Guild Wars 2

yeah. 2 months later, and the system is not working.

please... PLEASE... stop ignoring us. throw us a bone. put a lower hard-cap on the points. TELL us you are thinking of a solution. something. anything. the silence is killing us

katz.8376:

the silence is killing us

You sure that wasn’t me? :P

100% agreed katz. Seriously, it’s T8’s experience that the following just simply does not hold true for the T8 situation…

MikeFerguson.8921:

However, even with all the issues glicko presents, we have seen that while it takes a few weeks for the system to adjust to the population shifts, it DOES adjust, and eventually those worlds end up playing in competitive games again once they reach a tier that suits their current population.

We’ve been stuck in this tier since the beginning of the year. This tier is just NOT competitive. We’ve had well over a month of solid curbstomps with no escape from T8 in sight for SF (hurray for loosing points when we win by a very large margin!). And it’s frustrating when our enemies are not our server opponents, but Glicko itself.

Please let us know SOMETHING is being done to address the T8 issue (even if it’s the bog-standard “we’re looking into this issue” boilerplate response). The silence is deafening.

What happens if HoD moves down, dominates the two of you like they probably would? Just server transfer off if you enjoy wvw that much. Find a new home for yourselves because its not something that will be fixed any time soon, no matter how many forum threads you t8 guys make.

Actually, this is not a new thread so it is not adding to the number of threads on this.

imalog.7689:

What happens if HoD moves down, dominates the two of you like they probably would? Just server transfer off if you enjoy wvw that much. Find a new home for yourselves because its not something that will be fixed any time soon, no matter how many forum threads you t8 guys make.

It appears that HoD may actually be a good fit for ET and FC. But we’ll never know until they drop down to T8 (or we SF folk somehow find a way to claw out of the T8 rating pit).

Otaur.9268:

We on Henge of Denravi know your pain… We are greatly outnumbered 90% of the time. Just about 30 mins ago was 4 of us in EB trying to defend versus about 30+ Gates of Madness. Zerg Wars is not fun. Oh and we didn’t even get the Outmanned Buff, stupid excuse for a “Buff” anyways. I’m posting a video of it.

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/pvp/wuvwuv/T8-Frustration/page/2#post1613041

Cantur Soulfyre.5409:

katz.8376:

the silence is killing us

You sure that wasn’t me? :P

nope. i’ve seen a pic of your armor. no one that badkitten looking has killed me, yet. XD

but yeah. transferring away is NOT AN ANSWER. it’s what got us into this mess in the first place, so quit suggesting it, plz thx.

LOL, I believe you would be missed by someone(s) on SF if you transferred.

Honestly, I can’t understand why there’s constantly someone dropping this obligatory “Whoever drops down is gonna dominate anyways”. Currently SF is untested in how it would fair in its full power against tier 7 in a rematch, so just because they dominated doesn’t neccesarily mean other tier 7 servers would.

BUT..

Even if they would dominate, that is really not the issue or the complaint at all. The complaint of tier 8 is always simply how long a dominating server takes to advance. How would those of you in tier 7-2 feel if a server in your tier could dominate you with 300k-400k+(in comparison to your 140k-ish score or whatever) scores every week, possessing the numbers two suppress both its competitors in their own borderlands AND control EB/press one other map simultaneously, and despite this disparity this server was stuck in your tier for 2-3 MONTHS. That’s the problem. You don’t know how it feels, and you never will know how it feels unless you drop here. Servers that dominate in your brackets like that advance within ONE WEEK. Here it can take up to a quarter year with the same server. Get it? Sorrow’s Furnace is not enjoying this. Ferguson’s Crossing is not enjoying this. Eredon Terrace is not enjoying this. ALL THREE of us are complaining about a legitimate issue.

Drop the misconception already. We have no issue with Sorrow’s Furnace. This is not a server issue. Bit by bit we’ve even started to become friends on the forums due to this Glicko junkhole. What if HoD dropped down and dominated us even HARDER than SF and advanced back up within a week, and this trend constantly continued forever with various tier 7 servers like what can happen in other tiers, where advancement doesn’t take months? We would actually be A LOT LESS frustrated because the functionality would be working here just as it does in higher tiers. At least we would get to truly put to the test whether the other tier 7 servers can hold their ground or not rather than operating purely off speculation. And if we were that weak even in our prime largest showings in WvWvW, we would happily accept it because we would of gotten to put it to test with more than just tier 6/tier 5/tier 3 WvWvW showings. Consider also the fact that we SCORED BETTER against the tier 5 and tier 3 level showings of both Devona’s Rest and Kaineng than tier 7 did. Don’t you think us having at least a new shot against a new server in tier 8 every three weeks at least or so would be fair? But we never get that opportunity in a timely fashion, unlike those of you in higher tiers. So, can you really not understand what the complaint is? Why should EVERY OTHER TIER (except tier 1, but at least they have the option to purposely drop DOWN if they don’t like it.) enjoy the privilege of having servers dominating like SF does advancing in as little as a week, two weeks tops while it takes many months here, and increasingly more every time more points get sucked out of tier 8 by the advancing server?

We don’t want tier 8 servers to be bumped up, we’re not asking to pick and choose who gets bumped down, we’re asking in a very reasonable fashion to have advancement to tier 7 and drops from tier 7 to work at in the very least COMPARABLE rates to other tiers. You people in higher tiers would be yelling the same crap twice as loud as us if it happened in your tiers, that’s the irony in all of this. So kitten stop trying to drown out our voices and legitimate complaints with “You will always be dominated by whoever drops”, that’s a non factor in our frustrations to begin with, and has never even had the chance to be adequately tested outside a single server in the case of Sorrow’s Furnace. After all as I made clear earlier, Devona’s Rest and Kaineng were very different case.

And for the love of Guild Wars 2, stop recommending us to transfer to your queue-plagued tiers and trying to use our threads to pick off what WvW dedicated guilds we have left. Didn’t Mike Ferguson or Habib in one of the posts in the thread where all you whiners got the rating reset cancelled outline that it was their intention to have PEOPLE SPREAD OUT THROUGH THE TIERS rather than clustering into a select few “Holy servers”.

What’s it to you if whoever drops down here dominates anyways? If our complaints annoy you higher tier people, than do both of us a favor and keep your sorry hides somewhere else while you pass by the 20 minutes of your fail queues. At this point I’m even starting to think you guys just want to block all changes to this tier because you’re scared that one of these days with an unpredictable population shift your servers could fall in here, and maybe think that with us down here you’re safe from that.

Detharos.3157:

Even if they would dominate, that is really not the issue or the complaint at all. The complaint of tier 8 is always simply how long a dominating server takes to advance. How would those of you in tier 7-2 feel if a server in your tier could dominate you with 300k-400k+(in comparison to your 140k-ish score or whatever) scores every week, possessing the numbers two suppress both its competitors in their own borderlands AND control EB/press one other map simultaneously, and despite this disparity this server was stuck in your tier for 2-3 MONTHS. That’s the problem. You don’t know how it feels, and you never will know how it feels unless you drop here. Servers that dominate in your brackets like that advance within ONE WEEK. Here it can take up to a quarter year with the same server. Get it?

Anet doesn’t redesign WvW because tier 8 has their feelings hurt.
No, higher tiers don’t know how it FEELS because we know it sucks so we didn’t put ourselves in that position.

You can complain about people saying that any other server would dominate tier 8 all you want, but it doesn’t make it false. What good is it going to do for Anet to put their time and resources and money into fixing tier 8’s problem, if the very next week the server that replaces SF is going to be just as bad/worse?
You cannot seriously be so self entitled

Maybe they should put a minimum rating level in so that T8 servers cant fall too far behind the pack.

seriously? SEROIUSLY?!?!

you know what. you have no friggin clue what you are talking about so get out of this thread. there is a huge problem here, and you’d dang sure be whining like a stuck pig about it if it were happening to you.

your answer to the problem is ignore it. pretend it doesn’t exist. it’ll go away. it’s just those loln00bs in tier 8 who obviously don’t know how to play and get roflstomped every week. why bother listening to their legit concerns.

and you call US self entitled. get over yourself buddy

EnRohbi.2187:

Detharos.3157:

Even if they would dominate, that is really not the issue or the complaint at all. The complaint of tier 8 is always simply how long a dominating server takes to advance. How would those of you in tier 7-2 feel if a server in your tier could dominate you with 300k-400k+(in comparison to your 140k-ish score or whatever) scores every week, possessing the numbers two suppress both its competitors in their own borderlands AND control EB/press one other map simultaneously, and despite this disparity this server was stuck in your tier for 2-3 MONTHS. That’s the problem. You don’t know how it feels, and you never will know how it feels unless you drop here. Servers that dominate in your brackets like that advance within ONE WEEK. Here it can take up to a quarter year with the same server. Get it?

