Guild Wars 2

Rising Dusk? You can’t envision a massive battle with a large contingent of Pact npc’s helping you struggle to the point where you can finally reach and trigger the giant crossbow that pierces the dragons armor fatally?, or the plunger that Pact forces hooked up to the device that triggers an explosion that destroys the entire island and the dragon with it, or… do I need to go on? There are many ways it could have been done to everyones enjoyment, without forced grouping.

The Source of Orr was my end!
Still have 80 Arah open on all my chars.

Does this mean the dungeon is now soloable?

If so then thank god.

You are not understanding the issue. Yes everyone can find a group, sooner or later. The issue is that in a PERSONAL story line, no group should EVER be required. There is no sense of personal achievement in a forced group.

Let’s just dissect your arguments.

Conclusion: A game should contain challenge
Premises:
a) Guild Wars 2 is a game
b) a game is supposed to provide fun
c) challenge is the only way to provide fun
Argument:
Since GW 2 is a game and a game is supposed to provide fun then Guild Wars 2 is supposed to provide fun. Because Guild Wars 2 is supposed to provide fun and challenge is the only way to provide fun then Guild Wars 2 needs to be challenging/provide challenge.

This argument however is easily shown to be false by demonstrating that there are ways to provide fun that are entirely passive in nature such as watching a comedy show on the telly. It necessarily follows that if there are ways to have fun other than being challenged then being challenging is only a sufficient but not necessary condition for Guild Wars to provide fun. Since it could also provide fun by becoming a comedy show then Guild Wars 2 does not need to be challenging.

Life also contains permadeath, but I don’t think anyone, including you, wants Guild Wars 2 to feature perma death. So if we don’t want to replicate one aspect of real life then it is also possible we don’t want to replicate other aspects of real life. We certainly don’t want to replicate the fact that there is no magic in the real world nor that injuries cannot magically heal completely within 10 especially when injuries in the real world when left untreated or even when treated can lead to death. We also don’t want to replicate that having your unarmored arm get struck squarely with a greatsword would cut your arm clean off. Video games are a form of escape, they are not real life simulators (though some video games try to be but cannot ever actually be a true reali life simulator because not only is real life incapable of being simulated but simulating it in its entirety would be undesireable).

Obviously of course every game needs to replicate real life to a certain extent in order to function and be believeable, we could hardly play GW 2 if the devs hadn’t chosen to replicate the effects of gravity.

Quite franky, I really don’t like games that grab you and refuse to let go. (which they can do by requiring an onerous amount of grinding).

Here is my favorite quote from Ghost in the Shell: Standalone complex which addresses a problem of MMOs:

Kanazuki: What do you think [of the movie]?

Major: I have to admit, for a movie it wasn’t bad- but diversionary entertainment is transitory, it just comes and goes at the viewers whim. It’s the way it should be, but a film with no beginning or end that hooks an audience and won’t let go of them is harmful no matter how wonderful you may have believed it was.

Kanazuki: Ohh, you’re a tough critic. Are you saying that we members of the audience have a reality to which we should return?

Major: Yes I am.

Kanazuki: For some who sit and watch the film, misery will be waiting for them the instant they go back to reality. You’re willing to accept responsibility for depriving these people of their dreams?

Major: No, I’m not. But dreams are meaningful [only] when you work toward them in the real world. If you merely live within the dreams of other people it’s no different from being dead.

Kanazuki: You’re a realist.

Major: If a romantic escapes from reality, then yes.

Kanazuki: A strong girl you are. If the reality you believe in ever comes about, you give me a call. When it happens, that’s the time we’ll leave this theatre.

I’ve completed my personal story on two characters now and frankly the immersion aspect is completely ruined by having to team up with a bunch of randoms (no offence) or even guildies who just want to burn through and ‘git ’er done’.

I enjoyed the personal story but seeing some other player being called ‘Commander’ in the cutscenes made a mockery of the whole thing.

Please change this Arenanet and give us a bunch of hardy npcs as per the other story quests, so we can solo this final dungeon and truly savour the spoils of victory.

People have been telling ANet this since day one. They’re not going to change anything.

