Guild Wars 2

Hazal.9560:

the average thief will run from my mesmer.

i agree if you meet one that is average in T2 there are not many of them so we have a few good fights

They should make thieves unstealth when damaged, like the Eternal Battleground fountain stealth. This should be an easy thing to implement

When thieves can solo claiming lords, you know theres something wrong with this class

I hope a Thief developer reads your post Miku because I’m sure he/she has read it many times before like I have on this forum for over a couple months.

I too hope he/she will implement an effective solution soon.

For Aion, if an assassin is hit or in combat, he/she is revealed and cannot stealth until combat is over. I think that would be a suitable solution for thieves in GW2, especially because a thief can still surprise a player and kill him/her in a few seconds, but can’t then kill an entire group of players without a chance for them to fight back because of constant stealthing / rendering issues…

In the mean time, if you are a mesmer, use Moa bird so you don’t have to deal with such issues…

wow people are stilling crying about the thief all i can say is just go and leave why make a cry thread in the forums i hate to say it but its just another L2P issue like 95% of the thief threads are no doubt u are pre 80s all in GC gear and dont know how to play your class or how to counter a thief so when you die the first thing you do is “OMG that thief stayed in perma stealth and starred at me and one shotted me while doing 8 backflips in one jump then! he punched me thru my computer screen =(” honestly im glad you and your friends left people like you ruin class balance

Setch.2398:

I am not going to lie, I too have had friends leave the game because of thieves.

my friends rage at getting stealth/blown up by them. They haven’t quit but they certainly rage quit after getting ganked a few times in a row. I left after10mins of WvW for the day when a thief completely destroyed a large group of us. It was silly to watch.

No one could see him or target him then he would appear next to someone and instantly kill them, then suddenly disappear. He wasn’t a thief he was like some vampire. He tried his opener on me and by the time I managed to dodge roll away I was at 25% health and a simple heartseeker finished me off.

Seriously something needs to be done already. Surely they must keep logs on the amount of damage thieves are doing. its 3x what any other class can produce and within seconds.

What frustrated one of my friends (who left) the most was that once the thief decided he wanted to kill all yaks from the north camp there was no way to stop him. 3 people trying to escort the yak(s) all the way south was not possible. The thief could always kill the yaks, he never went for the people. One entire night (over several nights) with zero yaks ever making it out of the north camp with no viable counter and he said he was done with this game.

HeeHee.5208:

For Aion, if an assassin is hit or in combat, he/she is revealed and cannot stealth until combat is over. I think that would be a suitable solution for thieves in GW2

Then you don’t really understand GW2 stealth or how thieves utilize it both offensively and defensively.

Your suggestion would force more thieves into backstab-assassin style play and nerf more conservative control/condition based thief builds.

I play a mesmer and I’m a solo’er in WvW. Thieves aren’t as overpowered as the common player will try to make you believe. Yes, they do hit hard and yes, they can stealth often. But that’s the flavor of the class. I beat thieves 9 out of 10 times when I come across them, and I’ve even beaten 2 thieves at once quite a few times.

To beat a thief you have to play defensively at first then go offensive. Truth is that the common player thinks he is a better player than he is. Rather than trying to improve and practice when you can’t beat a class, you assume it’s impossible to beat that class and call for nerfs.

And if you and 5 friends working cooperatively gets slaughtered by 2 thieves, I’m pretty you and your friends aren’t playing at a high skill level. I admit that dual pistol condition thieves give me problems, but it’s not because they’re overpowered; it’s just because my particular build doesn’t have enough tools to remove conditions.

For the record, I spend a lot of time in WvW. I personally have never had a problem facing a thief and dieing because of a culling bug. I’m still not exactly sure what that is. When they stealth, I immediately put my hands on a defensive skill or a roll and am ready to hit it as soon as I get a feeling they’re going to pop out. You have to use your defensive skills proactively against thieves. Don’t wait for them to unload on you and then hit it.

This game seems very easy to play because there are so few skills, when compared to games like WoW. But I’ve found the skill cap to be just as high. Even though the classes are easy to play, they’re a lot harder to master. My suggestion to you is to practice. And you may not like this, but if you want to get better at fighting thieves, keep fighting them. The mists is a great place to duel and practice.

buki.3108:

Basically….

Glass cannon/low hp – you will get 1-shot by thieves. There is no counter. Stick to the back field and hope your allies manage to kill the noob thief.

