I only just found about this CDI from a post in General. As someone with 3 rangers at 80 I’d like to think I have something to offer here but after 52 pages and 12 days it doesn’t look like it now. I’ll just have to see what happens in game.
I agree that the CDI turned out very big. It should be closed and divided into the main aspects, the pet, the weapons and the utility and traits. And those threads need more collaborative development.
The more responses I read from Anet, the more I realize how little they must play this classes compared to people who have put endless hours into ranger… I’m so close to re-rolling and starting a new main if this “keep rangers as a sustained DPS” nonsense is actually going to happen.
I have spent far too much work on my ranger to simply re-roll another class. I hope they hear what we have to say.
Especially this “We don’t want the ranger to deal too much damage” sounds odd to me since the ranger is the class with the smallest damage output.
I am really surprised with 90% of these posts. They show that most players just do not know how to play a ranger.
Since…
- Pets are Rangers, Rangers are Pets. Take another profession if you do not like to control 2 things (the pet and the ranger) at the same time.
I can’t disagree more. Pets are a bad elaborated mechanic. Just because you can make them work doesn’t mean they’re good.
And I’m definitely not going to reroll a warrior just to play as a crippled archer.
You can have your pet, I’m completely fine with that. However if I don’t want to use it, I should be able to stow it and get the damage back.
Since the devs did a pretty good job in avoiding this thread, I just want to remind you all that this thread is probably going to get closed on monday.
Okay, suddenly I really like the idea of replacing pets with preperations as the class mechanic. Just an F1 through 4 that affects our weapon skills in some way, by providing secondary effects. Perhaps one of those preparations can be the pet, itself. And when the pet it out, replace it with the pet’s usable skill.
F1 – Ingite Arrows (like Flame Legion Stalker can)
F2 – Poisoned Arrows
F3 – Sharpening Stone Arrows
F4 – Bilinding Arrows
Each effect holds for 5 shots or 5 seconds. Would be cool but I doubt it would happen.
Permastow is not impossible. I never meant to give that impression, so I apologize if I did. However, as far as priorities go for the Ranger, it is not high on the list. Why? Because it would require an entire re-balance of Ranger, but if we re-balanced, then the players that do play with the pet would be OP. See the dilemma there?
Thank goodness. I am confused about something though, why would perma stow make pets op? I figured that something like a damage boost would only occur while the pet was stowed. I don’t think that the skills themselves would need to be changed, just a %stat boost that would give the approximate damage that the pet gave.
The reason why I latched onto the aspect idea was because it was an option that seemed we could maybe work around. Rather than having to rebalance the whole class, we’d just have to balance the aspects to be similar to what the pet does damage-wise. That seemed a little more viable.
I thought that aspects was basically the equivalent of perma-stowing with a stat boost, an F2 skill by family and glowing particles to show which aspect you were in. I don’t really understand how this is dramatically different from perma stowing with a damage boost while stowed.
Perma stow wouldn’t make pets OP. In rebalancing for permastow, it would make those that still want to play with the pet op. THAT IS, unless we design something that gives the player a boost to balance it out.
The aspects I think were a little different. They talked about having specific bonuses based on the pet that the player was using. That is different from just giving a damage boost, which could end up being difficult to balance.
So if you don’t want to shift the damage to “Ranger 100% damage + Pet additional damage”, which could be partly shifted back by investing points into beastmastery, you better have a smart solution. Personally I like to have a pet around since it draws the aggresion. The only thing I want more than having a pet tanking for me is having my damage back. With my suggestion, I could have both. If you want to give us our damage back if we’ve our pet stowed, I would have to decide.
Add a grandmaster trait that gives us 100% of the power for our class and this issue goes away.
I don’t think that we should have to spend trait points to get to 100% of our base power.
I agree. I’d actually prefer this.
Rebalance the 70% 30% split to 95% 5% and add a minor trait in BM that allows you change back to the 70% 30% if you rely on on your pet.
Treat pets as an addition to rangers the same way spirits are. Rangers are an A la carte class, so please allow us to not order a double helping of pet.
Or just balance it to 95%-5% and make the BM Pet Attribute Bonus something like -5% ranger damage per 10 points and +10% pet damage per 10 points.
