Guild Wars 2

Carighan.6758:

Jashugan.4820:

there is a difference, between an aoe stealth with a radius of 240 and an aoe stealth 1,2k range… apparently i fail to see what that might be.

Then here it is, spelled out:

• MI happens to be equipped in a slot further to the right. Ever noticed that?

yeh thanks for pointing that out… not that i didn’t mention it myslef like 1 sentence later.

• PU happens to preclude you from taking CI, one of the cornerstones of what we as Mesmers even bring to our team in PvP. Same in WvW, we got a few multi-interrupts, CI is an autokill on most people in the context as standing still means instant death.
• MI also happens to have a wee longer cooldown, but I guess that’s a minor detail as you’re tabbed out crying on the forums by the time it’d matter. Sorry ,getting really tired of this constant “WAAAAH, this is so broken ;_;”

‘’Capturing and defending a keep, became frustrating for a lot of people. i’ve seen a lot of people here writing about those 1-hit mesmers and i do agree, that the mesmer has other things rather than PU to should have taken a look at.’’ if u want to pin me down on something, go ahead, but read the whole argument then. this topic is about PU, so we talk about PU, not CI, not grenade barrage, not rampage and so on.

I mean yes, maybe PU is too strong (notice: not broken, but I might as well argue with a wall on that one, since PvP whining is inherently education-resistant, I know…), but even then, it is by a minor amount.

cool, i didn’t even mention spvp or duelling once. hence go with this one, since it also applies to something i did actually mention, being wvw group roaming and taking/defending keeps.

Anybody who has played for at least an hour in wvw and was not a mesmer will tell you this build is supremely broken with no risk at all. It is just THAT bad. At least in WvW.

and i agree with that and the whole stealth testing post it referred to.

We’re talking maybe reducing stealth duration to 66% (giving 5s Prestige, 8s MI, 5s Decoy, 3,5s Veil), or maybe changing the boons assortment.

Though, given ANet’s track record with Mesmers, they’ll probably just remove the duration buff outright, then wonder why neither before nor after anyone picks Mesmers for their teams, but congratulate themselves on a job well done. And probably buff Thieves while they’re at it.

whilst expecting or rather hoping for the nerf bat, i do also hope, that mesmer stays viable. generally i don’t think it’s bad that the mesmer got buffed, but not the way it has happened, not talking bout PU only here tho. as for PU however i hope that something is changed about it in wvw, i don’t care if it stays as it is now in pvp or pve, but a class that can port in an entire zerg staying unreveald for so long is kitten. but who knows maybe the new borderlands will help fixing that, though i have a feeling that with the upgrade changes, wvw will become more of a karma-fest.

Jashugan, if we go by that definition of “broken” then Anet have created a very “broken” game. Quickness, resistance, stealth, aegis, invulns, stuns, teleports, elementalists, guards, warrs, thieves, engineers, mesmers, ranger longbow, vigor, energy symbols, stealth stomps, portal and half the stuff under the sun of Tyria are “broken”.

’’ 1. (General) Something/Someone that is so good in a particular context that it eclipses saecond place.

2. (Games) A game object or facility that is too good to exist. It is so powerful that it is unbalancing and hence breaks the game. Every winning player has to use this to be competitive.

Entymology: The power cards from Magic The Gathering (Black Lotus, Time Walk, Ancestral Recall, all Moxen, etc) were so powerful and unbalancing that they were eventually banned from tournament play because they BROKE the game.

Bobby Fisher is a completely broken chess player. ’’

apharma.3741:

Also, thief blackpowder ->blinding powder is 6-8s of AoE stealth on an almost instant cast (1/2s), gl interrupting that. While the Mesmer has used an elite and their highest cool down and most defensive skill possible to get that 10s stealth. Seems a fair trade imo.

there is a difference, between an aoe stealth with a radius of 240 and an aoe stealth 1,2k range… apparently i fail to see what that might be. ginving stealth to 10 people, allmost no matter how kittenin far away they r from the mesmer casting it, is allready more than reasonable for me to be an elite with high cd. it’s not a fair trade… mass invis was very good and very strong as it was before, i don’t see why on earth it was necessary to buff it in a such reduculous way.

That’s without mentioning you made no response on what the PvP forum specialist asked for which is how would you change it.

I have made mine repeatedly, nerfing stealth duration won’t stop the QQ, only put it back onto thieves till trapper rune guards start melting people. What stealth needs is real counters.

hmmm yeh right, cuz i didn’t say that the reveal applying skills that the game has to offer r crap. doesn’t that include, that there should be better options to apply reveal? like, how i said maybe on skills/traits that would make sense to have, even if u r facing a class/build with no stealth whatsoever, like condi removes can even make sense against a power match-up aswell. sry, but u don’t have to be a mind reader to understand what is implied, unless u r forcing urself into it.

Why not add AoE reveal onto ranger pet F2 onto wilting strike or invigorating bond?
Why not add reveal to fear me for warriors?
Why not make dhuumfire reveal hit foes or allow necro to inflict reveal upon entering DS?

In other words give people tools to be able to bring someone out of stealth every now and then.

or being reveald skills aoe with no need for a target. you made some nice suggestions, giving u that. here have a cookie. however none of the things u said justifies a +100% stealth duration buff the mesmer got with his PU, u actually gave another good reason urself, why this change is rediculous and shouldn’t have happened in the first place, a good counterplay against stealth has yet to be applied to the game.