Tanky – you survive the initial burst. Thief goes into ultra noob CnD spam mode. If you aren’t in a group, you will die. There is no counter.

The only defense is if you have a skill to block the CnD. Only a select few classes have an actual BLOCK ability though (which is on a CD unlike CnD -.-) Dodging DOES NOT WORK. You have 2 dodges, 2 seconds of blocking CnD. Every stealth skill has > 5s stealth thanks to culling.

There is no counter play to thief stealth. It is a broken mechanic and needs a re-work.

Thief is the noobtube of this game. Sadly I doubt they will fix this class because, well… noobtube encourages noobs to play more -.-

This is so much bs. Just because you don’t know how to counter them doesn’t mean anything. On a few classes thieves will win more often then not, but it’s not a given.

On my guard, I kill thieves all the time. Last time was a 1v2 against a warrior and thief. Trapped thief with my hammer, thief dead.

On my mes I kill thieves all the time. 8 stacks of confusion will tear up a thief, not too mention blurred frenzy.

Hammer warrior = dead thief a lot of the time.

And so on and so on.

Seriously, L2P.

Create a high burst DPS class AND give them stealth. What were they thinking?

High burst DPS always causes balance issues and player complaints with any game with PvP. Stealth classes always cause balance issues and lot of player complaints in any game with PvP. So they make a class with both!

Yet Devs keep making the same mistakes and never seem to learn from other game developers mistakes. I guess they think they are better or smarter or something and can make them ‘balanced.’

Here is an idea for you Anet: Don’t have any stealth classes in your next MMO unless it is single player only.

Mechanix.5719:

wow people are stilling crying about the thief all i can say is just go and leave why make a cry thread in the forums i hate to say it but its just another L2P issue like 95% of the thief threads are no doubt u are pre 80s all in GC gear and dont know how to play your class or how to counter a thief so when you die the first thing you do is “OMG that thief stayed in perma stealth and starred at me and one shotted me while doing 8 backflips in one jump then! he punched me thru my computer screen =(” honestly im glad you and your friends left people like you ruin class balance

You leave your spawn.
You have full exotics, balanced gear, (no glass cannon), you’re a squishy class.
Out of the blue you take around 100% your health in damage before you have time to say “what”, and after you’re dead from stealth finish, you finally see the attacker.
Tell me, how is that L2P issue? What were you supposed to do? Randomly dodge all the time after leaving your spawn? Hit thin air with AoE just because you’re not in your immunity zone anymore? Keep hitting 1 while moving?

I really don’t know why Anet hasn’t fixed thieves yet. Everything in this game completely caters to low skill casuals, yet Anet continues to ignore one of the biggest frustrations those players experience. It’s not even a question of balance, it’s just that it’s completely unenjoyable to get pretty much one shotted by thieves, and that is happening nonstop.

Er… please, no mesmer comments on how easy a thief is I too can wreck thieves while wearing greens using Moa.

Snacktime – no time for kitten noobs. “User successfully ignored!”

Back to the topic on hand…

There is a timing to the theifs attack, theives do not appear out of nowhere. Then run to you, stealth 2-3 seconds out, then hit their attacks. If you force them to miss their lead ins, and they burn their initiative you are going to get some counterplay in. Focus on CCing them first.

I do recommend you roll up a thief in sPvP and learn the class. There is a lot you probably dont intrinsicly understand about how to shut down a thief, and make him badgefood.

I play these classes in WvW now: Warrior, Elementalist, Mesmer. All three of them dont get 3 shotted by even the most glassy of cannon thieves, and 2 of them arnt even level 80. (my thief is only level 14, rarely played, and before you go but you have a thief! I have one of each class, and the lowest level is 14).

I do think stealth needs to be addressed, both in culling and ‘render lag’. I do think a lot of the issues will be fixed when that is addressed.

snacktime.1082:

On my guard, I kill thieves all the time. Last time was a 1v2 against a warrior and thief. Trapped thief with my hammer, thief dead.

On my mes I kill thieves all the time. 8 stacks of confusion will tear up a thief, not too mention blurred frenzy.

Hammer warrior = dead thief a lot of the time.

And so on and so on.

Seriously, L2P.

can you fraps this? I would love to see a video of you doing this. I think everyone would. Until then I won’t believe a word of it.

thieves can easily get out of a hammer snare. shadow step removes the condition, actually it removes 3 of them.