So… you and a few others have specifically said that you love having a pet around, but at the same time, you want ANet to nerf pet damage and put more of it on to Ranger?
I mean, I’m all in favor of giving Ranger more damage, but I’m just confused why you’d want a pet in the first place if its damage is going to be even more pathetic. It’s entirely counter-intuitive.
If the pet dies, you just lose additional stuff rather than 1/3 of your effectiveness.
Investing into the Beastmastery traitline will still turn your pet into a serious enemy.
The pet could be more utility-oriented rather than beeing trimmed on dealing damage.
No other classmechanic sets yourself on a disadvantage to justify itself.
The pet will never be a reliable damagesource. Therefore, make it additional.
I just think it’s hilarious that self-proclaimed pet supporters are looking to move the pet’s damage onto the Ranger.
As I’ve said before, somewhere in this thread, I don’t want the pet to be removed; I want the damagecomponent to be removed.
An AI will never be reliable. Therefore it’s stupid to think that the pet would be able to deal our damage. It is on the other hand perfectly capable of providing additional things.
You can use your pet for support or utility (Tanking in PvE, F2 skills, shouts) but they shouldn’t be mandatory i order to succeed.
Ranger is the only class ingame with 15sec invul uptime..
If your pet doesn’t die. And only if you’ve traited for the signets.
I highly doubt that the raflect we have is as big as the ele ones (Ele 400 units radius, ranger (traited) 150 units radius). Furthermore, the ele’s reflect lasts 6 seconds, it doesn’t require the ele to stand still and it hasn’t be traited to be somewhat effective.
Roots are neglectable in PvE. In PvP, they’ll mostlikely be cleansed immediately. Furthermore, using spiders locks you in using bunkertype builds. You can’t go straight out damage. That is one of many flaws. We can’t make straight damage setups and be as effective as other classes. Another flaw is that we have to trait for every aspect of our build to be effective. Try to protect your team in a dungeon with untraited axe 5. You not gonna succeed until you’ve told them to stack behind you.
We have also been discussing this internally and agree that it is awkward to be forced to take a trait in order to receive the active effects of signets. Obviously some balance work would need to be done on the signets as well as redesigning the trait. Definitely a good idea and something we are thinking about. =)
I don’t know if I should like this or not. As Chrispy has already pointed out in this thread, the signets are actually pretty strong. They probably have to be toned down and I really don’t think a nerf shouldn’t be the outcome of this thread.
I can’t see them implementing something like that. Imagine all the meleers whinning… and for a reason. But I can imagine to have the kiting support on the short ragne shortbow, plus the range and spike damage skills (with some stuns, knockbacks, or condis thrown in) on the longbow. So you use a longbow at a distance and finish with a shortbow whatever lives long enough to get close to you. And this is the very moment when you start running (using roots and slows as you go) as well.
What remains to be solved is how to make longbow useful in dungeons and stacking. I’m affraid that unless somebody comes with some smart idea, lb will remain useful for soloing only.
I’m ok with the LB beeing not “the optimal” weapon for dungeons if it would excel in any other point in the game. I do like Yoh’s idea, you could also revert the range on shortbow. However the arrow speed would be still a mess. Also I don’t think you should run faster while channeling but slower. You shouldn’t be rooted, though.
I had more fun playing WoW, because at least there you had a good chance at high level drops from bosses.
~snip~
Many thing doesn’t hold true in your post, especially this one.
If that is true, then I don’t see why running the dungeons here in GW2 to get badges so that you can purchase the gears you want is not better than running raids in hopes for a high level drops.
It seems that the problem here is your preference and not the game itself.
The true part about his post is, that you have to grind through dungeons until you get the reward you wanted. I would like to see longer content with higher rewards.
That would help lowering the grind experience.
I have to say there are few things in GW2 you can do, they’re fun but since you have to grind those few things, like dungeons, championfarming, Worldboss-farming or resourcefarming all day long, they become very grindy. I would love to go out to maps like Timberline falls and farm eventchains. But until I don’t get a proper reward which can compete with dungeonrewards, I wont.
