Guild Wars 2

SaracenZA.8426:

Did it with no buffs or help, and I play from South Africa on a ping of roughly 250ms -300ms. The First bit is the hardest! I must say jumping puzzles have taken me by surprise and i actually realized that they are insanely fun. The Clock Tower was no exception, I loved every bit of it and the end is very rewarding.

Keep up the good work Anet!

P.s. it took me roughly an hour and a half to do it twice (the first time i lagged out and walked off the final staircase…)

I don’t think anyone has seriously been thinking the puzzle was not doable by some people. I also don’t think you and others being good at jumping puzzles much helps the folks having difficulty or addresses the underlying root problem. But that’s just an observation.

Mario.6309:

I dunno… I believe that’s part of what makes it an achievement. Completing it, and completing it within a time constraint. It’s a measly 10 achievement points and it doesn’t go towards the title. Why can’t there be a few achievements that I can feel are worthy of being called an achievement?

No one’s forcing you get all the achievements, it’s all self-imposed. Anyone that get’s overly frustrated about an achievement really only has themselves to blame. If there’s something I can’t complete, I accept it and move on.

If you don’t care about the achievement, a measly 10 points as you put it that don’t go toward a title…then why are you so adamant about having that achievement remain the way it is? Obviously you do care.

You aren’t as dense as that, you know why people will force themselves to do crap they don’t want to just for a random achievement. I’ve seen it in more games then just this.

Moving the achievement and puzzle off the special event doesn’t diminish the value of that achievement, it just gives those having problems time to learn the puzzle and not have to stress over it. Unless you actually think moving the achievement is a nerf to the difficulty?

Mario.6309:

I’ve said it countless times. Making the content accessible for everyone effectively EXCLUDES those of higher skill levels because content that’s too easy isn’t fun… there needs to be some challenge. Why can’t there just be content with varying levels of difficulty, something for everyone. It’s ONE optional event, not even needed for the title. Don’t like it? Move on to one of the many other pieces of content.

I don’t think anyone really minds there being content of varying levels of difficulty. I believe, after reading this thread, that the issue is the achievement associated with it. Having the Clock Tower be difficult isn’t an issue, having it for only a week isn’t an issue either, having it be time limited and associated with an achievement is a huge problem for some people (particularly anyone who’s a completionist). It’s unfortunate a those who’ve completed the achievement seem quick to forget the frustrations of it and turn around ridiculing the other side for suggesting some simple changes.

Personally I believe the most balanced tactic in this situation would be to remove the achievement while keeping the clock tower puzzle the same. It gives both sides what they say they want. Difficult content for one and making it optional for anyone who’s really into achievements.

If as has been suggested that the clock tower was designed such that 5 to 10% of the player base could do it, then by removing the achievement you cater to the majority of the player base. In the end that seems the best option for the longevity of the game as a whole vs the egos of the few.

I did however do some thinking, if the Clock Tower were just made available outside of the event timeline and the achievement moved to the jumping puzzle achievement section, that’d let the people who do complete the puzzle have their achievement points and relieve the stress on the folks trying desperately to finish the puzzle before the event ends. The clock tower is actually a really good puzzle, minus all the Char and Norn…and Humans (hey my toon is Asura). Shame it’s only available for a week now isn’t it

Oats.9546:

Did you ever think that this event was put in for people who want a challenge? I LOVED the clocktower. LOVED it. You know why? Every other game that has a holiday event makes it cheesy, grindy, and ultimately boring. The clocktower took me at least 2 hours to finish ONE time. That in my opinion is fun because you feel accomplished. After another 2 hours, im hitting the top 70% of the time. I find that I want to do the event just because its fun, i could give a crap about the halloween bags.

If you want “events for everyone”, look around! 80% of this event caters to EASY quests with decent rewards. Find the ghost… with guides… really? This does nothing for the hardcore gamers, but its something for everyone. Leave the kitten clocktower! There are other ways to get the rewards from it (MK dungeon) if you can’t platform.

As far as achievements go, you may not get it if you can’t do a hard jumping puzzle. In real life, i’d like the achievement of being a CEO, winning the lottery, being a quarter back in the NFL, and performing successful heart surgery. I’ll probably do none of these, and nobody will give me an acknowledgement of completing these tasks. Just face it, you may not get all of the achievements for Gw2. Tera had an achievement for first of your class to max level and nobody kittened about that even though only 7 or so people could achieve it. The simple solution is to do nothing about this event and leave it as it is, and its also the best one

BTW my guild is filled with full time employees that are casual as hell and EVERYONE has finished (most of them under 2 hours).

