Guild Wars 2

In southsun there is a riot instigator that spawns just down the hill. I logged in and ran down there waiting for him to spawn on my necromancer. Since i lag like crazy when there are tons of people on the screen (20+ all firing spells at the same time) i laid down my necro marks where he spawns.

All of the sudden i start getting tells about "What the heck do you think your doing? — “What did you do to make him die so fast?” … As well as map chat posts saying “OMG look at that necro exploiting!” I have NEVER exploited and was mad at first. I tried to tell them that i was doing nothing different than anyone else, using my skills as intended.. and i got harassed in map chat and in several tells…

i finally logged off in disgust after about an hour or so of harassment by several players in map chat.

How would using a skill that i have make him bug? There were tons of people there.. which was why i thought he was dying so quickly (or that instigator is just bugged from bad coding)

Me and the other necro that were there were the ones getting yelled at and threatened with bans… yet all the other classes with pre fight mechanics.. such as elementalists with aoe storms and engineers with turrets were doing the same thing, blanketing the area in aoe trying to get hits in when he spawns.

I use staff, like i said because of the lag there. I can throw a set of marks down and at least i get credit for the event etc if i cant move the rest of the fight.

I read the description for all my staff skills again as well.. “Creates a mark that activates when something enters it” or something to that effect. I am not using them in any special way, other than laying them down as intended.

Frankly, im getting sick of every time i log in and go there, tons of people start whispering me and yelling in map chat that they are reporting me for exploiting for using my skills AS INTENDED.

Is using my skills an exploit??? If not can you PLEASE make a post acknowledging the problem and that it is NOT necro wells making that instigator bug…. or should i just not even play my necro at all?

I need to know for sure. I cant find any posts about the subject.

I dont want to get banned for using my skills as they were intended and as the description says with just a ton of people sending in false reports that i am exploiting a bug.

It is 12:15 AM EST and my character is Truely Deadly on the Tarnished Coast server. If an admin would like to talk with me, i will be online for an hour or two, unless i am once again forced off by people threatening to report me for exploiting.

I can confirm that this was going on in Southsun on TC this evening, though I was not one of the people talking in map chat. The general line seemed to be that something about laying things (specifically necro wells) down prior to combat was making the Instigator scale incorrectly. While I’ve no idea whether it’s because of necro wells or any other mechanic (much less any specific player), there does exist a vast difference between when it happens and when it doesn’t.

When the bug trips, the Instigator goes down much, much faster than it does with the same zerg without the bug. Additionally, it only ever seems to happen on the Instigator by Kiel’s waypoint; the other one seems unaffected. The difference is dramatic, and oftentimes players don’t have a chance to target and tag the boss before he goes down, especially if they only get in range at, say, 50% health.

Oh. So that’s why he died so quick. Only saw it happen once the other night, but I figured it was a some random bug. Had no idea it could be exploited in this way. By the time I ran up the ridge, the champion was dead in less than a minute.

Yeah, it needs to be fixed.

as stated in another thread, this might be a bug but is not an exploit as marks are an essential element of a staff necromancer and placing them pre-battle is considered to be a normalway of playing the game as a necromancer.

If people treat you badly in chat then rightclick report them. They are violating several rules in the code of conduct.

He’s knew it a bugged but keep doing it then it consider an exploiting act, also his action effecting majority of other players at the event as well. I saw players asked him stop bugging the Instigator in nice way as first but his response like an idiot with fury of rage and calling others “moron”.

first… i have not seen any other posts regarding this as a known bug. If you have a link to a post (an anet official) posting that this is an exploit or bug, please link it here. There was speculation being thrown around in map chat that it was only necro wells at first, then the same people started yelling at engineers and even a few elementalist who were playing there as well and preloading the area with aoes (as they should.. its how you play thier class as well). I have yet to see a single post and this is not listed as a known bug on the bug forum (one that i could find anyway)

second… i only called someone a moron after they told me i cannot use ANY wells or skills (which is how i play my class) and harassed me with threats of reporting me for exploiting for almost an hour. I am a nice guy and i never use strong language in chat.. but after this type of harassment i lost my cool for a moment and did call someone a moron, and for that i apologize. Yet, getting yelled at for playing my class how it is intended did perturb me a great deal and this issue needs to be addressed asap.

