Guild Wars 2

Well, you do get better loot when you wear MF.

Personally I feel most dungeons are so easy you could run them naked and it still would be smooth sailing.

Sure, I have that full zerker set tucked away in my backpacks. Sometimes you need it. But I don´t remember the last time I did.

And you know whats more leechy then MF wearers? The other 90% of the playerbase that die on trash AoEs in dungeons / can´t follow directions / don´t know target priorities and still feel that they are in fact totally ubereleet since they have the dungeon master title (who doesn´t? only kitten wear it) and can speed run CoF in 6 minutes.

There isn´t a single hard dungeon in this game. There are some that are boring and tedious. But not a single hard one.
If you need everyone contributing 100% capacity all the time in full ascended / full exotic while skipping every single trash mob (god forbid you fight something more challenging then the bosses) then perhaps you should just farm CoF until you drown in cash from that?
Thats really the only reason to be angry about MF. All other scenarios you just kind of suck if its ever an issue. Learn to dodge – wear the MF gear – kill the trash – drown in rares – profit

So, I see this pop up every now and then along with suggestions along the lines of “mass invis” or “portal” or “shield” and whatnot.

But, heres a nifty trick for those that just want to run dungeons!

Assign roles, decide who does what, before the event starts.

You want 2 people capable of placing kegs inside red circles (thats right folks, 2, not 5 or 3 or 4, just a mere 2) and they will be in charge of the real bombs.

The remaining 3, they will place decoys all over the place. Together. They start the event by picking up one keg each and just going crazy placing them. Once they place one, they run straight back and get another and place that one as well.
They do not hurt the monsters. At all. What they can do is apply AoE cripple auras that wont kill the mobs.

The 2 “real” placers start running their kegs. They do not hurt the mobs either. At all. It doesn´t matter if some bandits come and steal your kegs. Just get new ones.
It takes a short while (depending on the speed of your decoy placers really) but soon all the bandits are either A) already holding a keg that they swing around real slow or running back and forth between decoys and the stand.
The reason you do not hurt the mobs is that they just respawn up by the door, picking up the first kegs they come across (hint, those are in the circles by the door… ;D )
Kabooie, the door blows up.

And here comes the next nifty bit you can´t do if you mass invis or whatnot. Engage the mobs, kill them ASAP and SAVE the kegs. The bandits will still try to put them back at the stand, don´t let them.

Each keg you save, up to 1 each, you bring with you. Place them by the wall in the next section and use them on the bosses.

And now you get to feel like a big boy worthy of his own youtube videos since the Nr 1 ability on the keg (the overhead smash + stun) hits the bosses for… read it and weep… 28000ish (thats twentyeight thousand) on non crits without pots and easy 44000+ on crits.

Mad Martha takes around 9 hits. non crit ones. Then she dead.
Vurmaine takes fewer. 6-7 hits, then he dead.

Get tokens, win, go back and hit the HP pinata dog for an extra blue. He does take an awesome beating. Prolly like 10-11 hits. Then he dead.

So, I now invite everyone to pretend that this was indeed common knowledge and just what all the “leet” kids already did. Over and over. And for some reason the fact that you have to spell this out for every new member you bring to CM (“experienced” or not) doesn´t mean they have been using cheesy fixed exploits at all.
No sir, you all know exactly how to play!

See you all around folks, and remember, once you learn HOW you outthink turrets and bandits, it really isn´t such a scary place anymore! (Hint: Don´t run at them or stand next to them. It ain´t bright!)

Personally I just run dungeons for fun now. And prefer not skipping trash at all, although the compromise we have at the moment in my regular grou kitten kipping the golden mobs with four buckets of HP that drop a blue each while we do kill the silver stuff.

Now, since it is kinda easy, you can afford to squeeze in some MF, like utility slot on the ascended neck / hybrid rings (sun / moon) / signet of luck / food buff is what I use. With that and not skipping trash you average 4 yellows from the trash for Arah P4, usually 2 from the shorter ones.
Not much, but its something and getting a little does make the trash a bit more fun even if I tend towards thinking the fights in themselves are the reward for doing them.
Nothing says “good run” like completing P4 with trash and no repair bill at all. (Gear don´t break before you are defeated, not on downs)

But on topic, I really don´t think Simin breaks as often as people claim. If she did it would stand to reason that we would have gotten “THE EBOLABUG OF 50%!!111!” at least once by now. Never happened.
But we have been stuck around 50% several times like I said. Always due to the groups inability, and eventually it always fixes itself after repositioning and some short discussions.
I will admit that P4 is the one and only path in the entire game that I just plain don´t go on without having at least 1 guildie along with me though, that particular bit is very stressful. Especially with the youtube crowd in todays MMOs, watching a movie of someone else doing it with a particular set up and then thinking that will fly just as good with a completely different set up.

