Guild Wars 2

nicknamenick, Furious has always granted 1 stack of adrenaline whenever you did critical damage, the tooltip was wrong sinds day one.

But I don’t know why, for some reason a dev once messed up that tooltip even more (in a “correction” patch note, the irony) into triple adrenaline. Wich is completely wrong.

Sinds Warriors need to have 30 stacks of adrenaline for a lvl 3 Burst and a considering a single flurry can still achieve to get
1 Bar when dealing critical hits on 1 target
2 Bars when dealing critical hits on 2 targets
3 Bars when dealing critical hits on 3 targets

We can consider the effect hasn’t change sinds the patch note and the tooltip now actualy display its real purpose.

Ambrecombe.4398:

nicknamenick, Furious has always granted 1 stack of adrenaline whenever you did critical damage, the tooltip was wrong sinds day one.

But I don’t know why, for some reason a dev once messed up that tooltip even more (in a “correction” patch note, the irony) into triple adrenaline. Wich is completely wrong.

Sinds Warriors need to have 30 stacks of adrenaline for a lvl 3 Burst and a considering a single flurry can still achieve to get
1 Bar when dealing critical hits on 1 target
2 Bars when dealing critical hits on 2 targets
3 Bars when dealing critical hits on 3 targets

We can consider the effect hasn’t change sinds the patch note and the tooltip now actualy display its real purpose.

Well the June 23rd patch did mention Furious is supposed to give triple adrenaline and the most recent one said nothing therefore triple has to be correct! :P

Khisanth.2948:

Well the June 23rd patch did mention Furious is supposed to give triple adrenaline and the most recent one said nothing therefore triple has to be correct! :P

I know, but the June 23rd patch note was the most awkward change sinds the effect never was a multiplying value to start with and the previous tooltip was closer to its true value compared to the new one.

Also I rather keep the way it has always worked, it is so fun to root your target in place with Flurry and to be allowed to follow it up with a Combustive Shot whenever you switch weapon.

Ambrecombe.4398:

Khisanth.2948:

Well the June 23rd patch did mention Furious is supposed to give triple adrenaline and the most recent one said nothing therefore triple has to be correct! :P

I know, but the June 23rd patch note was the most awkward change sinds the effect never was a multiplying value to start with and the previous tooltip was closer to its true value compared to the new one.

Also I rather keep the way it has always worked, it is so fun to root your target in place with Flurry and to be allowed to follow it up with a Combustive Shot whenever you switch weapon.

I don’t see how making it triple rather than double would stop you from continuing to do that. I’ve never gotten any adrenaline from flurry(I don’t use the trait) so I am not sure how that works.

Khisanth.2948:

I don’t see how making it triple rather than double would stop you from continuing to do that. I’ve never gotten any adrenaline from flurry(I don’t use the trait) so I am not sure how that works.

Ok let me explain it with an exemple.

For instance right now when you hit a target, you gain 1 strike of adrenaline. Dealing a critical hit gives you 1 additional strike of adrenaline. So every critical hit you do with you strike will generate
a. [(1 + 1) x crit chance/100] = overall strikes of adrenaline with normal attacks.

If I use Flurry, wich is our burst skill on sword, you spend all your adrenaline whenever you use that skill. Because every hits done by this skill generates 0 additional strike of adrenalines. But with Furious trait, I am still generating adrenaline because it works this way
b. [12 x (0 + 1) x crit chance/100] = overall strikes of adrenaline with your Flurry.

Should I now use your version of it granting triple adrenaline on every critical strike I would get the following results
a. [(1 × 3) x crit chance/100] = overall strikes of adrenaline with normal attacks
b. [12 x (0 × 1) x crit chance/100] = 0 strike of adrenaline with your Flurry.

Do you understand my point now?

Ambrecombe.4398:

Khisanth.2948:

I don’t see how making it triple rather than double would stop you from continuing to do that. I’ve never gotten any adrenaline from flurry(I don’t use the trait) so I am not sure how that works.

Ok let me explain it with an exemple.

For instance right now when you hit a target, you gain 1 strike of adrenaline. Dealing a critical hit gives you 1 additional strike of adrenaline. So every critical hit you do with you strike will generate
a. [(1 + 1) x crit chance/100] = overall strikes of adrenaline with normal attacks.

If I use Flurry, wich is our burst skill on sword, you spend all your adrenaline whenever you use that skill. Because every hits done by this skill generates 0 additional strike of adrenalines. But with Furious trait, I am still generating adrenaline because it works this way
b. [12 x (0 + 1) x crit chance/100] = overall strikes of adrenaline with your Flurry.