Anet doesn’t redesign WvW because tier 8 has their feelings hurt.
No, higher tiers don’t know how it FEELS because we know it sucks so we didn’t put ourselves in that position.

You can complain about people saying that any other server would dominate tier 8 all you want, but it doesn’t make it false. What good is it going to do for Anet to put their time and resources and money into fixing tier 8’s problem, if the very next week the server that replaces SF is going to be just as bad/worse?
You cannot seriously be so self entitled

Self-entitled to what? A fix for a broken rating system? It’s not even like we’re asking for a rating reset. We’re asking for something that works for all tiers and solves our problems simultaneously, not something that shoves your higher tiers under the carpet so that we can enjoy WvWvW.

And you speak like your opinion is absolute fact. Can you present to me any credible evidence that if for example, HoD dropped down here they would dominate? Or other servers? You tell me, how is it that tier 8 held out better against Devona’s Rest and Kaineng than tier 7 themselves did, and consistently so in multiple weeks? Maybe whether the current tier 8 servers are truly tier 8 quality SHOULD BE re-examined on a large scale and put to the test. I’m increasingly less convinced that the current three servers in tier 8 really are the weakest of all the tiers, especially when every single time a server has dominated with score discrepancies like Sorrow’s Furnace has, it has proceeded to crush upwards of two tiers above it.

Working as intended? Yeah, right.

How about this. IF EVERY SINGLE IN TIER 7 REALLY IS that much stronger than us, and there REALLY is this “Tier 7 wall” between our tiers like you seem to think, and this contrary to the evidence in all of mos.millennium score history, how about having EVERY SINGLE TIER 7 SERVER ACTUALLY TESTED against tier 8 for a few weeks to confirm this?

In the very least if what you said was true, it would prove a convenient opportunity for tier 7 to get their map completion don’t you think? But if things didn’t happen that way in such a test, all your arguments and opinions would prove to simply be full of crap wouldn’t it? I guess you can’t have that happening, so you’ll continue to show up in every single thread we make.

Seriously, did you even read my post at all? You must of gotten angry at the part I called all you out for whining about the rating reset, do you even understand why I did that? You think I want a rating reset to go through? NO. My point in that was that your people of higher tiers, to the very FACE of developers and their representatives whined about a crappy change, and made a difference because so many of you threatened to quit and move on to other games.

So when our tier members COMPLAIN about a LEGITIMATE ISSUE, and are CONSTANTLY PROPOSING SOLUTIONS THAT FIX OUR TIER WHILE LEAVING YOUR HIGHER TIERS INTACT, again we RAISE UP VIABLE SOLUTIONS while NOT threatening to quit the game like a bunch of spoiled brats like certain people did, why do you constantly try to block us out?

But no, even forget all the mos.millennium evidence that contradicts everything you say at this point, since you’ve constantly gone against it anyways, can you present to me rather evidence that you are NOT a mere forum troll? Because I’m really starting to think that you are.

Again let me make this clear to you one final time. We want dominating servers in tier 8 to advance to tier 7 just as quickly as tier 7 servers dominating like SF do advance to tier 6. That is ALL we want. We are not saying that advancement rates should be slowed down to what we suffer for every tier, we’re asking to receive the same treatment and situations other tiers have the privilege of enjoying.

EnRohbi.2187:

No, higher tiers don’t know how it FEELS because we know it sucks so we didn’t put ourselves in that position.

LOL, now who sounds entitled? Do you honestly think we put ourselves in this position on purpose? LOL, oh the irony. You aren’t one of those who transferred off your original creation world to find a “better” WvW server, are you?

Why are you posting on a T8 thread anyways? Troll much? Just because what we are experiencing means nothing to you does not make our points invalid. So you coming here and stating these things on a T8 thread that has nothing to do with you just shows what kind of class you have.

Please, if you do not want to hear our complaints about the system, stay off our threads and do not read them. Very simple. However if you continue coming onto our threads with this junk it will just show you for what you are, a troll.

Cantur Soulfyre.5409:

EnRohbi.2187:

No, higher tiers don’t know how it FEELS because we know it sucks so we didn’t put ourselves in that position.

LOL, now who sounds entitled? Do you honestly think we put ourselves in this position on purpose? LOL, oh the irony. You aren’t one of those who transferred off your original creation world to find a “better” WvW server, are you?

Why are you posting on a T8 thread anyways? Troll much? Just because what we are experiencing means nothing to you does not make our points invalid. So you coming here and stating these things on a T8 thread that has nothing to do with you just shows what kind of class you have.

Please, if you do not want to hear our complaints about the system, stay off our threads and do not read them. Very simple. However if you continue coming onto our threads with this junk it will just show you for what you are, a troll.

No, been on the same server since launch. Through good times and guild exoduses.

And I’m posting on a tier 8 thread because it’s in a public WvW forum for the entire game, and I have input to give.
If you don’t want people from other tiers posting in it, you should go post it on your server’s forum (If you have one).

But, alas, this is the way public forums work.

And yes, I do think you put yourself in this situation on purpose. You have options.
You have had an ample amount of time to find a new home if tier 8 is so unplayable for you. I’m all for server loyalty and not bandwagoning away when things get tough, but when the reality of the game is that YOUR TIER IS BROKEN, it’s okay to find a new home that satisfies your WvW needs.

EnRohbi.2187:

Cantur Soulfyre.5409:

EnRohbi.2187:

No, higher tiers don’t know how it FEELS because we know it sucks so we didn’t put ourselves in that position.

LOL, now who sounds entitled? Do you honestly think we put ourselves in this position on purpose? LOL, oh the irony. You aren’t one of those who transferred off your original creation world to find a “better” WvW server, are you?

Why are you posting on a T8 thread anyways? Troll much? Just because what we are experiencing means nothing to you does not make our points invalid. So you coming here and stating these things on a T8 thread that has nothing to do with you just shows what kind of class you have.

Please, if you do not want to hear our complaints about the system, stay off our threads and do not read them. Very simple. However if you continue coming onto our threads with this junk it will just show you for what you are, a troll.

No, been on the same server since launch. Through good times and guild exoduses.

And I’m posting on a tier 8 thread because it’s in a public WvW forum for the entire game, and I have input to give.
If you don’t want people from other tiers posting in it, you should go post it on your server’s forum (If you have one).

But, alas, this is the way public forums work.

And yes, I do think you put yourself in this situation on purpose. You have options.
You have had an ample amount of time to find a new home if tier 8 is so unplayable for you. I’m all for server loyalty and not bandwagoning away when things get tough, but when the reality of the game is that YOUR TIER IS BROKEN, it’s okay to find a new home that satisfies your WvW needs.

So basically, you ADMIT the tier is broken. We haven’t left exactly because we believe in seeing broken things FIXED, and it should be pretty possible to fix tier 8 without damaging other tiers at all. This is all we’ve been waiting on:

Either a fix, or an FORUM ADMISSION from the developers and representatives that they are convinced there is a problem here, and that it cannot be fixed. If it came to that, we would be willing to transfer. They could even have the courage to offer our tier specifically free transfers to certain servers so we could once again effectively grab at the chance to move without breaking up our guilds/communities as much as it takes with paid transfers. As it stands the most recent post on the issue from an ArenaNet representative literally amounted to this:

“Give it some weeks and it will fix itself.”

