Guild Wars 2

King Amadaeus.8619:

DevonCarver.5370:

I’d love to say you should be able to get everything ever from just playing WvW, but not only is that not going to happen, it’s not good for the game as a whole.

but honestly if you want to get all the things in the game, you have to play all the game. Branch out, I suspect you’ll enjoy it. And WvW will still be there when you want to play it.

Pfffffft, it is obvious you guys just do not understand many of the WvWers….Read all I need to read moving forward. Thank you sir for the info.

They understand you KA….they understand PvE is carebear land full of $$ spending customers who like sparkles in the air and balloons…

They know that if this game were to be made more competitive, #’s would decrease in wvw b/c zerg babies would cry they dont win as much anymore against “elitest pricks”. Meanwhile, even alot of zergers are bored lol. Nice model.

Jscull.2514:

King Amadaeus.8619:

DevonCarver.5370:

I’d love to say you should be able to get everything ever from just playing WvW, but not only is that not going to happen, it’s not good for the game as a whole.

but honestly if you want to get all the things in the game, you have to play all the game. Branch out, I suspect you’ll enjoy it. And WvW will still be there when you want to play it.

Pfffffft, it is obvious you guys just do not understand many of the WvWers….Read all I need to read moving forward. Thank you sir for the info.

They understand you KA….they understand PvE is carebear land full of $$ spending customers who like sparkles in the air and balloons…

They know that if this game were to be made more competitive, #’s would decrease in wvw b/c zerg babies would cry they dont win as much anymore against “elitest pricks”. Meanwhile, even alot of zergers are bored lol. Nice model.

I just wish they would stop trying to make WvW’ers into PVE’ers, and sPVP’ers into WvW’ers, and PVE’ers into….Well whatever they are into.

I make fun of people that grinded legendary’s for the skin (same stats as an exotic), so really it makes no issues with me that EZNET does not want to reward WvW-only players. However I think that it is a joke that it is just another element that pulls people out of WvW to do things they really could care less to do otherwise. I mean for whatever reason people REALLY want that skin…Or they really want that ascended backpiece etc.

But don’t come in here and tell me to “branch out, that I would like it”, it is borderline slap in the face material. Kinda like me saying, “Hey mister developer, read some forum threads, you might learn what WvW’ers actually want”.

Jscull.2514:

They understand you KA….they understand PvE is carebear land full of $$ spending customers who like sparkles in the air and balloons…

I like sparkles and I’m wvw-focused. 5-6 days of the week. I’d pay for some sparkles, but I’d pay for them in wvw. Just yesterday the guildies that spent 3 hours farming 20g ended up turning around and spending it on the custom finishers (and this was us being cheap because PvE earns you obscene amounts of gold. We’d have shelled out real money if it weren’t so easy to dungeon). If they want sparkles, they are more than capable of implementing them in wvw. And I think a lot of wvw-ers would pay for them.

King Amadaeus.8619:

Jscull.2514:

King Amadaeus.8619:

DevonCarver.5370:

I’d love to say you should be able to get everything ever from just playing WvW, but not only is that not going to happen, it’s not good for the game as a whole.

but honestly if you want to get all the things in the game, you have to play all the game. Branch out, I suspect you’ll enjoy it. And WvW will still be there when you want to play it.

Pfffffft, it is obvious you guys just do not understand many of the WvWers….Read all I need to read moving forward. Thank you sir for the info.

They understand you KA….they understand PvE is carebear land full of $$ spending customers who like sparkles in the air and balloons…

They know that if this game were to be made more competitive, #’s would decrease in wvw b/c zerg babies would cry they dont win as much anymore against “elitest pricks”. Meanwhile, even alot of zergers are bored lol. Nice model.

I just wish they would stop trying to make WvW’ers into PVE’ers, and sPVP’ers into WvW’ers, and PVE’ers into….Well whatever they are into.

I make fun of people that grinded legendary’s for the skin (same stats as an exotic), so really it makes no issues with me that EZNET does not want to reward WvW-only players. However I think that it is a joke that it is just another element that pulls people out of WvW to do things they really could care less to do otherwise. I mean for whatever reason people REALLY want that skin…Or they really want that ascended backpiece etc.

But don’t come in here and tell me to “branch out, that I would like it”, it is borderline slap in the face material. Kinda like me saying, “Hey mister developer, read some forum threads, you might learn what WvW’ers actually want”.

Yes I felt that slap too. Many of the core guilds in WvW have been around for over 15+ years, every new WvW type game we are there, that is what we live for and enjoy. Our enjoyment is in winning a battle and ensuring we do it in the most efficient way. Many of us moved servers because our previous servers were too focused on PVE, we lose maps and objectives when and event is on and masses go and do an event. Yes we care about our WvW maps more.

