Guild Wars 2

laokoko.7403:

Amun Ra.6435:

Smooth Penguin.5294:

Amun Ra.6435:

Behellagh.1468:

Prove that morrolan. How is ANet manipulating the TP?

Manipulation might not be the most appropriate word to use, but Anet controls all prices in the game…I say again…all prices in the game.

I would hope you don’t need a detailed explanation on how.

We as players are just left with the scaps to play with and set the prices. Again…we are only setting prices based on the scaps Anet gives us…should Anet not like the price we set they give or take away scaps and thus “Manipulate” the prices we see in game…Anet has done so many times…

When a developer has nothing better to do (no ideas) then simulate the real world economy…they HAVE to intervene and change prices as they see fit (“whats best for the economy”)…haven’t heard that before…lol…

Actually, Anet can control the “availability” of items. We players control the prices. If I want to sell a Dusk for 100 Gold, Anet’s not stopping me from doing so. On a related note, it wouldn’t be Anet’s fault if another player put in a Dusk Buy Order for 600 Gold. That’s one player’s own personal choice. So then I’ve just made six times as much money as I initially wanted.

Yes…but what if Anet does not like the prices being set…what happens then? Not like they haven’t messed with prices before…

And to the bold part of your response…Yeah, like that happens…ever. Unless you are talking about the insider trading going on, ala “The Crossing”…Anet really needs to get their kitten together on that kitten.

well, he’ll probably spend a very long time explaining players are the one setting the price. And talk about economy 101. Like he did to me before.

In which, I think he’s missing the point. People are complaining because items are too hard to acquire. In which is what people are discussing. The availability of item.

The main problem here is that people feel entitled to getting all the good stuff in game. And by “good stuff”, I mean all stuff that individual player desires. New rare Chainsaw Greatsword skin outs out, and it’s “That’s awesome! I want it!” kinda deal. And when that player can’t get it, and sees the prices on the TP, it turns into “manipulation” complaints.

Rare items are rare for a reason. Because they’re rare. If they weren’t rare, then they’re be more common. And if they’re more common, the following occurs:

1) It’s no longer desirable since everyone has it, so the game gets saturated with the not-so rare skin.
2) People spend less money, because wanting a common skin isn’t worth paying Gems for.
3) It ends up being a bad business decision as sales fall.

Just look at the fancy Zenith skins Anet gave everyone for free. They were awesome looking for the first hour after release. Now days, you don’t see people showing them off in LA, because there’s nothing to brag about… nothing awe inspiring to see. Everyone has them, so it’s no longer a big deal.

Take the new Bat Greatsword, with flying bat animations and unique look. People gawk at how great it, because it’s rare (or semi rare), and looks good. Without the rarity, the “looking good” part fades to the point where no one is impressed anymore. Then it’s time to move on to find the next great temporary skin. Then you give birth to the Skin Treadmill.

Amun Ra.6435:

And to the bold part of your response…Yeah, like that happens…ever.

Example please? Yes need an explanation since I don’t see the conspiracies that you see.

Amun Ra.6435:

Manipulation might not be the most appropriate word to use, but Anet controls all prices in the game…I say again…all prices in the game.

I would hope you don’t need a detailed explanation on how.

Yes this was exactly my point eg. the introduction of the ability to salvage ectos for dust

Smooth Penguin.5294:

Take the new Bat Greatsword, with flying bat animations and unique look. People gawk at how great it, because it’s rare (or semi rare), and looks good. Without the rarity, the “looking good” part fades to the point where no one is impressed anymore. Then it’s time to move on to find the next great temporary skin. Then you give birth to the Skin Treadmill.

There IS already a Skin Treadmill though. You see it every time a new backpiece or weapon set comes out. A day or two after the content is released, you start to see everybody wearing Jetpacks/Holographic Wings/Fervid Censers/Karka Shells/Tequatl Wings/Slickpacks. Then, after the next content comes out, those items drop off in favour of whatever’s the newest backpiece. You hardly ever see anybody wearing the Holographic Wings anymore, and it’s been months since I’ve seen someone with the Shatterer Wings. I still see some people (mostly Sylvari) wearing the Fervid Censer, but more often than not, it’s the Southsun Rose. People have moved on from showing them off to wearing them because they like the aesthetic.

The same thing goes for the weapon sets. When something is new, everybody wants the item, but once the novelty wears off, people just dump it in favour of the latest shiny. Even now during Halloween I hardly see the Greatsaw, and when one does come out, nobody says a word about it. I’m certain that you’ll hardly see the Bat Greatsword in a year’s time too. It’ll have lost its novelty factor.

Salvaging ectos for T6 dust helped the economy greatly as T6 dust is used to create T6 mats from T5 mats. And we all know that T6 anything isn’t in great supply. Yes it raised the price of ectos and with it rare gear level 68 to 80 as an ecto supply. And of course it lowered the price of T6 dust and may have lowered the price slightly on T6 mats but likely conversions were for personal purposes and not marketed. Limited to no profit in it.

