Showing Posts For Agrivane.9207:
I do however feel bad for you about the whole event where you were reviving people and not getting rewarded. The issue is actually how rewards are handled in dynamic events and how they calculate contributions.
That is exactly what I meant.
I don’t think the developer post about damage contribution was meant to imply that more damage = better loot. My post is about how basic game design hinges on damage dealt, which shifts the focus too far away from support roles (in my opinion), and how it really does not have to be that way. But to make support roles more meaningful is a more difficult task given the rest of the game’s design.
TLDR:
Reading about the adjustments to “qualifying” for loot on monsters, I realized something. It was described that “qualification” for loot depended on the damage done to the monster. This brought up my first memory of disillusionment with GW2 and revealed what I think is the true basis for getting rid of the MMO “holy trinity.” It is this: because measuring group contribution by damage dealt is far easier than accounting for heals, buffs, debuffs, revives, and cures, GW2 shoehorns all players into damage dealing roles at the expense of meaningful support roles and synergistic group play.
Full Explanation:
My first memory of disillusionment in GW2 came fairly early on. At first, everything was wonderful. Mob “tagging” was gone! Everybody is encouraged to help everybody else! You get XP for reviving fallen allies! Then came a particularly tough fight against a Champion. He was slaying allies left and right. I got a few hits in, but spent the majority of the time helping revive my fallen allies and buff them with my warrior shouts and banners. This was what GW2 was about – great exploration and players being encouraged to work together – to view each and every person as a true ally and not a competitor for mobs and resources.
After a lengthy battle, at last the enemy was slain! But then I realized – I had received no credit for the kill. No experience, no event completion medal, no loot. Meanwhile, the players I had helped to revive and who gleefully went back to damaging the boss were fully rewarded for their efforts – efforts that I had made possible by bringing them back to the fight. Had I contributed? Absolutely. Did I have fun? Yes! Yet the game did not think I was deserving of reward. I realized then that GW2 was less about working as a team and more about individual play. It was not about playing how you want to play – it was about damaging the boss.
Ultimately, in GW2, the group activity that is the most “fun” according to the developers and the only viable option for achieving personal rewards and growth – damage dealing – also happens to be the group activity that least involves other members of the group. It contributes to the feeling that GW2’s groups are less about groups working together and more about gathering reasonably decent players who can individually achieve high enough performance that victory is achieved.
And that brings us to the truth about the trinity. The true innovation in GW2 is not the removal of the trinity. The removal of the trinity limits players by funneling everybody in the damage dealing role. The true innovations are individual loot tables and unlimited mob tagging and how they come together in GW2 with dynamic events. It is the fact that anywhere from 1 to 100 players can be beating on a bad guy and still benefit from experience and loot without being grouped. It creates a sense that everybody is working together in a way other games (at least those that I have played) have never done before. It fosters roving bands of players that patrol a zone, going from event to event, as in the glory days of Orr. It is a unique and wonderful experience in gaming.
Yet how do you achieve that experience and still adequately compensate players for their efforts? You need some measure by which to gauge player participation in events and boss kills. You cannot just award loot to all members of a party, because partying is not mandatory. You cannot just award loot based on proximity to events, because that that could reward players standing around AFK and not truly participating. There are really just 2 options: (1) damage dealt; (2) group contribution.
Damage dealt is simple. Create a formula where you have the boss’s total health, the number of participating players, and the damage each player contributes. Any players meeting the right criteria get loot. It is as simple as that.
Group contribution is far harder. You have to measure not just damage dealt, but how every revive, buff, debuff, cure, and heal helps increase the overall damage and success of the group as a whole. Of course, we all understand that these things are meaningful and fun – there are skills and entire builds based on “support” roles. Many people, including myself, yearn for more meaningful support roles in GW2.
So my theory is simple. GW2 developers opted for the simple formula – damage dealt. To make it work, they eliminated the “holy trinity” and shoehorned all players into damage dealing roles. It was the only way to make their very cool, very fun, innovative system of working together without grouping work well without requiring complex computations for rewarding players.