Guild Wars 2

Hotfix engineer turrets please. The traits are all broken as of 30th April and they are even more laughably useless than normal. Don’t forget Supply Drop while you’re at it plz.

Plus if you could actually give the turrets the ability to survive more than 0.2 seconds in typical WvW engagements sometime this year, that would be nice. This month being the minion/pet month it might have been a nice time for example to remember engineers have also have minion problems rather than breaking the turrets still further.

How long till we finally get a word from one of the devs acknowledging what we have been trying to get out for days now, since the patch.

Rifled Turret Barrels is horribly broken, i decided to make a small video about it to show it does not apply the 15% extra damage.
First Test : Rifle Turret
532 damage without Rifled Turret Barrel Trait
532 with Rifled Turret Barrel Trait

Second Test : Rocket Turret
887 damage + 328 dott without Rifled Turret Barrel Trait
887 damage + 328 dott with Rifled Turret Barrel Trait

Third Test : Flame Turret
142 damage + 328 dott without Rifled Turret Barrel Trait
142 damage + 328 dott with Rifled Turret Barrel Trait

“http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fMJH2Li4fx0”
Change settings to 1080p for best quality.

Conclusion, Rifled Turret Barrel Trait does not apply the 15% damage bonus.

This test was done on a naked Character, only had the standard pvp pistol to create aggro, talent spec was : 30 points in Inventions.
On tests without i put in 30 in inventions but did not choose a trait.
On tests with Rifled Turret Barrels i put in 30 in Inventions and chose the Trait.

Hope this is sufficient proof that the Trait is broken.

And this is not the only one, all the turret traits are broken, metal plating and auto repair, but this one was easiest to reproduce.

Here’s a video i made showing how Rifled Turret Barrels is broken.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fMJH2Li4fx0

And bump up the 5 minute timer to 15 minutes so that they at least have a chance to survive boss/events without going on full cooldown for no reason.

Hay! C’mon guys!

Their QA department is really busy!

See? So busy, in-fact, they had to take on more help…They added that Clock!

Delete you engineer.
Roll a Zerker GS Warrior.
Run CoF until you see Flame Legion Charrs even when you are not online.
Play GW2 as ANet intend.

I’m an Engineer btw.

I think all Engineers are abit jaded right now, which is a shame, bugs have been broken for months without any word, no response from Anet about class crippeling bugs that happened this patch, which are well documented and easily reproduced (like the video i showed in my post above) and still nothing, they(ANet) should stop the favoritism thing or simply delete the classes they are not interested in.

They’re probably too busy designing new greatsword skins.

Even if you report a bug, finding it isn’t necessarily so easy. I guess you think because no one has come and said something, that no one is actually looking into it. But tracking down bugs can sometimes take months.

I mean they can’t really correct what’s wrong if they can’t find what’s wrong. That’s the lousy side of being a programmer.

Vayne.8563:

Even if you report a bug, finding it isn’t necessarily so easy. I guess you think because no one has come and said something, that no one is actually looking into it. But tracking down bugs can sometimes take months.

I mean they can’t really correct what’s wrong if they can’t find what’s wrong. That’s the lousy side of being a programmer.

If the bug is reproducable then it’s more easy to find.
Also whenever another class they clearly show favoritism to has a bug they are all over it in their respective class forum, the last time a dev even spoke about an Engineer was when 1000nades was nerfed, and it was on the Thief forum.

JoxerNL.3752:

Vayne.8563:

Even if you report a bug, finding it isn’t necessarily so easy. I guess you think because no one has come and said something, that no one is actually looking into it. But tracking down bugs can sometimes take months.

I mean they can’t really correct what’s wrong if they can’t find what’s wrong. That’s the lousy side of being a programmer.

If the bug is reproducable then it’s more easy to find.
Also whenever another class they clearly show favoritism to has a bug they are all over it in their respective class forum, the last time a dev even spoke about an Engineer was when 1000nades was nerfed, and it was on the Thief forum.

This just isn’t true. A reproducible bug doesn’t necessarily make it easier to find. I used to manage a computer store and one day a guy brought in a machine that had a problem with video. It wasn’t showing a picture. He left it in the store and I attempted to fix it.