Yet its months and it hasn’t fixed itself, and evidence shows it probably never will without some drastic interference in the Glicko2 system from ArenaNet. So we wait on AT LEAST a single reply from ArenaNet, some light and closure on the issue. Of course we won’t wait forever, we eventually will transfer off despite the close knit online communities that have been built up here. Tier 8 could then at least function as a ghost tier that supports the ratings of the “real servers”. No we did not put ourselves into this position on purpose, we’re not masochists.

Weren’t many people from higher tiers, and even some from your very server also suggesting to us to attempt to inspire our PvE communities into showing up rather than resorting to transfers? Guess what, we missed our opportunity to benefit from free transfers simply because we had that same sentiment. That was not us making some masochistic decision to be dominated forever, that was us making a sacrifice to put to the test whether we could change things.

Do you really despise us just because we took ArenaNet at their word? For believing that somewhere deep down they do care, are listening and have at least some intention to fix what you yourself admit to be a problem, calling it a “broken tier”?

But alas, maybe we are fools for doing so. Maybe we did bring this upon ourself. Maybe it was weakness that we trusted ArenaNet to fix our tier, that we didn’t whine like other tiers did or in unity threaten to quit Guild Wars 2 for rival games in order to ArenaNet’s hand forced when the worry of dwindling net income is threatened.

Maybe we were naive, and maybe we were wrong for ironically NOT acting “self-entitled” as you called us earlier.

Yeah, I guess the joke’s on us.

It’s not even worth engaging the nincompoops from the higher tiers who come into these threads and crap all over them. They’re like teenagers who think they have all the answers and life figured out, when the actuality is they know next to nothing. All we can do is roll our eyes and take anything they have to say with a grain of salt and move on.

Detharos might be quite verbose, but if the trolls actually took the time to read what the guy has to say he makes a lot of sense. The system is broken down here. Sticking your head in the sand about it doesn’t make it any less true.

EnRohbi.2187:

Cantur Soulfyre.5409:

EnRohbi.2187:

No, higher tiers don’t know how it FEELS because we know it sucks so we didn’t put ourselves in that position.

LOL, now who sounds entitled? Do you honestly think we put ourselves in this position on purpose? LOL, oh the irony. You aren’t one of those who transferred off your original creation world to find a “better” WvW server, are you?

Why are you posting on a T8 thread anyways? Troll much? Just because what we are experiencing means nothing to you does not make our points invalid. So you coming here and stating these things on a T8 thread that has nothing to do with you just shows what kind of class you have.

Please, if you do not want to hear our complaints about the system, stay off our threads and do not read them. Very simple. However if you continue coming onto our threads with this junk it will just show you for what you are, a troll.

No, been on the same server since launch. Through good times and guild exoduses.

And I’m posting on a tier 8 thread because it’s in a public WvW forum for the entire game, and I have input to give.
If you don’t want people from other tiers posting in it, you should go post it on your server’s forum (If you have one).

But, alas, this is the way public forums work.

And yes, I do think you put yourself in this situation on purpose. You have options.
You have had an ample amount of time to find a new home if tier 8 is so unplayable for you. I’m all for server loyalty and not bandwagoning away when things get tough, but when the reality of the game is that YOUR TIER IS BROKEN, it’s okay to find a new home that satisfies your WvW needs.

Good for you, I like hearing about people who stayed on their creation world. T8 is playable for me, nobody is talking about playability (like my new word?). And as for you coming here with your input, making fun of others as you have done and making no contribution to the actual conversation if the thread is trolling by definition. (In Internet slang, a troll (pron.: /?tro?l/, /?tr?l/) is someone who posts inflammatory,¹ extraneous, or off-topic messages in an online community, such as a forum, chat room, or blog, with the primary intent of provoking readers into an emotional response² or of otherwise disrupting normal on-topic discussion)

As you just stated, T8 is BROKE. Guess what genius? That means it needs fixing. not ignoring, which is what you suggest. How can you suggest we put ourselves in this place yet you also admit the system is broken?

EnRohbi.2187:

And I’m posting on a tier 8 thread because it’s in a public WvW forum for the entire game, and I have input to give.

Input from someone who admits to having no understanding of the situation, sounds like a train wreck in the happening.

Cantur Soulfyre.5409:

EnRohbi.2187:

Cantur Soulfyre.5409:

EnRohbi.2187:

No, higher tiers don’t know how it FEELS because we know it sucks so we didn’t put ourselves in that position.

LOL, now who sounds entitled? Do you honestly think we put ourselves in this position on purpose? LOL, oh the irony. You aren’t one of those who transferred off your original creation world to find a “better” WvW server, are you?

Why are you posting on a T8 thread anyways? Troll much? Just because what we are experiencing means nothing to you does not make our points invalid. So you coming here and stating these things on a T8 thread that has nothing to do with you just shows what kind of class you have.

Please, if you do not want to hear our complaints about the system, stay off our threads and do not read them. Very simple. However if you continue coming onto our threads with this junk it will just show you for what you are, a troll.

No, been on the same server since launch. Through good times and guild exoduses.

And I’m posting on a tier 8 thread because it’s in a public WvW forum for the entire game, and I have input to give.
If you don’t want people from other tiers posting in it, you should go post it on your server’s forum (If you have one).

But, alas, this is the way public forums work.

And yes, I do think you put yourself in this situation on purpose. You have options.
You have had an ample amount of time to find a new home if tier 8 is so unplayable for you. I’m all for server loyalty and not bandwagoning away when things get tough, but when the reality of the game is that YOUR TIER IS BROKEN, it’s okay to find a new home that satisfies your WvW needs.

Good for you, I like hearing about people who stayed on their creation world. T8 is playable for me, nobody is talking about playability (like my new word?). And as for you coming here with your input, making fun of others as you have done and making no contribution to the actual conversation if the thread is trolling by definition. (In Internet slang, a troll (pron.: /?tro?l/, /?tr?l/) is someone who posts inflammatory,¹ extraneous, or off-topic messages in an online community, such as a forum, chat room, or blog, with the primary intent of provoking readers into an emotional response² or of otherwise disrupting normal on-topic discussion)

As you just stated, T8 is BROKE. Guess what genius? That means it needs fixing. not ignoring, which is what you suggest. How can you suggest we put ourselves in this place yet you also admit the system is broken?

I didn’t make fun of anyone,
And I actually did make a contribution,
I gave you suggestions about what to do.

Just because you’ve chosen to disregard what I had to say doesn’t mean I didn’t have anything to say. And it certainly doesn’t make me a troll.

Having a broken system and putting yourself in a bad situation are not mutually exclusive in this case. In fact, with the exception of responding to people who have nothing better to say except that I’m a troll or that I have no business posting in a tier 8 thread (All off-topic or “extraneous” in themselves), I have not posted anything off topic in this thread.

Doesn’t that make you the troll?

LOL, notice this guy won’t respond to anyone but me? Because all he can do is defend not being a troll because he is contributing nothing to the actual conversation here so he doesn’t respond to anyone else.

Well, at least he admitted the tier is broken. That’s a start, that’s a change. Someone realizes its not a matter of skill, its not even necessarily a matter of numbers causing the frustration, its a matter of an undeniable fact that the ratings here a broken, that Glicko2 cannot manage tier 8 like it does every other tier, and that unless fixed it probably never will. Every single person who accepts reality and admits that this tier is broken counts in having us heard by ArenaNet, and at least he did bump the thread for us with his posts.

Now if only we could hear from ArenaNet. With the sheer volume of tier 8 posts, unanimous complaints on the issue, and even growing support from various people in higher tiers, even posts by someone from a completely different tier about the topic in a different forum entirely, I’m sure they’ve HEARD by now. We await the REPLY. I hope they’re not waiting on this march patch as if its gonna magically fix things, because its obvious at this point it won’t.

More incentives for WvW /=/ fixing broken ratings and server advancement rates in tier 8.

Detharos.3157:

Honestly, I can’t understand why there’s constantly someone dropping this obligatory “Whoever drops down is gonna dominate anyways”. Currently SF is untested in how it would fair in its full power against tier 7 in a rematch, so just because they dominated doesn’t neccesarily mean other tier 7 servers would.