Yes, the thought that the clock tower was for people who want a challenge did occur to me. That is why I prefer the solution to a problem that keeps the clock tower the way it is.

Given that the suggestion wouldn’t change the clock tower puzzle, your discussion would seem to suggest you aren’t actually concerned about the jumping puzzle itself but the achievement associated with it. So if you are that tied to getting the achievement, then it really isn’t a stretch to understand the feeling of the people having difficulties.

I also don’t think you can apply “best” to your solution, perhaps, “best for you”. “Best for me” would probably be to reduce the difficulty a tad so I don’t have to spend 8 hours trying it. On the other hand I think “best for the game” is to remove the achievement. In any case not up to us, I only made a suggestion, assuming the developers read this stuff, the decision is theirs.

Strang.8170:

I don´t think adding achievement for the puzzle is bad thing, quite the contrary. What i do think is bad thing is that the achievement counts towards the overarcing title achievement.
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To be clearer, I was referring specifically to jumping puzzles during holiday events. Achievements for jumping puzzles are fine, there’s one for completing all the open world jumping puzzles already in the game but putting them on a limited timed event is a bad idea. I submit this thread as proof of that.

The root cause of the problem is the achievement, removing it would seem the most reasonable approach that would solve the problems of the majority of the people. The side in favor of hard jumping puzzle gets to keep the puzzle the way it is, and gets an extra shot at loot. The other side doesn’t feel pressured to complete the puzzle because it’s not on the achievement list for the Halloween world event.

I would just like to point out, that completing the clock tower does not count as an achievement towards the overall event title. What you get from the clock tower are some achievement points and ofcourse the nice exotics.

Thanks for pointing that out Imrhien, however, I was already aware of this.

The problem is that it shows up in the list of achievements for the event. As long as it exists there people will feel the need to complete it. And if they have problems doing jumping puzzles for whatever reason (their connection, just not good at jumping puzzles, a disability, etc) not being able to do the achievement can feel like a real failure. People will do bizzar things for achivements (e.g. lvling your gw1 character to max in pre-searing noob area), this is no different.

Fearys.9026:

Fearys.9026:

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This is what´s wrong with achievement systems….people have started thinking they have to be able to get them all. And as a consequence we have achievements for watching a kittening intro…. :/
It´s an achievement, grab a dictionary and look it up.
Other than that it´s also completely personal achievement, nobody knows you have it, nobody can see you have it…it´s there only as a little reward for yourself. If you feel it´s not worth it, why the hell would you do it? Your future, in game or otherwise, certainly doesn´t depend on it. After a week nobody but you is even interested wether you even knew what gw2 is week ago, musch less wether you finished an achievement, which most propably goes away with all the other holiday stuff.

There isn’t anything wrong with the achievement system, getting them all is actually the entire point of the bloody thing. It’s a meta game inside the main game, a type of character progression beyond simple XP. And some people really get into it. Sticking the achievement to a difficult jumping puzzle that not everyone will be able to do is like placing a cooked ham just outside the range of a tied up starving dog, it will drive him crazy. A basic level of empathy toward other people and you can see what’s wrong with the situation.

Read through a good portion of this thread. I tend to have more sympathy for the argument of the people who are having difficulty then those that don’t. If you’re not particularly good at twitch mechanics, fighting the camera, running and jumping at the same time, it can be very frustrating. Not everyone has the same abilities and this isn’t CoD or Mario Brothers.

As far as the clock tower is concerned, it seems a bit over-tuned toward the “twitch” side of things and there are a couple external factors that really impact the puzzle.

I believe one good suggestion to fix this was to reduce the speed at which the mist raises (gives time for people to fight their camera and do the jumps) and make the tower a solo instance.

Alternatively, remove the achievement from the world event. Not sure about anyone else but I don’t really care about the loot that drops, I want the clock tower because of the achievement associated with it. Remove the achievement and the clock tower becomes optional.

I would also recommend for future holiday events that such jumping puzzles do not have associated achievements with them or you’ll just end up with the same type of thread where people who have completed the event ridicule the folks who have difficulty.

Aside from the tower jumping puzzle it’s been a great event so far, lots of fun