Guild Wars 2

Yup… and I was so happy when i read the patch notes.

achmed.6542:

Some of the criticism is just “I hate X” and doesn’t say how it could be improved, but even this kind of input is useful on some level and should be considered. Most people realize they aren’t skilled game designers and can only say if they like something or don’t like something.

thats what gets me most in game forums. no matter what game you play, people usualy come up with ideas they think are great, but dont spent a second thinking about consequences or balancing issues this will cause.
“hey, wouldnt it be cool if we had an instagib attack?” ofc it would but was this serious question?

got no problem with bug reports or asking to exchange/buff a certain skill since we have plenty of those, but total game/class redesigns? i mean common people, you should know that this isnt done within a month or even possible.

We already have a 1500 range kit. This kit is by far the highest dps the engineer has, how is a second long range kit with (one would hope) reasonable damage, and only single target hits gonna unbalance the class?

The amount of straw manning that goes on on the engineer is what I have a problem with, people try to shut down conversations with arguments about balance, and fear mongoring about current skills/weapons being replaced.

To the op the majority of threads if i remember right were asking for alternatives not replacements, a new long ranged kit not replacing the current rifle skills with longer ranged ones.

Also a arguments that our current weapons ( minus grenade kit) are long ranged are irritating. The rifle has a total 1 skill that does max damage at long range. Overload and (arguably) jumpshot is mid range, and blunderbuss is less than melee range.

Anyway bit of a rant myself there, OP I respect your opinion and get where your coming from, there feels like massive amount of negativity on this forum, disagree that long ranged alternative is class breaking.

He didn’t say rifles are crap, they just don’t suit the want he’d like to play his engineer. Read the first post.

Replace one of the lesser used skills with the new kit. Not ideal but something like battering ram could be incorporated into a longer ranged kit easily (just an example, I love battering ram :-( )

So there seems to be a lot of negativity around engineers at the moment, if I was lead designer I would be half way through a bottle of scotch by now wondering where it all went wrong!

So lets give our imaginary designer a lift, I love my engineer and I know a lot of you guys do, tell us why.

1. Kits are a great mechanic , love whipping out my massive… crowbar and giving the enemy a good bonk in between rifle blasts.

2. So many tools , toolbelt is a great idea and make you feel like your set for anything, more than make us for lost slot on kits.

3. Animations , with the exception of one rifle skill they all look great and are really satisfying.

4. Play style , running about the battle field throwing out grenades, pogo-ing on my rifle, throwing out rams heads, all that good stuff. Playing an engineer is just the right amount of crazy.

5. Skill cap , its a deep class which requires a lot of focus to play well, and its sooo satisfying when you do everything right 1v1 in pvp.

Disclaimer: Blatant rip off of the “What do you hate about your engineer” thread.

@ Zinwrath

Can’t wait to hear your ideas for your rocket kit.

@Aristio

Hah, bit of a swipe at me on the bland sniper rifle, it’s ok I forgive you. My idea was more about the appearance/flavour than the skills anyway. Like the combo on the leap, always feel we should have more combo-ing options.

Believe it or not I think the damage on charged shot would be a little low for the 3 seconds of vulnerability. Like the way you kept Throw Mine, seems under used as is.

So had a minute to think about it,

1. Turrets suck at the moment.

2. No long ranged weapon apart from grenades. (Don’t like ground targeting)

3. Back packs, should be able to turn them off.

4. Elixers are too random, in competitive play this stops being fun starts being annoying.

5. Grenades are too powerful, everything else is too weak. (Intra-class balance is rubbish)

Latex nun is a grown up game played by Mummies and daddies that love each other very much :-<

Yeah love it when my back pack glitches off. Easy to implement quality of life adjustment.

Signed.

Way hey progress, thanks for you idea Aristio, still don’t think your kit fits the engineer flavour quite right but that’s more personal preference. Love the skill ideas though, especially the tool belt skill.

Numbers need work but like I said on my first post it’s up to Arena Net to balance the numbers.

@Zinwrath

Love the launcher kit idea works with the current engineer feel. Honestly think its the best idea so far, only problem which trait line??? Explosives or fire arms? The mind boggles!

Gravity gun sounds cool but would fit the asura like a glove, not so much with races, just my opinion. Would make an amazing asura racial elite though! Maybe later well see racial+profession elites?

Fair enough you don’t like the idea, if you had of just said that at the start we coulda cut down on all the crap about mid-ranged class.

The kit is a offered solution to a genuine problem many engineers have encountered (that the came in expecting to have a viable ranged weapon), the main complaint against sniper kits is they don’t fit the game (in people’s opinions).

My kit fits engineers as they are fire arms specialists, inventors, so an experimental fire arms kit makes sense (flame thrower feels more alchemy).

With grenades, jump shot, glue shot etc. we have loads of ground targeted skills already (ground targeting is a main complaint on grenades kits), and electricity doesn’t really fit engineers, apart from static discharge, #3 pistol, #5 shield we are not meant to be masters of electricity. 2s aoe stun far too powerful, spec full bunker run in, elixir s, team mates, ???, profit.