BUT..

Even if they would dominate, that is really not the issue or the complaint at all. The complaint of tier 8 is always simply how long a dominating server takes to advance. How would those of you in tier 7-2 feel if a server in your tier could dominate you with 300k-400k+(in comparison to your 140k-ish score or whatever) scores every week, possessing the numbers two suppress both its competitors in their own borderlands AND control EB/press one other map simultaneously, and despite this disparity this server was stuck in your tier for 2-3 MONTHS. That’s the problem. You don’t know how it feels, and you never will know how it feels unless you drop here. Servers that dominate in your brackets like that advance within ONE WEEK. Here it can take up to a quarter year with the same server. Get it? Sorrow’s Furnace is not enjoying this. Ferguson’s Crossing is not enjoying this. Eredon Terrace is not enjoying this. ALL THREE of us are complaining about a legitimate issue.

Drop the misconception already. We have no issue with Sorrow’s Furnace. This is not a server issue. Bit by bit we’ve even started to become friends on the forums due to this Glicko junkhole. What if HoD dropped down and dominated us even HARDER than SF and advanced back up within a week, and this trend constantly continued forever with various tier 7 servers like what can happen in other tiers, where advancement doesn’t take months? We would actually be A LOT LESS frustrated because the functionality would be working here just as it does in higher tiers. At least we would get to truly put to the test whether the other tier 7 servers can hold their ground or not rather than operating purely off speculation. And if we were that weak even in our prime largest showings in WvWvW, we would happily accept it because we would of gotten to put it to test with more than just tier 6/tier 5/tier 3 WvWvW showings. Consider also the fact that we SCORED BETTER against the tier 5 and tier 3 level showings of both Devona’s Rest and Kaineng than tier 7 did. Don’t you think us having at least a new shot against a new server in tier 8 every three weeks at least or so would be fair? But we never get that opportunity in a timely fashion, unlike those of you in higher tiers. So, can you really not understand what the complaint is? Why should EVERY OTHER TIER (except tier 1, but at least they have the option to purposely drop DOWN if they don’t like it.) enjoy the privilege of having servers dominating like SF does advancing in as little as a week, two weeks tops while it takes many months here, and increasingly more every time more points get sucked out of tier 8 by the advancing server?

We don’t want tier 8 servers to be bumped up, we’re not asking to pick and choose who gets bumped down, we’re asking in a very reasonable fashion to have advancement to tier 7 and drops from tier 7 to work at in the very least COMPARABLE rates to other tiers. You people in higher tiers would be yelling the same crap twice as loud as us if it happened in your tiers, that’s the irony in all of this. So kitten stop trying to drown out our voices and legitimate complaints with “You will always be dominated by whoever drops”, that’s a non factor in our frustrations to begin with, and has never even had the chance to be adequately tested outside a single server in the case of Sorrow’s Furnace. After all as I made clear earlier, Devona’s Rest and Kaineng were very different case.

What’s it to you if whoever drops down here dominates anyways? If our complaints annoy you higher tier people, than do both of us a favor and keep your sorry hides somewhere else while you pass by the 20 minutes of your fail queues. At this point I’m even starting to think you guys just want to block all changes to this tier because you’re scared that one of these days with an unpredictable population shift your servers could fall in here, and maybe think that with us down here you’re safe from that.

Because we saw ET on the way down to T8 and their population is where they belong.
You seem very angry about something i care little about, all im saying is you two arent wvw servers, and most likely wont ever be. and to the other people, theres at least 2 threads a week about SF or T8 problems. Theres 2 threads up right now.

EnRohbi.2187:

I didn’t make fun of anyone,
And I actually did make a contribution,
I gave you suggestions about what to do.

Just because you’ve chosen to disregard what I had to say doesn’t mean I didn’t have anything to say. And it certainly doesn’t make me a troll.

Having a broken system and putting yourself in a bad situation are not mutually exclusive in this case. In fact, with the exception of responding to people who have nothing better to say except that I’m a troll or that I have no business posting in a tier 8 thread (All off-topic or "extraneous" in themselves), I have not posted anything off topic in this thread.

Doesn’t that make you the troll?

you are telling us that we put ourselves in this situation.
you are telling us the system is broken.
you are telling us to run away from the problem.

i joined ET with no knowledge of WvW. i didn’t start messing with it at all for at least a month. now i have a guild, friends, etc. i am not gonna pull up my roots and RUN AWAY from the problem like a coward. it’s BROKEN (by your own admission), and i expect it fixed.

it’s broken. let that sink in... cuz i think that even tho you’re agreeing its broken, i don’t think you truely understand what that means. there is a tier of WvW that is currently fundamentally screwed up so bad that it’s a black hole of despair. SF is currently owning by nearly DOUBLE OUR COMBINED SCORE... and will STILL not pull out of the tier any time soon... unless someone ELSE drops into the tier.

running away from the problem does nothing to FIX the problem. all it does is exacerbate it... make it worse... spread the problem to OTHER servers.

you coming in here and flippantly saying "phht. whats the big deal, just transfer. its your own fault" is crass, rude, uncalled for, and WRONG. so please, take your opinion, wad it up in a little ball, and shove in in a place that will garner me an infraction if i describe it in detail, because you are NOT helping.

imalog.7689:

Detharos.3157:

Honestly, I can’t understand why there’s constantly someone dropping this obligatory “Whoever drops down is gonna dominate anyways”. Currently SF is untested in how it would fair in its full power against tier 7 in a rematch, so just because they dominated doesn’t neccesarily mean other tier 7 servers would.

BUT..

Even if they would dominate, that is really not the issue or the complaint at all. The complaint of tier 8 is always simply how long a dominating server takes to advance. How would those of you in tier 7-2 feel if a server in your tier could dominate you with 300k-400k+(in comparison to your 140k-ish score or whatever) scores every week, possessing the numbers two suppress both its competitors in their own borderlands AND control EB/press one other map simultaneously, and despite this disparity this server was stuck in your tier for 2-3 MONTHS. That’s the problem. You don’t know how it feels, and you never will know how it feels unless you drop here. Servers that dominate in your brackets like that advance within ONE WEEK. Here it can take up to a quarter year with the same server. Get it? Sorrow’s Furnace is not enjoying this. Ferguson’s Crossing is not enjoying this. Eredon Terrace is not enjoying this. ALL THREE of us are complaining about a legitimate issue.

Drop the misconception already. We have no issue with Sorrow’s Furnace. This is not a server issue. Bit by bit we’ve even started to become friends on the forums due to this Glicko junkhole. What if HoD dropped down and dominated us even HARDER than SF and advanced back up within a week, and this trend constantly continued forever with various tier 7 servers like what can happen in other tiers, where advancement doesn’t take months? We would actually be A LOT LESS frustrated because the functionality would be working here just as it does in higher tiers. At least we would get to truly put to the test whether the other tier 7 servers can hold their ground or not rather than operating purely off speculation. And if we were that weak even in our prime largest showings in WvWvW, we would happily accept it because we would of gotten to put it to test with more than just tier 6/tier 5/tier 3 WvWvW showings. Consider also the fact that we SCORED BETTER against the tier 5 and tier 3 level showings of both Devona’s Rest and Kaineng than tier 7 did. Don’t you think us having at least a new shot against a new server in tier 8 every three weeks at least or so would be fair? But we never get that opportunity in a timely fashion, unlike those of you in higher tiers. So, can you really not understand what the complaint is? Why should EVERY OTHER TIER (except tier 1, but at least they have the option to purposely drop DOWN if they don’t like it.) enjoy the privilege of having servers dominating like SF does advancing in as little as a week, two weeks tops while it takes many months here, and increasingly more every time more points get sucked out of tier 8 by the advancing server?

We don’t want tier 8 servers to be bumped up, we’re not asking to pick and choose who gets bumped down, we’re asking in a very reasonable fashion to have advancement to tier 7 and drops from tier 7 to work at in the very least COMPARABLE rates to other tiers. You people in higher tiers would be yelling the same crap twice as loud as us if it happened in your tiers, that’s the irony in all of this. So kitten stop trying to drown out our voices and legitimate complaints with “You will always be dominated by whoever drops”, that’s a non factor in our frustrations to begin with, and has never even had the chance to be adequately tested outside a single server in the case of Sorrow’s Furnace. After all as I made clear earlier, Devona’s Rest and Kaineng were very different case.

