Guild Wars 2

Hello,

probably has been mentioned a lot, but it still is an issue. During FotM in the Asuran fractal (Uncategorized Fractal) the starter area is at times completely bugged.

You hit some harpy hunters, jump back down to rez your team, and once you get back at the top, you notice that ALL harpy hunters are invulnerable to your attacks. Sure, you can just run through, but there are times (especially at higher tier fractals) where a party member is unable to do so. So this is blocking team progress.

Is this something that can be looked into?

Best,

— Threepsie

P.S.: They become hittable again once you get Out of Combat, however, if you jump down again and go back up, they’re all invulnerable once again…

Pointed out at least once a week since the bug appeared.
Ignored ever since.
Don’t expect anything there.

also happens to the bats on lava shaman fractal.

I’m pretty sure this is to prevent people who are not standing in “melee combat range” to prevent them from killing the enemies in a cheap fashion. The problem with harpies is everyone is in melee range(close range I mean) where the harpies will fight back, everyone gets knocked down while some guy below is too far away trying to hit them, causing invulerability.

I don’t really think it’s a bug, just how the mechanics work.

Osi.3504:

I don’t really think it’s a bug, just how the mechanics work.

If I’m on melee range hitting an enemy that I’m supposed to kill to progress and it keeps popping “Invulnerable” while other enemies farther away keep damaging/knocking me off, I’m pretty sure the mechanic is bugged.

Honestly if it is a bug fix it. If not then remove the stupid perma knock back from these harpies. Knockdown is cool. Knock back throwing you off a ledge where you cant do anything and the reflects make them invulnerable. that is just stupid.

Jeremiah Lee.2764:

This is only in that specific fractal? And only with Harpy Hunters?

Thank you!

It is a bug? lol. When yu start “fractal with cats” in middle of first group of Harpy Hunters.

Could you talk something about rushing grawls trying throw 4 willagers in fractals with Shaman? It it special? From few weeks I see it. Also one time shaman was stucked on top and he dont go down to hit thron. It was bad beacuse we need exit it ;/

I just made a topic about this like 2 nights ago and it got no real views at all..

Jeremiah Lee.2764:

This is only in that specific fractal? And only with Harpy Hunters?

Thank you!

The way the jumping puzzle is designed, the harpies constantly go invulnerable (seemingly at random) if you fight them at range.

Kil M.3680:

Jeremiah Lee.2764:

This is only in that specific fractal? And only with Harpy Hunters?

Thank you!

It is a bug? lol. When yu start “fractal with cats” in middle of first group of Harpy Hunters.

Could you talk something about rushing grawls trying throw 4 willagers in fractals with Shaman? It it special? From few weeks I see it. Also one time shaman was stucked on top and he dont go down to hit thron. It was bad beacuse we need exit it ;/

This comment gave me cancer.

This frequently happens while playing as my guardian. I’ll often attack a harpy from a different platform (usually the one right next to the one they’re on) to get them to attack me (helps to draw aggro before putting up a Wall of Reflection) and when I jump up onto the same platform as the harpies, they’re usually invulnerable. This is extremely irritating because they can’t be impacted by crowd control skills yet they can continue to hit me and the rest of my party.

There have been plenty of cases where I haven’t even attacked them from a distance, move into melee range, and they’re immediately invulnerable. I’ve had them stay this way for well over 10 seconds, all while being pummeling by arrows and their knock down attacks.

I understand that this is probably to prevent people from using really cheap tactics against them. And I’m ok with that. I hate AI exploits and cheap tactics. But the fix for this is breaking actual legitimate strategies and makes this fractal pure hell. You should be able to attack an enemy on the next platform from you without having them become invulnerable. At the very least, they shouldn’t be able to attack the party when this happens. It kind of feels like the harpies are exploiting by taking advantage of their invulnerable state to kill the party…

I attack from range and only some of them become invulnerable. I didn’t fall, I didn’t jump down to rez others. In some cases, they would take damage from Wall of Reflection, but not from my direct attacks. If I swapped to melee weapon and jumped to their platform, sometimes they would take damage.

