Guild Wars 2

I didn’t even bother responding to that.

I just went 11 tries and haven’t gotten a clover. Did you guys take it out of the game this patch???

ugh man. I’ve had like 10 people tell me that I was wrong about this in the bugs section and that it only applied to getting items higher than blue rarity.

I think my nose got flatter from facepalming so much.

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/support/bugs/Mystic-salavage-kit-of-getting-rarer-materials-is-broken/page/2#post365604
Wanna get this fixed yknow. >_>

Wait, when you say crafting materials you mean like gossamer/ori and stuff right?

Just alter the wording each time you get blocked. they do it by phrase basis.

I would prefer people not to theory craft about this because I’m sick of arguing with people about this. I want to hear this straight from a GM.

What exactly does “Rarer materials” entail on the salvage kits tooltip?

Does rarer materials mean materials that are above uncommon(meaning only ectoplasm i guess? I think highly unlikely >_>) or higher tier crafting materials? ex. Gossamer on a silk grade item

I personally think(and have tested) that rarer materials applies to higher tier crafting materials.

Hsinimod.5784:

Fatalyz.5270:

saurus.8290:

theres only 1 rare material

its called glob of ectoplasm

Hey! i’m glad you are literate and read what i wrote. Oh wait you didn’t.
To add on to that literacy issue you are having, it says “rarer materials”.

thanks for the extremely productive comment.

Your thread is valid, but I wouldn’t get emotional over replies from people that are confused. It was clear that one person was confusing (and still is) the difference between ‘salvaging’ and ‘drops’. They combined two separate subjects into 1 incoherent argument, which should just be ignored. (doesn’t apply to anything you said, so why say ‘WTF’ to anyone about it?)

Insulting them is uncalled for, and makes a proper subject look like a childish argument.

Thank you for the research. Having numbers to backup observation helps.

well think of me arguing with these poor fools as a way to keep this thread bumped so someone can actually take a look at this. as a bonus I get to laugh at these people when it turns out I was right and they were terribly wrong about their ignorant and ungrounded assumptions. win win.

Pennry.9215:

Thread is busted the moment I log in so I can’t quote.

Just because you haven’t received a blue from salvaging doesn’t mean that the system doesn’t think you can. When you get a drop, it rolls for quality, quantity, and type. It’s the same for salvaging. What I’m pointing out is that maybe the “rarer” quality (ie blue or better) loot table is empty for salvaging. So you salvage, it hits “rare” but has nothing to give you, so it gives you the next stage down (“common”). It’s not the kits that are broken. It’s the system of salvaging. You start off by stating that Mystic Kits are broken, then show evidence that all kits are broken.

And I’m not saying you’re wrong. In fact, several times I’ve said you were right.

And what makes you think the system was coded to look at the color of an item when they will never make a blue able to come from salvaging therefore they never intended to do so(and never will)? Blue crafting materials are in the game and them didn’t make them able to come from salvaging. why would they add excessive lines of code for something they will not use like a bunch of amateurs?

And you can’t compare “drops” to"salvaging". Completely separate coding.

And how did i prove all the kits were broken when the numbers show that they are in fact working as intended?

And what do you mean “when it hits rare”? that makes no sense at all. Every item in the loot table has a set percentage. so essentially the game uses a random number generator within 1-100 or 1-1000 and if your number falls within the range of the item you get that item.
It’s not tiered in any way.

And as i have said before, when you salvage an item it only has two possible outcomes for the base loot drop which will always be a white. either a rarer higher tier or a less rare lower tier. so 89-100 will be assigned to gossamer and 1-89 will be assigned to silk.

Please don’t make up delusional ideas or possibilities that have no grounds whatsoever.

Or let me reword that, you can’t get blues from salvaging. Bones and bloods are strictly drops or come from the pouches.

Haunter and gengar are better.