Yes many of us would just pay with real money to have things available quickly, I sure many of us would pay for an expansion map or maps to be developed on-going. Test the wvw community sometime, you maybe surprised.

But my question is why are we telling you this Devon? You should know?

DevonCarver.5370:

Precursors do drop from the chests, but very rarely. I’d love to say you should be able to get everything ever from just playing WvW, but not only is that not going to happen, it’s not good for the game as a whole. We will continue to do what we can to improve the rewards available from WvW and there are some developments specifically relating to skill points that are coming soon to the game as a whole, but honestly if you want to get all the things in the game, you have to play all the game. Branch out, I suspect you’ll enjoy it. And WvW will still be there when you want to play it.

Anet should look into if they haven’t already expanding the achievement section in WvW, it has a lot of crazy achievements, might think about putting in some that are a little more reasonable.
But don’t get rid of those ones we have already. Just add onto it.

DevonCarver.5370:

Precursors do drop from the chests, but very rarely. I’d love to say you should be able to get everything ever from just playing WvW, but not only is that not going to happen, it’s not good for the game as a whole. We will continue to do what we can to improve the rewards available from WvW and there are some developments specifically relating to skill points that are coming soon to the game as a whole, but honestly if you want to get all the things in the game, you have to play all the game. Branch out, I suspect you’ll enjoy it. And WvW will still be there when you want to play it.

Here the thing, I DID enjoy it. I enjoyed Bioshock Infinite, too. In both cases, I beat on AI till I got my fill, then I moved on. WvW is about going up against living, thinking humans, where things are different every time, and the meta is always evolving. While I admit, I’ll hop over and look at the new PvE stuff every other week, it’s more out of curiosity than excitement.

So don’t act like the problem is that we’ve never given PvE a try. Guild Wars 2 made some giant leaps in MMO PvE content, but at the end of the day there are still lots of folks who aren’t here to beat on bots.

It seems to me that Tiers 2 through 8 (at least on the NA side) could overall, use a heavy injection of PvE’ers into WvW seeing as it’s rare to que all 4 maps at once aside from reset night. In fact, I wager to guess than many of these servers within those tiers often see that outmanned buff a fair amount when they enter WvW. The perfect way to do this would be to equalize the rewards in WvW itself.

From the very beginning, if we were told to play how we want to play, then loot in WvW gets sizeably reduced like it did in the last patch; if that doesn’t scream:

“Stop playing WvW and play this new living story content instead” then I don’t know what does.

Overall, WvW loot is not as good as PvE to begin with, but to reduce it the amount that they did makes no sense.. other than they want people to stop playing and join the living story instead. This hardly seems like a “play as you like scenario”.

There are players out there who do WvW strictly for the fights, but they are few and far between. Evidence of this rears it’s head when content comes out that proves to be a far better farming spot. Like that instigator event in southsun. Everytime I entered WvW during that event, we were either outmanned or all the maps were nearly empty.

I am surprised there isn’t a “Get 5 Precursors from WvW Rank chests” achievement, just to put the cherry on top of the already utterly wretched system we have in place currently.

If you stick to the game long enough, your heirs might one day have a shot at getting one out of there once the inheritate your holy grail of a GW 2 account.

I am sure it’ll be quite ceremonial.

And “hard to get with random luck” made me laugh out loud. The single most delusional remark on ANet’s RNG System I have yet to see. As there are people who just get precursors dropped for them with 0 effort and then there’s others who dump thousands of hours and gold into the acquisition of one and might never see one from any of the current RNG sources in place.

Tough luck.

Hrist.8972:

Obscure One.4357:

It was stated multiple times on multiple panels by multiple devs on the team.

I’ll bet you 100 gold I can find a direct quote in this regard that sounds similar to, “we don’t want our players to be forced to do content that they don’t want to do. You will be able to play the game exclusively in PvP and not be at any disadvantage for doing so.”

Now if won’t be that verbatim, but it’s gonna be real close. So whattya say? 100 gold on the table. I’m wrong and its all yours. Friendly wager.

What disadvantage are you experiencing these days if you play only WvW?

How about, making measly amounts of gold while PVE player base exploits orr and makes the money we earn in wvw seem like nothing? Not to mention the loot nerf from killing players. Has that been addressed yet? The amount I am currently earning is still way too low. For every 2g I make in wvw, my PVE friend makes 40g in FGS or Orr.

