Guild Wars 2

I bought Guild Wars 2 about 9 months ago hoping that my existing PC could handle the game, boy was I wrong. My computer runs this game at about 2-5 FPS, somehow I am still playing with it.

So I started to look into building my own gaming computer that can run games very well but at the same time is very affordable, here is what I came up with:

Case- http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16811146076
Motherboard- http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813131977
GPU-http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814125443
PSU-http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16817703038
CPU-http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16819116899
Hard Drive-http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16822136533
Disc Burner-http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16827135204

I didn’t put any RAM into the build because I have 8gb of RAM in my current computer that I want to put into this new build and put back in the old 4gb of RAM. I still need to find out if it will be compatible with this new build however.

I have read the reviews for all of the components but still would like further insight on these topics:
•How long will this build last?
•Is there any way to reduce the price of this build without losing performance?
•Should I go for the i7 processor or the i5?

As of now I don’t have an exact budget on the build but I would really like for the build to not exceed $1,000.

DaBleuberry.1780:

•How long will this build last?

The CPU market is so stagnant right now it could be a long time. You may have to replace the GPU at some point, especially if decent high res screens finally start showing up.

DaBleuberry.1780:

•Is there any way to reduce the price of this build without losing performance?

The 750 W PSU is overkill unless you’re planning heavy overclocks and/or multiple GPUs.

You don’t want the PSU getting near its stated max power — they do wear a little with time and are more efficient (and less noisy) at about 50-60% output — but with a single GPU and an Intel CPU… I’d say a 500 W model from a decent brand should be fine.

DaBleuberry.1780:

•Should I go for the i7 processor or the i5?

Games will not benefit much from the i7 — especially ones like GW2. Many others are heavily GPU limited in almost any situation and won’t show much difference in average framerate.

If you’re planning to encode lots of video, compile huge codebases or run some other task that parallelizes better than complicated game engines, the i7 might be worth it.

Also, I don’t see a CPU cooler in there. Get a 3rd party one; the Intel stock one is junk and can barely keep the i7 from overheating. The i5 sort of manages on it, but you don’t want to hear the stock cooler hit max speed. Even something like the cheap Cooler Master Hyper 212 EVO should be fine if you’re not planning an epic overclock.

If you have any money to spare get a 120+ GB SSD and install your OS on that; the computer will feel a lot faster.

Intel i5 processors are not high-end CPUs. They are budget / business CPUs for general use. You should honestly go for an i7 as they will lend you more CACHE than i5 processors. CACHE is critical for a gaming system.

It saddens me that to this day you still see players/people say i5’s are better or not that much different than i7 processors. They are in fact much better over an i5 due to the CACHE. CACHE is an essential part for a gaming system and help in the performance area greatly.

You’re dropping some money into this system, so avoid an i5 processor if you can afford to do so. Businesses lean towards i5’s because it lowers the price in mass purchases to save money. If employees are doing day-to-day tasks, there is no need for an i7, whicher are in fact higher-end processors.

A 500W PSU is not a good idea if you are going to go with that GPU you linked. Between the processor and the GPU, 750W is perfectly fine and not overkill by any means. Plus this allows you to add hardware (i.e. HDs, etc.) in the future.

I am not trying to say Tota is dead wrong, I just disagree with him/her. It is in no way to be disrespectful.

Go with:
i7
8GB Memory (at least)
SSD if you can afford too, if not stick with 7200 RPM high-CACHE HDs
Good motherboard (one that allows for dual 16x PCI rails, not single)
GPU you picked is a good pick for the price, stay with it.
(don’t forget: hardware you already have can be ported over to your new system. i.e. HD, CDROM, etc.)

If you really want to get a great system for under $1,000 just ping me and I’ll help you pick-out the hardware. I have been building PCs since the 80’s and have a degree in electronics. I love the smell of electronic devices!