You would be right if you could salvage blues. WHICH YOU CANT.
and on a side note, ectoplasm is on a different loot table than the whites. that’s why you always get a white when you salvage . yes given that if there were more than 2 things to roll on, then i would be wrong. but there aren’t. Please refer above to how salvaging works step by step.

why is this topic blank?

where is your proof i’m wrong? what if i am in fact right and they needed to fix a miscoding in the source code?

saurus.8290:

Number of flip: 1000 Number of heads 465 Number of tails 535

The probability so far to get heads is 0.465 – 46,5%
The probability so far to get tails is 0.535 – 53,5%

does this make head rarer?

already told you theres a luck factor, you just could be lucky with crude and basic kits

and unlucky with mystic kit

Hey buddy, making numbers up doesn’t mean you are right.
I would chalk it up to luck if i didn’t have 4 samples here.

You want to know how i know you made numbers up? in a sample of 1000 the percentage would be much closer to 50%. also the fact that your example is in a factor of 5 is pretty hilarious. also i was clicking that coin flipping program on that site and it balanced to 50% at about 180 flips and when i kept clicking it for anouther 300 times it fluctuated by 1% every time. good try.

Sarie.1630:

Doesn’t need to say “Rare Material”. The name “Glob of Ectoplasm” is Orange. Orange means “Exotic”.

If Orange text has another meaning please share with us.

Sorry if it’s too intuitive.

I’m not arguing that orange is not rare. I’m arguing that just because an item is white, doesn’t mean it can’t be rarer than another white. See how narrow minded you are? It’s sickening that you would leave a response like that.

Let me tell you something. If the tooltip does in fact say “rare material” then you would be 100% right. but it doesn’t and says rarer materials. Essentially whatever has the lower probability of obtaining is rarer. Picking whether silk or gossamer is rarer is easy isn’t it? which one is it?

Your argument is simply: “It’s this color so I’m right and being completely open to other possibilities is just wrong.” What a weak argument.
Then can you explain my numbers that i got? How was there a 10% increase in gossamer during a 10% increase in chance of salvaging rarer materials? If you can’t explain it then you are wrong. If you continue to deny it you are just blind and narrow minded.

Sarie.1630:

Fatalyz: I see your interpretation of “rarer items” being “items required for higher level crafting”, but by your logic, you should be able to salvage Gossamer from loot dropped in Queensdale.

So. Can you? Have you? That’s going to be the only thing that might sway me on this.

how does my logic lead to loot in queensdale lot giving gossamer? It’s a different tier therefore a different loot table.

Sarie.1630:

The standard salvageable cloth from L70+ gear is Silk. Gossamer, as you have shown is received in far lower quantities. If ArenaNet raised the level cap to L100, for instance, with new zones dropping new loot and a new tier of crafting materials, Gossamer would logically be the most common salvaged cloth from the “new set” of loot drops, with a brand new material taking the place of Gossamer.

Yes which means that next tier of cloth would become the rarer item. Each piece of loot has two items on their base loot table. the standard tier and the higher tier. the higher tier is rarer than the lower tier.
As someone familiar with computer programming, let me tell you exactly what
happens when salvaging an item. I can literally code this if you want.

The game will roll a dice a maximum of three times.
Roll1: Roll to see if you get a a standard tier material(standard) or a higher tier material(rarer)

If item has an attached upgrade roll again>
Roll2: roll to see if you successfully retrieve your upgrade from the item. percentage dictated on kit.

if item is rare or exotic roll again>
Roll3: roll to see if you receive ectoplasm.

End salvage

Are you getting a better idea of how this works? give me an instance when this system does not hold true.

Sarie.1630:

Cisza.9540:

So either Salvage Kits are not working as intented if Gossamer Scrap is rarer material OR Salvage Kits are not working as intended if “blue” items are considered rarer material.

RarER just means MORE RARE than Common. As Blue (Fine) items are more rare than White (Common) materials, then yes, if Blue items were salvageable (note I said “If”) then they should logically be subject to the “increased chance” clause.

So yes. Working as intended according to all th evidence I’ve seen to date.

The only thing that doesn’t seem to be working as intended are players’ abilities to differentiate something ArenaNet has designated Rare by colouring the description text yellow, and something that the Player has decided is Rare because it doesn’t drop as much as something else.

