yes mesmers are strong in pvp but in wvsw i think the only class that got me sooo frustrated is the thieves.
there was a group of 8 thieves running around messing and trolling us at our camps. we were 5. we walk in the camp no one there we cap the camp and then boom! all of the sudden they attack us out of nowhere.
as a mesmer im at least able to survive for a while. but they are able to revive each other all the time. we cant even prevent them from reviving, they are nearly dead then go into stealth come out fully revived, can attack us even in stealth, can now since the new update pull me off a kitten tower!, stay almost perma invisible and their attacks are way to strong,
My mesmer gets some ok damage but those thieves get me down form 20k health to 1 k in like 2 attacks. and then they even laugh at u after the slaughtered u.
Anet, i am sorry but u guys have to nerf thieves for wvsw plz. i gave up after 2 hours of humiliation and was happy to go to another map where i could fight real players that dont have to press 2 buttons to kill u, players that are actually really good and fun to fight.
I think, It wasn’t half bad then if you cry about them reviving eachother.
Just imagining right now if it had been 8 d/d elementalists… You wouldn’t even be able to cry about them reviving eachother or “being able to survive a bit more than the rest”. All 5 of you’d die simultaneously within 3-6 seconds, depending on position.
A hint: a team of 8 organized players should kill a team of 5 players regardless.
yeah agree d/d eles are very very strong and can destroy u quickly. i’m not crying im just annoyed how thieves get sooo powerful due to their incredible stealth duration. being attacked out of the blue because not seeing the enemy at all is really frustrating thats all. btw all of us 5 are extremely well players and would have no problems against 8 others normally but 8 thieves…pretty much invisible all the time…different story.
Lv 80 glamour Mesmer Triforce Mesmerpower PU mes,Lv 80 power necro
[AVTR]
Isle of Kickaspenwood
i hope anet realizes that this just opens the flood gates for more people qqing about the stupidest things wanting to be changed.
i guess now if you cant figure out how to counter a class’s ability then, then just whine about it till i gets changed
This is a legitimate point in some cases…this is not one of those cases. Being able to affect capture circles while stealthed was dumb, and there was precedent for the change in sPvP.
The real problem is the rendering issue which Anet fails to address and “fix” (can it even be fixed?). Anyways, nerfing thieves into the ground isn’t a good solution.
You’re one of those straight up kitten yeah? Arenanet has acknowledged that problem and has stated they’re working on a delicate fix many times now.
The real problem is the rendering issue which Anet fails to address and “fix” (can it even be fixed?). Anyways, nerfing thieves into the ground isn’t a good solution.
You’re one of those straight up kitten yeah? Arenanet has acknowledged that problem and has stated they’re working on a delicate fix many times now.
Yeah well its pretty lame that they have to essentially nerf a class because they cant fix their own kitten engine
In an upcoming patch the WvW capture points will be updated to follow the same rules as the PvP capture points with respect to invisibility & invulnerability. As a result invisible & invulnerable players will no longer contest capture points.
w00t!
Justice is apparently going to be served! Thanks muchly for informing us Habib.
Well guess we can quit posting about this issue now, thank god.
Thieves perma stealth on the other hand…its lame. The “just AoE the area” is bout lame as the “area” is a 6k-8k diameter circle, short of a large AoE zerging it, there’s near nothing u can do until the thieve makes a mistake.
I vote to simply make the cap circle no larger than any of the other cap circles on the maps. Circle the supervisor like at all the other points.
Apart from the happy fact that this issue will be addressed —- the way you write it you’re badly mistaken how stealth works for thieves. It really helps to know your opponent …
A thief must attack sooner or later to regain stealth. And if you have most of your people outside of the circle and mybe 5 or so in the circle all nicely balled up with traps and marks set around that ball … if done that way the size of the circle does not matter because you know exactly where the thief will attack … unless he leaves the circle to attack a target outside of it.
