Can we please have the door’s on the keeps/SM take more than an enemy looking at them funny to contest?
Today, I encountered an enemy theif who build their entire build to do one thing. Hit the gates to contest them.
He would run between stonemyst and our keep contesting them keeping our waypoints from being used.
The problem? No one could stop him. We had upwards to 15 players hunting him down and he would teleport/stealth/stunbreak/swiftness away. That’s just ridiculous. I know you want theifs mobile but when 15 players cannot kill him?
Stealth traps? Apparently no one wanted to use them. The idea was floated in the chat but no one bothered to buy any.
I don’t think it takes a genius to see if one player could permanently lock 2 way-points Its overpowered.
EDIT:
In case you don’t want to read;
-Keep’s and Stonemist are contested too easy.
-An minimum damage requirement is needed.
-Traps are too expensive to use on one person who can re-spawn quickly.
Stealth traps? Apparently no one wanted to use them. The idea was floated in the chat but no one bothered to buy any.
Isn’t that your problem then? ANet has literally given you something to help in a situation and your server refused to use it. I have no pity for you guys despite agreeing that it should tap more than tap to contest a wp.
Good to see I’m not the only one
I actually gave up WvW outside from guild events because of it. I’d add “until they fix it”, but I don’t belive ANet considers it a problem.
The funnies thing is, they said, they don’t want perma stealth, coz it’s “not fun”, yet they don’t nerf it when players learned to make it perma.
Stealth traps? Apparently no one wanted to use them. The idea was floated in the chat but no one bothered to buy any.
Welp
yeah, personally I believe there far too expensive, why use 15 tokens for a trap that someone MAY run over when you can get an arrow cart and a balista for one token more?
Isn’t that your problem then? ANet has literally given you something to help in a situation and your server refused to use it. I have no pity for you guys despite agreeing that it should tap more than tap to contest a wp.
He had 2+ stunbreakers, CC is useless, and you cant moa morph what you cant see. Not to mention if it takes one specific skill to counter that’s OP.
How is that trolling, sounds like smart play. You had a way to counter him with the stealth traps and you and your server decided not to use them at all. I agree that thief mobility/stealth is ridiculous but thats your own fault for letting him contest your nodes like that, he simply outplayed you and 15 other people.
What i find is a bit ridiculous is that the traps are the only way to counter stealth, in most other MMO’s you can be knocked out of stealth by some kind of damage, and i think thats what we need.
not to mention the fact that he was abusing teleports by jumping up cliffs and doing things that shouldnt be able to be done.
you totally need more than just one player to hit the door once to contest the waypoint for 3mins. Especially if its a thief that can do it. instant infinite stealth, shadow steps, teleports…
tbh I don’t think contesting waypoints is an issue I think its the class than can do it.
Stealth traps? Apparently no one wanted to use them. The idea was floated in the chat but no one bothered to buy any.
Isn’t that your problem then? ANet has literally given you something to help in a situation and your server refused to use it. I have no pity for you guys despite agreeing that it should tap more than tap to contest a wp.
Going into stealth costs nothing. Traps cost 15 badges (and do hold some value). In the time it’d take to kill the thief, for him to respawn, and hike it back from the WP to his intended target, the WP he’s contesting will not have dropped its swords.
Stealth traps? Apparently no one wanted to use them. The idea was floated in the chat but no one bothered to buy any.
Isn’t that your problem then? ANet has literally given you something to help in a situation and your server refused to use it. I have no pity for you guys despite agreeing that it should tap more than tap to contest a wp.
Going into stealth costs nothing. Traps cost 15 badges (and do hold some value). In the time it’d take to kill the thief, for him to respawn, and hike it back from the WP to his intended target, the WP he’s contesting will not have dropped its swords.
Yeah…
… Which is why you then bunker down, drop some ranger traps, send out some scouts, and murder every rabbit that comes within 100 yards of your keep.