Cisza.9540:

So the true point is, which OP already stated (thou with wrong percentages, but it doesn’t mater in conclusion) – Salvage Kits are broken.
Either way I’d love to see dev response on this.

So would I, if only to point out that GOSSAMER IS A COMMON MATERIAL.

Why are you so bound to this metaphorical representation of rarity?

Lol this is actually giving me a better ideas presented in Nietzsche’s ideas on truth and lies in a nonmoral sense. Your have been blinded by this metaphorical representation of a rarity system that you completely refuse to understand how it actually works. You constantly run on the assumption that color is the only way to determine rarity.

You want to know how i determine rarity? Something with the lower probability of getting is rarer. Are you telling me I’m wrong in thinking that? Obviously my way is more logical and accurate.

Sarie.1630:

Cisza.9540:

So either Salvage Kits are not working as intented if Gossamer Scrap is rarer material OR Salvage Kits are not working as intended if “blue” items are considered rarer material.

RarER just means MORE RARE than Common. As Blue (Fine) items are more rare than White (Common) materials, then yes, if Blue items were salvageable (note I said “If”) then they should logically be subject to the “increased chance” clause.

So yes. Working as intended according to all th evidence I’ve seen to date.

The only thing that doesn’t seem to be working as intended are players’ abilities to differentiate something ArenaNet has designated Rare by colouring the description text yellow, and something that the Player has decided is Rare because it doesn’t drop as much as something else.

Cisza.9540:

So the true point is, which OP already stated (thou with wrong percentages, but it doesn’t mater in conclusion) – Salvage Kits are broken.
Either way I’d love to see dev response on this.

So would I, if only to point out that GOSSAMER IS A COMMON MATERIAL.

So this metaphorically flawed representation of rarity should dictate how everything in the game works?

Hypothetically if there were no rarity system in place, how would you determine the rarity of an item?

If you mean to tell me that ectoplasm are in fact rarer than gossamer, then you haven’t played the game near enough to be talking.

OH I have an idea. Then how do you calculate the overall chance of something? Is it not a compilation of chance on use?

by the way, breaking 1 million scraps is overkill. as you can see, a sample size of 2000 was already enough to create 0% margin of error.

“chance on use” isn’t “chance over all”.
False. Say that to someone who has a middle school diploma and they will laugh at you.

Here let me give you something simple to digest. speak up if you can’t understand what is going on here.
http://www.basic-mathematics.com/coin-toss-probability.html

oh god what is this witchcraft! how can it be getting so close to 50%!.

Pennry.9215:

Again you all ignore that “chance on use” isn’t “chance over all”. Take a hundred-sided die, 75 sides have Silk on them and the other 25 have Gossamer on them. That die has a 25% chance to land on Gossamer per roll, not overall.

You could take a millions scraps and break them all down and still not be satisfied with your results. The system doesn’t go “they’ve done 95 breakdowns and only have received 20 Gossamer, better give them Gossamer for the next 5 breaks to make up the percentage”. It goes “breakdown… roll die, if 1-75 then Silk, else Gossamer”.

Welcome to odds and the true nature of RNG. Go to a casino, they may tell you it’s a 1:100000 (random numbers) chance to win the slot jackpot. That doesn’t mean you can take 100000 people and be guaranteed a winner.

Wow. You don’t get it do you. You understand what card counting is and all that stuff works? It’s all calculated probability. Probability can all be calculated. I learned this in middle school buddy. You must not have been educated very well.

It sounds like you think RNG is some mythical beast that will spit out a random result.
SO apparently i magically had a 1% increase per 10% and it was all a silly coincidence. You caught me. you win.

Gahro.4095:

What the tooltip means by “rarer” or “rare” materials is "one tier higher than normal for this a given cloth/leather/heavy piece. For Lv70+ items this means a chance of Gossamer/Orichalcum/T6Leather (forgot the name).

Ectos are something completely different. They are a “trophy” and they actually have always the same chance to be salvaged out of 70+ (rares/exotics only) REGARDLESS which salvage kit you use (even Crude will do) (might be 68+, don’t know exactly).