Thieves perma stealth on the other hand…its lame. The “just AoE the area” is bout lame as the “area” is a 6k-8k diameter circle, short of a large AoE zerging it, there’s near nothing u can do until the thieve makes a mistake.
I vote to simply make the cap circle no larger than any of the other cap circles on the maps. Circle the supervisor like at all the other points.
Apart from the happy fact that this issue will be addressed —- the way you write it you’re badly mistaken how stealth works for thieves. It really helps to know your opponent …
A thief must attack sooner or later to regain stealth. And if you have most of your people outside of the circle and mybe 5 or so in the circle all nicely balled up with traps and marks set around that ball … if done that way the size of the circle does not matter because you know exactly where the thief will attack … unless he leaves the circle to attack a target outside of it.
Someone who still doesn’t get the fact, less people in the circle means easier stealth for a d/p thief.
If the thief plays p/d+d/p, things get even more kittened up as you can’t even tell anymore, what he’s gonna use to stealth.
The only crime, turrets committed, is being good against the celestial meta.
The mob has spoken and the turrets shall be burnt at the stake.
Someone who still doesn’t get the fact, less people in the circle means easier stealth for a d/p thief.
If the thief plays p/d+d/p, things get even more kittened up as you can’t even tell anymore, what he’s gonna use to stealth.
I may not get it but so far we’ve countered any thief who tried to pull that number on us. With necro and ranger in the group and an elementalist who uses his pbaoe skills as soon as a trap goes off we usually have a dead thief in a few minutes.
Or tell me what I (and the tieves we played against) missed:
(1) Smoke Screen + Heartseeker – thief will end up in the middle of our AoE
(2) Hide on Steal – Thief will end up in the middle of our AoE
(3) C&D -Thief will end up in the middle of our AoE
All other skills that provide stealth have serious cooldowns so sooner or later a thief has to use 1 – 3.
Someone who still doesn’t get the fact, less people in the circle means easier stealth for a d/p thief.
If the thief plays p/d+d/p, things get even more kittened up as you can’t even tell anymore, what he’s gonna use to stealth.
I may not get it but so far we’ve countered any thief who tried to pull that number on us. With necro and ranger in the group and an elementalist who uses his pbaoe skills as soon as a trap goes off we usually have a dead thief in a few minutes.
Or tell me what I (and the tieves we played against) missed:
(1) Smoke Screen + Heartseeker – thief will end up in the middle of our AoE
(2) Hide on Steal – Thief will end up in the middle of our AoE
(3) C&D -Thief will end up in the middle of our AoE
All other skills that provide stealth have serious cooldowns so sooner or later a thief has to use 1 – 3.
Oh, now he can suddenly smoke screen + heartseeker, when before he “had to attack someone in the circle or leave the circle” to regain invisibility?
Can you be more clear with your posts?
And a good thief can still stall a big group, organized as they may be, for 2-3 minutes.
The only crime, turrets committed, is being good against the celestial meta.
The mob has spoken and the turrets shall be burnt at the stake.
Um – as what do you classify heartseeker? I’d say it’s an attack ….
Edit: Just tested it with my thief … you can actually use an untargetted heartseeker to get the combo finisher which in my opinion is a bug … ok … now if the thief would be smart and set up his smoke screen where it can’t be easily seen he gains another stealth move without having to attack someone …
It’s clear that they are exploiting the culling/rendering bug, but ANET isn’t doing anything to fix it for WVWVW.
please explain how not coming out of stealth is “exploiting” culling/rendering? it is currently possible to maintain 100% stealth uptime without Shadow Refuge.
perma-stealth is in no way an “exploit” more so than it is combo field use.
please do not cry “exploit” on something that is very clearly not.
When 1 player class can prevent 10+ players from capturing a point for many many minutes, that class needs adjusting. Anyone who says different isn’t interested in a balanced game.
Is perma stealth really a feature of the game or is the 3 seconds of being exposed between stealths more the intention? Has there been an official statement from ANet regarding constructive perma stealth (i.e. not via culling issues but by design)?