Stealth traps? Apparently no one wanted to use them. The idea was floated in the chat but no one bothered to buy any.
Isn’t that your problem then? ANet has literally given you something to help in a situation and your server refused to use it. I have no pity for you guys despite agreeing that it should tap more than tap to contest a wp.
Going into stealth costs nothing. Traps cost 15 badges (and do hold some value). In the time it’d take to kill the thief, for him to respawn, and hike it back from the WP to his intended target, the WP he’s contesting will not have dropped its swords.
Yeah…
… Which is why you then bunker down, drop some ranger traps, send out some scouts, and murder every rabbit that comes within 100 yards of your keep.
And then watch as you still can’t actually stop them from reaching the gate, you can only maybe stop them from getting away afterwards. Which they are unlikely to care about. And then they’ll be back by the time the swords run out again.
Sounds like a you problem. You didn’t put down a stealth trap allowing a thief to play with your minds. Stop turning this into another “omg I can’t kill a thief they must be OP” thread. If you honestly couldn’t counter a thief with 15 people, I’d feel ashamed.
Stealth traps? Apparently no one wanted to use them. The idea was floated in the chat but no one bothered to buy any.
Isn’t that your problem then? ANet has literally given you something to help in a situation and your server refused to use it. I have no pity for you guys despite agreeing that it should tap more than tap to contest a wp.
Going into stealth costs nothing. Traps cost 15 badges (and do hold some value). In the time it’d take to kill the thief, for him to respawn, and hike it back from the WP to his intended target, the WP he’s contesting will not have dropped its swords.
Yeah…
My point still stands, they gave them an option and they still chose not to use it. Also, I thought the Stealth Disruptor costs ~600 karma and 10 supply?
What’s the reason for not trying to fight him then using what I suggested? Can’t see/find him?
I believe anet said a little while ago that they where looking into a way to fix 1 player keeping a wp contested. Cant remember where though. Was a little while back though so i dont know if it is still on there priority list.
Edit.
And all the people saying “Well use so and so skill or way and stop said person from contesting” make me chuckle. I can use any class, thieves just make it easier, to contest a waypoint whether you try and stop me or not short of being jumped 10 to 1. And even if you do get me i can just come back so you better have 10 at each gate. Most keeps have around 3 gates so i consider keeping 30 people occupied a good trade for keeping a waypoint uncontested for just little old me lol
… Which is why you then bunker down, drop some ranger traps, send out some scouts, and murder every rabbit that comes within 100 yards of your keep.
there are more than one gate on keeps bunker on one he hits another. We bunkered SM gate twice and he just teleported in hit the gate then teleportered out.
Let me explain this.
-Theifs DO NOT NEED A NERF! There doing as intended and not OP.
-Gates Need to take more damage before contesting!
-Traps are too expensive!
I would like to see a progressive contesting on the gate (although I’m sure an anet coder is shuddering when reading this)
(numbers are variable, I’m just thinking of this now)
-attacking a wall/gate adds 1 second contest for every 600 damage
-destroying a gate/wall adds a minute
Stealth traps? Apparently no one wanted to use them. The idea was floated in the chat but no one bothered to buy any.
Isn’t that your problem then? ANet has literally given you something to help in a situation and your server refused to use it. I have no pity for you guys despite agreeing that it should tap more than tap to contest a wp.
Going into stealth costs nothing. Traps cost 15 badges (and do hold some value). In the time it’d take to kill the thief, for him to respawn, and hike it back from the WP to his intended target, the WP he’s contesting will not have dropped its swords.
Yeah…
… Which is why you then bunker down, drop some ranger traps, send out some scouts, and murder every rabbit that comes within 100 yards of your keep.
And then watch as you still can’t actually stop them from reaching the gate, you can only maybe stop them from getting away afterwards. Which they are unlikely to care about. And then they’ll be back by the time the swords run out again.