What’s it to you if whoever drops down here dominates anyways? If our complaints annoy you higher tier people, than do both of us a favor and keep your sorry hides somewhere else while you pass by the 20 minutes of your fail queues. At this point I’m even starting to think you guys just want to block all changes to this tier because you’re scared that one of these days with an unpredictable population shift your servers could fall in here, and maybe think that with us down here you’re safe from that.

Because we saw ET on the way down to T8 and their population is where they belong.
You seem very angry about something i care little about, and to the other people, theres at least 2 threads a week about SF or T8 problems. Theres 2 threads up right now.

Check the date on this thread, its an old one not a new one. It makes more sense to use an older one rather than creating more doesn’t it, or bumping the others? This one also has that convenient ArenaNet post marker on it, I think we should stick to this one now.

Cantur Soulfyre.5409:

LOL, notice this guy won’t respond to anyone but me? Because all he can do is defend not being a troll because he is contributing nothing to the actual conversation here so he doesn’t respond to anyone else.

I’ll give you a hint about my forum-going methods.
I don’t look at the names of people who post.

Until you pointed it out, I didn’t even realize I was responding to the same person every time. I already gave my input to the conversation, something that nobody has even acknowledged except to call me a troll or otherwise attack me because I don’t believe Anet should waste their time and money fixing a problem that effects only a very small minority of the wvw population in this game.

I stand by my “self entitled” opinion.
Anyone who doesn’t think Anet should make tier 8 their top priority is a “troll” and not contributing anything.

EnRohbi.2187:

Cantur Soulfyre.5409:

LOL, notice this guy won’t respond to anyone but me? Because all he can do is defend not being a troll because he is contributing nothing to the actual conversation here so he doesn’t respond to anyone else.

I’ll give you a hint about my forum-going methods.
I don’t look at the names of people who post.

Until you pointed it out, I didn’t even realize I was responding to the same person every time. I already gave my input to the conversation, something that nobody has even acknowledged except to call me a troll or otherwise attack me because I don’t believe Anet should waste their time and money fixing a problem that effects only a very small minority of the wvw population in this game.

I stand by my “self entitled” opinion.
Anyone who doesn’t think Anet should make tier 8 their top priority is a “troll” and not contributing anything.

Forget whether its their top priority or not, it would do us wonders just to hear a single reply from ArenaNet representatives on the topic.

T8 has their feeling hurt?
Accusing us of putting ourselves into a broken system?
Calling someone self-entitled?

That is making fun of people sir. You said all of that in your posts.

Your suggestion are not to the topic and do not fix the broken system (which you admitted to).

And I did not disregard what you had to say, I just do not respond to someone who is making no contribution to the actual conversation (not the conversation you are trying to make with junk posts). They are mutually exclusive because I didn’t put the broken system into place.

Topic: Points Extremely Scewed

Please, kindly point out what you had in your posts that addresses that topic. (Besides admitting the system is broken)

Nice try on the troll-reversal, sad tactic. You are just avoiding answering the real questions here.

Plus, how sad is it that you think people who pay for a game to enjoy it should be discounted just because the broken system only affects the minority?

I am sure you have never had a problem with this game and wanted something fixed?

Cantur Soulfyre.5409:

T8 has their feeling hurt?
Accusing us of putting ourselves into a broken system?
Calling someone self-entitled?

That is making fun of people sir. You said all of that in your posts.

Your suggestion are not to the topic and do not fix the broken system (which you admitted to).

And I did not disregard what you had to say, I just do not respond to someone who is making no contribution to the actual conversation (not the conversation you are trying to make with junk posts). They are mutually exclusive because I didn’t put the broken system into place.

Topic: Points Extremely Scewed

Please, kindly point out what you had in your posts that addresses that topic. (Besides admitting the system is broken)

Nice try on the troll-reversal, sad tactic. You are just avoiding answering the real questions here.

For someone who doesn’t respond to someone who is making no contribution to the actual conversation (Verbatim what you said), you have already derailed the thread enough to get the whole thing locked.

Please, kindly point out what you had in your posts that addresses that topic. (Besides admitting the system is broken)

I’m going to completely ignore how you’ve NOT ONLY pointed out what I said that addresses the topic, but then proceed to tell me I can’t use it as an example.

-I said tier 8 is broken
-I suggested that players on tier 8 take into consideration whether server loyalty or having fun in WvW is more important, and to transfer if they choose the latter
-I explained that Anet is not going to prioritize tier 8 because there is simply not enough of their wvw playerbase in tier 8 to warrant them addressing it before the countless other issues with WvW and GW2 in general.

Then I had you calling me a troll in every.single.subsequent.post (Including the most recent that I am responding to now).
Just because you’ve never dealt with someone who’s a little blunt doesn’t mean they’re a troll.

One thing that I always see posted as a fix is that Anet put a floor so servers in T8 wont go below, but wont that just push all the other servers up higher and just revert back to what we have now after the higher tiers gain more points.
I mean the match did start out at 0 and given the time if you make the floor 1,000 seems like it would only be a matter of time before the situation would just repeat itself.

FilthyRat.4652:

One thing that I always see posted as a fix is that Anet put a floor so servers in T8 wont go below, but wont that just push all the other servers up higher and just revert back to what we have now after the higher tiers gain more points.
I mean the match did start out at 0 and given the time if you make the floor 1,000 seems like it would only be a matter of time before the situation would just repeat itself.

FilthyRat, take a look at the EU ratings, the exact same thing happens with tier 9 and their tier 8 reflects scores of the other tiers more closely, just like tier 7. Yet I doubt their tier 8 is signifcantly stronger than ours.

So it seems this problem will only inevitably happen with the “Floor” of the tiers the final tier in a ranking, in this case tier 8. It is a Glicko2 math issue that occurs in a tier where there is nowhere to fall to, if there was a tier 9 and three new servers we would probably magically get ratings that would enable us to access tier 7 as readily as they can access tier 6 rather than current disparity.

So one thing that could be done is to establish an artificial tier, for example creating a “Tier 9” in NA and “Tier 10” in EU, only fill them with ghost servers where accounts cannot be created or played, ghost servers that exist simply to take the rating hit. Call them “Tier Ghost” or something like that. This is assuming that there are no mathematical algorithms that could be added in to make it work.

Basically, an artificial tier with artificial servers to take the artificial ratings gap that we otherwise have to suffer.

Cantur Soulfyre.5409:

LOL, I believe you would be missed by someone(s) on SF if you transferred.

Wait there are definitely some that I would miss if they transferred out, unless they came over to the Dark side.

Detharos.3157:

FilthyRat.4652:

One thing that I always see posted as a fix is that Anet put a floor so servers in T8 wont go below, but wont that just push all the other servers up higher and just revert back to what we have now after the higher tiers gain more points.
I mean the match did start out at 0 and given the time if you make the floor 1,000 seems like it would only be a matter of time before the situation would just repeat itself.

FilthyRat, take a look at the EU ratings, the exact same thing happens with tier 9 and their tier 8 reflects scores of the other tiers more closely, just like tier 7. Yet I doubt their tier 8 is signifcantly stronger than ours.

So it seems this problem will only inevitably happen with the “Floor” of the tiers the final tier in a ranking, in this case tier 8. It is a Glicko2 math issue that occurs in a tier where there is nowhere to fall to, if there was a tier 9 and three new servers we would probably magically get ratings that would enable us to access tier 7 as readily as they can access tier 6 rather than current disparity.

So one thing that could be done is to establish an artificial tier, for example creating a “Tier 9” in NA and “Tier 10” in EU, only fill them with ghost servers where accounts cannot be created or played, ghost servers that exist simply to take the rating hit. Call them “Tier Ghost” or something like that. This is assuming that there are no mathematical algorithms that could be added in to make it work.

Basically, an artificial tier with artificial servers to take the artificial ratings gap that we otherwise have to suffer.

