Guild Wars 2

Are there any plans to make gossamer more useful? The value is at 1-1.5s per bolt (compared to 10s per silk bolt) already since there is barely any sink for it. Everytime I salvage something and get gossamer instead of I have to sigh instead being happy although its a higher tier material. At the very least let us demote gossamer to silk at the ratio of 1 gossamer = 3 silk or something.

More importantly, they should increase the supply of silk or decrease its need. At least they should make bolt of silk cost only two scraps again.

If they would let us demote gossamer they would fix 2 problems: Too much gossamer and too few silk in one go. Plus also sink skillpoints and other stuff in the mystic forge recipe.

Or they could introduce some prestige armors which need 250 gossamer bolts per part. That would be 1500 Gossamer Bolts per set which would make the price stabilize at a fair point again.

Do you really expect someone from Anet to come here and say:
Wow, thats a great idea, we will implement this some time in the future?

Wanze.8410:

Do you really expect someone from Anet to come here and say:
Wow, thats a great idea, we will implement this some time in the future?

That’ll be the day. This is the only sub-forum that gets less dev feedback than WvW.

Herr der Friedhoefe.2490:

Wanze.8410:

Do you really expect someone from Anet to come here and say:
Wow, thats a great idea, we will implement this some time in the future?

That’ll be the day. This is the only sub-forum that gets less dev feedback than WvW.

You must have never visited the dungeon sub-forum.

There is a dungeon sub-forum? Wow, who knew?

If you could demote crafting items that would effect the entire crafting market. It would increase the supply of mid tier crafting mats and increase the demand of higher tier crafting mats. Cloth and leather would be effected the most since they only come from loot bags or salvage. Love the prestige armor idea. It something that could increase the demand of the higher tier crafting mats that are very abundant(Gossamer and thick leather).

Wanze.8410:

Do you really expect someone from Anet to come here and say:
Wow, thats a great idea, we will implement this some time in the future?

Yes, considering they also announced other market changing updates like ascended armors weeks before, I wouldnt see any issue with this. Better than changing something in a sneaky way and hit people unprepared.

Malediktus.9250:

Wanze.8410:

Do you really expect someone from Anet to come here and say:
Wow, thats a great idea, we will implement this some time in the future?

Yes, considering they also announced other market changing updates like ascended armors weeks before, I wouldnt see any issue with this. Better than changing something in a sneaky way and hit people unprepared.

That was announced in blog posts, not as an answer to a forum post.

Herr der Friedhoefe.2490:

Wanze.8410:

Do you really expect someone from Anet to come here and say:
Wow, thats a great idea, we will implement this some time in the future?

That’ll be the day. This is the only sub-forum that gets less dev feedback than WvW.

Praise the Day!
The first 5 pages of the BLTC forum got 17 topics with a red tag, the first 5 pages of the General Discussions Forum have 12 topics with a red tag.

Gossamer bolts now below 1s (70c buy orders), this doesnt feel right. Anet do something please.
Silk is worth over 8 times more :/

Malediktus.9250:

Gossamer bolts now below 1s (70c buy orders), this doesnt feel right. Anet do something please.
Silk is worth over 8 times more :/

As has been stated numerous times in this very sub-forum, Anet doesn’t do anything with the prices on the TP. The prices on the TP are set solely by players. Of course Anet sets the drop rate, and that argument for prices of mats has been fully exhausted. In the end the players control the price.

The main problem with Gosamer, as stated before, there are very little sinks for it. Other then getting crafting to 500, there really is no use for it. If anet were to do something, they would need to increase the use for it. Also, many people forget, that silk, before ascended, was in the same place as gossamer. Stuff was super abundant, and super cheap on the TP, almost not worth buying. Then along came ascended, and bolts of damask, and the 3 scraps per bolt for silk. This wasn’t an accident, the repercussions of such a move were carefully considered, and the long term effects were weighed long before such an implementation happened. It was by design, and it has achieved its purpose.

Part of the problem with silk, and most mats, is that no one wants to farm it. It’s easier and faster to run a few dungeons and buy it off the TP, but that only creates more demand, and thus a higher TP price. You want a lower price on the TP? Don’t buy it, do the work and farm it.