If that’s the case, then any profession could just run up to some gates, hit them, get killed, and then run back. The only difference is that they could do it with more range. A ranger could do it from 3000 units away. A mes could use clones to distract NPCs and then hit the gate, all while teleporting around traps and juking you out. A guard could just bunker his way through damage up to the gates. An ele could RTL/Lightning Flash/Mist Form/Earth Armor/Swiftness his way right up to the gates. So this isn’t an issue about thieves, then, it’s about players being too incompetent to stop somebody from touching a gate. Which is extremely easy to do, particularly when you know where they’re going anyways.
I like the what the Anet PvP developer said about thieves..
“we want to give them the highest burst and the highest mobility” – also included: the best evasion mechanic as well.
their failure to balance this class after 9months is a bit of a worry. It makes me wonder if they are like the blizzard devs who failed to make thieves work correctly after 8 years.
I play WvW pretty much 80% of the time. Thieves and stealth was one of the main reason I left WoW. You don’t leave straight away.. its just builds up over time until you say “fuk this! I don’t enjoy dealing with this class, its ruining the fun, time to play something else” then you find yourself returning less and less often. You also lose confidence that the developers have any idea what they are doing, which adds to the disappointment.
Stealth traps? Apparently no one wanted to use them. The idea was floated in the chat but no one bothered to buy any.
Isn’t that your problem then? ANet has literally given you something to help in a situation and your server refused to use it. I have no pity for you guys despite agreeing that it should tap more than tap to contest a wp.
Going into stealth costs nothing. Traps cost 15 badges (and do hold some value). In the time it’d take to kill the thief, for him to respawn, and hike it back from the WP to his intended target, the WP he’s contesting will not have dropped its swords.
Yeah…
… Which is why you then bunker down, drop some ranger traps, send out some scouts, and murder every rabbit that comes within 100 yards of your keep.
And then watch as you still can’t actually stop them from reaching the gate, you can only maybe stop them from getting away afterwards. Which they are unlikely to care about. And then they’ll be back by the time the swords run out again.
If that’s the case, then any profession could just run up to some gates, hit them, get killed, and then run back. The only difference is that they could do it with more range. A ranger could do it from 3000 units away. A mes could use clones to distract NPCs and then hit the gate, all while teleporting around traps and juking you out. A guard could just bunker his way through damage up to the gates. An ele could RTL/Lightning Flash/Mist Form/Earth Armor/Swiftness his way right up to the gates. So this isn’t an issue about thieves, then, it’s about players being too incompetent to stop somebody from touching a gate. Which is extremely easy to do, particularly when you know where they’re going anyways.
Yes, exactly. Except for the last 2 sentences, where you don’t understand that the problem is that a completely insignificant amount of damage is able to contest the keep for who knows how many people, and you clearly don’t understand how easy it is to reach the gate if you don’t care about your own survival.
Can we please have the door’s on the keeps/SM take more than an enemy looking at them funny to contest?
Today, I encountered an enemy theif who build their entire build to do one thing. Hit the gates to contest them.
He would run between stonemyst and our keep contesting them keeping our waypoints from being used.
The problem? No one could stop him. We had upwards to 15 players hunting him down and he would teleport/stealth/stunbreak/swiftness away. That’s just ridiculous. I know you want theifs mobile but when 15 players cannot kill him?
Stealth traps? Apparently no one wanted to use them. The idea was floated in the chat but no one bothered to buy any.
I don’t think it takes a genius to see if one player could permanently lock 2 way-points Its overpowered.
Aww..is the crushing majority of the player base still complaining about the broken thief class with Anet ignoring them almost a year since launch? No worries. Here comes ESO!
I lol’d at all the L2P comments. How the timeforkittenword do you want to hit thief that can go perma stealth? Run around swinging sword? I tried, it doesn’t work And why would any thief with more than half of brain trigger trap? It’s soo obvious where they will be, and if they see ppl placing them then it’s GG. Not to mention such kittenty balance that requires you to use siege weapons to conter just 1 (ONE!) escape mechanism of signle class? Why don’t ppl have to build balistas to counter ranger or warrior?
personally Im fine with the suicide contesters, They get their 2mins i get free loot.