Jupitus.4352:

Errr…. roll thieves yourselves? Just a suggestion

Been there done that, killed multiples at lvl 5 with 1 utility. It wasn’t even funny how easy it was. Yes there is a major issue, but your not going to convince the ones that suck that it really is not their skill level winning fights.

In their minds they are skilled and that is why they can kill and escape with zero issue.

Not to be confused with the ones that truly are skilled, generally they are the ones that will admit theres an issue.

Tulisin.6945:

Navzar.2938:

…

Watch your combat log, auto chains, and on-hit procs.. People effective at combating stealthed opponents already know when they’re hitting.

Ah thank you. I don’t have auto chains or on hit procs, but the combat log should be fine. I usually keep it off because it really floods chat in wvw, but I guess I can keep it on when I’m roaming.

snacktime.1082:

This is so much bs. Just because you don’t know how to counter them doesn’t mean anything. On a few classes thieves will win more often then not, but it’s not a given.

On my guard, I kill thieves all the time. Last time was a 1v2 against a warrior and thief. Trapped thief with my hammer, thief dead.

On my mes I kill thieves all the time. 8 stacks of confusion will tear up a thief, not too mention blurred frenzy.

Hammer warrior = dead thief a lot of the time.

And so on and so on.

Seriously, L2P.

Sure, everyone can kill thieves that are a) Not playing the correct build b) are part of that casual part of the community that got frustrated playing against thieves and decided to join them, but can’t really play their class right. The groups are not mutually exclusive.

This thread however is about the actual, skilled thieves. If he didn’t burst you to less than 50% hp out of the blue, he doesn’t know how to play his class. Or you got lucky. (Or you’re guardian)

Not to mention that guards and mesmers are the most effective at countering thieves: Guardian has passive block (So the thief really can’t surprise you, can he?) and is of the heavy armor class on top of that. Mesmer is an excellent duelist profession, so unless that thief plaid his cards right and burst’d that mes to death on the first set of blows, he’s majorly screwed.

buki.3108:

Er… please, no mesmer comments on how easy a thief is I too can wreck thieves while wearing greens using Moa.

Snacktime – no time for kitten noobs. “User successfully ignored!”

Back to the topic on hand…

If you think the only way to beat a thief is to use Moa morph then you’re playing at a low skill level. I’ve never even purchased Moa morph because I don’t waste skillpoints on unnecessary skills since I’m saving all my skill points for the legendary weapon.

And I don’t run a shatter build, and I don’t beat them by running a phantasm build either. I don’t hide while phantasms kill them and come back to finish them. I actually stand toe to toe with thieves. No, I’m not bunker build either. I found a sweet spot for how much toughness I need to not get one shotted. I don’t stack any vitality because it is a wasted stat for my playstyle. And like I said, I use my defensive skills proactively.
I hate to use this term because it is usually attached to criticism that is not constructive, but Learn to Play. This is really a learn to play issue.

http://m.youtube.com/watch?v=1SymCAw2pZI

You all crack me up. I have been 1 hit before. And they downed me before they rendered out of stealth

another chest thumping noob for my ignore list

Fred Fargone.3127:

Mechanix.5719:

wow people are stilling crying about the thief all i can say is just go and leave why make a cry thread in the forums i hate to say it but its just another L2P issue like 95% of the thief threads are no doubt u are pre 80s all in GC gear and dont know how to play your class or how to counter a thief so when you die the first thing you do is “OMG that thief stayed in perma stealth and starred at me and one shotted me while doing 8 backflips in one jump then! he punched me thru my computer screen =(” honestly im glad you and your friends left people like you ruin class balance

You leave your spawn.
You have full exotics, balanced gear, (no glass cannon), you’re a squishy class.
Out of the blue you take around 100% your health in damage before you have time to say “what”, and after you’re dead from stealth finish, you finally see the attacker.
Tell me, how is that L2P issue? What were you supposed to do? Randomly dodge all the time after leaving your spawn? Hit thin air with AoE just because you’re not in your immunity zone anymore? Keep hitting 1 while moving?

1:Define balanced gear be more specific with what your wearing,Traits and ofc class.

2:Okay i can say what in around 1/3 of a second so your being killed in under a second okay seems legit. By out of the blue do you mean your in tunnel mode and someone got the drop on you(thats your fault) if not and you didnt see him then thats the culling issue NOT THE THIEF okay anet are aware of this problem and working on it, the only way a thief can retain nearly perma stealth is a P/D thief and they have absolutely no burst at all.