I know all that. I am asking Anet to add new sinks for cheap materials such as gossamer. Or let us demote them to lower tier mats.
It shouldnt feel like a punishment when you salvage something and you get a more rare, higher tier material.

pdavis.8031:

Malediktus.9250:

Gossamer bolts now below 1s (70c buy orders), this doesnt feel right. Anet do something please.
Silk is worth over 8 times more :/

As has been stated numerous times in this very sub-forum, Anet doesn’t do anything with the prices on the TP. The prices on the TP are set solely by players. Of course Anet sets the drop rate, and that argument for prices of mats has been fully exhausted. In the end the players control the price.

The main problem with Gosamer, as stated before, there are very little sinks for it. Other then getting crafting to 500, there really is no use for it. If anet were to do something, they would need to increase the use for it. Also, many people forget, that silk, before ascended, was in the same place as gossamer. Stuff was super abundant, and super cheap on the TP, almost not worth buying. Then along came ascended, and bolts of damask, and the 3 scraps per bolt for silk. This wasn’t an accident, the repercussions of such a move were carefully considered, and the long term effects were weighed long before such an implementation happened. It was by design, and it has achieved its purpose.

Part of the problem with silk, and most mats, is that no one wants to farm it. It’s easier and faster to run a few dungeons and buy it off the TP, but that only creates more demand, and thus a higher TP price. You want a lower price on the TP? Don’t buy it, do the work and farm it.

Part of the thing that many people overlook is that ANET has a hand in TP prices because they set demand, via sinks.

Wanze.8410:

Herr der Friedhoefe.2490:

Wanze.8410:

Do you really expect someone from Anet to come here and say:
Wow, thats a great idea, we will implement this some time in the future?

That’ll be the day. This is the only sub-forum that gets less dev feedback than WvW.

Praise the Day!
The first 5 pages of the BLTC forum got 17 topics with a red tag, the first 5 pages of the General Discussions Forum have 12 topics with a red tag.

I looked at the thread at the bottom of the 5th page.
BLTC: about a month old
GD: 3 days old

In other words, threads get buried around 10 times as quickly in GD as in this forum. That would suggest GD has approximately 7 times as much dev feedback to keep the thread ratio you listed, if seeing how many threads have red tags is even an accurate measure.

Haaretram.6214:

Wanze.8410:

Herr der Friedhoefe.2490:

Wanze.8410:

Do you really expect someone from Anet to come here and say:
Wow, thats a great idea, we will implement this some time in the future?

That’ll be the day. This is the only sub-forum that gets less dev feedback than WvW.

Praise the Day!
The first 5 pages of the BLTC forum got 17 topics with a red tag, the first 5 pages of the General Discussions Forum have 12 topics with a red tag.

I looked at the thread at the bottom of the 5th page.
BLTC: about a month old
GD: 3 days old

In other words, threads get buried around 10 times as quickly in GD as in this forum. That would suggest GD has approximately 7 times as much dev feedback to keep the thread ratio you listed, if seeing how many threads have red tags is even an accurate measure.

Well, feel free to apply any other measures. A good one would be devpost/playerpost at any give timeframe but its hard for us to calculate.

Anyways, there is a sticky on top of this subforum, where you can post questions about the economy. IF your question wasnt already answered in the past and the answer doesnt fall under the NDA, John Smith most likely will answer it within a couple of days.
I think thats plenty of Dev attention.

I guess Herr der Friedhöfe also meant the crafting subforum (which actually does not get much dev attention) instead of the bltc forum.

Guhracie.3419

Part of the thing that many people overlook is that ANET has a hand in TP prices because they set demand, via sinks.

Yes, it’s true that Anet sets the demand, however the TP prices are set strictly by the player, regardless of the demand.

For example, on the TP there is a masterwork (green) level 30 ring that is selling for 26g 19s 95c. (http://www.gw2spidy.com/search/ring?sort_min_sale_unit_price=desc&rarity_filter=3&min_level=&max_level=). There is a very limited supply, and not a huge demand for such an item. Of course one could argue that such a price for such an item is due to the drop rate of such an item, but what it all comes down to is what people are willing to pay, and willing to sell for any given item.

Prices for silk on the TP are going up, because people are willing to pay that much for it. If I were to list a bolt for 20s, there stands a chance that someone at somepoint would be willing to pay that much for it. So while Anet sets the demand (not really the demand, but the sinks) the players themselves set the price. Anet doesn’t have a hand in that at all.