The problem is some classes can do it without dieing…
You can nerf those classes but that will make them worse in general, so the only real thing you can do is increase the gate hits.
No..fixing a broken mechanic won’t make classes worse..it would make things fair.
That’s what I’m saying. Gates need a Minimal damage for contesting. Not a nerf on one/two classes. All classes have problems but the main issue here is the Minimal damage on gates.
Using a Stealth trap for a single thief is not a reasonable option. Spending 15 badges, 10 supply and 600 karma and then pray the Thief actually steps on it. Which isnt guarenteed at all!
The trap is fairly small, can be teleported passed and whatnot. Teleports, just the thing a Thief has a ton of…
And if you actually catch him out of Stealth, and even kill him (again, nothing guarenteed) he’ll be back in no time. If you don’t kill him, he’ll be back in 30seconds. And then he might just go for another gate. There’s more then one.
You all forget that the best class to contest keeps is a necromancer.
After a patch a while back they can use a trait and actually lifesteal of walls = contested waypoint (and dont tell me you can defend ALL your walls from all possible sides)
You all forget that the best class to contest keeps is a necromancer.
After a patch a while back they can use a trait and actually lifesteal of walls = contested waypoint (and dont tell me you can defend ALL your walls from all possible sides)
Seems to me that that update note has gone unnoticed by many…. But I do this everytime on my necro; good thing we are on the same server uh?
Yep Necromancers contesting keeps is so extremely easy. Go on a random wall – auto attack once – contested. And everyone keeps crying for thieves.
This is seriously another “Omg please nerf thieves” thread.
You all forget that the best class to contest keeps is a necromancer.
After a patch a while back they can use a trait and actually lifesteal of walls = contested waypoint (and dont tell me you can defend ALL your walls from all possible sides)
really?! that’s just stupid. God kitten it Anet.
If I had a massive castle and some single peasant was banging on the keep walls I wouldn’t alert my army and say “we’re under attack – this place is contested.”
IMO the contested thing needs to be reworked to only occur when a thing is actually contested. Not when the lichens growing on the door/wall have been disturbed.
IMO the contested thing needs to be reworked to only occur when a thing is actually contested. Not when the lichens growing on the door/wall have been disturbed.
I agree! then we wouldn’t have to worry about uncatchable perma stealthed/teleporting thieves or necros that rub themselves all over the castle walls.
Yep Necromancers contesting keeps is so extremely easy. Go on a random wall – auto attack once – contested. And everyone keeps crying for thieves.
This is seriously another “Omg please nerf thieves” thread.
I repeat again, this is NOT a theif nerf thread.
Many classes, other than thief can do similar things.
This thread is for adding a minimal damage to walls/doors before it goes contested so one person cannot just sneeze on it to contest it.
Yep Necromancers contesting keeps is so extremely easy. Go on a random wall – auto attack once – contested. And everyone keeps crying for thieves.
This is seriously another “Omg please nerf thieves” thread.
I repeat again, this is NOT a theif nerf thread.
Many classes, other than thief can do similar things.
This thread is for adding a minimal damage to walls/doors before it goes contested so one person cannot just sneeze on it to contest it.
That is true it is yet another thief thread. Always people having issues with thieves but not in spvp where they were correctly nerfed but in WvW where Anet think its pve.
Its not thieves so much as its stealth. mesmers have it as well. But only two on long cooldowns.
You all forget that the best class to contest keeps is a necromancer.
After a patch a while back they can use a trait and actually lifesteal of walls = contested waypoint (and dont tell me you can defend ALL your walls from all possible sides)
Yes, it WAS stupid.
Because in reality, that patch REMOVED the ability to do that. The patch note is a typo.