And honestly I glad they did because that upheaval is where I made what limited gold I have before the market stabilized. Same true with the elimination of Traveler gear for Dire.

But that’s not wide spread manipulation. That’s not “all prices in the game”. And it wasn’t them that set the price, they just adjusted supply by providing a means for players to produce T6 dust from a price depressed rare material.

I’m sure the introduction of luck in blues and greens is another example of ANet messing with “all prices in the game” by simply providing a purpose for junk that most players were either already salvaging, vending and in rare cases selling at the TP. As a source of luck, including ectos, I imagine there were spikes in their prices as well as the over supply dried up. Haven’t looked myself. But again all that ANet did was introduce a new purpose for items we already have and the shift in prices were player driven. Blame ourselves in being too greedy wanting to up our MF % as fast as possible.

Increased actual demand raises prices and in turn sucks more gold out of the economy due to the TP fees/taxes. So who made out on all this? Everyone gets blue and green drops all the time. Now we can if we want actually sell them in short order for reasonable prices to players who mine them for luck if we don’t want them for ourselves. Ecto prices were highly depressed before the T6 dust change but had already started to go back down when they added luck to the results and now prices have gone up again. That raises the price of rare gear which raises the cost in trying to MF a precursor.

But that’s how economies work. Demand shifts due to new uses of existing materials and the next thing you know markets shake up. Learn to spot the shifts as they are happening and you too can make some coin. Or you can sit on the sidelines and complain about how everything is getting more and more expensive. Well actually only very few items have shifted in price by any large amount.

I guess I can understand why you think ANet is moving the carrot on you. It’s just that your timing is poor.

John Smith.4610:

I’m not sure I entirely understand what the problem is, if someone could elaborate objectively on the argument I would appreciate it.

Problem is that the game has tradeable Black Lion ticket weapons that hase insane price.
Who on earth will buy/farm ~300 Keys to get a 7 ticket Fused weapon? Not so many.
And its price gone up from 260 to 350 in the days I’ve mentioned Fused Short Bow’s price.

Our problem is still the SAME since a whole year.: RNG.
Black Lion Chets has no sure drop of scraps at least, so optaining these items are way harder than the game promised. We can buy them now IF someone puts them up to the TP, but their price is something that casual players (whos the the game designed for) can’t really get.

It is time to change buisness and reward systems. Stick to the kitten achievements to unlock new skins, or sell them DIRECTLY.

We lack of skins to chose from, we can’t be really unique due there is no better crafting even, so at least make all the game items (excluding Legendaries and Ascendeds) collectable for casual gamers too.

RoyalPredator.9163:

John Smith.4610:

I’m not sure I entirely understand what the problem is, if someone could elaborate objectively on the argument I would appreciate it.

Problem is that the game has tradeable Black Lion ticket weapons that hase insane price.
Who on earth will buy/farm ~300 Keys to get a 7 ticket Fused weapon? Not so many.
And its price gone up from 260 to 350 in the days I’ve mentioned Fused Short Bow’s price.

Our problem is still the SAME since a whole year.: RNG.
Black Lion Chets has no sure drop of scraps at least, so optaining these items are way harder than the game promised. We can buy them now IF someone puts them up to the TP, but their price is something that casual players (whos the the game designed for) can’t really get.

It is time to change buisness and reward systems. Stick to the kitten achievements to unlock new skins, or sell them DIRECTLY.

We lack of skins to chose from, we can’t be really unique due there is no better crafting even, so at least make all the game items (excluding Legendaries and Ascendeds) collectable for casual gamers too.

You still don’t seem to understand this concept. If you can’t afford a certain skin you desire, you weren’t meant to have it. That’s as simple as I can get. It doesn’t matter what a “Casual” player wants. What matters is what he can afford (with Gold), or what he’s willing to pay for ($ → Gems).

This game was meant for everyone to play. Luxury items that have absolutely no impact on the game are just optional addon. If you’re still having a hard time understanding this, I’ll use a real world example. Not everyone can afford to buy a Lamborghini. Just as not everyone is entitled to one.

RoyalPredator.9163:

Problem is that the game has tradeable Black Lion ticket weapons that hase insane price.
Who on earth will buy/farm ~300 Keys to get a 7 ticket Fused weapon? Not so many.
And its price gone up from 260 to 350 in the days I’ve mentioned Fused Short Bow’s price.

A lot more people are running around with Fused weapon skins than there used to be. Prices go up because they are popular and many people can and will pay that much for the skins. These things wouldn’t happen if people didn’t buy or farm the keys in the first place because there is no other way to get the skins.