Is perma stealth really a feature of the game or is the 3 seconds of being exposed between stealths more the intention? Has there been an official statement from ANet regarding constructive perma stealth (i.e. not via culling issues but by design)?
The “revealed” debuff is a 3 second debuff that prevents restealthing only when attacking from stealth. So, by design, if you aren’t attacking anyone then you can chain together stealth effects to achieve permastealth. The only time this really becomes a balance issue is if you can actually do something useful by standing around in stealth not attacking anyone. The upcoming change should fix that issue.
When 1 player class can prevent 10+ players from capturing a point for many many minutes, that class needs adjusting. Anyone who says different isn’t interested in a balanced game.
The mechanics adjustment, not a profession adjustment, was a proper solution to the problem. The issue isn’t permastealth as much as the fact that you could be useful just standing around stealthed due to how capture circles work.
Is perma stealth really a feature of the game or is the 3 seconds of being exposed between stealths more the intention? Has there been an official statement from ANet regarding constructive perma stealth (i.e. not via culling issues but by design)?
The “revealed” debuff is a 3 second debuff that prevents restealthing only when attacking from stealth. So, by design, if you aren’t attacking anyone then you can chain together stealth effects to achieve permastealth. The only time this really becomes a balance issue is if you can actually do something useful by standing around in stealth not attacking anyone. The upcoming change should fix that issue.
They do intend you are able to chain stealth when not attacking but not forever. Anet has made constant changes to fix anything that allowed stealth for a prolonged time. They have capped it to 15s, put a 8sec CD on the stealth part of our fall dmg trait (which isn’t even needed anymore because of the cap).
The thing is a d/p build that achieves this is so bad in all other ways, I doubt you will see it after this change. It’s only productive as a glass cannon/back-stab type build that doesn’t have the required init regen. I wouldn’t be surprised if they still nerf it’s ability to perma stealth though. Hopefully not hitting the rest of us with collateral damage like the fall trait that still hasn’t been changed back.
As i wrote before they need to add a unstealth skill for some classes, say 1 class have a solo unstealth that last 20sec and 30sec cd and 1 class have a group unstealth that last for 15sec and 20sec cd, solo = only for you, group = for the group your in, no mater if you are next to other players or on difrent side off the map. The unstealth shouldnt be like in SW-TOR were the stealthed player poped out off stealth, it should be so the player/players see stealthed enemys without the stealthed player knowing do they see me or not.
And then a pot that you can buy that do solo unstealth for 30sec and 40sec CD.
As i wrote before they need to add a unstealth skill for some classes, say 1 class have a solo unstealth that last 20sec and 30sec cd and 1 class have a group unstealth that last for 15sec and 20sec cd, solo = only for you, group = for the group your in, no mater if you are next to other players or on difrent side off the map. The unstealth shouldnt be like in SW-TOR were the stealthed player poped out off stealth, it should be so the player/players see stealthed enemys without the stealthed player knowing do they see me or not.
And then a pot that you can buy that do solo unstealth for 30sec and 40sec CD.
What you are experiencing is a learn to play issue. My condolences.
Let’s give everyone a consumable that removes other profession defining abilities as well. Pot to remove ranger pets on 30 or 40 second cool-down, Pot to disarm a warrior, Pot to prevent mesmer clones, Pot to prevent Ele stance changes. So many great options for your pot idea!
Tried to cap a supply camp last night but couldn’t because a thief was permastealth… I say couldn’t we tracked him down but he kept going in to stealth which made things VERY annoying considering the size of the area made to cap.
They’re doing a job but it’s the size of the capping area that makes things annoying…. Reduce the size of the capping area don’t nerf the thief, even a squishy Mesmer like me can take down a thief or make him run in the right conditions.
Tortun – Protector of Gandara and Bessie!
WvWvW Player Who Doesn’t Have Much of A Clue
The issue is the redering. Otherwise stealth is fine. I hate thieves but i dont want to see them being destroyed. But its really sad that every thief you find in wvw has the same build and combo.