Malediktus.9250:

Gossamer bolts now below 1s (70c buy orders), this doesnt feel right. Anet do something please.
Silk is worth over 8 times more :/

Obviously, this is the time to buy and finish leveling tailoring. To the TP!

Gilosean.3805:

Malediktus.9250:

Gossamer bolts now below 1s (70c buy orders), this doesnt feel right. Anet do something please.
Silk is worth over 8 times more :/

Obviously, this is the time to buy and finish leveling tailoring. To the TP!

No need. I maxed all crafting professions long ago. And the amount of gossamer you need to level everything to max is abysmal.

Its only because the supply demand is so close on silk vs gossamer, the supply of gossamer is over 1.7mill with only 183k demand, but the supply on silk is 619k and demand is 511k, this is why the price is higher, also I believe silk is needed for all forms of ascended armor crafting, thus keeping its demand higher,

I find it rather easy to come across silk scraps, from just salvaging all the junk armor I get drop in game.

Ok I Did It.2854:

Its only because the supply demand is so close on silk vs gossamer, the supply of gossamer is over 1.7mill with only 183k demand, but the supply on silk is 619k and demand is 511k, this is why the price is higher, also I believe silk is needed for all forms of ascended armor crafting, thus keeping its demand higher,

I find it rather easy to come across silk scraps, from just salvaging all the junk armor I get drop in game.

The ratio of listed items/buy orders isnt a great indication of actual supply/demand.

Okay I’ll chip in here:
Gossamer commonly refers to: from wiki….

Fine spider silk used by spiderlings for ballooning or kiting
Gossamer (fabric), very light, sheer, gauze-like fabric

So in theory this should be more expensive than silk.
The problem is here people farm lvl 80 zones and get this stuff (and silk)..

There is no Gossamer sink (yet) – it only takes a tiny upset in the market for things to change demand quickly as the plate base reacts.

I won’t say any more or I’ll be hinting too much at MMO economics – good luck all investors out there !

TPMN.1483:

Okay I’ll chip in here:
Gossamer commonly refers to: from wiki….

Fine spider silk used by spiderlings for ballooning or kiting
Gossamer (fabric), very light, sheer, gauze-like fabric

So in theory this should be more expensive than silk.
The problem is here people farm lvl 80 zones and get this stuff (and silk)..

There is no Gossamer sink (yet) – it only takes a tiny upset in the market for things to change demand quickly as the plate base reacts.

I won’t say any more or I’ll be hinting too much at MMO economics – good luck all investors out there !

Yeah, I think you and I are thinking the same way. I’m expecting leather to get fixed at some point here too. Possibly Wintersday recipes, but more likely next LS.

T6 should always cost more than T5,best way to ensure that is if you can transmute T6 items to 2x or 3x T5 mats.

Killface.1896:

T6 should always cost more than T5,best way to ensure that is if you can transmute T6 items to 2x or 3x T5 mats.

Any particular reason why you think that higher tier mats should have a higher price?

In my opinion, high value, lower tier mats are a great way to combat wealth disparity between old and new players.
This of course doesnt apply to gossamer/silk as they are both farmed from the same levels but for t1-4 mats.
If veteran players are willing to pay 10 silver per bolt of wool, linen or a soft wood plank for their end game crafting, I think its a great way of transferring wealth from old to new players. It also gives incentive to visit lower level zones for farming, if the average prices for those tiers or higher than t5/6, which helps to spread the population.

I’ll agree with the last thing Wanze said, that it helps spread out veteran players. I do not agree with it being a good thing for new players though. I remember being a new player and feeling taxed for crafting mats. I don’t think we should relegate crafting to end game. New players should be able to reasonably craft as well. That as we all know means they will have to buy lower end crafting mats in addition to what they gather.

My reason why T6 should be more than T5 is it have lot lower drop rate and you should not be unhappy when you salvage and get T6

Killface.1896:

My reason why T6 should be more than T5 is it have lot lower drop rate and you should not be unhappy when you salvage and get T6

All over the place people are complaining about crappy loot, bad rewards and abysmal rng.
Now you get a loot table that awards you with the more valuable item 90% of the time and you complain about the 10% being less valuable.