This is your problem, not the game’s problem. The game was set up this way by the devs for a reason. It was not an accident and it is not a situation that needs to be corrected. You need to set a goal and to work towards that goal – if you want a Fused greatsword or whatever, then farm gold or farm keys if you don’t have the cash for gems.

If the devs wanted “everyone” to have these weapons, they would have sent every account a Fused Weapon claim ticket instead of changing them over to the BLTC tickets. Everyone is not meant to have one, there are a dozen or more skins for every weapon that are as common as dirt and sell on the TP for a few silver. Other skins are intentionally rare to give people a goal to work towards.

With 25 silver and a handful of transmute stones, I can start a new toon and buy armor and weapons from the TP with skins that I like and some basic dyes to create a unique look for my toon. I don’t worry about rare skins that cost 250 gold because I’ll get tired of them in a month anyway and find something else I like better.

Smooth Penguin.5294:

Not everyone can afford to buy a Lamborghini. Just as not everyone is entitled to one.

The cognitive dissonance here is mind boggling.

We play a game to be heroic warriors and spell slinging magic users. No one expects players to go through the years of training it would take to do these kinds of things, but when it comes to the economy, for some reason it needs to be realistic. People have to put in the time to earn their stuff, and any question of how the game is designed to reward players is met with scoffing at the clear ignorance of economies on the part of the questioner.

In an open market, the people with unhealthy play habits who spend as much time in game as they would in a job will always screw it over for people who treat it like a past-time. There only reason that the game can’t be designed so that the player who plays an hour or two a day gets the Lamborghini is because the players who play six hours a day would have theirs in the first week, get bored, throw a fit, and leave.

So we have the toxic skinner boxes that MMORPGs inevitably become. You have to keep the insatiable grinding away by keeping the Lamborghinis out of reach, which means the average player can reasonably expect to be riding around in their Ford Focus.

Sure, it’s just like real life. If you want a Lamborghini, you can either work your butt off, invest in markets, or probably both.

I just don’t get how that makes sense in a high fantasy adventure game.

Before the inevitable “welfare socialists want to log on and be handed everything” stupidity, let me make it clear I’m not talking about rewards raining down from the sky. I’m talking about people being able to play the game like a game, like a hobby, and get some of the coolest things in game, rather than the coolest things being restricted to the farmers and TP players.

I don’t expect to be handed the keys to a Lamborghini IRL. I don’t even expect to earn one even though I have a terminal degree and sometimes put in the work of two full time jobs because I chose a profession that doesn’t make that kind of money.

But why in the world does a fantasy computer game have to work the same?

This game has a million beautiful skins. It really does. I think people overlook that.

Gibson.4036:

I just don’t get how that makes sense in a high fantasy adventure game.

This is an MMO, where every single asura PC won the Snaff Prize, every human PC is the Hero of Shaemoor, etc.

It works a little differently from a game like Skyrim. There, if you want to shortcut to the good stuff you can open the cheat console and give yourself infinite gold or whatever. You are the game.

Here you share the game with thousands of other people on every server. For some people, getting the rare skins is the game, and it’s the reason why they play. So Anet puts things into the game for them to work for. And things that are handed out just because, like the skins players get for LS achievements and such. Their enjoyment is just as important as yours, so don’t expect it to change.

If you want to have access to everything in the game, play a single-player game. MMOs don’t work that way.

Everyone can be super! And when everyone’s super… [chuckles evilly] no one will be.

tolunart.2095:

If you want to have access to everything in the game, play a single-player game. MMOs don’t work that way.

Which is too bad.

It’d be nice to have a multiplayer game that didn’t reward financiers and hardcore farming over the average player.

Early on, it looked like GW2 was that game.

There are many good looking, yet cheap skins in the game. But many overlook it because they are not rare, don’t give you that royalty.

Genesis, one of the best looking hammers in game, is only ~40g.
Cobalt, one of the best particle effect weapons, is only 2g.
The SAB weapons, unique look and sound, you just need to work on them
Dungeon weapons like AC and Arah’s.
Emberglow, which my necro is using, is the largest scepter ingame and has particle effect, yet cost only 2g.

So many weapons to choose from, but you don’t want them because everyone can access to those. I bet if chiroptophobia cost like 2g, you wouldn’t want it.

((Holds beloved Infinite Light close)))

I have one of the rarest skins in the game – I’ve seen it once on another player as opposed to the unending cavalcade of Legendaries out there.

It took me 8 months as my primary goal to get it. That’s saving every copper from dungeons, fractals, general play… Weeks upon weeks of farming high level air elementals ‘till I was on a first name basis with every spawn point for them in the entire game. But truthfully I wanted it because it fits the theme for the character that now has it, not because it’s rare.

I get it people want stuff for the aesthetics, rather than the perceived uniqueness. But expecting other players to just hand over their goodies on the cheap will not fly as a game design policy. Its adorable when your tastes grossly outstrip your means, but if you want to be happy, you’d better figure out what meets your needs within the circle of effort you’re willing to put forward. It may not make for the best masturbatory power fantasy – “Heroic” – simulator on the market, but its a pretty understandable model for them to use.

