Guild Wars 2

The Stun boon is removed when you daze someone. To replicate this bug on warrior:

• Stun someone with head butt OR use #4 on shield, then use skill #3 on mace; the stun will be removed. This bug is basically a free stun break for the enemy.

Please fix this bug

That is no bug,you should not override your own stuns with a daze,they do not stack and daze + stun is not possible,it’s either daze or stun.Or you wanna see people in perm cc state ?

Caedmon.6798:

That is no bug,you should not override your own stuns with a daze,they do not stack and daze + stun is not possible,it’s either daze or stun.Or you wanna see people in perm cc state ?

I think it is legitimate to expect that both may apply concurrently, only one taking precedence, here. Like: not that adding daze to stun extends the duration of the CC, but that both can apply, and if one wears off before the other, the other is still in effect.

Caedmon.6798:

That is no bug,you should not override your own stuns with a daze,they do not stack and daze + stun is not possible,it’s either daze or stun.Or you wanna see people in perm cc state ?

Nobody is asking for daze and stun to stack. Stun roots the enemy while daze allows the enemy to move and dodge. Take for example head butt, this skill has a 3 second stun, however, if you use daze on the stun enemy, the stun is removed and the player can now move and dodge. For this reason daze is a FREE stun break for the enemy.
Stun should take priority over daze.

This is a bug that needs a fix.

SlippyCheeze.5483:

Caedmon.6798:

That is no bug,you should not override your own stuns with a daze,they do not stack and daze + stun is not possible,it’s either daze or stun.Or you wanna see people in perm cc state ?

I think it is legitimate to expect that both may apply concurrently, only one taking precedence, here. Like: not that adding daze to stun extends the duration of the CC, but that both can apply, and if one wears off before the other, the other is still in effect.

Hence you get CC stacking,i doubt this is a bug and it’s meant to be like this.

Caedmon.6798:

SlippyCheeze.5483:

Caedmon.6798:

That is no bug,you should not override your own stuns with a daze,they do not stack and daze + stun is not possible,it’s either daze or stun.Or you wanna see people in perm cc state ?

I think it is legitimate to expect that both may apply concurrently, only one taking precedence, here. Like: not that adding daze to stun extends the duration of the CC, but that both can apply, and if one wears off before the other, the other is still in effect.

Hence you get CC stacking,i doubt this is a bug and it’s meant to be like this.

That seems like an odd definition of stacking; would you also argue that “blind and stun” at the same time is stacking, and one should be removed if the other is applied?

I can see an argument that they should not apply consecutively, but I can’t see why they couldn’t be applied concurrently, just like any other distinct conditions are?

I think it’s fair to report it as a bug and wait to see how ANet responds. It seems that there are several plausible options:

• As the OP states, it’s a bug: stun shouldn’t override daze or vice versa.
• It’s intentional, just as hide in shadows overrides the nearly-identical stealth
• It’s a bug, but the devs don’t think it’s worth changing, for balance reasons (as suggested above).

SlippyCheeze.5483:

Caedmon.6798:

SlippyCheeze.5483:

Caedmon.6798:

That is no bug,you should not override your own stuns with a daze,they do not stack and daze + stun is not possible,it’s either daze or stun.Or you wanna see people in perm cc state ?

I think it is legitimate to expect that both may apply concurrently, only one taking precedence, here. Like: not that adding daze to stun extends the duration of the CC, but that both can apply, and if one wears off before the other, the other is still in effect.

Hence you get CC stacking,i doubt this is a bug and it’s meant to be like this.

That seems like an odd definition of stacking; would you also argue that “blind and stun” at the same time is stacking, and one should be removed if the other is applied?

I can see an argument that they should not apply consecutively, but I can’t see why they couldn’t be applied concurrently, just like any other distinct conditions are?

Blind and stun are 2 completely different skills.Stun is a cc,Daze is a cc,Just as launch overrides a knockback the same happens on daze – stun or any other cc besides immob.if i stun you for 3 sec and use a 1 sec knockback/launch/fear/daze right after it. the stun is gone and the 1 sec knockback/launch/fear/daze ( pull i think aswell ) is applied instead so the stacking of different kind of cc’s won’t be able.

Caedmon.6798:

SlippyCheeze.5483:

Caedmon.6798:

SlippyCheeze.5483:

Caedmon.6798:

That is no bug,you should not override your own stuns with a daze,they do not stack and daze + stun is not possible,it’s either daze or stun.Or you wanna see people in perm cc state ?