Go actually try it for yourself.
They stated that they want to change the mechanic to prevent both waypointing why a keep is contested and hindering a single player from contesting it in the first place.
They probably never will because they don’t really care, but one can hope…
Good to see I’m not the only one
I actually gave up WvW outside from guild events because of it. I’d add “until they fix it”, but I don’t belive ANet considers it a problem.
The funnies thing is, they said, they don’t want perma stealth, coz it’s “not fun”, yet they don’t nerf it when players learned to make it perma.
DAOC perma stealth made more sense…once you pop out of stealth, you could not stealth again as long as someone was watching you
Stealth traps? Apparently no one wanted to use them. The idea was floated in the chat but no one bothered to buy any.
There’s your mistake.
Since all that guy has to do after been killed is to come back in less than minute, what would be the cost per hour to prevent him doing what he was doing?
“OMG, I’ll spend lots of supplies”. Well, yes, but he’ll get bored of not being able to succeed in his attempts.
You think so? If I’d be in his shoes, I’d be happy to make enemy waste so much resources and players just to counter me…I’d even call friend thief to help by activating stealth trap, so I can go unnoticed and still keep WPs contested
You all forget that the best class to contest keeps is a necromancer.
After a patch a while back they can use a trait and actually lifesteal of walls = contested waypoint (and dont tell me you can defend ALL your walls from all possible sides)
Yes, it WAS stupid.
Because in reality, that patch REMOVED the ability to do that. The patch note is a typo.
Go actually try it for yourself.
I think something is wrong then, I’m doing this since I’ve read it on patch notes. Maybe some other guy is contesting a gate at the same time I’m hitting a wall? could be… I don’t know, I always thought it was me contesting things.
Furthermore, if 15 players couldn’t catch one thief, then you guys need to L2P. Thief stealth is not nearly long enough nor unpredictable enough to make it that difficult. Thief throws down Shadow Refuge? Illusionary Wave or Void pull him right out and slam revealed. Shadowsteps away? Well, you better have a mobile setup too; it’s not ANet’s fault that you chose to have the slowest-moving build in the game. CnD’s one of your players? AoE the area where your player just got hit, and be prepared to see the thief running away from the direction you came in. Chaining stealth with HS + BP? Stand in the BP field, or AoE the kitten out of it, or use a pull. Moving too fast? Use immobilize, cripple, and chill, and any pulls you have. And swiftness? Please, thieves have horrible access to swiftness. Either way, you could have simply pulled out a boonsteal thief or a boon corruption necro to destroy the swiftness anyhow.
If, of you 15 players, you couldn’t pull off simple anti-stealth and anti-mobility tactics like that, then you guys need to go watch some guides ASAP.
just watch the first 2 min to see an example where the theif used shadow refuge as a decoy then used another ability and leap finished for his perma stealth
Hold on her people most are missing the point… explain to me why it requires a purchased consumable and supply just to counter a game mechanic? That would be the equivalent of forcing people to buy a consumable in order to strip retaliation.
Good to see I’m not the only one
I actually gave up WvW outside from guild events because of it. I’d add “until they fix it”, but I don’t belive ANet considers it a problem.
The funnies thing is, they said, they don’t want perma stealth, coz it’s “not fun”, yet they don’t nerf it when players learned to make it perma.
DAOC perma stealth made more sense…once you pop out of stealth, you could not stealth again as long as someone was watching you
oh I like this idea. that’s stealth! what thieves are in GW2 are wizards using teleport and invisibility.
I agree that tagging towers and keeps should take more, then just damaging it for a couple of seconds. Like a gate or wall being damaged for 5% within three minutes, or when siege is used.
As for stealth, ArenaNet just needs to tone it down. For instance, by removing all stealth triggers from weapon sets, and put some boons in instead.
80 Ranger | 80 Mesmer | 80 Thief | 80 Guardian | 40 Engineer
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