EDIT: The HD you linked is a bit high in price. I picked up a 2TB 7200 RPM 64MB CACHE drive for $92 at MicroCenter here in Denver. I would keep looking around for a better deal on that drive. Bit pricey for a 1TB drive if you ask me. Just an FYI

tip with newegg, I’ve been playing around with it lately for a future proof build myself – they have a lot of hidden great deals – I had found this 100 dollar discount deal on a 4770k with an msi mpower mobo – they took it down the next day – not sure if it was a typo or a one day sale – but I’ve kept playing around with combinations and finding major discounts – current build I’m putting together in my wishlist is -146 dollars in savings – also, keep your eye on the gtx 760 gamer version ….its 259 – and has some really good stats for it’s price range. – I’ve read people posting that 2 sli 760’s oc version performs as well as 1 titan.

Crawford.4135:

Intel i5 processors are not high-end CPUs. They are budget / business CPUs for general use. You should honestly go for an i7 as they will lend you more CACHE than i5 processors. CACHE is critical for a gaming system.

It saddens me that to this day you still see players/people say i5’s are better or not that much different than i7 processors. They are in fact much better over an i5 due to the CACHE. CACHE is an essential part for a gaming system and help in the performance area greatly.

If going from 6 MB to 8 MBs of cache made a huge difference in the CPU’s ability to work with anything, it would show in some single thread benchmark or weakly threaded game out there. In practice, the i7-4770K is within about 5% of the i5 equivalent’s performance in them, while its price is far higher.

The original poster is building a gaming PC on a budget here; I have to disagree with paying 40% extra for a CPU with +0-5%-ish gaming performance. Even considered as a part of the overall budget it’s starting to hit some diminishing returns there.

Crawford.4135:

A 500W PSU is not a good idea if you are going to go with that GPU you linked. Between the processor and the GPU, 750W is perfectly fine and not overkill by any means. Plus this allows you to add hardware (i.e. HDs, etc.) in the future.

I don’t think that system will ever draw more than ~350 W or so. If the PSU is a good 500 W that doesn’t catch fire when reaching 50% of its rated load, it shouldn’t be a problem. A modern 7200 RPM drive draws about 10 W while working hard so 1-2 more will not matter.

Of course, if he’s thinking about going with multiple GPUs at some point, the 750 W PSU would be an excellent idea.

I don’t think I plan on running with multiple GPU’s at a time. I will look more into detail with the PSU’s however, I need some more information before I finalize my decision.

Over the i5 and i7, it looks like there is a lot of controversy over it everywhere so that may take a while to take a side on. At first I went with the i7 because I wanted a powerful build but then when I finished I realized that the price was just way too high and I needed to edit the build a bit to reduce the cost.

Keep in mind this is my first PC build so don’t expect anything that great! :P

honestly, I’m taking my time and researching as much as I can before I spend anything – I’m finding there are 300 opinions and 500 variations per piece of gear – and it seems to be more of an art of building a computer than exact numbers.

as of this moment, my aim is an msi mpower max mobo with a 4770k @750watts psu – with a kracken water cooler – or a phantek – considering a xigmatek full tower – it’s a beast of a case that can hold 2 power supplies! I’m sure that will hold me over for quite a few years! lol – after that I can upgrade the rest of the parts over time.

btw – the parts i named for you total to about 1k without compromising a high end build. any decent gtx card, and 1600mhz xmp ram, will get a boost from additional perks in the msi board …..the extra space and cooling in that case will allow you to do a good overclock on a low fi gtx video card – which will hold you over till you save up for another great part to add to the Beast! What GW2 needs most is a strong cpu – with the kraken and the 4770k ( which also has an onboard video + msi gives you software to utilize it as well ) – you should be able to ( in theory ) do a good overclocking as need be, and see a big improvement in GW2.

I believe Crawford is suffering from justification blindness. Doesn’t matter how many benchmarks show limited performance difference between the top end i5 quad and a top end i7 quad that extra $100 buys, it must be better because I have one and paid that money. Just as some gamers ignore benchmarks and insist that the socket 2011 CPUs are better or that hex cores are better simply because they paid so much more for those CPUs and they don’t want to seem like fools for spending $500 or $1000 on an i7 CPU that plays game X just as well as a $200 i5.

Anyways 6MB of L3 cache is plenty for a 4 core/4 thread CPU like an i5. It’s the 4 core/8 thread nature of the i7 that justifies the 8MB.