The issue is the redering. Otherwise stealth is fine. I hate thieves but i dont want to see them being destroyed. But its really sad that every thief you find in wvw has the same build and combo.
If you have played a thief, you’d find that we really don’t have many options. Even the ones we did have, have been severely nerfed because of people complaining. Most thieves run Dagger-Dagger because it maximizes damage output, and that’s exactly the type of class best suited for thief, single-target damage. We have a lack of AoE for our weapon sets, so many thieves use a shortbow in WvW. As far as being effective in WvW, you are really only going to see D-D, Sb, or D-p.
Chody – Leader of We Came To Dance GW2
Crystal Desert
We Came To Dance [WCTD]
In an upcoming patch the WvW capture points will be updated to follow the same rules as the PvP capture points with respect to invisibility & invulnerability. As a result invisible & invulnerable players will no longer contest capture points.
The issue is the redering. Otherwise stealth is fine. I hate thieves but i dont want to see them being destroyed. But its really sad that every thief you find in wvw has the same build and combo.
If you have played a thief, you’d find that we really don’t have many options. Even the ones we did have, have been severely nerfed because of people complaining. Most thieves run Dagger-Dagger because it maximizes damage output, and that’s exactly the type of class best suited for thief, single-target damage. We have a lack of AoE for our weapon sets, so many thieves use a shortbow in WvW. As far as being effective in WvW, you are really only going to see D-D, Sb, or D-p.
yeh i know how you feel. I deleted my thief to make room for an ele. Thief are forced to one build and the others been nerfed. They also die amazingly fast even if on a tanky build. But some thieves just want to watch the world burn.
The issue is the redering. Otherwise stealth is fine. I hate thieves but i dont want to see them being destroyed. But its really sad that every thief you find in wvw has the same build and combo.
If you have played a thief, you’d find that we really don’t have many options. Even the ones we did have, have been severely nerfed because of people complaining. Most thieves run Dagger-Dagger because it maximizes damage output, and that’s exactly the type of class best suited for thief, single-target damage. We have a lack of AoE for our weapon sets, so many thieves use a shortbow in WvW. As far as being effective in WvW, you are really only going to see D-D, Sb, or D-p.
I have played a thief and I understand where the class is in WvWvW.
Thief may be the hardest class to balance in PvP, a lightly armored character that is designed around single target spike damage. Stealth is an important aspect of the class for survivability.
You must admit the class is strong at this point. Well played they are a force on the battlefield with a single target focus or with dagger storm on the edges of zergs. We have yet to see coordinated use of multiple dagger storms but it’s time will come.
A difficult class to balance. But I will bet a lot of people are leveling thieves. And why not use a class that has the most potential? That’s all I’m trying to say. You will see more thieves in WvWvW in the coming weeks.
The issue is the redering. Otherwise stealth is fine. I hate thieves but i dont want to see them being destroyed. But its really sad that every thief you find in wvw has the same build and combo.
If you have played a thief, you’d find that we really don’t have many options. Even the ones we did have, have been severely nerfed because of people complaining. Most thieves run Dagger-Dagger because it maximizes damage output, and that’s exactly the type of class best suited for thief, single-target damage. We have a lack of AoE for our weapon sets, so many thieves use a shortbow in WvW. As far as being effective in WvW, you are really only going to see D-D, Sb, or D-p.
yeh i know how you feel. I deleted my thief to make room for an ele. Thief are forced to one build and the others been nerfed. They also die amazingly fast even if on a tanky build. But some thieves just want to watch the world burn.
I run three different builds depending on whats needed and all are effective at killing. I’d run more builds but still working on the gear. I’m not quite sure if people just choose to pigeon hole themselves into one build or because it’s what they “see” posted as the “best” build. I run P/P with either D/D or SB as secondary (depends on situation) and in 1v1 I very rarely switch unless in trouble. I’m by no means a top tier PvP er but I’ve taken 3v1 using P/P and come out on top. Please don’t think we are stuck into one build because we aren’t.