3:if a theif kills you in say 5secs which the standard GC does then you are infact in glass cannon mode or your lying/extremely over exaggeration like 95% of all thief QQ threads.

4: you can not play in tunnel vision have a wide spread view you will see a GC thief before he attacks you i always do unless its a P/D theif then quite simply you use condi removers and proceed to CC him and apply Condis/burst damage onto him and he will be dead quite soon.

So yes it was a learn to play issue or your a liar please choose which one it was and move along, we shouldn’t see you posting anything about how OP thief are any time soon or do what i did and level the class and play it i learnt it strengths and weaknesses and now i beat every D/D gc unless i get culling issues in which case doesn’t bother me since i know anet are on the problem and i play a Engi btw

Niim.9260:

No offense meant but the truth is thief is just the focal target, and there is always a focal target, so if it was not thieves it would be the next item on the QQ train. If you enjoy the game you figure out a way around the parts that bother you, or you do not enjoy it enough to be bothered and just leave. The ‘reason’ you are leaving has nothing to do with what you are saying, because there will always be that ‘thing’ for those that look for it.

That is false, I have played morpgs for more than 8 years and this is the first time I am posting about a op class, I know on several games there are op classes but still you can counter them with practice but how can you counter a thief who hit you 12k or even more on the first hit and 3k or more on the second, if they are more you are down on just 2 hits and what is worse it that you dont know who was then after a few seconds you found someone but suddenly is hide again and when your friend is trying to ress you the thief finalize you “hidden” so at then he killed you hidden and there was nothing else to do, your friend is the next target, so with 2 thief you can get down 3,4,5,6,7 or who know how much more players down, at the end

almost permantent stealth (little cooltime + be able to hit you stealth and keep stealth + be able to finalize you stealth) + ubber hit damage (2 or max 3 hit on light or mid) = very broken gameplay.

Sorry for my english, it is not my native language but I am trying to communicate as better as I can to explain the current situation.

Hot Boy.7138:

buki.3108:

Er… please, no mesmer comments on how easy a thief is I too can wreck thieves while wearing greens using Moa.

Snacktime – no time for kitten noobs. “User successfully ignored!”

Back to the topic on hand…

If you think the only way to beat a thief is to use Moa morph then you’re playing at a low skill level. I’ve never even purchased Moa morph because I don’t waste skillpoints on unnecessary skills since I’m saving all my skill points for the legendary weapon.

And I don’t run a shatter build, and I don’t beat them by running a phantasm build either. I don’t hide while phantasms kill them and come back to finish them. I actually stand toe to toe with thieves. No, I’m not bunker build either. I found a sweet spot for how much toughness I need to not get one shotted. I don’t stack any vitality because it is a wasted stat for my playstyle. And like I said, I use my defensive skills proactively.
I hate to use this term because it is usually attached to criticism that is not constructive, but Learn to Play. This is really a learn to play issue.

I still didn’t get how this render problem is a L2P issue…

Sunspots.9861:

Niim.9260:

No offense meant but the truth is thief is just the focal target, and there is always a focal target, so if it was not thieves it would be the next item on the QQ train. If you enjoy the game you figure out a way around the parts that bother you, or you do not enjoy it enough to be bothered and just leave. The ‘reason’ you are leaving has nothing to do with what you are saying, because there will always be that ‘thing’ for those that look for it.

A million times this. I get killed by stealthed thieves now and then, guess what, I get killed by falling to my death more often cause I’m stupid. Should I quit because chatting and running is causing me repair bills?

Dropping to your death does not incur a repair bill. EVEN if you have been in combat with another player. I constantly kill myself with cliffs in pvp just to avoid repair bills.

Getting 1 shot by a thief who you cant even see coming does…its broken.

I’ve said it before and this is coming from a long time thief. Cloak and Dagger is ridiculously overpowered and the source of this ‘forever stealth’. If Anet put a more solid cool down on it….this wouldn’t happen.

Look at every thief proclaiming their kitten in wvw on youtube…..and you’ll see a guy who hits C&D a lot.

buki.3108:

Basically….

Glass cannon/low hp – you will get 1-shot by thieves. There is no counter. Stick to the back field and hope your allies manage to kill the noob thief.