The most funny moments happend in LA anyways. Mystery tonics where involved…
That’s not remotely true. There is not a single class that can completely ignore their class mechanic and still do their best. There are ways to shift them to more of a passive than an active role, just as you don’t have to trait into Beastmaster or slot pet-based utilities, but with any class if you don’t use your class mechanics at all then you’re leaving a ton of DPS on the table.
No other class get its damage cut to 2/3 just to make its mechanic work.
I would happily accept the drawback of noone tanking for me or no skills to use if I just get my missing damage back.
Could you please stop to post walls of text, I don’t want to read all that.
I usually skip your posts because of that. Keeping in mind that the Ranger CDI starts soon, you should work on compressing your posts to keep them clear.
Oh gosh please. I wish there was a way to filter out the least skilled players from posting on this specific forum section.
You’re basically saying that a 180ish seconds cooldown ELITE skill shouldn’t kill you if you have 2 people currently attacking you? I don’t even play mesmer and I infact hate them, but that’s just nonsense. Not to mention that most good mesmers run cloak on pvp.
No I’m not “basically” saying that. I AM saying that a skill that leaves you 100% defenceless for a number of seconds is overpowered (see the suggestions I made). I don’t think you know what “good” mesmers run considering you don’t play mesmer? Please refrain from trying to start an argument on here with me, I don’t have time to argue with the ignorance of people who can’t give a reasonable response.
If you really came here to trash talk, and think I am a “least skilled player” I would be happy to duel you in pvp, my username is Jelzouki.
This skill is suited for PvP. It’s useless in PvE, it even makes the most mobs stronger. If you ban this skill from PvP it will become useless. Deal with it. -1
No other class in GW2 is capable of combining top survivability, top CC, top damge and top buff/debuff capabilities all in one build. I wont say the damge the warrior deals is OP, I wont say the survivability is OP, I wont even say the CC’s or the buffs are OP. I just say that the combination of all those aspects are OP. You can have your damage. But don’t claim to be tanky and specced with a hell lot of CC’s at the same time. And that’s the problem with the warrior right now.
After reading most of your posts I have to say that I don’t like them that much.
I’m convinced that the devs hat a very clear concept for all the classes. While some turned out over- or underpowered, I think their vision of class balance is good as it is.
However you try to flip the whole gameplay around, creating a completely new balance.
This might happen in another game but I hope not in GW2.
Now now, MQM, let’s let the Rangers have their time. Eles are next, and then it’s us necros.
I wouldn’t hold your breath. If just a quarter of the suggestions made in this thread are taken into consideration, we would have to wait a long time to see some core-mechanics to be improved.
Just noticed one extra info, not sure if its possible that im wrong but i left already a ticket with it and will share it here in case it is happening also with you guys, im in the server SFR, have been all tournament and havent changed, on EotM im normally on the green team which either has the name of my server or Overgrowth, just now i logged on there to level an alt and it put me on Frostreach and sayed that is my homeserver as shown on the ss bellow.
You guys have this problem? http://i.imgur.com/qUPb8ef.jpg
1. Wrong thread.
2. No bug. Your homeworld is blue, so you’re blue in EotM.
Then you picked the wrong class. The Warrior and Thief are the Archers, the Ranger is a pet class that can use a bow, really more Druid than Archer. Which other class you pick depends on what else you want to do, but either class is great and leveling to 80 in the current environment is fairly easy. Good luck.
You have given the answer to your question in your own statement. Ranger is the only class who can both use longbow and shortbow. And yes, I’m already running both Kudzu and The Dreamer. Ranger is one of the classes who reach 1500 range. I don’t agree with any other point you mentioned. Thief as archer? LoL yes, thief is the is the first class which comes in my mind if I’m thinking about archers… not. Or yeah, reroll a warrior… no. Gosh I hate those guys. “If u want to play archer, play warrior” is one of the most stupid things I’ve heard in this forum.
Rangers meant to be the archers of GW2, yet they get hindered by their pet.
If you actually did your research you’d realize that that rangers are in a good place at the moment. Top tier in PvE dungeons and sPvP tournaments and also good roamers in WvW.
So rangers are top tier dungeon runners?
I want to see how you run dungeons because what i’ve experienced so far, rangers are mostly the worst dungeonrunners.
Every class has a reason to be chosen in a dungeonrun but I see no point where a ranger is better than other classes.
Build and Video or it didn’t happen.