Khanswrath-80 Thief [ODN]
“Do not argue with an idiot.
He will drag you down to his level and beat you with experience. "
Thieves are ruining pretty much everything. The class is pretty much broken, if you ask me. They’re in need of a thorough re-evaluation.
I love how they are ruining PvE, Dungeons, World Events and all forms of PvP. You sir are correct please make a separate thread so we can ALL bask in this “game-breaking” opinion.
Khanswrath-80 Thief [ODN]
“Do not argue with an idiot.
He will drag you down to his level and beat you with experience. "
Thieves are ruining pretty much everything. The class is pretty much broken, if you ask me. They’re in need of a thorough re-evaluation.
I love how they are ruining PvE, Dungeons, World Events and all forms of PvP. You sir are correct please make a separate thread so we can ALL bask in this “game-breaking” opinion.
No point in making another thread, because the issue has already been discussed to death. The thief is a crutch class that allows terrible players to excell and believe they are gods. The real tragedy is that it overshadows the thieves who are actually good at their class.
Love all these comments…My Guardian is my Main, I’ve played one of every Class to get a feel for them and honestly the only one that ever seemed “OP” was Warrior, and that was even a close one and only seemed to be with Greatsword build. I love to fight and kill Thieves, knowing their tricks makes it easier to counter them. Having played a Mesmer I can actually spot a Mesmer PC among all their clones easy as hell now. Know just when to Knockback or otherwise CC to deal with enemies. There are some that my Guardian just can’t kill, but if it’s a Glass Cannon, I eat them for breakfast.
The complaints about the Thief are semi-valid, removing a Target is -extremely- powerful in PvP, throwing up a crap-ton of Clones and being invisible doing so is extremely powerful…But regardless, I don’t think the Thief is OP. (The Mesmer I’m iffy on…They really seem able to take WAY too much punishment when their entire Build is based around avoiding being hit, I’d say THEY are the ones with the highest potential.)
It’s funny how many of the players considering permastealth a non gamebreaking issue are thieves. But who face a permastealth thief in wvwvw knows perfectly it is a gamebreaking issue instead. 10 people running around in circle on a supply camp to find a SINGLE thief who prevents them from cap. Well if this is not an issue…
Or a permastealth thief destroying all siege weapons one after the other beyond enemy lines during a stonemist siege. sarcasm mode on Sure that’s not a problem sarcasm mode off
I can understand perfectly that many “kids” will lose their little toy and cry if thief will be fixed by anet so im not surprised about what many ppl wrote here.
It’s funny how many of the players considering permastealth a non gamebreaking issue are thieves. But who face a permastealth thief in wvwvw knows perfectly it is a gamebreaking issue instead. 10 people running around in circle on a supply camp to find a SINGLE thief who prevents them from cap. Well if this is not an issue…
Or a permastealth thief destroying all siege weapons one after the other beyond enemy lines during a stonemist siege. sarcasm mode on Sure that’s not a problem sarcasm mode off
I can understand perfectly that many “kids” will lose their little toy and cry if thief will be fixed by anet so im not surprised about what many ppl wrote here.
Did you not read they are fixing the cap issue??? 2nd page 7th post down. I’m happy it’s being fixed. The fewer “kids” we have on the forums toting “game breaking” comments the better off we all will be. There’s no sarcasm there.
Khanswrath-80 Thief [ODN]
“Do not argue with an idiot.
He will drag you down to his level and beat you with experience. "
It’s funny how many of the players considering permastealth a non gamebreaking issue are thieves. But who face a permastealth thief in wvwvw knows perfectly it is a gamebreaking issue instead. 10 people running around in circle on a supply camp to find a SINGLE thief who prevents them from cap. Well if this is not an issue…
Or a permastealth thief destroying all siege weapons one after the other beyond enemy lines during a stonemist siege. sarcasm mode on Sure that’s not a problem sarcasm mode off
I can understand perfectly that many “kids” will lose their little toy and cry if thief will be fixed by anet so im not surprised about what many ppl wrote here.