Honestly, the chief failure here is in the scripting of the “personal story”, creating an expectation that is left unfulfilled. The showdown with Zhaitan should be an optional end, not the primary one.

Written properly, I think players would have been satisfied with knowing they were responsible for taking the fight back to the dragon, pounding on his door and leaving it there on whether they personally finished the job or not. Perhaps summoning other great commanders to their aid? (In other words, four other players to complete Arah?)

I get the feeling this conclusion was implied in the Source of Orr, but wasn’t given a dramatic enough finale/reward to feel like a passable ending to the personal story. There is no sense of accomplishment, and that’s a big problem. It’s fine if you want to have defeating Zhaitan be a special and perhaps difficult achievement, but you have to also leave players who are unable to make that step feeling they accomplished something special by seeing the story through to the end. No one likes seeing a project unfinished.

As it stands, I agree that forcing both a raid to open Arah and then four additional players to complete your “personal story” is unacceptable. It will simply lead to more disillusionment from casual players and soloists who do not have the assumed resources of large guilds and multiple friends to accomplish a goal left in the right corner of all of their screens.

So I’m doing the Infinite Ball story mission “Any Sufficiently Advanced Science” and I literally burst out laughing as I saw the protestors.

To anyone who doesn’t get the reference, it’s poking fun at how people were protesting the Large Hadron Collider in real life because they thought it would create a black hole.

I really want to thank ANET for the hilarious reference. This made my day!

Sacrificing the mentor in all three cases was a cheap way of getting rid of them..

Tybalts sacrifice was the best though. (also he was the worst one to lose as I think he is the best of the three mentors. Forgal was way too stiff and boring).

I wish it was Mira carrying a lifeless Trahearne.

It’s the real Trahearne.

Well as soon as I’m done with the racial alliance portion of my personal storyline I’m through with it, my character is a Centurion of the Iron Legion and fully vetted Crusader of the Vigil, I refuse to follow the braying dictations of an bafoon like that Sylvari abomination that is afflicted upon us. I am Charr, and I don’t salute salads.

Jeffrey Vaughn.1793:

The Durmand Priory likes to raid tombs

ahem

The Durmand Priory enjoys engaging in archaeological expeditions to further the understanding of the past, thank you very much. :P

Those that remember Ring of Fire Island missions before Factions (or if they had no other content to access skills/heroes) and long before they updated henchmen, those were tough missions so people grouped for them. However, you at least had the option to grab your simpleton crew of AI and enjoy your story.

While I echo the dissent over forced grouping, I think there’s a bigger point to be made. The final mission in the personal story is actually lopped off at the end and literally stitched together with a separate storyline: Destiny’s Edge and their reuniting. That is the real tragedy here. I have not done every dungeon, I don’t think many people ever did by the end of their story yet the player is put at the conclusion and redemption of DE likely without ever experiencing that story arc.

It was a mistake to link the two; it cheapened them both. Well as I go back and start working on dungeons, I guess I know how it ends, because I just read the last chapter!

Pvp as someone said earlier is the worst thing you can put in a mmo and then add loss of items and money you worked for…those games dont work, people have no desire to risk items they won in a game.

In fact only people I ever see ask for this Crap are griefers who never actually go up against people their own level and gank newwbies and lowbies. I have to come to the conculsion that world pvpers and those that request ffa servers are the worst form of human on the planet and are despicibale gamers

Well, I’ve played my share of asian MMOs with free PvP systems.

And evrytime it all comes to this:
1) Two huge guilds fight zergwars with eachother over one spot over and over. (it would be Cursed Shore in GW2, I suppose)

2) A number of smaller guilds, who will have several squads of people scatteres around popular levelling areas to hunt any lonely noob. Spamming “lol, pwned, we’re da best pvp guilde here!1”

3) A lot of lonely noobs diyng from aforementioned gank-squads, not having any fun, growing bitter, forced to join some guild and hunt another noobs with spite.

There are really few people who actually geniunely enjoy such a system. Not gonna happen.

Pk is one of the worst things you can have in an mmo.And it again would seperate alot of players,horrible idea.