@DaBleuBerry – As for skipping the memory part I sure hope your old memory is at least DDR3-1333 CAS 9. And yes you can easily knock 100 watts off that PSU and you don’t need an 80 Plus Gold, 80 Plus Silver or Bronze is good enough for a system your size.

Crawford.4135:

Intel i5 processors are not high-end CPUs. They are budget / business CPUs for general use. You should honestly go for an i7 as they will lend you more CACHE than i5 processors. CACHE is critical for a gaming system.

It saddens me that to this day you still see players/people say i5’s are better or not that much different than i7 processors. They are in fact much better over an i5 due to the CACHE. CACHE is an essential part for a gaming system and help in the performance area greatly.

So not true, cache is necesary for multithreaded tasks, games won’t really notice if u have 6 or 20mb cache since they won’t full utilize the 6mb anyway, u only need cache for workstation and server (Xeon grade CPUs) workloads, for gaming an i5 or a regular 1150 socket i7 will do as well if not better than any 1000$ socket 2011 CPU. Also u don’t need a motherboard with 40 PCIe lanes, a regular z87 motherboard will be just fine for single and double GPU configurations, even if u have 2 GTX titans.

just overclock the heck out of the i5.
check this out:
http://pcpartpicker.com/p/1iFyZ

Some games do utilize i7’s full potential and with the new consoles coming out shortly I would suspect that more PC games will be using multithreading. Currently, to my knowledge Battlefield 3 and Crysis 3 both take advantage of the i7’s threads.

My logic when investing in a new PC is longevity and making that hardware last for as long as possible. I would go with the Haswell i7 4770k for sure. That extra money has the possibility to make your PC last substantially longer.

GPU side, another poster mentioned that the industry is rather stagnant and that is correct. We really haven’t seen a massive increase in performance generationally(usually about 10-15%).

PSU is very important and make sure you get a 80+ bronze or higher, even for budget systems. Also make sure you get a reliable manufacturer. XFX and Corsair are relatively stable brands.

Aftermarket cooling is very important as well. The Kraken is a nice cooler but make sure you have a case that will fit it. H80i and H100i are good. I have never had a problem with heat on my H100i and my OC never gets to 80c under folding.

I’ll echo a couple of things others have said……

Budget in mind, the i5 is your best bang for your buck.
For a Haswell build 750w is indeed overkill for a single modern gpu setup. 500w is more than enough.

That said there are a few other things I would recommend considering:

Your case……You will be looking at this more often than you might think. Make sure to get one that pleases you aesthetically. Also be advised that the Haswell cpu/mobo has usb 3.0. The case in your OP did not. Might want to consider one that does. Make sure the size of the case fits where you will be placing it. I know that seems like common sense, but I have see a lot of full towers crowding tiny desks.

Haswell……this cpu is energy efficient. To take full advantage of this you may want to consider a psu that is able to effectively deliver very low power…ie……“haswell certified”. Haswell also has an memory controller that is more advanced than past iterations. At clock it may be able to take advantage of ddr3 2800 speeds, but as you oc that’ll go down. 1600-1866 should be sustainable at the upper oc speeds.

Your monitor….A lot of what has been said has not taken this into consideration. We need to know what kind you are planning to use with such a system. For example: if you are currently running a 30hz 1680×1050 monitor and have no plans on upgrading anytime soon then that will have a drastic effect on gpu recommendations. Point being dependent on what you will be using your gpu choice may vary 100s of dollars.

SSD…..make it snappy. The inclusion of kitten (filter*……a……..ssd) will add snap to your new system. I know they are not mandatory, but once you’ve used one you wonder how you managed w/o one.

Something everyone forgot to ask….What will this computer be used for? What monitor rez will you be running? You said nothing about the old computer other than it sucked, so with that in mind I am very doubtful it was a newer computer and as such probably has DDR2 RAM where the new build will need DDR3, so reusing the RAM might not be an option.