Thank you for your replies and hopefully we will see a anet rep answer here soon.

Oxymus.5241:

He’s knew it a bugged but keep doing it then it consider an exploiting act, also his action effecting majority of other players at the event as well. I saw players asked him stop bugging the Instigator in nice way as first but his response like an idiot with fury of rage and calling others “moron”.

Like I said, faul language in chat isn’t allowed, report that in game but dont fight over i. Don’t make a fight in mapchat roll over to here. give it a break!

Second in my opinion it isn’t an exploit at all only a bug. demanding a necromancer with staff to stop putting down marks is the same as demanding a mesmer to stop making clones.

I don’t think anyone was asking the OP to not put down any marks at all during the event. The issue was putting down AoE stuff prior to the spawn, not for the entirety of the encounter. Playing your class to its optimum potential is one thing, but if you suspect doing so might be bugging the boss, it’s probably a good idea to stop, out of politeness if nothing else. The world will not end if you don’t eke out every last drop of DPS.

I mean, there aren’t any damage meters, you know? Putting up the AoEs two seconds later isn’t going to get you kicked from a raid or something. However, if it is the pre-spawn AoEs that’re making the boss bug, you should stop. Yes, even if it’s part of how you play your class. That bug makes it much more difficult for others to participate in or get credit for the event, and is obviously not something that’s working as intended. Continuing to trigger it after being called out is inconsiderate at best and griefing at worst.

That being said, A.) map chat harassment isn’t good, either, and B.) there’s no word from any devs about what’s causing the bug.

I’m on TC and this bug is hurting our community. There are two, mutually incompatible methods of farming for these events and people are getting upset over them to such an extent that map chat is filled with every manner of insult. People are even adding each other to the block list. It’s downright toxic.

Please fix this bug for the good of the community.

One of the worst parts of the problem is when someone is exploiting this bug, and is asked to stop, they get defensive, start saying that exploiting this known bug is just how their class plays, and starts threatening to report anyone who disagrees for harassment. it makes constructive conversation about the topic completely useless. It isn’t harassment to ask someone to stop doing something that literally does not benefit them (tossing down the AoEs once the mob is spawned in such a situation will still add to damage, plenty of necros play without this griefing behaviour just fine) , and only makes other people frustrated or upset. If someone is saying “the way you are exploiting this bug is ruining the experience for other people” maybe you could consider altering how you play very slightly so that more people who are spending time on this game they spent money on, can actually have the same level of enjoyment with this event that you do.

The post that i made is the only post that i have seen to date that mentions this type of occurrence and it has yet to be identified as a bug. If someone else knows of a post by an anet team member or developer about this issue, please link it here.

In response to the above poster, I did not take offence to anything anyone said, until they started harassing me personally in map chat and in private tells. I do know for a fact that that this type of behavior is bannable and i will continue reporting people for harassment as it happens.

I am NOT exploiting a bug in any way or form and being singled out on map chat and in tells is just ludicrous. I am NOT the only person using prefight skills (as my skills are intended to be used) and the people posting the negative comments here are some of the ones i reported for harassment.

There are usually 20-40 people standing there waiting for these bosses to spawn. Necro wells, elementalist storms and engineer bombs/turrets are all over the place and i get singled out and harassed in map chat for throwing down my marks as they are intended to be used. Some people even telling other people (who aren’t even in the area) to report me for exploiting, which once again… i am NOT doing.

Can we please get a red post about this issue?

Most of the time, actually, people stand on the rocks waiting for the boss to spawn. Sometimes you get people putting down AoEs, but it’s not the norm by any means. It is possible, however, that once someone starts doing it, other people join in—not out of malice, but out of a desire to get credit. It just happened to me about ten minutes ago on TC. The bug got triggered, and despite the fact that I was right there, I couldn’t target the boss quickly enough in the zerg to get credit. It is entirely possible that the OP was behaving this way in reaction to other people bugging the event.