Tanky – you survive the initial burst. Thief goes into ultra noob CnD spam mode. If you aren’t in a group, you will die. There is no counter.

The only defense is if you have a skill to block the CnD. Only a select few classes have an actual BLOCK ability though (which is on a CD unlike CnD -.-) Dodging DOES NOT WORK. You have 2 dodges, 2 seconds of blocking CnD. Every stealth skill has > 5s stealth thanks to culling.

There is no counter play to thief stealth. It is a broken mechanic and needs a re-work.

Thief is the noobtube of this game. Sadly I doubt they will fix this class because, well… noobtube encourages noobs to play more -.-

My mesmer is in exotics. Full vitality and toughness build and gear, 28k health. I run him as a rez support spec. I have been two shot by thieves…when I say two shot I mean the span of about 1.5 seconds from my first health dip to dead…then they stealth and finish you off.

They are broken.

We’re talking about a class that can’t be killed if they don’t want to be (yes, X/d elementalist with cantrips is similar), has fantastic mobility which allows it to pick battles, and has huge burst damage.

It’s too much, too focussed in one package.

I do see two different ways to attack the problem, either allow one or two conditions (e.g. burning, cripple) to prevent stealth, or put a 60s cooldown on stealth. At least then a thief would actually have to commit to the fight.

-Jeff

Wiredgunslinger.5480:

I’ve said it before and this is coming from a long time thief. Cloak and Dagger is ridiculously overpowered and the source of this ‘forever stealth’. If Anet put a more solid cool down on it….this wouldn’t happen.

Look at every thief proclaiming their kitten in wvw on youtube…..and you’ll see a guy who hits C&D a lot.

Yes your a longtime thief and your saying CnD grants “forever stealth” so who are you trying to fool again?

CnD uses 6 int if traited it can return 2 stealth but that not your claim its CnD not the traits so that doesn’t get accounted for "Cloak and Dagger is ridiculously overpowered and the source of this ‘forever stealth’. Stealth lasts 3 seconds i regen int to a ratio of 1/1.33secs. To get 6 int it would take me 7.98 seconds to achieve that yet i can only cloak for a grand total of 6 seconds so please explain to me where you have got this theory from. but anyway lets say your claim does work CnDs damage isnt that high so i fail to see how this could be Op if anything its a guy who wants to tease some newbs a simple application of AOE around yourself will have a dead thief in no time, i must say i look forward to your response.

I guess that people who deny this and call everyone noob is because they or their close friend play thief. I just saw the video shared by UberLander http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1SymCAw2pZI And thats indeed what is happening, uber hit on stealth, 1-3 hits and you are down. Guardians could be the only class who could counter them but I still think that a uber thief can kill an uber guardian all day long. Not all thiefs are uber killers because several of them probably just changed to that class to join the “uber family” but on a normal wvwvw day of probably 2-4 hours for a normal player you can be killed by thiefs more than 3 times for sure which is not bad but if you get killed 3 times from someone you cant see then that will really kitten you off. As I already said several of my friends already left because of this issue and the only ones I have currently on this game are 2 thiefs, 1 guardian, 1 mesmer, 1 warrior, the mesmer and the warrior are already building a thief so from my group at the end will be 4 thiefs and 1 warrior. If this is the average behaviour then the wvwvw will become thiefvtheifvthief and the game will be over.

Stealth is just broke =P
It is not the end all be all of things and is situational but between mesmers and thieves I feel it could use toning down. Give wvw a different set of rules for these things, slightly longer cd to make up for culling and possibly give stealth a chance to break on damage or something. My main is a thief and I’m sick of all the stealth fights.

Miku.7156:

Currently there is a huge problem with one profession that is making the wvwvw to become a thiefvthiefvthief

I absolutely agree with this, unfortunatly. Two well played thiefs can easily win against six soso played other classes.

One can argue that that is the way it should be, because you got to play your thief well by pushing those three buttons at the right time, but I fully understand that getting killed in 2 seconds over and over again makes people leave WvWvW

jaif.3518:

I do see two different ways to attack the problem, either allow one or two conditions (e.g. burning, cripple) to prevent stealth, or put a 60s cooldown on stealth. At least then a thief would actually have to commit to the fight.