A 750W PSU is far and away over kill and getting a PSU way out of range puts a harder load on the PSU, it puts out more heat and efficiency drops, you want to load a PSU around 60-70% and no more than 80% for continuous load. My system (in sig) pulls 380-400W from my UPS, so thats AFTER the PSU waste, so my whole system is pulling about 350W from the PSU at load in GW2 (everything other than SS maxed). People over buy PSU’s all the time, save some money and get a 500W psu, or spend the same money and get a really nice well made 500W.

SSD is a waste, it will make the day to day system feel awesome, and load times (from map to map) faster, but will do nothing for FPS or game play.

If all you are looking for is a gain in GW2 the i5 is the choice. An i7 will not help, you will be better off with a i5 and OCing, if you plan on OCing. Also, watercoolers are over priced, get a good aircooler and enjoy, AIO watercoolers are for cramped cases where a tower cooler will not fit, the top of the line aircoolers will do just as good as the top AIO, however the aircoolers are often much quieter. Don’t spend the money in the wrong places, be smart about it and make the best use of what you have to spend.

yeah, then upgrade again next year when all the cheap parts aren’t good enough!

Ricky.4706:

yeah, then upgrade again next year when all the cheap parts aren’t good enough!

Games have not been leaps and bounds more demanding like they did in the good old days of PC gaming, since the consoles came into the market you have a stretch of 5+ years at a time where games stay the same as they are all ports, the demanding games being really poor ports that just perform bad, kinda like GW2, you reach a point with hardware of diminishing returns because its a poor/old engine and not a hardware issue (to a point). Every now and again we will have PC only games that push the limits of current hardware, but that’s not often and they are almost always more than playable on the normal systems, just don’t expect to max them.

When the new gen of consoles come out we will see much better games, graphically speaking hitting the market again, and only then will we be making use of the hardware we have had for years in the PC. They have been so slow to improve, where it use to be you had to upgrade your whole PC just to play a game, today, games are so undemanding of the hardware its pretty common to see triple monitor setups for gaming because the games are just not pushing the hardware anymore.

unfortunately, I’m finding that more and more developers are doing more poor coding, so in effect, I find that we don’t really upgrade to have new features but to compensate for errors. It seems that the more power we get, the more bugs are are tolerated as acceptable.

In fact, I dare even to say that this is why mac’s had an edge at one point, it wasn’t so much that their systems were better – but the software was very well made.

Ricky.4706:

unfortunately, I’m finding that more and more developers are doing more poor coding, so in effect, I find that we don’t really upgrade to have new features but to compensate for errors. It seems that the more power we get, the more bugs are are tolerated as acceptable.

In fact, I dare even to say that this is why mac’s had an edge at one point, it wasn’t so much that their systems were better – but the software was very well made.

Mac’s had a closed ecosystem, while windows had to deal with crappy hardware and poor to no driver support from thousands of vendors, it’s not that Mac/Apple systems were better or the software was made better, it’s that it only had to deal with a single set of hardware/drivers, and when you only have that to deal with it is very easy to make a stable system, just look at all the people who just wanted to add another GPU, even from the same family tree, it was a nightmare if it could be done at all. This is another reason devs go for consoles, you have one or two hardware/software setups to program for, so it’s easy, and when they come to port to PC, that just really don’t give a kitten as they already made their money off it and are just trying to milk somemore out of it.

fair enough, I can appreciate that response – especially after sorting through a ton of gear to build a new pc. Cheers

Oh yes, it is a hunt, and for the most part, Intel/AMD or AMD/Nvida, for the most part its about fan boys, or which has the best MIR at the time, only in very few cases, where you only play ONE game does branding matter, as sometimes you will run into games that play better with one over another. But other than that it can be hell to sort through. This is why MS has pushed into hardware side of things, they are wanting more control over the hardware running their OS, this first started with the “Vista certified” stuff, because when MS came out with the new OS and driver system in Vista, most all the third party hardware mfg’s sat on their hands thinking nothing changed, then when it came out and no drivers worked on it and hardware caused crashes and BSOD’s, to users, this meant it was Vista that was crap, when it was really poor driver support from the hardware they were using.

So best thing is quality parts, and knowing what your goal with the system is.