In general, though, a good rule of thumb is to just be nice. You may not be exploiting, but if you’re triggering the boss in that manner, you are ruining other people’s gaming experience. Saying that you haven’t been told not to by a dev is absolutely disingenuous. You don’t need a dev to tell you to not be a jerk.

the issue isn’t about pre-fight skills, about this particular instance clearly being bugged to allow pre-fight skills to take effect prior to the boss’s scaling for# of people involved. Unless you think that necromancers being able to trivialise an event for dozens of people in an exclusionary way is “Working as intended”. Yes, it’s how you play the class under normal circumstances, but this is not a normal circumstance.

I think you also need to understand that people expressing distaste for this abuse of a bug is not harassment. The only reason you might feel singled out is because other people stopped doing it when it was pointed out, because they were being conscientious about how their gameplay was affecting others. Being able to affect a boss before it’s scaling kicks in is absolutely an exploit, and continuing to do so after it’s pointed out, even if it’s not yet an offense to A-Net, is absolutely offensive to other people trying to work the event. You gain nothing by exploiting like this, except making people frustrated. Which, I guess, if that’s what you’re going for, you’re doing a great job. But it’s unbecoming to tick off dozens of people then cry harassment when they call you on being unsportsmanlike behaviour and how it is ruining their fun.

The very fact that you recognise that this might be an exploit and came to the forums to report about it, yet continued to do it and defend your actions, speaks more about why you’re doing this than anything else. “Hey this might be a bug and it wrecks everyone’s fun, I should keep doing it as much as possible before it’s fixed!”.

It’s not harassment when you’re asked to not ruin an event over and over, and then have the reasoning explained to you. Especially if you counter with “it’s not a bug it’s just how my class works”… after mentioning that it might be a bug here in the forums. If there’s any inclination that something you’re doing is negatively affecting the gameplay of dozens of other game-buying, gem-buying income sources for arenanet, you may want to consider your position in this whole thing. There are plenty of instances where people continued to exploit after the exploit was discovered but before it was fixed by Devs, that have led to bans. Please consider what you’re doing and the effect it’s having on other people, and potentially the future of your own account.

alchahest.1423:

the issue isn’t about pre-fight skills, about this particular instance clearly being bugged to allow pre-fight skills to take effect prior to the boss’s scaling for# of people involved. Unless you think that necromancers being able to trivialise an event for dozens of people in an exclusionary way is “Working as intended”. Yes, it’s how you play the class under normal circumstances, but this is not a normal circumstance.

I think you also need to understand that people expressing distaste for this abuse of a bug is not harassment. The only reason you might feel singled out is because other people stopped doing it when it was pointed out, because they were being conscientious about how their gameplay was affecting others. Being able to affect a boss before it’s scaling kicks in is absolutely an exploit, and continuing to do so after it’s pointed out, even if it’s not yet an offense to A-Net, is absolutely offensive to other people trying to work the event. You gain nothing by exploiting like this, except making people frustrated. Which, I guess, if that’s what you’re going for, you’re doing a great job. But it’s unbecoming to tick off dozens of people then cry harassment when they call you on being unsportsmanlike behaviour and how it is ruining their fun.

The very fact that you recognise that this might be an exploit and came to the forums to report about it, yet continued to do it and defend your actions, speaks more about why you’re doing this than anything else. “Hey this might be a bug and it wrecks everyone’s fun, I should keep doing it as much as possible before it’s fixed!”.

It’s not harassment when you’re asked to not ruin an event over and over, and then have the reasoning explained to you. Especially if you counter with “it’s not a bug it’s just how my class works”… after mentioning that it might be a bug here in the forums. If there’s any inclination that something you’re doing is negatively affecting the gameplay of dozens of other game-buying, gem-buying income sources for arenanet, you may want to consider your position in this whole thing. There are plenty of instances where people continued to exploit after the exploit was discovered but before it was fixed by Devs, that have led to bans. Please consider what you’re doing and the effect it’s having on other people, and potentially the future of your own account.

Form the forum rules: ‘do not engage in personal attacks against forum members or in character assassination.’

Saying that the OP is exploiting is wrong and counts as a personal attack. As stated before this is a bug. The main problem started when people where calling him an exploiter in the first place. By the definition he is not exploiting. You can ask necromancers in the area nicely to not place marks down, but don’t call them exploiters while they are doing whats in their nature (placing marks).