The problem with all of these “make it harder to stealth” suggestions is that stealth is not a purely defensive tool. Thief auto attack changes into a different from-stealth attack depending on main hand weapon. Removing the ability to consistently stealth to fire off these attacks breaks much of the profession, narrowing viable builds down to just a couple. Notably, it’d do almost nothing to “jump in and instakill” thieves that so many people complain about.

Without understanding what stealth means for a thief and how it actually plays into builds a big stealth nerf is liable to push more thieves into assassin-type bursty play by removing access to defensive, utility, control, and condition-based builds.

Setch.2398:

I am not going to lie, I too have had friends leave the game because of thieves.

Same.

Lately, I have seen a lot of people log out and not return to WvW because of thieves. Some moved onto other games.

Thief with good spec and gear >>> all other classes with whatever gear you can imagine.

Avalon.4809:

Rhyis.7058:

Avalon.4809:

Rhyis.7058:

They left because they don’t like siege warfare. I know this because they were running around solo. I know this because they don’t like thieves.

Yea, I don’t like thieves…
That’s why i play thief.
OMG dude, please…!

Same applies to those who play thieves ironically. Thief is completely useless in any fight that has more then 10 people.

If you fear thieves, you run around WvW solo or a small group. It really is that simple. If you defend objectives with siege all day long, you’ll never even see a thief.

Thieves are not useless against 10 people. If you can’t do it with your thief, that doesn’t mean noone can, because I can.

I don’t run solo or with a small group. Btw, not running around solo won’t change this problem. Steath has a problem in this game, you can’t deny it. It really is that simple.

This issue is already talked in many threads.
What do you mean? All these ppl are talking wrong? Stealth has not a problem? All these ppl are noobs who don’t know how to play?

Stealth isn’t helping you anywhere near as much in a larger fight because of the increased amount of AoE being thrown around willy-nilly. Sure, a thief can be adequate as they still produce a large chunk of damage. But it’s nothing like fighting them in the smaller scale fights. There’s simply less room to maneuver.

I also say this as a thief.

You’re saying it has nothing to do with skill, but I have no problem with thieves. I kill 90% or more of the thieves I encounter. And because I’m a solo’er most of my encounters are 1v2, or more…. so many times the thief is an extra in the fight for me to deal with…. I still have no issues killing that thief and whoever else is fighting alongside them.

And in that video Miku posted, the players are dieing in 1 second are glass canon and/or not max level. And the people not dieing in the first second are too busy trying to run to counter. Which I’ve seen a lot; even though I’m not a thief, when I engage people they are so busy trying to get away they literally don’t do anything to counter. Just their back towards me running away while i’m shooting them in the back as they run, until they’re dead. So those people who run away without ever trying to fight will die the same death, no matter which class was attacking them. And a few people in that video that didn’t die in the first second and a half play stupidly. They try go for a heal cast in the middle of the thief burst without realizing that a roll would evade the next hits. They don’t use any defensive CDs, or do much anything to save themselves.

Frankly, whoever the thief is in that video is killing all low level, glass canon, and very unskilled players. You’re probably thinking that he killed a lot of players and no way all of those players are baddies. Truth is, players in WvW are very bad at playing their class. WvW focus isn’t on individual skill and more about having enough numbers to capture a base. So many players in WvW never learn to play their class well. And when they’re forced into a position against a duelist 1v1, they have no idea how to react; they either try to run without countering, or they play stupidly.

Just wanted to add that the thief in that video isn’t going to post the scenes of him losing 1v1s, though I’m sure there are few moments of that since most people in WvW have no individual skill. So all you’re seeing is him roflstomping bad players, which I suppose is the point of the video. Almost all pvp montages shows the person pwning. What would be the point otherwise?

I am sorry to say it but it sound like sabotage
“This is best game, but we will only play if you nerf thief "
First of all WvWvW is balanced for large scale battles , where thieves are an joke
Check some videos on youtube from zerg vs zerg … an warrior make 30 – 40 kills in 1 minute and you complain about thief and how Op it is –
Forget about 1 vs 1 in WvWvW , there are 300 – 500 players on every map
Regarding 2 vs 6, i refuse to belive that 6 players can lose vs 2 thieves. And if you lost 6 vs 2 the issue is with you , not with thief class.