I think it is legitimate to expect that both may apply concurrently, only one taking precedence, here. Like: not that adding daze to stun extends the duration of the CC, but that both can apply, and if one wears off before the other, the other is still in effect.

Hence you get CC stacking,i doubt this is a bug and it’s meant to be like this.

That seems like an odd definition of stacking; would you also argue that “blind and stun” at the same time is stacking, and one should be removed if the other is applied?

I can see an argument that they should not apply consecutively, but I can’t see why they couldn’t be applied concurrently, just like any other distinct conditions are?

Blind and stun are 2 completely different skills.Stun is a cc,Daze is a cc,Just as launch overrides a knockback the same happens on daze – stun or any other cc besides immob.if i stun you for 3 sec and use a 1 sec knockback/launch/fear/daze right after it. the stun is gone and the 1 sec knockback/launch/fear/daze ( pull i think aswell ) is applied instead so the stacking of different kind of cc’s won’t be able.

So, what is the purpose of stunning an enemy for 3 seconds if you use a skill that has daze and breaks him out of stun? Should one be passive while the target is stun? should one just sit and wait till the stun is gone so that you can use the skill that has the daze?

Please enlighten me because the logic escapes me.

Daze overwriting stun is a bug, and it needs to be fixed.

Hitman.5829:

Caedmon.6798:

SlippyCheeze.5483:

Caedmon.6798:

SlippyCheeze.5483:

Caedmon.6798:

That is no bug,you should not override your own stuns with a daze,they do not stack and daze + stun is not possible,it’s either daze or stun.Or you wanna see people in perm cc state ?

I think it is legitimate to expect that both may apply concurrently, only one taking precedence, here. Like: not that adding daze to stun extends the duration of the CC, but that both can apply, and if one wears off before the other, the other is still in effect.

Hence you get CC stacking,i doubt this is a bug and it’s meant to be like this.

That seems like an odd definition of stacking; would you also argue that “blind and stun” at the same time is stacking, and one should be removed if the other is applied?

I can see an argument that they should not apply consecutively, but I can’t see why they couldn’t be applied concurrently, just like any other distinct conditions are?

Blind and stun are 2 completely different skills.Stun is a cc,Daze is a cc,Just as launch overrides a knockback the same happens on daze – stun or any other cc besides immob.if i stun you for 3 sec and use a 1 sec knockback/launch/fear/daze right after it. the stun is gone and the 1 sec knockback/launch/fear/daze ( pull i think aswell ) is applied instead so the stacking of different kind of cc’s won’t be able.

So, what is the purpose of stunning an enemy for 3 seconds if you use a skill that has daze and breaks him out of stun? Should one be passive while the target is stun? should one just sit and wait till the stun is gone so that you can use the skill that has the daze?

Please enlighten me because the logic escapes me.

Daze overwriting stun is a bug, and it needs to be fixed.

Yes thats exactly what you should do mate, you have other skills for a reason use skill 1 on mace untill the stun is gone and then daze if that is what you want.

Hitman.5829:

Caedmon.6798:

SlippyCheeze.5483:

Caedmon.6798:

SlippyCheeze.5483:

Caedmon.6798:

That is no bug,you should not override your own stuns with a daze,they do not stack and daze + stun is not possible,it’s either daze or stun.Or you wanna see people in perm cc state ?

I think it is legitimate to expect that both may apply concurrently, only one taking precedence, here. Like: not that adding daze to stun extends the duration of the CC, but that both can apply, and if one wears off before the other, the other is still in effect.

Hence you get CC stacking,i doubt this is a bug and it’s meant to be like this.

That seems like an odd definition of stacking; would you also argue that “blind and stun” at the same time is stacking, and one should be removed if the other is applied?

I can see an argument that they should not apply consecutively, but I can’t see why they couldn’t be applied concurrently, just like any other distinct conditions are?

Blind and stun are 2 completely different skills.Stun is a cc,Daze is a cc,Just as launch overrides a knockback the same happens on daze – stun or any other cc besides immob.if i stun you for 3 sec and use a 1 sec knockback/launch/fear/daze right after it. the stun is gone and the 1 sec knockback/launch/fear/daze ( pull i think aswell ) is applied instead so the stacking of different kind of cc’s won’t be able.