The bug itself is reported. Stop going after the op or anyone that triggers the bug and give it a rest both here as in your server map chat.

….so, people should just be quiet and let themselves get cheated out of events so that an individual doesn’t have to slightly alter their playstyle?

I mean, map harassment is wrong, but the action of bugging the event, even if it isn’t an exploit, is really inconsiderate.

Gabe.3976:

….so, people should just be quiet and let themselves get cheated out of events so that an individual doesn’t have to slightly alter their playstyle?

I mean, map harassment is wrong, but the action of bugging the event, even if it isn’t an exploit, is really inconsiderate.

No complaining bout the bug is ok, but the fight and issues on the mapchat are teleported to here. The bug is reported and I’m pretty is going to be taken serious. but this biggering and fighting should stop.

Gabe.3976:

….so, people should just be quiet and let themselves get cheated out of events so that an individual doesn’t have to slightly alter their playstyle?

I mean, map harassment is wrong, but the action of bugging the event, even if it isn’t an exploit, is really inconsiderate.

Yeah, it’s inconsiderate. Complaining is fine. Public accusations of exploitation are seriously problematic, however. People are tarring someone’s reputation without first verifying if ArenaNet thinks it is an exploit.

Guns and Giblets.9308:

Gabe.3976:

….so, people should just be quiet and let themselves get cheated out of events so that an individual doesn’t have to slightly alter their playstyle?

I mean, map harassment is wrong, but the action of bugging the event, even if it isn’t an exploit, is really inconsiderate.

Yeah, it’s inconsiderate. Complaining is fine. Public accusations of exploitation are seriously problematic, however. People are tarring someone’s reputation without first verifying if ArenaNet thinks it is an exploit.

As i stated before.. this is the ONLY post i have seen dealing with this issue and i only made the post here because we need to get an answer on this. It has yet to be identified as a bug as far as i know and i have seen him downed just as fast with no marks or skills being used. If it is a bug, it seems to be internal, not external and caused by anyone’s actions.

The blatant fact of the matter is that just because i have to drop my marks before the fight (as i orginally stated) because once it starts i lag so badly (5 fps) because of the number of people there and the amount of spells going off should NOT make me or anyone else a target for map chat insults, threats or anything else.

Once again.. if anyone knows of a post where this has been discussed before by any Anet rep, please post the link here.

Please keep the derogatory remarks and insults in open chat and on the forums to yourself. There is no need to slander or deface anyone because they are looking for an official answer to what seems to be a simple mistake in the coding of the mob and an internal problem that has yet to even be identified.

Using skills as they are designed and intended is not an exploit.

I did hear rumors last week that people were using traps ( the ones from kiel’s waypoint close to there) to somehow bug the instigator, but i wouldn’t know for sure since i never used any of them.

My marks are however my skills and they are working as intended and as per their description.

You’re absolutely correct, your skills are working as intended. I think you’re still misinterpreting what people are calling a bug. Nobody is saying your skills are bugged. Your skills are working like they should. the problem is the Instigator isn’t acting properly, and it’s causing what is normally an ordinary interaction to be extremely frustrating for everyone else. And because the instigator is bugged, your skills (which are not bugged!) are interacting in an unexpected and abusive manner.

Kind of like if there was an area of the map which had clipping disabled accidentally in a patch and you could just walk up to some chests that normally require a boss fight / jumping puzzle to get to. your walking is not bugged, but the area of the game it’s interacting with is. Only problem is, in this case, it’s causing massive amounts of people to not get any action on the instigator, which of course causes frustration, as they put time and effort into farming the guy, much like you do.

You are using the skills as designed, yes. That in itself is not an exploit. But using them on a bugged piece of the game can be abusive, and does negatively impact the enjoyment of others. It’s compounded in this case because you literally lose nothing by using a different type of attack and allowing other people to get damage on it before it dies, so there’s not even a material (in game) benefit to this exploitation of a bug. Doing it really only makes people frustrated, and a lot of those people get too emotional in chat.