But OP is right in that the Mystic Salvage Kit does not give the stated 25% increased chance. If the tooltip is wrong or the salvage kits are bugged is a question a dev has to answer.

Recently I tried using lower tier kits for ectos. that didnt go too well. I had about 1 ecto out of 6 yellows and decided to stop wasting my money. I started using black lion kits and saw a significant increase of ectos. (about 50 ectos to 40 yellows)

Ectos are harder to test because they are a much bigger gamble due to the chance of getting 1-5 ectos per salvage therefore much harder to test due to a much larger sample requirement.

first of all, no where in the description does it say “rare” material. therefore assuming “rare grade items” can come from salvaging is completely irrelevant. In the end 11% is less than 89% therefore the item with an 11% chance of being salvaged is rarer because it has a lower percentage of being salvaged. Pretty basic comparison skills here. I dont understand why people’s minds are so narrow and completely bound to this rarity system. The assumption that colors define how rare an item is very simple minded. In the end, the rarer item is the item with a lower percentage or is harder to obtain is rarer. Why can’t people understand that? Arenanet can go off and change the colors of their items however they wish. They actually changed the color of a mystic forge conduit from white to orange. in the end its attainability didn’t change just because of the color.

And how are my percentages wrong? that is exactly how it works. Diablo had a similar system with magic find. And the percentage are proof that it is how it work. From my data, the kits are actually working as intended except for the mystic kit which is showing a 0% increase unlike its listed 25%.

Waiting for GM response on this issue

saurus.8290:

Fatalyz.5270:

saurus.8290:

theres only 1 rare material

its called glob of ectoplasm

Hey! i’m glad you are literate and read what i wrote. Oh wait you didn’t.
To add on to that literacy issue you are having, it says “rarer materials”.

thanks for the extremely productive comment.

i have read everything

gossamer, orichalcum and ancient wood isnt a rarer material

using low or best salvage kit doesnt increase your chances to get them

it only affect ectos or other rare materials (if they exist)

Where is your proof? if you don’t have numbers to back it up then you are wrong. sorry

“From here on forward I refuse to argue whether higher tier whites count or not as “rarer materials” without proper evidence. I have hard evidence they do. Unless you can do a sample similar or greater than mine, you have no right to argue otherwise. It doesn’t matter what you think is right. If you really want me to be technical, all I can say is the tooltip says “rarer materials”. If you want to deny that gossamer is the same rarity as silk when salvaging an item when the chance of getting a gossamer, proven with a 2000 sample that it is in fact 11%, while silk is the rest of that percentage, then you have complete lack of logic. If you want to continue to argue with me, show me a sample of 1000 each of each kit on the same item and see if it comes to be the exact same."

Character: Fatalys
Story Step: Level 70- Picked “dishonored allies” but ended up on “liberating apatia”(making another suffer)

saurus.8290:

theres only 1 rare material

its called glob of ectoplasm

Hey! i’m glad you are literate and read what i wrote. Oh wait you didn’t.
To add on to that literacy issue you are having, it says “rarer materials”.

thanks for the extremely productive comment.

Tallenn.9218:

I personally have seen for myself that it DOES NOT MATTER what kit you use if your goal is higher tier regular mats (i.e. orichcalcum, gossamer, and ancient wood). I’ve tested it on white salvage items, 100 each with a crude kit, a basic kit, and a master kit, and got about the same number of orichalcum each time. Now I’m wondering if perhaps the same applies to ectos?

Is there ANY VERIFIABLE advantage to using anything but a crude kit?

I essentially did the same test with a bigger sample. a 1 % fluctuation is very difficult to see with only a sample of 100. the difference would vary by 1 orichalcum.

And i was playing around with salvaging ectos with black lion kits. I noticed a huge difference although i did not record my results. one example of this was today when i salvaged 6 yellows with a mystic kit i got 1 ecto. after this, i started using black lion kits and out of 40 salvages i came out with 50 ectos. I rarely failed to salvage ectos and I was getting on multiple back to back 2 ectos per salvage.

I don’t feel like throwing anymore money at testing so this is just from speculation.