Nike.2631:

((Holds beloved Infinite Light close)))

I have one of the rarest skins in the game – I’ve seen it once on another player as opposed to the unending cavalcade of Legendaries out there.

It took me 8 months as my primary goal to get it. That’s saving every copper from dungeons, fractals, general play… Weeks upon weeks of farming high level air elementals ‘till I was on a first name basis with every spawn point for them in the entire game. But truthfully I wanted it because it fits the theme for the character that now has it, not because it’s rare.

I get it people want stuff for the aesthetics, rather than the perceived uniqueness. But expecting other players to just hand over their goodies on the cheap will not fly as a game design policy. Its adorable when your tastes grossly outstrip your means, but if you want to be happy, you’d better figure out what meets your needs within the circle of effort you’re willing to put forward. It may not make for the best masturbatory power fantasy – “Heroic” – simulator on the market, but its a pretty understandable model for them to use.

Indeed. While your sword isn’t as flashy as, say, Twilight, I still admire ANYONE who carries it. Part of it stems from the fact that is does look nice. But the other part of it is because it’s so rare.

It’s sad that people keep wanting stuff to be handed to them, just because someone else has it. The argument that it’s unfair that one player has more time to play/farm over a “casual” is one of the worst I can think of. It’s like a rich person being jealous of a low-income family getting government assistance/free food.

Smooth Penguin.5294:

It’s sad that people keep wanting stuff to be handed to them, just because someone else has it. The argument that it’s unfair that one player has more time to play/farm over a “casual” is one of the worst I can think of. It’s like a rich person being jealous of a low-income family getting government assistance/free food.

What? That doesn’t make any sense. Might want to rethink/rephrase that maybe?

tolunart.2095:

Gibson.4036:

I just don’t get how that makes sense in a high fantasy adventure game.

This is an MMO, where every single asura PC won the Snaff Prize, every human PC is the Hero of Shaemoor, etc.

It works a little differently from a game like Skyrim. There, if you want to shortcut to the good stuff you can open the cheat console and give yourself infinite gold or whatever. You are the game.

Here you share the game with thousands of other people on every server. For some people, getting the rare skins is the game, and it’s the reason why they play. So Anet puts things into the game for them to work for. And things that are handed out just because, like the skins players get for LS achievements and such. Their enjoyment is just as important as yours, so don’t expect it to change.

If you want to have access to everything in the game, play a single-player game. MMOs don’t work that way.

First, I am not directing this at you, per se, but you brought up some commonly-mentioned points, so I am quoting you.

1. Wanting to be able to play the game and have the pretty toys does not mean you want a cheat code, or God Mode, or welfare, or are lazy. People want to get these items as ingame rewards for ingame work. Using black and white thinking to paint people as lazy is unhelpful and obscures what people are really disappointed about ; ingame work results in absent or random reward. We are not rats; that will only work for so long.

2. No, most mmos ARE designed to put the player through punishing ground for a sliim chance at reward, you are right. I don’t want this game to be Another MMO, So Shut Up And Keep Farming, QQer. I want it to be different.

3. Just because some people only find value in their things because they like to feel smug does not mean we all have to be held hostage to their kittens. I mean, come on. There are so many gorgeous skins in this game; if we had relaxed access to more of them, you would be surprised how many people would pick unexpected ones.

Essence Snow.3194:

Smooth Penguin.5294:

It’s sad that people keep wanting stuff to be handed to them, just because someone else has it. The argument that it’s unfair that one player has more time to play/farm over a “casual” is one of the worst I can think of. It’s like a rich person being jealous of a low-income family getting government assistance/free food.

What? That doesn’t make any sense. Might want to rethink/rephrase that maybe?

I’ll try again.

On the subject of feeling entitled to rare skins because other people can afford to get them: It’s like asking the government to pay for your filet mignon steak dinner, when you can only afford hot dogs.

Smooth Penguin.5294:

On the subject of feeling entitled to rare skins because other people can afford to get them: It’s like asking the government to pay for your filet mignon steak dinner, when you can only afford hot dogs.

Makes total sense in the real world.

Kinda odd in a game where every player is playing a hero that was instrumental in saving the world from an elder dragon.

Gibson.4036:

Smooth Penguin.5294:

On the subject of feeling entitled to rare skins because other people can afford to get them: It’s like asking the government to pay for your filet mignon steak dinner, when you can only afford hot dogs.

Makes total sense in the real world.

Kinda odd in a game where every player is playing a hero that was instrumental in saving the world from an elder dragon.

You can save the world without the optional luxury items.

Smooth Penguin.5294:

Amun Ra.6435:

Behellagh.1468:

Prove that morrolan. How is ANet manipulating the TP?