Rayya.2591:

I am sorry to say it but it sound like sabotage
“This is best game, but we will only play if you nerf thief "
First of all WvWvW is balanced for large scale battles , where thieves are an joke
Check some videos on youtube from zerg vs zerg … an warrior make 30 – 40 kills in 1 minute and you complain about thief and how Op it is –
Forget about 1 vs 1 in WvWvW , there are 300 – 500 players on every map
Regarding 2 vs 6, i refuse to belive that 6 players can lose vs 2 thieves. And if you lost 6 vs 2 the issue is with you , not with thief class.

Watch some YouTube videos , and then come say that again.

Hot Boy.7138:

Frankly, whoever the thief is in that video is killing all low level, glass canon, and very unskilled players.

While you’re right that most thieves running assassin-type quick kill builds pick easy/squishy targets, I think you’re missing the fact that being able to do so is an innate profession attribute thanks to stealth and mobility. It isn’t a coincidence, it is how the game is built.

Miku.7156:

Mechanix.5719:

jaif.3518:

We’re talking about a class that can’t be killed if they don’t want to be (yes, X/d elementalist with cantrips is similar), has fantastic mobility which allows it to pick battles, and has huge burst damage.

It’s too much, too focussed in one package.

I do see two different ways to attack the problem, either allow one or two conditions (e.g. burning, cripple) to prevent stealth, or put a 60s cooldown on stealth. At least then a thief would actually have to commit to the fight.

-Jeff

Wow slow down cowboy “We’re talking about a class that can’t be killed if they don’t want to be” well ive certainly died on my thief in WvW and sure has heck have not wanted to die basically you should worded it like this “Were talking about a class that stomps noobs who dont know how to play and makes them come to the forums to cry about it”

“has fantastic mobility which allows it to pick battles, and has huge burst damage.”

im pretty sure every class has a 25% move speed signet or if you mean spamming HS/AOI then you should write after it saying how it cannot deal any damage for around 6secs making it completely vulnerable. “and has huge burst damage” Yes if specced and gear for but you missed out a small feature doing this gives it a very small defense meaning it gets killed extremely fast and oh if you do the old “i cant see it in stealth” you simply apply some CC to thief prior which everyone should be doing and pretty soon your see a dead thief okay

Oh and btw don’t do the little -Jeff thing it makes you look like a obnoxious kitten who thinks very highly about themselves and its even worst when your argument is nothing more than a tear stained lie

-Mechanix <3

Of course you will not complain if you use that “very fair” class, if I make a poll the next month to see if thief is op or not, the “no” will win for sure (obvious, most of the players will be thiefs), then when people get bored out of their minds to play against another thief almost the whole day and when more and more people leave the game they will say that PS2 killed the game, no! darkfall killed the game, no! AC2 killed the game but the truth is this is one of the best games I ever played and several of my friends think the same, but when there is something that really dont make sense then it anoy you, if it happen everyday it disturb you but if it happen after few minutes you join wvwvw then you get frikin mad and do alt+f4 probably to dont log in a long time or probably never again.

Please make more sense and stop this before is too late.

i use about 7 classes i dont use a necro since they are in a bad state, i didn’t say the thief is very fair at all please find were i said that since you quoted it and im pretty sure your find if you make a poll it will go to the Yes side since the amount of people come on here and cry about the thief is very high im pretty sure the thief wont kill the game i think you need to take deep breathes and calm down simply because WvW isn’t GW2 on the whole honestly if anyone needs to make sense its you with that paragraph you just wrote, if you get ganked in WvW by a thief then you should group up or follow the zerg maybe you should take your GC armor off. Your point has raised no argument against my point raised showing that i was right honestly theirs a reason you don’t see high ranking Tpvpers running around the forums saying “OMG THAT THEIF KILLED ME IN 2SECS AND I WAS FULL TANK!!!11” because they know how to play their class and how to counter the D/D gc thief if anything you should go to utube and watch some guides on how to counter the thief im sure it would help you out alot.

Mechanix.5719:

theirs a reason you don’t see high ranking Tpvpers running around the forums saying “OMG THAT THEIF KILLED ME IN 2SECS AND I WAS FULL TANK!!!11” because they know how to play their class and how to counter the D/D gc thief

Well, it is mostly because damage doesn’t get as out-of-hand in TPvP as it can in WvW. With Ascended gear there is a bigger gap than ever between PvE (WvW) capabilities and S/TPvP capabilities. But, yeah, knowing how to counter helps too.