Should I now use your version of it granting triple adrenaline on every critical strike I would get the following results
a. [(1 × 3) x crit chance/100] = overall strikes of adrenaline with normal attacks
b. [12 x (0 × 1) x crit chance/100] = 0 strike of adrenaline with your Flurry.

Do you understand my point now?

Well I see that you’ve missed my point.

If double is [12 x (0 + 1) x crit chance/100] then triple should be [12 x (0 + 2) x crit chance/100]

Khisanth.2948:

Well I see that you’ve missed my point.

If double is [12 x (0 + 1) x crit chance/100] then triple should be [12 x (0 + 2) x crit chance/100]

I understand what you are trying to say but that statement is just wrong. Anytime you speak about doubling or tripling a product you increase its value exponentialy, not additively.

So in this exemple, should it ever state you gain 3 times the product of a base value, the result should always be 3 times that base value, no matter what. If you do otherwise the description remains inaccurate.
If 1×3 = 3 = triple -> 1 Normal Blow
than 0×3 = 0 = triple -> 1 Blow from Burst Skill

The description can only be true if it was writen the following way “you gain additional adrenaline with each critical hits”, and in this case specificy the amount you gain in the tooltip.

Just wanted to point out that the wiki has now been updated to say that Furious only grants 1 strike instead of 3.

The last time Furious was listed in patch noes was June 25th, 2013 (http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Game_updates/June_2013) which increased the adrenaline gain to “triple adrenaline is rewarded on critical attacks.”

The Oct 15th patch notes do not mention the Furious trait, yet the tool tip and the in game effect were both changed. Is this a bug or a “stealth” nerf? Thanks.

Wallace MacBix.2089:

Just wanted to point out that the wiki has now been updated to say that Furious only grants 1 strike instead of 3.

The last time Furious was listed in patch noes was June 25th, 2013 (http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Game_updates/June_2013) which increased the adrenaline gain to “triple adrenaline is rewarded on critical attacks.”

The Oct 15th patch notes do not mention the Furious trait, yet the tool tip and the in game effect were both changed. Is this a bug or a “stealth” nerf? Thanks.

Well according to Ambrecombe’s post above there hasn’t been any change to the functionally of the trait. Someone just messed with the tooltip several times.

Khisanth.2948:

Wallace MacBix.2089:

Just wanted to point out that the wiki has now been updated to say that Furious only grants 1 strike instead of 3.

The last time Furious was listed in patch noes was June 25th, 2013 (http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Game_updates/June_2013) which increased the adrenaline gain to “triple adrenaline is rewarded on critical attacks.”

The Oct 15th patch notes do not mention the Furious trait, yet the tool tip and the in game effect were both changed. Is this a bug or a “stealth” nerf? Thanks.

Well according to Ambrecombe’s post above there hasn’t been any change to the functionally of the trait. Someone just messed with the tooltip several times.

His posts are related to how the Furious trait works with our burst skills, not the Furious trait for all (crit) attacks. Since the Oct 15th patch the amount of adrenaline gained from a normal critical has gone down to +1 (for a total of 2) instead of what it was before. “…triple adrenaline is rewarded on critical attacks” would mean we should be getting +2 (or 3 strikes total) of adrenaline on a critical hit. While I don’t have any videos pre patch, you can “feel” the difference.

And either way it still was never noted in patch notes, which is why I still hope this is a bug, and not intended.

Ambrecombe.4398:

So in this exemple, should it ever state you gain 3 times the product of a base value, the result should always be 3 times that base value, no matter what. If you do otherwise the description remains inaccurate.
If 1×3 = 3 = triple -> 1 Normal Blow
than 0×3 = 0 = triple -> 1 Blow from Burst Skill

The description can only be true if it was writen the following way “you gain additional adrenaline with each critical hits”, and in this case specificy the amount you gain in the tooltip.

I’ve noticed burst crits gave +adrenaline with Furious.

So whatever the description said about triple, the math formula for actually adding adrenaline must have always been additive for the very reason you stated.

It almost makes sense to simply say Triple, since ~90% of Warrior moves are 1 adrenaline. But the few skills that have a base adrenaline gain of zero, show us the ACTUAL coding MUST have been something functionally equivalent to this:

If Normal Attack then Adrenaline = 1
If Burst Attack then Adrenaline = 0
IF Furious Trait=Yes, and Crit=Yes, then Adrenaline = Adrenaline + 2

In other words, ANet needs to decide which way they want to go with this trait. Do they want it to say “Adds +2 adrenaline on crit” which means adjusting the tooltip, or “grants triple adrenaline” in which case they need to adjust their code.