It worked fine. Called the guy, he brought it home, called me up and said it didn’t work. So I told him to bring in his monitor too. He comes in, we set up the whole thing, it works fine. He gets it home, it doesn’t work.

It turns out the difference was the position of the case. We always worked on computers in the story lying them down. Standing them up, as he did at home prevented the computer from working.

It took a long time to track down precisely why that was, even though I knew exactly what was going on (and that’s a much simpler situation than the kind of bug you’re talking about).

Various subroutines in software affect other parts of the program, often unexpectedly. They can’t just go in and make a change without knowing specifically what caused the change in the first place. Because if that’s worked on again, then it could conceivably break again. They have to know specifically which area of code is affecting the outcomes. Why has it changed since last time.

I can assure you that knowing what a problem is, doesn’t tell anyone what part of the code corrupted it. You can’t treat just the symptom. You have go get to the root of the problem and that takes time.

You seemed to have completely ignored the second part of my post, which is acknowledgement.

JoxerNL.3752:

You seemed to have completely ignored the second part of my post, which is acknowledgement.

I haven’t ignored anything. Rangers have felt ignored. Necros have felt ignored. When you’re working on a project, any project, you have to prioritize things. Every time a thread pops up that says engies are badly broken, some one comes along and says L2P I do fine on my engie.

And engies aren’t particularly bad at WvW and they can excel in SPvP. So it’s really only PVe there are problems with and there, mostly dungeons.

I get it….you’re a disenfranchised engineer. Well, my first 80 was an engie and in the open world with a bomb kit, I’m pretty much king. And engie is what I use in SPvP mostly as well.

Sure there are problems, but engie is not the only profession that has those. I wouldn’t necessarily assume favoritism.

Some professions are more standard and probably a lot easier to work on in the first place.

JoxerNL.3752:

You seemed to have completely ignored the second part of my post, which is acknowledgement.

Modus operandi.

Vayne.8563:

This just isn’t true.

[snip]

TL;DR version: there was this time I tried to troubleshoot some issue in an unrelated field. It was hard. Therefore, you are wrong and you need to give ANet some slack.

Not only is your analogy irrelevant, it contains no logically compelling facts or reasoning and avoids the general failure of ANet to crack down on these bugs after months of documentation.

The only part of your absurdly long post that’s (marginally) relevant is this:

Various subroutines in software affect other parts of the program, often unexpectedly. They can’t just go in and make a change without knowing specifically what caused the change in the first place. Because if that’s worked on again, then it could conceivably break again. They have to know specifically which area of code is affecting the outcomes. Why has it changed since last time.

I can assure you that knowing what a problem is, doesn’t tell anyone what part of the code corrupted it. You can’t treat just the symptom. You have go get to the root of the problem and that takes time.

Yes, yes, programming 101. It is, however, true that being able to repeat an instance of a bug makes it significantly easier to fix it as generally compared with a bug that is difficult to reproduce. He didn’t say it was strictly/always the case, as can be inferred from his statement. And you say other people are too literal.

You’re shooting in the dark. You have no real reason to say that it’s fine that these bugs haven’t been ironed out, even though the whole purpose of your post is for us to trust that ANet knows what it’s doing. Don’t substitute faith for reason.

And, yes, you ignored “acknowledgement.” Your response to that was a non-sequitur.

Kalan.9705:

Hotfix engineer turrets please. The traits are all broken as of 30th April and they are even more laughably useless than normal. Don’t forget Supply Drop while you’re at it plz.

Plus if you could actually give the turrets the ability to survive more than 0.2 seconds in typical WvW engagements sometime this year, that would be nice. This month being the minion/pet month it might have been a nice time for example to remember engineers have also have minion problems rather than breaking the turrets still further.

How are they broken? “Laughably useless” is an opinion and you state no backing for said opinion. I’m saying there isn’t something wrong, just that saying “it’s broke” over and over doesn’t help.

Pennry.9215:

How are they broken? “Laughably useless” is an opinion and you state no backing for said opinion. I’m saying there isn’t something wrong, just that saying “it’s broke” over and over doesn’t help.

Check out the second post in this thread, made by me, it’s a video that shows the only one that is easy to test, namely the Rifled Turret Barrels, it does not work at all, tested it on all turrets with and without the trait, naked characted that only has the pvp gun.
So there is plenty of backing there, hell there is even someone on the Engineer forums who made a video about the hitboxes being abnormally large, which contributes why they die so fast in zerg fights.

