According to the tooltip, the basic salvage kit should have a 20% chance of recovering upgrades, ie runes.
However, over the course of salving 100s if not thousands of masterwork items with minor runes, i noticed the rune salvage rate is extremely low. I should be expecting to see about 5 minor runes per 1 salvage kit, but i see 0 most of the time. It seems to have a rate similar to that of the crude salvage kit instead.
Vague guessing? Nothing vague about it and no guessing involved either. It’s nor rocket science. At 20% you should theoretically get 1 in 5, and it most definitely is not this ratio
I have hard time believing you can remember all those thousands of items without recording any data. And if you can’t, then it’s just a gut feeling which doesn’t prove anything.
But anyways, here is some actual data:
300 uses on some green armor: 15 runes recovered → 5% chance to recover an upgrade.
If the rate was like 10-15%, then yea i wouldn’t notice the discrepancy easily. But since i’m flushing and salvaging masterwork/rares, which come out at a rate of 4:1, and i’m using the basic/master salvage kit respectively, which should have a rate of 20%:80%, by right i should be getting equal amounts of minor and major runes. I don’t. I don’t need to track the data to know that every time i flush all my runes, the majority are major runes.
But since you want some data: Just flushed 76 masterworks, got 2 runes. → 2.6%. Obviously a small sample size, but the deviation from the expected 20% is huge enough to not be bad luck.
It’s not a case of remembering all the salvages, it’s an easy thing to spot. I tend to salvage a lot when my bags get full, so I easily salvage 40 to 50 items at a time. I should be getting about 8-10 runes with that and when you constantly get 2 or 3 it’s very easy to ‘remember’. No gut feeling, no guesses, just fact
And the data you provided Wethospu just backs up what we were already saying :rolleyes:
Oh, my results are not facts but yours are? I bow to your superiority on this matter, I am obviously talking rubbish and you are not. lol, get and grip.
And it is very easy to remember the bad streaks because they are ALL bad streaks, never good. You seem to have trouble believing other people
By all means do more of your own testing, it will show over and over again that 20% is never attained. That is fact, whether I write it down or not.
We are reporting a bug here which you have agreed is a bug, so what is your problem? Grow up and move on.
And why are you sorry for being co-operative and useful? You should be sorry for being pedantic and condescending
If your goal is to get ANet to review the actual rates for particular kits, your best bet is to be meticulous about recording data and report the details first and theories after. The dev team will be swayed to investigate by compelling research.
If you don’t …write down your results then you can very easily remember only your bad streaks.
Humans are very good at remembering unlucky streaks and terrible about taking note of lucky ones. Somehow, we think it’s “fair” when we get better-than-average results and complain when we get less than expected. (And we hardly even notice “average” results.)
For example: I can remember the details of a series of 20 “no-upgrade” forging attempts that took place months ago, but hardly any of them from a 14-successes-in-20-attempts streak that took place less than a week ago.
John Smith: “you should kill monsters, because killing monsters is awesome.”
I fully understand what you are saying about remembering bad streaks and forgetting good streaks, but this is different. There have never been any good streaks to remember, and so you can’t remember something that hasn’t happened.
And figures printed here and ‘recorded’ can just as easily be dismissed. I could easily say that I salvaged 300 items and got 15 runes and I wrote it all down. It would mean no more than anything else said in this post. The only people who know the truth are ANET when and if they look into this.
There is no evidence or proof provided here by anyone. The whole purpose of this thread is to alert ANET to a possible bug, which I hope we have now done.
There is no evidence or proof provided here by anyone. The whole purpose of this thread is to alert ANET to a possible bug, which I hope we have now done.
The only people who know the truth are ANET when and if they look into this.
What I’m trying to explain is that there won’t be any reason for ANet to “look into this” until someone has shown them that there is a “this” to look in to.
Put another way, compare the two statements below and decide for yourself which would be more likely to get ANet’s attention:
Over the last month, I don’t seem to be getting many runes/sigils when salvaging greens with Basic Kits. I don’t think I even had a lucky streak of recovering more upgrades than expected, never mind at least average.
Over the last month, I salvaged 500 greens with a Basic Kit and recovered 50 upgrades, whereas I would have expected to see ~100 minor runes/sigils.
John Smith: “you should kill monsters, because killing monsters is awesome.”
While I don’t use the Basic Salvage Kit, I use the Salvage-o-Matic, which supposedly has the same percentages as the Basic Kit, and I have noticed that the return rate of upgrades is unusually small too. I suspect the two kits use the same script, and it’s definitely possible that it is bugged.
Then again, this isn’t that big an issue to me because a while back, the Matic was bugged and returning an abnormally high amount of upgrades. It actually got quite annoying having my inventory filled up so quickly with cheap upgrades. :P Still, I agree that this is something that ANet should look at.
Just read my post above again. I don’t feel the need to repeat myself to pointless pedantic banter.
The point isn’t about language, it’s about whether ANet would be more swayed by quantitative rather than qualitative descriptions.
For example, I can confirm your gut feeling with the following data from 200 salvages of green armor L74-80.
I recovered 6 runes, an average rate of 3%.
The stated rate is “20% chance of recovering upgrades.” If true, I would expect to recover ~40 runes from 200 trials.
While 200 salvages isn’t enough to reliably determine the actual drop rate, it is enough to determine that the current drop rate is far less than 20%.
There less than a millionth of a percent chance I could get 6 or fewer runes in 200 tries, if the actual rate was 20%.
There’s a 1.4% chance of getting 6 or fewer runes, if the rate was 10%.
A 12.4% chance of 6 or fewer if the rate were 5%.
In other words, the actual rate isn’t 20%. There’s a small chance it’s 10%, but it’s more likely to be lower than 5%.
At best, the tool-tip is incorrect or misleading. At worst, the rate depends on salvage kit and on the target item, e.g. perhaps there’s one rate for Masterwork items and another for Rares or perhaps it depend on the level or type (armor vs weapon, etc).
edit: grammar
John Smith: “you should kill monsters, because killing monsters is awesome.”