Oh yes I see that I was under the impression people just wanted to put a numerical floor of 1,000 pts.

FilthyRat.4652:

Detharos.3157:

FilthyRat.4652:

One thing that I always see posted as a fix is that Anet put a floor so servers in T8 wont go below, but wont that just push all the other servers up higher and just revert back to what we have now after the higher tiers gain more points.
I mean the match did start out at 0 and given the time if you make the floor 1,000 seems like it would only be a matter of time before the situation would just repeat itself.

FilthyRat, take a look at the EU ratings, the exact same thing happens with tier 9 and their tier 8 reflects scores of the other tiers more closely, just like tier 7. Yet I doubt their tier 8 is signifcantly stronger than ours.

So it seems this problem will only inevitably happen with the “Floor” of the tiers the final tier in a ranking, in this case tier 8. It is a Glicko2 math issue that occurs in a tier where there is nowhere to fall to, if there was a tier 9 and three new servers we would probably magically get ratings that would enable us to access tier 7 as readily as they can access tier 6 rather than current disparity.

So one thing that could be done is to establish an artificial tier, for example creating a “Tier 9” in NA and “Tier 10” in EU, only fill them with ghost servers where accounts cannot be created or played, ghost servers that exist simply to take the rating hit. Call them “Tier Ghost” or something like that. This is assuming that there are no mathematical algorithms that could be added in to make it work.

Basically, an artificial tier with artificial servers to take the artificial ratings gap that we otherwise have to suffer.

Oh yes I see that I was under the impression people just wanted to put a numerical floor of 1,000 pts.

The problem with creating a numerical floor is, you would have to create a numerical roof as well for ratings to not get sucked up into higher tiers, and probably end up having to create a numerical floor and roof for every single tier from tier 8 all the way to tier 1.

Which would probably be a great long-term permanent solution to balancing tiers quickly if done like that, but I’m sure the servers that are proud of their bloated ratings would detest such a proposal and spam all kinds of ridiculous complaints on the forums, so rather its probably better just to stick to fixing tier 8 only at this time. :/

Heck, having “Rating roof” alone in every tier rather than a “rating floor” might actually work also.

Huge props to Detharos for speaking up for us in tier 8.

It’s a shame so many people from higher tiers feel the need to come here and speak like this. I personally chose SF when I got the game because of real life friends, I didn’t even know what wvw was. Now you’re saying I have to pay 20g just to have a wvw experience on par with everyone elses? That’s on top of leaving my guild as well.

Telling us to cry about it because we’re only tier 8 isn’t a solution, it’s just insulting. If we all just keep transferring to a different tier, the problems will still be there and eventually start effecting the higher tiers.

Detharos.3157:

The problem with creating a numerical floor is, you would have to create a numerical roof as well for ratings to not get sucked up into higher tiers, and probably end up having to create a numerical floor and roof for every single tier from tier 8 all the way to tier 1.

Which would probably be a great long-term permanent solution to balancing tiers quickly if done like that, but I’m sure the servers that are proud of their bloated ratings would detest such a proposal and spam all kinds of ridiculous complaints on the forums, so rather its probably better just to stick to fixing tier 8 only at this time. :/

Heck, having “Rating roof” alone in every tier rather than a “rating floor” might actually work also.

You have 2 Problems:

The first is that Transfers Artificially Altered the numbers.

This may have given a vastly low number to T8 specifically, because as a server that got an influx of people went to pull out, it would have had to start at where Glicko thought it was, and then pound till it pulled out, as Glicko corrected where it belonged. In this case, it’s first pull out is the hardest, and as such, T8 takes the largest hit.

Had they not had free transfers, the Glicko system would have been better, and the numbers may have been inherently closer or at least reflect where some tiers should be.

To give that real numbers: ET and FC are now rated at 600 point worlds. However, a good chunk of their damage was done by Kaineng puling out, hence why SF lost 150 points when they came here at first. Had Kaineng not received an influx of serious WvWvW players, then FC and ET would be hovering much higher and SF would not have taken the loss it took upon coming here.

So, the reality is, ET and FC might be closer to 800 even 900 point worlds, which would mean that SF is really a 1200 point world, but, because of the Transfers damage was done. Now many worlds might be also affected by this, but because they can move down and up, they can be rectified faster as they face different and new opponents, ET and FC can’t, because they can’t move about.

The Second Problem is lack of Options. We only have 24 worlds, and need to make up teams of 3. That means the top 3 worlds will fight, no matter how lop sided that match is, the bottom 3 will fight, again, no matter what or how imbalanced they are.

Same for worlds 4,5,6, or 19, 20, 21. They will fight, no matter how lop sided the score is, and because it is a code doing the work, it does not take into account the effects of tedium on a score, or anything else. Just World 21 will fight World 19 and 20. End of discussion.

So build better matches, Glicko needs more worlds to work with, and more stability among those worlds for things to work their way out.

A floor, would be a type of fix, but more a band aid then a fix. They really should have stuck with the plan to re-set everything after the free transfers were done, and that would be best solution.

Why they really chickened out on that, no one knows but them, but I personally feel that they really dropped the ball doing so.

Detharos.3157:

imalog.7689:

Detharos.3157:

Honestly, I can’t understand why there’s constantly someone dropping this obligatory “Whoever drops down is gonna dominate anyways”. Currently SF is untested in how it would fair in its full power against tier 7 in a rematch, so just because they dominated doesn’t neccesarily mean other tier 7 servers would.

BUT..

Even if they would dominate, that is really not the issue or the complaint at all. The complaint of tier 8 is always simply how long a dominating server takes to advance. How would those of you in tier 7-2 feel if a server in your tier could dominate you with 300k-400k+(in comparison to your 140k-ish score or whatever) scores every week, possessing the numbers two suppress both its competitors in their own borderlands AND control EB/press one other map simultaneously, and despite this disparity this server was stuck in your tier for 2-3 MONTHS. That’s the problem. You don’t know how it feels, and you never will know how it feels unless you drop here. Servers that dominate in your brackets like that advance within ONE WEEK. Here it can take up to a quarter year with the same server. Get it? Sorrow’s Furnace is not enjoying this. Ferguson’s Crossing is not enjoying this. Eredon Terrace is not enjoying this. ALL THREE of us are complaining about a legitimate issue.

Drop the misconception already. We have no issue with Sorrow’s Furnace. This is not a server issue. Bit by bit we’ve even started to become friends on the forums due to this Glicko junkhole. What if HoD dropped down and dominated us even HARDER than SF and advanced back up within a week, and this trend constantly continued forever with various tier 7 servers like what can happen in other tiers, where advancement doesn’t take months? We would actually be A LOT LESS frustrated because the functionality would be working here just as it does in higher tiers. At least we would get to truly put to the test whether the other tier 7 servers can hold their ground or not rather than operating purely off speculation. And if we were that weak even in our prime largest showings in WvWvW, we would happily accept it because we would of gotten to put it to test with more than just tier 6/tier 5/tier 3 WvWvW showings. Consider also the fact that we SCORED BETTER against the tier 5 and tier 3 level showings of both Devona’s Rest and Kaineng than tier 7 did. Don’t you think us having at least a new shot against a new server in tier 8 every three weeks at least or so would be fair? But we never get that opportunity in a timely fashion, unlike those of you in higher tiers. So, can you really not understand what the complaint is? Why should EVERY OTHER TIER (except tier 1, but at least they have the option to purposely drop DOWN if they don’t like it.) enjoy the privilege of having servers dominating like SF does advancing in as little as a week, two weeks tops while it takes many months here, and increasingly more every time more points get sucked out of tier 8 by the advancing server?

We don’t want tier 8 servers to be bumped up, we’re not asking to pick and choose who gets bumped down, we’re asking in a very reasonable fashion to have advancement to tier 7 and drops from tier 7 to work at in the very least COMPARABLE rates to other tiers. You people in higher tiers would be yelling the same crap twice as loud as us if it happened in your tiers, that’s the irony in all of this. So kitten stop trying to drown out our voices and legitimate complaints with “You will always be dominated by whoever drops”, that’s a non factor in our frustrations to begin with, and has never even had the chance to be adequately tested outside a single server in the case of Sorrow’s Furnace. After all as I made clear earlier, Devona’s Rest and Kaineng were very different case.