Wanze.8410:

Killface.1896:

My reason why T6 should be more than T5 is it have lot lower drop rate and you should not be unhappy when you salvage and get T6

All over the place people are complaining about crappy loot, bad rewards and abysmal rng.
Now you get a loot table that awards you with the more valuable item 90% of the time and you complain about the 10% being less valuable.

Higher tier and higher rarity crafting mats should always be more valuable. Anything else defies logic. Its just anet fault for not making sure there is the correct amount of sinks for this item. Gossamer will sink to vendor price if nothing is being done in the long run. Ideally I would say each crafting mat tier should be at bare minimum worth 25%, preferably 50% more than the previous tier.

While instinctively I do agree that higher tier/rarity goods should always be more valuable than lower tier ones (speaking purely from a “game logic” view), Wanze also made a really good point about the increased prices for lower tier mats being a great way to shift money from veteran players to newer ones.

Still, in the long term I would like to see downgrade recipes get introduced for all mats. It would ensure that no matter how the supply/demand curve changes, all mats would constantly adjust in equilibrium with each other. (The precise exchange mechanics would need to be calibrated so you couldn’t generate an infinite loop of materials, of course.)

Zaxares.5419:

While instinctively I do agree that higher tier/rarity goods should always be more valuable than lower tier ones (speaking purely from a “game logic” view), Wanze also made a really good point about the increased prices for lower tier mats being a great way to shift money from veteran players to newer ones.

Still, in the long term I would like to see downgrade recipes get introduced for all mats. It would ensure that no matter how the supply/demand curve changes, all mats would constantly adjust in equilibrium with each other. (The precise exchange mechanics would need to be calibrated so you couldn’t generate an infinite loop of materials, of course.)

I simply dont see the problem with the status quo. Of course common sense would dictate that higher tier mats should be the more expensive. But that also requires the higher tier mats to be harder to get than lower tier mats, which isnt the case in GW2 (exceptions apply). IT also requires that higher tier mats have more demand than lower tier mats from veteran players, which also isnt the case, at least for gossamer.
RIght now, prices are dictated by supply and demand. If people farm one ressource too much, its value drops. Its perfectly self regulating.

I don’t see the current situation as a “problem” either. Having downgrade recipes is something I think would be good (especially in the later years of GW2, when the population is likely to be primarily veterans with very few new players, resulting in a bigger glut of T5/6 mats), but the situation as it currently stands doesn’t need adjusting right now.

would be nice if we can downgrade gossamer → silk.

Wanze.8410:

Zaxares.5419:

While instinctively I do agree that higher tier/rarity goods should always be more valuable than lower tier ones (speaking purely from a “game logic” view), Wanze also made a really good point about the increased prices for lower tier mats being a great way to shift money from veteran players to newer ones.

Still, in the long term I would like to see downgrade recipes get introduced for all mats. It would ensure that no matter how the supply/demand curve changes, all mats would constantly adjust in equilibrium with each other. (The precise exchange mechanics would need to be calibrated so you couldn’t generate an infinite loop of materials, of course.)

I simply dont see the problem with the status quo. Of course common sense would dictate that higher tier mats should be the more expensive. But that also requires the higher tier mats to be harder to get than lower tier mats, which isnt the case in GW2 (exceptions apply). IT also requires that higher tier mats have more demand than lower tier mats from veteran players, which also isnt the case, at least for gossamer.
RIght now, prices are dictated by supply and demand. If people farm one ressource too much, its value drops. Its perfectly self regulating.

That’s the whole point of this thread though. It’s not perfectly self regulating. Gossamer is not at it’s price because players farm it too much. It’s at that price b/c the sinks for it are too low to match the byproduct supply. Some items have the opposite problem. This game doesn’t allow much self regulation, as much of supplies are byproducts and therefore do not balance in regard to demand.

Essence Snow.3194:

Wanze.8410:

Zaxares.5419:

While instinctively I do agree that higher tier/rarity goods should always be more valuable than lower tier ones (speaking purely from a “game logic” view), Wanze also made a really good point about the increased prices for lower tier mats being a great way to shift money from veteran players to newer ones.

Still, in the long term I would like to see downgrade recipes get introduced for all mats. It would ensure that no matter how the supply/demand curve changes, all mats would constantly adjust in equilibrium with each other. (The precise exchange mechanics would need to be calibrated so you couldn’t generate an infinite loop of materials, of course.)