Is it me or does the OP message sound like "I don’t like being a special snowflake, I want to be an unrecognized cog in the machine! "
That’s the undertone I’m picking up. Not that it’s necessarily bad, but in a video game where the story is interactive with the player I feel it is.
When I want a story that doesn’t give me credit I’ll watch a show, a movie, or read a story. I’m not taking part in those stories so I shouldn’t get any credit.
Yes, you are a special snowflake (clapclap). But so am I, and every other player in this game. So you are just one of many “special snowflakes”. In this terms, it would be better if we were some guy in the backline rather than beeing the “hero”. The story wouldn’t be that flawed. It’s like “Hey, I’ve stombed scarlet!”, “Hey, I stombet her too”, “You know what, Player XY stombet her too! Man I fell so special right now.”
It would be nice if the initial post in the ranger CDI could sum up the thoughts the devs had when they designed the ranger so we can base our suggestions on those thoughts.
Personally I don’t want to change the overall classdesign but improve those bits who aren’t performing that well right now.
Anyhow, it would be extreme helpfull if you, the devs, could outline the efforts you are about to do to fix the pets. There are a lot of suggestions from simply removing the pet up to switching the control of the pet to the client side, which would be a lot of coding to be done.
Thank you for the summary post, however, I did not see anything in there pertaining to WvWvW. We still have the problem of them dieing way to fast in zerg vs zerg. And we also have the large issue of us loosing 30% of our damage when defending or taking a keep/fort because pet’s will not scale up or down the walls. This includes the birds which will not fly up or down the wall to attack the targets. The only way I can see to combat this would be to have pets like all over class mechanics, an addition to our damage, not taking away from our damage. For instance, warriors get to do 100% of their damage and if they have full adrenaline they do an extra 15% damage. Ranger should be set up the same way with pets. Ranger’s should have 100% control of their damage and the pet, while alive, should be able to deal an extra 15% damage. If the pet is dead then it deals no extra damage like warriors with no adrenaline will deal no extra damage. We will still have the problem of the pets not being able to hit a moving target but at least the ranger will no longer have this handicap on them.
Stealth
If you use a weaponskill while stealthed, you will become visible.
Revealed
If the skill that broke your stealth deals damage to an opponent, you will gain the effect Revealed.
The Ranger is designed to have a pet. If the pet was taken away or didn’t do damage, then it wouldn’t be a Ranger anymore. Does that make sense?
Why do pets have to deal damage at all for the Ranger to be considered a Ranger?
Would the Nature Loving Ranger really not be considered a Ranger if for example, you introduced new pets like :: (examples Op slightly to show Utility)
Some more suggestions:
Eagle F2: Marks an enemy – The enemy can’t stealth for the duration and all arrows shot at the marked enemy will hit (if not obscured or out of range).
Raven F2: Cripples an enemy for 3/4 seconds every 1/2 second for the duration of the skill.
Krytan Drakehound: Passive: Tracker – The drakehound can attack and use abilities on stealthed targets without breaking their stealth.
F2: Reveals all enemies in a small cone around the drakehound.
Bear AA: Knocks the target down
Spider AA: Removes 1 stack from stackable boons or removes 3 seconds of the duration of non-stacking boons.
Do you autokick every profession what has access to knockback?
If those other professions had the same % of aweful skill spammers I would but that isn’t the case. Out of all the pug groups that I have run with, LB rangers are the worst for spamming all their CD, I don’t waste time trying to educate them anymore.
When your only PvE reliable skill on most popular weapons like Sword, Longbow or Shortbow is autoattack under 1, you understand that player behind Ranger may want to be more… Active? And press some other button. Sadly, it’s no-no, because it breaks stacking.
While he may be a bit overbearing, his point is right:
The knockback will just comes in handy if you’re solo and you don’t intent to switch weapons soon. Since PvE, or dungeons atleast, center around teamplay, the skill is just worth de-stacking defiant stacks on champs. It should be a root with a short daze, so you could still get rid of the defiant stacks but not pushing the enemy all over the place.
Hammer stuns are fine as is, without them… There is no reason to even use a hammer on war. A nerf to the damage on the stun is awful too. 2 sec stun nets you roughly 2 AA attacks at that rate with a hammer. And both of the stun/knockdown skills have obvious animations. Learn them, then dodge them. The knock back skill is fine as is.