So, what is the purpose of stunning an enemy for 3 seconds if you use a skill that has daze and breaks him out of stun? Should one be passive while the target is stun? should one just sit and wait till the stun is gone so that you can use the skill that has the daze?

Please enlighten me because the logic escapes me.

Daze overwriting stun is a bug, and it needs to be fixed.

Stun > Spike > Daze > etc.

Don’t break your own applied stuns,it is not a bug.

so all these should cancel each other outs?:
Daze
Fear
Float
Knockback
Knockdown
Launch
Push
Sink
Stun
Taunt

Romgaard.1965:

so all these should cancel each other outs?:
Daze
Fear
Float
Knockback
Knockdown
Launch
Push
Sink
Stun
Taunt

Did you read my other posts or… ?

Caedmon.6798:

Romgaard.1965:

so all these should cancel each other outs?:
Daze
Fear
Float
Knockback
Knockdown
Launch
Push
Sink
Stun
Taunt

Did you read my other posts or… ?

yes, just trying to make sense of the whole thing..
so if I use a 3 sec stun on someone and right after someone use a 1/4 sec daze on the Person, that 1/4 daze overrides the 3 sec stun?

Romgaard.1965:

Caedmon.6798:

Romgaard.1965:

so all these should cancel each other outs?:
Daze
Fear
Float
Knockback
Knockdown
Launch
Push
Sink
Stun
Taunt

Did you read my other posts or… ?

yes, just trying to make sense of the whole thing..
so if I use a 3 sec stun on someone and right after someone use a 1/4 sec daze on the Person, that 1/4 daze overrides the 3 sec stun?

Yes it will,every other CC will cancel that effect.Try to imagine that those effects would all stay while getting other cc’s ontop of you ( a 3 sec stun + a 4 sec daze + a 2 sec knockback for e.g ) when having a teamfight.People wont be able to move,and be in constant cc chains.Some classes when timing it perfectly can already stunlock you well enough.

Just try to make sure that every knockback,launch,stun,daze,fear,pull you make will be used for its full duration.So you cc,make a spike or apply normal damage or w/e,let the full duration of the cc last before you make another cc.

Caedmon.6798:

Romgaard.1965:

Caedmon.6798:

Romgaard.1965:

so all these should cancel each other outs?:
Daze
Fear
Float
Knockback
Knockdown
Launch
Push
Sink
Stun
Taunt

Did you read my other posts or… ?

yes, just trying to make sense of the whole thing..
so if I use a 3 sec stun on someone and right after someone use a 1/4 sec daze on the Person, that 1/4 daze overrides the 3 sec stun?

Yes it will,every other CC will cancel that effect.Try to imagine that those effects would all stay while getting other cc’s ontop of you ( a 3 sec stun + a 4 sec daze + a 2 sec knockback for e.g ) when having a teamfight.People wont be able to move,and be in constant cc chains.Some classes when timing it perfectly can already stunlock you well enough.

Just try to make sure that every knockback,launch,stun,daze,fear,pull you make will be used for its full duration.So you cc,make a spike or apply normal damage or w/e,let the full duration of the cc last before you make another cc.

By the looks of it, people don’t understand the bug.

• Stun roots you and puts your skills on cooldown (You are not able to move or dodge unless you use a stun break).
• Daze only puts your skills on cooldown but allows you to move and dodge.

The bug consists on daze overriding stun and thus acting as a FREE stun break. Daze should not override stun; daze should only override daze and stun should only override stun.

Additionally, there is a misconception that stun stacks duration which is wrong.

Hitman.5829:

Caedmon.6798:

Romgaard.1965:

Caedmon.6798:

Romgaard.1965:

so all these should cancel each other outs?:
Daze
Fear
Float
Knockback
Knockdown
Launch
Push
Sink
Stun
Taunt

Did you read my other posts or… ?

yes, just trying to make sense of the whole thing..
so if I use a 3 sec stun on someone and right after someone use a 1/4 sec daze on the Person, that 1/4 daze overrides the 3 sec stun?

Yes it will,every other CC will cancel that effect.Try to imagine that those effects would all stay while getting other cc’s ontop of you ( a 3 sec stun + a 4 sec daze + a 2 sec knockback for e.g ) when having a teamfight.People wont be able to move,and be in constant cc chains.Some classes when timing it perfectly can already stunlock you well enough.