Manipulation might not be the most appropriate word to use, but Anet controls all prices in the game…I say again…all prices in the game.

I would hope you don’t need a detailed explanation on how.

We as players are just left with the scaps to play with and set the prices. Again…we are only setting prices based on the scaps Anet gives us…should Anet not like the price we set they give or take away scaps and thus “Manipulate” the prices we see in game…Anet has done so many times…

When a developer has nothing better to do (no ideas) then simulate the real world economy…they HAVE to intervene and change prices as they see fit (“whats best for the economy”)…haven’t heard that before…lol…

Actually, Anet can control the “availability” of items. We players control the prices. If I want to sell a Dusk for 100 Gold, Anet’s not stopping me from doing so. On a related note, it wouldn’t be Anet’s fault if another player put in a Dusk Buy Order for 600 Gold. That’s one player’s own personal choice. So then I’ve just made six times as much money as I initially wanted.

Actually there are guilds that grind gold, pool their resources and have certain members manipulate item prices by buying at one price, posting incrementally higher sell prices to create a run on the purchase of an item because people see the value rising then sell off huge amounts at a profit.

If you believe this kind of manipulation is ok, then there’s no argument i can provide that will change your mind.

Gibson.4036:

We play a game to be heroic warriors and spell slinging magic users. No one expects players to go through the years of training it would take to do these kinds of things, but when it comes to the economy, for some reason it needs to be realistic. People have to put in the time to earn their stuff, and any question of how the game is designed to reward players is met with scoffing at the clear ignorance of economies on the part of the questioner.

Spot on this echoes my complaints about the treatment of this part of the game. In a sandbox the players are given a world and they create their own content whether it be playing the market or whatever, GW2 is not that game.

Smooth Penguin.5294:

Indeed. While your sword isn’t as flashy as, say, Twilight, I still admire ANYONE who carries it. Part of it stems from the fact that is does look nice. But the other part of it is because it’s so rare.

I don’t because its not acquired by being a skilled player its obtained by the one who is prepared to grind the most.

I think most of the prestige of these weapons come from the exclusivity and how brand new it is. Sure, the more expensive any skin is would be directly proportional to its prestige but rather i think this case is especially true for BL ticket skins because almost every other new skin thats added to the game is in the BLTC. The champ weapon skins were a really nice addition. But ultimately, with ALL new armour skins being exclusive to the gem store, and this game having a currency conversion system, it really does encourage more grinding for gold(for gems and indirectly BLTC keys). And considering the meta to get gold is rather repetitive it really gets to a boring grind fast. There are so many fun, challenging things to do in the game yet almost none of them provide a decent incentive to convince us to go do them(have fun and get good loot!). I think either they add more incentives to various activities in the game, or they add more elite rewards for completing elite content (i.e. queen’s gauntlet, i dont really give a kitten about minis, but the amount of challenge it took to beat liadri really had a sense of achievement towards it, i think thats a more positive prestige rather than value of prestige), i think this may get rid of grinding and encourage people to engage in more challenging activities. Just a thought.

morrolan.9608:

Smooth Penguin.5294:

Indeed. While your sword isn’t as flashy as, say, Twilight, I still admire ANYONE who carries it. Part of it stems from the fact that is does look nice. But the other part of it is because it’s so rare.

I don’t because its not acquired by being a skilled player its obtained by the one who is prepared to grind the most.

Thankfully, I didn’t do it for anyone’s admiration. I did it for my own sense of aesthetics.

If people want to be impressed by it, I’d rather it be because it complements the rest of my visual choices .

Smooth Penguin.5294:

sorudo.9054:

for now i am forced to buy gems with euro’s and Anet screws over europeans every single day, they favor USD over EURO and even make an excuse that apparently some weak minded ppl believe.

Then you should tell Europe to get rid of your VAT, and then convert all your currencies to the US Dollar.

or have the euro prices corrected without the lame “but we rounded it up for you” excuse, i really don’t care about a price that looks weird, i rather pay a weird price then a unfair price.
euro INCLUDING VAT is €9,45 and no, it’s not ok to just round it up to €10,-.

BilboBaggins.5620:

Smooth Penguin.5294:

Amun Ra.6435:

Behellagh.1468:

Prove that morrolan. How is ANet manipulating the TP?

Manipulation might not be the most appropriate word to use, but Anet controls all prices in the game…I say again…all prices in the game.

I would hope you don’t need a detailed explanation on how.