Did you not read they are fixing the cap issue??? 2nd page 7th post down. I’m happy it’s being fixed. The fewer “kids” we have on the forums toting “game breaking” comments the better off we all will be. There’s no sarcasm there.
Read carefully what i wrote and you’ll discover the cap issue is not the only one. It’s just one side of a bigger problem, infact this thread is not about the cap issue, is it?
BTW you’re a thief right? Was sure about that, you feel “involved” at once right? =)
Or a permastealth thief destroying all siege weapons one after the other beyond enemy lines during a stonemist siege. sarcasm mode on Sure that’s not a problem sarcasm mode off
Permastealthing doesn’t seem like it would be an issue at all in this situation. Siege equipment should be protected anyway, so if one person, permastealthing thief or not, manages to take out numerous siege weapons back to back by themselves then that sounds like a serious failure on the part of the assaulting server. I can see culling issues being a factor, but it shouldn’t be a deal breaker since siege should never be left undefended like that unless it’s no longer needed.
If it just me or are there a Per stealth rouge at every dang supply now a days. I play a thief I do not perm stealth because I play the thief as its intended I don’t exploit. I believe this needs to be fixed asap. IMO this is ruining wvw. Not one of any profession should be capable of holding off an entire 20 man group of players from capping a point they fought hard to get. This will end up being a big game breaker for wvw if they don’t find a way to fix this. I for one can’t stand you types of thieves your weak players dependent on a defect of design and your never gonna convince me otherwise. Stop exploiting the game. Play with skill not cheap dirty tricks.
So yes, this thread is literally about the cap issue.
It’s funny how many of the players considering permastealth a non gamebreaking issue are thieves. But who face a permastealth thief in wvwvw knows perfectly it is a gamebreaking issue instead. 10 people running around in circle on a supply camp to find a SINGLE thief who prevents them from cap. Well if this is not an issue…
Or a permastealth thief destroying all siege weapons one after the other beyond enemy lines during a stonemist siege. sarcasm mode on Sure that’s not a problem sarcasm mode off
I can understand perfectly that many “kids” will lose their little toy and cry if thief will be fixed by anet so im not surprised about what many ppl wrote here.
Did you not read they are fixing the cap issue??? 2nd page 7th post down. I’m happy it’s being fixed. The fewer “kids” we have on the forums toting “game breaking” comments the better off we all will be. There’s no sarcasm there.
Read carefully what i wrote and you’ll discover the cap issue is not the only one. It’s just one side of a bigger problem, infact this thread is not about the cap issue, is it?
BTW you’re a thief right? Was sure about that, you feel “involved” at once right? =)
I read what you wrote and feel real bad your siege got destroyed now re-read all the posts in this thread and realize the issue with the capping is being addressed. Also pay close attention that I am HAPPY it’s being fixed. Glad you read my sig also maybe you see some sarcasm in it about the rendering issue??? If you took the time to actually read the entire instead of calling people “kids” you wouldn’t be looking so foolish right now.
Khanswrath-80 Thief [ODN]
“Do not argue with an idiot.
He will drag you down to his level and beat you with experience. "
It easy to kill a thief, If the thief try to troll you in supply camp, just gather and try to cc him. If he shadow refuge just knock him out the circle when the house still appear. If the house disappear gather again and start auto swing.
Please, Anet, do not listen to all the whiners complaining about thieves and mezmers.
While I agree to a certain extent with your decision to prevent stealthed characters from capping, be very cautious about any more changes to the classes themselves. I play both classes. Playing a thief is very hard. One has to have the timing just right and know exactly which skills to use to stay stealthed while fighting an enemy. I still stack a lot of toughness as a thief but am still squishy. Stealthing, movement, and speed are our defense. People say they do too much damage. but like with any class, those guys are glass cannons, and can be killed very easily. You guys already nerfed my mezmer a great deal. I can’t do any damage to players on a wall unless they are right on the edge. I have to waste 10 trait points in order to reduce my portal cool down. I can’t target invulnerable players (i really don’t understand that). I’ve seen people complain about how they have to re-aquire the target if they go into stealth. Really? This is a big deal? This is a computer game. If you want to just button mash, go play a console. So, please, keep the classes dynamic and interesting, and don’t listen to everyone who says this class or that class is OP.