I simply dont see the problem with the status quo. Of course common sense would dictate that higher tier mats should be the more expensive. But that also requires the higher tier mats to be harder to get than lower tier mats, which isnt the case in GW2 (exceptions apply). IT also requires that higher tier mats have more demand than lower tier mats from veteran players, which also isnt the case, at least for gossamer.
RIght now, prices are dictated by supply and demand. If people farm one ressource too much, its value drops. Its perfectly self regulating.

That’s the whole point of this thread though. It’s not perfectly self regulating. Gossamer is not at it’s price because players farm it too much. It’s at that price b/c the sinks for it are too low to match the byproduct supply. Some items have the opposite problem. This game doesn’t allow much self regulation, as much of supplies are byproducts and therefore do not balance in regard to demand.

That Gossamer is not at a right price might be your opinion. However, the general player base seems to value Gossamer differently.

I didn’t say that at all. I said it wasn’t perfectly self regulating. The price is apt for for what it is.

Seeing how the “too much silk” problem got “solved”, i don’t think you really want gossamer fixed.

cafard.8953:

Seeing how the “too much silk” problem got “solved”, i don’t think you really want gossamer fixed.

I actually like how they solved the silk problem. We need the same for t5+6 leather, mithril and gossamer.

Malediktus.9250:

cafard.8953:

Seeing how the “too much silk” problem got “solved”, i don’t think you really want gossamer fixed.

I actually like how they solved the silk problem. We need the same for t5+6 leather, mithril and gossamer.

If they did that, then we’d see an over abundance of complaints about the prices of those items. More cries of “inflation”, and how everything was much better before the change. I feel that while the current market bears silk just fine, I don’t think it would hold up for t5-6 leather, mithril, and gossamer as well. But thats just my opinion.

I miss the 10-20 copper silk scraps :P

People need to post weather or not they stocked a bunch of leather and gossamer before they make such claim.

I know the only reason I hope leather or gossamer price go up is because I stock up a bunch in the bank…. and it is just collecting dust now.

laokoko.7403:

People need to post weather or not they stocked a bunch of leather and gossamer before they make such claim.

I know the only reason I hope leather or gossamer price go up is because I stock up a bunch in the bank…. and it is just collecting dust now.

Of course I have a lot of it on bank. I wont sell anything for less than I feel like it would be worth with appropriate sinks and let speculators fill their guild banks with it and make big bank if a patch comes
I think John Smith is smart enough to check the accounts of people who make these kind of threads without them disclosing their items to the public though. I mean he doesnt hesitate to look up how often someone died when he claimed he never dies

Malediktus.9250:

laokoko.7403:

People need to post weather or not they stocked a bunch of leather and gossamer before they make such claim.

I know the only reason I hope leather or gossamer price go up is because I stock up a bunch in the bank…. and it is just collecting dust now.

Of course I have a lot of it on bank. I wont sell anything for less than I feel like it would be worth with appropriate sinks and let speculators fill their guild banks with it and make big bank if a patch comes
I think John Smith is smart enough to check the accounts of people who make these kind of threads without them disclosing their items to the public though. I mean he doesnt hesitate to look up how often someone died when he claimed he never dies

ya I mean, I find it hard to believe anyone cares about the economy or some kitten what the price should be because they are at a higher tier…

People are probably just complaining that their investment don’t turn out big and is collecting dust in the bank.

laokoko.7403:

Malediktus.9250:

laokoko.7403:

People need to post weather or not they stocked a bunch of leather and gossamer before they make such claim.

I know the only reason I hope leather or gossamer price go up is because I stock up a bunch in the bank…. and it is just collecting dust now.

Of course I have a lot of it on bank. I wont sell anything for less than I feel like it would be worth with appropriate sinks and let speculators fill their guild banks with it and make big bank if a patch comes
I think John Smith is smart enough to check the accounts of people who make these kind of threads without them disclosing their items to the public though. I mean he doesnt hesitate to look up how often someone died when he claimed he never dies

ya I mean, I find it hard to believe anyone cares about the economy or some kitten what the price should be because they are at a higher tier…

People are probably just complaining that their investment don’t turn out big and is collecting dust in the bank.

Few people have the stomach for long-term investments. I like collecting, so a few extra stacks of ingredients sitting around is fine with me.