Just try to make sure that every knockback,launch,stun,daze,fear,pull you make will be used for its full duration.So you cc,make a spike or apply normal damage or w/e,let the full duration of the cc last before you make another cc.

By the looks of it, people don’t understand the bug.

• Stun roots you and puts your skills on cooldown (You are not able to move or dodge unless you use a stun break).
• Daze only puts your skills on cooldown but allows you to move and dodge.

The bug consists on daze overriding stun and thus acting as a FREE stun break. Daze should not override stun; daze should only override daze and stun should only override stun.

Additionally, there is a misconception that stun stacks duration which is wrong.

Its not about stacking duration,i merely gave the durations as an example of how long you would be in a chain.Its the stacking Of daze PLUS a stun or any other cc ( Besides immobilize which i keep saying over and over aswell) not being possible which isn’t a bug.

Again,a Knockback or any other CC ..besides immob… will override that effect aswell,not related to daze – stun only.

I think i explained this all well enough several times.

Caedmon.6798:

I think i explained this all well enough several times.

It seems to me that you have missed the point much more significantly:

daze (4s) + stun (3s) + knockback (2s) == 4s wall time spent under CC.

timeline:

1s: lying on the ground, can’t do anything
2s: get up, because knockback wears off, but still stunned and dazed
3s: can move, because stun wears off, but still dazed
4s: can act again, because daze wears off

compare to “CC breaks other CC”:

1s: lying on the ground, can’t do anything, dazed, stunned, and knockbacked
2s: get up, and can act again, because knockback overwrite stunned and dazed

also, compare to the unreasonable thing nobody is asking for, “CC stacks”:

1s: lying on the ground, can’t do anything, dazed, stunned, and knocked back
2s: stand up, now stunned takes effect
5s: stun wears off, so you can move, but daze takes effect
9s: daze finally wears off, but you quit the game already

The last one is unreasonable. Stacking durations or extending them isn’t the right thing to do, and I don’t think anyone disagrees.

What we do disagree with is this sequence:

1. apply daze 4s
2. apply stun 1s, which removes daze 4s totally
3. total time under CC: one second, due to the stun overwriting the daze.

SlippyCheeze.5483:

Caedmon.6798:

I think i explained this all well enough several times.

It seems to me that you have missed the point much more significantly:

daze (4s) + stun (3s) + knockback (2s) == 4s wall time spent under CC.

timeline:

1s: lying on the ground, can’t do anything
2s: get up, because knockback wears off, but still stunned and dazed
3s: can move, because stun wears off, but still dazed
4s: can act again, because daze wears off

compare to “CC breaks other CC”:

1s: lying on the ground, can’t do anything, dazed, stunned, and knockbacked
2s: get up, and can act again, because knockback overwrite stunned and dazed

also, compare to the unreasonable thing nobody is asking for, “CC stacks”:

1s: lying on the ground, can’t do anything, dazed, stunned, and knocked back
2s: stand up, now stunned takes effect
5s: stun wears off, so you can move, but daze takes effect
9s: daze finally wears off, but you quit the game already

The last one is unreasonable. Stacking durations or extending them isn’t the right thing to do, and I don’t think anyone disagrees.

What we do disagree with is this sequence:

1. apply daze 4s
2. apply stun 1s, which removes daze 4s totally
3. total time under CC: one second, due to the stun overwriting the daze.

Why cant you guys understand that you cannot have any other cc applied together with another cc in effect besides immob ? Its been like this since 2012.

didnt know that daze will free stun, i think most of player also will not know, as there is not in game tip for these, even wiki not mention anything about certain hard cc cancel each other.
If it is not bug, it will be great if someone can edit the wiki in https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Control_effect, https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Daze, https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Stun

And for Scrapper – Impact Savant – The duration of your outgoing stuns and dazes are increased, and the duration of stuns and dazes applied to you are decreased. <<< the trait that improve the CC that is contradict each other….
imagine a new scrapper player doing these together: https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Spare_Capacitor, https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Thunderclap

Also, in game stun apply skill’s tool tip should also have “applying daze cancel stun” etc.

Lastly, head butt is done in a group fights, and many skills, runes etc will apply short period daze that overwrite the 3 secs stun…..

Caedmon.6798:

Why cant you guys understand that you cannot have any other cc applied together with another cc in effect besides immob ? Its been like this since 2012.

We understand it, we just think it should change.