Guild Wars 2

Ashen.2907:

graymouser.4698:

If someone has an idea why primitive weaponry is still being used in Tyria, please add this to the discussion!

Cheers!

Gray

My thought is that the primary damaging force in a weapon in Tyria is the magic contained therein. The magic is delivered via the weapon strike. The amount of magic is directly proportional to the mass of the weapon. In the case of a missile weapon the mass of the projectile is used. This means that a sword, axe, etc will do more damage than an aarrow. Since magical armor, or the magic infused hides of monsters, outmass an arrow by a greater margin than they do a greatsword, the arrow will do less damage than will a greatsword strike.

This mass to magical force theory would also explain why so many of the most powerful weapons, those of, “Legendary,” power are crafted to be so very large. They need to be big in order to contain legendary levels of magic. Why else would anyone want to use a sword the size and shape of an unwieldy surfboard?

Good Lore explanation! Do official resources exist on this subject (the magical strength of iron weaponry)?

Thanks

Cheers

G. Mouser

Ticky.5831:

graymouser.4698:

If someone has an idea why primitive weaponry is still being used in Tyria, please add this to the discussion!

Cheers!

Gray

I’m guessing they aren’t obsolete because it’s fantasy. For whatever reason(magic, materials, “Human’s” not being “Earthlings” and being harder to penetrate with projectiles for whatever reason, etc), there isn’t the gulf between the levels of effectiveness that exists in our world.

Basically the math of the game accurately represents the effectiveness of the weapons in Tyria. If a sword is as effective or more than a rifle in Tyria, the fact that a sword isn’t as effective as a rifle on earth is irrelevant. Therefore, they are still modern weapons on Tyria.

And that may seem like a total handwave and copout, but according to the lore; it’s unusual for Tyrians to NOT fully manifest magical ability by the age of 5. In a fantasy world that throws our basic model of metphysics out the window, our assuption of them are absolutely worthless.

Good explanations…

Yeah, if I speak of “realism” I do not mean the game world has to comply to Newtonian physics as we know them on our version of “Earth”, but that we have Tyrian lore that explains things in a believable, logical way. Where things have reasons why they are as they are.

Logical lore makes a world “believable” to me, and that’s what I call “realistic”. If there is no logic behind manifestations then they loose reality value. And reality value is what makes a world come to life, otherwise it remains the ramblings of a psychotic.

We need the logical ramblings of a mage not the irrational ramblings of a psychiatric patient. Although the two are very close, they are not the same…

Very interesting tread here, and I now completely accept the absence of horses and the magical strength of iron weaponry…

G. Mouser

Torolan.5816:

If I had access to teleporters, I would probably only know what a horse is if I saw one in a book. Sturdy animals like an ox find a use in agriculture, and some horses of course too, so that use is still there, but this also screams “Job for a golem!” for me. And why take an unconvenient ride if you can just teleport, or feed a horse if the friendly Golem can do the job? The technic affirmity surely is someday a running buzzsaw falling into the lap of man, but it is how it is.^^

Riding a horse for the sake of reaching a place does simply not make sense for me in Tyria, sry.

Well such lore based arguments as this one have convinced me enough now to accept that Tyria is a successful, believable world WITHOUT mounts.

If they indeed discovered magic and magical driven mechanics and because of this taming and riding ride-able mounts became unpopular, then that’s a reasonably valid explanation for me.

Still it’s a bit strange then that they still rely on swords and such and not 100% on magic driven rifles, canons and rockets etc. And that they did not develop individual transport by magical means. But yeah maybe the government wants to control all distance travel, so they just prohibited individual controlled transport. They probably register every movement in and out a portal

If someone has an idea why primitive weaponry is still being used in Tyria, please add this to the discussion!

Cheers!

Gray

Donari.5237:

How is this not merged into the Mounts thread yet? It is exactly the same discussion that’s been held every single time this topic comes up.

There must be some hidden psychological reason for this…

And it comes back again and again because apparently many ppl keep being disappointed about this…. Its says something…

EphemeralWallaby.7643:

graymouser.4698:

But simply the statement: “we don’t need horses because we have fast travel” is a 1oo% non-argument for me

We should base ourselves on immersion and lore when making a decision on horses.

It’s the ‘immersion and lore’ argument that doesn’t hold any water, sorry. In RL horses for travel all but disappeared because of the automobile showing up… cars are faster, easier, and cheaper to use. If cheap and accessible teleportation were to become widely available, automobiles would go the way of the horse.