But we all play differently, I find speed runs plain boring (not because we suck at them, we tried that some and I know some guildies do it on the side, it just isn´t for me, might as well solo farm CS for all the fun you get out of that) and while we very rarely wipe on any trash in any dungeon anymore, I didn´t mind wiping when we learned it.

In contrast, having never done CoF exept 1 time doing story – 1 – 2 – 3 I can say that being part of a group that routinly smashes trash all over, we had exactly 1 stopping point in CoF part 3 (puzzle) and nobody even reflected on anything else in there being hard. At all. In a group that contains both a ranger and a engineer.
So when people say something is “way overtuned” or “bugged” while skipping trash cos they read it on the net, there might be a point in just learning how to fight stuff.

Well, try again. So far we have killed Simin lots and I have to say that I have never witnessed this bug. Not once.

I have been in groups that got stuck at phase 2, with Simin healing up, sometimes several times in a row, due to poor communication in the group.

As for the bit about it being a DPS check, thats so far from the truth its laughable. Done it with extremly high DPS groups (3 warriors 1 mesmer 1 engie) and about the opposite (1 warrior 1 ranger 1 engie 2 condition necros) and its about the same, exept group set up 2 has to bring their A-game for a longer duration (more repeats on the kiting) then groupset up 1 did.

Never ever have we failed Simin. What I can say though, is that if the group takes a bit on the long side with the sparks (and I think this is where 90% of the “OH SNAP SHE SO BUGGED” posts are really coming from, delusions on how fast you are) you most likely won´t win.

So, for set up 2, in an effort to max out the DPS, park the warrior where Simin stealths, always send any pet class back to the tree and tell them to hug it until trap has been dealt with, and the people running sparks do that.
Usually PUGs here take at least 3-4 cycles before sparks are done in anything even resembling a good fashion, then you have time lost from petrification (honestly, most people just don´t land tears as soon as it switches from stare into stun) as well as her healing and its very very easy for people to start thinking its bugged.

Like I said though, it really isn´t. And we have been stuck, for long periods at a time, at 45%-55%, after the initial switch. Sometimes its just harsh.

Now I don´t know where this minute for DPS that people keep refering to comes from, I can honestly say that the window between stealth cycles seems more like 30 seconds, so a 10 second spark kite gives 20 seconds of DPS, a 15 second gives 15 and so on. Then toss 1 petrified on top and a few bad rounds and Simins restealthing sure seems instant indeed. But it isn´t.

Practice makes perfect. And I´m positive it wasn´t perfect for 90% of the groups.

That said, they sure could fix some stuff here, it´s sad that even I feel that rangers are an issue on path 4 of Arah. A big hindrance. And I´m so far away from being an elitist overall but they do make Simin twice as hard. I can only imagine how “fun” it would be wiht 2 there.

And also, buff the reward from the legendary giant event. 2 silver for 3 purple giants feels kinda like cheating. Not even a chest? Really?

Recipie for winning without hogging any of the 3 spots where rocks don´t fall for some reason (betting that this is a bug, just like they probably never intended for people to stand on the roof or on the ledge in CM Path 1 etc etc) so you also experience the good feeling that goes with beating content legit.

Grast needs to be buffed via stability during the START of the howl or he might fall. Several different abilities can achieve this, assign an order before you engage so you don´t end up wasting multiplies at once.
You might still have to dodge once near Grast just incase he decides a slow hammer swing is the smartest opening move during the shout. Do this, rocks miss, and Grast will 100% certain shield after this. Anyone claiming he doesn´t shield has missed core mechanics just. Grast finishes his current move, then shields. If he has no move going when the howl starts (unlikely actually) he shields instantly.

So, thats how you GET the shield up. Now the entire party is inside the little bubble, Grast is in the very middle of the bubble and the big gnarly is staring at the lot of you and trying to nibble a bit on the lot of you.
As many might have noticed, Rumblus can knock you out of the shield. Often. So you want to avoid that, this is achievable via stability / dodging OR just max ranging it INSIDE the bubble while you toss Grast a heal. If the ENTIRE party max ranges inside the bubble, Grast will tank this bit for you, heal him.