I think you’ll find that I haven’t been name calling, I’m only trying to outline why you should change your playstyle (for now) until the bug is fixed. I don’t want to see people getting accounts retroactively banned for exploiting because they’re “just using skills as intended”. It’s a bad situation but you’re literally the only person who can stop aggravating all those people, by making a small change to your playstyle, when in that tiny portion of the map, fighting that single mob.

Personally, I do not think it is the aoe trap placed on the spot where he spawns that is causing the improper scaling issue.

Notice how everyone hangs out on the rocks? I feel that the area of detection (box?) that is used to scale the instigator is not large enough and does not encompass the area of the rocks where the majority are at.

And since everyone is back on the rocks out of this scaling box when he spawns and is scaled due to the instant triggering of the trap, that he is then improperly scaled.

So it is not the necro/ranger/thief dropping traps that is causing the improper scaling, it is, in fact, those hanging out on the rocks and doing the whining/incorrectly passing blame that are causing the improper scaling.

Anet needs to properly define the area of the scaling detection to include the rocky area where the majority hang out waiting for him to spawn.

It is in fact people on the rocks and whining? This is a new issue, people have been on the rocks since the event opened up. Please use less inflammatory language to describe the people who are trying to prevent someone from taking away their chances at some payoff for the time invested in the event, simply because “it’s how the skills are intended to work”.

And to top it off, those of us “Whiners” who don’t wait on the rocks, but instead will wait behind the instigator or off to the side, many of us were denied loot, too.

alchahest.1423:

It is in fact people on the rocks and whining? This is a new issue, people have been on the rocks since the event opened up. Please use less inflammatory language to describe the people who are trying to prevent someone from taking away their chances at some payoff for the time invested in the event, simply because “it’s how the skills are intended to work”.

And to top it off, those of us “Whiners” who don’t wait on the rocks, but instead will wait behind the instigator or off to the side, many of us were denied loot, too.

It is not a new issue, it has been occurring since the start. You may not have experienced it from that point, but it has been happening since then.

I did not use any inflammatory language to describe people that stand on the rocks outside of the theoretical scaling detection zone. I did, however, use intentionally non-inflammatory language to describe them based on their documented behaviors and quoted choices of words against those dropping traps. Yes, they are whining. One who whines is, by definition, a whiner. Much worse could be said of them and their behavior.

I stated nothing of there also being people who are whining and are also not on the rocks. Did you just confirm that there are also people in the battle area who whine as well? I did not include them in that statement as I specified those on the rocks, you included them.

Perhaps those that are not up on the rocks should encourage those that are to come down to the actual area where the Instigator spawns to potentially prevent improper scaling from occurring.

I also did not state that those who were not on the rocks and were actually within the spawn area, yet happened to be unable to target the Instigator to take part in the improperly scaled event, were whiners or to blame whatsoever.

All who are denied the chance to take part in the combat due to their distance from the improperly scaled event is extremely unfair and very disappointing. I myself have missed out on taking part even though the fight began at the time I waypointed to Kiels and was unable to make that short distance to the fight before it was over.

However, the less than adequate targeting system is no excuse if you are in the area waiting for him to spawn. You do not need to actually target and attack the Instigator directly to get credit for taking part and receive the chest. Attacking the settlers grants equal participation to attacking the Instigator. If you insist on receiving a chance at his body granting loot, then there are many skills and abilities that any person can activate, regardless of class, that are active without having a selected target…just use them in his general direction and the power of odds that one hit will land is greater than not.

/Bump for an anet answer pls

BTW.. it does seem to happen when there are NO marks or spells down at all. I think it does have something to do with the number of people that are standing close to him.

Maybe since they changed the rock cliff this last patch (it has been changed since it is now a darker purple and some of the rocks at the top were changed graphically) that maybe it isn’t detecting the people that stand at the top when it spawns, which is where everyone who has been complaining seems to stand.

If it is marks or spells, it doesn’t seem to be consistent. I still throw my marks down in the area, as this is how you play the class, but i try and throw them to the sides to tag the adds instead to make sure i get credit for the event when i start to lag.

I would still like to hear from an Anet official as to if this is a bug. As stated earlier, i have YET to see any other posts on this matter and still continue to receive private tells and /m chat comments from people just because i choose to stand down in the area where he spawns.

Can we please get an official answer on this?