DevonCarver.5370:

Gadzooks.4687:

This is how I translate this most of this response:

My statement doesn’t require translation. WvW is a part of GW2, it is not its own game, it is not a standalone product and it is not separate from the game. Your characters from WvW are usable in PvE and vice-versa for a reason. I love WvW and prefer it to the rest of our game, but I still go and run Living World content when I feel like it. The idea is that all of our players create an ecosystem that is interdependent. If players only played one or the other, each area would be less compelling and less fun. Sure, there are some number of people who only play WvW, but more people play the rest of the game as well. If people had to pick which to play WvW would have fewer people playing it, period. Don’t confuse my belief that our game is better the more people you find around you with some sort of slighting of WvW or a statement that WvW is second best. I focus my efforts entirely on WvW every day of the week and I will continue to do so. We want everyone who buys our game to play as much of all the parts of the game they enjoy because that is what we do.

I have a question about this. I played GW1 for the GvG which I again hoped to find in GW2. That is not the case. As a result I do not play PvE, nor care for the living story. I have one commander character and because the WXP is not account bound I am not inclined to try another. (Do not get me wrong, I did level a few alts to around mid-50’s. But the leveling process is just mind numbing to me. I guess I pushed myself too much hoping to get any actual reward from 100% map completion on my main. That aside;…)

Are you planning to introduce any content that a player like me would like?
I mean sure, the finisher animations in the gem store look fun. But with zerging being the way to go in WvW (which I do not like, but if I roam and have a good fight I usually let the other player live…) I rarely see a finisher anyway. If I were to open up my wallet for this game I would like to see some content for it in return. (Or in the worst case even a world ability point reset.)

Point is that I am willing to even pay good money for content updates, but if these are not delivered I am only on board until the next MMO comes around the corner. One that hopefully does deliver the PvP experience I am looking for.

DevonCarver.5370:

Gadzooks.4687:

This is how I translate this most of this response:

My statement doesn’t require translation. WvW is a part of GW2, it is not its own game, it is not a standalone product and it is not separate from the game. Your characters from WvW are usable in PvE and vice-versa for a reason. I love WvW and prefer it to the rest of our game, but I still go and run Living World content when I feel like it. The idea is that all of our players create an ecosystem that is interdependent. If players only played one or the other, each area would be less compelling and less fun. Sure, there are some number of people who only play WvW, but more people play the rest of the game as well. If people had to pick which to play WvW would have fewer people playing it, period. Don’t confuse my belief that our game is better the more people you find around you with some sort of slighting of WvW or a statement that WvW is second best. I focus my efforts entirely on WvW every day of the week and I will continue to do so. We want everyone who buys our game to play as much of all the parts of the game they enjoy because that is what we do.

I agree, but why don’t we have a choice in the matter? Rewards in WvW are not even comparable at this point to the rewards in PVE. I tried out the farm in FGS, and all it involved was one large group of 50+ people running in one large circle around the map killing champions. The bosses melted so fast that sometimes it died before I even tagged it. Now this requires 0 skill. In WvW, killing a player requires more skill and it rewards ‘Junk’ (Believe it or not, in-game name). I don’t know if it is a bug or not, but I have been receiving less from killing players in general. Are PVE’rs forced to WvW for any item? WvW skins look like kitten. With reward chests they don’t even need to get ported up the EB JP for badges for a legendary, so why are we forced to PVE? I find it completely boring in comparison. I used to dungeon a bit with friends, but now I can’t even do that because of the ‘1 dungeon a day’ policy. My PVE friend makes x20 the amount I make in wvw, and it inflation due to exploiting in orr, the money I make is literally nothing.

DevonCarver.5370:

My statement doesn’t require translation. WvW is a part of GW2, it is not its own game, it is not a standalone product and it is not separate from the game.

Not trying to troll here, legitimate comment:

This is just further proof that many at ANET do not understand the interests of many (not all) of their “customerbase”.

Sir, we all understand that WvW is essentially only 1/3 of GW2, but there is a large sect of folks that have absolutely no desire to play (and some even HATE) the other 2/3’s.

The same can be said about people in PVE and PVP, they do not care for the other 2/3 either.

What’s it take for you guys to realize someone doesn’t have your interest in mind? Anet has no idea what their doing to make the pvp aspect better of wvw. I mean if you need examples look a year into the game…. I.e. supply mastery/treb mastery….

Devon is just a political peace keeper. He says what anyone with no answer says. For some reason you guys seem to believe he’s sitting on some gold mine Anet is dancing around. Don’t you think the company would have released it not to lose the numbers they have already? Lol

Haven’t read most of the thread apart from first page, but why is there still no (decent) looking armor sets and weapon sets that can only be acquired through WvW? You know, a variety and nice looking ones like the ones you can obtain through PvE. Invader armor and weapons are fugly.