You’re crying about loosing either damage or CC capabilities will kill the hammer.
Yust look at guardian hammer. Great CC capabilities aswell but rather low damageoutput. Yet there is noone claiming that the hammer is useless.
Face it, you can’t have both. GS, Axe both are great damage weapons. Both just offer soft CC. Mace on the other hand has 3 different forms of CC but low damage. Those weapons are balanced. The hammer is not balanced.
I went back to ranger because even though warrior may be regarded as king of the game? It doesn’t work for me. And it’s why I really don’t want the ranger to turn into “warrior in medium gear”.
The ranger should atleast be able to compete damagewise.
But yeah, I already have 2 warriors; I don’t need a 3rd one.
This is a thread that everyone in the forums knew was going to be BIG…. having one freaking person assigned to answering in this thread was a huge fault of anet AGAIN…
I don’t understand, you have actual developers and class design people and not a SINGLE one can make a post. This thread has been up for what, the entire work week?
You are telling me that this anet dev team is soooooo busy they cant possibly take one hour of their entire work week to post a few things on this CDI?
It’s just flat out disappointing. I’m not even mad anymore though, we all knew where this was heading when anet decided we will remain a pet first class, even though we have absolutely no intentions on fixing the core issues…
There are people in this CDI that are posting great suggestions and taking their time out of the day to make such a committment. Where is the anet side of this committment?
almost 2 years of little to no feedback for this broken class and it still continues..i’m in awe of how little they care.
And please , if i see one more post red saying “just because we don’t post anything doesn’t mean we didn’t read it”…. umm it means you completely ignored it (see, past 1.5 years of feedback for rangers, this thread, etc)
This playerbase is doing soo much to try and help fix the myriad of problems yet anet, in my point of view, devs are just sitting their twiddling there thumbs (i’m making this on the fact there is been no feedback at all from a dev).
I’m sure Allie is doing all she can, I am by no means angry at her, just the people behind the steel curtain
I literally can visualize Allie sitting in a room with the devs trying to sum up this whole thread. It’s ridiculous.
You’ve been around here for a while and are a steadfast, reliable poster on the ranger forums, I thought you would have known that. I wish I remember exactly when that quote came out so I can link it but it was a while ago.
Thanks for the kind words but I switched from the german forum onto the english forum just 3 months ago. So I’m not familiar with any dev posts earlier than that.
Was this because of just the profession’s flavor text? Or because of some other game’s idea of what a ‘Ranger’ is? Please don’t say it was because Ranger has the ‘range’ as the first five letters.
Maybe because I’ve always wanted to play an Archer in MMOs and maybe because I’ve created the ranger 2 day after I bought the game?
I didn’t know what the classes where about but the ranger looked like an archer to me.
So yeah, because of the text. I still want to play an archer and still I get hindered.
Seriously, just open the ranger or profession balance subforum and you will soon notice that rangers are far (and I mean really far) from beeing OP in PvE or WvW.
Well ANet has said, that you can play your class the way you want. The only class who is matching this statement is the warrior. However in my estimation, if you would raise all classes to the level of the warrior, all classes would become some sort of powerhouse, which would turn PvP into onehit kill battles, which obviously wouldn’t be funny. It would be way easier to tone the warrior down a bit instead of buffing all other classes.
An RP flag (that would be visible to others, and also determine which megaserver you end up on) would be great.
This flag could be added to the already existing statuses “Online”, “Away” and “Invisible”. Simply a new status “RP mode”.
And a RP chat, which will hold all emotes and messages if you’re in “RP mode”.
It should function like the normal /say chat and emote messages, just with the difference that you can either hide this chat or any other chat.
If done so, they could also add a new report option, “violating chatrules”, if someone uses the RP chat to insult RPlers. He would be punished with not being able to use the RP chat anymore.
pet qq here…pet qq there…qq people from other discussions everywhere.
any other themes then our pets? its about the ranger in general and not just the pet
If you want other things to be discussed, bring them on the table. We had a discussion about the longbow just recently.
Fact is, that the pet needs the most help and that the devs are currently unwilling to do some major overhauls.