We as players are just left with the scaps to play with and set the prices. Again…we are only setting prices based on the scaps Anet gives us…should Anet not like the price we set they give or take away scaps and thus “Manipulate” the prices we see in game…Anet has done so many times…

When a developer has nothing better to do (no ideas) then simulate the real world economy…they HAVE to intervene and change prices as they see fit (“whats best for the economy”)…haven’t heard that before…lol…

Actually, Anet can control the “availability” of items. We players control the prices. If I want to sell a Dusk for 100 Gold, Anet’s not stopping me from doing so. On a related note, it wouldn’t be Anet’s fault if another player put in a Dusk Buy Order for 600 Gold. That’s one player’s own personal choice. So then I’ve just made six times as much money as I initially wanted.

Actually there are guilds that grind gold, pool their resources and have certain members manipulate item prices by buying at one price, posting incrementally higher sell prices to create a run on the purchase of an item because people see the value rising then sell off huge amounts at a profit.

If you believe this kind of manipulation is ok, then there’s no argument i can provide that will change your mind.

The tin foil is strong in this one.

sorudo.9054:

Smooth Penguin.5294:

sorudo.9054:

for now i am forced to buy gems with euro’s and Anet screws over europeans every single day, they favor USD over EURO and even make an excuse that apparently some weak minded ppl believe.

Then you should tell Europe to get rid of your VAT, and then convert all your currencies to the US Dollar.

or have the euro prices corrected without the lame “but we rounded it up for you” excuse, i really don’t care about a price that looks weird, i rather pay a weird price then a unfair price.
euro INCLUDING VAT is €9,45 and no, it’s not ok to just round it up to €10,-.

But they are never going to base the cost on just the running exchange rate plus 20% VAT. Just as Sony and Microsoft isn’t going to price their next gen consoles that way.

Just because they are never going to do it, doesnt mean its fair that way.

Well it’s not like they can reprint the cards every month. And it wouldn’t be fair for gem card buyers if TP buyers get a better deal.

Lots of things in the world and life are unfair. This is trivial in the big picture.

Smooth Penguin.5294:

You can save the world without the optional luxury items.

Yeah.

This thread had me thinking earlier this morning. I was imagining a novel where King Arthur had to kill thousands of White Stags for Stag Hearts and Stag Antlers to refine them so he can craft Excalibur in order to defeat the Green Knight once a day for a month to earn the gold needed to buy the Holy Grail from a wealthy merchant.

Gibson.4036:

Smooth Penguin.5294:

You can save the world without the optional luxury items.

Yeah.

This thread had me thinking earlier this morning. I was imagining a novel where King Arthur had to kill thousands of White Stags for Stag Hearts and Stag Antlers to refine them so he can craft Excalibur in order to defeat the Green Knight once a day for a month to earn the gold needed to buy the Holy Grail from a wealthy merchant.

And it would equally sad if every knight in the kingdom had an Excalibur.

Gibson.4036:

Smooth Penguin.5294:

You can save the world without the optional luxury items.

Yeah.

This thread had me thinking earlier this morning. I was imagining a novel where King Arthur had to kill thousands of White Stags for Stag Hearts and Stag Antlers to refine them so he can craft Excalibur in order to defeat the Green Knight once a day for a month to earn the gold needed to buy the Holy Grail from a wealthy merchant.

But Excalibur wasn’t an optional luxury item Arthur needed to purchase. It was bestowed upon him by the Lady of the Lake after he became King.

Smooth Penguin.5294:

Gibson.4036:

Smooth Penguin.5294:

You can save the world without the optional luxury items.

Yeah.

This thread had me thinking earlier this morning. I was imagining a novel where King Arthur had to kill thousands of White Stags for Stag Hearts and Stag Antlers to refine them so he can craft Excalibur in order to defeat the Green Knight once a day for a month to earn the gold needed to buy the Holy Grail from a wealthy merchant.

But Excalibur wasn’t an optional luxury item Arthur needed to purchase. It was bestowed upon him by the Lady of the Lake after he became King.

“Oh, but you can’t expect to wield supreme executive power just because some watery tart threw a sword at you.”

Behellagh.1468:

Smooth Penguin.5294:

Gibson.4036:

Smooth Penguin.5294:

You can save the world without the optional luxury items.

Yeah.

This thread had me thinking earlier this morning. I was imagining a novel where King Arthur had to kill thousands of White Stags for Stag Hearts and Stag Antlers to refine them so he can craft Excalibur in order to defeat the Green Knight once a day for a month to earn the gold needed to buy the Holy Grail from a wealthy merchant.

But Excalibur wasn’t an optional luxury item Arthur needed to purchase. It was bestowed upon him by the Lady of the Lake after he became King.

“Oh, but you can’t expect to wield supreme executive power just because some watery tart threw a sword at you.”

" If I went around saying I was an emperor, just because some moistened **** had lobbed a scimitar at me, they’d put me away!"

Note – Wasn’t sure if one of the words are bad, so I took it out for safety.

While the game needs prestigious & rare skins. Paying a high amounts for a desired skin on the TP through a very low drop rate, is just 1 way to make them rare. I’d like to see more rare account bound skins obtained from skill.