The principle in the rest of the game is: if you can hurt it, it can hurt you. If it can’t hurt you, you can’t hurt it. For some reason, it’s different here.

Ranged classes ought to be able to use their attacks at their maximum range. This is using skills as intended. The harpies should have a means of returning fire against long range attacks but not invulnerability. Invariably the invulnerability lasts far longer than intended while the invulnerable mobs are still able to attack.

Jeremiah Lee.2764:

This is only in that specific fractal? And only with Harpy Hunters?

Thank you!

First of all, thank you for responding to an issue that seems to be going on for quite some time. It at least gives us a sparkle of hope that it is being looked into! (-:

To answer your question: it seems to happen rather frequently at the start of the aforementioned fractal. More specifically: it starts to kick in from the third and/or fourth Harpy Hunter (the first two are rather easily killed). In my run yesterday as a mesmer the whole team had issues with the invulnerability up until the part where we decided to ‘just evade them’ and run through to the room with the 4 mini-bosses (rabbit, veteran grenadier, etc). In that room we were all able to get out of combat and went back to assault the Harpies. At that time these beasts were still gloating at us with their immortality buff (read: invulnerable).

This issue might be related to ‘hiding behind objects’ and them not able to hit you, since we all often jumped down to resurrect a fallen team member who got hit/slaughtered/thrown off the plateau. Otherwise I am in the dark as to what may be causing this.

Also worth mentioning is that there were no further issues with the remainder of the fractal.

I think there is no actual bug. Harpies become invulnerable if they can’t hit you (their attack range is different then players). But this is still very annoying since sometimes you have to get out of their range, to dodge the lightning balls.

Vink.6453:

I think there is no actual bug. Harpies become invulnerable if they can’t hit you (their attack range is different then players). But this is still very annoying since sometimes you have to get out of their range, to dodge the lightning balls.

Again, if you’re in melee range or attacking them with ranged weapons from 1 platform of distance and they are “Invulnerable”, as it happens, there IS an actual bug.

Yeah, I hate that harpy level just for that reason. It’s very annoying to be in melee range with them beating on them for 5 seconds while the invulnerable pops up, and your getting pummeled by all the other harpys and there is nothing you can do but pray the invul goes away soon. Also I find it’s in the grawl level too after the shaman drops into the lava, the first fire imp that is on the broken bridge, he is like that too. It’s why we just skip him, why waste 5-10 seconds beating on a mob for a chance for a copper
This bug in fractals has been ever since the coding was changed to stop ppl from using platforms and such to kill enemies that cannot reach them. Also on a side note I get the invul thing in CoF path 2 on the boss that summons devourers just because he’s a smidge too close to the wall. Im sure there are other bosses like that too, where they get to close to a wall and go invul even though your in melee range the whole time.
Oh and another one almost as bad as the harpy invul is the krait in the underwater fractal going INTO the ceiling, making it annoying to kill, just to free the prisoner to move on to the next part. It would be nice if some of these bugs got fixed for fractals though, tired of it getting nerfed all the time but the bugs remain

Just another issue to add with the harpy hunters, if you manage to successfully evade all the attacks from rapid fire (I think this is what the spell is called) while in combat with them they go invulnerable as well. Although it sounds difficult to do it is actually very easy to replicate (especially as ranger since you are aware of projectile mechanics since you’ve always seen them), but the biggest peeve I have with this is that you get punished for skillful play. Every time I run this fractal I have to make a mental note to not dodge the rapid fire spell completely, or else I’ll stand there like an idiot waiting for it to reset and hit me back.

