Guild Wars 2

I’m fairly new to “computer stuff” so bear with me :>

My specs:
AMD Phenom II X3 720 @ 2.80ghz
6 RAM
AMD Radeon 6870

I read this game is heavy on the processor and is Intel bias. I have a motherboard that only supports AMD processors and I really don’t want to buy a whole new motherboard. I found a website that tells me the processors that could run with my motherboard (http://www.asus.com/Motherboards/M3A78EM/specifications/)

I don’t know what exactly I’m looking for in a CPU… I basically look at gigahertz but Idk if I should be looking at other things…

So my question is, which CPU should I go for??

The only Intel bias is Intel cores are inherently more powerful than AMDs since the Core 2 came out 8 years ago. AMD has been playing catch up since.

Here’s the problem. While you may get some additional performance out of a Phenom II X4 quad core, they are virtually gone from the market. And since you have a socket AM2+ motherboard, you can’t even go with an FX- series CPU. On top of that, having an AM2+ motherboard means you have DDR2 memory. Currently DDR3 is widely used with DDR4 just starting to come out for the uber high end Intel X99 motherboards for Haswell-E CPUs.

So not a lot of options CPU wise. A Phenom II X4 925 is simply a quad core version of your trio core CPU and that won’t buy you much of anything in terms of improved performance. Not sure if you can find a 945 or 965.

http://www.amazon.com/dp/B0047T7NI2

To be honest you are in desperate need of a new system. Any reasonably priced motherboard upgrade, either AMD or Intel, will require you to toss your current memory for DDR3.

Thanks for the reply!

I understand I need a new system but I am on a tight budget and I’m def. going to look at building my own computer. That’s in the way future though…

I’ve been browsing CPUs and found this (http://www.cpumedics.com/hdz980fbk4dgm.html?cmp=googleproducts&kw=hdz980fbk4dgm?141001&gclid=CjwKEAjwkrmhBRD49Mbm_MvruWsSJAAEDt13LElaWpNWfNZ67B8aFz_bD9ezuXOdyCbz02FTU4GiGRoCPWTw_wcB)

Now, Idk if this would be compatible for my current motherboard.. but it seems like the most sufficient CPU that I’ve found.

Also, what is the significance of DDR memory?

According to the link to your motherboard, it supports up to the 965, assuming the BIOS is new enough, but that’s an easy enough fix. The last BIOS update for that motherboard came out 5-6 months before the 980 which is why it’s not supported. On a per core basis, the 965 is 20% faster than your 720.

http://www.cpumedics.com/hdz965fbk4dgm.html

That is the latest, lower wattage version of the 965 BE.

Wow thanks for the help! I really appreciate it!!

I think that’s the CPU I want to go for.

I’m guessing you will likely need to update your BIOS.

http://www.asus.com/Motherboards/M3A78EM/HelpDesk_Download/

Select your OS (which doesn’t actually matter) and choose BIOS and the first one listed is the latest. Then read your motherboard manual about flashing a new BIOS (if you misplaced it a PDF of the manual is also on that page as well as the latest BIOS upgrade tool).

Since you will be buying a tray version of the CPU, meaning it doesn’t come with a cooler or anything, you will have to reuse the current heatsink so once you remove it you really need to clean the side that will be touching the CPU, reapply thermal compound, etc.

Edit: All of this said, I’m not sure pouring that much money into a 20% faster CPU is the best course of action. In comparison the core found on an Intel Pentium G3258 that sirsquishy is talking about below is twice as fast as your 720 and it’s two cores can outpace that tricore by 35%. And that’s at stock clocks and the G3258 is crazy overclockable (35%-40%) even with the default Intel heatsink (although tossing a $30-40 aftermarket heatsink is still advisable).

The point is if you could save up another $100-150 you could have a considerably faster setup (CPU, motherboard, memory) than the amount spent on a “new” X4 965 BE.