Valanga.5942:

They’re probably too busy designing new greatsword skins.

Aas a matter of fact, they are.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i6j9c6NRkWE

Vayne.8563:

JoxerNL.3752:

Vayne.8563:

Stuff

Some stuff

Stuff in reply

I’m sorry you can’t just throw in words like “subroutines” and expect that analogy to work. And yes, a reliably reproduced bug does generally make it easier to find than one that is not. That’s what he was saying.

Remember, You can put lipstick on a pig, but in the end its still a pig. Why fix such bad skills ASAP? They clearly need an entire re-design not a hotfix. And other classes have worse problems.

JJBigs.8456:

Remember, You can put lipstick on a pig, but in the end its still a pig. Why fix such bad skills ASAP? They clearly need an entire re-design not a hotfix. And other classes have worse problems.

Because they almost have made turrets viable, all they need now is more hp, and maybe a few tweaks to the traits.

JJBigs.8456:

Remember, You can put lipstick on a pig, but in the end its still a pig. Why fix such bad skills ASAP? They clearly need an entire re-design not a hotfix. And other classes have worse problems.

Worse problem? We have an entire section of traits dedicated to turrets that aren’t working anymore! It is close to removing stealth from a thief for a month, without it they can’t survive. And because you can’t play them doesn’t meen they are bad, they do feel clunky sometimes, but they just need some adjustements to feel more attractive. And no they don’t need to be redisigned, all that is needed :
1) A smaller hitbox.
2) Adjustement to their already existing traits. (And traits that are actualy working!)
3) A way to track their targets with the current overcharge skills.

Do this and you already solve 75% of our turrets issue. No instead let me guess you are one of those lazy people who wants a 90% dmg reduction from AoEs, is that your idea of redisigned turrets? Or no maybe you just want them to be mobile? Or why not an entire weapon kit only with turrets? Or maybe you are just a HgH build and actualy never played for about 5 months a Turrets Engineer?

Turrets Engineers have hidden in the shadows for to long, we deserve that hotfix!

FOR TURRETS!

Why the hell are engineers treated like crap by ANet?

I mean we get ZERO new skins especially from the SAB, now we got this turret crap going on?

Really ANET?

and still not a peep from ANet,
The analogy made earlier is perfect, like a Ranger without pets, or a Guardian without Virtues, we are missing one of our main mechanics, and all ANet is doing is sticking its head in the sand trying to ignore it as if its going to go away eventually.

still hoping for someone from ANet to see this.

Shouldn’t this be in the Game Bugs forum?

Soulstar.7812:

Why the hell are engineers treated like crap by ANet?

I mean we get ZERO new skins especially from the SAB, now we got this turret crap going on?

Really ANET?

If you post an image with a caption no one will take you serious.

I really don’t see the point of this thread. Should we discuss about how you feel that the turrets are broken?

Guns and Giblets.9308:

JoxerNL.3752:

You seemed to have completely ignored the second part of my post, which is acknowledgement.

Modus operandi.

Vayne.8563:

This just isn’t true.

[snip]

TL;DR version: there was this time I tried to troubleshoot some issue in an unrelated field. It was hard. Therefore, you are wrong and you need to give ANet some slack.

Not only is your analogy irrelevant, it contains no logically compelling facts or reasoning and avoids the general failure of ANet to crack down on these bugs after months of documentation.

The only part of your absurdly long post that’s (marginally) relevant is this:

Various subroutines in software affect other parts of the program, often unexpectedly. They can’t just go in and make a change without knowing specifically what caused the change in the first place. Because if that’s worked on again, then it could conceivably break again. They have to know specifically which area of code is affecting the outcomes. Why has it changed since last time.

I can assure you that knowing what a problem is, doesn’t tell anyone what part of the code corrupted it. You can’t treat just the symptom. You have go get to the root of the problem and that takes time.

Yes, yes, programming 101. It is, however, true that being able to repeat an instance of a bug makes it significantly easier to fix it as generally compared with a bug that is difficult to reproduce. He didn’t say it was strictly/always the case, as can be inferred from his statement. And you say other people are too literal.