I think I’ve figured out how the bug is triggered, but am not sure how to fix it. I believe invulnerability is triggered when you character and a monster are both in combat and if the monster can not damage you in X amount of time they become invulnerable. The problem with harpies is that the rapid fire spell is too telegraphed by sound, so it is possible to dodge the entire spell by simply by listening to the sound and moving your character left and right (you don’t even need to look at the harpy or even use dodge). The duration of rapid fire is also very close the X amount of time as well, so if the entire spell misses they can go invulnerable easily.

A new day… A new fractal… And it happened again at the third Harpy!

Minute.7293:

Just another issue to add with the harpy hunters, if you manage to successfully evade all the attacks from rapid fire (I think this is what the spell is called) while in combat with them they go invulnerable as well. Although it sounds difficult to do it is actually very easy to replicate (especially as ranger since you are aware of projectile mechanics since you’ve always seen them), but the biggest peeve I have with this is that you get punished for skillful play. Every time I run this fractal I have to make a mental note to not dodge the rapid fire spell completely, or else I’ll stand there like an idiot waiting for it to reset and hit me back.

I think I’ve figured out how the bug is triggered, but am not sure how to fix it. I believe invulnerability is triggered when you character and a monster are both in combat and if the monster can not damage you in X amount of time they become invulnerable. The problem with harpies is that the rapid fire spell is too telegraphed by sound, so it is possible to dodge the entire spell by simply by listening to the sound and moving your character left and right (you don’t even need to look at the harpy or even use dodge). The duration of rapid fire is also very close the X amount of time as well, so if the entire spell misses they can go invulnerable easily.

Ok, that’s interesting. I’ll have to try that the next time I’m in that fractal and see if I can trigger it by my actions. As a guardian, I try to get into melee range as quickly as I can so I can draw aggro but the harpies use that rapid fire attack at close range too. So I think I’ll be able to replicate it.

And yes, this does indeed happen in other fractals/situations in the game. But it seems to happen the most frequently in this fractal due to how it’s designed. So there appears to be a bug that impacts creature behavior throughout the game. It’s just more noticeable in certain situation and actually becomes a problem.

That doesn’t make any sense. We constantly fight enemies without letting them damage us in the slightless, all across the game, and they don’t go invulnerable even if you kite them for several minutes without taking damage.
No, time in combat without making damage can’t be the decisive factor, or it would be a problem all across the game, while we find it only in very specific places. It must be a specific mechanic involved here.

What I personally expect the issue to be, for this specific case:

The invulnerable trigger may be based off of whether the enemy can possibly path to the player. The harpies are on floating platforms, disconnected from one another – they cannot possibly path to the player, and thus become invulnerable.

If that’s the case, then the invulnerable check should check if the player is in range of any of the mob’s attacks, not whether the mob can path to the player.

Canach in his instance had a similar issue; if you stood on the rock in the center of the room, because he couldn’t climb on top of it, he’d reset, even though the rock wasn’t large enough for the player to stay out of his melee range.

Dingle.2743:

What I personally expect the issue to be, for this specific case:

The invulnerable trigger may be based off of whether the enemy can possibly path to the player. The harpies are on floating platforms, disconnected from one another – they cannot possibly path to the player, and thus become invulnerable.

That’s the general way enemies reset (or go invulnerable once reset and not able to aggro an attacking pj again), and it might be something related to this. The issue is that even being able to attack back at the players, even with players on melee on the same platform as them, they keep popping “invulnerable” and ignoring the attacking players for several seconds. That’s not the usual way to behave, even in the normal reset-invulnerable mechanic. Must be a certain specific mechanic on motion to avoid exploits (killing them from platforms afar where they can’t reach) that has this non-justified too-long-going invulnerability as undesired side-effect.

Jeremiah Lee.2764:

This is only in that specific fractal? And only with Harpy Hunters?

No, it happens in almost ANY dungeon/area with ANY enemy. Fx when you fight the slave driver in CoF path 1 with melee, he may become invulnerable while you are fighting him. So you deal some damage, then he becomes invulnerable for 10 secs.