As for your question about DDR memory. Simply put every few years, to achieve faster memory transfers, DDR memory undergoes a design shift that includes electrical voltage changes as well as signal timings. Original DDR was officially limited to 400 million transfers a second. DDR2 was 1066 and DDR3 to 2133. DDR4 is very new and starts at 2133. The memory controller on your CPU dictates the type and maximum (official) speed. And to prevent people from plugging the wrong kind into a motherboard, each type of DDR memory sticks are keyed differently. Currently DDR3-1600 is a common “speed” even though it’s faster than what is commonly “official” for CPUs.

Now even though your X3 720 or a X4 965 has both DDR2 and DDR3 controllers, other components on a AM2+ motherboard, including how the memory slots are keyed, means you can only use DDR2 memory in your setup. An AM3 motherboard is wired for DDR3.

You can buy a used 965BE off ebay from $70-$120, that is already new territory for a new CPU/Motherboard.

If i were you, and looking at that very option, I would take a look at the Intel G3258 and a Z97-G43 Motherboard and see if you can budget it. The G3258 will be 2x’s to 3x’s faster then ANY AMD CPU when it comes down to performance for GW2.

You will have to upgrade your Memory as well. As you are currently on DDR2.

While the G3258 is an overclockable CPU, and you will need a Z87 or Z97 chipset to enable the overclocking features for it, you do not HAVE to overclock that CPU if you do not want to. And yes, with out OCing the CPU the stock cooler that comes with it will be just fine.

But, I would not put any money into an aging platform like AM2+ or AM3 at this point. Even if its just a CPU. I would budget for a newer platform (Even AM3+ with an FX8370e if you wanted/needed to stay AMD)

edit actually looked at your MB link and saw that its an AM2+ with Support for only DDR2. :-)

many non z boards can overclock the pentium K.

http://forums.anandtech.com/showthread.php?t=2389948

Albeit not as well as z97 boards, though at under 60 USD its decent for a budget build. Especially now that pentium k’s are around 60 USD as well. 120 for a new cpu/oc mobo is a great deal these days. And much more worthwhile than spending money on such an old platform

dodgycookies.4562:

many non z boards can overclock the pentium K.

http://forums.anandtech.com/showthread.php?t=2389948

Albeit not as well as z97 boards, though at under 60 USD its decent for a budget build. Especially now that pentium k’s are around 60 USD as well. 120 for a new cpu/oc mobo is a great deal these days. And much more worthwhile than spending money on such an old platform

I know H and B boards can play with the detected/supported multiplier (x9-x32) But I my understanding was the H and B’s would only allow OC via the FSB (which puts everything out of wack) even if the CPU was unlocked.

BUT, you are right on that. 120~ for a H97/H87 + G3258 is a HUGE deal when building under a budget. AMD cannot touch that for the performance you get out of that dual core Intel Haswell CPU. Can’t even touch it :-)

The h/b boards oc in the same way z boards do as intel left loopholes in the microcode lock that have yet to be patched. However they typically cannot change the base clock and have less power phases. Also the fsb is oced in many cases to use 1600 or higher ram because the pentium k technically only supports 1333.

I suspect this was an “intentional” loophole specifically for the pentium K but somehow also allowed the unintentional non z overclock of the i5/i7 k’s. There was supposed to be a patch but no one has seen it yet.

Personally i think that the fix is an all or nothing type, and that to fix the i5/i7 k oc on the low end boards they also needed to remove the overclocking of the pentium k on the same boards. And after seeing the massive uptake on the pentium k + h/b boards, decided it wasn’t worth it to anger all those customers (who might upgrade to better chips in the future) to fix a problem with such a small part of their user base. Very few people imo would spend 250 on a 4690k and not pony up the little bit extra for a z97 board.

And you both missed the …

Dishy.3168:

I understand I need a new system but I am on a tight budget and I’m def. going to look at building my own computer. That’s in the way future though…

He understands that he needs a new “core” to his rig (motherboard/CPU/RAM) but currently doesn’t have money for that now.