You’re shooting in the dark. You have no real reason to say that it’s fine that these bugs haven’t been ironed out, even though the whole purpose of your post is for us to trust that ANet knows what it’s doing. Don’t substitute faith for reason.

And, yes, you ignored “acknowledgement.” Your response to that was a non-sequitur.

My son is a programmer and he says the same thing. I used an example, because it was personal but any coder will tell you that bugs can be very very hard to track down even if they’re reproducible. One doesn’t necessary follow the other.

Recycle.5493:

Valanga.5942:

They’re probably too busy designing new greatsword skins.

Aas a matter of fact, they are.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i6j9c6NRkWE

So you think artists that design swords are the same guys as programmers that fix bugs. I see. Interesting. /rolls eyes

JoxerNL.3752:

and still not a peep from ANet,
The analogy made earlier is perfect, like a Ranger without pets, or a Guardian without Virtues, we are missing one of our main mechanics, and all ANet is doing is sticking its head in the sand trying to ignore it as if its going to go away eventually.

What would you like Anet to say? Yes they’re broken. They know they’re broken. They’re probably working on a fix. If Anet responded to every single thread that needed response, because someone found a bug, they would have no time to fix bugs.

Your desire for a response is not reasonable, in my opinion.

Of course it should be in the bugs forum, but the OP feels that he’ll get more attention here. It’ll probably be moved by a mod at some point.

And he’s not wrong to be annoyed that a bug exists. It’s just my opinion that the ease with which bugs an be fixed is being is being vastly overstated, and the assumption Anet doesn’t care is a baseless opinion without a shred of evidence to back it up.

He just wants Anet to come into the thread and say we’re looking into it, I guess.

A.Net just called me, they can’t answer right now. They told me that they are aware of this bug and that they are working on a fix right now.

Vayne.8563:

JoxerNL.3752:

and still not a peep from ANet,
The analogy made earlier is perfect, like a Ranger without pets, or a Guardian without Virtues, we are missing one of our main mechanics, and all ANet is doing is sticking its head in the sand trying to ignore it as if its going to go away eventually.

What would you like Anet to say? Yes they’re broken. They know they’re broken. They’re probably working on a fix. If Anet responded to every single thread that needed response, because someone found a bug, they would have no time to fix bugs.

Your desire for a response is not reasonable, in my opinion.

That would be nice. We have been forever posting on our forums about how our scope trait is bugged. Up until a few days ago, someone finally answered in the pvp section saying that scope was working fine. FINE. The engineers had to present a whole lot of evidence to him showing that scope wasn’t working before him finally saying they would look into it then closed the thread.
So what did we learn from this? A) It seems we have to get our problems posted in other forums to be heard and B ) Like hell we are going to wait out for months like what happened with scope, and any acknowledgement that they actually agree they don’t work would go a long way. This isn’t just one trait, its an entire build made unusable.

Turrets have been conceptually broken since day 1. Let’s look at the only other build that focuses on summoning NPC’s, the necro minion master:

-Much greater variety of minion traits to choose from.
-Flesh golem has much shorter downtime than supply crate.
-Minions are mobile. For sPvP this matter less since you can bunker nodes, but in WvW it’s a huge drawback that can’t be fixed with a small buff or two.
-Necros have 2 weapon sets, which makes up for the lack of utility from filling up your skill slots with minions.
-Necros can wield dual daggers for a permanent speed boost in WvW. Turret engineers have to sacrifice the healing turret for healing kit, or go around at normal speed which is unacceptable.

The only advantage that turrets have is that healing and flame turrets can generate water and smoke combo fields respectively, but the ele and bomb kit do these better. So yeah turrets basically suck, bugged traits or not.

Vayne.8563:

Recycle.5493:

Valanga.5942:

They’re probably too busy designing new greatsword skins.

Aas a matter of fact, they are.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i6j9c6NRkWE

So you think artists that design swords are the same guys as programmers that fix bugs. I see. Interesting. /rolls eyes

You know, there’s no need to wear the white armor with ANet logo every time someone makes a joke…

Valanga.5942:

Vayne.8563:

Recycle.5493:

Valanga.5942:

They’re probably too busy designing new greatsword skins.