So, thats 1 method of doing it reliably that accomodates several different party makeups (just need stability reliably on reasonable cooldowns) that will, once you learn it, lead to a 100% win ratio.

The 2nd option is interrupting Rumblus. For this, you need to remove defiance + interrupt Rumblus at the end. You want the FINAL interrupt (the “actual” interrupt if you want) to be a short duration pushback (not a knockdown / stun / daze) since these give the LEAST amount of defiance stacks. It is advisable that the group, prior to engaging, decides who is in charge of using the final one during the actual wind up on the howl. Immediatly after interrupting (you see that this was done via the reappearance of the yellow defiance counter with Nr X in it) the group needs to strip away the X new defiance stacks (best case, very low number, worst case there would be 6 stacks, you dont want that) by taking turns hitting Rumblus with knockdown / stun / daze / knockback etc until all the stacks are gone. Rinse and repeat, 100% win if done properly and no NPC reliance at all.

The issue here is that 1 person messing up (missing the last interrupt OR someone using 1 ability to much while stripping and refreshing rumblus stacks prior to howl) will usually lead to the entire group wiping since the group isn´t focused on helping / healing Grast and instead find themselves smashed to mosh by the rocks.

Not sure wether or not this one is bugged (that windup hammer attack not being stopped for Grast to shield when the howl starts seems kinda off for instance) or not (since yeah, totally doable, not hard and in no way complicated if people are able to communicate even just a little) but I have to say that the people that claim that its totally impossible after trying 6 times and wiping even though they are ZOMGAMAZING players really never should try any hard MMOs.

But, for all its worth, there are at least 3 spots in the room or just outside where rocks don´t fall, you can always just use those and pretend its an intended feature for "pro"players to find like most whiners do with all odd bugs from AC up to Arah and every dungeon inbetween!

Well, I knew it was that room you meant, they are just as vulnerable for corner pulling as everything else in this game.

If the issue was multiple cond builds in the same group, then yeah, that won´t fly sadly (I also wanted to be a cond build, they rock solo but the way conds work now they are utterly wasted in PvE even if they are the only cond build in any given group) but its hard to belive that there were 2 cond built engies in the same group.
Sadly, doing a war of attrition against AoE heavy silver mobs in a dungeon enviroment where they also have acess to stability, thats not going to fly in CM or in Arah (where you again meet AoE happy packs with stability) sadly, the only way to go is frontloaded damage and using conditions as a back up.
See, what your saying is that you were able to destroy the groups easy with 1 warrior 1 engineer and 1 guardian. If you cant outperform that 1 warrior / 1 guardians AoE damage using 4 toons + what I assume to be the same engineer as in the above scenario, then something is wrong with those 4 toons.

Sure, a warrior does more AoE DPS then my engineer, but he doesn´t do 4 times more. I rarerly skip those groups, when I do it´s cos of lacking AoE power along with the feeling I often get in PuGs (that people aren´t up to snuff plain and simple) and so skip those two packs. But if people are performing, there is no reason ever to skip them. Corner pull > “shut down damage” > AoE > destroyed

The only time your group is vulnerable, is the moment you open up and before you have spread out a bit, after that its cake and free loot galore.
Try it and see.

Well, I assume team 1 just sat behind a reflect bubble mashing their 1 key while team 2 got AoE owned by mobs with stability?

Engineers come with 2 handy tricks for avoiding that, one is in the flamethrower (blind) and the other is in the pistol (blind) / X setup.

So, in answer, corner pull, CC, AoE, win. In that order.

The trick with a corner pull, and where most PuGs fail, comes from the fact that a ranged mob that can see anyone from the party will stop and use ranged attacks. Then again, why shouldn´t it?

So, when doing CM (or really, ANY dungeon anywhere) its always better to pull mobs in then to rush at them or, god forbid, fire at them while standing around like 5 drooling sacks of not so free repair bills.
The sad part in any PuG is that 1 person standing in the open is enough for all of the above to fail. Especially in CM where quite a few mobs are capable of blinding you / knocking you / putting oodles of vulnerability on you from a distance.