Carighan.6758:

Jashugan.4820:

PU right now, especially with mass invis, is pretty broken. In WvW where roaming in groups is a thing i highly doubt that ppl didn’t happen to run into 5 ppl groups with at least 2 mesmers. not to mention how strong mass invis allready is in a premade group with access to teamspeak or any other form of communication, the bonus stealth-duration, made it rediculous.

So what you’re saying is, Thief is no longer the only class to stealth a group. I’m… shocked. Especially because I’m using my elite + a GM trait to do this, compared to a thief’s utility skill. Who would have thunk that mine is not rubbish in comparison as it used to be :P

Btw, that’s not “broken”.
What you state is that you consider it overpowered. That’s not “broken”, as the difference in word choice hints at already.

But as I said, how is it overpowered if Thieves can do nearly the same thing, and our skill is an Elite? Mind you I don’t advocate class-to-class envy, but if group-stealthing is an issue, remove it from both classes. If it ain’t, let us have our fun.

‘’oh thief is not the only class to stealth a group’’ and – news flash – never was, my problem isn’t stealth per se, i’m ok with stealth, however i’m not ok with a that long stealth-duration, that is so easily achieved and offers no counterplay whatsoever. two thiefs constantly stealthing in one skmoke field have to be close to that field, u r able to see AND hit them before they use their leap finisher and u can knock ppl out of a shadow refuge before they get their stealth, furthermore punish them with revealed. a mesmer casting mass invis, being invulnurable buring the cast and then vanishing for 10+ seconds with his whole team, that didn’t even give away any sighn, that their mesmer is about to stealth them, how far is that ok?

yes, i am aware that mass invis is an elite, that’s why i said, it’s allready a very strong ability as it is. and i’m ok with it and what it does, just taken for itself, and i wouldn’t mind if you constantly buff ur teammates during the stealth period, it is an elite after all, but that shouldn’t be an excuse for being completely broken….

I agree with you almost entirely.
But I’d fix a minor error of yours:
Mass invisibility works on 10 targets, so a zerg of 10 within 1200 range getting 10 secs stealth, with addition of constant aegis, protection, regen and stuff.
2 mes = 20 secs minimum. 3 would be 30 seconds.
GL dealing with that.

broken is the right term for that, as it breaks an enjoyable game experience for others.

The PU changes on mesmer r a joke, a rly bad joke… at least I gotta hope so.

PU right now, especially with mass invis, is pretty broken. In WvW where roaming in groups is a thing i highly doubt that ppl didn’t happen to run into 5 ppl groups with at least 2 mesmers. not to mention how strong mass invis allready is in a premade group with access to teamspeak or any other form of communication, the bonus stealth-duration, made it rediculous.
yes, other classes, mostly lookin at thief here, can stealth a whole groupe for a very long time too, BUT…. if a thief does so, u r mostly forced to stand really close to him and if taking shadow refuge, forced to stand in a specific area, for a certain duration, otherwise you won’t even be stealthed and punished with the reveald debuff instead. mass invis affects all allies in 1200 range which means both mesmer and his teammates r pretty much unbound to where they stand and what they do, they don’t have to gather together, the mesmer isn’t forced to stand fairly still, placing a smoke field and using explo finishers, no. still the mesmer and his teammates will disappear for 10 kittening seconds, cuz the mesmer menaged to hit 1 button, with his f4 there won’t be even that much counterplay in interrupting him before the cast finishes. as said, mass invis in a premade group is allready pretty strong to beginn with and i’m not a mesmer main, so i’m not sure whether teammates are affected by the bonus stealth-duration or not.

Capturing and defending a keep, became frustrating for a lot of people. i’ve seen a lot of people here writing about those 1-hit mesmers and i do agree, that the mesmer has other things rather than PU to should have taken a look at, but there are also a kitten lot of other mesmers running around with tank gear, only equipted and traited to hide in a keep, till they can port in their zerg. finding some of those, while they sit 24/7 in stealth is a huge pain in the kitten , especially in the borderlands bay, where a mesmer can get pretty mobile in the water without really relying on stealth in case of revealed debuff caused by a stealth trap, he will simply swim that time out. jump into the water, get out, blink up the ledge to save time (since a lot of classes still would have to walk that way) and if ur opponent gets to u jump back into the water and repeat… oh no wait, you should be able to stealth again now.

this whole thing about other classes being able to put on the revealed debuff is bullkitten… yes, there are classes that can put on a revealed debuff, but at first by far not every class has access to such abilities and the classes that have, don’t have great abilities to do that, any other ability is most likley to be a better choice overall. being forced into something that comparably weak feels kitten. one could argue, that if you play against a condi class, one is forced to play with more condi remove, but thing is, a lot of condition removing traits/skills are still usefull against none condition classes/builds (a removed imobelize is a removed imobelize after all) and any class can be encounterd as a condition version, whereas access to stealth is not a common thing. i don’t want to be foced to play with reveal, because mesmer and this PU kitten has become the flavor of the month, especially in wvw. oh and i was only talking about the bonus stealth duration, not about the mesmer fully regenerating himself in stealth and reengaging as nothing happened, hitting like a brick from a far away distance. it’s just not fun to play against.

but as said, i really think that a lot of other traits/ratios would need a closer look on rather than PU. PU should just be removed, none mesmers kitten about it and mesmer mains say that it ain’t even that great, end the debate :P

also sorry for my bad english.

EDIT: i like how every swearword is replaced by kitten… i like kittens

almost forgot… so u can locate it better.

think this is not supposed to look like it does now :/ i have already send an in-game report bout this, but wasn’t quite sure bout that.