Magic Knight if you just wanted range you could have rolled Elementalist, Necro, or Rifle Warrior. We have rifled barrels, so longer horizontal range than bows.

Zinwrath, glad there are other people out there that feel the same. When I said balance I meant 2 of each kit not game balance, in an ideal world I’d agree about kits being balanced independent of weapons. However all kits are not created equal unfortunately.

Anyway this has gone loads off topic, arguing the balance of a non-existent kit is the definition of futility.

So if you agree Aristio that we are not an only mid ranges class then what’s the harm of balancing it out so we have 2 melee, and 2 long ranged kits?

They do have loads of cool skills, I love mine as is, but you don’t play classes for ranges, it might be a part of the class flavour but its not the reason. You play classes for their mechanics, mesmers for clones, rangers for you animal companion, etc.

It wouldn’t be an advantage if its balanced. And we do ok in damage but its not awesome unless your using grenades.

(Quotes not working on my phone)

“And for god’s sake, WE’RE A MID-RANGE CLASS!!! How hard is that to except? In fact, they only gave us the range on the Grenades when they realized everyone needs at least 1 form of a 1200 range weapon. Grenades originally could only go up to 900 with the Throwing Arm trait (Later combined into Grenadier along with Big Satchel or something).”

Bit aggressive, everyone is entitled to their opinion, they don’t have to just accept yours.

The mid ranger class thing is daft, if they were designing the game like that they’d have just changed the trinity from healer, tank, dps to short, middle, long. Rangers are an all range class, effective in melee as well as long range. So why given that should a engineer to pigeon holed as middle ranged?

How does it affect you if engineers gain a balanced long ranged option? How does it affect the game? There’s no downside, so why are you so opposed to it?

Westley.4716:

Thamyris.3570:

Everyone and their dog has a pistol or rifle in this game, there are sniper rifles, mortars, char tracked vehicles, and flying machines. Engineers are a long was off being the first gunmen now, and rockets are a tougher tech than automatic weapons. Anyway that’s my opinion.

Fun fact: The first explosive rockets were in use by the Chinese in the 13th century. The first automatic rifle was made in 1887. The first multi-barreled automatic gun (the famous Gatling Gun) was invented in 1862, 25 years before the first automatic rifle.

I support a deployable, controllable gatling Elite skill.

Drat fouled by the Chinese again, yeah they had most crazy warfare ideas long before the western world.

Yeah I’m not really expecting any new skills for a long while, bug fixes have priority and rightly so.

In reply to Aristo;

Not trying to make the engineer into a one man army, we are already the firearm specialists like it or not, we come to battle with turrets, grenades, mortars, flame throwers, and Medical kits. In my opinion a rickety Gatling gun style weapon, which is basically 3 rifles strapped together and powered my a crank handle would fit perfectly with the profession.

To Magic Knight;

Everyone and their dog has a pistol or rifle in this game, there are sniper rifles, mortars, char tracked vehicles, and flying machines. Engineers are a long was off being the first gunmen now, and rockets are a tougher tech than automatic weapons. Anyway that’s my opinion.

I admit the skills are not crazy enough as is, change tracer rounds to “Whizz bang” or something, fires 3 small aoe fire works, and Ap rounds to “launch shrapnel” and have wrenches, hammers, clusters of screws fire out of the barrels.

Also the ranger argument irks me as they can go pure melee if they really want.

So first post on the forum so far, I want to preface this by stating that I love my engineer. We all know that they have their bugs, but nothing really game breaking (apart from turrets being rubbish imo) so I won’t rehash them here. Engineers are viable and this suggestion is entirely based on personal preference.

Anyway like many engineers I’m a little miffed at the lack of a long ranged option (minus grenade kit). Its been said loads that there should not be a sniper kit due to the fact that they exist in game and they are imba, tripod mounted beasts, fair enough here’s an alternative idea.

Gatling / Auto-rifle kit:

I’m going to leave damage/duration/CD out as Arena Net will have their own data to balance the game with.

Notes: All skills would have a explosive shot sized aoe or poison shot type spread, to represent rapid fire. This kit would have the same stationary cast as long bow on rangers, for flavour all skills would be multiple hits. Its designed to synergize (not a word) with condition builds as they’re more screwed at range (power at least has grenades).

1. Incendiary Rounds.
Standard auto-attack, with a burning effect.
Range 1200

2. Suppressive Fire.
Straight damage with a cripple effect (possible immobilisation).
Range 600 – 800 (possible ranges not sweet spot)

3. Tracer rounds.
Damage and confusion.
Range 1200

4. AP rounds.
Damage and bleeding component (or vulnerability).
Range 1200

5. Rapid fire / Unload.
Big damage, knock back for enemy and knock down for engineer.
Range 200 – 400

So the gatling gun style weapon fits with current kits, big gun multiple barrels, back-pack full of ammo. It also fits with the movement limiting feature. But some people are asking for kits without back packs so a combat with a massive drum magazine would suffice.

Anyway that’s my suggestion I don’t expect anything like this to be implemented, if Arena Net had wanted us to be a proper long ranged class then they would have launched us with a different rifle. Work of fantasy, discuss.