Blackgate Native. It takes tremendous strength and skill to pull a lever.
It’s funny how many of the players considering permastealth a non gamebreaking issue are thieves. But who face a permastealth thief in wvwvw knows perfectly it is a gamebreaking issue instead. 10 people running around in circle on a supply camp to find a SINGLE thief who prevents them from cap. Well if this is not an issue…
L2Read please. You, along with many others since page 2, failed to see anet post that they are working on a fix for this. You probably just saw “thieves” and decided everyone needed to hear your view on it (a view that has been repeated ad nauseam).
Or a permastealth thief destroying all siege weapons one after the other beyond enemy lines during a stonemist siege. sarcasm mode on Sure that’s not a problem sarcasm mode off
I can understand perfectly that many “kids” will lose their little toy and cry if thief will be fixed by anet so im not surprised about what many ppl wrote here.
A thief (or any stealthed class) can’t permastealth WHILE destroying anything. If you don’t defend your siege, then you deserve to have it taken away from you. If your siege was inside a base, and the thief stayed in stealth after you capped it, that’s on your team not sweeping properly (see Mesmer portals complaint threads).
classes that can remain stealthed while they slaughter people.
Not how it works. Either they’re abusing culling, which isn’t stealth, or they’re “slaughtering people” at a rate of 1 hit every 3 seconds.
Thieves don’t abuse culling. For your enlightenment, when you play a thief you don’t notice any culling on your thief because you are rendered first. What you consider a thief abusing culling is merely a thief playing his profession within the parameters he is given.
If I want to attack the back line, I drop Shadow Refuge on some allies that need a bit of a heal and I don’t attack, I sit there and stack my duration (a feature of the skill, not an exploit) when the refuge disappears I move as fast as I can to my target (or targets) drop caltrops and shoot choking gas cloud to reduce healing and deal an additional condition, I then follow this up with blinding powder to cause AoE blind, cluster bomb to add weakness to the poison cloud, Switch to pistol dagger, C&D and target the lowest health player with a sneak attack. Then I use Shadow Strike to step out of melee and retreat back to my team. Smart teams will catch me, necros might transfer their conditions back to me, Elementalists or guardians might remove all my work with one button but the majority of pugs and mercs will panic, run around like a benny hill episode and bleed out. This tactic varies greatly depending on what the enemy does but it is far more effective than backstab and it doesn’t Abuse rendering, I jusst use my abilities the way they are intended to be used. Rendering is an unfortunate side effect for the enemy. Abusing rendering is would be zerg rushing or portal bombing, but eeven then, it’s not abusing anything, it is merely utilising the abilities we are given withing the parameters we are granted.
I wish people would stop using the term “exploit”. Its not, its just kitteny skill balance combined with technical problems in rendering.
On the flip side to thieves who think they are being unfairly targeted, I’ve got an 80 Ele, Necro, Mesmer and Thief with probably 500 hours played on the thief and 3/4 of that in WvW. I have to be honest and admit my thief is by far the most unstoppable engine of destruction of all those classes. Is a thief counterable? Sure. Are there other classes the thief has problems with, like mesmer and guardian? Sure. However, the thief is still getting a 20m head start in a 100 race, unless the other guy is a kitten good player, you’re going to get a default win 80% of the time.
As a thief I worry about how the final nerf will fall to stealth. I wouldn’t like to see some solutions (eg I don’t think damage should break stealth) but I do think their should be a cumulative cooldown on entering stealth across multiple skills/spams so as to get back to the original intent of stealth, short term disengagement mechanic rather than long term ganking mechanic.