What’s it to you if whoever drops down here dominates anyways? If our complaints annoy you higher tier people, than do both of us a favor and keep your sorry hides somewhere else while you pass by the 20 minutes of your fail queues. At this point I’m even starting to think you guys just want to block all changes to this tier because you’re scared that one of these days with an unpredictable population shift your servers could fall in here, and maybe think that with us down here you’re safe from that.

Because we saw ET on the way down to T8 and their population is where they belong.
You seem very angry about something i care little about, and to the other people, theres at least 2 threads a week about SF or T8 problems. Theres 2 threads up right now.

Check the date on this thread, its an old one not a new one. It makes more sense to use an older one rather than creating more doesn’t it, or bumping the others? This one also has that convenient ArenaNet post marker on it, I think we should stick to this one now.

nah t8 frustration thread is where its at.

EnRohbi.2187:

-I explained that Anet is not going to prioritize tier 8 because there is simply not enough of their wvw playerbase in tier 8 to warrant them addressing it before the countless other issues with WvW and GW2 in general.

Then I had you calling me a troll in every.single.subsequent.post (Including the most recent that I am responding to now).
Just because you’ve never dealt with someone who’s a little blunt doesn’t mean they’re a troll.

Mostly just because I’m curious, do you have some sort of insight into what exactly ArenaNet prioritizes? Some sort of source in the company? Because I’m sure the rest of us would love to be enlightened as to exactly how ANet makes decisions. You should share some of that knowledge.

No? Then it’s just speculation, and speculation isn’t a substitute for facts. You don’t know what Anet is going to do anymore than any of us other schlubs. And being blunt doesn’t make you right, in any case.

EnRohbi.2187:

I’m going to completely ignore how you’ve NOT ONLY pointed out what I said that addresses the topic, but then proceed to tell me I can’t use it as an example.

-I said tier 8 is broken
-I suggested that players on tier 8 take into consideration whether server loyalty or having fun in WvW is more important, and to transfer if they choose the latter
-I explained that Anet is not going to prioritize tier 8 because there is simply not enough of their wvw playerbase in tier 8 to warrant them addressing it before the countless other issues with WvW and GW2 in general.

Then I had you calling me a troll in every.single.subsequent.post (Including the most recent that I am responding to now).
Just because you’ve never dealt with someone who’s a little blunt doesn’t mean they’re a troll.

OK, the first one is on topic, that is true. My apologies.

The rest do not address the topic or the broken system that causes the topic, so ya, not on topic.

And again, you are still only addressing me in all your posts and not the others who have replied to your posts. So, again, guess what definition that falls under?

I never take exception to actual contribution to the topic (hence the apology up there) but I will point out that you are bringing absolutely nothing to the table besides admitting it is broken. Telling everyone that they put themselves into a broken system on purpose doesn’t even make sense, let alone it is off-topic. Being blunt? Maybe, but your bluntness is part of your problem especially when it is not on topic.

I am getting tired of this. Please actually reply to the other folks who replied to you and stay on topic this time. Topic: Tier 8 Points Extremely Scewed

Cantur Soulfyre.5409:

Plus, how sad is it that you think people who pay for a game to enjoy it should be discounted just because the broken system only affects the minority?

I am sure you have never had a problem with this game and wanted something fixed?

You can also try answering these questions I already asked of you…

geekanerd.4123:

EnRohbi.2187:

-I explained that Anet is not going to prioritize tier 8 because there is simply not enough of their wvw playerbase in tier 8 to warrant them addressing it before the countless other issues with WvW and GW2 in general.

Then I had you calling me a troll in every.single.subsequent.post (Including the most recent that I am responding to now).
Just because you’ve never dealt with someone who’s a little blunt doesn’t mean they’re a troll.

Mostly just because I’m curious, do you have some sort of insight into what exactly ArenaNet prioritizes? Some sort of source in the company? Because I’m sure the rest of us would love to be enlightened as to exactly how ANet makes decisions. You should share some of that knowledge.

No? Then it’s just speculation, and speculation isn’t a substitute for facts. You don’t know what Anet is going to do anymore than any of us other schlubs. And being blunt doesn’t make you right, in any case.

If you had a game with bugs and problems in just about every single aspect of the entire thing. What would you fix first? The issues that affect everyone, or the issues that affect like 5% of the playerbase?
No, I do not know for a stated fact that Anet will not prioritize tier 8, but they would be foolish to do so when there are so many other areas of the game that need to be fixed first.

Also,
If anyone in tier 8 actually looked at the ratings lately,
They would see SF gaining 40-50 points this week, and being less than 100 ratings points away from HoD’s score.
The system is balancing itself out, just as it should.

But of course, after a few weeks of HoD steamrolling tier 8, you’ll all be back here complaining about that too.

Cantur Soulfyre.5409:

OK, the first one is on topic, that is true. My apologies.

The rest do not address the topic or the broken system that causes the topic, so ya, not on topic.

And again, you are still only addressing me in all your posts and not the others who have replied to your posts. So, again, guess what definition that falls under?

I never take exception to actual contribution to the topic (hence the apology up there) but I will point out that you are bringing absolutely nothing to the table besides admitting it is broken. Telling everyone that they put themselves into a broken system on purpose doesn’t even make sense, let alone it is off-topic. Being blunt? Maybe, but your bluntness is part of your problem especially when it is not on topic.

I am getting tired of this. Please actually reply to the other folks who replied to you and stay on topic this time. Topic: Tier 8 Points Extremely Scewed

You’re still sitting there doing nothing but picking apart my posts and how I choose to present them.
You are being more off-topic than I am, so how about you go ahead and try to keep it focused?

EnRohbi.2187:

If you had a game with bugs and problems in just about every single aspect of the entire thing. What would you fix first? The issues that affect everyone, or the issues that affect like 5% of the playerbase?
No, I do not know for a stated fact that Anet will not prioritize tier 8, but they would be foolish to do so when there are so many other areas of the game that need to be fixed first.

Also,
If anyone in tier 8 actually looked at the ratings lately,
They would see SF gaining 40-50 points this week, and being less than 100 ratings points away from HoD’s score.
The system is balancing itself out, just as it should.

But of course, after a few weeks of HoD steamrolling tier 8, you’ll all be back here complaining about that too.

Do you know what you are typing? First, the system balancing itself out is taking over 3 MONTHS. That is not just as it should unless you know specifically that Anet intended this?

And if it happens to HoD, is your solution for all of them to transfer also? That is not fixing anything and you know it. You are just arguing for the sake of arguing.

EnRohbi.2187:

geekanerd.4123:

EnRohbi.2187:

-I explained that Anet is not going to prioritize tier 8 because there is simply not enough of their wvw playerbase in tier 8 to warrant them addressing it before the countless other issues with WvW and GW2 in general.

Then I had you calling me a troll in every.single.subsequent.post (Including the most recent that I am responding to now).
Just because you’ve never dealt with someone who’s a little blunt doesn’t mean they’re a troll.

Mostly just because I’m curious, do you have some sort of insight into what exactly ArenaNet prioritizes? Some sort of source in the company? Because I’m sure the rest of us would love to be enlightened as to exactly how ANet makes decisions. You should share some of that knowledge.

No? Then it’s just speculation, and speculation isn’t a substitute for facts. You don’t know what Anet is going to do anymore than any of us other schlubs. And being blunt doesn’t make you right, in any case.

If you had a game with bugs and problems in just about every single aspect of the entire thing. What would you fix first? The issues that affect everyone, or the issues that affect like 5% of the playerbase?
No, I do not know for a stated fact that Anet will not prioritize tier 8, but they would be foolish to do so when there are so many other areas of the game that need to be fixed first.

Also,
If anyone in tier 8 actually looked at the ratings lately,
They would see SF gaining 40-50 points this week, and being less than 100 ratings points away from HoD’s score.
The system is balancing itself out, just as it should.