Well, in GW2 there IS teleportation, as well as modes of travel that are cheaper and easier to use from an immersion standpoint. Horses/mounts are absolutely irrelevant in this context.

From a business standpoint adding in mounts would be time and energy spent making something that’s NOT special in comparison to other MMOs, and thus just ‘reinventing the horse.’ Faster travel that is special to GW2 (such as teleportation and gliding) is a much better use of ANet’s labor than being derivative. It’s that fact that gives the “we already have teleportation” argument more validity, even if you (and others) feel it’s a non-argument.

~EW

You made a decent point there but its not a strong one: if teleportation takes away the need for mounts, then why are npc’s still using oxes for transporting materials?

Just like trains do not make cars obsolete, teleportation does not take away the convenience of horses or other personal mounts or personal mechanical transportation.
With a horse you can easily go from your house to a nearby market, bar, river (to fish) while teleports have fixed start and end points. For personal freedom and for combat a horse is superior to teleports.

That said I would have no issue with Arenanet taking the teleports out of the game, they are only there for laziness sake anyway

In a pre-mechanised world mounts are simply a realistic development.

And if magic is of such common and powerful scale that it can provide all levels of transportation for every citizen then we might just as well throw away our rusty swords :p Such kind of powerful accessible magic would make any instrumental or mechanical item obsolete.

Imo fast travel and teleports are a cheap way for devs to cover up game-technical shortcomings and to provide a convenient way for 21st century casual players – who as kids got everything presented to them on a silver plate – with frustration free game time.

But I say to this: trying to avoid all frustration at any cost will eventually lead to less joy/happiness/satisfaction.

And to the argument that it’s foolish to talk about realism in a fantasy world I say this:

Fantasy is not devoid of reality. Fantasy is using our memory of images of real world objects, events and persons to invent new imaginary universes.

If a fantasy world would have no realism whatsoever then we could not even imagine it.

Also if we do not at all take in account realism then our fantasy world will be come so surrealistic that we loose interest/attraction.

It is exactly the resemblance of the real world merged with greater freedom of creativity and the significant up-scaling of how easy it is to attain/satisfy our desire (for aggression, joy, possession, power….) that makes fantasy worlds worthwhile.

This is also what movies and books are about…

Anyway if such arguments would come from people who actually play for the lore and immersion then it would be a worthwhile discussion.
But most anti-arguments here come from people who play the game for other reasons, which are just as well genuine and justified.

It would be better if you just said it like it is: “for me convenience of game play is superior to lore, immersion and rp, therefor I am against mounts”. Nothing wrong with that.
But at least we then all know which is our position and the discussion would lead to more clarity instead of more confusion….

Cheers!

Gray

ok now I realize that mounts are not present in the lore of Guild Wars, only as some kind of a legendary creature. So from an RP standpoint I would like to refrain myself a bit.

They should add some reason why people did not try to ride oxes or other carrying animals to the lore, then I could accept. Or they could bring in horses after some lore-wise kind of discovery of tameable wild horses in some far away colonial province.

Because indeed after so many years it would be a bit superficial if they would suddenly add mounts without a story behind it…

But simply the statement: “we don’t need horses because we have fast travel” is a 1oo% non-argument for me

We should base ourselves on immersion and lore when making a decision on horses.

Every person plays video games from his/hers own perspective and for his/her own reasons, so I do not wish to judge other opinions.

But from my standpoint, I see no good argument against mounts. I play video games for the sake of immersing myself in a medieval or science fiction like fantasy world. Mounts are simply realistic in medieval or renaissance like settings.

Guild Wars 2’s universe clearly hints to the renaissance- and revolutionary eras thus the absence of horses is almost a game breaker for me. One of the reasons I have been holding off this game is for it not having mounts.

If you really think of it its a bit hard to imagine a world without mounts, certainly when there are carts with animals pulling ppl everywhere. If there were no horses in Tyria, people would climb oxes or camels or whatever. It simply is not realistic that people would just go everywhere on foot or collective transport only while they could just as well try to tame and ride a personal animal.

I presume many play Guild Wars as some kind of a competitive action game, but I wonder why then use lore? Lore needs horses. Lore without horse is incomplete lore. It makes GW 2 much less valid for RP.

So to me not having horses in an RPG is almost like a sin. Its really a great failure, maybe GW’s only one.

But it’s so much in your face that it is n’t even funny.

I really have to guide my thought in not paying attention to the “big absence” so my fun in this otherwise nearly perfect game would not be spoiled…

So Gddmnd, for the sake of fantasy art, literature and rp, bring in the horses!