Jscull.2514:

What’s it take for you guys to realize someone doesn’t have your interest in mind?

Pretty much realized that when they started devoting manpower to creating new content every two weeks for PVE, and created a progression system in WvW thinking they would:

1. Hush the people complaining about end game / WvW progression.
2. (Most importantly) be able to roll out a new “mastery” in that two week time-span to justify “new WvW content”.

Other than supply mastery, the single greatest joke in mmo history….

The fact you still can’t KICK people out of party after they leave is just ludicrous. Says it all about what you need to know going forward.

Jscull.2514:

Other than supply mastery, the single greatest joke in mmo history….

The fact you still can’t KICK people out of party after they leave is just ludicrous. Says it all about what you need to know going forward.

But you’re supposed to leave party before you DC.

Monetize it:

1) Gems, Coin & Karma Reward each week, based on:
a) Overall Server Finish (1st, 2nd, 3rd)
b) Your Overall Contribution (based on how many levels you acquired during that week – Must have obtained AT LEAST 1 RANK to receive any reward)

IE:
1 Rank = 100% of Reward
5 Ranks = +20% of Reward
10 Ranks = +50% of Reward (this way people whose server places 3rd and achieve 10 ranks have equal earnings to the person whose server places 1st but only gained 1 rank)

2) Unique WvW Skins:
a) Skins Availability based on Rank. (Rank 0-50, Rank 50-120, Rank 120 – 150, Rank 150+)
b) Bought w/ all 3 of the following: Gems, Karma & Badges (here’s your profit)

• the base Gear should remain the same, bought w/ Badges + Coin.

3) WvW Boosters (+dmg, +run speed, +regen, +protection, etc) – Bought w/ Karma & Badges

4) Legendaries at Max WvW Rank

• New Currency Exchange: Gems <-> Badges.

DevonCarver.5370:

Precursors do drop from the chests, but very rarely. I’d love to say you should be able to get everything ever from just playing WvW, but not only is that not going to happen, it’s not good for the game as a whole. We will continue to do what we can to improve the rewards available from WvW and there are some developments specifically relating to skill points that are coming soon to the game as a whole, but honestly if you want to get all the things in the game, you have to play all the game. Branch out, I suspect you’ll enjoy it. And WvW will still be there when you want to play it.

Hi Devon,

First of all, thank you for taking the time to reply to us. Threads that see actual dev posts have a way of turning into hornet’s nests fairly quickly, so the effort is genuinely appreciated.

I completely agree with you that not everything should be available in every format. PvE players deserve rewards that are unique to their format. The problem isn’t the uniqueness of certain rewards, but rather a lack of parity in rewards. Now I don’t claim that WvW should be as profitable as (certain areas of) PvE, nor do I want it to be. If WvW suddenly became the most profitable format for players, it would be swamped in an invasion of players whose only motivation would be loot, and I do not for one second believe that would be healthy for the format. But even so, there has to be some room for movement here. WvW players were already falling far behind to begin with in terms of gold earned over time. As of late the living story content has only exacerbated that difference.

Regardless of which format we choose to play, what all players ultimately want is a reward for their time invested. That doesn’t mean the rewards handed out to players across different formats need to be absolutely identical or equal in quantity – but when differences between formats become substantial enough, problems arise. As a WvW player I could literally log on right now, spend some gold on a couple of upgrades for camps/towers/keeps here and there, and I will have just about broken even for the past week or so. Meanwhile, if you ask the PvE players in my guild, they will tell you that they have made hundreds upon hundreds of gold over the past week and are now able to buy precursors off the trading post if they wanted.

I’m glad to hear that there will be some improvement on the issue of achievement points available for WvW players, as it is sorely needed, but – and I think a lot of other WvW players will tell you the same – that alone won’t be nearly enough. If you disregard the gold for the moment, when was the last time we saw any rewards at all that are unique to WvW? PvE has seen the introduction of quite a few new weapon and armor skins, so where are the skins for the WvW players? Feel free to monetize some of this stuff by the way, many players have already suggested numerous ways in which you can recoup your costs. My mesmer wears her Phoenix armor set proudly, and I consider it well worth the cost. Likewise for my guardian and her Braham set. And as soon as you make a finisher that fits a necromancer, I’m buying that too.

What won’t help is telling me that I should go play another format to get what I want. I’m a grown adult, and I know my preferences perfectly well, thank you. I’m here to play against real players, not whatever passes for an AI these days. And I think you’ll find that a lot of other players who play PvP formats share similar sentiments. We want rewards for the time that we invest, just as other players do. And as it stands, I honestly believe you could do better in that regard.