I am not surprised anymore about the amount of bugs. It feels like this game is not ready for release yet. I have been beta testing since I bought the game. And it is the sole reason I haven’t bought a single gem for cash.

It indeed is a mechanic that occurs everywhere.

In the case of the uncategorised fractal, I experienced that it triggers when the following happens: You attack a harpy, you then fall down and are teleported to the starting position in downed state. If you then get revived, the foe(s) you hit before getting knocked down are invulnerable.

In every case where the invulnerable mechanic triggers, the only way to break it is getting hit by the invulnerable foe.

I groan every time I get this fractal. As a ranger without marksmanship, I understand that I’m limited in my range. I’m pretty good at jumping around on the ledges to avoid the bombs that knock me back. I even manage to figure out just how far outside of the circle the stupid lightning hits (because, yes. That circle is incredibly misleading, and you are NOT safe outside of it if you’re on the same platform). Once I get to the top, though, EVERY harpy is invulnerable to me. I’ve DIED because they’ve hit me, killed me, and gloated at me with their invulnerability.

I cannot help my teammates out if I cannot kill a harpy that is right in front of me at the top of the puzzle if they go invulnerable.

I understand that invulnerability was reinstated in dungeons and the like in order to avoid exploits of killing melee bosses from a range, but the harpies are ALL ranged. They should never, ever go invulnerable in my personal opinion. If they can hit us (even if it’s with a lousy autoattack), then we should be able to hit them.

As a ranger, I absolutely HATE invulnerability. Get one step higher than the enemy that can’t jump and BAM, you’re gonna have a bad day. And unfortunately, getting hit by the invulnerable foe does not always remove their invulnerability. Never has for me. (but RNG hates me, so why not invulnerable monsters, too? yay)

… /rant. Please fix. Love fractals otherwise! (…‘cept Mossman, he’s a jerk)

Lyana Evrilow.8102:

As a ranger, I absolutely HATE invulnerability. Get one step higher than the enemy that can’t jump and BAM, you’re gonna have a bad day. And unfortunately, getting hit by the invulnerable foe does not always remove their invulnerability. Never has for me. (but RNG hates me, so why not invulnerable monsters, too? yay)

Agreed, it is an absolutely terrible mechanic. You’d think the point of a ranged class is to hit enemies from afar, or from a vantage point.

Another problem with the harpies, is that in that specific Fractal it is sometimes impossible to get out of combat. Especially at the start, the harpies will often keep shooting at downed players, and there is no spot to take cover and break combat. And due to the in-combat slow down, you’ll have trouble jumping as well, because they continue shooting as you’re trying to reach them.

Yeah those harpies can shoot you just fine, but try and shoot back, and they’ll turn invulnerable. That is why it is an absolutely unfair, and unfun mechanic.

Jeremiah Lee.2764:

This is only in that specific fractal? And only with Harpy Hunters?

Thank you!

Snowblind fractal, final boss is invulnerable for me for the first 10s of the figt (he can hit me I can not hit him). This happens on my ele, warr and thief on all fractal levels I have done so far (up to 4x). Its very often, like 9 times on 10 tries. The faster I get to the boss to init the fight (RTL, Steal, Rush) the longer the invulnerability last. Usually I am the first one in party who start attacking, if for some reason I am not the one who starts the fight (1 of 10 runs) there is no problem with inv.

Also this problem occurs on every mob/boss fom time to time. Usually when you hit the mob (again as the first player in party – yea I am quite a rusher ^^) and then for some reason you withdraw from the fight (for example to res slowbies) there is great chance that when you get back to the mob/boss he will be inv for some seconds.

Edit:
Snow boss buggy behaviour can be seen here
http://youtu.be/qZOe7UblT5A?t=7m7s
for me the boss is usually longer in inv mode than on this movie.

Vlaamsche Leeuw.7598:

In every case where the invulnerable mechanic triggers, the only way to break it is getting hit by the invulnerable foe.

not the case for me. Snow fractal boss can hit me or even kill me while being inv the whole time.