BUT, if everyone hugs the wall like it was their first born child and 1 person shoots 1 shot from a good distance before going V / V to dodge backwards and then you start letting loose on the mobs when they close in, I assure you that you will win these fights in a nice, timely fashion without needing a reflect bubble for hiding behind.

Infact, I promise you that if you stop relying on the crutch that is pressing keys behind a bubble and just learn how to outthink the rather dumb AI, you would see a lot less teams wanting only warriors / mesmers / guards.
Easymode is all good and whatnot, but hardly required anywhere, and certainly not in CM.

Why is it that everyone that complains about the dungeons being “way over the top hard” are the very same people that ABSOLUTELY refuse to follow even the simplest of instructions?

Is it really that much fun when you die over and over and over and over because you can´t be arsed to actually pull mobs, instead of RUSHING into them and eating 2-6 ground AoEs just because some 3 warrior / 1 guardian / 1 mesmer group on youtube did that?

Every class gets lots of utility in one form or another, using it is never bad. It´s getting frustrating when you first have the task of finding people that want to try dungeons, then you start on up, only to find out that one guy in the group is the type of clown that gets outsmarted by a turret and ends up wiping your group when he does manage finding a group of mob that is´nt permarooted and pulls them all.

The playerbase here is so DPS focused (and I admit, when you DO know what you´r doing, you can take off as much utility as possible in favor of DPS) that it makes dungeons ten times harder then they should be.
In all fairness, I recon something like half the players crying in this forum are the kind of players that you are actually better of trying to 4 man the dungeon without them.

CM is the first dungeon that actually requires you to think on your feet. Calling it hard is a mockery of any hard dungeon in any game. It´s not hard. At all. Even at 45 (I did every dungeon at level so far) and certainly not at 80.
Now, if you go in at 45 with a group that has another make-up then the youtube groups you´r watching before you go (or heck, same make-up but different traits / skills picked) then yeah, what they did MIGHT NOT work for you.
Lets not rush to the forums and whine about it.

For any dungeon in any game ever made, first time you do go, you should be a bit careful. When you pull, the basic line of thinking is “judge amount of mobs – shoot the one furthest from the others – hide ENTIRE group behind terrain”, this makes the gnarly and all his friends run over. Since they don´t see you, they don´t stop to cast or shoot on their way over. When they come around the corner, you unload. If the mobs are lacking stability this is a good time for the group to unload 1 AoE CC of some kind. Or AoE guard. Or AoE reflect. Or AoE “whatever”. After a bit they die. You move on, rinse repeat.

In all honesty, speed ruuuuuushing trough dungeons rather then being a bit careful IS ONLY FAST IF EVERYONE KNOWS WHAT THEY ARE DOING AND WHAT THE DUNGEON LOOKS LIKE AND HOW IT WORKS AND WHERE THEY ARE GOING AND WHERE THE MOBS LEASH (this bit is in caps because its SOOOOO IMPOOOORTANT) and if ALL of the above isn´t true, odds are your rush is going to end up with somewhere between 1 and 5 dead party members. Sometimes you MUST rush, say you wiped a bit and the mobs are now placed poorly and you have no choice left, but thats RARE if you and your group are even a little careful.

In CM the key to sucess is PULLING (not RUSHING INTO) onto your group. You get small chunks of mobs (top pull is 5 silvers, but they come first 2, then another 3 after a bit) and after that its just target priority. Which ones go down first depends on whats in your group mostly. If riflemen are present, stand still when the big red target is under your feet.
Blinds rock. Knocks rock on ANYTHING that shoots or wants to melee, unless a thug is present. Reflect rocks. Fear rocks. Cripple rocks. Terrain is your friend (gnarly monsters, like white men, can not jump) always.

Good luck in your future runs. Stop complaining, man up, don´t let those TRIXXY TURRETS outsmart you (the solution when you see a turret is…. waaaait for iiiit…. DON´T FIGHT BY THE TURRETS, move the mobs, after all mobiles are dead, stand around a bit, toss in some ground target stuff, get a general idea about how many mobs you hit with those, active dodge into room, push off AoE blind / stun / daze etc and quickly burn down whats left) on your next run. ANd never ever ever run up and into a group of gnarlies if you aren´t SURE that they are trivial for your group.

And me personally, I don´t even like running into groups of mobs when they ARE trivial since that makes people sloppy.
You better belive that the first people that figured out those dungeons had their fair share of wipes as well. But, if they are anything like me, it sure as heck wasn´t on the trash.