Leather in particular can only go up from here – it is selling at vendor +1 on the TP. Any logical move ANet makes regarding leather can only raise the price. And since the price is so low, it only has to go up a miniscule amount for the investment to be worth it. It’s the surest bet on the market, just with an indefinite time frame.

laokoko.7403:

Malediktus.9250:

laokoko.7403:

People need to post weather or not they stocked a bunch of leather and gossamer before they make such claim.

I know the only reason I hope leather or gossamer price go up is because I stock up a bunch in the bank…. and it is just collecting dust now.

Of course I have a lot of it on bank. I wont sell anything for less than I feel like it would be worth with appropriate sinks and let speculators fill their guild banks with it and make big bank if a patch comes
I think John Smith is smart enough to check the accounts of people who make these kind of threads without them disclosing their items to the public though. I mean he doesnt hesitate to look up how often someone died when he claimed he never dies

ya I mean, I find it hard to believe anyone cares about the economy or some kitten what the price should be because they are at a higher tier…

People are probably just complaining that their investment don’t turn out big and is collecting dust in the bank.

Fun facts:
- An economy does not exist just for the sake of there being an economy, if you wouldnt be positively or negatively afftected by it, there would be no reason to care about the economy
- a problem like this where a more rare, higher quality resource is worth a fraction of a lower quality resource would never happen (or at least not last long) in real life, because people would invent new uses/recipes/whatever to make better use of said resource, in this virtual economy we depend on Anet to make enough sinks for resources since we cannot add our own inventions to the market
- the last time I bought gossamer, some time before ascended armors were introduced, it costed over 7s per bolt if I remember right

Don’t worry, soon all will change when cooking and jeweler go to 500. I’m sure this will happen right with the new dungeons.

Malediktus.9250:

laokoko.7403:

Malediktus.9250:

laokoko.7403:

People need to post weather or not they stocked a bunch of leather and gossamer before they make such claim.

I know the only reason I hope leather or gossamer price go up is because I stock up a bunch in the bank…. and it is just collecting dust now.

Of course I have a lot of it on bank. I wont sell anything for less than I feel like it would be worth with appropriate sinks and let speculators fill their guild banks with it and make big bank if a patch comes
I think John Smith is smart enough to check the accounts of people who make these kind of threads without them disclosing their items to the public though. I mean he doesnt hesitate to look up how often someone died when he claimed he never dies

ya I mean, I find it hard to believe anyone cares about the economy or some kitten what the price should be because they are at a higher tier…

People are probably just complaining that their investment don’t turn out big and is collecting dust in the bank.

Fun facts:
- An economy does not exist just for the sake of there being an economy, if you wouldnt be positively or negatively afftected by it, there would be no reason to care about the economy
- a problem like this where a more rare, higher quality resource is worth a fraction of a lower quality resource would never happen (or at least not last long) in real life, because people would invent new uses/recipes/whatever to make better use of said resource, in this virtual economy we depend on Anet to make enough sinks for resources since we cannot add our own inventions to the market
- the last time I bought gossamer, some time before ascended armors were introduced, it costed over 7s per bolt if I remember right

If you really care so much you should go to another post called precursor selling for 70 gold and say a precursor should cost more than 70 gold because it is so rare.

No one says higher tier should worth more. And there are many mineral even more rare than diamond. That dont’ mean they are actaully worth the price of diamond.

Supply and demand. That’s how the real world function right? an item with no demand still worth nothing even if it have low supply. It’s up to Anet to decide how their economy should function.

If Anet is making more demand for gossamer it’s their choice. They are the creator of the universe.

Thats because natural diamonds are mostly from a monopolist in real life. If governments would finnaly crush that monopoly you could buy a whole bag of diamonds for 10 USD

As for the precursors, I dont have any and dont intend to buy any at this point. So there is no point in me caring about the precursor economy at this time.

Malediktus.9250:

Thats because natural diamonds are mostly from a monopolist in real life. If governments would finnaly crush that monopoly you could buy a whole bag of diamonds for 10 USD

As for the precursors, I dont have any and dont intend to buy any at this point. So there is no point in me caring about the precursor economy at this time.

yup anyway keep stocking up on those gossamer. Maybe in a few years legendary armor will come out and require a bunch of it and you’ll make a killing.