But of course, after a few weeks of HoD steamrolling tier 8, you’ll all be back here complaining about that too.

Cantur Soulfyre.5409:

OK, the first one is on topic, that is true. My apologies.

The rest do not address the topic or the broken system that causes the topic, so ya, not on topic.

And again, you are still only addressing me in all your posts and not the others who have replied to your posts. So, again, guess what definition that falls under?

I never take exception to actual contribution to the topic (hence the apology up there) but I will point out that you are bringing absolutely nothing to the table besides admitting it is broken. Telling everyone that they put themselves into a broken system on purpose doesn’t even make sense, let alone it is off-topic. Being blunt? Maybe, but your bluntness is part of your problem especially when it is not on topic.

I am getting tired of this. Please actually reply to the other folks who replied to you and stay on topic this time. Topic: Tier 8 Points Extremely Scewed

You’re still sitting there doing nothing but picking apart my posts and how I choose to present them.
You are being more off-topic than I am, so how about you go ahead and try to keep it focused?

Still not answering direct questions, I wonder why. (Well, I really do not wonder why. I think we ALL know why.)

The mistake you’re making is that you believe these issues are mutually exclusive of one another. I’ve seen no evidence to the contrary that people can fix general game bugs and also work on this issue in Tier 8. ArenaNet has more than two people as employees. More than three, even.

Ah, who am I kidding? We haven’t even gotten a response out of them in three months of kittening. Maybe they can’t work on different things at the same time. Maybe during WvWvW Wednesdays everybody at ANet calls in sick. Everybody shows up for ‘Pushing Products on the BLTC’ Thursdays, apparently. So maybe you’re right and I’m wrong. Still, I have a glimmer of hope that, indeed, they are capable of working on different things simultaneously.

Though, you’re little HoD Steamrolling comment is both ignorant of the issue and oddly right on all at the same time. We’d love to get steamrolled by HoD. It means something is working as it is should. Though I’m with Detharos in believing that HoD dropping into T8 isn’t an automatic win for HoD. But I guess we’ll never know at this juncture, eh? Oh, see? That’s the problem.

Cantur Soulfyre.5409:

EnRohbi.2187:

If you had a game with bugs and problems in just about every single aspect of the entire thing. What would you fix first? The issues that affect everyone, or the issues that affect like 5% of the playerbase?
No, I do not know for a stated fact that Anet will not prioritize tier 8, but they would be foolish to do so when there are so many other areas of the game that need to be fixed first.

Also,
If anyone in tier 8 actually looked at the ratings lately,
They would see SF gaining 40-50 points this week, and being less than 100 ratings points away from HoD’s score.
The system is balancing itself out, just as it should.

But of course, after a few weeks of HoD steamrolling tier 8, you’ll all be back here complaining about that too.

Do you know what you are typing? First, the system balancing itself out is taking over 3 MONTHS. That is not just as it should unless you know specifically that Anet intended this?

And if it happens to HoD, is your solution for all of them to transfer also? That is not fixing anything and you know it. You are just arguing for the sake of arguing.

I know exactly what I’m typing, that’s why I typed it.
The system is working as intended. The playerbase balance is kittened, sure, but the system is working the way it was designed to work.

Anet intended a scoring system to keep the most evenly matched servers facing against each other. The system itself is not built to have volatile matches, it is built for quite the opposite, to keep servers in place until there’s a power shift.

ET and FC are in a kittenty place. Never denied that. They are two servers that are so far separated in terms of coverage that there is no third server in the game that would be a balanced match against them. And it sucks for them. But unless you expect Anet to start merging servers (Which isn’t gonna happen. At least not to fix a WvW problem.), then it’s about time that tier 8 learns to accept that that is the reality of the game.

Now,
Would you like to have a conversation or would you like to just keep trying to imply I’m trolling you? Because your crying troll is getting a little old for me.

PS: If I were a troll, the fact I’ve kept you going so long would warrant this a complete success.

MikeFerguson.8921:

Catisa.6507:

There is no system in the world that’s ever going to compensate for server transfers, or guilds taking a break from wvw, or differences in primetime play hours.

Pretty much this. We use gliko to help make sure the matches end up being somewhat competitive, but no systems can really predict and react immediately to constantly changing populations.

While glicko may not be the greatest thing to use for tiered competition, I think it’s actually worked fairly well to help ensure that a large portion of our matches end up being competitive. We haven’t been seeing nearly as many lopsided blowouts happening as we continue to have more matches being played out and then feeding those results into the formulas. The obvious exception to that being the worlds who either lose or gain large amounts of players in a short period of time and get caught in a matchup where they get dominated or are the dominating force.

However, even with all the issues glicko presents, we have seen that while it takes a few weeks for the system to adjust to the population shifts, it DOES adjust, and eventually those worlds end up playing in competitive games again once they reach a tier that suits their current population.

And yes, we need to get paid server transfers in. We all agree with that statement, and we’re trying to make it happen as soon as we can, while still making sure the guesting system is as useful and easy to use as possible. We’re agonizingly close, so hopefully soon we can stop talking about it and just do it!

Wrong. Combining NA and EU for WvW will fix the lack of players playing at one time, coverage wars, and servers population #’s.

1. Great posts Detharos. We may be opponents in the battlefield, but we are very much allies on this particular issue.

2. It’s clear the rating system is broken (especially for T8, but also for T1). Broken things very much should be fixed.

3. FC and ET WvWers transferring to higher servers does NOTHING to solve the issue at hand. In fact, it just further exacerbates the underlying problems of the broken rating system. Let’s look at an extreame case…if hypothetically all of WvWers in T8 abandon ship to higher tiers, it would just further topload the upper tier servers (creating more population discrepancy between the upper and lower tiers). And if nobody is hypothetically playing WvW on T8 servers anymore, you know what happens? The T8 Glicko Ghetto creeps up to higher tier servers and T7 becomes the new Glicko Ghetto. What then? Would your advice in that hypothetical scenario be for those T7 players to abandon ship to higher tier servers too? Now, it’s unlikely EVERYONE on T8 would transfer to higher tiers. But this does illustrates the underlying problem with the suggestion that “everyone should just transfer.”

So the sage advice we are getting from people not in T8 is to quit and move on to another server, right? Great! Love that advice! I love it so much I’m going to adapt it as my life’s creed. Then I’m going to teach it to my kids. I can see it now…

“Son, just remember when things get tough, when you feel like you can’t do anymore, that you won’t be successful…just quit. Go ahead, quit. Move on to easier avenues, options that aren’t so troublesome. Put aside all your earlier efforts and hard work. Who cares? Don’t try and make it better or fix it. Just quit! That a boy, son, you make me so proud! My son the quitter!”

Idiots, great advice…

Mudfin.4637:

So the sage advice we are getting from people not in T8 is to quit and move on to another server, right? Great! Love that advice! I love it so much I’m going to adapt it as my life’s creed. Then I’m going to teach it to my kids. I can see it now…

“Son, just remember when things get tough, when you feel like you can’t do anymore, that you won’t be successful…just quit. Go ahead, quit. Move on to easier avenues, options that aren’t so troublesome. Put aside all your earlier efforts and hard work. Who cares? Don’t try and make it better or fix it. Just quit! That a boy, son, you make me so proud! My son the quitter!”

Idiots, great advice…

Most parents I know actually do want their kid to take the safest/most secure route to success and would push them into it.
Think about any parent that has ever discouraged their kid from being an actor or a musician in favour of going to university and getting a business degree, or some equivalent.
They don’t exactly emphasize the “quitter” part, but that’s how reality plays out.

Also,
My advice was to figure out what’s most important to you, and if your wvw experience is more important than your server loyalty, consider moving somewhere better suited to you.

Because you can’t tell me that you honestly see there being a real solution to your problem anytime in the near future.
We could talk all day and night about what Anet COULD do to fix the problem, but if you look at things Anet has said in the past, and things they’ve done in the past, you’ll see that it very unlikely they’ll be doing anything that would really help tier 8. With the exception of maybe putting a ratings floor into it to prevent servers from becoming too far lost, but that is not a solution for imbalanced matches, only for stagnant imbalanced matches.