Aas a matter of fact, they are.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i6j9c6NRkWE

So you think artists that design swords are the same guys as programmers that fix bugs. I see. Interesting. /rolls eyes

You know, there’s no need to wear the white armor with ANet logo every time someone makes a joke…

Except you can’t always tell when some people are joking.

Vayne.8563:

Valanga.5942:

Vayne.8563:

Recycle.5493:

Valanga.5942:

They’re probably too busy designing new greatsword skins.

Aas a matter of fact, they are.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i6j9c6NRkWE

So you think artists that design swords are the same guys as programmers that fix bugs. I see. Interesting. /rolls eyes

You know, there’s no need to wear the white armor with ANet logo every time someone makes a joke…

Except you can’t always tell when some people are joking.

Well you got a point, english is not my native language, so i may sound more rude than i actually want to be

Valanga.5942:

Vayne.8563:

Valanga.5942:

Vayne.8563:

Recycle.5493:

Valanga.5942:

They’re probably too busy designing new greatsword skins.

Aas a matter of fact, they are.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i6j9c6NRkWE

So you think artists that design swords are the same guys as programmers that fix bugs. I see. Interesting. /rolls eyes

You know, there’s no need to wear the white armor with ANet logo every time someone makes a joke…

Except you can’t always tell when some people are joking.

Well you got a point, english is not my native language, so i may sound more rude than i actually want to be

It’s not just that. Your reply was to someone who also said Anet is too busy making great swords to fix the engineer bug. So yeah, I probably should have quoted that and not you.

JoxerNL.3752:

Here’s a video i made showing how Rifled Turret Barrels is broken.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fMJH2Li4fx0

Great vid makes you wonder wtf is going on with this class huh..

INB4 Thread gets chucked into the Engineer section never to be seen again..

kokiman.2364:

A.Net just called me, they can’t answer right now. They told me that they are aware of this bug and that they are working on a fix right now.

Do they have your home number

I have a motto: anything that doesn’t work is, by default, bad. No matter how innovative the design of something is, how novel the idea behind it, how much money went into it, etc. If it doesn’t work, it is bad.

I do wish more resources were put into bugfixing than what are currently. I can’t use my engineer in sPVP anymore because none of the turret traits work.

Blood Red Arachnid.2493:

I have a motto: anything that doesn’t work is, by default, bad. No matter how innovative the design of something is, how novel the idea behind it, how much money went into it, etc. If it doesn’t work, it is bad.

I do wish more resources were put into bugfixing than what are currently. I can’t use my engineer in sPVP anymore because none of the turret traits work.

It’s been broken since the patch and been ignored completely, whenever something else broke after the patch from other classes it was hotfixed the day after, this is just kitten poor from ANet imho.

JoxerNL.3752:

Blood Red Arachnid.2493:

I have a motto: anything that doesn’t work is, by default, bad. No matter how innovative the design of something is, how novel the idea behind it, how much money went into it, etc. If it doesn’t work, it is bad.

I do wish more resources were put into bugfixing than what are currently. I can’t use my engineer in sPVP anymore because none of the turret traits work.

It’s been broken since the patch and been ignored completely, whenever something else broke after the patch from other classes it was hotfixed the day after, this is just kitten poor from ANet imho.

Exactly Ranger traps got broken in a patch, and a few hours later fixed, Engineer turrets gets broken we’ll we might get an update next patch, what a joke…

I think engineer turrets and ranger spirits are in the same boat really, they both suck and all changes so far hasn’t really amounted to them being useful in anything but a spec heavily traited into them

Normal turrets don’t heal since the patch, only the ones in the Supply Crate do.

CyberneticRanger.9170:

Normal turrets don’t heal since the patch, only the ones in the Supply Crate do.

It looks like all talents work on the supply crate turrets, but our -normal- turrets are not, i think they changed something so they are flagged as different entities or something.

still no word on a game breaking bug, great -.-

Do not look at that Engineer behind that curtain.. here.. look at this shiny new Greatsword.

Mad Rasputin.7809:

Do not look at that Engineer behind that curtain.. here.. look at this shiny new Greatsword.

It’s a shame, though im sure this is a team issue, skins are part of graphic designs where as this is balancing issue with coding.

Could we have some acknowledgement regarding this bug? And maybe some news regarding a fix?
They’re are already sub-par even with traits, but having those broken makes them near-useless tier.