what they’re doing? I dunno.
Either way, thief isn’t a ticket to glory, except against a player who isn’t built to handle one.
Tell me, how unbalanced are they in sPvP?
I’m sorry, I reread my post and looking for when I said ‘zerg’, or where i said I ‘killed a player’.
I am just looking forward to the end of the “perma stealth” aspect of the thief that has been abused in wvwvw.
To better understand it I got my thief up to level 80 and took her into wvw and was amazed at how easy it was to hit and vanish on a consistent basis, and yes thieves do hit hard.
When it became apparent that with just a little bit of tweaking and even less experience that playing a thief this way enabled even someone without any real pvp skill, like myself, to effectively tie up and slowly pick off groups of 7-8 people or less without any real danger to myself I had to put her away. It wasn’t even amusing it was actually pitiful.
This being said I still really hope that the developers have come up with a way to even the playing field where the thief is buffed in a way to not have them go the way of the dinosaur.
Your post lacks credibility. If you are good enough to take on 7-8 other players, even as a thief, then you should be good enough on your other characters to be able to counter most of the thieves effectively, because let’s face it most thieves are bad.
Yeah a thief can simply sneak behind the zerg and take them out one by one!!!
Are you playing Tier 8? Seriously!
I tried that tactic tonight and got nowhere but dead very quickly. Perhaps I’m bad, or perhaps I’m playing against people who know what they’re doing? I dunno.
Either way, thief isn’t a ticket to glory, except against a player who isn’t built to handle one.
Tell me, how unbalanced are they in sPvP?
I’m sorry, I reread my post and looking for when I saw ‘zerg’, or where i said I ‘killed a player’.
Now this is getting silly. If you’re really going down the route of semantics, what does this mean… “Oh the lawls i was having going behind people’s groups” or “and i still kept downing them or weakening their forces. It was so stupid”?
Well, you see, there are these instances where people run in less thakittenerg, and sometimes in groups of just 5-10. And usually when we run into a group of equal or slightly greater size, me running up and behind, causing confusion and panic, usually works, as when a player goes down before my haste buff even ends and I can stealth away, their friends usually have 1 or 2 people rezzing that person, thus, 2-3 people arent fighting.
Well, you see, there are these instances where people run in less thakittenerg, and sometimes in groups of just 5-10. And usually when we run into a group of equal or slightly greater size, me running up and behind, causing confusion and panic, usually works, as when a player goes down before my haste buff even ends and I can stealth away, their friends usually have 1 or 2 people rezzing that person, thus, 2-3 people arent fighting.
So that’s great, you just described the focus of the kind of groups that get decimated by a skilled thief.
Well, you see, there are these instances where people run in less thakittenerg, and sometimes in groups of just 5-10. And usually when we run into a group of equal or slightly greater size, me running up and behind, causing confusion and panic, usually works, as when a player goes down before my haste buff even ends and I can stealth away, their friends usually have 1 or 2 people rezzing that person, thus, 2-3 people arent fighting.
So that’s great, you just described the focus of the kind of groups that get decimated by a skilled thief.
its not that hard, hence it being lawl worthy. And thats what i was talking about. you’re the one that had ‘zergs’ on the brain. But i accept your apology
Well, you see, there are these instances where people run in less thakittenerg, and sometimes in groups of just 5-10. And usually when we run into a group of equal or slightly greater size, me running up and behind, causing confusion and panic, usually works, as when a player goes down before my haste buff even ends and I can stealth away, their friends usually have 1 or 2 people rezzing that person, thus, 2-3 people arent fighting.
So that’s great, you just described the focus of the kind of groups that get decimated by a skilled thief.
its not that hard, hence it being lawl worthy. And thats what i was talking about. you’re the one that had ‘zergs’ on the brain. But i accept your apology
To be fair, I’m not that type of thief. I’m specced for group play and zergs are all I seem to encounter. However, anyone who stops to rez in a sticky situation is a baddy in my book. You WILL die to a thief or any other high dps class when you do that.
I am pretty sure the end of culling is going to be bad for my glass cannon ele. The alternative is that I am really good lol.
Culling has(had) some qualities that may contribute to how fun WvWvW is.
It distorts troop numbers so both sides feel like they are outnumbered so even fights where you have a major numbers advantage can seem like you are epic.
When you lose a fight you can blame culling and not be provably wrong so no one ever be shown to lose a fair fight.
You end up entering fights you would not otherwise and when you win it is epic, and when you lose you can blame culling. It is almost as if they made a system where everyone wins more than half the time (or maybe it is just because I am playing on SF and we do win most of the time)
Commanders Ararius(guardian) & Attack Robot (ele) [CoSA] SF
Portal weren’t as big an issues as mass invis. The enemy portal at least showed up on the ground even if the enemy didn’t
It’s good that you could see the portal, but you had no idea how many would come through it, or that sometimes you couldn’t get a skill off when they did.
I found myself running from portals with 3 players at times. It’s like “it’s spitting, everyone inside” (you might have to be from the UK to understand that).