Behellagh.1468:

And you both missed the …

Dishy.3168:

I understand I need a new system but I am on a tight budget and I’m def. going to look at building my own computer. That’s in the way future though…

He understands that he needs a new “core” to his rig (motherboard/CPU/RAM) but currently doesn’t have money for that now.

we do not know his budget. he never stated it. But if he is considering upgrading his CPU from the x3 to anything that will fit that AM2+ socket, he is looking at 120~ as it is.

so why not just upgrade to a G3258 and H87 based motherboard for the same cost (or near due to memory as well) and get 2-3x’s the performance of what a 965BE can bring to the table.

sirsquishy.8531:

Behellagh.1468:

And you both missed the …

Dishy.3168:

I understand I need a new system but I am on a tight budget and I’m def. going to look at building my own computer. That’s in the way future though…

He understands that he needs a new “core” to his rig (motherboard/CPU/RAM) but currently doesn’t have money for that now.

we do not know his budget. he never stated it. But if he is considering upgrading his CPU from the x3 to anything that will fit that AM2+ socket, he is looking at 120~ as it is.

so why not just upgrade to a G3258 and H87 based motherboard for the same cost (or near due to memory as well) and get 2-3x’s the performance of what a 965BE can bring to the table.

Becomes sometimes people still need to pay the rent and eat occasionally. Sure we can partpicker something in the $250 range around a G3258 but for some people that extra $100 might as well be $1000 for some.

http://pcpartpicker.com/p/TNgTFT

Well, I do still live with my parents so I don’t pay any bills or anything. I just wanted to save up for books next semester, and I’ve been spending a abundant of money on in-game items so yeah.. BUT I do still have time to save up for books!

I’ve been reading some reviews on the suggested CPU (G3258) and motherboard (Z97)… and I think I might go for it. It does seem like a better deal for performance than going for a 965. I also read a review for G3258 that he/she overclocked it to 4.0 without touching the stock fan or voltage.. o_O

I’m looking at these 2 specifically

CPU: (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16819117374)

Motherboard: (http://www.amazon.com/ASUS-Z97-A-DDR3-2600-Motherboards/dp/B00K2MAU5Q/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1412367436&sr=8-1&keywords=asus+z97#customerReviews)

Do you guys think they’re compatible for each other?? I only understand that the motherboard is ASUS Z97 w/ DDR3 memory. I don’t know what the other text/numbers mean xD

Behellagh.1468:

sirsquishy.8531:

Behellagh.1468:

And you both missed the …

Dishy.3168:

I understand I need a new system but I am on a tight budget and I’m def. going to look at building my own computer. That’s in the way future though…

He understands that he needs a new “core” to his rig (motherboard/CPU/RAM) but currently doesn’t have money for that now.

we do not know his budget. he never stated it. But if he is considering upgrading his CPU from the x3 to anything that will fit that AM2+ socket, he is looking at 120~ as it is.

so why not just upgrade to a G3258 and H87 based motherboard for the same cost (or near due to memory as well) and get 2-3x’s the performance of what a 965BE can bring to the table.

Becomes sometimes people still need to pay the rent and eat occasionally. Sure we can partpicker something in the $250 range around a G3258 but for some people that extra $100 might as well be $1000 for some.

http://pcpartpicker.com/p/TNgTFT

http://pcpartpicker.com/p/QNDYf7

136.47 to gut his CPU/MB and end with 4GB of ram.

I dont know where you get off talking like that, but its NOT appreciated.

LGA 1150 is the socket type which means Intel’s Haswell series of CPUs which the G3258 is one off with the current top end being the i7-4790K.

DDR3-2400 says the motherboard could support DDR3 memory that fast. Actually that’s wrong, Asus’s page for that motherboard says it can accept DDR3-3200 which is insane.

Z97 is the top end motherboard chipset for LGA 1150.

The motherboard also can support two video cards and has a port on the motherboard to accept a stick based SSD, the M.2 support.