I just get a kick out of all the players who come to a new game, and complain that it is not like the game they left and want it changed so it’s like thier old game.
Makes absolutly no sense at all as it seems all they want is ever game to be a clone of every other game with nothing new or original. I think it must be something to do with not being able to adjust to a new game, so they just want the game to adapt to them instead.

How come everyone feels the need to post there gaming history ?

W v W v W is a FFA server in a kinda way

LordNat.4963:

They removed Engineers from the game in all meaningful ways… There is not a single aspect of the game where the class is even useful anymore.

So glad I just started playing an engineer up to 25.. I think I’ll shelve it for now and work on a guardian maybe.

Tyr.1965:

Rustypipes.6238:

Lex Talionis.5396:

Malleus Maleficarum.2603:

Anet absolutely crushed this patch. they addressed almost everything i can think of that had been wrong with some of the professions i use, and the problems i’ve heard on the forums.

Necromancer pets.

Yeah, this one. Necros did get some love but not where it mattered most, our pets.

We have pets? Oh that’s right; we do. See, it’s been so long since I’ve had them on my bars that I forgot they even exist…. not to sound snarky lol

Fwiw, even when/if they fix them, I doubt I’ll go back to using them much.

yeah, loved the 30% damage reduction for grenade kits. That’s just what engineers needed and were asking for. GG Anet!

Ya this blows.
It’s Friday.
It’s raining.
I don’t feel like going out.
I want to play Guild Wars 2.
Guess I’ll go exercise.
And then go to the buffet and get some Dolyak meat.

For me, the most hilarious moment after knowing a little about Destiny’s Edge is when you first properly go to Lion’s Arch, and as you go up the stairs, you see a bunch of kids of all races playing with each showing, showing how racially diverse Lion’s Arch is.

Then you stop to listen to the kids and realise they’re roleplaying as Destiny’s Edge, and picking roles… and the charr kid goes “I’m Logan, and I’m gonna run away.”

Total spit-out-drink moment there. XD

Also, after their argument and they all walk away in different directions… HEY EIR! YOU FORGOT YOUR DOG! Maybe it’s a bug or something, but Garm just stays there. XD

I agree, I l LOVED the Order of the Whispers story, but felt like it went downhill afterwards.

Tybalt was such a great sidekick for your character. He was funny, earnest, and you really felt for him. I would have loved to have him with me all throughout the story. Whoever wrote Tybalt needs to be in charge of the entire writing team lol.

But yeah, Trahearne…he’s just dull. Whereas with Tybalt, I could totally identify with this goofy guy that was almost considered a joke, yet always felt a burning desire to prove himself. He was such a human character…despite not being human lol.

Trahearne though…he seems like he only exists for the plot. Everything he does is plot driven. I have to get this sword. I have to form the pact, I have to save Orr. I really don’t know what his character is…it’s pretty one-dimensional. The only character development he has is a bit of self-doubt before accepting his destiny, but that was short-lived, and honestly felt a bit cliche (every hero has their moment of self doubt).

+1 / agree

Well now I’m just shattered, here I am Lvl 80 feeling confident and I have thoroughly enjoyed GW2 to date, like the others I have enjoyed my personal story and I was looking forward to completing it.

I somehow breezed through from 70 – 80 (well dragged to a couple of the dragon fights + crafting saw to that), and I was really looking forward to putting a ‘tick’ next to the invisible “My Personal Story complete”. However, I then heard in chat what this thread is discussing; you HAVE to group to finish it.

What a let down – I haven’t had much luck grouping to date and my experiences have been the negative that is often talked about, call it karma, or bad luck, whatever (e.g. LTP noob, gawd ur an 80???, people leaving, etc, etc). My timezone is heavily influenced by non-english (not a problem just makes communications extremely difficult at times), and guilds that I’ve run with are in a TZ that is 3 hours ahead, so when I get on their going to bed.

I’ve tried those other MMO’s and one thing that always cheesed me was the ‘forced grouping’ to complete a narrative that moved you on. some of these stories are trite and some are downright entertaining (ever check out the option of “I always wanted to be in the Circus”?), but as has been repeated numerous times “personal”.

I guess it’s just one more thing to leave in the ‘incomplete’ basket.