I vote they just update the wording of the tooltip…. every time they touch the code, something breaks. Look how bad they messed up chaos storm last week!

Dand.8231:

Ambrecombe.4398:

So in this exemple, should it ever state you gain 3 times the product of a base value, the result should always be 3 times that base value, no matter what. If you do otherwise the description remains inaccurate.
If 1×3 = 3 = triple -> 1 Normal Blow
than 0×3 = 0 = triple -> 1 Blow from Burst Skill

The description can only be true if it was writen the following way “you gain additional adrenaline with each critical hits”, and in this case specificy the amount you gain in the tooltip.

I’ve noticed burst crits gave +adrenaline with Furious.

So whatever the description said about triple, the math formula for actually adding adrenaline must have always been additive for the very reason you stated.

It almost makes sense to simply say Triple, since ~90% of Warrior moves are 1 adrenaline. But the few skills that have a base adrenaline gain of zero, show us the ACTUAL coding MUST have been something functionally equivalent to this:

If Normal Attack then Adrenaline = 1
If Burst Attack then Adrenaline = 0
IF Furious Trait=Yes, and Crit=Yes, then Adrenaline = Adrenaline + 2

In other words, ANet needs to decide which way they want to go with this trait. Do they want it to say “Adds +2 adrenaline on crit” which means adjusting the tooltip, or “grants triple adrenaline” in which case they need to adjust their code.

I vote they just update the wording of the tooltip…. every time they touch the code, something breaks. Look how bad they messed up chaos storm last week!

Personally I always thought the anomaly of gaining adrenaline during a burst skill was related to this (from the wiki)

http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Burst

Burst skills do not necessarily immediately drain adrenaline after connecting with a foe, and will only drain adrenaline upon following up with another skill or effect and widely varies. For example, triggering Furious or a Sigil of Fire will drain your adrenaline during Flurry’s channeling effect. Versatile Rage’s adrenaline gain when swapping weapons can also drain this adrenaline. Following up with a second burst skill will result in a unique zero-adrenaline burst effect.

With Furious (or a Sigil of Fire) caused the adrenaline to drain and then allow more to be gained, but I could be wrong.

Do they want it to say “Adds +2 adrenaline on crit” which means adjusting the tooltip, or “grants triple adrenaline” in which case they need to adjust their code.

Unless I’m mistaken, those are the same thing. And currently both the code and the tool tips were changed from what they were.

Also compare this to the Axe Mastery, Master Discipline trait.
“Critical hits with axes grant extra adrenaline. Reduces recharge on axe skills.” This trait grants +2 strikes of adrenaline on an axe critical, in addition to reducing the axe recharge by 20%.

Compared to the Grandmaster Arms Trait, Furious which currently only grants +1 strike of adrenaline on a critical.

Just the difference between Master and Grandmaster traits makes me think that this has to be a bug.

Wallace MacBix.2089:

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Also compare this to the Axe Mastery, Master Discipline trait.
“Critical hits with axes grant extra adrenaline. Reduces recharge on axe skills.” This trait grants +2 strikes of adrenaline on an axe critical, in addition to reducing the axe recharge by 20%.

Compared to the Grandmaster Arms Trait, Furious which currently only grants +1 strike of adrenaline on a critical.

Just the difference between Master and Grandmaster traits makes me think that this has to be a bug.

Well I wouldn’t complain if it becomes a +2 adrenaline gain on critical strike, but I have always used this trait and I can pretty much ensure you it has always been +1.

Now for the master trait affecting axes. I never played a lot with those (because the lack of utility in this set) so I could’t confirm if it has always been +2. I know for instance there wasn’t any cooldown reduction on that trait when I started the game, but if it was a +1 or +2 is something I honestly have no idea.

Any update on this? I’d like to know if it’s intentional that it’s only giving 1 extra adrenaline per critical, instead of 2. If it’s been nerfed, or otherwise adjusted, I’d like to know so I can rearrange my build accordingly.

Arcturus Dathanarr.3568:

Any update on this? I’d like to know if it’s intentional that it’s only giving 1 extra adrenaline per critical, instead of 2. If it’s been nerfed, or otherwise adjusted, I’d like to know so I can rearrange my build accordingly.

^?

Have any of the developers commented on this?