Take fractal weapons. They are rare and yet admired for that fact that they were not purchased for the TP, renowned for thier unique look and partical effect.

Sure there are dungeon skins, but they are missing the rarity factor. Anyone can get dungeon skins, but high lvl fractals take large amounts of time, dedication, and skill. Which still might not be obtainable for a lot of casuals, but still i still think more skill based skins are a good idea.

Truth is most casuals can’t have something really rare and prestigious, because once it’s easy to get it’s no longer rare and admired as much.

Behellagh.1468:

And it would equally sad if every knight in the kingdom had an Excalibur.

Which is why it’s important that Sting, Anduril, and Vorpal Blades are all available. When there’s enough variety to choose from, everyone won’t be wielding the same weapon (with the exception of whatever just got released, which will always be FotM).

What’s truly sad is that people need to get a feeling of eliteness from a video game. Especially when having that “prestige” item has little to do with skill, and mostly to do with spending huge amounts of time in game (or playing the market, which is a skill, just not the one you expect to be prominently featured when you see the flaming dragon on the box).

It’d be great if people could just choose the item they most like the look of, and get it with a moderate amount of play. I don’t want everything to be handed to everyone for logging in. When you have people willing to farm gold hours and hours a day, however, it means top tier stuff will never be attainable by the average player, and that’s just silly for a piece of fluff entertainment. It’s not like you can compare getting an elite skin with the effort required to do something real, like learn an instrument or become an accomplished athlete. It’s more like watching television marathons.

I’ll agree with one of the posts above. Some of the best looking items in game are easy to get. My ele has his starter armor look transmuted over exotic stats. Cobalt can be had for only 4g. That’s just my taste, though.

Curse Drew.8679:

While the game needs prestigious & rare skins.

It’d be interesting to see an explanation of why the game needs prestigious and rare skins.

Truth is most casuals can’t have something really rare and prestigious, because once it’s easy to get it’s no longer rare and admired as much.

Not just casuals. Average players who log on a couple hours a day, most days a week.

I like how some of the legendaries were created. They almost look like a developer mocking people who need “prestige”. It’s too bad all the extremely rare skins aren’t jokes, and all the well designed stuff readily available. People who need to feel elite could run around shooting rainbow unicorns and waving disco-balls while everyone else was content with their non-exclusive, but cosmetically satisfying gear.

Curse Drew.8679:

This is a game of skins, where you can get exotic items pretty easy. Collecting your look is large part of the game. Some people should standout, and be admired for thier play time investment. In most mmorpgs you chase stats, but in this one you chase skins. In this game after leveling to 80 you continue playing and building your character with awesome skins. It’s one of the main reasons to play pve after you get leveled. With all skins easy to get people would be done playing more quickly, because it’s to easy to get what they want. But with prestigious awesome looking rare skins, people desire them and will want to complete whatever task it takes to get them. A skin chasing game should have rare and admired skins.

You haven’t sold me there.

The problem with things like “easy to get” and “get done playing more quickly” is that they are relative.

You could scale things so that they felt rewarding, but not frustrating for a player who plays a moderate amount, and keep them around for a long time. The problem is that the choice is usually made to scale things so that the full-time farmer takes a while to get them, which places them at the end of a terrible slog for the moderate player.

There’s really nothing standout about playing a game like a part time or even full time job. There’s nothing worth admiring there. But such is the state of the industry, that it feels the need to cater to people who play crazy amounts and give them special rewards. I guess the professionals have looked at the data, and see that it brings in more money in the long run, so what can you do?

And honestly, a lot of what is “prestigious” in game today will probably become commonplace down the road. It’s a tried and true formula. Hand out “elite” rewards to the people who are happy to grind them out, so they feel special. Then, when they’ve gotten the shinies and move on, you get more bang for your buck by making it easier to get the same rewards, so that the people who play less but have been envying them can now realistically chase the same content, while the professional farmers move on to the new ultra-rare.

I’m not a fan of frustrating either. Some of the skins require a huge grind, especially those new recipes for Halloween skins. It’s not good to have impossible grinds. That’s why i was suggesting more skill based skins may be better then rare skins available for gold on the trading post. Less grinding the same champs/meta events for straight gold, and more playing dynamic and challenging content. I like some grind to get something rare, but not the same thing, over and over, like farming for gold.

You asked for an explanation on why we need rare skins, and that’s my thoughts.

I feel that making the ultra rare weapons sellable is a mistake. It makes it so that playing the content (non farm grind) is not a valid option to obtain them. What we are left with is sheer luck (lottery level), farm grinding for excessive amounts of time, and playing the trading post as the avenues to them. Why of all the things to do in this game are we rewarding those three? I cannot think of one justifiable reason as to why those should reward the most desired skins vs playing content.

I feel what we should be after is rewarding actual game play versus other options that do not enrich the world.