The reason higher tier salvage kit seem to have such a strong affect on ectos i believe because their initial salvage rate is very high, so the modifier produces very noticeable results. for example, IF the chance of getting an ecto is 60% base, then with a black lion kit the chance of getting an ecto now becomes 90%. that’s huge.

On the case of t6 materials, the base rate is VERY LIKELY 11% as seen from the sample of 2000. lo and behold we can see the power of probability with such a large sample which came out with 220 gossamer, which is a perfect 11%.

From my personal results, mystic kit giving 11% also is a very bad sign. And to further prove that my findings ARE in fact correct that higher tier materials are affected by this, each time i increased the percentage chance to get rarer materials by 10%, a little over a 1% increase was seen as it should be.

PS
From here on forward I refuse to argue whether higher tier whites count or not as “rarer materials” without proper evidence. I have hard evidence they do. Unless you can do a sample similar or greater than mine, you have no right to argue otherwise. It doesn’t matter what you think is right. If you really want me to be technical on your level Pennry, all I can say is the tooltip says “rarer materials”. If you want to deny that gossamer is the same rarity as silk when salvaging an item when the chance of getting a gossamer, proven with a 2000 sample that it is in fact 11%, while silk is the rest of that percentage, then you have complete lack of logic. If you want to continue to argue with me, show me a sample of 1000 each of each kit on the same item. and see if it comes to be the exact same.

Pennry.9215:

I am truly sorry that you fail to see that there is an entire section of crafting materials called “Fine Materials”.

And to follow your link:
“To confirm this a much greater study needs to be done (N=500+). Because the values of these two are so similar it may be worth while to test small sample groups of the lesser masterwork, fine, and common salvaging kits to see if all kits have the same salvage rate of ~1.
While this is by no means conclusive, it does provide us with useful information. "

By your definition of “rarer”, in a 1-15 zone, T6 materials are rarer because you mostly get T1 materials. My definition of “rarer” means that in that same 1-15 zone, you get less T1 Fine Materials than you do T1 common materials. AND I will agree with you, at first glance the next higher tier of materials would seem to be considered rarer just because you get less of them, but that doesn’t fall in to the game’s established rarity scale.

And honestly you have lost all your credibility the second you said you can get blues from salvaging. you can never get blues from salvaging. EVER.

Khisanth.2948:

The mystic kit might require gems to make but with the gold -> gems conversion the mystic kit is actually half the price(based on current prices) of the master kit and they have the same “stats”.

Also “dividing the amount of gossamer with the number of items” does not seem correct to me. If you salvaged 250 items it should be “number of times you got gossamer”/250 not “number of gossamer scraps”/250. Same with the other kits and items.

rags only give one gossamer per “success”. so yes. My calculations are still correct.

and the fact that one of the stats on the mystic salvage kit is the equivalent of a crude kit, you think it shouldnt be fixed?

Pennry.9215:

Fatalyz.5270:

wait wtf are you talking about? there are no greens or blues in this game that you can get from SALVAGING.

Um, I’ve gotten “fine materials” (which are blue) and Ectoplasm (which is Exotic). Don’t believe me about the “fine materials”? You can’t deny that Ectoplasm is a salvaged material, so go do a “study” on how much Ecto you get.

And to answer the direct question: I’m talking about “rarer” referring to the in-game rarity scale, not the tier scale. Higher tier does not equal rarer.

EDIT for your edit: Fine materials are crafting materials. I get more T6 fine materials off the 81-84 than the 80s or lower.

After this many salvages, I have not once gotten a blue from salvaging.
I guess i’m the most unlucky human being ever.

Pennry.9215:

Fatalyz.5270:

wait wtf are you talking about? there are no greens or blues in this game that you can get from SALVAGING.

Um, I’ve gotten “fine materials” (which are blue) and Ectoplasm (which is Exotic). Don’t believe me about the “fine materials”? You can’t deny that Ectoplasm is a salvaged material, so go do a “study” on how much Ecto you get.