I don’t think it’s a bug, this happens to all NPC enemies that are in combat with someone that they can’t hit.

EnemyCrusher.7324:

I don’t think it’s a bug, this happens to all NPC enemies that are in combat with someone that they can’t hit.

You didn’t get a good grasp of the topic at all, did you?

AeroJavi.1687:

EnemyCrusher.7324:

I don’t think it’s a bug, this happens to all NPC enemies that are in combat with someone that they can’t hit.

You didn’t get a good grasp of the topic at all, did you?

Wow, why such unwarranted rudeness? You even said yourself that that might be related:

AeroJavi.1687:

That’s the general way enemies reset (or go invulnerable once reset and not able to aggro an attacking pj again), and it might be something related to this.

I’ve seen this happen with the bats in the volcano fractal and with the harpies in the asuran fractal, and in both cases it was because of that. The bats and the harpies that I saw become invulnerable did so because they were still targeting a player that they were unable to hit even though there were other players that they could hit.

The whole topic is about how they go invulnerable and stay that way permanently. They should be reseting once you are out of combat with them.

EnemyCrusher.7324:

I’ve seen this happen with the bats in the volcano fractal and with the harpies in the asuran fractal, and in both cases it was because of that. The bats and the harpies that I saw become invulnerable did so because they were still targeting a player that they were unable to hit even though there were other players that they could hit.

If you haven’t noticed that the difference here is that while as general mechanic a mob changes aggro to a new aggroable pj if there is one when the one it had locked becomes unavailable (not able to move to the pj/reach with attacks, resetting and then becoming invulnerable if still attacked by the player but not able to aggro), this particular bug is that while having other available pjs to aggro it ignores them and keeps popping invulnerable for several seconds, you’re not very smart. Not my fault you’re going to have a complex about it.
Again, while it’s somehow related to that general reset/invulnerable mechanic all mobs follow, here there must be a specific mechanic, probably to avoid exploits such as killing the harpies from points they can’t fight back, causing them to not reaggro normally even if they have pjs to do so.

I don’t care about other mobs and other instances within the game. The way aggro and resets function with the harpy hunters in the Uncategorized Fractal is complete bullkitten and utterly broken. I have no problem with Anet fixing exploits, but this is not the answer.

AeroJavi.1687:

EnemyCrusher.7324:

I’ve seen this happen with the bats in the volcano fractal and with the harpies in the asuran fractal, and in both cases it was because of that. The bats and the harpies that I saw become invulnerable did so because they were still targeting a player that they were unable to hit _even though there were other players that they could hit_.

If you haven’t noticed that the difference here is that while as general mechanic a mob changes aggro to a new aggroable pj if there is one when the one it had locked becomes unavailable (not able to move to the pj/reach with attacks, resetting and then becoming invulnerable if still attacked by the player but not able to aggro), this particular bug is that while having other available pjs to aggro it ignores them and keeps popping invulnerable for several seconds, you’re not very smart. Not my fault you’re going to have a complex about it.
Again, while it’s somehow related to that general reset/invulnerable mechanic all mobs follow, here there must be a specific mechanic, probably to avoid exploits such as killing the harpies from points they can’t fight back, causing them to not reaggro normally even if they have pjs to do so.

Personally attack me and agree with me in the same sentence? I’m done trying to have a civil and constructive discussion with you.

Tentonhammr.7849:

I don’t care about other mobs and other instances within the game. The way aggro and resets function with the harpy hunters in the Uncategorized Fractal is complete bullkitten and utterly broken. I have no problem with Anet fixing exploits, but this is not the answer.

Enemies’ can remain aggroed on a player even after that player is no longer “in combat”. I don’t think it’s a bug, but it does seem like poor implementation, and I agree that it should be changed. It would be an improvement if enemies could change aggro targets easier and don’t become invulnerable to the players that they can hit.

Time to fix this.