Tulisin.6945:

Mechanix.5719:

theirs a reason you don’t see high ranking Tpvpers running around the forums saying “OMG THAT THEIF KILLED ME IN 2SECS AND I WAS FULL TANK!!!11” because they know how to play their class and how to counter the D/D gc thief

Well, it is mostly because damage doesn’t get as out-of-hand in TPvP as it can in WvW. With Ascended gear there is a bigger gap than ever between PvE (WvW) capabilities and S/TPvP capabilities. But, yeah, knowing how to counter helps too.

yes you are right on that one they also Nerf crit damage i believe in Spvp so my point isnt so good but you can at least see the point

hell i’d choose a thief as an enemy every time instead of getting killed by the freaking siege weapons !!!

Tulisin.6945:

Hot Boy.7138:

Frankly, whoever the thief is in that video is killing all low level, glass canon, and very unskilled players.

While you’re right that most thieves running assassin-type quick kill builds pick easy/squishy targets, I think you’re missing the fact that being able to do so is an innate profession attribute thanks to stealth and mobility. It isn’t a coincidence, it is how the game is built.

I agree that it is how the game is built. I think that’s the role of the thief. To be an assassin or rogue type of class. This is the intended playstyle. I like the idea of Thieves having this role. I’m not a thief, but I love that each class a theme and a niche. I’m also a roleplayer so to me it makes sense that Thieves can single out a player in a group, take him out and leave before caught. It makes sense that they have uber mobility and can vanish into the shadows often. That’s the flavor of the class.

And like assassins, you pick and choose your targets carefully. And you pick choose your battles carefully so I like that developers made it possible for them to run away if they need to and hard to catch. I’m a mesmer and I’m slow as hell. I have no speed increasing traits in my build or skill on my bar that makes me faster. I’m a turtle compared to everyone else in pvp. But that makes sense to me to because it’s just the class design.

I love this game and the class design. But again, I saw thieves try to choose targets they can take out very quickly, and most pvp thief montage videos won’t show them fighting targets they couldn’t take out.

Tulisin.6945:

Mechanix.5719:

theirs a reason you don’t see high ranking Tpvpers running around the forums saying “OMG THAT THEIF KILLED ME IN 2SECS AND I WAS FULL TANK!!!11” because they know how to play their class and how to counter the D/D gc thief

Well, it is mostly because damage doesn’t get as out-of-hand in TPvP as it can in WvW. With Ascended gear there is a bigger gap than ever between PvE (WvW) capabilities and S/TPvP capabilities. But, yeah, knowing how to counter helps too.

yea especially when thieves are the only ones who can use ascended gear….

Art.9820:

I’m sorry but as a thief I feel useless when it comes to help capping towers or keeps, I can only help to defend others from sneaky thieves or kill some dumb toon who fall from the building,

You’re doing it wrong, then. But that is fine, thieves can excel at those roles if they choose to do so, there’s nothing wrong with being ineffective at siege combat if you chose to spec into open-field skirmish style play.

I know someone was asking to see it in video or it isn’t true for them. But if you wanted to buy me a harddrive and fraps, I would be more than happy to make a montage for you of me only killing thieves. I’ll even let you pick the soundtrack :-)

Art.9820:

Tulisin.6945:

Mechanix.5719:

theirs a reason you don’t see high ranking Tpvpers running around the forums saying “OMG THAT THEIF KILLED ME IN 2SECS AND I WAS FULL TANK!!!11” because they know how to play their class and how to counter the D/D gc thief

Well, it is mostly because damage doesn’t get as out-of-hand in TPvP as it can in WvW. With Ascended gear there is a bigger gap than ever between PvE (WvW) capabilities and S/TPvP capabilities. But, yeah, knowing how to counter helps too.

yea especially when thieves are the only ones who can use ascended gear….

Offensive stats synergize better than defensive stats. Give glass cannons another tier of glass cannon gear while giving bunkers another tier of bunker gear and the glass cannons will down the bunkers faster. GW2 stats don’t nicely zero-sum to keep everything baselined when stats move up, which is one of the major concerns of creating linear gear progression.

In whatever game you play you will always get people that say they can beat any class and l2p lol for them I reply with 5 videos

as a bonus heres a super game breaking Ranger…
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=imPsk-Q5LqM

:)

Svarty.8019:

Double dagger elementalist is the new thief.

See the funny part is people complain about DD ele’s when DD ele’s don’t come close to thieves damage and still have less mobility…. And of course no stealth.