And to answer the direct question: I’m talking about “rarer” referring to the in-game rarity scale, not the tier scale. Higher tier does not equal rarer.

What blues have you gotten from salvaging? i would really love to know
Ectos have already been studied.
http://www.reddit.com/r/Guildwars2/comments/10d69g/salvaging_for_ectoplasm_an_analysis/
It has proven irrelevant to the kit.

Pennry.9215:

I never thought of the T6 materials as being any “rarer” than the lower tiers. I think each level bracket has a tier of materials and you’ll just get lucky and get the next tier sometimes. IE mostly T3 materials, but sometimes a T4. Since T6 is the highest, they’ve just set the “to 80” bracket to have the T5 materials as more common with the “sometimes” being the T6 materials. That’s considering there is a rarity scale with the the color coding and labels as such. This “study” only shows the “sometimes” multiplier.

“Chance of rarer materials” has always meant (to me) as chance to get more blues than whites, more greens than blues, etc. I fully expect an 81+ item to give more T6 materials than the >80 item. Thinking back now, I actually think that the 81-84 event mobs seem to give more T6 mats just as drops.

Even at lower levels, I’ve never experienced a higher rate of the higher tier materials no mater what kit I used.

wait wtf are you talking about? there are no greens or blues in this game that you can get from SALVAGING.
If HIGHER tier materials don’t count, then what does? What counts as “rarer materials”. NOTHING. so logically what would be a “rare material” then? nothing? Then why do they bother writing that “% chance of getting rarer materials” on there?

And since when do 81-84 mobs drop crafting materials? Are we playing the same game? wtf?

Gossamer would be considered a rarer crafting material. If not, what WOULD count? Ectoplasm has been studied and the study says in the end its 1ecto- 1rare.
The salvage kits % simply means a higher tier of materials.

This study shows that the base rate of getting a higher tier material is 11%. What the kit does is increase that 11% by the listed amount.
ex.:
10% of 11% is 12.1%
20% of 11% is 13.2%
As you can see my tests shows this is very accurate.

but the advertised 25% is more like 0%
that is the point.

SO I did a study on this comparing:

Mystic salvage kit: “25%” chance of getting rare materials.
Basic salvage kit: 10% chance of getting rare materials.
Journeyman Salvage kit: 20% chance of getting rare materials.

and

I already have a sample of crude salvage kit: which has an unlisted (probably negligible .01 or something) from a source that compelled me to do this study.
http://www.guildwars2guru.com/topic/68588-from-rags-to-riches/

What I did was for each kit:
I tried using a sample of 250 rags for each kit and here are the results-

MYSTIC- |Gossamer- 28| |Silk-379|
BASIC-|Gossamer- 31| |Silk-386|
Journeyman-|Gossamer-34| |Silk-376|

So after you do the math of dividing the amount of gossamer with the number of items broken down or:
gossamer from kit/250= % chance of salvaging rare materials

Here are the percentages:
Mystic- 11.2%
Basic- 12.4%
Journeyman- 13.6%

AND CRUDE from the link above was a PERFECT 11% with a SAMPLE OF 2000 it comes out with 220 gossamer.

So from this we can assess that the base chance of getting a higher tier material from an item is 11% and the salvage kits modify this chance by the listed amount EXCEPT FOR THE MYSTIC SALVAGE KIT WHICH REQUIRES GEMS TO CREATE.

This really needs to be fixed.

PS
From here on forward I refuse to argue whether higher tier whites count or not as “rarer materials” without proper evidence. I have hard evidence they do. Unless you can do a sample similar or greater than mine, you have no right to argue otherwise. It doesn’t matter what you think is right. If you really want me to be technical on your level Pennry, all I can say is the tooltip says “rarer materials”. If you want to deny that gossamer is the same rarity as silk when salvaging an item when the chance of getting a gossamer, proven with a 2000 sample that it is in fact 11%, while silk is the rest of that percentage, then you have complete lack of logic. If you want to continue to argue with me, show me a sample of 1000 each of each kit on the same item and see if it comes to be the exact same.

metaphorm.6904:

in PvE i’m running a condition damage set. i’ve got a 4 of Major Rune of the Krait (for the condition damage and increased bleed duration) and a 2 of Minor Rune of Affliction (for condition damage and increased bleed duration…) Using Sigils of Agony on my daggers (for increased bleed duration). I think you get the point, right?