It can also use SATA Express SSDs which can transfer data beyond the SATA 3 600MB/s limit, which is only important with expensive high end SSDs right now. Right now conventional hard drives barely get close to SATA 1’s 150MB/s limit.

And if you don’t know what ATX is, that’s the format of the motherboard which normally has 7 slots. It is important to know if your case can handle an ATX motherboard because it won’t fit in most store bought PCs (assuming a retrofit) which use micro ATX (mATX or uATX).

I think I know for certain on what I want to do…

Thanks for all the info guys I really appreciate the time!

sirsquishy.8531:

I dont know where you get off talking like that, but its NOT appreciated.

Sorry dude but I’ve seen far too often other DIYers blow past the budget requirements when recommending upgrades and systems, poo-pooing anything less. It’s the DIY builder version of Zerker only party fanatics. I simply wanted the participants in this conversation to remember that fact before others start chiming in for i5 or i7s, SSDs and even a video card upgrade.

Sorry if it ruffled your feathers.

Also he had 6GB so going to 4GB is a bit of a step back.

And well he did initially list a $239 CPU.

Behellagh.1468:

sirsquishy.8531:

I dont know where you get off talking like that, but its NOT appreciated.

Sorry dude but I’ve seen far too often other DIYers blow past the budget requirements when recommending upgrades and systems, poo-pooing anything less. It’s the DIY builder version of Zerker only party fanatics. I simply wanted the participants in this conversation to remember that fact before others start chiming in for i5 or i7s, SSDs and even a video card upgrade.

Sorry if it ruffled your feathers.

Also he had 6GB so going to 4GB is a bit of a step back.

And well he did initially list a $239 CPU.

well, just remember he never said what his budget was. He was talking about 965BE (they are 99-120 USED on ebay). The logical recommendation is the G3258 (60 now) and a supported MB (many many to choose from, they are as low as 38 now). So for the cost of that 965BE its actually cheaper to just buy the G3258 and a supported MB.

Granted his current system uses DDR2 so he will need to buy DDR3 with the new CPU/MB, and yea 4GB is a step back from 6GB. But DDR3 is faster then DDR2, and he can snap in another 4GB module when he gets another 40~ for the 2nd stick.

as for the rest of his system I am assuming that his Case will take a standard mATX motherboard. And his GPU is more then fine for the game (HD6870IIRC), so what else would he really have to upgrade to get more out of this game..even at 1080p?

Really nothing, other then maybe going with a i5 for 2 additional cores if the G3258 cant hold its own for him (Mine gets 90FPS with a 260x at 1080p on high settings, typical 18-24FPS in zergs…so lol)

I suggested something totally based on budget, and you threw it out saying the complete opposite. Coming from you, that was completely unexpected.

Sorry again, I kneejerked to the “throw everything away …” more so than what you were recommending, since you didn’t have it priced out at that point. I went with doggy’s Z97 comment as a motherboard baseline (cause it allows K series i5 and i7 for future CPU upgrades) and more than 6GB as a requirement to come up with $250 and he was already down to $170 from $240.

Something I forgot to consider…. if I plan on getting ASUS Z97-A motherboard, do I have get a new graphics card? I know I have to get new RAM, but what exactly? How much RAM would I need?

New RAM yes. The RAM you have, DDR2, won’t work/fit. Video card is fine. The HD 6870 should be similar in performance to the R7 260X. You can always upgrade that at a later date.

These are examples of the kind of memory you should get. 2×4GB sticks of DDR3-1600 with CAS 9 timings (or lower).

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820231544
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820226401

Just an update:

I got a z97 mb, g3258 cpu, and 8gb of RAM.

The performance is a big difference from what I experienced…. before I used to get close to 0 fps in large groups. Now I get only 30fps which is freaking awesome!

I really want to thank you guys for helping me! (especially Behellagh) <3

You’re welcome. Glad to see the upgrade went well.