I suggest that all the social action gamers go play CoD. Thats a really unrealistic game but it’s a very action paced serie-killing of mobs

BUT respect for any ones nature & viewpoint!

Cheers!

Gray

Some like grinding, some don’t. The nice thing about GW2 is that everyone can choose his/hers own play style.

Personally I love grinding and I don’t think I will ever buy this 80 lvl boost. But because GW2 let’s me play how I choose I am grateful and do not mind if other people choose such play styles. It does not threaten my own way, so why bother?

At least I know for myself that I do not use these boosts and I am proud of that. If others want to be “lazy” (viewed from my standpoint), let them be it. You know who you are. If you can live by your own commandants you’re fine. Don’t care about what others do. Live and let live.

Cheers

Gray

Dear all

I am playing Guild Wars 2 again after playing the game for 1 week in 2012 and never logging in again after that, until now.

My main issue with the game back then was the absence of challenge I felt while playing. It all felt way too cheesy easy.

Now I realize that it mainly had to do with my own way of playing, (but I also read that (stats-)difficulty has been ramped up slightly: bravo!).

I think this subject has been mentioned endlessly already but I enjoy sharing my enthusiasm with you, so…

Back then I treated hearts as quests and I was doing them all in semi-order, which made me (in my experience) out-level the mobs continuously, which made them dirt easy. I was disgusted after one week easy gameplay. I must add that at that time I was quite mmorpg-ignorant as I came from playing single player rpg’s so you can imagine my disappointment.

Since then I started to be very critical towards easiness in mmorpgs and I have been cursing casual play style in mmorpgs ever since.

But step by step, through playing many different mmorpgs, I came to understand the limits and the common challenges that all mmorpg devs face. How they have to accommodate all types of players. My own brother for example is someone who hates too much challenge in games, and as I love my brother I tried to understand how it is for him.

I understand better now how people play videogames from very different perspectives.

And I fully understand the commercial need of games to comply to market demand.

Knowing this, its clear the goal for any mmorpg is to be all-inclusive. This means hardcore as well as softcore players must find their place in a game. Games who succeed in delivering such an experience have a great chance to succeed overall.

Up till now there is no game that does this better than Guild Wars 2.

I realize that I was doing it wrong and not GW2. I was playing the game wrongly. I was a bad player so to speak while in fact Guild Wars 2 is simply the best game on the current market, and still much better than any brand new mmorpg that came out in 2016.

I was was playing like a casual, against my own likes, not realizing one can just as well play Guild Wars 2 in a more hardcore way.

I realize I have the choice as there is almost no invisible wall. I can challenge mobs that are up til 10 levels higher than me: there is all the challenge I could want. And events and hearts do not stop me from joining in based on my level.

Besides just difference in stats I also experience enough tactics by enemies in the game. So more stat difference + interesting tactics by enemies, that’s all you need for a hardcore game play.

First I saw dynamic events & hearts as a measure to suit lazy people. But now I see how it enhances fluid and free play: no grouping issues, no level barrier, no pre-reqs for playing them. This solves many issues I have with other games like ESO, Blade and Soul, Tree of Savior… which I feel continuously force you to play in a certain way. They put you on a rail track and you just ride from quest to quest in predefined chains of order.

In Guild Wars 2 I feel completely free to be hardcore or casual. To play challenging fights with mobs or just one shot them. To explore or craft. Nothing is obligated and all is available. Also: the more effort, the more reward. Its all just feels really dynamic.

This freedom greatly enhances immersion. As in real life you are also free to do as you like and face the consequences of your choices.

The fact that there is less of a gear treadmill is more realistic.

I can go on for a long time but don’t want to keep on boring you.

Put simply, I am amazed by my own ignorance back then and really happy that I now, based on some new information I obtained about the game, chose to take a gamble and bought the Heart of Thorns Expansion.

For me Guild Wars 2 is a game of great freedom. Freedom is what I appreciate the most in any mmorpg. So Guild Wars 2 is now on top of my list of decent games.

Devs, thank you so much!

PS To the Devs: I love the recent changes. Please never make the game easier then it is right now. The current average difficulty is just right. Taking in account that casuals can underlevel and hardcores can overlevel. And please keep on investing in pvp and Esports. GW2 PVP is decent and can only get better…. Don’t worry about new AAA titles: your game is still the best and people will come back again and again and keep on rewarding you for this.

Cheers to all & enjoy playing!

Gray M.