When we lack of skins, there is no room for Luxury items.
I understand the concept of “Get it now Now NOW!”, but its seems the same awkward old model that GW2 promised to change… IMO There is no room for those who still want to stick to this model. Play anything else then, all is the s(h)ame.

On the other hand, same people complaining about the lack of prestige at Legendary weapons… so do not fight against yourself. I’m sure you would go through a challenged adventure rather than training between champions or node points…

BTW, Thanks to all of those who wants skill based skin rewards, just like me.

John Smith.4610:

I’m not sure I entirely understand what the problem is, if someone could elaborate objectively on the argument I would appreciate it.

For anything regarding the currency exchange I will say that the currency exchange is NOT a good indicator of market prices or inflation, it wasn’t designed to be.

The problem, as far as I can see, is that this game requires an unholy amount of farming to afford anything. I think most players agree that the game should be more about character progression through fun (for example a personal quest to create your legendary, without all the horrible farming, amounting to 2000g… yeah farm 1 year more). That’s what really sucks in this game and puts a lot of people off.

^ Every mmorpg pretty much is about farming in the end. It is impossible for Anet to make that much content.

That’s why GW2 have grinding. They want to keep you playing from doing those repeatable content. Because they really dont’ have that much content.

How do you think they make a personal quest for legendary that take a year to do. It’s called farming.

You can call it farming. But champ farm, dungeon, spvp, wvw, world event is all the content anet have.

There isn’t even any skillful content which can’t be finished in 1 day on a weekend in the game. I’m not sure what skill based rewards people are expecting. Farming high level fractal over and over again? (which is pointless anyway, because eventhough it is a bit more skill based you still have to farm).

The problem Anet need to keep people playing. And some people play way too much. Not to mention the Gemshop make money by having those skippable farm content people dont’ want to do.

All sales in a real world Auction businesses take money up front and/or after the sale in many cases an many auction businesses don’t hold the item tell sold they hold it for that sale period, To help deter people just buying a reposting things after raising the price 50%-100% something like reposting item that you just got off the trading post should charge the full sale’/posting tax up front with out the charge after the sale so that people that buy an item will not get there money back if they raise the price so high that people will not buy to repost. (OR) have the sales of exotic to legendary items be on a one week turn around with a vary vary small posting fee each time like .5% every time you wish to post a item of a certain rarity for a day week month (aka the WoW mechanic)

RoyalPredator.9163:

You’re just missed my point. I’m not QQing, and can afford 200g skin. Just Won’t.

That’s exactly how it’s intended to work. If the price is right for you, you make a purchase. If not, you don’t. Not only is this common sense, I’m certain that Anet is aware this would be the result as well. Trying to convince people there is something ‘wrong’ with that approach defies logic.

I don’t think the prices are unreasonable because its not something I need.

JasonP.4028:

All sales in a real world Auction businesses take money up front and/or after the sale in many cases an many auction businesses don’t hold the item tell sold they hold it for that sale period, To help deter people just buying a reposting things after raising the price 50%-100% something like reposting item that you just got off the trading post should charge the full sale’/posting tax up front with out the charge after the sale so that people that buy an item will not get there money back if they raise the price so high that people will not buy to repost. (OR) have the sales of exotic to legendary items be on a one week turn around with a vary vary small posting fee each time like .5% every time you wish to post a item of a certain rarity for a day week month (aka the WoW mechanic)

But it’s not an auction. Player putting it up for sale says “will sell for X” and it’s up to other players to decide if that’s a price they want to pay and others with the same item to sell it at the same price or less.

And you are trying to play the “ebil flipper” card. Flipping isn’t evil. Playing the TP isn’t evil. Flipping isn’t raising prices, that’s primarily shifts in supply and demand plus the recent injection of coin into the game since the start of the Queen’s celebration and raising the champ rewards.

^ I dont’ even understand what he is trying to say.

So I buy a sword for 100 gold. and If I resell it for 130 gold, I’ll end up only getting 30 gold?

laokoko.7403:

^ I dont’ even understand what he is trying to say.

So I buy a sword for 100 gold. and If I resell it for 130 gold, I’ll end up only getting 30 gold?

No you’ll end up with 10.5g after fees but that’s neither here or there. The guy I was quoting was suggesting yet another artificial means to reduce flipping when flipping isn’t what’s driving prices up. The player who bought it from you for 130g could have competed with you to acquire it in the first place for 100g. Nothing prevented him other than either his own indifference or impatience which is what a flipper capitalizes on. At the end of the day one player gets an item they wanted, the flipper got 10.5 gold, the player who sold it for 100g got 85g after fees and the TP removes 34.5 gold from the game.

In feudal Japan, merchants were considered the lowest class because they were considered parasites on the rest of society and I feel that’s what a lot of players believe the same about those who play the TP. But they are necessary in keeping the economy flowing.