Bleed damage attacks scale in three ways so I try to exploit all 3 scaling methods.

1) Scales linearly (more damage per tick) with Condition Damage stat. the coefficient is low compared to poison and burning though, because bleeding stacks in intensity rather than duration. But still, this state does increase its damage so its obviously a primary concern. Doubling your condition damage stat will (approximately) double your additional damage per tick. I say “additional” damage per tick because there is always a baseline established by your player level only, so the contribution from condition damage is a term added on to this baseline.

2) Scales linearly with applying additional stacks. 2 stacks is twice as much damage as 1 stack. 3 stacks is 3 times as much as 1 stacks, etc. Abilities that stack bleeds just keep linearly increasing your damage output in this way, up to the cap of 25x (basically impossible to hit the cap while soloing though). The way to best exploit this scaling method is with initiative generation, since you need initiative to Death Blossom and apply more bleeds. I like traits that increase initiative generation for this reason.

3) Scales linearly with additional duration. 2 seconds of bleeding is twice as much damage as 1 second of bleeding. linear.

So I pick equipment and traits to get all 3 scaling techniques at the same time. Bleed more per tick. Make more initiative to put on more stacks. Increase duration so each stack does more damage.

My observation has been that the duration bonuses from runes and sigils are far more powerful than the bonuses that would effect damage per tick or number of stacks applied. For example, Sigil of Earth gives a chance to apply bleeding on crit. This means you now have to worry about your critical hit rate. My crit rate is low! I don’t have much precision on my gear. Earth Sigil would be a good way of getting some bonus damage for a crit build, but is a bad way of getting more bleed damage for a condition build. Sigil of Agony though basically is just +10% total damage throughput. Awesome. It doesn’t increase DPS in quite the same way (though increased duration will allow more stacks to be ticking simultaneously, so it does increase DPS indirectly) but it just outright increases damage throughput by alot. Its really good.

I’m just gonna say it now. condition damage thief is not very good compared to what you could do with other specs.

1. D/D is very situational in a condition damage spec the fact you always have jump through the mob constantly puts you at risk of falling off ledges and jumping in front of the boss. On the other hand, If you play pres/power D/D youa re benifiting your party more by stacking vulnerability and dealing massive amounts of damage with backstab and of course blowing kitten up when the bosses reach 25%. I actually initially played condition damage thief and I have to say that its pales in comparison to other combinations.

2. S/P is probably the strongest pve spec for thief right now. want to know why? PERMABLIND. yes you can tank elite mobs with s/p spec. MASSIVE DAMAGE. I have hit over 12k damage with 1 pistol whip. INVINCIBLE FRAMES. Pistol whip has a very long invincible frame. the whole sword swinging duration makes you invincible. 0 CD DISPEL AND ESCAPE. That teleport move is ridiculous. It will break you out of everything. If you get trapped in a crystal in CoE exp, you can break out with the backtrack. 3 STUNS. Yeah you get a 2 seconds stun, and 2 other stuns in this spec. enough said.

3. Alot of players play condition damage. If you have a team with more than 2(which is still way too much IMO), your bleed is useless because it only stacks to 25. SO situationally you are screwed. On the other hand, you can never go wrong with the other mentioned specs. You take full advantage of might stacking too. Its such a pity when a guardian gets 20 stacks of might on you and you don’t do anything with it.

Side note: I prefer using SUPERIOR RUNE OF THE UNDEAD. it gives condition damage and toughness. Goin max condition damage really is meaningless when you can’t survive. (especially because blossom animation is so long and compared to the invincible frames you get.)

Given, You can play whatever you want man. just realize you aren’t contributing as much as you could to your group.

So I took the risk of buying another set and actually got them this time. Which is even worse because the first set I lost was possibly a 1 time thing bug/glitch/lag. I hope I still get the items i paid gems for.