I know we’re a fickle bunch. But please, work with us here.

They should bring back all the GvG content of GW1 along with the guild halls.

Now THAT would be cool.

ManaCraft.5630:

Snip

That about sums it up perfectly.

Xillllix.3485:

They should bring back all the GvG content of GW1 along with the guild halls.

Now THAT would be cool.

It is simple, make it player vs player focused….not player vs capture point.

Jscull.2514:

Xillllix.3485:

They should bring back all the GvG content of GW1 along with the guild halls.

Now THAT would be cool.

It is simple, make it player vs player focused….not player vs capture point.

When they made WvW they had no idea what they were getting into IDT…Because it is really (in it’s simplest form), sPVP: with bigger maps, walls/structures as the objectives, and a 3rd team.

Even in PvP there is no flat-out deathmatch….Fighting over objectives is a novelty idea that gets old fast IMHO. You cap a point, the enemy caps it, you backcap it, you defend it, they come back later and cap it, you recap it later….I mean it gets boring. And that applies to sPVP and WvW essentially, with only subtle differences at best.

What keeps this game fresh (or rather what would) is the focus on the fights between players, focus on objective capturing/ppt/siegewars/coveragewars will only make it die faster.

Competitive players bought gw2 because for the first time in 5-7 years an mmo came out with an open world “tri-faction pvp” zone. Well, once that 10-20% of the total population discovered they were only going to fight a ball of new pvpers with Anets mechanics allowing those new players to win purely due to size (while that ball of new players only cared about accumulating points for a meaningless scoreboard), they left.

That was months ago. Now what’s left is a bunch of zergers who discovered PPT is about as meaningful as nfl preseason… Who finally would like to fight players. Well, for competitive guys it’s been too long and 99% of that 10-20% is never coming back to gw2. A shame, the platform is there…. Just needed a more competitive natured Anet team. Instead, we all got supply mastery.

Truthfully, I never cared about PPT either. I do care about painting my borderland my color, and I care about not being spawn camped. I care about having WP’s in all keeps if possible. Map control makes life easier. If you don’t control the map, life just sucks. You spend 5 minutes running for 30 seconds of battle, only to die and repeat the process.

It seems there is a lack of imagination at work here. So much more cool stuff could be done with WvW. Making a ladder that affect siege stats isn’t one of them.

- A new battleground map with 3 castles with design based on the different cultures

- A portal in WvW that leads to organized GvG battles (taking place in guild halls as guest or defender)

- Subterranean passageways and darker areas

- Real-time weather that affects classes in different ways and bring visual variety (Snow storm, flood)

- Unique and frequent WvW crafting material drops (for legendary precursors)

- some free deathmatch maps with no structures at all, perhaps just an objective in the middle (PvP variant?)

- Events taking place around enemy commanders…

- nuke

^ apply at anet

Xillllix.3485:

It seems there is a lack of imagination at work here. So much more cool stuff could be done with WvW. Making a ladder that affect siege stats isn’t one of them.

- Suggestions~

I believe it’s all down to the lack of resources allocated towards WvW. Have a look at the content the living story team puts out each second week, that should give you a pretty clear indicator where the most resources are spent.

I thought this was appropriate:

http://m.youtube.com/watch?v=1iH1IyoLvNM

DevonCarver.5370:

Precursors do drop from the chests, but very rarely. I’d love to say you should be able to get everything ever from just playing WvW, but not only is that not going to happen, it’s not good for the game as a whole. We will continue to do what we can to improve the rewards available from WvW and there are some developments specifically relating to skill points that are coming soon to the game as a whole, but honestly if you want to get all the things in the game, you have to play all the game. Branch out, I suspect you’ll enjoy it. And WvW will still be there when you want to play it.

I pretty strongly disagree with this. At least the part about it not being good for the game. What’s not good for the game is to overly pressure people who love one aspect of the game to play another aspect of the game.

There are two reasons why this is bad:

1) It’s bad for newbies. You want new people to be constantly encountering people who think what they are doing is fantastic. If a newbie goes to WvW s/he should encounter people who love WvW. If a newbie runs a dungeon s/he should encounter people who love dungeons. Encountering a group of WvWers who are dragging themselves through a fractal will not be a good experience.

2) It’s bad for customer retention. You want people to enjoy your game so they hang around. If you bore us or worse, make is do stuff we hate, some of us will leave the game and you will quit making money off of those gem store purchases.

TL;DR: If you can’t make something enough fun that we want to do it, don’t try to force us with treats or by withholding treats.

gotem.5284:

Why not have an ascended token be a reward from the chest so I can pick the ring I want?

Don’t stop there….

Chests drop Gems & Laurels…